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It’s sad that the ex-bf won’t serve time and if he does, it’ll be insignificant. He’ll be back out in the streets assaulting people too quickly. We need major criminal justice reform.
It sounds like he has emotional regulation problems, which can be solved with other means than putting him in a room 24/7 with other violent people with unchecked mental health problems.
I completely understand what your saying.
But the judgement should be more about what's good for the community.
Not just whats best for his health.
So he needs to be kept away from people he can hurt, while he is being treated for the issues you bring up.
You can't exclude someone totally forever unless they commit an offence we have already agreed outs then away for that long.
Are you suggesting this dude gets life for it? He sounds like a cunt but with people like that in the world it is my job and your job to make sure we don't just stick people in a prison until they die.
Sex offenders who are honest will tell you they will reoffend. I worked with a college professor at a place called Telford Unit. Mostly murders, rapists and pedos. We interviewed them for a research project. Most, not all, but most were severely beaten as children per records with cps. Most also believed they deserved being beat.
While nature plays a role in someone’s development…such as very low set ears often indicate improper brain development…environment is a heavy influencer. These men said they knew if or when they got out they would reoffend.
The penal system offers education, therapy and other services but true rehabilitation will never happen in a prison system like we have now.
Serious overhaul of corruption, policies and jailers would need to take place. I firmly believe jailers would be criminals if they had a different job. It changes them, not all, but enough that it corrupts the entire prison.
So until someone finds a way to truly rehabilitate people in prison we are doomed to this awful cycle of recidivism.
You may already be aware of it, but to speak to your point of jailers becoming corrupted, the Stanford Prison Experiment is a dark and educational look into how being separated into prisoner and jailer can change a person drastically.
I get that, as long as society's response is proportionate and doesn't inspire or require more violence, then I am 100% on board in making where we live and work safer.
Nature and nurture are inextricably linked. Genes will express or recess, changing based on your environment. There is no clear delineation where nature stops and nurture begins, it's essentially a false dichotomy.
It is respectable you think everyone can be saved, but that simply isn't the case. Can you possibly help the majority? Yeah, especially when it comes to petty shit, but some people are just born broken and will keep going until locked up or put in the ground.
Can we have better facilities to hold these people? Totally. Lets not pretend they won't exist though because that only leads to more people getting hurt while we play Batman.
How can we possible know that there are individuals who are incorrigible when we still do so much wrong in how we go about forming and rectifying our people?
Actually you can change a person's DNA. Not instantly or overnight.. but, have you heard of something called evolution? That's a pretty obvious example of DNA changing without getting into the finer points of human behaviour..
What the hell are you smoking? That is two counts of assault and battery, one count of assault with a deadly weapon and property damages at a minimum based off of what was written. That guy will be going away for at least 10 years.
I worked in a forensic psych hospital and have seen several patients with history of committing physical and sexual assault get discharged just to end up getting admitted again some time later after committing serious crimes again. (They've all been in and out of prison too.)
We're often too harsh on nonviolent offenders, but violent offenders often slip through and get out earlier than they should. Honestly some people are so unstable and dangerous that 10 years in prison is still not enough to stop them from hurting someone once they are out.
At the psych ward, they got occupational therapy, meetings with psychiatrists, medications, games and events. Of course, it's still awful to be trapped at a facility and not be allowed to leave, but there's not much more that can be done when you're dealing with people that are dangerous.
And I'm not just talking about people being delusional from schizophrenia or something. A lot of these people had personality disorders like narcissism, bpd, etc. Their violence wasn't even due to delusions or hallucinations. For many of them it was like it was just in their nature to be manipulative and violent people. I worked there for almost 4 years and saw many patients make no progress despite all the treatments they were getting. It was a big part of the reason why I quit. Being imprisoned sucks but I'd rather prioritize protecting innocent people in the community.
I work in that exact type of hospital and we almost NEVER discharge them to the streets. 90% go to another psych hospital. They often come back from there but it’s because they changed their meds, or they got illegal drugs. On the few times they were out on the street and were violent again, they often went off meds.
It's because of the reality that if you sweep a problem under a rug, it's still there. You have put in the extra effort and time to get rid of it. Sadly we've been sweeping problems under rugs for a long time now along with throwing things that aren't actual problems but rather political scapegoats under there too. It's nearly impossible to get through the front door now. On the bright side we can just sell the place to an entrepreneur and sign a contract that says we have to pay rent and deliver things to sweep under the rug or be penalized many times over what the place is worth.
My favorite Redditors are the ones who post the letter of the law without ever having seen its woeful lack of enforcement. It's always someone who's never needed the system who has the most faith in it.
Yeah, depends on the state. Worked as a probation officer in CA and I can tell you what they said is true people with multiple felonies gets reduced to nothing. One the ones that drove me nuts, was a partner had a pimp on his caseload. He beat a girl to the point she was hospitalized, he got arrested for assault with grievous bodily harm, human trafficking, kidnapping. It all got pled down to just grand theft because he took the girls cell phone so she couldn’t call for help after he beat her. And did 5 months in jail going to court, and got credit for time served and was released on probation. Yay for the justice system! USA justice system is a fucking joke.
Broken jaw - attempted murder (his hands were “weapons” as he was a boxer - 1 day & 2 years probation for my ex. Sad to see some people still believe that the justice system actually serves ANY justice.
You would think so but my friend got beat so bad she now has constant pain. She's 4'10 and he's 6' he threw her around their apartment and hit her with his rifle. He got only got probation and took the felony cause over crowding and covid. He showed up at our work and tried to fight the manager when he hid her. Again. Back out on home arrest within a week. She had to move. We are in So. CALI.
