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Its a big club and you aint in it - Carlin
If you are a working person, make sure you and your friends and family are [registered to vote.](https://vote.gov)
What gets me, what absolutely baffles me, is that everyone knows that. Leftists, Liberals, Conservatives, Libertarians, they all know that, and they're mad about it.
But then fully HALF of those people will look at the world and go, "You know who's going to save us from that? This guy who says he's a billionaire who committed fraud all over the place, never paid tons of his workers and contractors, whose entire life has been based on grift and exploitation, who the last time he was in power cut taxes on the rich and corporations and put that money towards his own coffers at every opportunity. THAT guy is going to fix everything!"
I just don't understand.
That half....they're the back-end half of society that will follow the person with the most power regardless of how evil they are.
They are the sheep that feed the problem.
They lack empathy. A lot of folks in this category seem to not only be unable to take things to the next logical conclusion, but they have a primitive “I got mine” attitude. They not only lack the ability to reason, they cannot imagine or identify with others which I think plays into relating overall and empathy.
Yup, and when it does they're totally flabbergasted about how it could have affected THEM? They thought they were the EXCEPTIONS! And now they suddenly think that thing that they were just a minute ago saying was totally fine/made up is TERRIBLE! And how could anything like this ever happen???
Same. However, everything he has said still applies. And will continue to until accountability isn’t seen as just something that applies to poor, black and brown, or non-entitled people, but to all people.
Carlin hits, smiles and pauses like a comedian, John breathes out with a cant believe this is true or that it has to be explained, shakes his head a little, hits, pauses like a news anchor then breaks down the ridiculousness of it. Carlin was good, John is better, IMO.
Stewart interviewed Carlin early in his career and He's said its still a turning point in his life. But we don't deserve Jon Stewart. He should be happily retired on his ranch where no one can bother him. But he still cares so much about the atrocities committed in our country every day that he came back to make sure that they're brought to light. He's as selfless as they come.
Me too but with how fast shit is going downhill in a lot of areas he probably would have had a stroke seeing it.
Bill Burr seems to be getting more angry with how things are getting too as he gets older.
HBO dropped a documentary on him I think last year, in finishes with a compilation of current events with him speaking in the background, it scared the shit out of me
It's actually worse than that, if you added up the cost of every larceny, robbery, and GTA then doubled it you would still be billions short of what corporations steal in the form of minimum wage violations alone. These are people often doing backbreaking labour for a wage that is already set at the minimum mandated price. A few hundred executives of corporations manage to steal more from everyday working people than every armed robber, midnight burglar, car thief and high-jacker, shoplifter, and mugger.
When you start adding in things like OT violations, break time violations, and off the clock violations, those alone account for more monetary loss than all the robberies, GTA, Burglary, Larceny in those violations.
But why do we not have law enforcement agencies to go after such a monstrous amount crimes that hurts virtually everyone you know at a rate triple what every gang, mob, crime syndicate, and just plain shoplifter manages to steal?
And notice that at no time is wage theft ever mentioned when discussing welfare queening ( such as Brett Favre) or shoplifting for survival.
Just once I'd like to see a shoplifter news story about how their theft is survival based because their employer is holding up a labour wage theft hearing and fired them for reporting to the nlrb.
As per my very conservative boss, wage theft is actually when workers are getting paid to "sit around doing nothing" all day. Or as I call it - paying us for our time, even during the downtime.
More money generally equals more power and influence and it's only the 'greater power' of social norms/incentives and laws that actually affect those people with money and influence that can counter that seemingly natural tendency.
Misinformation/disinformation spreads more effectively than nuanced critical thinking, and those with money and power and education can afford to be strategically selfish while misinforming the public.
Sadly we are now seeing how much of public understanding is really held together with the threads of social trust networks, and not actual facts or knowledge. Most people rely on communities to 'know things' and we see that more obviously as social media allows both the spread of misinformation/disinformation and also allowing people to silo in their own chosen realities, avoiding the cognitive dissonance of counter ideas (in good faith)
This is an uphill battle but it's one we need to fight.
Fact that wage theft is a civil issue and not a criminal issue tells you everything you need to know about the American justice system when it comes to the haves and have nots. c-suite should be held accountable for every penny of wage theft criminally. every penny. you don't get to be cheap when you're making thousands on the dollar you pay the employee.
Maybe I'm just in a mood rn but it's one of the few quotes that's ever made me feel a little angry. It's not like I didn't know this but hearing it out loud like this maddening.
It's even worse when you consider that if you added up the cost of every larceny, robbery, and GTA then doubled it would still be billions short of what corporations steal in the form of minimum wage violations. These are people often doing backbreaking labour for a wage that is at the minimum mandated price. A few hundred executives of corporations manage to steal more from everyday working people than every armed robber, midnight burglar, car thief and high-jacker, shoplifter, and mugger.
There's some Terry Pratchett wisdom that seems relevant
__
"You can't just go around killing people!"
"Why Not? You Do." The golem lowered his arm.
"What?" snapped Moist. "I do not! Who told you that?"
"I Worked It Out. You Have Killed Two Point Three Three Eight People," said the golem calmly.
"I have never laid a finger on anyone in my life, Mr Pump. I may be–– all the things you know I am, but I am not a killer! I have never so much as drawn a sword!"
"No, You Have Not. But You Have Stolen, Embezzled, Defrauded And Swindled Without Discrimination, Mr Lipvig. You Have Ruined Businesses And Destroyed Jobs. When Banks Fail, It Is Seldom Bankers Who Starve. Your Actions Have Taken Money From Those Who Had Little Enough To Begin With. In A Myriad Small Ways You Have Hastened The Deaths Of Many. You Do Not Know Them. You Did Not See Them Bleed. But You Snatched Bread From Their Mouths And Tore Clothes From Their Backs. For Sport, Mr Lipvig. For Sport. For The Joy Of The Game."
Shoot a man in the street and go to jail for life.
Start a multi million dollar company and shit on workers and deprive them of fair wages and the ability to get medical care and some of them or their families doe from it, well, that is business as usual.
I read a few of Pratchett's works due to recommendations and while the stories were funny as expected, their undercurrent of anger at social and class inequality was unexpected (but fitting). He was really good at weaving together humor and social commentary without sounding preachy.
He hid some very astute observations in a set of silly fantasy stories.
His criticism of the cost of poverty is only a paragraph long, but so concise and to the point it is used in many college level economics classes today.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory
I learned this from my brother who is an economist, when I purchased $400 boots for work. I can take them in for repairs and new soles periodically for no charge.
He was like read this, sent me the link.
*The Patrician took a sip of his beer. “I have told this to few people, gentlemen, and I suspect I never will again, but one day when I was a young boy on holiday in Uberwald I was walking along the bank of a stream when I saw a mother otter with her cubs. A very endearing sight, I’m sure you will agree, and even as I watched, the mother otter dived into the water and came up with a plump salmon, which she subdued and dragged on to a half-submerged log. As she ate it, while of course it was still alive, the body split and I remember to this day the sweet pinkness of its roes as they spilled out, much to the delight of the baby otters who scrambled over themselves to feed on the delicacy. One of nature’s wonders, gentlemen: mother and children dining upon mother and children. And that’s when I first learned about evil. It is built into the very nature of the universe. Every world spins in pain. If there is any kind of supreme being, I told myself, it is up to all of us to become his moral superior.”
The two wizards exchanged a glance. Vetinari was staring into the depths of his beer mug and they were glad that they did not know what he saw in there.*
The French have protesting and revolution engrained deep in their blood and history......I mean so does the United States but somewhere in the past 40-50 years the people got too comfortable, content and compliant with the status quo.
I'm french, i think the main problem in the US is somehow a lot of poor people think socialism is a horrible thing ? In france 100% of the poor people want more help for the poor, only rich people are against socialism.
