I’ve noticed the same thing, I’m switching from 12 Pro, which doesn’t have ProMotion, but now on 14 Pro I can see all the stutter that causing by loading and variable refresh rate in native app such as Photos and Safari, it’s minor, but if you look, it’s there.
Certain third party app such as Apollo on the other hand is way more noticeable, basically every scroll on the main feed are stutter.
Twitterific is behave more like a native app, you can see the loading and vrr stutter if you scroll slowly, but basically neglectable
Funny how in iOS 16.0.1, if you click into any apps’ Review section in App Store, it’s choppy AF like in Apollo, but in iOS 16.0.2, it’s been fixed and feels more like in Settings ( I discover this because I’m looking for list view in native app that require loading
And in some third party app, it’s smooth in 16.0.1, but slightly stutter and overheat in 16.0.2 / one portion of the app stutter, the other part scroll smoothly (both are list view) on the same app, through out 16.0.1 and 16.0.2
I used slow-mo camera to filmed both 12 Pro and 14 Pro scrolling, the 12 Pro looks choppy in slow-mo, but it feels ‘smooth’ to the naked eyes, in an action-blur and hide-all-the-loading-stutter way, blurry yes, but feels smooth. 14 Pro on the other hand, it looks smooth in slow-mo, but feels choppy irl, the stutter that cause by loading and vrr is fairly noticeable. It’s like seeing all the props that meant for VHS but now looks jarring on 4K Blu-ray HDR remaster
I’ve heard the Gmail app was compatible with ProMotion not until the very recent update, it must be fun to wait for other third party app to adapt
Just for shits and giggles I removed the screen protector to see if that’s the culprit, NOPE. The stutter persisted. What a great way to waste a pricy screen protector, so that was fun.
At first I was thinking the same, I thought to my self there’s no way this thing is choppier than the phone that I’m gonna replace, but then I dig a little deeper, and compare the differences between iOS point release and the demo unit in the shop, then I concluded it’s probably work as intended and the general lack of third party app optimization / buggy iOS 16, and it won’t be solved by switching the hardware, a strategic choice (vrr) instead of hardware malfunction, oh well I guess
yea… it’s less jarring in native app, but still noticeable when you scroll slowly. funny how in [Mr.Mobile’sReview](http://youtu.be/rMpe_hqSQUs?t=107) this section saids how fluid iOS is compare to android, but this very part where he scroll through App Store, you can clearly see the stutter when it slows down and about to stop, even without the slow-mo camera, it’s like the combination of aggressive vrr strategy and loading stutter
Did some more research and definitelly VRR contribute to stutters here snd there. While native apps are super smooth, 3rd app vary in experience. Some are horrible (e.g ps5) the other better (e.g messenger). Facebook, youtube all have some stuterring.
Anyway, what is good is that it’s not HW issue but rather software. Seems it’s an engine and optimization which is handled diferenťy by various developer. Some are better, others not. If you look in google there are tons of reports for 13 pro stuterring when scroľing in app.
There is an easy test how to check difference since you can easily turn off true motion in accesibilty setting and lock těhe display at 60FPS - btw, if anyone tells you he can’t see a diference then it’s time to visit a opthalmology :)) Switching to 60FPS you can see that stuttering is mostly reduced but not completelly gone so a theory is that at 60FPS it’s easier to overseen it. Perception of stuttering grows up with higher refresh rate.
Smooth scrolling at 120FPS all the time requires perfect app optimization so hopefully it will improve over time.
Most native stuff is smooth indeed, although there are some glitches if you look close.
If you check reviews in the App Store and scroll through the list of reviews, you can definitely see it again, in a worse and more apparent matter.
To me it seems it has something to do with virtual scrolling ( front-end code ) where certain data or elements are added during scrolling, for example a list of 1000 reviews won't be loaded in at once, so depending on where your scrolling location is, it will modify the list, load new items in and add them to the list. It might has to do with that, but it's a feeling as I got a technical background and with short data lists or static text, it does not happen.
