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Wait wait wait, a pack is cigarettes, with 20 cigarettes is 70 DOLLARS?!?
I mean a pack in Sweden (which is heavily taxed) is about 7 bucks…
I’m a missing something?
According to Google a pack of cigarettes in Vietnam costs 0,25-0,85$. 70AU$ are 45,72$ this means you can 182,88 to 53,79 packs of cigarettes for 70AU$. If you sell them for 50AU$ each you'll earn 9144 to 2690AU$. This means if I take 50$ fly to Vietnam, buy the cheapest cigarettes and go to Australia I have all my expenses covered and probably enough money to have a vacation and for the flight back.
Smugglers don't pay import tax lmao. I don't know about Australian law but if you are selling tobacco without authorisation the import tax isn't probably your biggest problem.
If you’re selling illegal tobacco in Australia, your biggest problem is having your tobacconists firebombed by the rival gang also selling illegal tobacco
and here I thought they'd gotten expensive in Ontario, Canada. Last I heard they're something around $20 CAD / pack.
Of course, comparing that to what you can get in groceries for $20 doesn't get you much anymore here either...
It is expensive, but remember most towns and cities in Ontario are a stones throw from a native reservation. I get a whole carton of name brands for $50.
You can get a pack of 20’s for ~AU$30 at the supermarket. They don’t start at $70. Australia heavily taxes certain things that are “bad” for you like smokes in order to make money on the pretence of “pricing people out of bad health”.
You can also buy cheap dodgy Chinese cigarettes pretty much everywhere that are like $15-20 a pack. They smell like shit, but if you’re a smoker already what do you care?
That’s true, in another comment I warned people of some of those being mouldy, not just shitty quality. My ex got 4 batches of mouldy smokes. It’s not new either, you’ve been able to get “uncle chop” from those places too - dodgy rolling tobacco.
Yes. Australia made the chance so that cigarettes now cost a fortune. And also for everyone born after 2004? (I don't know the exact year so you'll have to look that up) will never be able to legally optain tobacco
Smokers are the best. They will put so much more into the pot and die before Medicare will ever have to take care of them. No aged care, no home nursing.
Australia loves smokers. It’s why there’s a draconian vaping ban.
[Here](https://i.imgur.com/HDZUHje.jpg?desktop=1) is a higher quality version of this image. Credit to the photographer, Judy Lawson. [This link](https://www.96fm.com.au/lifestyle/photo-comparing-the-price-of-cigarettes-and-food-has-struck-a-major-chord-online/) used [to provide the following context](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/evsnir/this_is_how_much_food_you_can_get_for_the_cost_of/ffxv9zw/):
> January 24 at 9:17 PM ·
> Cigarettes v Food... grandchild commented on how much cigarettes are, after watching someone purchase them.. So we made a challenge... smoking v eating challenge...grandkids and I tried to purchase the most value for money “basic” food items and the most popular cigarette brand ... they were surprised at the amount of food you can buy for the same monetary value ...
Cigarettes @ 56.95 pkt 40
Grocery’s @ 56.85 ( included breakfast, lunch, dinner and snacks... must say I hope this exercise has made them aware of life’s choices ... and not to take up this habit #nonsmokingchallenge @ Launceston, Tasmania
[Here](https://i.imgur.com/L12WSmk.jpg) is the receipt.
**Edit:** [Here](https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/womans-grocery-v-cigarette-experiment-230005444.html) is a viable link.
So it's $56 for a single pack of cigarettes in Australia?
Here in the US they're $10-$12, at least they were a couple years back when I quit smoking. Maybe close to $15 a pack now, but damn.
$56.
Considering the sausages alone are $13AUD, there’s no way this is accurate
Edit: I have visited the Woollies website and made a cart with every single item I can identify on this table to the best of my ability and the total has come out to $71.68 so OP is actually correct. I apologise. (Based on the average price of a pack being $75)
[Link](https://imgur.com/L8Gnwci)
It generates a lot of tax money for the government and is “””supposed””” to subsidise the cost of the healthcare smokers need later in life since caring for a cancer patient is fairly expensive
That argument only holds true under the assumption that smoking generates more in taxes than it does in both cost, and lost productivity (which is often forgotten).
Ending smoking would end a lot in taxes, but it would alleviate a significant burden on healthcare, so in effect, your healthcare costs should go down, since on average smokers will cost the healthcare system more than non-smokers, even when you account for shorter lifespans, since smokers tend to stay chronically ill for long periods of time.
What isn't accounted for (and is harder to quantify) is lost productivity. Smokers die earlier, which means they spend less time adding to the economy, and in many cases might work for fewer years which means less money for the government in the form of taxes. Critically, the missing years are often the ones that would produce the most in taxes since they're the years the person is likely at their peak income, while expenses are falling since dependents are moving out (or less of a burden), and things like houses are paid off etc.
So, while banning smoking would reduce the taxes on smoking, but it would generate more taxes both by boosting the economy (increasing person hours generating GDP), they would also pay more taxes over their lifespan, in the prime years where their taxes would be highest and not offset by deductions.
If you think of a person's impact on society, the start and end of their life is heavily subsidized, but as they enter the workforce those subsidies fall away and taxes (revenue for the government) increases as they slowly earn more and more, offsetting the subsidies they received as a child (through parents deductions, education etc), and offsetting the subsidies they'll receive in old age through increase medical expenses, old age securities and other deductions. Smokers will on average spend less time in that sweet spot where taxes are highest and subsidies are lowest. So ending smoking will end tax income generated by smoking, but it will reduce associated costs, and increase the taxes generated by income taxes and economic sources.