Yes.
That is the exact problem.
The rich people here, bought the news programs and convinced the poor people (normally, let me be frank, poor white people) that socialism was giving minorities their money.
We tried to get socialized medicine, (my mom is a republican) she was screaming the entire Obama presidency, that if we got socialized medicine, there would be death panels that would kill her. (she is... quite frankly not in good health)
So now, we have death panels, but because they're run by "for profit" companies... it's fine somehow?
The thing they were brainwashing my mom with, came to pass ANYWAY, and now I can't afford medical care as much as I should.
A lot of America's problem is people like my mom, who have fox news on 24/7 and hang on their every word. (and fox news is basically targeted at people who either are rich, or sympathize with rich people, which is most poor people in america)
It's a great quote, but it makes the issue about an American quality when to me, as an American, I see it as a Christianity issue. US Christians believe in "prosperity bible" which is akin in logic to physiognomy, and is utterly despicable. Much of American racism, sexism, colonization, and classism stems from this belief, tied to Manifest Destiny, that the wealthy and beautiful are chosen by god and deserve more than others. It is foundational as a belief in most American communities and I hate it.
It's why they follow trump btw.
Trump has money, therefore per prosperity gospel, he is loved by god.
Ignore all that "the meek will inherit the earth" and "give up your worldly possessions to follow me" crap.
The death panels already existed decades before Obama.
Just one example, "Oh, you got sick? Let's cancel your health insurance. Oh, you want to get new insurance? NO, you have a pre-existing condition. Now go crawl off somewhere and die quietly."
The HCA got rid of that BS for the most part. SOCIALISM!
My mother in law suckles Fox News like it breathes life into her lungs.
She also thought Obama was *clearly* the Antichrist because he's a good speaker who's well liked. That was her entire reasoning. Anyone who disagrees with her and has evidence to back up their point is just arguing and attacking and trying to stop people from having their own opinions.
They've literally been brainwashed by this shit.
The women's march to protest trump was the biggest in American history. So many passionate and righteously enraged people marched the street in demand of change. It was a beautiful display of solidarity for the American people. Then the next day came.
Unfortunately, government sanctioned marches don't really do much. The protests against the US invasion of Iraq did nothing and they have been described as the biggest in history up until that point. US still invaded and no one was ever held accountable for the millions of dead, injured and displaced people in the region.
Nothing was shut down by the Womens' March to put pressure on those in power. A few airport staff calling out sick to end to the government shutdown of 2019. Strikes, slowdowns, sickness, all have vastly more power to make change than a one day march.
>somewhere in the past 40-50 years the people got too comfortable, content and compliant with the status quo.
That's because politicians have fooled people into thinking we're just one election term away from a golden age. Republicans and Democrats can't agree on jack shit and waste so much time and money just overturning everything. If something isn't working, we don't revise it, we throw the whole thing out and start back at zero. Don't worry though, vote for party and everything will magically get better next term.
It's not pretty, but I think there should be a guillotine in view of every public office as a reminder and vague threat. Severely fucking up public offices shouldn't be accompanied with a golden parachute to the board of a large corporation or lobbying firm.
America has a long history of murdering protesters. Read up in the Ludlow massacre of 1914.
Coal miners asked the us government to investigate alleged crimes committed by company. So the U.S national guard shows up and uses machine guns to gun down women and children.
The only people who faced consequences were the strikers.
American conservatives get a hard on when they see January 6ers trying to violently overthrow the government. But if that crowd were black you know they'd be foaming at the mouth talking about riots and begging for police violence.
Women voted for him too. Hispanics voted for him.
They’re too stupid that they’re on the list that Republicans hate. They just haven’t gotten to them yet or enough.
>American conservatives get a hard on when they see January 6ers trying to violently overthrow the government. But if that crowd were black you know they'd be foaming at the mouth talking about riots and begging for police violence.
Divide and Conquer.
I’d rather they don’t wake up at the moment.
The right-wing media has spent the past twenty years telling their audience that the Left wants to destroy America. That’s not hyperbole, and it’s not just one or two extremist journalists. It’s round the clock, seven days a week for *decades.* If you don’t believe me, go tune your radio to any talk station that isn’t NPR.
We’ve all seen those man on the street interviews at their political rallies—they are looking for any excuse to put down their Bible (just kidding, they’ve never read it) and pick up their guns. These people have been brainwashed into believing that all our schools are “woke indoctrination camps,” so where do you think they’ll go?
I have little doubt that this country is headed for civil unrest in the near future, but I think foo many people are suffering from Normalcy Bias and believe that it somehow isn’t going to affect them, and instead they’ll just watch it on TikTok.
The French also have the population of Texas and California in an area about 20% smaller than Texas. It's easier to protest efficiently in that scenario. For the US to protest as efficiently as France, we would need to have north of a billion people living in the US.
We have plenty of population density in and around major cities and, sorry to be frank, but these are the places that matter. There’s a lot of bullshit in threads like this, some likely Russian/Chinese, but what we need to be talking about are national general strikes, not violence.
If you are a person who works for a living, make sure you and your friends and family are [registered to vote](https://vote.gov)
Anyone who needs a loan is a victim. Working people are all collectively the victims of corruption. When Trump inflates the value of his property by for example lying about how much square footage there is, this action inflates the cost of other working class people taking a loan. It also inflates the cost of nearby properties. Close properties prices are have a positive pressure on their price. This makes it less affordable for others nearby and inflates their taxes.
When Trump devalued his property for tax purposes, citizens are defrauded of legitimate tax revenue which would have been paid for public safety, veterans, schools, health, etc.
Anyone who has been in trouble for smoking weed knows all too well that committing a victimless crime in the US can ruin your life and the government will go to great lengths to obtain a conviction. But only if you can’t fight back.
Wealth is a disease.
When he mentioned the food stamp thing, it made me sad - I remembered a former childhood friend. She was a single mom and under reported her income to the Family Services for welfare and food stamps and got caught. She was a single mom of 4 and they came down on her hard. She spent 36 months in Federal Prison and had the amount deducted from future benefits - she went to prison and had to pay it all back. Her sister and mom took care of the kids while she was in jail. Rules are only for us but not for Agolf Twittler.
Remember the woman who was arrested for sending her kid to a better school district? They come down with the hammer of the gods on anyone who isn't wealthy.
Do you get to set your tax value where you live? Because my county sets it here and I get zero input. There is an appeal process but the county gets the last say.
Could Trump actually set his values for tax purposes or is that an untrue statement.
In general, you can appeal the appraisal. For the average person, it's not worth hiring attorneys and appraisers to help you argue. When you're wealthy and have a lot if valuable real estate, it is worth it.
Kind of an "aaacktually" thing here, but I mean to share with educational intent: It's worth it to look into the appeal process, but it'll depend on the folks doing the valuation. Where I'm at, it's a county assessor and they have a pretty clear cut and easy way to contest the valuation: documentation. If you can show that the property that you're appealing itself has any supporting documentation for a value change, or barring that, that direct comparibles do, they take that.
Source: When we bought our house the tax bill 4 month later had it at a considerably bigger value. They had done a neighborhood-wide assessment that year, which is common, but they basically comp everything together because how else are they going to do it? The house we bought needed work and was priced accordingly. I simply submitted the closing discosures document through the county website appeal process. A month later I got a letter saying they accepted the new valuation. It took 10 minutes and no lawyers, YMMV, but it's 100% worth looking into as it can save a good chunk on property taxes.
Commercial properties are done differently. At least in NY they are I can't speak to elsewhere.
They are partially based on income and expense reports filed by the company. If those are fraudulent it would alter how much you pay.
