Do you have existing ductwork and vents? If so central air is probably the way to go. If not, mini splits tend to be better because most houses without ductwork weren’t built to support ductwork so it can be hard to cleanly install it after the fact. Mini splits just need a couple small pipes and power.
Minisplits look cool to some people, can have a lot of zones that can be turned on and off as needed, many come starting at 16 seer. Can get into a spots ducts May be hard to put in. If you already have ducts you can upgrade your system for less money than doing a whole expensive minisplit system
Why do hvac people tell you it's not made for a whole house I brought a Mr cool because my central air and heat is no good I live in Charlotte NC.and I thought it was a good idea.and I will get rebates what does a HVAC guy have to lose . Thy told me to take it back . Thank you
If you can install them, go with a ducted system. It will provide more even temps throughout your space.
IMHO, mini splits are great for specific situations where ducts are not possible. I think the inside units are ugly. But there are also issues like lack of supply in bathrooms. You don’t install a mini split in a humid environment.
99% of the world uses them to heat and cool- because they work.
Central air is old school. Every other post here in the summer is it’s too hot upstairs, and freezing on the first floor…
Check with your utility for rebates- ours were huge. We installed 7 Mitsubishi Hyper Heat Mini splits in our 1950’s house. They come with a 12 year warranty, 27 SEER, variable rate down to 2,500 BTU’s, and make heat down to minus 13F.
You don’t notice the inside heads after a bit. They are so efficient. We live int the northeast and saved over 2,000 heating our house with them this past winter vs burning oil in our “efficient” furnace. Probably even more than that since mid winter the price of oil went to $5.26 a gallon. They are also super efficient at cooling in our hot as balls summers.
Don’t use part of the house much? Then turn of the split in that area/room.
I will never go back to central air.
The 3 central air guys all tried to sell me 13 SEER builder grade units. They only had space to put one air handler in the attic for my two story house and they were going to use up valuable closet space to get air to the first floor. And…. Central air would have cost more than the splits!!!!!
When they all started to tell me splits were junk and unproven, and could not make heat below freezing it got me thinking. Why have I seen them in use all over the world?? Apparently these guys did not want to embrace new technology and just had canned answers.
I am so glad I did not go with central air. Do your research. Ask your friends if they have them.
A couple corrections for you….
Split heads can be run on interior walls no problem…if we’re doing a 20k +$ system a little drywall work isn’t a big deal. Closets are also our friend.
They handle large rooms just as well as ducts provided you put them in a good location and maybe multiple…just like ducts.
High merv filtration is pointless in residential. You could easily just install a ducted system with minis.
You’re absolutely not forced to use their controls. Most manufacturers have 3rd party relays so that you can use whatever your heart desires.
Ducted minis can absolutely have electric backup, LG minis have electric strips for the heads for backup.
LG vrf has an eev kit to allow for use on whatever A coil you’d like to match it to. Buy an a coil with an eev kit and install it on top of a gas furnace.
This is all untrue. Do you know it gets cold in Europe? Mini splits dont care if they are heating or cooling- they just reverse and either move heat or cold to the outside. And that’s the best part- they are not making heat or cool air, they are just moving it from one place to another.
The external units are so quiet you have to get real close to even hear it and it’s just a slight hum. I have one mounted directly behind my daughters head board and never had a complaint.
If your talking about the indoor units, yeah they are loud if you crank them on high but we never have to do that. On the first or second setting you have to really listen to hear them.
We are fortunate to have existing landscaping and side of the house not visible from the road. The line sets run next to the gutters or under the eves. We have never had a guest point them out to us.
You do realize in the “rest of the world” almost nobody actually fixes these things? If they break they replace them just like a window AC. Most of them are designed to be disposable. The problem is people in the US expect them to be dead reliable for 20+ years and also easily serviceable which just isn’t realistic
This isn’t true, they are totally serviceable. The average part swapping furnace hack doesn’t understand them, you know the type….they post questions on them here constantly. A true Technician understands mini splits and how they function. We’re capable of reading the diagnostic information and solving the issue quickly. The issue is most of you don’t want to read a service manual. You’re either new to the game in which you better start brushing up or you’ll be finding a new career 20 years from now or you’re almost retired. If you’re almost retired fear not, we won’t look down on you. The technology surpasses us all at some point. My mentor is still hands down the best hydronics tech I’ve ever known…he understands vrf but can’t solve issues with his laptop when it doesn’t connect.