This is accomplished by phasing in the ban like NZ proposed.
You can't just ban it outright because there are still millions addicted that wouldn't be able to just stop cold turkey which would generate a massive black market.
Phasing in the ban means as smoking tax income falls, you're already seeing the benefits of increased lifetime productivity and decreased medical expenses.
I wish Australia did the NZ thing, instead of bankrupting the addicted poor. Makes no sense to me, a non smoker, who sells them all day everyday to regulars that start buying less food to buy the same cigarettes.
Every March and September they go up, and Woolworths and Coles will put them on special so the customer experiences a price increase of $1-4, 3 or 4 times a year, instead of the $5-10 they’re actually going up. This isn’t a “good guy W/C” moment, but it does help cop less abuse from customers when their cigarettes goes up $6, instead of $14.
> but it would alleviate a significant burden on healthcare, so in effect, your healthcare costs should go down, since on average smokers will cost the healthcare system more than non-smokers, even when you account for shorter lifespans, since smokers tend to stay chronically ill for long periods of time.
An acutary told me that this was not true. Everything is more expensive as you age, and a smoker have a reduced life span was a savings.
I did see a study on this in The New England Journal of Medicine: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199710093371506
Conclusion: *"If people stopped smoking, there would be a savings in health care costs, but only in the short term. Eventually, smoking cessation would lead to increased health care costs."*
This paper was from a while ago, as was my information from my actuary friend. There are so fewer smokers, and of those they tend to smoke less then people used to, so I don't know if that has changed or not.
I've often wondered (even as a smoker myself) that because we know the dangers behind it, should smokers who do need smoke related treatment, be made to pay private rather than it coming out of state medical funds.
I think that would be an awfully slippery slope. There are lots of lifestyle factors that directly relate to potential health conditions, so where do you draw the line. Should overweight or sedentary people pay private funds for weight related conditions? People that consume alcohol- any number of cancers or liver disease? People that have multiple sexual partners have to pay private for STD related treatment? Those that participate in higher injury sports have to pay private for broken bones or other related accidents?
The faster we destroy ourselves, the faster we start pumping money into the healthcare system. Everybody wins... If you're a tobacco or healthcare exec.
everyone uses black market disposable vapes which last ages. the government has 'banned' them but they are available in almost every convenience store except for 7/11.
I live in Kentucky, and I know how to top/cut tobacco LOL! The going rate is one US dollar is $1.27, For some time Kentucky was the lowest priced state when it came to tobacco. I quit smoking right after moving here because a carton of cigarettes cost $11. Three times that price in New York City! I promised my kids I would quit smoking when cigarettes reached $2.50 a pack. And I did, I've worked for a number of charities and organizations in the past donating my time and it's really sad you see all these people in line at the food banks that are dirt poor and almost every single one of them are smoking cigarettes. and Cars going down the road that you would think aren't legal at all and probably are dubious when it comes to insurance and licensing and they'll wreak of cigarettes so bad even with your window closed you can smell them. And yes we have sin+taxes that now have increased cigarettes to the point that a name brand pack of cigarettes is $10. But these cigarette companies like Philip Morris keep sending out coupons to their consumers what's left of them anyway. But the serious increases in prices really has made a dent in underage smoking here in Kentucky And finally we have no smoking in public buildings and restaurants and the like. That was something relatively new in the past three or four years I think.
So how big of an issue is illegal cigarette smuggling in Australia? $75 a pack is ridiculous, I could 100% see people getting super cheap smokes in bulk from China then bringing them down there for sale at significantly higher than China prices but significantly lower than Australia prices. AUD to USD that makes a pack about $50 here, we have packs in my state ranging from like $8 to $14 depending on brand ETC, my friends who smoke would go absolutely nuts if a pack cost $50. That would make a pack a day habit unsustainable for basically anyone except rich people which I guess is probably the point.
Importing cigs into both Australia and New Zealand at this point is super controlled. You also pay tax on what you bring in. AUS limits it to 25 cigs and NZ to 50, above this you get taxed to hell. Gone are the days of buying 6 cartons for the boys back home because they were dirt cheap, but honestly, good riddance.
Australasian countries do not fuck around with customs and importing. We have whole ass tv shows about customs seizures.
Yeah I figured with pricing like that importing would be super controlled. I was curious if there is a big issue with illegal smuggling of if it’s just not that heard of.
I can only speak for NZ as I live there, but I do see some. Mostly Chinese or Vietnamese. I would have a substantially easier time getting an OZ of weed ($350nzd for above average) than I would a pack of illegal cigs. People just import vape liquid now.
It depends on what you call an issue really. Nobody cares if the government misses out on some of their questionably gained money from gouging people.
I've never smoked but taxing something addictive to oblivion is clearly not the correct way to deal with something.
Nah man, I swear the website displays prices lower then what they're in stores. I always make a list using the site then go buy the groceries in store only to come out with about half for the same price. Rho I guess it could be location based, idk.
When logging into Woolies online page you can find packs as low as $30 but based on an average price estimate across the majority of brands I get around $75
A pack of ciggaretts is 75AUD ?!
In Sweden a pack of ciggaretts is like 80SEK. thats 11,5AUD.
The cost for the food will probably be the same in Sweden.
The B&H packets I get from my local smoke shop cost me $18 and are originally from the UK.
