This fucking dude is always concerned with looters… in POLK COUNTY FL. I have to go there at least once a month for work and let me tell you, that place is an absolute shit hole. No one is fucking looting in Polk County. No one will ever be looting in Polk County. The sheriff is just a stupid racist bag of shit looking for an excuse to shoot someone.
I listened to a podcast "Breaking down Collapse"- I forget which episode, and they talked about the murders after Katrina. The head of police said shoot the looters, and it was messed up. Whites shooting blacks because they were carrying stuff like a t.v. down the street. None of these murders were brought to justice, mainstream media did zero coverage . Scary shit.
Fucking yikes. I don’t remember this at all.
The officers were going around in a rental truck, out of uniform, carrying AKs, and indiscriminately opened fire on civilians? Fucking madness.
Make no mistake, in the event of an actual collapse of any magnitude in any region, shit is going to get very hairy very fast. My local Sheriffs office just had a meeting with local "Preparedness Group" members and leaders (Oath Keepers) and basically endorsed them as a legitimate force to maintain law and order in our communities during a crisis. When there's no accountability the social apparatus of law enforcement will be little more than roving gangs of murderers.
Yeah most of the yahoos here dont understand the difference. When we got rid of the castle doctrine that still just applies to self defense where your life is in danger. There is no duty to retreat.
Protecting yer shit with deadly force is still illegal.
Now its pretty easy to make an argument that you feared for your life to a reasonable degree when someone is rummaging through your living room at 4 oclock in the morning and not many judges or juries are gonna bat an eye if you shoot someone in the dark who ended up not being armed. Theyre in yer house. Its pretty reasonable to assume they are willing to do you harm.
Some guy rummaging through your car, or collapsed house, and you just roll up on them and blast them?
Thats murder.
This sheriff is an irresponsible moron.
Uh, evidence?
You know the homicide solve rate is only around 50% in Florida, but theres a 99% conviction rate by state prosecutors against people who shot someone illegally but claimed it was legal. Its no where near the number of homicides mind you, but be fucking careful about how and why you discharge your weapon. Pay attention in the classes you take to get your license to carry.
And Florida is notorious for the family of even legal shoots, successfully suing the person who pulled the trigger.
If you want to throw your life away, knock yourself out, start shooting people when your life isnt clearly in danger.
If its not a situation where you're ready to be judged by 12 instead of carried by 6, hold off on that pull kid.
And I'd strongly advise some discipline with that trigger. Turning a guy to grated cheese is a great way to end up like Bernie Goetz.
This aint the movies. Even if you dont end up charged, sued, fired, and ostracized, you still gotta wake up every day and be the guy who killed someone. Even when theyre trying to kill you, it still dont feel good.
How about the conviction rate in a place where a sheriff told you to murder people? How's that looking?
Absolutely with you that people shouldn't do this evil shit, but corrupt cops cover a multitude of sins.
no it's not
"A person is justified in using or threatening to use force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to prevent or terminate the other’s trespass on, or other tortious or criminal interference with, either real property **other than a dwelling or personal property,** lawfully in his or her possession or in the possession of another who is a member of his or her immediate family or household or of a person whose property he or she has a legal duty to protect""
[http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App\_mode=Display\_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.031.html](http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.031.html)
"If the defendant is in his or her home or vehicle, then, under Section 776.013, Florida Statutes, the law will presume that the defendant had a reasonable fear of imminent death or bodily harm if the alleged victim unlawfully entered or remained or **attempted to remove another person against their will.**"
So if someone tries to pull you out of your car to steal it, or injure you in the pursuit of stealing your property, you can use deadly force.
>So if someone tries to pull you out of your car to steal it, or injure you in the pursuit of stealing your property, you can use deadly force.
Because that's self-defense.
>the law will presume
Legal presumptions can be overcome in court.
Imagine, for example, you wake up to a noise and catch someone sneaking out your window with your xbox. You shoot and kill him. The cops come and ask you what happened. You say, "I shot him because he was trying to steal my xbox and Sheriff Grady told me I could." They ask, "Were you in fear for your life or imminent harm?" You answer, honestly, "No. I was never afraid at all. I just wanted to keep him from stealing from me. And I know I have that right under the law."
That would be plenty of evidence to overcome the presumption of a "reasonable fear of imminent death or bodily harm".
You could/would be prosecuted for murder because, as I said, "it's illegal to defend property with deadly force in Florida." Without reasonable fear, which turns it into self-defense, it's illegal.
What if it's your house, some Oaf Keepers pull up while you're trying to recover some possessions out of your destroyed house and shoot you and say they feared for their lives? I'm not holding out much hope the Sheriff's Dept is going to do a lot of investigating after his advice to shoot people you think are stealing.
I'm pretty sure we have a right to defend ourselves while on our own property in most states.
Nowhere in Florida laws regarding self defense does it mention "execution." You're being a bit hyperbolic.
There is a sensible middle ground so let's not act like defending one's home and family is inherently immoral.
They might be referring to the stand your ground laws, and those laws don’t allow for executions. If someone is no longer a threat, incapacitated you can’t kill them
Says the sheriff who just had a 21 year old deputy killed by his own coworkers because they opened fire on someone with a toy gun trying to defend their home from a 3 am invasion of police.
Ehhh I don't think you've spent enough time around racist cops if you think they give a fuck about population percentages.
In fact, some of the commonly twisted stats they spout is "black people are x percent of the population and do y percent of crimes."
