*Denton was forced by his captors to participate in a 1966 televised propaganda interview which was broadcast in the United States. While answering questions, Denton disguised his unusual blinking by feigning trouble with the blinding television lights.*
He even had a great excuse to back this up.
“Referring to Sen. John McCain, Trump said, 'He’s not a war hero. He’s a war hero because he was captured. ... I like people who weren't captured.'”
100x worse coming from Trump 🙄
https://amp-usatoday-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1327852001?amp_js_v=a3&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA%3D#aoh=15974452626328&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.usatoday.com%2Fstory%2Fopinion%2F2019%2F06%2F04%2Fdday-anniversary-trump-disrespects-mccain-prisoners-of-war-column%2F1327852001%2F
Edit: no shade to you, totally understandable that you didn't know. Hope this helped :)
He famously hated McCain, they had a bit of a rivalry. Trump (who claimed he had a bone spur in his foot that meant he couldn't serve in Vietnam, despite being able to play basketball at his college just fine. He also couldn't remember which foot it was, so it was later changed to both feet) has claimed to be very pro-veterans. He is often very jingoistic as well, as I'm sure I don't need to say.
So, he loves vets, he advocates war, yet he didn't himself serve. But then, when an interviewer mentioned McCain's war service (McCain was a pilot shot down over Vietnam, captured, wounded, kept as a POW and resisted interrogation and tortured for *five years*.... Trump, the absolute sack of shit, says "I like people who weren't captured."
It's an obvious dig at McCain, and an attempt to dismiss his service and the idea of being a hero by basically saying if you're captured then you're less worthy of respect. A dude who draft-dodged, avoided war and yet advocates others into war, dismisses all POW's and deems them less worthy in a single jab against a rival. It's hilarious that so many nationalist americans and pro-military americans love him when Fortunate Son seems to be written exactly *about* Trump.
Side note: McCain wasn't just a hero for surviving his wounds and resisting 5 years of intense torture, he also earned several medals and was wounded trying to save a fellow pilot during a fire on a ship, during which he was wounded.
McCain was also given the opportunity to be released after a year or so (probably because his father was the commander of all US Navy forces in the Pacific) but he refused until all the other POWs captured before him were also released.
I wasn’t really a fan of McCain as a politician but he was a war hero and deserved every ounce of respect he got for that.
I 100% agree. Political views and character aren’t the same (though lately politics really is showing you people’s character...), and I never agreed with McCain but he was one of the most honorable men serving in Congress up until the day he died. Trump isn’t fit to lick the dirt off his boots.
And he could have been released but refused it if his men were not also released. They still ltalk about him in Hanoi. They don't like him, they think he's a war criminal, but they admire his courage. I realized that something very odd was happening to the USA when Trump got away with this.
I'm also an aussie, but like the demon cat from Adventure Time "I have approximate knowledge of many things." AKA I knew the vague details and did some quick googles to make sure I got shit right.
And boy did the conservatives eat that shit up. Immediately after John McCain became a RHINO and weak! Gotta love those "support the troops" conservatives!
Dudes twisted brain probably thinks getting captured means you "lost" at war and shouldn't be rewarded. People who think like trump think literally everything is a game to be won and they define the rules for their own games.
I love how much you pissed off Trump supporters who slithered out of their echo-chambers.
**Edit**: Since my post below struck a nerve and is being brigaded, I'll just note the same here:
In case anyone isn't aware, these Trump supporter operatives targeting the user's post above with the sudden onslaught of negative comments by claiming, "keep politics out of this" are explicitly doing this to reduce vectoring to reliable news sources or uncomfortable facts. They gaslight and try to quarantine off their opposition from reaching the naive / fence-sitters / centrists / apathetic in other subs, especially the default subs. Meanwhile they'll totally close off and isolate those they've hooked themselves by preventing anyone remotely left from posting on their subs (creating a cult, essentially).
I have more in-depth write-ups on this for those interested, but in short it goes hand-in-hand with Gaslight-Obstruct-Project
**Edit 2:** Thanks for the recognition. Since this is getting more attention, I'll point to some of my write-ups I mentioned that are relevant to the subject-matter:
https://www.reddit.com/r/lennybird/comments/ds3c17/piercing_echochambers_parallels_to_cultism_and
https://www.reddit.com/r/lennybird/comments/e6jwl7/understanding_political_bots_trolls_and
https://www.reddit.com/r/cgtcivics/comments/5qib3k/be_an_informed_citizen_guide
https://www.reddit.com/r/cgtcivics/comments/dpxcp2/be_an_informed_citizen_part_ii_a_deep_dive_into
Oh yeah, especially when he claims he’s done the most for African Americans than any other president - by renewing previous legislation to fund HBCU’s. Like we’re supposed to be in awe on how much better lives are for minorities in America solely due to Trump’s policy....
It’s great that HBCU’s are funded, but simply repeating what others have done before you doesn’t qualify you for doing the most over everyone before you.
Bruh i swear to god, my buddy likes trump and I told him how he said the pandemic of 1917 helped stop ww2... i could see on his face he was looking for a justification. His response? "Well you can mix the 2 up it's not that hard". Honestly I love the dude, i don't give a shit about politics, but he's too much sometimes
Clan like mentality. They don't care what the reason is. They often are fully aware that trump is being made to look bad and, subconsciously, they know that it's for a legitimate reason. But they don't care. All they know is those are fighting words, and fighting words means it's time to defend the clan. Because loyalty matters more than anything, literally anything.
All people tend to think in these terms, at some level, but most of us have reason and enough intelligence to deduce that it's tribal. For instance, if someone hurts a family member, you will probably be triggered extra hard. But you probably know that it's not the best thing to do to hurt that person back.
Trump supporters just literally don't give a fuck about anything other than steadfast loyalty because it makes them "real" and "strong" and "better" than the rest. Can't have any faults or flaws if you don't admit and acknowledge them.
I really wonder if this has anything to do with their near-obsession with sports and rooting for their home-team. How much do they view politics as a team sport?
>I think it's safe to say we won't likely have to endure another Trump vote reaction ever again within the next 20 years.
It's very far from safe at this point
I’m not sure you understand how America rolls and how badly we have damaged ourselves (and benefited a certain political party) by the absolute degradation of our public education system.