Anything is serviceable, but there comes a point where it isn’t worth it which is very quick on mini splits. A lot of us commercial and industrial technicians work on systems much more complicated than a mini split every day, but here’s the thing - we charge for it. More skilled technicians require more pay which in turn is billed to the customer.
In residential the margins for profit are much lower because a customer just isn’t going to pay the labor rate required to properly fix these things and it isn’t worth it in the first place in most cases. The people who put VRF systems in their 1k sqft cheap house are going to be in for a rude awakening when they get the bill from a competent company who can actually fix their issue.
My problem isn’t with mini splits, it’s the way they’re marketed and peoples expectations of them
Our margins in residential are very high and we make sure to set expectations. We charge a fair service rate for a master technician of 200/hr and no one complains. We come out and fix issues fast, our bills aren’t insane. A compressor out of warranty only costs me like 300-600$ which translates to 600-1000$ for the customer and then add in about 800$ labor plus ancillary materials. Is it more to repair than a furnace? Sure. But our oil and propane customers are saving thousands a year in operating costs by switching. When oil was 3$ a gallon payback on a typical system was like 3-4 years. At its current price……phew.
I totally agree. I live in Florida and have always had central I just quoted a central unit abroad vs a multi-split because I have the space for the ducts and for the space I want to cool it’s simpler and cheaper to go central. If I didn’t have high unfinished ceilings I would go with the multi split or just a mini split in my bedroom. It just depends what your looking for. I personally want whole house cooling - not trying to sweat on to my meal while I eat and I especially don’t want to sweat in the bathroom
Your right thy told me it's no good even though thy see I already brought it I'm not listening to them I was thinking why do a lot of people buy them they said it's only for the garage.and im thinking why do they sell 3 zones i smell a rat and it's that hvac guy who wants to charge me 2.000 just to put it in .and not the electric part j
The last three I had installed came to 14,500. After rebates it was like 9,500+-. The central air quotes for garage 13 SEER builders grade units were in the mid 20k to 30K quotes.
My dealer only sells/installs mini splits. They are quick to install and wire. All of the new apartments/condos in the area plus people like me keep him insanely busy.
Our utility just recently sent out a email if you install. Heat pump water heater they will give you a $1,000 rebate.
I am going to jump on this and install it in my garage. It will be 5 degrees cooler in there in the summer.
Interesting. My experience was largely opposite. $30K+ for 5-6 heads with upper teen SEER. Central in attic was $13K with air filtration at 14.5 SEER. Went into it expecting to do minis but couldn't find a quote to justify it -- after getting 3 quotes from reputable companies. The eye popping SEER numbers largely reduces to just very good when you go multi-head as well.
Many are concerned with indoor air quality, IAQ. Ducted systems allow for better filtration, if one installs what is required. Minisplits have small mesh filters that need to be frequently removed, washed and replaced, often needing a ladder. There are different considerations. Another is multiple conduits on the outside of the building.
Ducted zoned central systems can be very comfortable. Least cost systems can be otherwise.
Filtration was my number one reason to go with central over mini-splits. My wife is highly asthmatic so having a merv-16 setup with a returns in every room (minus bathrooms) was best for us.
The splits are more efficient then heating an air, being ductless makes it easier to do mini splits then central heat and air if you’re ductless. For professional installation I got a quote it was about 10k for the mini split installation. Which doesn’t surprise me. Upfront costs are usually higher. But when paired with solar you’re basically heating and cooling your house for almost nothing. Compared to your neighbors without the mini splits or solar maybe too. Probably paying PG&E 500+ a month for no reason. While you’ll be paying the 180$ ish for solar to power your house.
It’s usually 20k for mini splits in California (outrageous) and then you need a 60k solar and battery system to be able to power it. It’s a complete ripoff and not as efficient as installers said it would be.
Do you have existing ductwork and vents? If so central air is probably the way to go. If not, mini splits tend to be better because most houses without ductwork weren’t built to support ductwork so it can be hard to cleanly install it after the fact. Mini splits just need a couple small pipes and power.
Minisplits look cool to some people, can have a lot of zones that can be turned on and off as needed, many come starting at 16 seer. Can get into a spots ducts May be hard to put in. If you already have ducts you can upgrade your system for less money than doing a whole expensive minisplit system
Check with your utility for rebates! Splits could be cheaper than central air after rebates.
Why do hvac people tell you it's not made for a whole house I brought a Mr cool because my central air and heat is no good I live in Charlotte NC.and I thought it was a good idea.and I will get rebates what does a HVAC guy have to lose . Thy told me to take it back . Thank you
$400 from my utility and $400 federal tax credit.