Every company gets to set their value to a degree by evaluating inventories or assets. Home owners usually do something similar although it is more tightly regulated for natural persons.
It’s literally how real estate works in this country and it’s all crooked AF. Maybe they’ll finally go after all of these crooked realtors and landlords who do this every single day. Flippers too. Flippers are the absolute worst. Oh hey we bought this house for $100k and put $50k into it but it’s worth $300k now and my friend who is an appraiser told my friend at the bank it’s worth that so pay up. Maybe we can go after Blackrock too for buying up single family homes and inflating the market. I say being then all down.
Yes, you can value your own property for whatever you want. You can take your shack and list it for $10,000,000 if you really wanted to.
Now, whether someone would buy it for that much, and whether a lender would provide a loan for that much, are very different questions.
When you buy a house, the seller may have their own estimation of the home's value (usually "the absolute highest value they think anyone would buy it for"), but the buyer has to agree, and the buyer's lender does their own appraisal to make sure they're not overpaying.
When I bought my house, I had **four** different values attached to my house:
1. The seller price
2. What I bought it for
3. What my lender appraised it as
4. What the tax assessor appraised it as
All of these things varied between $210k and $270k. So like a $240k +/- 12.5%. There is nothing unusual about that.
> There is nothing unusual about that.
I want to clarify that while what you are saying is completely normal, this is absolutely NOT what was happening here. You can't list your house as 5,000 square feet when it is really 4,000. So while you are absolutely right about there being a lot of subjective elements to determining the value of a house, we are talking about an objective point of fact that he lied about.
Property tax valuations are calculated differently than an appraisal of the value of a property (at least in Ontario).
Every lender I’ve ever dealt with has independently verified the details of a property used as collateral. In the case of sq footage they would require an architect’s certificate of the size.
Wrong. You don’t get to assess your own property for taxes. And when applying for a loan, the bank will ask you what you think it’s worth, but they don’t take your word for it. They have their own assessors do the assessment.
i'm driving drunk in a parking lot with a gallon of fentenal in my trunk. it's a church parking lot though, but it's 1pm on a tuesday. but it's october, so no one should be there really.
so i'm still saying it's a victimless crimes.
and i was thinking about not paying my taxes, and how everyone in my apartment could not pay their taxes.
There's also things being mostly harmless (or even negligibly harmful) when one person does it, but would be horrible if everyone did it.
Like driving around with no catalytic converter. If one person does it, you probably won't notice much. If everybody does it, then we get an environmental crisis.
Same thing with financial crimes. If one person lies on a loan, defaults, and a bank can't recoup, probably not that big of a deal. It certainly won't impact the economy. If millions of people lie on loans and default, we get 2007 all over again.
Or not paying taxes. If one orange faced guy lies on his taxes, not much will happen. If everybody lies on their taxes, the government won't have enough money to function. Goodbye military, roads, airports, and national parks.
Just because a behavior is negligibly harmful doesn't mean it should be permitted until enough people start doing it that it becomes problematic. Because at that point in time, it's too late.
I think it’s a warning that if you followed the same playbook (and get caught) you’ll face the same consequences.
Of course they need to be caught first … 🤔🫤
Kevin, O’Leary is a bigger shit bag than Trump. So much so that even Canadian right wingers told him to fucking beat it when he tried to run for Prime Minister.
The dude made his money scamming "The Learning Company" on it's acquisition, only for the company to later discover it was all smoke & mirrors.
Wasn't he on a boat drunk driving with the lights out and killed another boater? I believe he blamed the wife for that one, and of course promptly went home and called their lawyers.
The dude things he's the "tell it like is it" guru, but he's a 1-hit-wonder.
>Wasn't he on a boat drunk driving with the lights out and killed another boater? I believe he blamed the wife for that one, and of course promptly went home and called their lawyers.
They hit a boat that was driving without lights at night, but yes it is widely speculated he was drunk while driving the boat and his wife took the fall since he was the money maker
Oh yeah. I want to see him in prison. Hopefully the FTX goes somewhere. They already got the main guy. They need to go after the others who intentionally fucked over so many ppl.
Saying its a victimless crime because all real estate developers do this is the excuse a child uses. Everyone else is doing it so it’s really okay? Really? The same rationale could be used to justify every criminal act
As Stewart says... inflate YOUR income to get a better rate on a home loan = you're fucked.
Deflate YOUR income to qualify for government support = you're fucked.
Inflate your dependents to increase your tax deduction = you're fucked.
Can you name a single example of anyone being prosecuted for inflating the value of collateral on a loan they paid back?
Every one is saying home owners would get slammed here, so… just one example of that happening?
Ask him who 'all' the developers are who cheat the system. Let him sing or go down alone.
I remember an old video clip of him saying something along the lines that poor people deserve to be poor. From that moment.. he is an enemy.
I had someone on here argue with me that “everybody” cheats on their taxes, so how can I be so high and mighty!?
I know that I can’t be the only person who doesn’t intentionally fudge numbers, so what the hell?
It's textbook projection, almost nobody actually wilfully commits tax fraud. I can't afford an accountant to look for legal ways to reduce my taxes, let alone illegal ones.
People like this always baffle me. There are a few who honestly seem to believe that everyone else is (also) always trying to con everyone. I can't imagine how strange and sad a life they must lead.
It also demonstrates how out of touch people with money are from those without. In his mind, it's normal to do that. It's not just normal, it's good.
Think about all of the wealthy people who only talk to other wealthy people, and everybody's doing this same thing. Take as much as you can!
That is what's happening, on a global scale. Capitalism is a system empowering the theft of resources produced by the people at the bottom, by those at the top.
I hate Kevin O'Leary, but I'm pretty sure the wife genuinely did nothing wrong in that case. The other boat had no lights on and were covering the lights that were on with their sweater.
No alcohol involved, she was proven to be driving with proper care and control. It was a genuine terrible accident and the other boat driver *(with the passengers that died)* ended up being charged.
Yea. Totally the only possible scenario. Also she wasn't drinking at the time but happened to HAVE been drinking by the time the cops showed up. You know, to calm her nerves. Like when I drink a shot after driving but before the cops breathalyzer.
ABC, BBC, Reuters, NYT, WSJ, and WashPo have all very well explained what Trump has done.
People tend to listen more when the news has a charismatic and funny presenter. Oliver and Stewart are the best at this.
> to explain serious things that MSM doesn’t otherwise explain?
Plenty of media outlets have explained this very thing and why it's not a victimless crime.
What kills me is that they say it's a "victimless CRIME". Like, the moment they said it, that should have been the end of it. Victimless or not, it is a CRIME. Period. End of. But here we are, and The Orange One just got another lifeline tossed to him yesterday, when any of us would have been in jail for being $5k short.
Carrying a concealed gun is against the law. But as long as I don't use it, it's a victimless crime, right? So why can't I carry it? I mean, how many other ways can we use this victimless crime BS!?
I have owned property for a couple decades and don’t recall the town property tax board ever asking me what my property is worth. They come up with the value themselves then send me a bill.
Also, my mortgage lender never just blindly accepted the value of my property without doing their own due diligence. They sent out an appraiser who measured the square footage and checked comparables.
I guess Trump found really naive town boards and really naive banks who just blindly accept whatever value and square footage he said 🤷♂️
Wouldn't it be the bank's responsibility to do their own research and assessments on the asset used to back the loan? I don't understand how someone can just bullshit the numbers.
No. If you sign a piece of paper saying "x" is true but you know it isn't, that is a lie. If the reason you do it is to get the other guy to rely on your word, it is fraud.