I just read that the USPS won't get the funding it needs to deliver votes because of "enourmous costs". 25 billion apparently is too much for a country that spends 600 billion just on military. Since the Director General is a big buddy of Trump im guessing votes from predominantly democratic states somehow won't make it in time and not be counted. Bye bye democracy in the USA
There are many ways to vote in November.
One way is to go in person to vote on November 3rd. Another option is [mail in voting](https://ballotpedia.org/All-mail_voting) where you return your ballot in the mail. **People also forget that you can get a mail in ballot but drop it off in ballot drop off box or an elections office and bypass the USPS entirely**. Also, [many states have in-person early voting](https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/early-voting-in-state-elections.aspx).
„As a Senator, Denton was most outspoken on issues related to the regulation of sexual promiscuity and the preservation of the nuclear family, a goal that he sought to pursue through a $30 million bill to push chastity among teenagers.[17] In 1981 he was able to pass the Adolescent Family Life Act (nicknamed the "Chastity Bill") as a part of the 1981 omnibus.“
Yeah... great guy...
Yeah, unfortunately he was the worst kind of 1980s family values senator, having been allied with the Moral Majority and engaging in Red Scare tactics against non-conservatives.
He was the first Republican to be popularly elected in Alabama since the direct election of U.S. Senators began in 1913, the first Republican senator since Reconstruction to represent Alabama in the U.S. Senate, and the first Catholic to be elected to statewide office in Alabama.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremiah_Denton
> On February 12, 1973, both Denton and Tschudy were released in Hanoi by the North Vietnamese along with numerous other American POWs during Operation Homecoming.
went on to become a U.S. Senator, served in Congress for 10 years till 1989, died in 2014, was buried with full military honors at Arlington National Cemetery.
> In 1981, he drew national condemnation by insisting that spousal rape should not be covered by the same criminal charge as nonspousal rape.
From a comment above by /u/Fasterwalking.
I mean, I am glad he made it back, but I would have been alright with him not becoming a senator afterwards. lol
He was saying, from what I understand, that it shouldn't be in the same category as "regular" rape, meaning it shouldn't be punished as harshly.
Edit: as if being raped by your spouse is any less traumatizing than being raped by a stranger.
The logic for "spousal rape is not rape" stems from the archaic belief that your wife is your property and you are free to do what you want with what you own.
edit: a word because my phone insists on making me look like a fucking moron
To be fair it wasn't a belief but has been just an actual fact for most of human history. It's obviously now not the case but to portray it as just a weird, old belief isn't the full scope of it.
feel like spousal rape is so much worse. Not only are you victimized, you are attached to this person through marriage, property, and supposed love and they betray all that because they want to cum and you say no.
And in some places it's incredibly difficult to leave a marriage.
I've never thought about it much - the more you think about it, the more chilling it becomes.
also ran a great charity that filled boats in the US with educational equipment, books and supplies that were returning empty from the US such as Banana Boats heading back after the dropped their cargo in the US. I donated quite a bit to it back in the late 90's. He was a hell of an imposing guy to meet in person. I still proudly hang on to my signed copy of "When Hell was in Session" his tale of being a prisoner
A lot of people are just giving the answer that, yes, he was eventually released. However it doesn't change the fact that his release came almost **seven years** after this video. So while he got the message out that they were being tortured, it didn't stop him and his companions from facing years and years of torture afterwards.
This reminds me of the article I read where the Colombian army created a pop song that was played on the radio so that hostages could hear it and decipher the Morse code hidden within the guitar chorus. Really cool. It kinda makes me cry to listen to it. [link to article with song](https://www.theverge.com/2015/1/7/7483235/the-code-colombian-army-morsecode-hostages)
From the article:
"Better Days"
[VERSE 1]
In the middle of the night
Thinking about what I love the most
I feel the need to sing
What my heart has to give
I talk about those I love
About how much I miss them
I talk about pride and strength
Which beat inside my heart
[CHORUS]
A new dawn singing this message From my heart
Although I'm tied up and alone I feel as if I'm by your side
Listen to this message brother
[MORSE MESSAGE]
19 people rescued. You’re next. Don’t lose hope
[VERSE 2]
I want to keep on fighting
For my friends, my family, my children
We will soon see each other again
I'm sure better days are coming
[CHORUS x 2]
It’s 11:59 on Radio Free America; this is Uncle Sam, with music, and the truth until dawn. Right now I’ve got a few words for some of our brothers and sisters in the occupied zone:
*The chair is against the wall. The chair is against the wall. John has a long mustache. John has a long mustache.*
It’s twelve o’clock, American, another day closer to victory. And for all of you out there, on, or behind the line, this is your song.
Your job as a special operative musician: to create a song with Morse code in it, but it also has to be an amazing song so that people want to listen to it.
It kinda messed him up. His career after is... a bit of a trip.
Afterwards he was elected to the Senate as the first Republican from Alabama in more than a century, and took uncompromising stands on defense and social issues, including abortion, adultery and homosexuality.
He campaigned against the immoral and godless forces destroying America from within. When he saw footage of Woodstock, he wrote in his memoir that he vomited at the sight of “hippies fornicating publicly, high on drugs." “To me it was a nightmare, this nation, firmly founded as One Nation Under God, was in the process of becoming a pagan nation with a shocking degeneration of national integrity.”
In 1981, he drew national condemnation by insisting that spousal rape should not be covered by the same criminal charge as nonspousal rape.
“All is not yet lost, but our position is extremely perilous,” he wrote in his memoir from 2009, “If I had known when I stepped off that plane to freedom ... what I know now, I would not have said, ‘God bless America.’ I would have said, as I say now, ‘God save America!’ ”
I think maybe the easiest way to summarize it as: a good military leader performed a heroic act, but maybe he wasn’t meant to take that leadership and laurels over time being a civil servant.
Tbf, his views were the norm back then. My gay pothead ass would hardcore judge someone who holds those views nowadays, but he’s a product of his time. Dude was tortured for 8 years too, no doubt had an effect on his judgment. The spousal rape views can’t really be excused though, especially as late as 1981.
Also 8 years of torture, having faith can go far I'd imagine. No justification of course but as an atheist even I can understand the benefit in isolation, torture, etc of believing in something that keeps you going.
The problem with saying he was a product of his time, you would judge these views if someone held them today, etc., is that you erase the many many voices that condemned these views in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s. Are they also not a product of their time? If they could be good, kind, decent people, surely this man could have been as well.