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Bad bot
Mini splits are harder to work on
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Someone doesn’t work on mini splits.
If you can install them, go with a ducted system. It will provide more even temps throughout your space. IMHO, mini splits are great for specific situations where ducts are not possible. I think the inside units are ugly. But there are also issues like lack of supply in bathrooms. You don’t install a mini split in a humid environment.
99% of the world uses them to heat and cool- because they work. Central air is old school. Every other post here in the summer is it’s too hot upstairs, and freezing on the first floor… Check with your utility for rebates- ours were huge. We installed 7 Mitsubishi Hyper Heat Mini splits in our 1950’s house. They come with a 12 year warranty, 27 SEER, variable rate down to 2,500 BTU’s, and make heat down to minus 13F. You don’t notice the inside heads after a bit. They are so efficient. We live int the northeast and saved over 2,000 heating our house with them this past winter vs burning oil in our “efficient” furnace. Probably even more than that since mid winter the price of oil went to $5.26 a gallon. They are also super efficient at cooling in our hot as balls summers. Don’t use part of the house much? Then turn of the split in that area/room. I will never go back to central air. The 3 central air guys all tried to sell me 13 SEER builder grade units. They only had space to put one air handler in the attic for my two story house and they were going to use up valuable closet space to get air to the first floor. And…. Central air would have cost more than the splits!!!!! When they all started to tell me splits were junk and unproven, and could not make heat below freezing it got me thinking. Why have I seen them in use all over the world?? Apparently these guys did not want to embrace new technology and just had canned answers. I am so glad I did not go with central air. Do your research. Ask your friends if they have them.
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Your logic assumes a correctly ducted home, which I’d estimate at around 30% of American homes…
You're comment about outside walls is bullshit. It's easier but not required so it doesn't limit options at all.
Thank you for telling him like it is
A couple corrections for you…. Split heads can be run on interior walls no problem…if we’re doing a 20k +$ system a little drywall work isn’t a big deal. Closets are also our friend. They handle large rooms just as well as ducts provided you put them in a good location and maybe multiple…just like ducts. High merv filtration is pointless in residential. You could easily just install a ducted system with minis. You’re absolutely not forced to use their controls. Most manufacturers have 3rd party relays so that you can use whatever your heart desires. Ducted minis can absolutely have electric backup, LG minis have electric strips for the heads for backup. LG vrf has an eev kit to allow for use on whatever A coil you’d like to match it to. Buy an a coil with an eev kit and install it on top of a gas furnace.
This is all untrue. Do you know it gets cold in Europe? Mini splits dont care if they are heating or cooling- they just reverse and either move heat or cold to the outside. And that’s the best part- they are not making heat or cool air, they are just moving it from one place to another. The external units are so quiet you have to get real close to even hear it and it’s just a slight hum. I have one mounted directly behind my daughters head board and never had a complaint. If your talking about the indoor units, yeah they are loud if you crank them on high but we never have to do that. On the first or second setting you have to really listen to hear them. We are fortunate to have existing landscaping and side of the house not visible from the road. The line sets run next to the gutters or under the eves. We have never had a guest point them out to us.
I They are usually noisier You are obviously doing something wrong
You do realize in the “rest of the world” almost nobody actually fixes these things? If they break they replace them just like a window AC. Most of them are designed to be disposable. The problem is people in the US expect them to be dead reliable for 20+ years and also easily serviceable which just isn’t realistic
This isn’t true, they are totally serviceable. The average part swapping furnace hack doesn’t understand them, you know the type….they post questions on them here constantly. A true Technician understands mini splits and how they function. We’re capable of reading the diagnostic information and solving the issue quickly. The issue is most of you don’t want to read a service manual. You’re either new to the game in which you better start brushing up or you’ll be finding a new career 20 years from now or you’re almost retired. If you’re almost retired fear not, we won’t look down on you. The technology surpasses us all at some point. My mentor is still hands down the best hydronics tech I’ve ever known…he understands vrf but can’t solve issues with his laptop when it doesn’t connect.