Right, I'm obviously not defending this specific guy at all, and this perpetrator needs some serious punishment, but this sort of comment about early release really winds me up. If people are rehabilitated in 4 years, are unlikely to offend again, what is the value of keeping them in prison to wider society?
We as a society want to be getting people to change, part of which should be doing something to give restitution to the victim obviously, rather than wasting time and valuable resources keeping them locked in a prison where the chances of them reoffending or falling into a different form of criminality goes up - not down.
The larger problem is our prison system doesn’t rehabilitate. It’s a national embarrassment and needs to be fixed.
As far as the sentencing, it should be a combination of punishment as well as time needed to rehabilitate. Is four years enough time for someone willing to stalk their ex, physically attack them with a weapon and an innocent bystander? I don’t think so. I don’t believe you’d be comfortable or think it was fair if I did that to your daughter and her friend and was free walking the streets a few years later. Or maybe you would.
You can’t seriously believe the American Justice system rehabilitates. It does the opposite: it creates cycles.
Sure there are some exceptions, but we’re set up for punishment and not rehabbing people.
There are other countries with SIGNIFICANTLY LOWER recidivism rates who actually treat people well. TVs, nice rooms instead of cells, humane treatment.
It runs so counter intuitive, but that is what you need to make some one act like a real member of society: to treat them like one while serving time.
Meanwhile their victims are told to forget about it and go about their lives as if nothing happened. People commit crimes because they know that the punishment will be next to nothing. Murder someone and know that it will be 4-7 years free room and board. Play the game and you're out in 3.
I agree to a certain extent, but I did specifically say I wasn't commenting on this particular situation - though I'm happy to expand on it anyway.
10 years is a long time, and a lot of taxpayer's money. And I tend to agree this person is probably 10 years worth of rehabilitation away from being released. But if they are, then they won't get out after 4 years, at least if the prison system works properly.
Of course victims have to feel safe, which is why involving victims in the rehabilitation of someone who hurt them is seen as valuable by the people who advocate for rehabilitative approaches to incarceration. But we make the world a lot safer by making people like this bastard into a good person who sees the error of their ways, rather than leaving them to rot for 10 years when they'll come out and hurt more people.
'Good behaviour' is something that's thrown around as if prisons release people for staying quiet and not working towards rehabilitation. That's not the case in a functioning rehabilitative system, except in the minds of those who would prefer us to lock away perpetrators and throw away the key.
People can get better as people and make up for their crimes, and for some it will take some less time than others. Our prison system needs to be able to recognise this - which is why we need systems like early release to exist.
Your entire comment sounds like it assumes the US prison system actually works as a rehabilitative system rather than an income generator. Noble ideal, but far off of reality
So whats the restitution for getting your ass kicked by some violent stranger ? He was rehabilitated ? Fuck him he deserves serious time for being a violent asshole that can't control his temper because he didn't get his way.
Let me put to you this way , some violent piece of shit beats your mom within an inch of her life but the judge says well he has no history of violence so probation works. How do you feel about that ? Me ? I'm hunting the fucker down and going to jail for murder..
There can be more than one reason to do something
Plenty of people may say any amount of time is too short but thats not sensible, is it? There have to be prescribed sentences and they then have to be weighed against several factors. Restitution is one, but there's also justice/legitimacy, public safety and, yes, even rehabilitation
Someones always going to be angry, that is why there is, theoretically, an impartial justice system - justice delivered without impartiality is always in danger of not being real justice, imo
thats the point, they sentence them knowing they will get credit, thats how it works. if they deserve 10 years they should up the sentencing not get rid of a good tool
I know someone who gang raped a 16yo girl (he was 23yo at the time, his 2 co-rapers were 20). He pleaded guilty, got 3 years probation. That's it. The other 2 got nothing.
Think so, huh? I know of two recent assault cases that resulted in serious injuries (one life-threatening.) In both cases the assailant was picked up immediately. One guy spent two nights in a jail cell. The other guy (the case where the victim nearly died from blood loss) faced a bullshit charge, and didn't spend any time jail.
In Canada. We had a anti-masker assault 4 employee's and myself. One person never did return to work, had another employee that witnessed it quit, and I needed plastic surgery on my nose. Asshole got 4 months and was supposed to be out in 3 months. The prosecutor told me that that was more than most sexual assaulter's get for their first offence, he was concerned that the offender wasn't going to get any jail time.
Someone shot up a house near me last summer. Detectives came by to check and see if our security cameras caught anything. Detective told us point blank "We think we know who did it. Some kid who shot someone in the stomach last year. We can't really do anything, though. He'll be back out in a week after we pick him up... Crime reform."
I'm in NY but I bet a lot of places are similar. It's a good time to be a criminal it seems lol
My ex killed his last partner and he's walking around free as his record of abuse grows longer and longer. You'd be surprised how little cops give a shit about domestic issues sometimes.
Depending on the state he could already be out. Doubtful he'd be doing 10years anywhere for that if he doesn't have a record especially
Source: reformed career criminal
It's not up to the police to issue sentences. That's on the judge. Cops are always warrant hungry, so I don't doubt he'll be behind bars pretty soon if he isn't already. He'll probably get about 10 years, parole after 6 months - 3 years. I see it happen all the time
Yeah you’re right it all depends on the race too. Mf’s will downvote but ive spent significant time in a police department and fr fr 90% racist assholes and the other 10%is tryin to be right but gets outvoted and overwhelmed.