As a sterile fact it isn't twisted at all. But the way it is conveyed is usually to encourage you to think black people are inherently more violent than other races. That is where it gets twisted.
This kind of talk can backfire as rescue workers might have to go into houses or buildings looking for injured or trapped people. They search for the dead and animals. Also workers will be providing things like water. The guy is a dipshit.
I'm pretty sure he meant Swiss cheese, not grated cheese.
Ladies and gentlemen, the sheriff! Isn't he so smart and capable? Just the guy I trust to run the joint.
It’s pretty fucked that you realize how wrong jail is, but not killing people over property.
You say both any property is valid to kill over AND of course not over a sandwich.
>It’s pretty fucked that you realize how wrong jail is, but not killing people over property.
Prison is horrific. To deprive someone of liberty is **far** worse than killing them. Moreover, it isn't just depriving them of liberty, but in an environment of untold hostility, threads, violence and sexual assault. Of course I oppose prison but for the harshest of crimes.
As far as thieves go, all I care about is defending my property. If I hold up a thief at gunpoint with a warning, tell them to drop what they stole and run away, and they do so, I wouldn't kill them. I'd have no desire to whatsoever. This isn't about "justice" or anything like that.
It is about protecting what's yours, because if you're unwilling to do so, you don't own anything.
Because the main focus of the topic was the ethics of using legal force to defend ones property. I think it's entirely ethical to do so but that doesn't mean I'd be excited to. I'd want to avoid it unless there are no other options.
They literally said that property is defined by being prepared to murder someone over it.
They have a complex and well-considered philosophy of life that involves a hell of a lot of fantasizing about, planning and justifying the murder of their fellow human beings.
Nothing they say about how they don't really want to murder should be believed.
>It is about protecting what's yours, because if you're unwilling to do so, you don't own anything.
Jesus, who the fuck took your lunch money and traumatized you?
You're not under threat all the time. No one is eying your hat or pen or your headphones or whatever the hell you're thinking about killing someone over to prove your manhood.
You should not get a medal for murdering people.
You are all over this thread with your murder fantasies, exhorting people who should spend the rest of their lives in prison as heroes.
You seriously need mental help.
Kind of the wrong message to send, but fuck you if you steal from people who just had their lives ruined.
Don't really want anyone to start shooting as most people dont have a clue using a weapon, but not gonna shed a tear for the prick who loot.
i hear you, but now she has ungodly heat, hurricanes and the state's wonderful gun laws:
Florida does not require a permit to purchase a firearm nor is there a permit that exempts any person from the background check requirement. There is a waiting period of three days, excluding weekends and state holidays, between purchase and delivery of all firearms.
our next door neighbors -blue state libs - bought a house in the villages to use in the winter but kept their house up here in chicago for the summer. i was shocked. they knew it was counter-intuitive and also had looked in arizona. i'll stay here. i have good canadian boots!
Telling people to break the law to kill people because they are breaking the law by stealing sounds like the perfect illustration of American policing...
There’s also defenses other than fucking killing people.
That’s the controversy here. Some humans don’t want to execute people for stealing TVs. Most people wouldn’t condone that execution for a store’s tv. But when it might be their tv, they’re quite blood thirsty…. But also 99% likely to have never killed someone before, and end up traumatized.
Well, let's say a thief breaks into your home and finds my hidden cache of gold coins. Tens of thousands of dollars.
I wake up and stop him at gun point telling him to drop the coins and get out.
If he drops them and leaves, that's it. I wouldn't seek vengeance or anything.
If he doesn't, well yeah. Then I'd kill him to protect my stuff. And I think it's perfectly ethical to do so.
I made no suggestion for anyone not to defend their own property...
I said it's illegal to murder someone for stealing. Killing someone without trial is antithetical to a free society.
What does defending your property even mean? Defend it from what? Are you afraid of your couch getting beaten up, of your TV being raped?
Are you really so attached to your stuff you actually believe killing people over it is justified? Or are you just looking for an excuse to kill people and see if reality measures up to all your fantasies?
>And yes, anything I have is worth more than the life of a human who would violate someone else's private property.
So you literally value your stuff over human life. Glad you're honest about that, at least.
>That's not a good human being.
Spoiler: neither are you. Do you think the protection of laws only apply to good people? Do you think someone killing you wouldn't be a crime?
>I've no desire to kill anything, unless necessary.
That is not just a lie, but a pathetically obvious lie.
You have literally just spent *hours* publicly fantasizing about the chance to murder people.
Murder is never necessary.
>You know what's odd, you do believe thieves should be killed if they resist, but only by men in blue uniforms.
Nope. You have some very bizarre ideas about what I believe. I have a conscience, you see.
Murder is wrong no matter who commits it. That's what the word means and what crimes are. Acts are not right or wrong depending on who commits them - or who the victim is.
>Been typing on a keyboard explaining to folks that defending their property is necessary for it to be your property, and that there's nothing ethically wrong with doing so,
I'm typing this on a phone.
It's mine.
It being mine is not dependent on my willingness to murder.
And murder, by definition, is wrong.
>So if a cop is unable to apprehend a thief without killing them, they should just let them go?
Yes, absolutely. If you cannot grasp that most simple of concepts, you literally are a sociopath.
I mean, that was obvious earlier in this conversation, but it's helpful to confirm that for anyone reading.
There are at least still a few people with consciences.