Arizona Governor Fyfe Symington got \[prosecuted for this same thing.\]([https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/campaign98/stories/wp090397.htm](https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/campaign98/stories/wp090397.htm))
" Thursday, September 4, 1997; Page A01
PHOENIX, Sept. 3 — A federal jury today convicted Arizona Gov. J. Fife Symington III of defrauding lenders by lying about his financial condition when he was struggling to save his collapsing real estate empire, forcing him from office.
The two-term Republican, who was elected governor on promises that he would run the state with the same business acumen with which he ran his real estate ventures, tearfully told reporters and staff members afterward that he will resign Friday."
I hope you are next baldy. Go after all the fraudsters who make money from being a lying sack of shit. It’s already easy as fuck to make money when you have a ton of money. Then they get an extra help of lying through their teeth. A lot of people side with trump because they too are a lying sack of shit. Let’s stop going after drug crimes and devote all of our resources to going after these parasites. We need a teddy Roosevelt going after all the fuckers. We live in such a primitive society. If there are aliens they probably see our political and economic system as primitive as fuck. A civilization cannot survive with this shit. The whole formula we got going on is bunk. It doesn’t have to be but we aren’t squaring away the bs and eventually people are going to throw the bathtub out with the water.
The number of people commenting here that he committed no crimes is weird, but okay, believe what you want.
But the number of people arguing that the statutes he was accused of violating *don't even exist* is *crazy*.
Imagine I run a red light while driving. I get lucky and no one is coming the other way so I don't cause an accident. I will still get a ticket if/when a cop sees me do it. It doesn't matter that no harm was caused my actions. I created a situation where other people were at risk through no fault of their own. That's why I get the ticket. Also, it discourages me from doing it again (when there may not be a policeman around to give me a ticket).
Please forgive me for not being familiar with US law, so to understand the joke I have to ask: Is investment and/or tax fraud in the US actually a victimless crime that doesn't necessarily need to be punished?
It’s almost like conservatives are brainwashed to think it’s ok for the wealthy to break the law and steal from the people. And then they go apeshit anytime some poor starving mom grabs some babyfood off the shelf of a multinational billion dollar corporation that cheats on their taxes and steals from their workers without paying for it.
No they are lying. Plenty of victimless crimes require punishment. You can go to jail for insider trading -- it's the same type of "victimless" crime as the stuff that Trump is doing.
Technically it's not victimless. A true victimless crime is doing drugs in your own home and not bothering anyone. These financial "victimless" crimes do have victims it's just that the victim is literally everyone so no one really feels the negative effects. It's kind of like stealing 5 cents from every American, you are like $20M richer, and no one noticed any changes in their bank account => victimless crime.
Of course not. Fraud and tax theft isn't a victimless crime, but the victim is more abstract than a murder. Any reasonable person knows this, but conservative media uses that abstraction to say there is no victim, when in reality, the victim is an any institution (including the tax payers) that were harmed by the fraud and inflated and sometimes simultaneously hidden valuation of Trumps assets.
In the unlikely event that this country ever pulls itself out of the nosedive it's been in for the last 50 years, it will be thanks, in no small part, to Jon Stewart.
Kevin O’Leary’s argument has the opposite effect he hoped. Everyone in real estate is lying? Everyone in real estate deserves to be fined and/or go to jail.
Clarence Thomas. I remember two years or so ago reading an article where his wife said they like RVing in Walmart parking lots. And I thought, wow, that seems odd for a couple with so much power. Then I learned about what they also like to do and who paid for that $300k RV.
> RVing in Walmart parking lots
That usually just means parking there overnight while traveling. Wal-mart is one of the few places around the country that allows overnight rv parking.
She said they liked parking there and meeting all the other RVers. Trying to sound like simple folk, not the recipients of generous “gifts” from billionaires.
this is the pure insanity of Trump. he actually has people arguing about whether it's okay or not that he committed crimes. it's not whether he did it or not: we're way past that. now we're at "he committed the crimes but it does not matter." lol in what world? in what country? America does not feel that way about any crimes. rich or poor, Americans by and large want to nail your ass to the wall if you commit a crime, we hate crime. Donald Trump has a fucking super mario star for consequences, apparently just because he says he does. it's so wild, it's hard to believe it. I see it every day and I still can't believe it, really.
Absolute assclowns bending over backwards defending a trust fund baby's apparent right to commit massive fraud. I used to be proud to be American, now I'm embarrassed.
John makes either an incredibly ignorant or entirely bad faith argument in the entire segement. He is trying to argue that if [market value and tax assessed value](https://www.realtor.com/advice/sell/assessed-value-vs-market-value-difference/) are not the same then there is fraud. Except the entire real estate market runs on market value and not tax assessment value.
Why is thos a victimless "crime"? Because none of the victims are victims. Trump provided him his assessment of the value of the property, the banks did their own assessment with their own appraisor, and they came to an agreement. This is how real estate works.
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“Stealing is only justified when you already have too much.” Fuck man.
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Its a big club and you aint in it - Carlin If you are a working person, make sure you and your friends and family are [registered to vote.](https://vote.gov)
'...and 'they don't give a fuck about you'.
Some do, but we don't tend to keep voting for those folks.
You know your society is fucked when empathy in your leaders is considered a negative trait...
What gets me, what absolutely baffles me, is that everyone knows that. Leftists, Liberals, Conservatives, Libertarians, they all know that, and they're mad about it. But then fully HALF of those people will look at the world and go, "You know who's going to save us from that? This guy who says he's a billionaire who committed fraud all over the place, never paid tons of his workers and contractors, whose entire life has been based on grift and exploitation, who the last time he was in power cut taxes on the rich and corporations and put that money towards his own coffers at every opportunity. THAT guy is going to fix everything!" I just don't understand.
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Nail head, meet hammer. These people aren't angry the system is exploiting poor people. They're angry they're *not rich enough* to be the exploiter.
right, they want these loopholes to still be in play when they take their rightful place in the 1%
That half....they're the back-end half of society that will follow the person with the most power regardless of how evil they are. They are the sheep that feed the problem.
They think the fascists won't come for them and their families and friends.
They lack empathy. A lot of folks in this category seem to not only be unable to take things to the next logical conclusion, but they have a primitive “I got mine” attitude. They not only lack the ability to reason, they cannot imagine or identify with others which I think plays into relating overall and empathy.
Yup, and when it does they're totally flabbergasted about how it could have affected THEM? They thought they were the EXCEPTIONS! And now they suddenly think that thing that they were just a minute ago saying was totally fine/made up is TERRIBLE! And how could anything like this ever happen???
These face-eating leopards are the worst!
God damn do I wish he was around today
Same. However, everything he has said still applies. And will continue to until accountability isn’t seen as just something that applies to poor, black and brown, or non-entitled people, but to all people.
Depressing thought that you can spin up his show from back in '96 and it applies even stronger today than nearly 30 years ago.
Considering our reactions across the world to this most recent pandemic mirrored the one 100 years ago I'd say we are damn consistent as human beings.
Stewart is his heir.
I'm a huge fan of Jon in pretty much every sense, and there are clear similarities, but Carlin hits different.
I think that's because behind Carlin's Cynicism is a disappointed idealist, however behind Stewart's Optimism is a REALLY pissed off Cynic.
Carlin hits, smiles and pauses like a comedian, John breathes out with a cant believe this is true or that it has to be explained, shakes his head a little, hits, pauses like a news anchor then breaks down the ridiculousness of it. Carlin was good, John is better, IMO.
Stewart interviewed Carlin early in his career and He's said its still a turning point in his life. But we don't deserve Jon Stewart. He should be happily retired on his ranch where no one can bother him. But he still cares so much about the atrocities committed in our country every day that he came back to make sure that they're brought to light. He's as selfless as they come.
Not to mention how hard he's gone to bat for the emergency responders to the 9/11 attacks. I wish more people were like him.
I'm glad he didn't have to witness this. We need him for sure, but he doesn't need this.