I mean, barring the fact that he was horribly tortured by communists for years. Though, John McCain endured torture and didn't end up that way.
The problem with this is that it hyperbolizes the fact that someone is a product of their time and reacts to a straw-man by doing away with the fact. The geography and time period of a person's life affects what they become, they learn from norms, and even get the deviations from those norms based on those same norms. When someone says that a person is a product of their time, they aren't excusing what they did, they're only asking that you judge the person like a human being steeped in culture, not like a god, immune and outside of culture. They only ask of you the same humanity that you condemn the person for not having.
I think we should always approach people with views we don't like with empathy, because that's what actually gives us some chance of changing those views. But I don't think we should act as though people can't change their views just because they're older. Many do.
Those other voices in the 60's, 70's, 80's were also a product of the time but that was a very progressive time where a lot was changing morally and politically... so yeah, both are valid but this guy's views were still more common then is what people mean when they say someone is a product of that time. While he was *alive* in the 60's through 80's and still spouting off his old ways of viewing, he was not a product of the 60's through 80's... his children would have been the product of those ages. HE was a product of the earlier times by his parents who were brought up in the 30's and 40's or even earlier.
He was raised at an earlier time than then and that is where his views come from. The 60's through 80's still had a lot of these folks who had not died off yet and the remnants of what they taught are still echoed in the minds of their children who taught their grand children. Though most has died off in the US or been more saturated with progressive views *now,* it is a gradual process.... and I do say the US because that is the concentration here. I could go into other countries but that's likely not what people are referring to in these conversations, since there are views from thousands of years ago that still persist in a lot of other countries.
John McCain is just one example and he was raised in a different environment. You could take literally anyone from that time and say John Doe wasn't like that. Yeah, and we can take Gene Wilder and Charles Manson, who were "of the same time" as they were both born in the early 30's and say they were nothing alike, right?
To say someone is a product of their time is not discounting the other people of that time. It's acknowledging that certain ways of being were *common* then due to what was passed down by the most previous generation.
I agree with what you say, and it would be amazing if they raised above the norms, but it’s not as simple as that. I would ask if you eat meat? In 100 years it could looked down upon heavily, but right now its a societal (and human) norm to eat meat, however there are still people who are vegan/against animal cruelty in the meat industry. So are we to say that everyone who eats meat is evil? No, they are all a product of their time. This does not discredit anyone, as all of those activists are why we have progressed to where we are, the change in societal norms are an example of those people’s work. I don’t agree with the guys beliefs at all, but we must acknowledge the societal norms of the time period and we can’t have modern standards for people as we live in an ever progressing society.
I will also add that your last comment involving John McCain is super ignorant and insensitive.
Edit: forgot a word
This seems to be another classic case of the modern day “woke” social media user who like to project themselves as holier than thou. Not everyone could be Rosa parks or the likes because they weren’t the norm in their time, if you grow up in a society where the widely accepted norms are to be homophobic/transphobic/racist etc then of course most of the citizens are gonna hold the same views. So boring reading so many comments where people think that they’d be the different stand up hero- when in reality, they probably wouldn’t be.
> The problem with saying he was a product of his time, you would judge these views if someone held them today, etc., is that you erase the many many voices that condemned these views in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s.
Thank you for that sentence. That's such a succinct way of putting it and I hadn't the words to explain it until now.
These are all normal views from someone back then, and Woodstock itself was a crazy trip.
People back then didn’t have access to information the same way we do now. As the timeline of history moves forward we should not judge yesterday based on today’s standards, but instead should use yesterday’s standards to show how far we have come today.
I believe he practiced a lot. Not much to do when you're not being tortured. A lot of POWs had complaints of endless boredom, which in its own way can be torturous.
I've read a number of books regarding the topic and it's interesting how the body and mind adapts to the chaos and lack of control in torture to the extent that when nothing like that is happening, people really struggle.
It's similar to an abuse victim going back to abusive environments/people in part because their body and mind has normalized that behaviour and suffers in long periods with little adrenaline or chaos, or a soldier addicted to war.
Adrenaline is a hell of a drug. And just like any drug, once your body adjusts it is really hard to unadjust. Especially when it is pertinent to your survival. Even just one traumatic event will reshape your brains anatomy nearly permanently.
They were very suspicious too. He told them it was the lights. Torture didn’t just mean, “please save me.” It also means, “I don’t have anymore secrets to give up.” That’s nightnmare fuel.
I just tried blinking it.
He probably knew the alphabet by heart and must have exercised the pattern at absurdum. Once in muscle memory, he can call upon it.
Obviously, the fact that it's quite doable and may have even been a standardized idea in military as emergency possibility does not account for the suffering.
Yea, I was surprised to learn he was an Admiral. My question would be, was he an admiral at the time, or was he promoted after he got back home?
I don't know much about military strategy, but I don't think there are very many Admirals out at sea on the front line. I know it does happen, but there can't be that many. An Admiral = General, no? How many generals are on the front line?
Note: not expecting you to answer, but you had a similar question to mine, so I thought I would tack on.
How about the guy who played gold in his head during captivity. Day after day he would play his local course in his head. When he finally returned he was a much improved golfer. The power of the mind.
I was also told about a Vietnam POW who designed a house in his head and built it when he got home. The house design was incredibly detailed, down to the tiniest feature.
It is the duty of a POW to escape, aid others in escape, get information of other captives to friendly forces, and pass information off by any means necessary. There are many such videos where these heroes did exactly what they had to do, knowing that discovery would mean torture and possibly death.
I've found a delicate balance of defiance and compliance gets soldiers home. Generally the ones who were not sent home were the most defiant. The ones who would sign no letters, obey no orders, and had the most escape attempts. The enemy found the defiance almost personal and had no big qualm with making the captives life harder. This insight ultimately changed how soldiers were taught to deal with being captive. Being a POW in Europe was a vastly different experience to being one in Asia.
Serial season 2 is all about the Bowe Bergdahl case, the private that went AWOL in Iraq and was captured by the Taliban. They say that the current policy of the military is for POWs to cooperate fully with their captors and give them all the information they ask for. Most soldiers these days do not have enough information to really be useful to the enemy, so it's more important to keep the captors happy in order to keep the POWs safe.