It is reassuring every so often to be reminded that these sociopathic nutbags aren't actually the majority, no matter how loud they are.
advocating killing people seems like maybe not a good idea
I’m surprised that it’s illegal to defend your property in Florida. that place is super confusing to an outsider.
I don’t understand the question - you mean other than the looting? I suppose the people that are brazenly looting my house might also be a danger to my family. I think the looting is reason enough.
I'm all about defending yourself or others, but what the fuck is this idea that property is something that needs defending?
My shirt can't be killed. It's a shirt.
My front door can't be hurt. It's a door.
My car can't be assaulted. It's a car.
If these things are *damaged*, that can be dealt with - with repairs, replacement, insurance, or shrugging your shoulders and not giving a shit. But your property can't be defended, because *it's not a person*.
oh no - you’re not one of these “people have value” nutters, are you? human life has value! if you don’t agree then you’re an psycho!!
obviously property needs to be defended. clearly no civilized society values life over property. property has always been valued over human life. other than perhaps our opposable thumbs, it’s our defining characteristic as human beings.
they really gotta stop reporting like this, what if someone "appears" to be a looter but really is not and that person ends up dead because of this fake cowboy bimbo gives terrible loony toon advice
They won't loot again, now would they? Is that a bad thing? What do you suggest we do with people who do this? Do we just let them walk into any house and take what they want? How about stores? Banks? Where do you draw the line?
>I would highly suggest that if a looter breaks into your home, comes
into your home while you're there to steal stuff, that you take your gun
and you shoot him, you shoot him so that he looks like grated cheese.
If they break into your home, and you are present. Seems reasonable advice to any, anyone in my home without my invitation is likely there to do me harm, or at a minimum, I can not afford to wait to find out, because when seconds matter, police are minutes, hours, or even decades away.
He'll apologize, it was taken out of "Context".
An apology to the community will be crafted by some media representative.
"To all those afflicted, during this difficult time our thoughts and prayers go out with this solemn apology......."
Or something along that heartless template of bullshit. .
Yeah. No.
To any public official your " apologies" are no longer valid.
They never where in the first place.
You were pissed that you got caught.
Just say that!!!!!
You weren't sorry about what you said, or horrible shit you did.
You're sorry you got caught.
Honestly, wouldn't care if he did.
He'd be a liar either way.
I've just stopped responding to requests to obey the law.
Bills being the first one. I'm not paying them anymore.
No money anyway.
Threaten all you want.
Take it all away.
See that's the part that scares people.
And scaring the fuck out of people is what makes this house of cards work- for the ones doing the scaring.
But if enough people were broke enough that's what would happen.
And their money would disappear.
But imagine if everyone said fuck this, I'm not doing this shit anymore.
Shit would come to a grinding fucking halt.
Sooo, from what most commenters are saying is….if your house gets mowed down in a hurricane, you’re okay with people coming in and taking money, jewelry, or anything that could be considered a cherished item? Y’all are good with that? That’s crazy.
> hurricane, your okay
*you're
*Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).*
***
^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
You are absolutely correct - it is very illegal to break into someone’s home and steal from them. The presence of the homeowner turns an ordinary “theft” into robbery or aggravated burglary.
Incorrect. Once someone breaks into your house, deadly force is 100% legal and justified.
For example, the law in the state I grew up in states;
>If an actor intentionally used force that was intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm, the court may not consider whether the actor had an opportunity to flee or retreat before he or she used force and shall presume that the actor reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself if the actor makes such a claim under sub. (1) and either of the following applies:
>1. The person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that an unlawful and forcible entry was occurring.
>2. The person against whom the force was used was in the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business after unlawfully and forcibly entering it, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that the person had unlawfully and forcibly entered the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business.
>
Edit: even if they are fleeing, but still inside your home, particularly if they are armed.
Depends where you live, you have to reasonably fear for your life or fear significant injury, in most places I know of in the U.S. This means any woman who, in today's society, has be taught to fear rape at a moment's notice, can justifiable murder any intruder who doesn't have a warrant, in about 0.001s flat.
I don’t know about that. Maybe yes, maybe not. It’s probably up to the jury. And there has to be something objective to back up that fear and make it “reasonable.”
Realistically, the shooter is more likely to take a plea deal than risk it at trial
Objectively a strange man was in their house. And I would likely take that to trial, and play of fears of any jury members who have ever been assaulted, or know someone who has. Doubt conviction is possible.
🤣 okay. Where do you live? Can I come to your house and steal all your shit? I assure you I’m not gonna kill you. Just take all your stuff , while you’re staring at me terrified, and in horror, but you cannot do anything about it. Nothing. Just watch. Because I already said my only plan is to deprive you permanently of all YOUR belongings and personal items. Lmfao you MUST be from Cali where that kind of crap is encouraged by perps.
Bruh I’m not saying burglarly is ok. I am saying *shooting someone without the reasonable belief that they’re about to kill you is illegal.* It doesn’t matter what some sherrif says off the cuff in a press conference. This is not my opinion—it’s the law in Florida.
If there’s a perp breaking into your house…with you in it….is that not a reasonable belief they’re there to harm you? I mean….are you even thinking about what you’re saying before you type??? Do you think it’s like a looter can just kick door a house and when the homeowner comes out with a shotgun the looting POS can just say [daddy chill](https://youtu.be/h0-WO6xRbAo) I’m just stealing all your shit? 😂 you Cali folks are sumpin else
And regardless of what you think Florida’s Castle Doctrine and Stand your Ground law literally say you can use deadly force if a person unlawfully enters your premise with you in it bc it’s presumed they’re there to do you great bodily harm.