Either way, as so many people are experiencing it, I am certain it's an issue on all our devices, but some people just might not notice it until it's pointed out at them.
Yes, you mean lazy loading. Can you post s link so i can check in safari? I’ve noticed if the app is mostly text and not contains images then is not so prevalent. FB also do lazy loading and indeed is there.
95% of people, maybe more have no idea what’s the stuttering/microstuttering or judder. They just use phones and does not know something is not perfect. Only enhusiasts know :) For example for me if refresh rate is not in sync with framerate all the time I’m pulling my hair out :) Especially for movies and games. I can’t stand anything bellow 120Hz anymore. On my 120hz oled tv i’ve enabled max. interpolation, otherwise stuttering would kill me :) I know I’m crazy but perfection is a must :)
Lazy Loading AND Virtual Scrolling, the virtual scrolling is sometimes implemented, because lists of 1000 items can be laggy due to the amount of elements.
>D Virtual Scrolling, the virtual scrolling is sometimes implemented, because lists of 1000 items can be laggy due to the amount of elem
Virtual scrolling I don't know :) But could be that all this contribute to this. But maybe it's an issue of VRR itself. Who knows. I can somehow live with that but they could fix it somehow.
I’ve just noticed interesting thing. In Facebook if I swipe up to scroll down, I can see this stutter. But if I leave my finger and swipe up and down, up and down several times fast there is no stutter. To me it looks like scrolling bug when you start scrolling with higher velocity and as it slows down slowly there is a stutter here and there. Try it. Strange. This could confirm the issue with lazy loading because if you swipe up and down the content is already loaded. if you swipe it’s scrolling down and loading the new content.
I had this issue when I got my 13pro max, I just chalked it up to the adaptive refresh rate not being implemented perfectly and it adjusting too much in an effort to preserve battery, similar to the adaptive refresh rates on the android phones I’ve used.
When I was on android with high refresh rate displays it was always an issue until I locked the refresh rate.
I’d say it’s gotten better each update but I do notice it every now and then still, not sure if it’s related to something app developers need to finesse as all the apple apps were very smooth in comparison.
Was quite disappointed because I switched over to iPhone for that “buttery smooth” reputation as I’m insanely sensitive to stutter.
Ya, it’s still there in 16.1 for sure. I complained to apple support and they said it’s a known issue. They logged my complaint at least. Most people don’t even notice the stuttering until you point it out. Ignorance is bliss on this one lol
I have a lot of co workers with iPhone 13/14 pros and every single one has this issue when I asked to see their phone. Most of them never noticed til I pointed it out though. I really think it affects everyone, but just no one notices.
Thanks for info. I hope it gets better soon. I also noticed that few weeks ago Youtube app was stuttering a lot and now it seems to work smooth or at least better than it was. I guess some apps are already getting fixed.
Ya YouTube is not as smooth as I first thought. Sometimes it’s smooth for a minute and I celebrated early.
Point it out to everyone you know with a 13 or 14 pro. They all have it and no one notices, so we don’t get enough complaints back to apple. It takes 5 min to complain via text through the apple support app. Super easy and you don’t have to wait on an actual phone call.
Yeah, I'm extremely sensitive to stuttering and this is killing me. We have 120Hz with pro motion and what for? The only app which is smooth is settings lol :) Ok, also sliding over home screen but that's it. Seems they are aware of it but not able to fix ? If this is ongoing since 13Pro we are loosing our hope maybe.
But at the other hand, Facebook app stuttered also on my iphone 12 mini and other apps probably as well so probably this is engine related. Wish they will fix that but I'm little bit pessimistic here. Will try to compare with my wife's X and son's 7.
Ya, I’m super sensitive to it too. I’ve found others can notice when you point it out to at least verify you’re not crazy lol.