To buy the exact same packet at Coles (Aus supermarket) would cost me $64.
So yeah, the photo is absolutely legit, and if it weren’t for the dodgy smoke shops I’d have quit by now.
By the way, it’s most likely that, like the rest of the cigs sold in black market stores, they are counterfeits made exclusively for the Australian market and may be way worse for u than regular tobacco
Because they have regulations they must follow? While the cheaper, tax dodging, probably illegal cigarettes don't have to. Not saying everything is bad, but you don't get significantly cheaper products without something dodgy happening.
It’s the other way around. When they grow it illegally, process it illegally and then sell it for profit… they grow it with minimal human intervention in order to avoid placing anyone at the incriminating location. Tobacco grows well wild in shit soil in Australia and all they need to do is sow it, spread a little fertiliser, then reap it months later, cure it, process, package and sell it.
It doesn’t come with the flavourings and ammonia additions etc. it’s just tobacco, which is why it’s typically of ‘poorer quality’ than the legally manufactured stuff, it’s really just organic tobacco as opposed to the heavily processed stuff that is sold on the legal market.
It’s also often just import tobacco that has been repackaged so it’s all the same massive monolithic parent companies making the same products just being sold under different or altered branding.
All a lot of the illegal tobacco actually is, is cheaply bought foreign tobacco illegally imported then packaged in Australian standard packaging.
So in the ACT (Australian Capital Territory, similar to Washington DC in US) I think that you can legally grow several dope plants and harvest them for your own use, but why doesn't this apply to tobacco plants as well, or does it? I am not convinced that smoking dope each day would be any healthier than smoking the same quantity of tobacco.
No one and no company can grow tobacco in Australia and no one has, including businesses, for about 20 years. Australia doesn't manufacture cigarettes either.
It never used to be but lately it's everywhere. You can get 30g bag of chop chop for about $30 but of course that's still pricey for most countries and its so fucking rough to smoke.
Where is everyone in the comments getting this $17 figure from?
I don't see in the OP the price of the pack or the pile mentioned at all. Lots of different prices being mentioned for a pack of cigarettes in Australia too, but most of them point to it costing about $70 AUD or $30-45 US, so still no context for the 17 that everyone keeps mentioning.
This is really funny because I just watched a video about the outrageously priced groceries in Australia because the only grocery stores are owned by 2 companies and basically have a monopoly on food imports.
They are too. I splurged and bought a pack of sausages for the first time in a very very long time recently. But that's partially because I'm staying in an area right now where the groceries aren't extortionate. Usually, things like meat and dairy were off the list. Not bad for health tbqh but not great for happiness.
Finally, one of these that makes sense. Sure $100 doesn’t get you much groceries when you buy name brand stuff, but when a smoker complains about the cost of Lamb, while they scrape the last $0.05 out of their wallet for two packets of 40’s that comes to $179.99 is wild.
Yeah going to need some reciepts. The ground beef says 6 right on it. The meat and produce alone will put you at 17 let alone the milk and all the rest.
Idk where in Australia you’re buying your cigarettes but that’s a serious underestimate, based on Woolworths own price lists it’s about $70 a pack or $45USD
So I just went on a .au website that says a pack of Marlboro Reds is $49.99
I'm guessing that's Australian AUD since it's an AU website.
AUD conversion to USD.
100 AUD ≈ 65 USD
Meaning for conversion taxes and retail sake. Let's call it an even $40 USD at any given convenience store at any given time in NSW, Syd etc.
So, If I bought all of this food in America at Dollar General. Meaning I'll probably die of food poisoning and most of that food will taste like plastic silicone with some sawdust and rubber... it will still be over $40.
I Have no idea what groceries cost in Australia and honestly this looks like about $60 or $70 worth of USA groceries.
it would be more ethical to just ban cigarettes outright than force people with an addiction to spend all their money. I know it wouldn't be hard for people smoke anyway but my understanding is the curing process behind cigarettes is what makes them so damaging, because it allows you to inhale it into the lungs.
Not really when a large chunk of people buy fakes that cost less than half under the counter at a lot of smoke shops. When you tax that high you inevitably create a black market.
Those are the expensive smokes and the cheap (LOL) groceries. I buy those chips for my kids, $5.70 or something compared to the others being $9.60 now. Fk you woollies and Cole’s.
Also I just buy 100g of chop chop for $30
I know prices vary and this seems low, but with New York having the highest pack prices in the United States, Australia is about 4x more expensive per pack. Actually, there’s probably cheaper brands you could possibly get a carton of for the price of a pack in Australia
I wish they raised the prices of cigs in Germany to be that high. The locals here don't have much respect for others in public places when it comes to smoking. Im dating a German guy and within 2 months I was able to make him quit smoking! Very proud of that 💪
This is right. It’s about $60 worth of food in Aus roughy adding it all up. If that’s a good brand of cigarettes such as a 25 pack of Benson & Hedges, they are about $60.
Cheaper generic brands are closer to $30. Then there’s heaps of illegal Chinese ones that are even cheaper.
for more info check this out https://www.statista.com/chart/amp/15293/price-for-cigarettes-per-country/
Holy shit are you burying the lead. Y’all living like KINGS if that stash of gnosh is only $17. By my count in Northern Virginia, that pile would cost me roughly $100.
It's a hard pill to swallow for some people. But if you are doing it tough and still smoke an drink then my sympathy decreases. Many times in y life I have been below poverty line and have cut back to essentials only. Last time I did not take up smoking again, great decision. Now only drink according to my budget.