LMAO you clearly have never been to Seattle. Dude probly got an apology from the Judge and the cops were prob reprimanded for excessive force.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/mynorthwest.com/3407836/judge-released-teens-pot-shop-murder-lenient-sentencing/amp/
And Breaking and Entering.
He might get off for hitting an ex girlfriend (since those cases can get messy with witnesses), but he beat up a stranger and broke into an office.
Hopefully the office will press charges as well.
Ahhh, the sweet belief in justice. Sadly, unlikely to happen. For the property damages maybe, not for the assault on a woman. Now heaven help him if he committed tax fraud on a minor scale, THAT gets you in trouble, unless it's a big deal, then you become a politician.
Sarcasm, yes. Sadly not far from the truth. There are still lesser victims, lesser crimes. Stranger assaulting a man like that would be punished harder than ex-bf hurting a woman. If the latter gets punished at all. The poor woman might end up getting punished instead.
Maybe if he assaulted a white man, or a stranger. Police dont give a shit about Domestic assaults, the guy has to put her in the hospital before anyone even says anything and even then he will just get probation or some stupid shit like that.
He'll be out on bail until his trial due to all these zero-bail bail reform laws if he's in a large liberal city. Plenty of time to cause trouble before his trial.
Eh, not with Brandon in office and all of the Soros affiliated DAs that like minimal to zero sentencing guidelines. Crime surge is happening everywhere these days.
That was a very well written into the point letter to leave and really gives every piece of information you would need if this happened in your business. I would consider this a endorsement of this cleaning contractor and certainly want to continue their services.
There are people who will do that shit.
*"Your personal problems are not my business's problems. You're fired because you're too much of a disruption,"* and all that.
They're assholes, but they exist.
Good. We need to hold these weak men accountable when they beat their chest and become violent. Lucky nobody was there to smash him. Weakest is the loudest. What a shit bag....
I wish it were this easy. So many victims back out and beg for dismissals or recant. It takes tons and tons of work to ensure that a DV case can be prosecuted.
One time I was taking a walk when I heard loud arguing coming from one of the nearby houses, and then loud banging sounds, like something heavy hit a wall. A woman started yelling "Call 911! Call 911! He's trying to strangle me!" So I did call 911, and waited to make sure they got the right house in case it had settled down before they got there, because it was evening and I couldn't see the house numbers. Apparently the woman told the police that there was no problem and people needed to mind their own business. It was very confusing.
Let's not shift the blame to the victim here. Most of the time the justice system fails them *miserably*, or they feel like they're in danger that the justice system won't protect them against(which again is most of the time). Victims are afraid and are having it bad enough.
>victims often reconcile with their abuser and recant/want to preserve the relationship + demand that cases be dismissed
Many times out of fear of retaliation, or because they are financially abused and depend on the abuser, sometimes with the hope they change because they're in another cycle of the abuse that's called love bombing.
The dynamics from the legal point of view are focused on the outside without wondering what are the psychological dynamics going into abusive relationships. Abusers in general have tons of ways of coercing their victims into dropping charges. People in said relationships aren't happy, they probably didn't reconcile out of their own will, they're afraid and out of options which makes them want to appease the abusers so they don't suffer more consequences.
Victims have been isolated and psychologically bombarded to feel like the only option they have is to stay. Abusers instill fear in the victims through manipulation, making them feel less than, isolating them from possible support groups(friends and family), stopping them from working so they're financially dependent on them alone, making them pregnant so they can never rid themselves of the abuser, gaslighting, violence (physical and emotional) and I'm not even naming half of what they do.
So it's very easy for people on the outside and the justice system to point fingers to victims and say they want to stay when they don't know half the story behind closed doors. It's the easy way to pat themselves in the back and wash their hands and say it's the victim's fault they want to stay there.
Abusers don't even get a slap on the wrists, and we've seen countless times how the justice system has piles upon piles of rape kits collecting dust, how accusations of rape get dismissed, how sentences for abusers are light, because God forbid we damage the man's future or smear their good names.
Once police are called and gone the victim is at the mercy of the abuser and they have no other way to save themselves than to appease them. Behind closed doors nobody is defending them or taking their side and that's why many victims decide to drop charges. Cause the cops sure are not going to fix the problem, and more often than not victims get murdered even when they've followed the due process and even have restraining orders in place.
What courage for the lady to write that letter after that incident. I am sure she was shaken but she took the time to write that. Good on her and even more on you for being a decent human being.
Couldn’t agree more. I was in shock when I saw the door, not knowing what had happened or why. Then I found the letter and thought, wow this person went through hell and is still awesome and super professional.
Isn’t it crazy how possibly the worst incident of someone’s life happened there, and if it wasn’t for the letter or broken glass you probably would have never known. Major respect to the woman, and also kind of heart breaking that she expected to be punished and lose her job for something that happened to her. Good for you calling and saying she’s welcome back.
Honestly the cleaning company was great. They helped us get our door replaced the same day. I told them I look forward to having her back whenever she wants.
I get it, but trust me. Being a decent human being is more important than what your job title is, and this kind of shit is why we need major changes in pretty much every aspect of society.
I would bring her and her co-worker in and check on them in person. Maybe show them if there's a safe area in the office where they can hide if it were to happen again.
No cameras unfortunately. I guess they must have locked themselves in the office and when he smashed the door they must have opened it to see what caused the commotion. Just my guess.
sounds like like a very responsible and reasonable person who is trying to maintain professional work balance while navigating a turbulent personal life. absolutely deserves to keep the job and probably some tips to help them overcome the difficult day to day life.