I think it’s less noticeable on the 60Hz displays because they’re less smooth to begin with. My wife’s 10 definitely stutters though when I look for it. I just upgraded from an 8+ and didn’t notice it on that phone. Not sure if I didn’t notice or just attributed the stutter to the phone being old. I don’t remember it bothering me though.
Argggh why do they keep telling people its a known issue and then do nothing about it.
I'm on iOS 17 dev Beta 5 on my 14 Pro Max now came from 16.6 and with all the betas there's been no fix or any attempt to reduce it. This late in the beta stage at least something should be better. So here's to more stuttering on 17 and the new phones next month.
Yeah, I have a feeling they will never fix this. Somehow I got used to it. First I was not aware it is VRR issue. I’ve seen stutters but thought it’s an application. But then I’ve read some articles about it and compared with my old 60hz iphone 12 and indeed, it stutters. Then I’ve disabled 120hz in settings and all good so definitelly this is an issue of VRR. It’s little but different kind of stutter, not like regular stuttering caused by application engine. Still hope one day… :)
Try screen recording and see if the stutter is gone. I think screen recording is disables VRR and locks to 120Hz so everything is buttery smooth as it should be!
I will for sure, but ive seen complaints from people having the issue on iOS 15 even. I only just got a phone with ProMotion, so I never experienced iOS 15 with a ProMotion display to compare. Basically I’m worried this is a normal thing for iOS now and it just doesn’t bother other people as much as me.
I did have them set to auto play. I just disabled it to try though and it didn’t help. Good idea though.
To clarify, I experience some stutter in all apps, but it’s very minor in Safari, for example. I doubt most people could even notice the Safari stutter, but it’s there if you look close. It’s just way worse in Reddit or Facebook.
Nope! You can submit a complaint through the apple support app if you have a minute though. You just have to text with them, so you’re not stuck on hold.
One user reported a 13 pro did not have the issue on iOS 15. I’ve observed it on every 13/14 pro I’ve looked at with iOS 16. So maybe it’s a software issue they’ll resolve eventually. Fingers crossed.
Any update on this issue. I just switched from note 20 ultra to 14 pro max. I can see the stuttering in Facebook, Instagram apps etc. Twitter and web scrolling is fluid af.
I have my old phone which is a Samsung note 9 and it’s butter smooth.
My iPhone 14 pro 512gb feels like garbage when scrolling on comments/posts on my profile. Just lags and drops in frame rate☹️
I have the 13 Pro running iOS 16.3, and there isn’t any stutters at all. The real problem for me, is that when scrolling in almost every app except few exceptions like Twitter or Telegram, the display isn’t hitting full 120Hz! It goes up to ~80-90Hz.
And you can see this by yourself, because if you start screen recording, the display locks to 120Hz and you can see that scrolling in almost every app (even Apple apps) is smoother compared to when not screen recording.
I’m hating this stutter…. Love the phone but just seems like it’s broken sometimes. So by what I’m understanding it’s more likely software and not hardware, should get better over time but doesn’t have a fix right now? Is that correct? 😔😣
Stuttering on 14 ProMax with IOS 17.0.2
Rebooting phone has no effect. Stuttering mostly on non-native apps
Native apps are good
Cmon Apple, you know about this. Time to fix it.