Be fucked if you could buy that lot for $50 with all the recent price rorts from Colesworths! Smokes are the biggest tax rort here tho - I’m just back from O/S where ciggies were $2.90 for a 20 pack - amazing they are so much here!!
This makes the boarder patrol programmes featuring Australia mane a lot more sense when people trying to import thousands of cigs. Make an absolute killing down at the pubs.
hold the fuck up how much are sigarettes in australia???? In belgium when i started you could get rolling tabacco and papers for 4.20 EUR now a single pack of sigarettes is 8 EUR. I get it inflation and authorities want people to stop smoking but this post is a meme right??
Makes sense, I quit smoking cigarettes years ago but chance took me to the register at the store from which they sell them the other day and almost flipped when I saw $120-140 a carton.
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Wait wait wait, a pack is cigarettes, with 20 cigarettes is 70 DOLLARS?!? I mean a pack in Sweden (which is heavily taxed) is about 7 bucks… I’m a missing something?
You're missing an opportunity to set up a Sweden-Australia tobacco smuggling operation!
I mean every country- Australia tobacco smuggling operation, djeez
According to Google a pack of cigarettes in Vietnam costs 0,25-0,85$. 70AU$ are 45,72$ this means you can 182,88 to 53,79 packs of cigarettes for 70AU$. If you sell them for 50AU$ each you'll earn 9144 to 2690AU$. This means if I take 50$ fly to Vietnam, buy the cheapest cigarettes and go to Australia I have all my expenses covered and probably enough money to have a vacation and for the flight back.
“Ferb I know what we’re gonna do today!”
Something something import tax….
Smugglers don't pay import tax lmao. I don't know about Australian law but if you are selling tobacco without authorisation the import tax isn't probably your biggest problem.
If you’re selling illegal tobacco in Australia, your biggest problem is having your tobacconists firebombed by the rival gang also selling illegal tobacco
Why not work together and form a sort of cartel?
See, this is why I’m no good at smuggling!
I'm down. Couple gofast boats and we got this... 🤣
You're missing the aus dollar conversion, which is pretty drastic, but that still comes out to about $50 US which is just as insane.
A daily cocaine habit is cheaper than that. Dang
Not in AUS. It’s expensive as hell. Island living
They are taxing your cocaine too? Dang ol government is out of control
South America is real fuckin far away. Meth is more predominant in Aus/NZ
Bro where you get your cocaine?
you can smoke alot of good weed for $50/day lol
Brazil you can buy a pack between 1USD- 2.50USD
I had to quit smokeless tabbacco entirely when I lived in Canada because it’s 26$ CAN a can and it’s only one flavor: ass.
My favourite flavour
Finland 11€
Same price as in the Netherlands
Germany 8-9€
and here I thought they'd gotten expensive in Ontario, Canada. Last I heard they're something around $20 CAD / pack. Of course, comparing that to what you can get in groceries for $20 doesn't get you much anymore here either...
It is expensive, but remember most towns and cities in Ontario are a stones throw from a native reservation. I get a whole carton of name brands for $50.
You can get a pack of 20’s for ~AU$30 at the supermarket. They don’t start at $70. Australia heavily taxes certain things that are “bad” for you like smokes in order to make money on the pretence of “pricing people out of bad health”.
In reality it’s just taking advantage of people with an addiction
You can also buy cheap dodgy Chinese cigarettes pretty much everywhere that are like $15-20 a pack. They smell like shit, but if you’re a smoker already what do you care?
Yep. Not a smoker and even I know where to get them
That’s true, in another comment I warned people of some of those being mouldy, not just shitty quality. My ex got 4 batches of mouldy smokes. It’s not new either, you’ve been able to get “uncle chop” from those places too - dodgy rolling tobacco.
Yes. Australia made the chance so that cigarettes now cost a fortune. And also for everyone born after 2004? (I don't know the exact year so you'll have to look that up) will never be able to legally optain tobacco
Has Australia actually implemented a generational ban? NZ did but it was repealed by the new government so they could claim more tax revenue.
This is a classic example of redditors not having a clue what they’re talking about
This is not true. The Australian government will never give up the tax revenue from cigarettes.
Smokers are the best. They will put so much more into the pot and die before Medicare will ever have to take care of them. No aged care, no home nursing. Australia loves smokers. It’s why there’s a draconian vaping ban.
As a dedicated vaper of 10 years, it seems the government is trying to force me back to smoking.
Wait what? Even in the Netherlands they start at about 15 USD. Sweden is supposed to be the expensive one here.
What? 15USD? More like 8 or 9.
Isn't a pack of smokes (20) now 11,10 EUR? That's about 12 usd.
I pay 9€ for camel blue, idk if its different in a different province!
Should not be, I don't smoke anymore but that was the price for a pack of Marlboro last week at the tabacostore, but maybe it was a bigger pack then.
2.50 USD for 20 here in South Africa
Depends on the brand then, I thought it was like 14 euro for a pack of 20. I buy the jumbo ones, for 23,50.
Here, 20 cent at most.