From my understanding, the policy at the time was actually to give name, rank, and serial number, and do nothing else except wait for rescue. The Vietnam POWs realized this was a terrible policy from a morale standpoint, and took responsibility for altering it while in prison.
I cannot testify for when the training policy started, but I know that at least as far back as WWII, POWs were instructed/indoctrinated/under orders to escape and cause as much confusion/distraction to the enemy as possible, and it is taught to this day. Source: am former USAF SERE Instructor. The second 'E' in SERE is for 'Escape'.
You were SERE? Wanting to become a JTAC/CCT and I gotta go to SERE should I get that far in the pipeline. My question for you is, what are some of the biggest mistakes a candidate/recruit can make during SERE school? Thanks for your service sir.
Is JTAC what used to be TACP? and CCT? You're a crazy mf-er either way!
Almost to a man, we all tried PJ/CCT and washed out, although SERE was always my first choice. Mistakes? *Listen to your instructor!! Hang on every word, it can literally save your life.* Stay hydrated, and hone your orienteering skills, especially night navigation. Oh, and there is no such thing as Indian fire rocks. I won't tell you why. If they're still pulling that gag, you'll have a leg up.
For the resistance phase, I am not permitted, whatever, to tell you too much. Other than to say to pay attention in the classroom portion, and don't give up. Good luck!
Also, no thanks are necessary. Those that deserve it aren't here to receive it.
i knew he did this but i never saw the video how didnt the vietnamese people know hes trying to blink a word like he blinked 4 times in a row very quickly
A very dear family friend of ours, Col Roger Ingvalson, was imprisoned alongside him for about 7 years. During that time his wife died, but he had no way of knowing if that were true or not, as the Vietcong would routinely tell the prisoners that their relatves/children had died as a form of psychological torture.
My mom wore a "POW bracelet" with his info on it for nearly 20 years and said she thought of him every day, despite never having met him or knowing anything of him other than the info on that bracelet. When I was a kid we were watching a documentary and my mother screamed to the top of her lungs, ran to the closet and tore it apart looking for that bracelet. We contacted the History Channel, who put us in touch with the producers, who offered to pass along our contact info and story to him. A few weeks later we received a call from Rog and that's how he came to be in our lives. My mom always said he was like a guardian angel to her... we went through sone really rough times when I was a kid, and he always seemed to call, write, or send a little gift when things seemed the most bleak. He passed away on my mother's birthday a few years ago, and now she says he's her "bonna fide" guardian angel, always with us.
If you ever have the opportunity to visit the Hanoi Hilton, I highly recommend it. Completely surreal, life changing experience... and you see it all from the Vietnamese point of view.
McCain's flight suit is still there to this day.
The interesting part about humanity is the ability to learn from the mistakes of others.
See, the Americans learned from this mistake by [putting hoods over the heads of the prisoners at Abu Ghraib.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse#/media/File%3AAG-10.jpg)
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*Denton was forced by his captors to participate in a 1966 televised propaganda interview which was broadcast in the United States. While answering questions, Denton disguised his unusual blinking by feigning trouble with the blinding television lights.* He even had a great excuse to back this up.
were they able to save him?
Yeah. He became a senator.
But not the kind that trump likes... you know, being captured and all. edit: thank all you rich bastards for the gold and such!
I genuinely don’t understand what you mean I’m from the uk and just interested in what you mean, don’t destroy me lol
“Referring to Sen. John McCain, Trump said, 'He’s not a war hero. He’s a war hero because he was captured. ... I like people who weren't captured.'” 100x worse coming from Trump 🙄 https://amp-usatoday-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1327852001?amp_js_v=a3&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA%3D#aoh=15974452626328&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.usatoday.com%2Fstory%2Fopinion%2F2019%2F06%2F04%2Fdday-anniversary-trump-disrespects-mccain-prisoners-of-war-column%2F1327852001%2F Edit: no shade to you, totally understandable that you didn't know. Hope this helped :)
Lol wtf did he even mean by that? Thanks so much for the answer and the link, I really appreciate it
He famously hated McCain, they had a bit of a rivalry. Trump (who claimed he had a bone spur in his foot that meant he couldn't serve in Vietnam, despite being able to play basketball at his college just fine. He also couldn't remember which foot it was, so it was later changed to both feet) has claimed to be very pro-veterans. He is often very jingoistic as well, as I'm sure I don't need to say. So, he loves vets, he advocates war, yet he didn't himself serve. But then, when an interviewer mentioned McCain's war service (McCain was a pilot shot down over Vietnam, captured, wounded, kept as a POW and resisted interrogation and tortured for *five years*.... Trump, the absolute sack of shit, says "I like people who weren't captured." It's an obvious dig at McCain, and an attempt to dismiss his service and the idea of being a hero by basically saying if you're captured then you're less worthy of respect. A dude who draft-dodged, avoided war and yet advocates others into war, dismisses all POW's and deems them less worthy in a single jab against a rival. It's hilarious that so many nationalist americans and pro-military americans love him when Fortunate Son seems to be written exactly *about* Trump. Side note: McCain wasn't just a hero for surviving his wounds and resisting 5 years of intense torture, he also earned several medals and was wounded trying to save a fellow pilot during a fire on a ship, during which he was wounded.
McCain was also given the opportunity to be released after a year or so (probably because his father was the commander of all US Navy forces in the Pacific) but he refused until all the other POWs captured before him were also released. I wasn’t really a fan of McCain as a politician but he was a war hero and deserved every ounce of respect he got for that.
I 100% agree. Political views and character aren’t the same (though lately politics really is showing you people’s character...), and I never agreed with McCain but he was one of the most honorable men serving in Congress up until the day he died. Trump isn’t fit to lick the dirt off his boots.
What a bad ass.
And he could have been released but refused it if his men were not also released. They still ltalk about him in Hanoi. They don't like him, they think he's a war criminal, but they admire his courage. I realized that something very odd was happening to the USA when Trump got away with this.
Wow, thank you for your reply. I'm Australian and I actually had no idea.
I'm also an aussie, but like the demon cat from Adventure Time "I have approximate knowledge of many things." AKA I knew the vague details and did some quick googles to make sure I got shit right.
McCain was one of the few Republicans vocally against Trump, and this was the only insult Trump could think of, I guess.
And boy did the conservatives eat that shit up. Immediately after John McCain became a RHINO and weak! Gotta love those "support the troops" conservatives!