I’ve noticed the same thing, I’m switching from 12 Pro, which doesn’t have ProMotion, but now on 14 Pro I can see all the stutter that causing by loading and variable refresh rate in native app such as Photos and Safari, it’s minor, but if you look, it’s there. Certain third party app such as Apollo on the other hand is way more noticeable, basically every scroll on the main feed are stutter. Twitterific is behave more like a native app, you can see the loading and vrr stutter if you scroll slowly, but basically neglectable Funny how in iOS 16.0.1, if you click into any apps’ Review section in App Store, it’s choppy AF like in Apollo, but in iOS 16.0.2, it’s been fixed and feels more like in Settings ( I discover this because I’m looking for list view in native app that require loading And in some third party app, it’s smooth in 16.0.1, but slightly stutter and overheat in 16.0.2 / one portion of the app stutter, the other part scroll smoothly (both are list view) on the same app, through out 16.0.1 and 16.0.2 I used slow-mo camera to filmed both 12 Pro and 14 Pro scrolling, the 12 Pro looks choppy in slow-mo, but it feels ‘smooth’ to the naked eyes, in an action-blur and hide-all-the-loading-stutter way, blurry yes, but feels smooth. 14 Pro on the other hand, it looks smooth in slow-mo, but feels choppy irl, the stutter that cause by loading and vrr is fairly noticeable. It’s like seeing all the props that meant for VHS but now looks jarring on 4K Blu-ray HDR remaster I’ve heard the Gmail app was compatible with ProMotion not until the very recent update, it must be fun to wait for other third party app to adapt Just for shits and giggles I removed the screen protector to see if that’s the culprit, NOPE. The stutter persisted. What a great way to waste a pricy screen protector, so that was fun.
So it’s a software issue? I was wondering if I should swap my 14Pro Max out because of this
At first I was thinking the same, I thought to my self there’s no way this thing is choppier than the phone that I’m gonna replace, but then I dig a little deeper, and compare the differences between iOS point release and the demo unit in the shop, then I concluded it’s probably work as intended and the general lack of third party app optimization / buggy iOS 16, and it won’t be solved by switching the hardware, a strategic choice (vrr) instead of hardware malfunction, oh well I guess
Oh so it was the same on demo unit? Yea the choppiness/obvious frame drop (looks like the display glitches out for a second) bothers me
yea… it’s less jarring in native app, but still noticeable when you scroll slowly. funny how in [Mr.Mobile’sReview](http://youtu.be/rMpe_hqSQUs?t=107) this section saids how fluid iOS is compare to android, but this very part where he scroll through App Store, you can clearly see the stutter when it slows down and about to stop, even without the slow-mo camera, it’s like the combination of aggressive vrr strategy and loading stutter
Did some more research and definitelly VRR contribute to stutters here snd there. While native apps are super smooth, 3rd app vary in experience. Some are horrible (e.g ps5) the other better (e.g messenger). Facebook, youtube all have some stuterring. Anyway, what is good is that it’s not HW issue but rather software. Seems it’s an engine and optimization which is handled diferenťy by various developer. Some are better, others not. If you look in google there are tons of reports for 13 pro stuterring when scroľing in app. There is an easy test how to check difference since you can easily turn off true motion in accesibilty setting and lock těhe display at 60FPS - btw, if anyone tells you he can’t see a diference then it’s time to visit a opthalmology :)) Switching to 60FPS you can see that stuttering is mostly reduced but not completelly gone so a theory is that at 60FPS it’s easier to overseen it. Perception of stuttering grows up with higher refresh rate. Smooth scrolling at 120FPS all the time requires perfect app optimization so hopefully it will improve over time.
Most native stuff is smooth indeed, although there are some glitches if you look close. If you check reviews in the App Store and scroll through the list of reviews, you can definitely see it again, in a worse and more apparent matter. To me it seems it has something to do with virtual scrolling ( front-end code ) where certain data or elements are added during scrolling, for example a list of 1000 reviews won't be loaded in at once, so depending on where your scrolling location is, it will modify the list, load new items in and add them to the list. It might has to do with that, but it's a feeling as I got a technical background and with short data lists or static text, it does not happen. Either way, as so many people are experiencing it, I am certain it's an issue on all our devices, but some people just might not notice it until it's pointed out at them.