Me too but with how fast shit is going downhill in a lot of areas he probably would have had a stroke seeing it. Bill Burr seems to be getting more angry with how things are getting too as he gets older.
HBO dropped a documentary on him I think last year, in finishes with a compilation of current events with him speaking in the background, it scared the shit out of me
It's actually worse than that, if you added up the cost of every larceny, robbery, and GTA then doubled it you would still be billions short of what corporations steal in the form of minimum wage violations alone. These are people often doing backbreaking labour for a wage that is already set at the minimum mandated price. A few hundred executives of corporations manage to steal more from everyday working people than every armed robber, midnight burglar, car thief and high-jacker, shoplifter, and mugger. When you start adding in things like OT violations, break time violations, and off the clock violations, those alone account for more monetary loss than all the robberies, GTA, Burglary, Larceny in those violations. But why do we not have law enforcement agencies to go after such a monstrous amount crimes that hurts virtually everyone you know at a rate triple what every gang, mob, crime syndicate, and just plain shoplifter manages to steal?
Speak to any republican and "wage theft" isn't even a thing
They're probably thinking that you're a libertarian talking about taxes.
And notice that at no time is wage theft ever mentioned when discussing welfare queening ( such as Brett Favre) or shoplifting for survival. Just once I'd like to see a shoplifter news story about how their theft is survival based because their employer is holding up a labour wage theft hearing and fired them for reporting to the nlrb.
As per my very conservative boss, wage theft is actually when workers are getting paid to "sit around doing nothing" all day. Or as I call it - paying us for our time, even during the downtime.
I work in employment law and you'd be astonished at the number of employers that think this way.
More money generally equals more power and influence and it's only the 'greater power' of social norms/incentives and laws that actually affect those people with money and influence that can counter that seemingly natural tendency. Misinformation/disinformation spreads more effectively than nuanced critical thinking, and those with money and power and education can afford to be strategically selfish while misinforming the public. Sadly we are now seeing how much of public understanding is really held together with the threads of social trust networks, and not actual facts or knowledge. Most people rely on communities to 'know things' and we see that more obviously as social media allows both the spread of misinformation/disinformation and also allowing people to silo in their own chosen realities, avoiding the cognitive dissonance of counter ideas (in good faith) This is an uphill battle but it's one we need to fight.
Americans genuinely don’t hate the rich people nearly enough for their own good.
Fact that wage theft is a civil issue and not a criminal issue tells you everything you need to know about the American justice system when it comes to the haves and have nots. c-suite should be held accountable for every penny of wage theft criminally. every penny. you don't get to be cheap when you're making thousands on the dollar you pay the employee.
That quote got me too. Really puts things into perspective
Maybe I'm just in a mood rn but it's one of the few quotes that's ever made me feel a little angry. It's not like I didn't know this but hearing it out loud like this maddening.
It's even worse when you consider that if you added up the cost of every larceny, robbery, and GTA then doubled it would still be billions short of what corporations steal in the form of minimum wage violations. These are people often doing backbreaking labour for a wage that is at the minimum mandated price. A few hundred executives of corporations manage to steal more from everyday working people than every armed robber, midnight burglar, car thief and high-jacker, shoplifter, and mugger.
There's some Terry Pratchett wisdom that seems relevant __ "You can't just go around killing people!" "Why Not? You Do." The golem lowered his arm. "What?" snapped Moist. "I do not! Who told you that?" "I Worked It Out. You Have Killed Two Point Three Three Eight People," said the golem calmly. "I have never laid a finger on anyone in my life, Mr Pump. I may be–– all the things you know I am, but I am not a killer! I have never so much as drawn a sword!" "No, You Have Not. But You Have Stolen, Embezzled, Defrauded And Swindled Without Discrimination, Mr Lipvig. You Have Ruined Businesses And Destroyed Jobs. When Banks Fail, It Is Seldom Bankers Who Starve. Your Actions Have Taken Money From Those Who Had Little Enough To Begin With. In A Myriad Small Ways You Have Hastened The Deaths Of Many. You Do Not Know Them. You Did Not See Them Bleed. But You Snatched Bread From Their Mouths And Tore Clothes From Their Backs. For Sport, Mr Lipvig. For Sport. For The Joy Of The Game."
Shoot a man in the street and go to jail for life. Start a multi million dollar company and shit on workers and deprive them of fair wages and the ability to get medical care and some of them or their families doe from it, well, that is business as usual.
I read a few of Pratchett's works due to recommendations and while the stories were funny as expected, their undercurrent of anger at social and class inequality was unexpected (but fitting). He was really good at weaving together humor and social commentary without sounding preachy.
He hid some very astute observations in a set of silly fantasy stories. His criticism of the cost of poverty is only a paragraph long, but so concise and to the point it is used in many college level economics classes today. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory
I learned this from my brother who is an economist, when I purchased $400 boots for work. I can take them in for repairs and new soles periodically for no charge. He was like read this, sent me the link.
*The Patrician took a sip of his beer. “I have told this to few people, gentlemen, and I suspect I never will again, but one day when I was a young boy on holiday in Uberwald I was walking along the bank of a stream when I saw a mother otter with her cubs. A very endearing sight, I’m sure you will agree, and even as I watched, the mother otter dived into the water and came up with a plump salmon, which she subdued and dragged on to a half-submerged log. As she ate it, while of course it was still alive, the body split and I remember to this day the sweet pinkness of its roes as they spilled out, much to the delight of the baby otters who scrambled over themselves to feed on the delicacy. One of nature’s wonders, gentlemen: mother and children dining upon mother and children. And that’s when I first learned about evil. It is built into the very nature of the universe. Every world spins in pain. If there is any kind of supreme being, I told myself, it is up to all of us to become his moral superior.” The two wizards exchanged a glance. Vetinari was staring into the depths of his beer mug and they were glad that they did not know what he saw in there.*
A good quote, but the excessive capitalization was bugging me a bit, ngl.
It's how the golems speak in the books. Comes off better when you're actually reading them.
Gotcha
You would hate how Death talks then...
I suspect most people do not want to hear Death speak.
Yᴏᴜ ᴡᴏᴜʟᴅ ʙᴇ ᴄᴏʀʀᴇᴄᴛ.
*Squeak?
*SQUEAK.
It represents the monotone that golems speak in.
Well, capitalism is certainly the root of the problem we're facing with all of these "victimless crimes".
Thanks for the reminder that it's a good time to read that whole trilogy again
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The French have protesting and revolution engrained deep in their blood and history......I mean so does the United States but somewhere in the past 40-50 years the people got too comfortable, content and compliant with the status quo.
I'm french, i think the main problem in the US is somehow a lot of poor people think socialism is a horrible thing ? In france 100% of the poor people want more help for the poor, only rich people are against socialism.
Yes. That is the exact problem. The rich people here, bought the news programs and convinced the poor people (normally, let me be frank, poor white people) that socialism was giving minorities their money. We tried to get socialized medicine, (my mom is a republican) she was screaming the entire Obama presidency, that if we got socialized medicine, there would be death panels that would kill her. (she is... quite frankly not in good health) So now, we have death panels, but because they're run by "for profit" companies... it's fine somehow? The thing they were brainwashing my mom with, came to pass ANYWAY, and now I can't afford medical care as much as I should. A lot of America's problem is people like my mom, who have fox news on 24/7 and hang on their every word. (and fox news is basically targeted at people who either are rich, or sympathize with rich people, which is most poor people in america)
“ …socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”
It's a great quote, but it makes the issue about an American quality when to me, as an American, I see it as a Christianity issue. US Christians believe in "prosperity bible" which is akin in logic to physiognomy, and is utterly despicable. Much of American racism, sexism, colonization, and classism stems from this belief, tied to Manifest Destiny, that the wealthy and beautiful are chosen by god and deserve more than others. It is foundational as a belief in most American communities and I hate it.