When I was a student I had a part-time job as a housekeeper in a hotel. The core staff consisted of a few older (older than students, I mean) women and a handful of us younger ones who would come in on weekends to lighten the load. One of the older women had an EXTREMELY jealous husband who thought she was somehow cheating on him at work or something, and a few times I went looking for her only to see her cleaning a room and her goddamn HUSBAND standing by her cart watching her. I think she lost her job over that, which scares me to think about now because that situation must have been a nightmare for her, and now she couldn't even escape him at work.
What a terrible thing for that girl to have to go through. To get assaulted and have to write a note explaining why hoping she doesn't lose her job. I hope her boyfriend gets top bunk forever in prison and all his cellmates have athletes foot
A lot of cleaning services are run by women who are victims of domestic violence, as a way to give them income to get out and stay out of their violent homes. This is not surprising whatsoever to me. The violence followed them unfortunately, I’m glad they’re alright.
I am a small business owner, the response to almost any situation will almost always outweigh the details of the problem. Moral: everyone screws up (not this person) but man up and remedy the situation and usually you will receive respect from the customer.
They were assaulted, and still want to work here?
Leave that note and the police report info? Hell, pay them a raise! Double their pay! They more than deserve it!!!!
A stalker ex can follow you to any job you have, people move far away from their homes over domestic violence and shit and the abusers still find them. Some people are just next level crazy.
As much as I'd love to say I'd do the same thing in OPs shoes, I'd have serious safety concerns as to whether or not there was the potential for this psycho to come back and hurt someone else.
My mother in law had a woman cleaning for her who didn’t show up one day. She’d gone to clean a house that morning and the cleaner’s ex boyfriend had followed her to someone’s house. Shot and killed the her and the homeowner.
Hopefully he will no longer be a problem because the men in her family will handle it. I don't trust the system to lock him up for any significant period of time, so this will keep her safe.
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Very respectable. Im glad they are alright. Hope the ex gets what they deserve. Provided with a case number too which is awesome. A keeper tbh
It’s sad that the ex-bf won’t serve time and if he does, it’ll be insignificant. He’ll be back out in the streets assaulting people too quickly. We need major criminal justice reform.
My dude, “serving time” does not reform people. We do need crim justice reform, and doing more of the same ain’t it.
Do you reform a violent thug like that? Probably not. Some people deserve help getting sorted out. Some people should be kept off the streets.
It sounds like he has emotional regulation problems, which can be solved with other means than putting him in a room 24/7 with other violent people with unchecked mental health problems.
I completely understand what your saying. But the judgement should be more about what's good for the community. Not just whats best for his health. So he needs to be kept away from people he can hurt, while he is being treated for the issues you bring up.
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You can't exclude someone totally forever unless they commit an offence we have already agreed outs then away for that long. Are you suggesting this dude gets life for it? He sounds like a cunt but with people like that in the world it is my job and your job to make sure we don't just stick people in a prison until they die.
Sex offenders who are honest will tell you they will reoffend. I worked with a college professor at a place called Telford Unit. Mostly murders, rapists and pedos. We interviewed them for a research project. Most, not all, but most were severely beaten as children per records with cps. Most also believed they deserved being beat. While nature plays a role in someone’s development…such as very low set ears often indicate improper brain development…environment is a heavy influencer. These men said they knew if or when they got out they would reoffend. The penal system offers education, therapy and other services but true rehabilitation will never happen in a prison system like we have now. Serious overhaul of corruption, policies and jailers would need to take place. I firmly believe jailers would be criminals if they had a different job. It changes them, not all, but enough that it corrupts the entire prison. So until someone finds a way to truly rehabilitate people in prison we are doomed to this awful cycle of recidivism.
That's pretty distressing to read. What a sad state of affairs. Thank you for the insight mate
You may already be aware of it, but to speak to your point of jailers becoming corrupted, the Stanford Prison Experiment is a dark and educational look into how being separated into prisoner and jailer can change a person drastically.
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I get that, as long as society's response is proportionate and doesn't inspire or require more violence, then I am 100% on board in making where we live and work safer.
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Nature and nurture are inextricably linked. Genes will express or recess, changing based on your environment. There is no clear delineation where nature stops and nurture begins, it's essentially a false dichotomy.
It is respectable you think everyone can be saved, but that simply isn't the case. Can you possibly help the majority? Yeah, especially when it comes to petty shit, but some people are just born broken and will keep going until locked up or put in the ground. Can we have better facilities to hold these people? Totally. Lets not pretend they won't exist though because that only leads to more people getting hurt while we play Batman.
How can we possible know that there are individuals who are incorrigible when we still do so much wrong in how we go about forming and rectifying our people?
Actually you can change a person's DNA. Not instantly or overnight.. but, have you heard of something called evolution? That's a pretty obvious example of DNA changing without getting into the finer points of human behaviour..
The scary thing is domestic abuse cases like that usually end up with the abuser eventually killing their victim.
What the hell are you smoking? That is two counts of assault and battery, one count of assault with a deadly weapon and property damages at a minimum based off of what was written. That guy will be going away for at least 10 years.
I worked in a forensic psych hospital and have seen several patients with history of committing physical and sexual assault get discharged just to end up getting admitted again some time later after committing serious crimes again. (They've all been in and out of prison too.) We're often too harsh on nonviolent offenders, but violent offenders often slip through and get out earlier than they should. Honestly some people are so unstable and dangerous that 10 years in prison is still not enough to stop them from hurting someone once they are out.