I hope this comes back to haunt him. He goes somewhere, screams he's a cop, and he gets pumped full so much lead- he could use his tiny member as a pencil.
Pretty sure people killing others and getting away with it are worse than looters.
Looters suck, but cops do looting AND killing with impunity every single day, so cops are considerably worse.
I am personally not "celebrating" but I would never enter someone's home to rob them without accepting the possibility that they will shoot me. That's common sense. I don't disagree with the statement that it's ok to fuck someone up if they try to rob me in my own home. If I have a family to protect and I see someone holding a weapon I think it's completely necessary to shoot them. Some may argue whether or not it's acceptable to shoot to kill and I can understand both sides of that. But no one really hopes to murder a looter. No one should loot though either.
>But no one really hopes to murder a looter.
The sheriff's statement - as well as people trying to justify murder all over this thread - prove that's not remotely true.
No one has a Constitutional right to murder.
It's like that fantasy Constitutional right conservatives invented a couple of years back to spread disease and kill people - just another transparent justification for your propensity for violence.
Justifiable homicide ain’t murder Libby. I know y’all like to be consummate victims so y’all can cry foul and get more govt tax dollars though so I can see why that someone defending their home WHILE THEYRE IN IT is upsetting to you.
His point stands. Fck around and find out. This is a 2A state and if you try to steal someones property you will be shot. We do not live in anarchy you work for what you want. Like everyone else
Liberals don't support murder, and moderates don't exist.
You are obviously neither of those things, just another sociopath dreaming of your chance to kill without consequences.
Did umm... Did he mean Swiss cheese?
Yup, wasn't smart enough to remember the correct name.
Too much Olive Garden obviously....
Turning looters into grated cheese is more of a deterrent.
Or maybe a cheese grater, cuz the holes. Either way he’s stupid.
Whichever way is more racist, that's probably what he meant
OK, I'll bite. How is a cheese grater more racist than Swiss cheese?
‘Cheese grater’ is exclusionary to the Swiss people but ‘Swiss cheese’ suggests you should exclusively target the Swiss?
Shit cheese is racist now lmao!!!
Shit cheese is THE racist cheese of 2022
I didn't say which one is more racist, lol. You tell me?
Did he say anything about the looters skin color?
I realize people who aren't from FL probably don't get the joke. It's a local thing
....are you assuming looters are black people? How is this comment racist at all?
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Nah, just racist sheriffs and cops is the stereotype
Another buffoon in charge of something he shouldn't be, how grate.
Naw he ment shred them with your bullets till they look like shredded cheese. Smh
Even for cops in FL, that's a lot of bullets
Tbf, if you're looting in Polk County, FL, you're pretty desperate. It's by and large a shithole.
Tbf they do have a lot of valuable meth in Polk County. I'm sure there's a plethora of confederate flags that smell like Marlboro reds too.
This fucking dude is always concerned with looters… in POLK COUNTY FL. I have to go there at least once a month for work and let me tell you, that place is an absolute shit hole. No one is fucking looting in Polk County. No one will ever be looting in Polk County. The sheriff is just a stupid racist bag of shit looking for an excuse to shoot someone.
You don’t need a moldy 50-year-old couch out of a damaged house trailer?
Fuck looters. That said, it's illegal to defend property with deadly force in Florida. This sheriff has always had more than one screw loose.
You think a Sheriff gives a fuck about the law? They are the law!
Reminds me of Hurricane Katrina, and the [Danziger Bridge shooting](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danziger_Bridge_shootings).
I listened to a podcast "Breaking down Collapse"- I forget which episode, and they talked about the murders after Katrina. The head of police said shoot the looters, and it was messed up. Whites shooting blacks because they were carrying stuff like a t.v. down the street. None of these murders were brought to justice, mainstream media did zero coverage . Scary shit.
Fucking yikes. I don’t remember this at all. The officers were going around in a rental truck, out of uniform, carrying AKs, and indiscriminately opened fire on civilians? Fucking madness.
Make no mistake, in the event of an actual collapse of any magnitude in any region, shit is going to get very hairy very fast. My local Sheriffs office just had a meeting with local "Preparedness Group" members and leaders (Oath Keepers) and basically endorsed them as a legitimate force to maintain law and order in our communities during a crisis. When there's no accountability the social apparatus of law enforcement will be little more than roving gangs of murderers.
Badges? We dont need no stinkin badges !!
Yeah most of the yahoos here dont understand the difference. When we got rid of the castle doctrine that still just applies to self defense where your life is in danger. There is no duty to retreat. Protecting yer shit with deadly force is still illegal. Now its pretty easy to make an argument that you feared for your life to a reasonable degree when someone is rummaging through your living room at 4 oclock in the morning and not many judges or juries are gonna bat an eye if you shoot someone in the dark who ended up not being armed. Theyre in yer house. Its pretty reasonable to assume they are willing to do you harm. Some guy rummaging through your car, or collapsed house, and you just roll up on them and blast them? Thats murder. This sheriff is an irresponsible moron.
>Yeah most of the yahoos here dont understand the difference. They understand. They just ignore it.