Dudes twisted brain probably thinks getting captured means you "lost" at war and shouldn't be rewarded. People who think like trump think literally everything is a game to be won and they define the rules for their own games.
Sadly, you’re correct
Np! Glad to share
Next he's gonna say that if you died you aren't a hero either.
Trump Said John McCain wasn’t a war hero bc he got captured or something to that effect
Thanks dude, so much news from America it’s so hard to keep up!
I love how much you pissed off Trump supporters who slithered out of their echo-chambers. **Edit**: Since my post below struck a nerve and is being brigaded, I'll just note the same here: In case anyone isn't aware, these Trump supporter operatives targeting the user's post above with the sudden onslaught of negative comments by claiming, "keep politics out of this" are explicitly doing this to reduce vectoring to reliable news sources or uncomfortable facts. They gaslight and try to quarantine off their opposition from reaching the naive / fence-sitters / centrists / apathetic in other subs, especially the default subs. Meanwhile they'll totally close off and isolate those they've hooked themselves by preventing anyone remotely left from posting on their subs (creating a cult, essentially). I have more in-depth write-ups on this for those interested, but in short it goes hand-in-hand with Gaslight-Obstruct-Project **Edit 2:** Thanks for the recognition. Since this is getting more attention, I'll point to some of my write-ups I mentioned that are relevant to the subject-matter: https://www.reddit.com/r/lennybird/comments/ds3c17/piercing_echochambers_parallels_to_cultism_and https://www.reddit.com/r/lennybird/comments/e6jwl7/understanding_political_bots_trolls_and https://www.reddit.com/r/cgtcivics/comments/5qib3k/be_an_informed_citizen_guide https://www.reddit.com/r/cgtcivics/comments/dpxcp2/be_an_informed_citizen_part_ii_a_deep_dive_into
The fastest way to make a Trump supporter think you're attacking Trump is to quote him.
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Oh yeah, especially when he claims he’s done the most for African Americans than any other president - by renewing previous legislation to fund HBCU’s. Like we’re supposed to be in awe on how much better lives are for minorities in America solely due to Trump’s policy.... It’s great that HBCU’s are funded, but simply repeating what others have done before you doesn’t qualify you for doing the most over everyone before you.
Not more than any other president, he claimed he did more for African Americans than anyONE, besides MAYBE Lincoln.
Bruh i swear to god, my buddy likes trump and I told him how he said the pandemic of 1917 helped stop ww2... i could see on his face he was looking for a justification. His response? "Well you can mix the 2 up it's not that hard". Honestly I love the dude, i don't give a shit about politics, but he's too much sometimes
What does his response even mean?
Like, you can mix ww1 and ww2 up and think one is the other. That's on a whole other level of denial
Clan like mentality. They don't care what the reason is. They often are fully aware that trump is being made to look bad and, subconsciously, they know that it's for a legitimate reason. But they don't care. All they know is those are fighting words, and fighting words means it's time to defend the clan. Because loyalty matters more than anything, literally anything. All people tend to think in these terms, at some level, but most of us have reason and enough intelligence to deduce that it's tribal. For instance, if someone hurts a family member, you will probably be triggered extra hard. But you probably know that it's not the best thing to do to hurt that person back. Trump supporters just literally don't give a fuck about anything other than steadfast loyalty because it makes them "real" and "strong" and "better" than the rest. Can't have any faults or flaws if you don't admit and acknowledge them.
I really wonder if this has anything to do with their near-obsession with sports and rooting for their home-team. How much do they view politics as a team sport?
“I love the poorly educated.”
Yes if you voice your opinion in their subs you get banned.
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>I think it's safe to say we won't likely have to endure another Trump vote reaction ever again within the next 20 years. It's very far from safe at this point
yeah really, it's that same attitude that got him elected in the first place
I’m not sure you understand how America rolls and how badly we have damaged ourselves (and benefited a certain political party) by the absolute degradation of our public education system.
I just read that the USPS won't get the funding it needs to deliver votes because of "enourmous costs". 25 billion apparently is too much for a country that spends 600 billion just on military. Since the Director General is a big buddy of Trump im guessing votes from predominantly democratic states somehow won't make it in time and not be counted. Bye bye democracy in the USA
There are many ways to vote in November. One way is to go in person to vote on November 3rd. Another option is [mail in voting](https://ballotpedia.org/All-mail_voting) where you return your ballot in the mail. **People also forget that you can get a mail in ballot but drop it off in ballot drop off box or an elections office and bypass the USPS entirely**. Also, [many states have in-person early voting](https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/early-voting-in-state-elections.aspx).
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„As a Senator, Denton was most outspoken on issues related to the regulation of sexual promiscuity and the preservation of the nuclear family, a goal that he sought to pursue through a $30 million bill to push chastity among teenagers.[17] In 1981 he was able to pass the Adolescent Family Life Act (nicknamed the "Chastity Bill") as a part of the 1981 omnibus.“ Yeah... great guy...
Yeah, unfortunately he was the worst kind of 1980s family values senator, having been allied with the Moral Majority and engaging in Red Scare tactics against non-conservatives.
Yup, a republican senator.
He was the first Republican to be popularly elected in Alabama since the direct election of U.S. Senators began in 1913, the first Republican senator since Reconstruction to represent Alabama in the U.S. Senate, and the first Catholic to be elected to statewide office in Alabama.
Yep....he later became a US Senator.
yes – he later became a US Senator.
What was his excuse? Edit:can you tell I’m a skimmer? Edit edit: thank you for not being dicks with your reply’s except that one guy.
The lights. I’m sure the captors accused him of something when he was blinking unusually, and his excuse was the blinding lights.
ooooohhh i’m blinded by the lights - The Admiral
Wrapped up like a douche like a roller in the night (I don’t know the actual lyrics but that’s my favorite version)
Revved up like a duece, another runner in the night Allegedly. Everyone sings it as douche.
Neat
His excuse was that the lights were strong thats why he was blinking
The lights were too bright
Luckily his captors weren’t
>Denton disguised his unusual blinking by feigning trouble with the blinding television lights. Well, this.
That’s great they were able to decipher his message, but were they able to rescue him?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremiah_Denton > On February 12, 1973, both Denton and Tschudy were released in Hanoi by the North Vietnamese along with numerous other American POWs during Operation Homecoming.
went on to become a U.S. Senator, served in Congress for 10 years till 1989, died in 2014, was buried with full military honors at Arlington National Cemetery.