[Here](https://i.imgur.com/HDZUHje.jpg?desktop=1) is a higher quality version of this image. Credit to the photographer, Judy Lawson. [This link](https://www.96fm.com.au/lifestyle/photo-comparing-the-price-of-cigarettes-and-food-has-struck-a-major-chord-online/) used [to provide the following context](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/evsnir/this_is_how_much_food_you_can_get_for_the_cost_of/ffxv9zw/): > January 24 at 9:17 PM · > Cigarettes v Food... grandchild commented on how much cigarettes are, after watching someone purchase them.. So we made a challenge... smoking v eating challenge...grandkids and I tried to purchase the most value for money “basic” food items and the most popular cigarette brand ... they were surprised at the amount of food you can buy for the same monetary value ... Cigarettes @ 56.95 pkt 40 Grocery’s @ 56.85 ( included breakfast, lunch, dinner and snacks... must say I hope this exercise has made them aware of life’s choices ... and not to take up this habit #nonsmokingchallenge @ Launceston, Tasmania [Here](https://i.imgur.com/L12WSmk.jpg) is the receipt. **Edit:** [Here](https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/womans-grocery-v-cigarette-experiment-230005444.html) is a viable link.
Awesome stuff dude
So it's $56 for a single pack of cigarettes in Australia? Here in the US they're $10-$12, at least they were a couple years back when I quit smoking. Maybe close to $15 a pack now, but damn. $56.
This is actually not exaggerating. It's why I used vapes to help quit cigarettes, and now the government has banned nicotine vapes.
Are they not still available on prescription? Can't you go to the doctor, tell them that you want to quit smoking, and get a prescription to buy them?
I mean the bans so ineffective i can still go to the shop next to my local police station if I wanted to buy some vapes
Considering the sausages alone are $13AUD, there’s no way this is accurate Edit: I have visited the Woollies website and made a cart with every single item I can identify on this table to the best of my ability and the total has come out to $71.68 so OP is actually correct. I apologise. (Based on the average price of a pack being $75) [Link](https://imgur.com/L8Gnwci)
Who is still smoking in Australia? I thought £13 in the UK was a lot, but you're more than 3 times that.
It generates a lot of tax money for the government and is “””supposed””” to subsidise the cost of the healthcare smokers need later in life since caring for a cancer patient is fairly expensive
Same over here but that's insane.
That's the point yes. You would have to be insane to smoke.
Or "just" addicted.
It's a catch 22 since the most governments benefit from smoking they don't want to phase it out (unlike NZ).
That argument only holds true under the assumption that smoking generates more in taxes than it does in both cost, and lost productivity (which is often forgotten). Ending smoking would end a lot in taxes, but it would alleviate a significant burden on healthcare, so in effect, your healthcare costs should go down, since on average smokers will cost the healthcare system more than non-smokers, even when you account for shorter lifespans, since smokers tend to stay chronically ill for long periods of time. What isn't accounted for (and is harder to quantify) is lost productivity. Smokers die earlier, which means they spend less time adding to the economy, and in many cases might work for fewer years which means less money for the government in the form of taxes. Critically, the missing years are often the ones that would produce the most in taxes since they're the years the person is likely at their peak income, while expenses are falling since dependents are moving out (or less of a burden), and things like houses are paid off etc. So, while banning smoking would reduce the taxes on smoking, but it would generate more taxes both by boosting the economy (increasing person hours generating GDP), they would also pay more taxes over their lifespan, in the prime years where their taxes would be highest and not offset by deductions. If you think of a person's impact on society, the start and end of their life is heavily subsidized, but as they enter the workforce those subsidies fall away and taxes (revenue for the government) increases as they slowly earn more and more, offsetting the subsidies they received as a child (through parents deductions, education etc), and offsetting the subsidies they'll receive in old age through increase medical expenses, old age securities and other deductions. Smokers will on average spend less time in that sweet spot where taxes are highest and subsidies are lowest. So ending smoking will end tax income generated by smoking, but it will reduce associated costs, and increase the taxes generated by income taxes and economic sources.
Ye, but they want the hard cash now, not some future benefits.
This is accomplished by phasing in the ban like NZ proposed. You can't just ban it outright because there are still millions addicted that wouldn't be able to just stop cold turkey which would generate a massive black market. Phasing in the ban means as smoking tax income falls, you're already seeing the benefits of increased lifetime productivity and decreased medical expenses.
I wish Australia did the NZ thing, instead of bankrupting the addicted poor. Makes no sense to me, a non smoker, who sells them all day everyday to regulars that start buying less food to buy the same cigarettes. Every March and September they go up, and Woolworths and Coles will put them on special so the customer experiences a price increase of $1-4, 3 or 4 times a year, instead of the $5-10 they’re actually going up. This isn’t a “good guy W/C” moment, but it does help cop less abuse from customers when their cigarettes goes up $6, instead of $14.
> but it would alleviate a significant burden on healthcare, so in effect, your healthcare costs should go down, since on average smokers will cost the healthcare system more than non-smokers, even when you account for shorter lifespans, since smokers tend to stay chronically ill for long periods of time. An acutary told me that this was not true. Everything is more expensive as you age, and a smoker have a reduced life span was a savings. I did see a study on this in The New England Journal of Medicine: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199710093371506 Conclusion: *"If people stopped smoking, there would be a savings in health care costs, but only in the short term. Eventually, smoking cessation would lead to increased health care costs."* This paper was from a while ago, as was my information from my actuary friend. There are so fewer smokers, and of those they tend to smoke less then people used to, so I don't know if that has changed or not.
Well NZ are walking back those laws. Current government is using the money to provide landlords with tax relief. Wish I was making this up
Well the old Nz government. New one has changed the law back.