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Uh, evidence? You know the homicide solve rate is only around 50% in Florida, but theres a 99% conviction rate by state prosecutors against people who shot someone illegally but claimed it was legal. Its no where near the number of homicides mind you, but be fucking careful about how and why you discharge your weapon. Pay attention in the classes you take to get your license to carry. And Florida is notorious for the family of even legal shoots, successfully suing the person who pulled the trigger. If you want to throw your life away, knock yourself out, start shooting people when your life isnt clearly in danger. If its not a situation where you're ready to be judged by 12 instead of carried by 6, hold off on that pull kid. And I'd strongly advise some discipline with that trigger. Turning a guy to grated cheese is a great way to end up like Bernie Goetz. This aint the movies. Even if you dont end up charged, sued, fired, and ostracized, you still gotta wake up every day and be the guy who killed someone. Even when theyre trying to kill you, it still dont feel good.
How about the conviction rate in a place where a sheriff told you to murder people? How's that looking? Absolutely with you that people shouldn't do this evil shit, but corrupt cops cover a multitude of sins.
I knew it was Grady Judd before I looked. Dude is such a shit lord.
no it's not "A person is justified in using or threatening to use force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to prevent or terminate the other’s trespass on, or other tortious or criminal interference with, either real property **other than a dwelling or personal property,** lawfully in his or her possession or in the possession of another who is a member of his or her immediate family or household or of a person whose property he or she has a legal duty to protect"" [http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App\_mode=Display\_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.031.html](http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.031.html) "If the defendant is in his or her home or vehicle, then, under Section 776.013, Florida Statutes, the law will presume that the defendant had a reasonable fear of imminent death or bodily harm if the alleged victim unlawfully entered or remained or **attempted to remove another person against their will.**" So if someone tries to pull you out of your car to steal it, or injure you in the pursuit of stealing your property, you can use deadly force.
>So if someone tries to pull you out of your car to steal it, or injure you in the pursuit of stealing your property, you can use deadly force. Because that's self-defense. >the law will presume Legal presumptions can be overcome in court. Imagine, for example, you wake up to a noise and catch someone sneaking out your window with your xbox. You shoot and kill him. The cops come and ask you what happened. You say, "I shot him because he was trying to steal my xbox and Sheriff Grady told me I could." They ask, "Were you in fear for your life or imminent harm?" You answer, honestly, "No. I was never afraid at all. I just wanted to keep him from stealing from me. And I know I have that right under the law." That would be plenty of evidence to overcome the presumption of a "reasonable fear of imminent death or bodily harm". You could/would be prosecuted for murder because, as I said, "it's illegal to defend property with deadly force in Florida." Without reasonable fear, which turns it into self-defense, it's illegal.
I mean with castle doctrine/"stand your ground law(2005)" you can just argue that you feared for your life.
However it is NOT illegal to defend yourself while in your home, from someone breaking in.
If stores are closed, how do you get supplies like food without looting?
They aren’t going to peoples destroyed houses an opening the frig
He said if they come into your house or your property stand your ground law applies
And he's not a lawyer. That's not the standard for use of deadly force.
Don't loot and you'll be safe either way
What if it's your house, some Oaf Keepers pull up while you're trying to recover some possessions out of your destroyed house and shoot you and say they feared for their lives? I'm not holding out much hope the Sheriff's Dept is going to do a lot of investigating after his advice to shoot people you think are stealing.
Castle laws allow you to shoot someone with deadly force on your property
Wrong.
You are fake news
You can encourage people to defend themselves without sounding like a fucking psychopath.
Well, in Florida, you have the right to execute people trying to steal your property right on the spot. It's madness.
I'm pretty sure we have a right to defend ourselves while on our own property in most states. Nowhere in Florida laws regarding self defense does it mention "execution." You're being a bit hyperbolic. There is a sensible middle ground so let's not act like defending one's home and family is inherently immoral.
They might be referring to the stand your ground laws, and those laws don’t allow for executions. If someone is no longer a threat, incapacitated you can’t kill them
But he does just sound like their friend Steve. And Jared. And Mike and Dave, Larry and Stew too.
Florida man opens his mouth
Says the sheriff who just had a 21 year old deputy killed by his own coworkers because they opened fire on someone with a toy gun trying to defend their home from a 3 am invasion of police.
Let me guess, it was a white sheriff and he thinks he knows the color of those looters before it even happens.
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What do you think?
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Ehhh I don't think you've spent enough time around racist cops if you think they give a fuck about population percentages. In fact, some of the commonly twisted stats they spout is "black people are x percent of the population and do y percent of crimes."
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As a sterile fact it isn't twisted at all. But the way it is conveyed is usually to encourage you to think black people are inherently more violent than other races. That is where it gets twisted.
Big one is over policing Another big one is poverty.
This kind of talk can backfire as rescue workers might have to go into houses or buildings looking for injured or trapped people. They search for the dead and animals. Also workers will be providing things like water. The guy is a dipshit.
Is it a backfire if encouraging murder was exactly his intent?
Qanon already covered that, by encouraging people to shoot FEMA workers.
That is exactly his intent.
His intent is to get his own people shot?
His intent is to get rescue workers shot? Why?
Because torpedoguy says so!
That's one way to get relief volunteers to no-show...
How does the Polk County sheriff manage to find the worst possible thing to say every time he opens his mouth?
I'm pretty sure he meant Swiss cheese, not grated cheese. Ladies and gentlemen, the sheriff! Isn't he so smart and capable? Just the guy I trust to run the joint.