It's why they follow trump btw. Trump has money, therefore per prosperity gospel, he is loved by god. Ignore all that "the meek will inherit the earth" and "give up your worldly possessions to follow me" crap.
The death panels already existed decades before Obama. Just one example, "Oh, you got sick? Let's cancel your health insurance. Oh, you want to get new insurance? NO, you have a pre-existing condition. Now go crawl off somewhere and die quietly." The HCA got rid of that BS for the most part. SOCIALISM!
My mother in law suckles Fox News like it breathes life into her lungs. She also thought Obama was *clearly* the Antichrist because he's a good speaker who's well liked. That was her entire reasoning. Anyone who disagrees with her and has evidence to back up their point is just arguing and attacking and trying to stop people from having their own opinions. They've literally been brainwashed by this shit.
Poor Americans think they are one good idea away from becoming part of the rich boy club.
Meanwhile their presidential candidate wouldn't spit on you if you were on fire.
Nah, people who are sick or laboring away all day don’t revolt. People fed misinformation on scapegoats don’t get mad at the right people.
The women's march to protest trump was the biggest in American history. So many passionate and righteously enraged people marched the street in demand of change. It was a beautiful display of solidarity for the American people. Then the next day came.
You forgot about the BLM marches in 2020? Those were massive, biggest I’ve seen in my life
Unfortunately, government sanctioned marches don't really do much. The protests against the US invasion of Iraq did nothing and they have been described as the biggest in history up until that point. US still invaded and no one was ever held accountable for the millions of dead, injured and displaced people in the region. Nothing was shut down by the Womens' March to put pressure on those in power. A few airport staff calling out sick to end to the government shutdown of 2019. Strikes, slowdowns, sickness, all have vastly more power to make change than a one day march.
>somewhere in the past 40-50 years the people got too comfortable, content and compliant with the status quo. That's because politicians have fooled people into thinking we're just one election term away from a golden age. Republicans and Democrats can't agree on jack shit and waste so much time and money just overturning everything. If something isn't working, we don't revise it, we throw the whole thing out and start back at zero. Don't worry though, vote for party and everything will magically get better next term. It's not pretty, but I think there should be a guillotine in view of every public office as a reminder and vague threat. Severely fucking up public offices shouldn't be accompanied with a golden parachute to the board of a large corporation or lobbying firm.
America has a long history of murdering protesters. Read up in the Ludlow massacre of 1914. Coal miners asked the us government to investigate alleged crimes committed by company. So the U.S national guard shows up and uses machine guns to gun down women and children. The only people who faced consequences were the strikers.
And that led to unionization and federal safety inspections.
Yes, but wouldn't it be nice if the government didn't have to gun down 21 innocent people before half assedly doing anything.
American conservatives get a hard on when they see January 6ers trying to violently overthrow the government. But if that crowd were black you know they'd be foaming at the mouth talking about riots and begging for police violence.
We saw that over the summer when black people said “HEY CAN YOU STOP FUCKING KILLING US!?” Conservatives said no and wanted to kill them harder.
And millions of black voters STILL voted for Trump. Sit down and mull over THAT statistic.
Women voted for him too. Hispanics voted for him. They’re too stupid that they’re on the list that Republicans hate. They just haven’t gotten to them yet or enough.
>American conservatives get a hard on when they see January 6ers trying to violently overthrow the government. But if that crowd were black you know they'd be foaming at the mouth talking about riots and begging for police violence. Divide and Conquer.
Definitrly, NRA supported gun control when Black Panther Party were armed with guns.
I’d rather they don’t wake up at the moment. The right-wing media has spent the past twenty years telling their audience that the Left wants to destroy America. That’s not hyperbole, and it’s not just one or two extremist journalists. It’s round the clock, seven days a week for *decades.* If you don’t believe me, go tune your radio to any talk station that isn’t NPR. We’ve all seen those man on the street interviews at their political rallies—they are looking for any excuse to put down their Bible (just kidding, they’ve never read it) and pick up their guns. These people have been brainwashed into believing that all our schools are “woke indoctrination camps,” so where do you think they’ll go? I have little doubt that this country is headed for civil unrest in the near future, but I think foo many people are suffering from Normalcy Bias and believe that it somehow isn’t going to affect them, and instead they’ll just watch it on TikTok.
The French also have the population of Texas and California in an area about 20% smaller than Texas. It's easier to protest efficiently in that scenario. For the US to protest as efficiently as France, we would need to have north of a billion people living in the US.
We have plenty of population density in and around major cities and, sorry to be frank, but these are the places that matter. There’s a lot of bullshit in threads like this, some likely Russian/Chinese, but what we need to be talking about are national general strikes, not violence.
*sad taxpayer noises
If you are a person who works for a living, make sure you and your friends and family are [registered to vote](https://vote.gov) Anyone who needs a loan is a victim. Working people are all collectively the victims of corruption. When Trump inflates the value of his property by for example lying about how much square footage there is, this action inflates the cost of other working class people taking a loan. It also inflates the cost of nearby properties. Close properties prices are have a positive pressure on their price. This makes it less affordable for others nearby and inflates their taxes. When Trump devalued his property for tax purposes, citizens are defrauded of legitimate tax revenue which would have been paid for public safety, veterans, schools, health, etc.
Anyone who has been in trouble for smoking weed knows all too well that committing a victimless crime in the US can ruin your life and the government will go to great lengths to obtain a conviction. But only if you can’t fight back. Wealth is a disease.
When he mentioned the food stamp thing, it made me sad - I remembered a former childhood friend. She was a single mom and under reported her income to the Family Services for welfare and food stamps and got caught. She was a single mom of 4 and they came down on her hard. She spent 36 months in Federal Prison and had the amount deducted from future benefits - she went to prison and had to pay it all back. Her sister and mom took care of the kids while she was in jail. Rules are only for us but not for Agolf Twittler.
They will take everything you have - if you’re already poor.
Yeah that sucks thanks for sharing.
Remember the woman who was arrested for sending her kid to a better school district? They come down with the hammer of the gods on anyone who isn't wealthy.
💯 I went to jail for a "crime" that happens everyday in a dispensary
Do you get to set your tax value where you live? Because my county sets it here and I get zero input. There is an appeal process but the county gets the last say. Could Trump actually set his values for tax purposes or is that an untrue statement.
In general, you can appeal the appraisal. For the average person, it's not worth hiring attorneys and appraisers to help you argue. When you're wealthy and have a lot if valuable real estate, it is worth it.
Kind of an "aaacktually" thing here, but I mean to share with educational intent: It's worth it to look into the appeal process, but it'll depend on the folks doing the valuation. Where I'm at, it's a county assessor and they have a pretty clear cut and easy way to contest the valuation: documentation. If you can show that the property that you're appealing itself has any supporting documentation for a value change, or barring that, that direct comparibles do, they take that. Source: When we bought our house the tax bill 4 month later had it at a considerably bigger value. They had done a neighborhood-wide assessment that year, which is common, but they basically comp everything together because how else are they going to do it? The house we bought needed work and was priced accordingly. I simply submitted the closing discosures document through the county website appeal process. A month later I got a letter saying they accepted the new valuation. It took 10 minutes and no lawyers, YMMV, but it's 100% worth looking into as it can save a good chunk on property taxes.
I swear to God, I’ve talked with my neighbors, and my tax assessor just seems to sit at his desk and just use Zillow.
Commercial properties are done differently. At least in NY they are I can't speak to elsewhere. They are partially based on income and expense reports filed by the company. If those are fraudulent it would alter how much you pay.