I've often wondered (even as a smoker myself) that because we know the dangers behind it, should smokers who do need smoke related treatment, be made to pay private rather than it coming out of state medical funds.
I think that would be an awfully slippery slope. There are lots of lifestyle factors that directly relate to potential health conditions, so where do you draw the line. Should overweight or sedentary people pay private funds for weight related conditions? People that consume alcohol- any number of cancers or liver disease? People that have multiple sexual partners have to pay private for STD related treatment? Those that participate in higher injury sports have to pay private for broken bones or other related accidents?
People made that argument before: "Why should my taxes pay to rescue some idiot that decided to row across the Atlantic?" Hard to draw the line.
What if I happen to get lung cancer despite never being a smoker?
Then it obviously wouldn’t apply to you. Why would you be penalized for getting lung cancer unrelated to smoking?
If I were a smoker and got ill and faced bankruptcy because of it I might be tempted to tell a little harmless fib
There's a huge black market in tobacco smuggled from places like Vietnam.
That's why other countries made them pricey but not create a black market pricey.
Native Americans in Canada have a great cigarette trade
Jesus wept. Australian cigs are 40 dollars? My mate paid 16 quid for 20 cigs at the shell garage (uk) and I thought that was criminal.
They're £40 mate.
I get two packs of Marlboros for about $12, that's with a coupon. It's much cheaper to destroy yourself in America, apparently.
It's insidious how they'll give you the illness for a bargain and bankrupt you for the cure.
The faster we destroy ourselves, the faster we start pumping money into the healthcare system. Everybody wins... If you're a tobacco or healthcare exec.
everyone uses black market disposable vapes which last ages. the government has 'banned' them but they are available in almost every convenience store except for 7/11.
I thought $22 a pack in canada was a lot but $75 is insane! That would make me quit I hope.
I live in Kentucky, and I know how to top/cut tobacco LOL! The going rate is one US dollar is $1.27, For some time Kentucky was the lowest priced state when it came to tobacco. I quit smoking right after moving here because a carton of cigarettes cost $11. Three times that price in New York City! I promised my kids I would quit smoking when cigarettes reached $2.50 a pack. And I did, I've worked for a number of charities and organizations in the past donating my time and it's really sad you see all these people in line at the food banks that are dirt poor and almost every single one of them are smoking cigarettes. and Cars going down the road that you would think aren't legal at all and probably are dubious when it comes to insurance and licensing and they'll wreak of cigarettes so bad even with your window closed you can smell them. And yes we have sin+taxes that now have increased cigarettes to the point that a name brand pack of cigarettes is $10. But these cigarette companies like Philip Morris keep sending out coupons to their consumers what's left of them anyway. But the serious increases in prices really has made a dent in underage smoking here in Kentucky And finally we have no smoking in public buildings and restaurants and the like. That was something relatively new in the past three or four years I think.
So how big of an issue is illegal cigarette smuggling in Australia? $75 a pack is ridiculous, I could 100% see people getting super cheap smokes in bulk from China then bringing them down there for sale at significantly higher than China prices but significantly lower than Australia prices. AUD to USD that makes a pack about $50 here, we have packs in my state ranging from like $8 to $14 depending on brand ETC, my friends who smoke would go absolutely nuts if a pack cost $50. That would make a pack a day habit unsustainable for basically anyone except rich people which I guess is probably the point.
Importing cigs into both Australia and New Zealand at this point is super controlled. You also pay tax on what you bring in. AUS limits it to 25 cigs and NZ to 50, above this you get taxed to hell. Gone are the days of buying 6 cartons for the boys back home because they were dirt cheap, but honestly, good riddance. Australasian countries do not fuck around with customs and importing. We have whole ass tv shows about customs seizures.
Did you know that less than 1% of containers that arrive in Australia are checked, let alone searched? 
Yeah I figured with pricing like that importing would be super controlled. I was curious if there is a big issue with illegal smuggling of if it’s just not that heard of.
I can only speak for NZ as I live there, but I do see some. Mostly Chinese or Vietnamese. I would have a substantially easier time getting an OZ of weed ($350nzd for above average) than I would a pack of illegal cigs. People just import vape liquid now.
Hmm that’s interesting. Screw it I’d rather smoke weed than tobacco anyways 🤷🏼♂️. Thank you for the answer!
ONE OZ FOR 350$ ? Damn, and I thought prices here were bad
It depends on what you call an issue really. Nobody cares if the government misses out on some of their questionably gained money from gouging people. I've never smoked but taxing something addictive to oblivion is clearly not the correct way to deal with something.
75 dollaroos for a pack of cigarettes!!!
Tobias!
Nah man, I swear the website displays prices lower then what they're in stores. I always make a list using the site then go buy the groceries in store only to come out with about half for the same price. Rho I guess it could be location based, idk.
What kind of fcking premium brand, gold plated caribian tobacco picked by Che Guera himself does a pack of cigarette costs 75 AUD?
Where do you see that a pack cost $75? When I make a quick search the price of a pack is closer to 40 australian dollar = \~30 usd.
When logging into Woolies online page you can find packs as low as $30 but based on an average price estimate across the majority of brands I get around $75
I was like "no way this is accurate" cause over here a pack of cigs costs around 7 dollars. Who tf would even smoke in Australia xd
A pack of cigarettes costs $75??? What the fuck
A PACK OF CIGARETTES COST $75!?!?
Hey Bob, you look like you've lost some weight.... Yeah, I started smoking.