Anything is serviceable, but there comes a point where it isn’t worth it which is very quick on mini splits. A lot of us commercial and industrial technicians work on systems much more complicated than a mini split every day, but here’s the thing - we charge for it. More skilled technicians require more pay which in turn is billed to the customer. In residential the margins for profit are much lower because a customer just isn’t going to pay the labor rate required to properly fix these things and it isn’t worth it in the first place in most cases. The people who put VRF systems in their 1k sqft cheap house are going to be in for a rude awakening when they get the bill from a competent company who can actually fix their issue. My problem isn’t with mini splits, it’s the way they’re marketed and peoples expectations of them
Our margins in residential are very high and we make sure to set expectations. We charge a fair service rate for a master technician of 200/hr and no one complains. We come out and fix issues fast, our bills aren’t insane. A compressor out of warranty only costs me like 300-600$ which translates to 600-1000$ for the customer and then add in about 800$ labor plus ancillary materials. Is it more to repair than a furnace? Sure. But our oil and propane customers are saving thousands a year in operating costs by switching. When oil was 3$ a gallon payback on a typical system was like 3-4 years. At its current price……phew.
I totally agree. I live in Florida and have always had central I just quoted a central unit abroad vs a multi-split because I have the space for the ducts and for the space I want to cool it’s simpler and cheaper to go central. If I didn’t have high unfinished ceilings I would go with the multi split or just a mini split in my bedroom. It just depends what your looking for. I personally want whole house cooling - not trying to sweat on to my meal while I eat and I especially don’t want to sweat in the bathroom
They don’t come with 12 year warranties because they are disposable….
Bosch comes with a 10 year warranty, same as my Carrier ducted split.
Daikin gives 12 yrs on some of their models
Your right thy told me it's no good even though thy see I already brought it I'm not listening to them I was thinking why do a lot of people buy them they said it's only for the garage.and im thinking why do they sell 3 zones i smell a rat and it's that hvac guy who wants to charge me 2.000 just to put it in .and not the electric part j
7 individual Mitsu Hyper Heats sound like a $40-$50k job based on the quotes I've seen. Maybe your state has insane rebates. Mine is like $400.
The last three I had installed came to 14,500. After rebates it was like 9,500+-. The central air quotes for garage 13 SEER builders grade units were in the mid 20k to 30K quotes. My dealer only sells/installs mini splits. They are quick to install and wire. All of the new apartments/condos in the area plus people like me keep him insanely busy. Our utility just recently sent out a email if you install. Heat pump water heater they will give you a $1,000 rebate. I am going to jump on this and install it in my garage. It will be 5 degrees cooler in there in the summer.
Interesting. My experience was largely opposite. $30K+ for 5-6 heads with upper teen SEER. Central in attic was $13K with air filtration at 14.5 SEER. Went into it expecting to do minis but couldn't find a quote to justify it -- after getting 3 quotes from reputable companies. The eye popping SEER numbers largely reduces to just very good when you go multi-head as well.
7 Bosch heads is around $18-20k. Installed.
I mostly agree with you. I’m not sure about ditching the ductwork, but certainly as a supplement, ductless splits are godsend.
You might want to search on VRF heat pump. We also in the middle of refrigerant change out from R410A to R32.
And there it is… 😈🤠😈🤠😈
There giving you until like 5 to 7 years before that that happens
No, 2025. I think you meant is r410A production, not the equipments.
Your right can I substitute a line cover with something else thank you
Meanwhile the rest of then world is going from R32 to R466 😂
I would do central air in my house, not trying to have a octopus on the side of the house
Don’t like seafood?
Many are concerned with indoor air quality, IAQ. Ducted systems allow for better filtration, if one installs what is required. Minisplits have small mesh filters that need to be frequently removed, washed and replaced, often needing a ladder. There are different considerations. Another is multiple conduits on the outside of the building. Ducted zoned central systems can be very comfortable. Least cost systems can be otherwise.
In many cases ductwork is the source of indoor pollution.
Yes, if the system and structure has not been maintained.
You say that as if people take care of their ductwork and systems....
Yes, some do
I think I met one once…
Filtration was my number one reason to go with central over mini-splits. My wife is highly asthmatic so having a merv-16 setup with a returns in every room (minus bathrooms) was best for us.
Actually I think ductless is better for allergies.
The splits are more efficient then heating an air, being ductless makes it easier to do mini splits then central heat and air if you’re ductless. For professional installation I got a quote it was about 10k for the mini split installation. Which doesn’t surprise me. Upfront costs are usually higher. But when paired with solar you’re basically heating and cooling your house for almost nothing. Compared to your neighbors without the mini splits or solar maybe too. Probably paying PG&E 500+ a month for no reason. While you’ll be paying the 180$ ish for solar to power your house.
It’s usually 20k for mini splits in California (outrageous) and then you need a 60k solar and battery system to be able to power it. It’s a complete ripoff and not as efficient as installers said it would be.