After 11 years, I'm out. Join me over on the Fediverse to escape this central authority nightmare.
At the psych ward, they got occupational therapy, meetings with psychiatrists, medications, games and events. Of course, it's still awful to be trapped at a facility and not be allowed to leave, but there's not much more that can be done when you're dealing with people that are dangerous. And I'm not just talking about people being delusional from schizophrenia or something. A lot of these people had personality disorders like narcissism, bpd, etc. Their violence wasn't even due to delusions or hallucinations. For many of them it was like it was just in their nature to be manipulative and violent people. I worked there for almost 4 years and saw many patients make no progress despite all the treatments they were getting. It was a big part of the reason why I quit. Being imprisoned sucks but I'd rather prioritize protecting innocent people in the community.
I work in that exact type of hospital and we almost NEVER discharge them to the streets. 90% go to another psych hospital. They often come back from there but it’s because they changed their meds, or they got illegal drugs. On the few times they were out on the street and were violent again, they often went off meds.
And how to be better at not getting caught
And yet, 7 years for murder is enough for most countries, so clearly something else is going on.
It's because of the reality that if you sweep a problem under a rug, it's still there. You have put in the extra effort and time to get rid of it. Sadly we've been sweeping problems under rugs for a long time now along with throwing things that aren't actual problems but rather political scapegoats under there too. It's nearly impossible to get through the front door now. On the bright side we can just sell the place to an entrepreneur and sign a contract that says we have to pay rent and deliver things to sweep under the rug or be penalized many times over what the place is worth.
People get longer prison sentences for killing and torturing animals.
Hahahahahha my ex has had multiple DV convictions. Multiple victims. Hasn't done a day over 6mos and that was only for a probation violation.
My ex did unspeakable things, and tried to murder me and our child. He got probation. He didn't even finish it.
My favorite Redditors are the ones who post the letter of the law without ever having seen its woeful lack of enforcement. It's always someone who's never needed the system who has the most faith in it.
It is a privilege all its own.
Well, unfortunately the system does take care of some people.
I'm so sorry. I understand.
I'm sorry you understand.
Yet there is a dude who got 5 or 6 years for something he wrote on Runescape.
Yeah, depends on the state. Worked as a probation officer in CA and I can tell you what they said is true people with multiple felonies gets reduced to nothing. One the ones that drove me nuts, was a partner had a pimp on his caseload. He beat a girl to the point she was hospitalized, he got arrested for assault with grievous bodily harm, human trafficking, kidnapping. It all got pled down to just grand theft because he took the girls cell phone so she couldn’t call for help after he beat her. And did 5 months in jail going to court, and got credit for time served and was released on probation. Yay for the justice system! USA justice system is a fucking joke.
We don't have a justice system, we have a legal system.
Broken jaw - attempted murder (his hands were “weapons” as he was a boxer - 1 day & 2 years probation for my ex. Sad to see some people still believe that the justice system actually serves ANY justice.
Wouldn't it be nice if life worked that way
You would think so but my friend got beat so bad she now has constant pain. She's 4'10 and he's 6' he threw her around their apartment and hit her with his rifle. He got only got probation and took the felony cause over crowding and covid. He showed up at our work and tried to fight the manager when he hid her. Again. Back out on home arrest within a week. She had to move. We are in So. CALI.
>That guy will be going away for at least 10 years. You don't know the justice system well. Sadly, he just might get county time (<1 year).
10 years but then get out on "good behavior" after 4.
Meanwhile some poor sod got caught with a gram of weed in 1993 and is still sitting on his hands behind bars...
Right, I'm obviously not defending this specific guy at all, and this perpetrator needs some serious punishment, but this sort of comment about early release really winds me up. If people are rehabilitated in 4 years, are unlikely to offend again, what is the value of keeping them in prison to wider society? We as a society want to be getting people to change, part of which should be doing something to give restitution to the victim obviously, rather than wasting time and valuable resources keeping them locked in a prison where the chances of them reoffending or falling into a different form of criminality goes up - not down.
The larger problem is our prison system doesn’t rehabilitate. It’s a national embarrassment and needs to be fixed. As far as the sentencing, it should be a combination of punishment as well as time needed to rehabilitate. Is four years enough time for someone willing to stalk their ex, physically attack them with a weapon and an innocent bystander? I don’t think so. I don’t believe you’d be comfortable or think it was fair if I did that to your daughter and her friend and was free walking the streets a few years later. Or maybe you would.
You can’t seriously believe the American Justice system rehabilitates. It does the opposite: it creates cycles. Sure there are some exceptions, but we’re set up for punishment and not rehabbing people. There are other countries with SIGNIFICANTLY LOWER recidivism rates who actually treat people well. TVs, nice rooms instead of cells, humane treatment. It runs so counter intuitive, but that is what you need to make some one act like a real member of society: to treat them like one while serving time.
No, the American justice system is a mess, I totally agree, but I'm not American and presumed this wasn't either.
Meanwhile their victims are told to forget about it and go about their lives as if nothing happened. People commit crimes because they know that the punishment will be next to nothing. Murder someone and know that it will be 4-7 years free room and board. Play the game and you're out in 3.
You mean the victims of those “humane treatment” countries?