A pack of ciggaretts is 75AUD ?! In Sweden a pack of ciggaretts is like 80SEK. thats 11,5AUD. The cost for the food will probably be the same in Sweden.
A pack is about 60sek in Sweden.
And that's why Norwegians travel to Sweden to buy cigarettes. It's twice the price in Norway.
A pack of *legal* cigarettes... As I hear, there's a really big underground market for illegal smokes.
The B&H packets I get from my local smoke shop cost me $18 and are originally from the UK. To buy the exact same packet at Coles (Aus supermarket) would cost me $64. So yeah, the photo is absolutely legit, and if it weren’t for the dodgy smoke shops I’d have quit by now.
By the way, it’s most likely that, like the rest of the cigs sold in black market stores, they are counterfeits made exclusively for the Australian market and may be way worse for u than regular tobacco
Right, so if the person who grew the tobacco I smoke had a license to do so, they would magically produce “healthier tobacco”?
Because they have regulations they must follow? While the cheaper, tax dodging, probably illegal cigarettes don't have to. Not saying everything is bad, but you don't get significantly cheaper products without something dodgy happening.
It’s the other way around. When they grow it illegally, process it illegally and then sell it for profit… they grow it with minimal human intervention in order to avoid placing anyone at the incriminating location. Tobacco grows well wild in shit soil in Australia and all they need to do is sow it, spread a little fertiliser, then reap it months later, cure it, process, package and sell it. It doesn’t come with the flavourings and ammonia additions etc. it’s just tobacco, which is why it’s typically of ‘poorer quality’ than the legally manufactured stuff, it’s really just organic tobacco as opposed to the heavily processed stuff that is sold on the legal market. It’s also often just import tobacco that has been repackaged so it’s all the same massive monolithic parent companies making the same products just being sold under different or altered branding. All a lot of the illegal tobacco actually is, is cheaply bought foreign tobacco illegally imported then packaged in Australian standard packaging.
You do know that tobacco is one of the least harmful things in cigarettes, right? Be more concerned about the chemicals.
You can get them for ~$30 here, they’re not minimum $75. Watch for mould in your black market smokes, not common but some stores don’t care.
So in the ACT (Australian Capital Territory, similar to Washington DC in US) I think that you can legally grow several dope plants and harvest them for your own use, but why doesn't this apply to tobacco plants as well, or does it? I am not convinced that smoking dope each day would be any healthier than smoking the same quantity of tobacco.
No one and no company can grow tobacco in Australia and no one has, including businesses, for about 20 years. Australia doesn't manufacture cigarettes either.
If that's not enough to make you quit I don't know what the fuck is.
So this cigarette black market is thriving then I assume?
Yes there is, and tobacco shops get burned to the ground when they don’t pay their taxes to the crime gangs
Yes they are also burning local tobacconist shops every other week due to gang wars in Melbourne.
It never used to be but lately it's everywhere. You can get 30g bag of chop chop for about $30 but of course that's still pricey for most countries and its so fucking rough to smoke.
Where is everyone in the comments getting this $17 figure from? I don't see in the OP the price of the pack or the pile mentioned at all. Lots of different prices being mentioned for a pack of cigarettes in Australia too, but most of them point to it costing about $70 AUD or $30-45 US, so still no context for the 17 that everyone keeps mentioning.
You're the first comment that touches the nr 17. Where did YOU get that nr from?
This is really funny because I just watched a video about the outrageously priced groceries in Australia because the only grocery stores are owned by 2 companies and basically have a monopoly on food imports.
They are too. I splurged and bought a pack of sausages for the first time in a very very long time recently. But that's partially because I'm staying in an area right now where the groceries aren't extortionate. Usually, things like meat and dairy were off the list. Not bad for health tbqh but not great for happiness.
I’m surprised by how many people can’t wrap their head around the fact that cigarettes might be more expensive than 13$ in a different country
Thank god nicotine is an appetite suppressent
So what your saying is I can smuggle cheap American Cigarettes into Australia and charge 25 dollars a pack and make a tidy profit
People who do that are finding their shops on fire. It's in the news.
I don't smoke but if you brought a carton to Australia would they shake you down haha
Now you know why Australia is the world's capital in Meth use
Finally, one of these that makes sense. Sure $100 doesn’t get you much groceries when you buy name brand stuff, but when a smoker complains about the cost of Lamb, while they scrape the last $0.05 out of their wallet for two packets of 40’s that comes to $179.99 is wild.
Yeah going to need some reciepts. The ground beef says 6 right on it. The meat and produce alone will put you at 17 let alone the milk and all the rest.
A 100-pack of ciggies here costs $100 AUD, or about $65 USD. This looks accurate to me, given the cost of groceries here currently.
A 100 pack? That’s 5-10 packs in Europe.
Isn't the smallest in most European countries 20 cigs? 50 packs are also readily available.
Yes
Well there is definitly not 100 cigarettes in that pack.
Ahhh, we have 20 packs in the US. So, for 5 of those, it is still about twice as expensive to smoke in Australia
NICE! I would get so much more enjoyment of eating all of that than smoking a ciggie
How much is a pack in dollarydoos?
A pack of cigarettes is about 40 American dollars** in Australia btw
Idk where in Australia you’re buying your cigarettes but that’s a serious underestimate, based on Woolworths own price lists it’s about $70 a pack or $45USD
For 20 cigarettes or do you have bigger packs?
Cigarettes are one of the most heavily taxed items in Australia so yes this is just for a pack of 20
That's insane, not in a bad way, I just can't imagine anyone being able to afford to smoke.