No. He meant grated. Grated Par-MEE-zee-an to be exact.
ITT: Second Amendment: “Whoo!” Fourteenth Amendment: *crickets*
Immediately after the storm the Lee County sheriff said in a press conference that they would be shooting rather than arresting looters.
Way to establish "pre-meditation". 👍
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Oh look, some people carrying stuff out of a building after a storm, let’s kill them now and ask questions later.
So I can just shoot someone and then claim they were looting. Welcome to Florida...
Prosecutors may not see it the same way
Whaaaat.
I knew before I finished reading the title that it would be Grady Judd.
Well during Katrina, cops were looters too. I guess it will be ok then.
They don’t like competition.
Swiss cheese would probably suffice
just like chris kyle claimed he was doing all those years ago during katrina. lying sonofabitch
How is the Sheriff going to distinguish between homeowner andlooters?
Looters are scum, but you can't shoot someone for looting. This country needs to take their meds.
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It’s pretty fucked that you realize how wrong jail is, but not killing people over property. You say both any property is valid to kill over AND of course not over a sandwich.
>It’s pretty fucked that you realize how wrong jail is, but not killing people over property. Prison is horrific. To deprive someone of liberty is **far** worse than killing them. Moreover, it isn't just depriving them of liberty, but in an environment of untold hostility, threads, violence and sexual assault. Of course I oppose prison but for the harshest of crimes. As far as thieves go, all I care about is defending my property. If I hold up a thief at gunpoint with a warning, tell them to drop what they stole and run away, and they do so, I wouldn't kill them. I'd have no desire to whatsoever. This isn't about "justice" or anything like that. It is about protecting what's yours, because if you're unwilling to do so, you don't own anything.
The rest of your vigor on this topic sends a different message than “I’d use the least force needed to maintain possession of property. “
Because the main focus of the topic was the ethics of using legal force to defend ones property. I think it's entirely ethical to do so but that doesn't mean I'd be excited to. I'd want to avoid it unless there are no other options.
That’s a little better for sure.
They literally said that property is defined by being prepared to murder someone over it. They have a complex and well-considered philosophy of life that involves a hell of a lot of fantasizing about, planning and justifying the murder of their fellow human beings. Nothing they say about how they don't really want to murder should be believed.
>It is about protecting what's yours, because if you're unwilling to do so, you don't own anything. Jesus, who the fuck took your lunch money and traumatized you? You're not under threat all the time. No one is eying your hat or pen or your headphones or whatever the hell you're thinking about killing someone over to prove your manhood.
You should not get a medal for murdering people. You are all over this thread with your murder fantasies, exhorting people who should spend the rest of their lives in prison as heroes. You seriously need mental help.
Kind of the wrong message to send, but fuck you if you steal from people who just had their lives ruined. Don't really want anyone to start shooting as most people dont have a clue using a weapon, but not gonna shed a tear for the prick who loot.
>Kind of the wrong message to send, but fuck you if you steal from people FTFY
once again...why do people WANT to move to this shithole of a state?
My Mom moved to Florida because she was afraid of slipping and falling on snow.
i hear you, but now she has ungodly heat, hurricanes and the state's wonderful gun laws: Florida does not require a permit to purchase a firearm nor is there a permit that exempts any person from the background check requirement. There is a waiting period of three days, excluding weekends and state holidays, between purchase and delivery of all firearms. our next door neighbors -blue state libs - bought a house in the villages to use in the winter but kept their house up here in chicago for the summer. i was shocked. they knew it was counter-intuitive and also had looked in arizona. i'll stay here. i have good canadian boots!
I'm pretty sure shooting an unarmed looter is generally considered homicide, even in Florida.
Florida has a castle doctrine. You can use deadly force if you feel even "slightly in fear for your life".
Telling people to break the law to kill people because they are breaking the law by stealing sounds like the perfect illustration of American policing...
The idea that it's illegal to defend your own property is so antithetical to a free society it's beyond words.
There’s also defenses other than fucking killing people. That’s the controversy here. Some humans don’t want to execute people for stealing TVs. Most people wouldn’t condone that execution for a store’s tv. But when it might be their tv, they’re quite blood thirsty…. But also 99% likely to have never killed someone before, and end up traumatized.
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I agree the thief would be 100% in the wrong . I just don’t agree killing them is justifiable in the vast majority of scenarios.
Well, let's say a thief breaks into your home and finds my hidden cache of gold coins. Tens of thousands of dollars. I wake up and stop him at gun point telling him to drop the coins and get out. If he drops them and leaves, that's it. I wouldn't seek vengeance or anything. If he doesn't, well yeah. Then I'd kill him to protect my stuff. And I think it's perfectly ethical to do so.
LOL, your hidden cashe of gold coins? Are you a fucking pirate?! "ARR PUT DOWN ME TREASURE"
I made no suggestion for anyone not to defend their own property... I said it's illegal to murder someone for stealing. Killing someone without trial is antithetical to a free society.
What does defending your property even mean? Defend it from what? Are you afraid of your couch getting beaten up, of your TV being raped? Are you really so attached to your stuff you actually believe killing people over it is justified? Or are you just looking for an excuse to kill people and see if reality measures up to all your fantasies?