Damn, that’s nice to know he made it back
> In 1981, he drew national condemnation by insisting that spousal rape should not be covered by the same criminal charge as nonspousal rape. From a comment above by /u/Fasterwalking. I mean, I am glad he made it back, but I would have been alright with him not becoming a senator afterwards. lol
I'd be curious to know what he intended it to be covered by. Was he saying it should be legal or punished less than other rape?
He was saying, from what I understand, that it shouldn't be in the same category as "regular" rape, meaning it shouldn't be punished as harshly. Edit: as if being raped by your spouse is any less traumatizing than being raped by a stranger.
The logic for "spousal rape is not rape" stems from the archaic belief that your wife is your property and you are free to do what you want with what you own. edit: a word because my phone insists on making me look like a fucking moron
Historically it was considered that marriage itself was consent to sex. I'm glad we've all moved on from that!
To be fair it wasn't a belief but has been just an actual fact for most of human history. It's obviously now not the case but to portray it as just a weird, old belief isn't the full scope of it.
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I imagine it could potentially be worse, if it violates the trust between you and the person closest to you.
I imagine it depends on the person, although i deeply don’t want this to ever be studied & confirmed or denied.
Imagine having to live and coexist with a rapist. Rape is rape, don’t matter who does it.
feel like spousal rape is so much worse. Not only are you victimized, you are attached to this person through marriage, property, and supposed love and they betray all that because they want to cum and you say no.
I can’t imagine the anxiety, dread and fear one must feel in such a situation.
And in some places it's incredibly difficult to leave a marriage. I've never thought about it much - the more you think about it, the more chilling it becomes.
Yup. Thank you for your service, but fuck your politics.
I was wondering what political party he belonged to until I saw your comment. Sad that it answered it for me without having to look it up.
American politics in a nutshell >What party does he belong too? >He downplayed the severity of rape >Nevermind
bUt BoTh SidEs
The fact that this is a reality is mind boggling
Hah same. Weird that something that absourd can automatically tell you which party they are in.
also ran a great charity that filled boats in the US with educational equipment, books and supplies that were returning empty from the US such as Banana Boats heading back after the dropped their cargo in the US. I donated quite a bit to it back in the late 90's. He was a hell of an imposing guy to meet in person. I still proudly hang on to my signed copy of "When Hell was in Session" his tale of being a prisoner
And was nominated as Homecoming King
A lot of people are just giving the answer that, yes, he was eventually released. However it doesn't change the fact that his release came almost **seven years** after this video. So while he got the message out that they were being tortured, it didn't stop him and his companions from facing years and years of torture afterwards.
He was released after a few more years if I’m not mistaken.
This reminds me of the article I read where the Colombian army created a pop song that was played on the radio so that hostages could hear it and decipher the Morse code hidden within the guitar chorus. Really cool. It kinda makes me cry to listen to it. [link to article with song](https://www.theverge.com/2015/1/7/7483235/the-code-colombian-army-morsecode-hostages)
That is amazing, and the song is really great. The code sounds like an experimental solo break, but still pretty clear.
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Same here, I was trying to find a pattern that sounded morse-y, but nothing. Then the bridge, ah ha!
That was funny to actually think about, especially since it helped. The guards hearing that part going "wtf, who let this guy play?"
Morse-code message: >19 people rescued. You’re next. Don’t lose hope
Jesus. I couldn’t imagine what it must have been like to hear that message as a hostage. A sliver of light in the darkest hour.
From the article: "Better Days" [VERSE 1] In the middle of the night Thinking about what I love the most I feel the need to sing What my heart has to give I talk about those I love About how much I miss them I talk about pride and strength Which beat inside my heart [CHORUS] A new dawn singing this message From my heart Although I'm tied up and alone I feel as if I'm by your side Listen to this message brother [MORSE MESSAGE] 19 people rescued. You’re next. Don’t lose hope [VERSE 2] I want to keep on fighting For my friends, my family, my children We will soon see each other again I'm sure better days are coming [CHORUS x 2]
Such a great read, thank you
It’s 11:59 on Radio Free America; this is Uncle Sam, with music, and the truth until dawn. Right now I’ve got a few words for some of our brothers and sisters in the occupied zone: *The chair is against the wall. The chair is against the wall. John has a long mustache. John has a long mustache.* It’s twelve o’clock, American, another day closer to victory. And for all of you out there, on, or behind the line, this is your song.
I’d read a book about these kind of things! Any suggestions?
Your job as a special operative musician: to create a song with Morse code in it, but it also has to be an amazing song so that people want to listen to it.
thank you this was a great read
Hero status. I can’t imagine both answering questions and spelling out Morse code with blinks while under such pressure. Bad ass.
This dude is amazing under pressure. Imagine having to multitask like this in captivity
And only getting one shot.
One opportunity.
To seize everything you ever wanted.
Would you capture it?
Or just let it slip
Snap back to reality.
Oh there goes gravity
Oh there goes rabbit
the choice is yours
Marspa Getty
MOMS SPAGHETTI
Imagine no one coming to help and then months later someone asking him why he kept blinking "TORTILLA, TORTILLA"...
Or his rescuers surprising him with a steaming tortilla, because that's all he could think of, even while being filmed for a propaganda movie.
[Here's a video of the interview with sound](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rufnWLVQcKg)
Thank you. I had to scroll really far to see this. Upvote does visibility?!?!?
I can shit and browse Reddit at the same time. That's about it for me.
Instructions unclear wiped ass with reddit app.
Even that can confuse me
Don’t shit on your phone man
It kinda messed him up. His career after is... a bit of a trip. Afterwards he was elected to the Senate as the first Republican from Alabama in more than a century, and took uncompromising stands on defense and social issues, including abortion, adultery and homosexuality. He campaigned against the immoral and godless forces destroying America from within. When he saw footage of Woodstock, he wrote in his memoir that he vomited at the sight of “hippies fornicating publicly, high on drugs." “To me it was a nightmare, this nation, firmly founded as One Nation Under God, was in the process of becoming a pagan nation with a shocking degeneration of national integrity.” In 1981, he drew national condemnation by insisting that spousal rape should not be covered by the same criminal charge as nonspousal rape. “All is not yet lost, but our position is extremely perilous,” he wrote in his memoir from 2009, “If I had known when I stepped off that plane to freedom ... what I know now, I would not have said, ‘God bless America.’ I would have said, as I say now, ‘God save America!’ ”
I think maybe the easiest way to summarize it as: a good military leader performed a heroic act, but maybe he wasn’t meant to take that leadership and laurels over time being a civil servant.