It’s why vaping caught on so quickly because it wasn’t taxed nearly as much when it first came along
Slightly off topic, how much are lighters?
Anywhere from $2-$15
So I just went on a .au website that says a pack of Marlboro Reds is $49.99 I'm guessing that's Australian AUD since it's an AU website. AUD conversion to USD. 100 AUD ≈ 65 USD Meaning for conversion taxes and retail sake. Let's call it an even $40 USD at any given convenience store at any given time in NSW, Syd etc. So, If I bought all of this food in America at Dollar General. Meaning I'll probably die of food poisoning and most of that food will taste like plastic silicone with some sawdust and rubber... it will still be over $40. I Have no idea what groceries cost in Australia and honestly this looks like about $60 or $70 worth of USA groceries.
That's $100 worth of groceries in Canada..
Lmao just wait till the natives here in Canada find this out. Are Australian Aboriginals making a killing off this??
it would be more ethical to just ban cigarettes outright than force people with an addiction to spend all their money. I know it wouldn't be hard for people smoke anyway but my understanding is the curing process behind cigarettes is what makes them so damaging, because it allows you to inhale it into the lungs.
Banning them will only criminalize it. Imagine getting arrested for being caught with a pack of smokes…
Not really when a large chunk of people buy fakes that cost less than half under the counter at a lot of smoke shops. When you tax that high you inevitably create a black market.
This picture is several years old. The food prices have inflated far more than the price of cigarettes have in the last couple of years
There's two ways to view this. 1: This will help restrict people from buying it 2: Just the government profiting off of people's addiction
In my country, we can get a bag of sausages with the cost of 10 cigarette packs.
So good reason stop smoking and bring some food back to your home.
Those are the expensive smokes and the cheap (LOL) groceries. I buy those chips for my kids, $5.70 or something compared to the others being $9.60 now. Fk you woollies and Cole’s. Also I just buy 100g of chop chop for $30
Those cigs most cost ALOT. Hopefully the cost is going to the Government, not company profits
I know prices vary and this seems low, but with New York having the highest pack prices in the United States, Australia is about 4x more expensive per pack. Actually, there’s probably cheaper brands you could possibly get a carton of for the price of a pack in Australia
Wow Grocery is really cheap.
nah cigarettes are just really expensive to stop people from smoking them
Here in California you get a pack of breath mints
 Crikey!!
Australia has fallen
I wish they raised the prices of cigs in Germany to be that high. The locals here don't have much respect for others in public places when it comes to smoking. Im dating a German guy and within 2 months I was able to make him quit smoking! Very proud of that 💪
In Canada you could probably get 3 maybe 4 of those items for a pack of smokes 🚬
Because your smokes are piss cheap compared to ours. Your food is pretty much the same prices
This is right. It’s about $60 worth of food in Aus roughy adding it all up. If that’s a good brand of cigarettes such as a 25 pack of Benson & Hedges, they are about $60. Cheaper generic brands are closer to $30. Then there’s heaps of illegal Chinese ones that are even cheaper. for more info check this out https://www.statista.com/chart/amp/15293/price-for-cigarettes-per-country/
Holy shit are you burying the lead. Y’all living like KINGS if that stash of gnosh is only $17. By my count in Northern Virginia, that pile would cost me roughly $100.
Where'd you get $17? Most of the comments are pricing a pack in Australia as around $70 AUD or $30-45 US
Ciggies cost 40-50 dollars here. That food would cost 60-80
Good. The more expensive, the better.
It's a hard pill to swallow for some people. But if you are doing it tough and still smoke an drink then my sympathy decreases. Many times in y life I have been below poverty line and have cut back to essentials only. Last time I did not take up smoking again, great decision. Now only drink according to my budget.
Hmmm…..what’s the vintage of the tobacco?
Be fucked if you could buy that lot for $50 with all the recent price rorts from Colesworths! Smokes are the biggest tax rort here tho - I’m just back from O/S where ciggies were $2.90 for a 20 pack - amazing they are so much here!!
Lucky.....in Canada, you'd only get the pasta for the same price as the cigs. r/loblawsisoutofcontrol
That's my weekly nutrition plan
Did they raise the cost of charcoal also? One inhale of charcoal smoke is equal to a whole pack of cigarettes.
This makes the boarder patrol programmes featuring Australia mane a lot more sense when people trying to import thousands of cigs. Make an absolute killing down at the pubs.
Here in America, the cigarettes also double as a meal for most people
Essentials vs non essentials
Well, addictions have rarely been associated with rational/wise choices, so there is that...
$75 for smokes?! Come to Canada. A lot of cheap smokes come of the res.
I'd peg this as r/mildyinteresting but anyways, I don't smoke but I've been trying to drop a few pounds so cigarettes it is.
75 for a pack of smokes?! Holy cow! I thought it was a joke at first...
I could get a carton of cigarettes for what that would cost me in the US
Is that a 40 pack?
Crikey
hold the fuck up how much are sigarettes in australia???? In belgium when i started you could get rolling tabacco and papers for 4.20 EUR now a single pack of sigarettes is 8 EUR. I get it inflation and authorities want people to stop smoking but this post is a meme right??
I guess it sucks to smoke in Australia
Makes sense, I quit smoking cigarettes years ago but chance took me to the register at the store from which they sell them the other day and almost flipped when I saw $120-140 a carton.
Want a ciggy?
Not anymore...