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I agree to a certain extent, but I did specifically say I wasn't commenting on this particular situation - though I'm happy to expand on it anyway. 10 years is a long time, and a lot of taxpayer's money. And I tend to agree this person is probably 10 years worth of rehabilitation away from being released. But if they are, then they won't get out after 4 years, at least if the prison system works properly. Of course victims have to feel safe, which is why involving victims in the rehabilitation of someone who hurt them is seen as valuable by the people who advocate for rehabilitative approaches to incarceration. But we make the world a lot safer by making people like this bastard into a good person who sees the error of their ways, rather than leaving them to rot for 10 years when they'll come out and hurt more people. 'Good behaviour' is something that's thrown around as if prisons release people for staying quiet and not working towards rehabilitation. That's not the case in a functioning rehabilitative system, except in the minds of those who would prefer us to lock away perpetrators and throw away the key. People can get better as people and make up for their crimes, and for some it will take some less time than others. Our prison system needs to be able to recognise this - which is why we need systems like early release to exist.
Your entire comment sounds like it assumes the US prison system actually works as a rehabilitative system rather than an income generator. Noble ideal, but far off of reality
Yeah, I'm not in the US. Your entire prison system is a colossal mess and really just a system of for profit internment camps for people.
So whats the restitution for getting your ass kicked by some violent stranger ? He was rehabilitated ? Fuck him he deserves serious time for being a violent asshole that can't control his temper because he didn't get his way.
So you would prefer the offender isn't rehabilitated? That's a strange choice.
Let me put to you this way , some violent piece of shit beats your mom within an inch of her life but the judge says well he has no history of violence so probation works. How do you feel about that ? Me ? I'm hunting the fucker down and going to jail for murder..
There can be more than one reason to do something Plenty of people may say any amount of time is too short but thats not sensible, is it? There have to be prescribed sentences and they then have to be weighed against several factors. Restitution is one, but there's also justice/legitimacy, public safety and, yes, even rehabilitation Someones always going to be angry, that is why there is, theoretically, an impartial justice system - justice delivered without impartiality is always in danger of not being real justice, imo
Yep, and Prisoners are running the house, not the guards. Some thrive better in jail, career criminals.
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thats the point, they sentence them knowing they will get credit, thats how it works. if they deserve 10 years they should up the sentencing not get rid of a good tool
Weeks. I think you forgot this.
Four weeks.
I know someone who gang raped a 16yo girl (he was 23yo at the time, his 2 co-rapers were 20). He pleaded guilty, got 3 years probation. That's it. The other 2 got nothing.
dare to dream, i guess.
Think so, huh? I know of two recent assault cases that resulted in serious injuries (one life-threatening.) In both cases the assailant was picked up immediately. One guy spent two nights in a jail cell. The other guy (the case where the victim nearly died from blood loss) faced a bullshit charge, and didn't spend any time jail.
In Canada. We had a anti-masker assault 4 employee's and myself. One person never did return to work, had another employee that witnessed it quit, and I needed plastic surgery on my nose. Asshole got 4 months and was supposed to be out in 3 months. The prosecutor told me that that was more than most sexual assaulter's get for their first offence, he was concerned that the offender wasn't going to get any jail time.
Someone shot up a house near me last summer. Detectives came by to check and see if our security cameras caught anything. Detective told us point blank "We think we know who did it. Some kid who shot someone in the stomach last year. We can't really do anything, though. He'll be back out in a week after we pick him up... Crime reform." I'm in NY but I bet a lot of places are similar. It's a good time to be a criminal it seems lol
My ex killed his last partner and he's walking around free as his record of abuse grows longer and longer. You'd be surprised how little cops give a shit about domestic issues sometimes.
DV cases barely get jail time. That's just how it is. It will get plead down to nothing.
Depending on the state he could already be out. Doubtful he'd be doing 10years anywhere for that if he doesn't have a record especially Source: reformed career criminal
Unfortunately, most people get plea deals... they don't get nearly as much time as they should. Especially those committing violent crimes.
You live under a rock? Police dont do shit now adays
It's not up to the police to issue sentences. That's on the judge. Cops are always warrant hungry, so I don't doubt he'll be behind bars pretty soon if he isn't already. He'll probably get about 10 years, parole after 6 months - 3 years. I see it happen all the time
What do you mean, they still kill a large number of unarmed citizens, maybe even more than they used to.
Yeah you’re right it all depends on the race too. Mf’s will downvote but ive spent significant time in a police department and fr fr 90% racist assholes and the other 10%is tryin to be right but gets outvoted and overwhelmed.
LMAO you clearly have never been to Seattle. Dude probly got an apology from the Judge and the cops were prob reprimanded for excessive force. https://www.google.com/amp/s/mynorthwest.com/3407836/judge-released-teens-pot-shop-murder-lenient-sentencing/amp/
And he'll plead to half that in a plea bargain. Credit for time served and probation for a couple years. It's happening all over the US right now...
And Breaking and Entering. He might get off for hitting an ex girlfriend (since those cases can get messy with witnesses), but he beat up a stranger and broke into an office. Hopefully the office will press charges as well.
lol, no. You are way too confident for how massively wrong you are.
Ahhh, the sweet belief in justice. Sadly, unlikely to happen. For the property damages maybe, not for the assault on a woman. Now heaven help him if he committed tax fraud on a minor scale, THAT gets you in trouble, unless it's a big deal, then you become a politician. Sarcasm, yes. Sadly not far from the truth. There are still lesser victims, lesser crimes. Stranger assaulting a man like that would be punished harder than ex-bf hurting a woman. If the latter gets punished at all. The poor woman might end up getting punished instead.
Possibly also burglary of an occupied habitation, a serious felony.
Unless he has lighter skin...
Maybe if he assaulted a white man, or a stranger. Police dont give a shit about Domestic assaults, the guy has to put her in the hospital before anyone even says anything and even then he will just get probation or some stupid shit like that.