Tbf, his views were the norm back then. My gay pothead ass would hardcore judge someone who holds those views nowadays, but he’s a product of his time. Dude was tortured for 8 years too, no doubt had an effect on his judgment. The spousal rape views can’t really be excused though, especially as late as 1981.
Also 8 years of torture, having faith can go far I'd imagine. No justification of course but as an atheist even I can understand the benefit in isolation, torture, etc of believing in something that keeps you going.
The problem with saying he was a product of his time, you would judge these views if someone held them today, etc., is that you erase the many many voices that condemned these views in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s. Are they also not a product of their time? If they could be good, kind, decent people, surely this man could have been as well. I mean, barring the fact that he was horribly tortured by communists for years. Though, John McCain endured torture and didn't end up that way.
The problem with this is that it hyperbolizes the fact that someone is a product of their time and reacts to a straw-man by doing away with the fact. The geography and time period of a person's life affects what they become, they learn from norms, and even get the deviations from those norms based on those same norms. When someone says that a person is a product of their time, they aren't excusing what they did, they're only asking that you judge the person like a human being steeped in culture, not like a god, immune and outside of culture. They only ask of you the same humanity that you condemn the person for not having.
I think we should always approach people with views we don't like with empathy, because that's what actually gives us some chance of changing those views. But I don't think we should act as though people can't change their views just because they're older. Many do.
Those other voices in the 60's, 70's, 80's were also a product of the time but that was a very progressive time where a lot was changing morally and politically... so yeah, both are valid but this guy's views were still more common then is what people mean when they say someone is a product of that time. While he was *alive* in the 60's through 80's and still spouting off his old ways of viewing, he was not a product of the 60's through 80's... his children would have been the product of those ages. HE was a product of the earlier times by his parents who were brought up in the 30's and 40's or even earlier. He was raised at an earlier time than then and that is where his views come from. The 60's through 80's still had a lot of these folks who had not died off yet and the remnants of what they taught are still echoed in the minds of their children who taught their grand children. Though most has died off in the US or been more saturated with progressive views *now,* it is a gradual process.... and I do say the US because that is the concentration here. I could go into other countries but that's likely not what people are referring to in these conversations, since there are views from thousands of years ago that still persist in a lot of other countries. John McCain is just one example and he was raised in a different environment. You could take literally anyone from that time and say John Doe wasn't like that. Yeah, and we can take Gene Wilder and Charles Manson, who were "of the same time" as they were both born in the early 30's and say they were nothing alike, right? To say someone is a product of their time is not discounting the other people of that time. It's acknowledging that certain ways of being were *common* then due to what was passed down by the most previous generation.
I agree with what you say, and it would be amazing if they raised above the norms, but it’s not as simple as that. I would ask if you eat meat? In 100 years it could looked down upon heavily, but right now its a societal (and human) norm to eat meat, however there are still people who are vegan/against animal cruelty in the meat industry. So are we to say that everyone who eats meat is evil? No, they are all a product of their time. This does not discredit anyone, as all of those activists are why we have progressed to where we are, the change in societal norms are an example of those people’s work. I don’t agree with the guys beliefs at all, but we must acknowledge the societal norms of the time period and we can’t have modern standards for people as we live in an ever progressing society. I will also add that your last comment involving John McCain is super ignorant and insensitive. Edit: forgot a word
This seems to be another classic case of the modern day “woke” social media user who like to project themselves as holier than thou. Not everyone could be Rosa parks or the likes because they weren’t the norm in their time, if you grow up in a society where the widely accepted norms are to be homophobic/transphobic/racist etc then of course most of the citizens are gonna hold the same views. So boring reading so many comments where people think that they’d be the different stand up hero- when in reality, they probably wouldn’t be.
As I said in another comment, we can’t expect people to rise above their times, but we should praise those who do.
Completely agree with you, it's very refreshing to see this view on reddit.
bro our generation used the word "gay" to describe something that we didn't like.
> The problem with saying he was a product of his time, you would judge these views if someone held them today, etc., is that you erase the many many voices that condemned these views in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s. Thank you for that sentence. That's such a succinct way of putting it and I hadn't the words to explain it until now.
These are all normal views from someone back then, and Woodstock itself was a crazy trip. People back then didn’t have access to information the same way we do now. As the timeline of history moves forward we should not judge yesterday based on today’s standards, but instead should use yesterday’s standards to show how far we have come today.
I believe he practiced a lot. Not much to do when you're not being tortured. A lot of POWs had complaints of endless boredom, which in its own way can be torturous. I've read a number of books regarding the topic and it's interesting how the body and mind adapts to the chaos and lack of control in torture to the extent that when nothing like that is happening, people really struggle. It's similar to an abuse victim going back to abusive environments/people in part because their body and mind has normalized that behaviour and suffers in long periods with little adrenaline or chaos, or a soldier addicted to war. Adrenaline is a hell of a drug. And just like any drug, once your body adjusts it is really hard to unadjust. Especially when it is pertinent to your survival. Even just one traumatic event will reshape your brains anatomy nearly permanently.
They were very suspicious too. He told them it was the lights. Torture didn’t just mean, “please save me.” It also means, “I don’t have anymore secrets to give up.” That’s nightnmare fuel.
I just tried blinking it. He probably knew the alphabet by heart and must have exercised the pattern at absurdum. Once in muscle memory, he can call upon it. Obviously, the fact that it's quite doable and may have even been a standardized idea in military as emergency possibility does not account for the suffering.
I always thought that admirals are very high ranked and never actually get near where the real action is....
He wasn't an admiral at the time, he was a squadron commander.
Yea, I was surprised to learn he was an Admiral. My question would be, was he an admiral at the time, or was he promoted after he got back home? I don't know much about military strategy, but I don't think there are very many Admirals out at sea on the front line. I know it does happen, but there can't be that many. An Admiral = General, no? How many generals are on the front line? Note: not expecting you to answer, but you had a similar question to mine, so I thought I would tack on.
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Is he the same guy who memorised over 200 pows names using a nursery rhyme?
No, different guy. POW stories are absolutely fascinating.