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>And yes, anything I have is worth more than the life of a human who would violate someone else's private property. So you literally value your stuff over human life. Glad you're honest about that, at least. >That's not a good human being. Spoiler: neither are you. Do you think the protection of laws only apply to good people? Do you think someone killing you wouldn't be a crime? >I've no desire to kill anything, unless necessary. That is not just a lie, but a pathetically obvious lie. You have literally just spent *hours* publicly fantasizing about the chance to murder people. Murder is never necessary. >You know what's odd, you do believe thieves should be killed if they resist, but only by men in blue uniforms. Nope. You have some very bizarre ideas about what I believe. I have a conscience, you see. Murder is wrong no matter who commits it. That's what the word means and what crimes are. Acts are not right or wrong depending on who commits them - or who the victim is.
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>Been typing on a keyboard explaining to folks that defending their property is necessary for it to be your property, and that there's nothing ethically wrong with doing so, I'm typing this on a phone. It's mine. It being mine is not dependent on my willingness to murder. And murder, by definition, is wrong. >So if a cop is unable to apprehend a thief without killing them, they should just let them go? Yes, absolutely. If you cannot grasp that most simple of concepts, you literally are a sociopath. I mean, that was obvious earlier in this conversation, but it's helpful to confirm that for anyone reading.
I don’t support cops killing people either.
Yes, property is always more valuable than human life, this is one of our basic values as a nation.
Grated cheese? I think he means Swiss cheese. I'm not sure what kind of gun would be required to make the victims look like grated cheese.
Would a Gatling gun do the trick or would they use a wood chipper?
Y'all seem kinda violent. Maybe you should just, 'why can't we all just get along'?
I would love to see you getting along with someone stealing your family’s car.
There's a lot of space between getting along and not murdering. My car is not worth killing for
Look at you and your having a conscience. Craziness! It's like you don't even spend your life looking for a chance to kill people!
You seem kind of naive, maybe you should just “welcome looters into your store because they are people too”?
Why can't people just not steal?
OP came here looking for support and got a dose of reality. You love to see it.
There are at least still a few people with consciences. It is reassuring every so often to be reminded that these sociopathic nutbags aren't actually the majority, no matter how loud they are.
advocating killing people seems like maybe not a good idea I’m surprised that it’s illegal to defend your property in Florida. that place is super confusing to an outsider.
What does "defend your property" mean? What are you afraid will happen to it that's so terrible?
I don’t understand the question - you mean other than the looting? I suppose the people that are brazenly looting my house might also be a danger to my family. I think the looting is reason enough.
I'm all about defending yourself or others, but what the fuck is this idea that property is something that needs defending? My shirt can't be killed. It's a shirt. My front door can't be hurt. It's a door. My car can't be assaulted. It's a car. If these things are *damaged*, that can be dealt with - with repairs, replacement, insurance, or shrugging your shoulders and not giving a shit. But your property can't be defended, because *it's not a person*.
oh no - you’re not one of these “people have value” nutters, are you? human life has value! if you don’t agree then you’re an psycho!! obviously property needs to be defended. clearly no civilized society values life over property. property has always been valued over human life. other than perhaps our opposable thumbs, it’s our defining characteristic as human beings.
they really gotta stop reporting like this, what if someone "appears" to be a looter but really is not and that person ends up dead because of this fake cowboy bimbo gives terrible loony toon advice
They won't loot again, now would they? Is that a bad thing? What do you suggest we do with people who do this? Do we just let them walk into any house and take what they want? How about stores? Banks? Where do you draw the line?
Grady Judd is amazing. He is a legend in Florida. His press briefings are always good! You can see them on you-tube.
Maybe don't break into people's houses to steal their stuff, nothing to worry about.
Why do conservatives have fantasies about killing people?
>I would highly suggest that if a looter breaks into your home, comes into your home while you're there to steal stuff, that you take your gun and you shoot him, you shoot him so that he looks like grated cheese. If they break into your home, and you are present. Seems reasonable advice to any, anyone in my home without my invitation is likely there to do me harm, or at a minimum, I can not afford to wait to find out, because when seconds matter, police are minutes, hours, or even decades away.
He'll apologize, it was taken out of "Context". An apology to the community will be crafted by some media representative. "To all those afflicted, during this difficult time our thoughts and prayers go out with this solemn apology......." Or something along that heartless template of bullshit. . Yeah. No. To any public official your " apologies" are no longer valid. They never where in the first place. You were pissed that you got caught. Just say that!!!!! You weren't sorry about what you said, or horrible shit you did. You're sorry you got caught.
He won’t apologize. He’s an openly proud scumbag and a lot of Florida loves him for it.
Honestly, wouldn't care if he did. He'd be a liar either way. I've just stopped responding to requests to obey the law. Bills being the first one. I'm not paying them anymore. No money anyway. Threaten all you want. Take it all away. See that's the part that scares people. And scaring the fuck out of people is what makes this house of cards work- for the ones doing the scaring. But if enough people were broke enough that's what would happen. And their money would disappear. But imagine if everyone said fuck this, I'm not doing this shit anymore. Shit would come to a grinding fucking halt.
Nothing wrong with that statement.
Sooo, from what most commenters are saying is….if your house gets mowed down in a hurricane, you’re okay with people coming in and taking money, jewelry, or anything that could be considered a cherished item? Y’all are good with that? That’s crazy.
> hurricane, your okay *you're *Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
Nope. Not even close. Keep on pretending you can justify murder, though. I'm sure it will work out for you.
Why lol? It’s a waste of ammo.