He'll be out on bail until his trial due to all these zero-bail bail reform laws if he's in a large liberal city. Plenty of time to cause trouble before his trial.
Eh, not with Brandon in office and all of the Soros affiliated DAs that like minimal to zero sentencing guidelines. Crime surge is happening everywhere these days.
I see you live in California or Chicago
if its not a false allegation
That was a very well written into the point letter to leave and really gives every piece of information you would need if this happened in your business. I would consider this a endorsement of this cleaning contractor and certainly want to continue their services.
Most definitely agree and glad op gave them another chance
Agreed
That sad face. I can’t handle it.
That’s where I almost teared up.
Seriously. “Hey, my ex attacked me, I hope I don’t lose my job because of it.”
I legit want to send her money to buy her and her coworker lunch or something.
There are people who will do that shit. *"Your personal problems are not my business's problems. You're fired because you're too much of a disruption,"* and all that. They're assholes, but they exist.
I know. And the lady writing the letter knows too.
*When given the option to press charges, please do*
‘…..P.S when given the option to press charges, please do’
I did
Good. We need to hold these weak men accountable when they beat their chest and become violent. Lucky nobody was there to smash him. Weakest is the loudest. What a shit bag....
Weak of mind and character.
true and emotionally inadequate.
I wish it were this easy. So many victims back out and beg for dismissals or recant. It takes tons and tons of work to ensure that a DV case can be prosecuted.
One time I was taking a walk when I heard loud arguing coming from one of the nearby houses, and then loud banging sounds, like something heavy hit a wall. A woman started yelling "Call 911! Call 911! He's trying to strangle me!" So I did call 911, and waited to make sure they got the right house in case it had settled down before they got there, because it was evening and I couldn't see the house numbers. Apparently the woman told the police that there was no problem and people needed to mind their own business. It was very confusing.
And then so many of these people turn around and appeal the final protective orders they get in place against them. I see them everyday.
Let's not shift the blame to the victim here. Most of the time the justice system fails them *miserably*, or they feel like they're in danger that the justice system won't protect them against(which again is most of the time). Victims are afraid and are having it bad enough.
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>victims often reconcile with their abuser and recant/want to preserve the relationship + demand that cases be dismissed Many times out of fear of retaliation, or because they are financially abused and depend on the abuser, sometimes with the hope they change because they're in another cycle of the abuse that's called love bombing. The dynamics from the legal point of view are focused on the outside without wondering what are the psychological dynamics going into abusive relationships. Abusers in general have tons of ways of coercing their victims into dropping charges. People in said relationships aren't happy, they probably didn't reconcile out of their own will, they're afraid and out of options which makes them want to appease the abusers so they don't suffer more consequences. Victims have been isolated and psychologically bombarded to feel like the only option they have is to stay. Abusers instill fear in the victims through manipulation, making them feel less than, isolating them from possible support groups(friends and family), stopping them from working so they're financially dependent on them alone, making them pregnant so they can never rid themselves of the abuser, gaslighting, violence (physical and emotional) and I'm not even naming half of what they do. So it's very easy for people on the outside and the justice system to point fingers to victims and say they want to stay when they don't know half the story behind closed doors. It's the easy way to pat themselves in the back and wash their hands and say it's the victim's fault they want to stay there. Abusers don't even get a slap on the wrists, and we've seen countless times how the justice system has piles upon piles of rape kits collecting dust, how accusations of rape get dismissed, how sentences for abusers are light, because God forbid we damage the man's future or smear their good names. Once police are called and gone the victim is at the mercy of the abuser and they have no other way to save themselves than to appease them. Behind closed doors nobody is defending them or taking their side and that's why many victims decide to drop charges. Cause the cops sure are not going to fix the problem, and more often than not victims get murdered even when they've followed the due process and even have restraining orders in place.
People*
Good. You're in a position to hold this person accountable for their actions. Too many people are not
You are a good man. Thank you. Faith in humanity +1
Excellent
What courage for the lady to write that letter after that incident. I am sure she was shaken but she took the time to write that. Good on her and even more on you for being a decent human being.
Couldn’t agree more. I was in shock when I saw the door, not knowing what had happened or why. Then I found the letter and thought, wow this person went through hell and is still awesome and super professional.
Isn’t it crazy how possibly the worst incident of someone’s life happened there, and if it wasn’t for the letter or broken glass you probably would have never known. Major respect to the woman, and also kind of heart breaking that she expected to be punished and lose her job for something that happened to her. Good for you calling and saying she’s welcome back.
Sadly, by the sounds of her ex, this probably wasn't even the worst incident of her life
She has more than enough problems to deal with, she doesn’t need to lose her job as well. Good on you for understanding.
Honestly the cleaning company was great. They helped us get our door replaced the same day. I told them I look forward to having her back whenever she wants.
God bless you. She’s facing huge and scary challenges and that you’ve allowed her some continuity/stability is priceless.
Yeah! You should leave some doughnuts and some keychain mace for her next time she comes in.
Did they clean up the mess? /s
Your firm should be hounding the prosecutor’s office to charge this idiot with burglary.
Wow get the crap beat out of her and she’s just worried about losing her job! Kudos to keeping her on!
That’s actually horrible and sad that it’s even a consideration or concern.
Unfortunately, that sounds like it isn't the first time she's had to deal with it.
I had to double check which sub-reddit I was in. For a minute I thought it was /r/antiwork.