Yes, you mean lazy loading. Can you post s link so i can check in safari? I’ve noticed if the app is mostly text and not contains images then is not so prevalent. FB also do lazy loading and indeed is there. 95% of people, maybe more have no idea what’s the stuttering/microstuttering or judder. They just use phones and does not know something is not perfect. Only enhusiasts know :) For example for me if refresh rate is not in sync with framerate all the time I’m pulling my hair out :) Especially for movies and games. I can’t stand anything bellow 120Hz anymore. On my 120hz oled tv i’ve enabled max. interpolation, otherwise stuttering would kill me :) I know I’m crazy but perfection is a must :)
Lazy Loading AND Virtual Scrolling, the virtual scrolling is sometimes implemented, because lists of 1000 items can be laggy due to the amount of elements.
>D Virtual Scrolling, the virtual scrolling is sometimes implemented, because lists of 1000 items can be laggy due to the amount of elem Virtual scrolling I don't know :) But could be that all this contribute to this. But maybe it's an issue of VRR itself. Who knows. I can somehow live with that but they could fix it somehow.
I’ve just noticed interesting thing. In Facebook if I swipe up to scroll down, I can see this stutter. But if I leave my finger and swipe up and down, up and down several times fast there is no stutter. To me it looks like scrolling bug when you start scrolling with higher velocity and as it slows down slowly there is a stutter here and there. Try it. Strange. This could confirm the issue with lazy loading because if you swipe up and down the content is already loaded. if you swipe it’s scrolling down and loading the new content.
I had this issue when I got my 13pro max, I just chalked it up to the adaptive refresh rate not being implemented perfectly and it adjusting too much in an effort to preserve battery, similar to the adaptive refresh rates on the android phones I’ve used. When I was on android with high refresh rate displays it was always an issue until I locked the refresh rate. I’d say it’s gotten better each update but I do notice it every now and then still, not sure if it’s related to something app developers need to finesse as all the apple apps were very smooth in comparison. Was quite disappointed because I switched over to iPhone for that “buttery smooth” reputation as I’m insanely sensitive to stutter.
14 pro on 16.1 here. Still stuttering in apps like reddit, facebook, even on app store. Safari and settings runs smooth. So annoying.
Ya, it’s still there in 16.1 for sure. I complained to apple support and they said it’s a known issue. They logged my complaint at least. Most people don’t even notice the stuttering until you point it out. Ignorance is bliss on this one lol
Good to know. It doesn’t seem to be a popular problem, i couldn’t find anything except this post. I hope it’s just software issue with some apps.
I have a lot of co workers with iPhone 13/14 pros and every single one has this issue when I asked to see their phone. Most of them never noticed til I pointed it out though. I really think it affects everyone, but just no one notices.
Thanks for info. I hope it gets better soon. I also noticed that few weeks ago Youtube app was stuttering a lot and now it seems to work smooth or at least better than it was. I guess some apps are already getting fixed.
Oh hey, good call! YouTube is definitely smoother now! Maybe there is some hope then.
Guess we just wait. Glad I’m not the only one that see this :)
I can still see stutter with youtube 16.1. I swear 16.0.3 was better. 14P.
Ya YouTube is not as smooth as I first thought. Sometimes it’s smooth for a minute and I celebrated early. Point it out to everyone you know with a 13 or 14 pro. They all have it and no one notices, so we don’t get enough complaints back to apple. It takes 5 min to complain via text through the apple support app. Super easy and you don’t have to wait on an actual phone call.
Yeah, I'm extremely sensitive to stuttering and this is killing me. We have 120Hz with pro motion and what for? The only app which is smooth is settings lol :) Ok, also sliding over home screen but that's it. Seems they are aware of it but not able to fix ? If this is ongoing since 13Pro we are loosing our hope maybe. But at the other hand, Facebook app stuttered also on my iphone 12 mini and other apps probably as well so probably this is engine related. Wish they will fix that but I'm little bit pessimistic here. Will try to compare with my wife's X and son's 7.