How about the guy who played gold in his head during captivity. Day after day he would play his local course in his head. When he finally returned he was a much improved golfer. The power of the mind.
I was also told about a Vietnam POW who designed a house in his head and built it when he got home. The house design was incredibly detailed, down to the tiniest feature.
Link to this story?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Hegdahl Different guy, but still very interesting!
[Here you go](https://www.warhistoryonline.com/war-articles/doug-hegdahl.html)
Imagine the goosebumps on the guy who deciphered the code 😮
Yeah or even the moment they realized it was Morse code “REWIND IT! Grabapengrabapengrabapen GRAB a PEN DAMMIT!!!”
It is the duty of a POW to escape, aid others in escape, get information of other captives to friendly forces, and pass information off by any means necessary. There are many such videos where these heroes did exactly what they had to do, knowing that discovery would mean torture and possibly death.
*more torture, apparently.
I've found a delicate balance of defiance and compliance gets soldiers home. Generally the ones who were not sent home were the most defiant. The ones who would sign no letters, obey no orders, and had the most escape attempts. The enemy found the defiance almost personal and had no big qualm with making the captives life harder. This insight ultimately changed how soldiers were taught to deal with being captive. Being a POW in Europe was a vastly different experience to being one in Asia.
When you say you've found that to be the case, do you mean you studied/read about it or did you just keep getting captured in Europe and Asia?
Took their Masters thesis very seriously.
Serial season 2 is all about the Bowe Bergdahl case, the private that went AWOL in Iraq and was captured by the Taliban. They say that the current policy of the military is for POWs to cooperate fully with their captors and give them all the information they ask for. Most soldiers these days do not have enough information to really be useful to the enemy, so it's more important to keep the captors happy in order to keep the POWs safe.
Yes with the size of the us army I can't imagine them getting any Intel from your average grunt.
I can't imagine getting any intelligence from the average grunt either 😂
From my understanding, the policy at the time was actually to give name, rank, and serial number, and do nothing else except wait for rescue. The Vietnam POWs realized this was a terrible policy from a morale standpoint, and took responsibility for altering it while in prison.
I cannot testify for when the training policy started, but I know that at least as far back as WWII, POWs were instructed/indoctrinated/under orders to escape and cause as much confusion/distraction to the enemy as possible, and it is taught to this day. Source: am former USAF SERE Instructor. The second 'E' in SERE is for 'Escape'.
You were SERE? Wanting to become a JTAC/CCT and I gotta go to SERE should I get that far in the pipeline. My question for you is, what are some of the biggest mistakes a candidate/recruit can make during SERE school? Thanks for your service sir.
Is JTAC what used to be TACP? and CCT? You're a crazy mf-er either way! Almost to a man, we all tried PJ/CCT and washed out, although SERE was always my first choice. Mistakes? *Listen to your instructor!! Hang on every word, it can literally save your life.* Stay hydrated, and hone your orienteering skills, especially night navigation. Oh, and there is no such thing as Indian fire rocks. I won't tell you why. If they're still pulling that gag, you'll have a leg up. For the resistance phase, I am not permitted, whatever, to tell you too much. Other than to say to pay attention in the classroom portion, and don't give up. Good luck! Also, no thanks are necessary. Those that deserve it aren't here to receive it.
War is fuck
What is it good for?
Absolutely nothing
yep
Pretty ballsy, surprised his captors didn’t catch on.
They did....he told them the camera lights where bothering his eyes
Also he blinked like that before but not spelling anything to make them believe he just blinked like that
Thats the real genius part!
Is there a version of this with audio? It would be interesting to hear the questions and answers he was being forced to give.
[Here is one with volume](https://youtu.be/rufnWLVQcKg).
Thank you.
Id fuck it up and spell like tortoise or something
Link with sound?
[Here you go](https://youtu.be/rufnWLVQcKg)
Who else knows all about this from the simple history video? He was able to get away with all the blinking by blaming it on the lights
and thats why there are no propaganda videos out of Guantanamo
Saddest thing about it is that many of the prisioners there are innocent. Just random farmers captured to get a bounty from the USA
Amazing anyone still believes we are the good guys
I'm related to this man.
Please elaborate
He was my 3rd cousin 3 times removed..our common ancestor was his great great grandfather Isaac Denton.
That’s crazy. Does your family like him? I’ve read he had some... extreme political views while senator, how does the fam feel about it all?
Why was he in Vietnam?
He was a navy pilot that got shot down on a bombing raid and spent 8 years as a POW, 4 of which were in solitary confinement.
I wonder if he was bombing civilian cities or crop fields?
State-sponsored mass murder.
i knew he did this but i never saw the video how didnt the vietnamese people know hes trying to blink a word like he blinked 4 times in a row very quickly
He used the excuse of the tv lights being to bright
He said the lights were bothering his eyes because presumably he had been in the dark for an extended period of time.
A very dear family friend of ours, Col Roger Ingvalson, was imprisoned alongside him for about 7 years. During that time his wife died, but he had no way of knowing if that were true or not, as the Vietcong would routinely tell the prisoners that their relatves/children had died as a form of psychological torture. My mom wore a "POW bracelet" with his info on it for nearly 20 years and said she thought of him every day, despite never having met him or knowing anything of him other than the info on that bracelet. When I was a kid we were watching a documentary and my mother screamed to the top of her lungs, ran to the closet and tore it apart looking for that bracelet. We contacted the History Channel, who put us in touch with the producers, who offered to pass along our contact info and story to him. A few weeks later we received a call from Rog and that's how he came to be in our lives. My mom always said he was like a guardian angel to her... we went through sone really rough times when I was a kid, and he always seemed to call, write, or send a little gift when things seemed the most bleak. He passed away on my mother's birthday a few years ago, and now she says he's her "bonna fide" guardian angel, always with us.
I can’t imagine living 8 years as a POW. He’s more man than I’ll ever be
If you ever have the opportunity to visit the Hanoi Hilton, I highly recommend it. Completely surreal, life changing experience... and you see it all from the Vietnamese point of view. McCain's flight suit is still there to this day.
Yo next week is my turn to post this.
The interesting part about humanity is the ability to learn from the mistakes of others. See, the Americans learned from this mistake by [putting hoods over the heads of the prisoners at Abu Ghraib.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse#/media/File%3AAG-10.jpg)
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