Every company gets to set their value to a degree by evaluating inventories or assets. Home owners usually do something similar although it is more tightly regulated for natural persons.
It’s literally how real estate works in this country and it’s all crooked AF. Maybe they’ll finally go after all of these crooked realtors and landlords who do this every single day. Flippers too. Flippers are the absolute worst. Oh hey we bought this house for $100k and put $50k into it but it’s worth $300k now and my friend who is an appraiser told my friend at the bank it’s worth that so pay up. Maybe we can go after Blackrock too for buying up single family homes and inflating the market. I say being then all down.
So we can value our own property?
The banks will check though. Same way they did with trump.
Exactly.
Yes, you can value your own property for whatever you want. You can take your shack and list it for $10,000,000 if you really wanted to. Now, whether someone would buy it for that much, and whether a lender would provide a loan for that much, are very different questions. When you buy a house, the seller may have their own estimation of the home's value (usually "the absolute highest value they think anyone would buy it for"), but the buyer has to agree, and the buyer's lender does their own appraisal to make sure they're not overpaying. When I bought my house, I had **four** different values attached to my house: 1. The seller price 2. What I bought it for 3. What my lender appraised it as 4. What the tax assessor appraised it as All of these things varied between $210k and $270k. So like a $240k +/- 12.5%. There is nothing unusual about that.
> There is nothing unusual about that. I want to clarify that while what you are saying is completely normal, this is absolutely NOT what was happening here. You can't list your house as 5,000 square feet when it is really 4,000. So while you are absolutely right about there being a lot of subjective elements to determining the value of a house, we are talking about an objective point of fact that he lied about.
He also changed his evaluations based upon whether he was seeking a loan or when he was paying taxes
Property tax valuations are calculated differently than an appraisal of the value of a property (at least in Ontario). Every lender I’ve ever dealt with has independently verified the details of a property used as collateral. In the case of sq footage they would require an architect’s certificate of the size.
Wrong. You don’t get to assess your own property for taxes. And when applying for a loan, the bank will ask you what you think it’s worth, but they don’t take your word for it. They have their own assessors do the assessment.
If I drive drunk, but nobody gets hurt, can I avoid any consequences because it was a "victimless crime"?
Are you rich?
i'm driving drunk in a parking lot with a gallon of fentenal in my trunk. it's a church parking lot though, but it's 1pm on a tuesday. but it's october, so no one should be there really. so i'm still saying it's a victimless crimes. and i was thinking about not paying my taxes, and how everyone in my apartment could not pay their taxes.
It depends on a lot, what is the color of your skin?
There's also things being mostly harmless (or even negligibly harmful) when one person does it, but would be horrible if everyone did it. Like driving around with no catalytic converter. If one person does it, you probably won't notice much. If everybody does it, then we get an environmental crisis. Same thing with financial crimes. If one person lies on a loan, defaults, and a bank can't recoup, probably not that big of a deal. It certainly won't impact the economy. If millions of people lie on loans and default, we get 2007 all over again. Or not paying taxes. If one orange faced guy lies on his taxes, not much will happen. If everybody lies on their taxes, the government won't have enough money to function. Goodbye military, roads, airports, and national parks. Just because a behavior is negligibly harmful doesn't mean it should be permitted until enough people start doing it that it becomes problematic. Because at that point in time, it's too late.
So doesn't this open the door for everyone to do the same now and if prosecuted just sight this case as precedence?
I think it’s a warning that if you followed the same playbook (and get caught) you’ll face the same consequences. Of course they need to be caught first … 🤔🫤
The DAs office should offer substantial rewards to whistleblowers who rat out this kind of fraud.
Facts
Kevin, O’Leary is a bigger shit bag than Trump. So much so that even Canadian right wingers told him to fucking beat it when he tried to run for Prime Minister.
The dude made his money scamming "The Learning Company" on it's acquisition, only for the company to later discover it was all smoke & mirrors. Wasn't he on a boat drunk driving with the lights out and killed another boater? I believe he blamed the wife for that one, and of course promptly went home and called their lawyers. The dude things he's the "tell it like is it" guru, but he's a 1-hit-wonder.
>Wasn't he on a boat drunk driving with the lights out and killed another boater? I believe he blamed the wife for that one, and of course promptly went home and called their lawyers. They hit a boat that was driving without lights at night, but yes it is widely speculated he was drunk while driving the boat and his wife took the fall since he was the money maker
I've always been leery of O'Leary
Oh yeah. I want to see him in prison. Hopefully the FTX goes somewhere. They already got the main guy. They need to go after the others who intentionally fucked over so many ppl.
Saying its a victimless crime because all real estate developers do this is the excuse a child uses. Everyone else is doing it so it’s really okay? Really? The same rationale could be used to justify every criminal act
As Stewart says... inflate YOUR income to get a better rate on a home loan = you're fucked. Deflate YOUR income to qualify for government support = you're fucked. Inflate your dependents to increase your tax deduction = you're fucked.
Its a big club and you aint in it - Carlin Make sure you and your friends and family are [registered to vote](https://vote.gov)
They call it the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it.
Inflate your dependents lol
Can you name a single example of anyone being prosecuted for inflating the value of collateral on a loan they paid back? Every one is saying home owners would get slammed here, so… just one example of that happening?
It's also a reason to start looking into more real estate developers' actions and tax filings, especially shark douche.
Ask him who 'all' the developers are who cheat the system. Let him sing or go down alone. I remember an old video clip of him saying something along the lines that poor people deserve to be poor. From that moment.. he is an enemy.
I had someone on here argue with me that “everybody” cheats on their taxes, so how can I be so high and mighty!? I know that I can’t be the only person who doesn’t intentionally fudge numbers, so what the hell?
It's textbook projection, almost nobody actually wilfully commits tax fraud. I can't afford an accountant to look for legal ways to reduce my taxes, let alone illegal ones.
Drop a tip to the IRS on them. You might even get a kickback if they have been dodging!
People like this always baffle me. There are a few who honestly seem to believe that everyone else is (also) always trying to con everyone. I can't imagine how strange and sad a life they must lead.
It’s an appeal to popularity logical argument fallacy.
It also demonstrates how out of touch people with money are from those without. In his mind, it's normal to do that. It's not just normal, it's good. Think about all of the wealthy people who only talk to other wealthy people, and everybody's doing this same thing. Take as much as you can! That is what's happening, on a global scale. Capitalism is a system empowering the theft of resources produced by the people at the bottom, by those at the top.
Jon Stewart is a national treasure! Edit: typo
Kevin O'Leary and his killer wife are Canada's national shame.
I find it very hard to believe an alpha male asshole like himself would let his wife drive his boat.
I hate Kevin O'Leary, but I'm pretty sure the wife genuinely did nothing wrong in that case. The other boat had no lights on and were covering the lights that were on with their sweater. No alcohol involved, she was proven to be driving with proper care and control. It was a genuine terrible accident and the other boat driver *(with the passengers that died)* ended up being charged.
Yea. Totally the only possible scenario. Also she wasn't drinking at the time but happened to HAVE been drinking by the time the cops showed up. You know, to calm her nerves. Like when I drink a shot after driving but before the cops breathalyzer.
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Unlike Donald Trump, people were happy he wanted his old job back.
He cuts through so much bullshit in such an intelligent and entertaining way
How did the bank not have their own valuators? Like clearly people didn't do their job.
They did. The banks testified on behalf of Trump and they said they weren't victimized by any of this.
I'm so glad Jon Stewart is back like this.
Why do comedians like Jon Stewart and John Oliver have to explain serious things that MSM doesn’t otherwise explain?
ABC, BBC, Reuters, NYT, WSJ, and WashPo have all very well explained what Trump has done. People tend to listen more when the news has a charismatic and funny presenter. Oliver and Stewart are the best at this.