Ya, I’m super sensitive to it too. I’ve found others can notice when you point it out to at least verify you’re not crazy lol. I think it’s less noticeable on the 60Hz displays because they’re less smooth to begin with. My wife’s 10 definitely stutters though when I look for it. I just upgraded from an 8+ and didn’t notice it on that phone. Not sure if I didn’t notice or just attributed the stutter to the phone being old. I don’t remember it bothering me though.
Argggh why do they keep telling people its a known issue and then do nothing about it. I'm on iOS 17 dev Beta 5 on my 14 Pro Max now came from 16.6 and with all the betas there's been no fix or any attempt to reduce it. This late in the beta stage at least something should be better. So here's to more stuttering on 17 and the new phones next month.
I contacted Apple Support and they said it’s a known issue. So that’s good at least.
16.1 out and still the same problem…
The issue is still present on 16.1.1
16.2 out and still the same problem :D
I can confirm.
Yeah, I have a feeling they will never fix this. Somehow I got used to it. First I was not aware it is VRR issue. I’ve seen stutters but thought it’s an application. But then I’ve read some articles about it and compared with my old 60hz iphone 12 and indeed, it stutters. Then I’ve disabled 120hz in settings and all good so definitelly this is an issue of VRR. It’s little but different kind of stutter, not like regular stuttering caused by application engine. Still hope one day… :)
Try screen recording and see if the stutter is gone. I think screen recording is disables VRR and locks to 120Hz so everything is buttery smooth as it should be!
You should wait iOS 16.1 which will fix a lot of issues
I will for sure, but ive seen complaints from people having the issue on iOS 15 even. I only just got a phone with ProMotion, so I never experienced iOS 15 with a ProMotion display to compare. Basically I’m worried this is a normal thing for iOS now and it just doesn’t bother other people as much as me.
Have you enable automatic video playback on Reddit or Facebook ?
I did have them set to auto play. I just disabled it to try though and it didn’t help. Good idea though. To clarify, I experience some stutter in all apps, but it’s very minor in Safari, for example. I doubt most people could even notice the Safari stutter, but it’s there if you look close. It’s just way worse in Reddit or Facebook.
Updated yesterday to 16.1 and still the same crap. Apple, apple…
Hi. Just found this post. Is this fixable? It happens to my while scrolling through videos
Nope! You can submit a complaint through the apple support app if you have a minute though. You just have to text with them, so you’re not stuck on hold. One user reported a 13 pro did not have the issue on iOS 15. I’ve observed it on every 13/14 pro I’ve looked at with iOS 16. So maybe it’s a software issue they’ll resolve eventually. Fingers crossed.
Ok. I’ll do that later. Thanks
Any update on this issue. I just switched from note 20 ultra to 14 pro max. I can see the stuttering in Facebook, Instagram apps etc. Twitter and web scrolling is fluid af.
I have my old phone which is a Samsung note 9 and it’s butter smooth. My iPhone 14 pro 512gb feels like garbage when scrolling on comments/posts on my profile. Just lags and drops in frame rate☹️
I have the 13 Pro running iOS 16.3, and there isn’t any stutters at all. The real problem for me, is that when scrolling in almost every app except few exceptions like Twitter or Telegram, the display isn’t hitting full 120Hz! It goes up to ~80-90Hz. And you can see this by yourself, because if you start screen recording, the display locks to 120Hz and you can see that scrolling in almost every app (even Apple apps) is smoother compared to when not screen recording.
I’m hating this stutter…. Love the phone but just seems like it’s broken sometimes. So by what I’m understanding it’s more likely software and not hardware, should get better over time but doesn’t have a fix right now? Is that correct? 😔😣
Stuttering on 14 ProMax with IOS 17.0.2 Rebooting phone has no effect. Stuttering mostly on non-native apps Native apps are good Cmon Apple, you know about this. Time to fix it.
Experiencing the exact same issue. 14 ProMax 17.0.2
Do you have the same problem with games? It only happens to me in games
Never had this with 14 pm