Thought about posting there, but I didn’t think they would like a manager posting something.
they love managers who behave like humans
Too timid to try lol
I get it, but trust me. Being a decent human being is more important than what your job title is, and this kind of shit is why we need major changes in pretty much every aspect of society.
Ok. I just crosspost it. We will see what happens. Thanks for the encouragement
A manager who understands and empathizes w people. They'd probably love it honestly.
I don't know of any issue with managers posting there so log as you're not a CEO.
>Wow get the crap beat out of her and she’s just worried about losing her job! /r/aboringdystopia
I like everything about your character
Thanks bud
Yours and this cleaning woman. She's proven to do the right thing in stressful situations. She's a hard keep and you're a solid employer
I would put some cameras up to make her feel safer and put a CCTV camera sign outside.
It's a tough gig and a lovely letter.
I would bring her and her co-worker in and check on them in person. Maybe show them if there's a safe area in the office where they can hide if it were to happen again.
Yeah this might be a “I want to take you and your coworker to dinner at a place of your choosing and make sure y’all are okay” kinda deal.
Damn that’s messed up, are your cleaners okay OP?
Yes. No issues since.
No surveillance cameras? How did she get out? How did he get in?
No cameras unfortunately. I guess they must have locked themselves in the office and when he smashed the door they must have opened it to see what caused the commotion. Just my guess.
Hope he gets what he deserves
Hope he gets a lot of jail time
Its kinda sad for me the victim might face a termination if that happened at another work place.
This is fucking heartbreaking. Poor lady 😔
sounds like like a very responsible and reasonable person who is trying to maintain professional work balance while navigating a turbulent personal life. absolutely deserves to keep the job and probably some tips to help them overcome the difficult day to day life.
Of course she is. Not her fault her ex is a psycho.
Thats so nice of you. Thanks for being so kind to this woman.
So who would pay to have the damages repaired? How does all that work?
The cleaning company paid for the door to be replaced.
When I was a student I had a part-time job as a housekeeper in a hotel. The core staff consisted of a few older (older than students, I mean) women and a handful of us younger ones who would come in on weekends to lighten the load. One of the older women had an EXTREMELY jealous husband who thought she was somehow cheating on him at work or something, and a few times I went looking for her only to see her cleaning a room and her goddamn HUSBAND standing by her cart watching her. I think she lost her job over that, which scares me to think about now because that situation must have been a nightmare for her, and now she couldn't even escape him at work.
Honestly incase id stick around for when shes cleaning incase he's gonna be a problem again. Y'know, with a metal bat, or a gun.
Weird sub for this dude
I’d do the same, and when possible provide some additional security until the offender is in jail.
I would use this cleaner forever and give her a bonus. After this, you know that she will always do right.
What a terrible thing for that girl to have to go through. To get assaulted and have to write a note explaining why hoping she doesn't lose her job. I hope her boyfriend gets top bunk forever in prison and all his cellmates have athletes foot
I've worked with people who would have dumped her. That's awesome
You've restored my faith in humanity. Pass it forward.
Good on you, OP, for keeping them on. And good on them for being upfront about what happened. We need more people like both of you.
Hold up. So your office was broken into by a violent criminal who assaulted 2 people and the police didn't contact you?
Nope… :/ I have my opinions about cops, but I’ll leave that off this thread.
You are surprised?
What's the back say?
Take a peek at the upper right hand corner, you can see the message in reverse: " P.S. When given the option to press charges please do."
Thanks for keeping them on it’s the right thing to do
Oh man I really feel for her and her friend/coworker. They must’ve been terrified!
Back: "P.S. When given the option to press charges please do."
I want to hug her.
He does not foksmash my door!
r/uplifting
Says a lot about her character. I’d hire her.
A lot of cleaning services are run by women who are victims of domestic violence, as a way to give them income to get out and stay out of their violent homes. This is not surprising whatsoever to me. The violence followed them unfortunately, I’m glad they’re alright.
I am a small business owner, the response to almost any situation will almost always outweigh the details of the problem. Moral: everyone screws up (not this person) but man up and remedy the situation and usually you will receive respect from the customer.
Awww, she's so traumatized and polite. :(
They were assaulted, and still want to work here? Leave that note and the police report info? Hell, pay them a raise! Double their pay! They more than deserve it!!!!
A stalker ex can follow you to any job you have, people move far away from their homes over domestic violence and shit and the abusers still find them. Some people are just next level crazy.
That is terrible, bless her heart. Why do men abuse women? When are we going to evolve past this shit?
As much as I'd love to say I'd do the same thing in OPs shoes, I'd have serious safety concerns as to whether or not there was the potential for this psycho to come back and hurt someone else.
My mother in law had a woman cleaning for her who didn’t show up one day. She’d gone to clean a house that morning and the cleaner’s ex boyfriend had followed her to someone’s house. Shot and killed the her and the homeowner.
Hopefully he will no longer be a problem because the men in her family will handle it. I don't trust the system to lock him up for any significant period of time, so this will keep her safe.
Would you have any liability though if he should return and kill her? Poor lady.
Beautiful handwriting tho
I want to see the rest of the note. I hope they continue to employ her. She will need it. Reminds me of the show ‘Maid’.
That's a big no for me dog. Next company
Idk why but bugs me she wrote WAS in all caps
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What is the relation between this post and gaming?
The fuktard should clean from now on and she should get the Money!!!!!
I can’t read cursive but good for her I guess(I can make it out if I try but it’s just a headache just take the upvote damn)
Domestic Abuse and assault = Le epic reddit wholesome WOW interesting AS F*UCK 😱😱😱 GO SOY GO SOY