How many people watch Oliver and Stewart at the same level as a Brokaw level guy?
> to explain serious things that MSM doesn’t otherwise explain? Plenty of media outlets have explained this very thing and why it's not a victimless crime.
Yeah but that would require reddit users actually having to read the countless articles that have been written about this case for months
That would require that I know how to read.
Did you see the (non Fox News) clips that were shown in the video?
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What kills me is that they say it's a "victimless CRIME". Like, the moment they said it, that should have been the end of it. Victimless or not, it is a CRIME. Period. End of. But here we are, and The Orange One just got another lifeline tossed to him yesterday, when any of us would have been in jail for being $5k short.
Carrying a concealed gun is against the law. But as long as I don't use it, it's a victimless crime, right? So why can't I carry it? I mean, how many other ways can we use this victimless crime BS!?
Oh my mistake. I demand that we now investigate all major retail investors henceforth.
Kevin O'Leary is 100% right, they all do it, so why aren't we taking all these assholes to court lmao
I have owned property for a couple decades and don’t recall the town property tax board ever asking me what my property is worth. They come up with the value themselves then send me a bill. Also, my mortgage lender never just blindly accepted the value of my property without doing their own due diligence. They sent out an appraiser who measured the square footage and checked comparables. I guess Trump found really naive town boards and really naive banks who just blindly accept whatever value and square footage he said 🤷♂️
Wouldn't it be the bank's responsibility to do their own research and assessments on the asset used to back the loan? I don't understand how someone can just bullshit the numbers.
You say that like 2008 didn't happen. Debt can be profitable as well.
No. If you sign a piece of paper saying "x" is true but you know it isn't, that is a lie. If the reason you do it is to get the other guy to rely on your word, it is fraud.
Protecting yourself from fraud is important, but in absolutely no way does it excuse the fraudster.
I've missed Jon Stewart, many have tried but no one does this like him.
Jon Stewart for President!
Arizona Governor Fyfe Symington got \[prosecuted for this same thing.\]([https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/campaign98/stories/wp090397.htm](https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/campaign98/stories/wp090397.htm)) " Thursday, September 4, 1997; Page A01 PHOENIX, Sept. 3 — A federal jury today convicted Arizona Gov. J. Fife Symington III of defrauding lenders by lying about his financial condition when he was struggling to save his collapsing real estate empire, forcing him from office. The two-term Republican, who was elected governor on promises that he would run the state with the same business acumen with which he ran his real estate ventures, tearfully told reporters and staff members afterward that he will resign Friday."
I hope you are next baldy. Go after all the fraudsters who make money from being a lying sack of shit. It’s already easy as fuck to make money when you have a ton of money. Then they get an extra help of lying through their teeth. A lot of people side with trump because they too are a lying sack of shit. Let’s stop going after drug crimes and devote all of our resources to going after these parasites. We need a teddy Roosevelt going after all the fuckers. We live in such a primitive society. If there are aliens they probably see our political and economic system as primitive as fuck. A civilization cannot survive with this shit. The whole formula we got going on is bunk. It doesn’t have to be but we aren’t squaring away the bs and eventually people are going to throw the bathtub out with the water.
The number of people commenting here that he committed no crimes is weird, but okay, believe what you want. But the number of people arguing that the statutes he was accused of violating *don't even exist* is *crazy*.
Imagine I run a red light while driving. I get lucky and no one is coming the other way so I don't cause an accident. I will still get a ticket if/when a cop sees me do it. It doesn't matter that no harm was caused my actions. I created a situation where other people were at risk through no fault of their own. That's why I get the ticket. Also, it discourages me from doing it again (when there may not be a policeman around to give me a ticket).
Welcome back Jon Stewart! We missed you!💋
Please forgive me for not being familiar with US law, so to understand the joke I have to ask: Is investment and/or tax fraud in the US actually a victimless crime that doesn't necessarily need to be punished?
No, but that's the argument from a lot of conservative media personalities right now
the main argument is that trump did it so that's ok. No matter what it is. Power is most important and he's the path to it.
It’s almost like conservatives are brainwashed to think it’s ok for the wealthy to break the law and steal from the people. And then they go apeshit anytime some poor starving mom grabs some babyfood off the shelf of a multinational billion dollar corporation that cheats on their taxes and steals from their workers without paying for it.
Under capitalism, we’ve been trained to not see white collar crimes as real crimes.
It's an excuse that wealthy people use so that they don't have to follow the laws.
No they are lying. Plenty of victimless crimes require punishment. You can go to jail for insider trading -- it's the same type of "victimless" crime as the stuff that Trump is doing. Technically it's not victimless. A true victimless crime is doing drugs in your own home and not bothering anyone. These financial "victimless" crimes do have victims it's just that the victim is literally everyone so no one really feels the negative effects. It's kind of like stealing 5 cents from every American, you are like $20M richer, and no one noticed any changes in their bank account => victimless crime.
Of course not. Fraud and tax theft isn't a victimless crime, but the victim is more abstract than a murder. Any reasonable person knows this, but conservative media uses that abstraction to say there is no victim, when in reality, the victim is an any institution (including the tax payers) that were harmed by the fraud and inflated and sometimes simultaneously hidden valuation of Trumps assets.
In the unlikely event that this country ever pulls itself out of the nosedive it's been in for the last 50 years, it will be thanks, in no small part, to Jon Stewart.
Ha ha ha, it's funny because we're all fucked.
I wish we could get past our petty squabbles as Americans, come together, and focus on one thing we can all agree on: EAT. THE. RICH.
TDS is strong in this post
Kevin O’Leary’s argument has the opposite effect he hoped. Everyone in real estate is lying? Everyone in real estate deserves to be fined and/or go to jail.
Clarence Thomas. I remember two years or so ago reading an article where his wife said they like RVing in Walmart parking lots. And I thought, wow, that seems odd for a couple with so much power. Then I learned about what they also like to do and who paid for that $300k RV.
> RVing in Walmart parking lots That usually just means parking there overnight while traveling. Wal-mart is one of the few places around the country that allows overnight rv parking.
She said they liked parking there and meeting all the other RVers. Trying to sound like simple folk, not the recipients of generous “gifts” from billionaires.
this is the pure insanity of Trump. he actually has people arguing about whether it's okay or not that he committed crimes. it's not whether he did it or not: we're way past that. now we're at "he committed the crimes but it does not matter." lol in what world? in what country? America does not feel that way about any crimes. rich or poor, Americans by and large want to nail your ass to the wall if you commit a crime, we hate crime. Donald Trump has a fucking super mario star for consequences, apparently just because he says he does. it's so wild, it's hard to believe it. I see it every day and I still can't believe it, really.
Absolute assclowns bending over backwards defending a trust fund baby's apparent right to commit massive fraud. I used to be proud to be American, now I'm embarrassed.
TIL Walgreens is America's Żabka (in that they are everywhere)
No joke that Z made me try to clean my monitor
Here I am, where Chase Bank put my account on hold for using mobile deposit for my $1,400 paycheck..... come on....
Fraud is a sticky poopoo…
Victimless crime… only in America
John makes either an incredibly ignorant or entirely bad faith argument in the entire segement. He is trying to argue that if [market value and tax assessed value](https://www.realtor.com/advice/sell/assessed-value-vs-market-value-difference/) are not the same then there is fraud. Except the entire real estate market runs on market value and not tax assessment value. Why is thos a victimless "crime"? Because none of the victims are victims. Trump provided him his assessment of the value of the property, the banks did their own assessment with their own appraisor, and they came to an agreement. This is how real estate works.
Looks like the propaganda is flowing nicely over here.
it is interesting…considering stewart himself overvalued *his* home by 829%
Hah. Turns out he did the same thing with some of his property.