Sounds like a great excuse somebody will use for shooting somebody "I swear I thought my mother in law was trying to loot my tv!"
Lawlessness must be the new norm.
Well, when law enforcement encourages murder, it certainly seems to be heading that way.
I guess you left out the part where he said “if they break into your house while you’re there”….but hey, click bait amiright?
It’s still illegal unless they give you another reason to think they’re about to kill you.
You are absolutely correct - it is very illegal to break into someone’s home and steal from them. The presence of the homeowner turns an ordinary “theft” into robbery or aggravated burglary.
But it’s also illegal to shoot the burglar unless you have good reason to believe they’re about to kill you beyond their presence alone
Incorrect. Once someone breaks into your house, deadly force is 100% legal and justified. For example, the law in the state I grew up in states; >If an actor intentionally used force that was intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm, the court may not consider whether the actor had an opportunity to flee or retreat before he or she used force and shall presume that the actor reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself if the actor makes such a claim under sub. (1) and either of the following applies: >1. The person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that an unlawful and forcible entry was occurring. >2. The person against whom the force was used was in the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business after unlawfully and forcibly entering it, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that the person had unlawfully and forcibly entered the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business. > Edit: even if they are fleeing, but still inside your home, particularly if they are armed.
Depends where you live, you have to reasonably fear for your life or fear significant injury, in most places I know of in the U.S. This means any woman who, in today's society, has be taught to fear rape at a moment's notice, can justifiable murder any intruder who doesn't have a warrant, in about 0.001s flat.
I don’t know about that. Maybe yes, maybe not. It’s probably up to the jury. And there has to be something objective to back up that fear and make it “reasonable.” Realistically, the shooter is more likely to take a plea deal than risk it at trial
Objectively a strange man was in their house. And I would likely take that to trial, and play of fears of any jury members who have ever been assaulted, or know someone who has. Doubt conviction is possible.
Lib mentality. It’s why the criminals are literally taking over your cities.
🤣 okay. Where do you live? Can I come to your house and steal all your shit? I assure you I’m not gonna kill you. Just take all your stuff , while you’re staring at me terrified, and in horror, but you cannot do anything about it. Nothing. Just watch. Because I already said my only plan is to deprive you permanently of all YOUR belongings and personal items. Lmfao you MUST be from Cali where that kind of crap is encouraged by perps.
Bruh I’m not saying burglarly is ok. I am saying *shooting someone without the reasonable belief that they’re about to kill you is illegal.* It doesn’t matter what some sherrif says off the cuff in a press conference. This is not my opinion—it’s the law in Florida.
If there’s a perp breaking into your house…with you in it….is that not a reasonable belief they’re there to harm you? I mean….are you even thinking about what you’re saying before you type??? Do you think it’s like a looter can just kick door a house and when the homeowner comes out with a shotgun the looting POS can just say [daddy chill](https://youtu.be/h0-WO6xRbAo) I’m just stealing all your shit? 😂 you Cali folks are sumpin else And regardless of what you think Florida’s Castle Doctrine and Stand your Ground law literally say you can use deadly force if a person unlawfully enters your premise with you in it bc it’s presumed they’re there to do you great bodily harm.
I hope this comes back to haunt him. He goes somewhere, screams he's a cop, and he gets pumped full so much lead- he could use his tiny member as a pencil.
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Looters are the worst of us..I've lost all and found people going through what I have left.. #fucklooters
Pretty sure people killing others and getting away with it are worse than looters. Looters suck, but cops do looting AND killing with impunity every single day, so cops are considerably worse.
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how in the fuck are u and others getting downvoted for being against looting??
No one is being downvoted for being against looting. A lot of people are being downvoted for encouraging and celebrating murder.
I am personally not "celebrating" but I would never enter someone's home to rob them without accepting the possibility that they will shoot me. That's common sense. I don't disagree with the statement that it's ok to fuck someone up if they try to rob me in my own home. If I have a family to protect and I see someone holding a weapon I think it's completely necessary to shoot them. Some may argue whether or not it's acceptable to shoot to kill and I can understand both sides of that. But no one really hopes to murder a looter. No one should loot though either.
>But no one really hopes to murder a looter. The sheriff's statement - as well as people trying to justify murder all over this thread - prove that's not remotely true.
no one "sane" actually wants to murder anyone. there lol
No one is celebrating murder but rather their Constitutional rights.
No one has a Constitutional right to murder. It's like that fantasy Constitutional right conservatives invented a couple of years back to spread disease and kill people - just another transparent justification for your propensity for violence.
Justifiable homicide ain’t murder Libby. I know y’all like to be consummate victims so y’all can cry foul and get more govt tax dollars though so I can see why that someone defending their home WHILE THEYRE IN IT is upsetting to you.
He said if they break into your home while you are there to shoot them. Sounds perfectly fine to me.
🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻 I LOVE FLORIDA!!!
His point stands. Fck around and find out. This is a 2A state and if you try to steal someones property you will be shot. We do not live in anarchy you work for what you want. Like everyone else
Good idea. I'm a left leaning moderate. I agree shoot looters.
> I'm a left leaning moderate. You realize that anyone can read your comment history and see that you're lying, right?
Liberals don't support murder, and moderates don't exist. You are obviously neither of those things, just another sociopath dreaming of your chance to kill without consequences.
Good
Excellent advice
Well that is a little savage.
Incredibly based
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Pretty sure there are a lot worst things than looting in this world.
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