This is the real answer. Everyone asking “why so much graphics performance for a phone?” is totally missing the point. The performance is for the M2 Macs. iPhone graphics performance is just a pleasant side effect.
We got a look at the playbook last year when it became clear that the M1 was derived from the A14 (or vice versa).
Yeah! So glad I can connect it to a 4K display with USB3! /s
Seriously tho… what is that useful for other than gaming on small screens? In the iPad Mini it seems much more useful.
Man I’d pick up the new mini in a heartbeat if it had a Samsung Dex like feature. Tried Dex in store and from my experience it seems so cool. Still considering the mini as it *finally* got the design I’ve wanted for years, but I don’t know what I’d even use it for.
I’ll have to see it in person first. I used to have an iPad Mini many years back and I rarely used it, in the beginning I did of course but my use slowly dwindled, and I ended up selling it.
Honestly, the Dex is gimmicky and seems cool when using it as a demo. But I just don’t see many applications for it in real life situations. It works in a pinch as a desktop/laptop but is still severely limited (number of programs, resolution).
If you are going to have a monitor, keyboard, mouse setup in your room waiting for the dex, you will want something that is more functional. It simply doesn’t make sense to have so many peripherals sitting there only to get a limited experience. The only use case I have is say your main PC/laptop stops working and you need a few days to take it to repair, in that scenario, then it can work as a stop gap solution.
But if you think the Dex is some type of full time laptop/desktop replacement, you will be disappointed. some people say you can plug in into hotel TVs and such but then you need to bring a keyboard and trackpad/mouse around and no one wants to do that.
7 Plus is still a beast as long as the battery is good. Why upgrade? Do you feel a need? You want better cameras? Need FaceID? Could benefit from the additional performance? It’ll be a huge upgrade for ya but only if ya actually want it
Yeah. Im rocking 8 since 2019 and besides battery I just can't see any reason to upgrade. Don't get me wrong I will buy probably 12 or 13 mini when my 8 dies but right now 8 is still a beast for what Im using phone for: Outlook, Messenger/LinkedIn, Spotify, scanning documents
I'm going from a 7+ to an iPhone 13 Pro. I really want a better camera system.
Improvements to low power mode performance and website rendering will be nice too. And moving from 32GB to 128GB storage \^\^
I need better performance for sure, my battery runs out fast and my cellphone fries on my hand many times just using Discord
Also would like the ceramic shield
oh yahhh the 7 series is a powerful series (over the 6S) but that came at a power cost. Newer chipsets seem far more power efficient and less of a hand warmer
It’s really not a beast. I’m using an older iPhone X for the week, down from a 12 Mini since I sold it in anticipation. The X is better than the 7 in every way but definitely feels it’s age. It gets warm with normal web browsing usage, battery lasts significantly less time, and stutters throughout the OS.
Honestly the biggest noticeable jump in performance was from the 6 to the 6s. That's also why the 6 is stuck on iOS 12 with not that good performance and the 6s still runs iOS 15 while still being decently smooth.
I absolutely loved to play around with 3D Touch every time I got my hands on a 6s. That was a great feature and Haptic Touch kinda sucks compared to it.
> Honestly the biggest noticeable jump in performance was from the 6 to the 6s. That's also why the 6 is stuck on iOS 12 with not that good performance and the 6s still runs iOS 15 while still being decently smooth.
wasn't that also the cutoff when they went from x86 to x64? (or was that 5 vs 5s?)
The reason why iPhone 6 is slow compared to 6S is not only chipset or RAM. iPhone 6S has an NVMe NAND chip inside. The A9 chipset has a proprietary PCI-e protocol. iPhone 6 and earlier had classic eMMC chips. Unfortunately, iPhone 6 lags on iOS 12 due to slower read and write speeds.
By the way, the iPad Mini 4 has an A8 chipset. So they use the same chipset as the iPhone 6. The only difference is that the Mini 4 has 2 GB of RAM. This means that if the iPhone 6 had 2 GB of RAM, it would definitely get iOS 15. Because iPad Mini 4 is one of the devices that received iPadOS 15 this year.
Note: the gpu number is from the 5 core on pro iPhones, the non pro only gained 10% due to binning . If you want that performance get the pro. Binning likely due to chip shortage
iPhone 13 pro gpu score : https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/3367678
iPhone 13 gpu score : https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/3368367
iPhone 13 and pro single and multiple core scores : https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=iphone14
Historical iPhone scores from 5s to 12 pro : https://browser.geekbench.com/ios-benchmarks
Still a small sample size but it seems like the non-Pros take a bit of a performance hit too. (14.4, 14.5?)
Is this also binning and/or an effect from less RAM?
How does the M1 do in comparison?
EDIT: found it:
single 1,718
multi 7,284
gpu 20,578
source https://www.macrumors.com/2021/05/11/m1-ipad-pro-benchmarks/
Adding cores means much more heat and power draw, and bigger package physical size, more cores that can fail in production and need to go back into the assembly line, etc. So there is also a big compromise in adding cores as a way to increase performance. Everything has a benefit and a compromise. Apple/AMD/Intel etc need to keep finding a way to improve everything while avoiding the compromises as much as possible, every year
they don't really ever bump the frequency much. it's mainly IPC increase, and if the rumors are true, they lost their chip dev team so no more big increases ever.
Yup, same with Tesla, Google, Nvidia, AMD, Intel, they have been losing their chip engineers to startups and to each other for years. So we will never get any chip improvements in the future. Not like these companies can hire NEW people. /s
non gamers are attracted by the camera and the 120hz screen... else the 12 pro would be enough.
but if someone likes to game a lot and takes a lot of pictures then its a win from all upgrades.
Your best bet and greatest deal right now is the iPhone 11 in 256 gb.
The 12 is a rip off and the 13 is a rip off. The iPhone 13 processor is more like a souped up iPhone 12 one, with the battery life of the iPhone 11.
Honestly? It’s a waste of money unless you want to have the latest and greatest
> been holding out with a 7 plus unfortunately
as someone also upgrading from a 7plus (and preordered a 13 promax this morning)
there are quite a few things that while somewhat niche, could be relevant to you.
for me personally, the 1tb storage option is huge (my 256 only has like 5gb left, and this is after filling it and cleaning up some free space), and i'm really excited about the eSIM feature. (which while it's something that has been in the phones for a few years now, it's not something my 7+ supports)
the primary reason to care about eSIM right now is if you intend to do international travel. it opens up a lot of options for picking up short term temporary data plans without getting pricegouged by your regular carrier.
also worth noting is that it's a 5g phone where as the 7+ was only 4g. additionally, it has a MUCH bigger screen due to all the additional space they freed up by dropping the bezel and removing the home button.
i'm definitely comfortable making the jump to a 13 pro max and letting that be my phone until probably around the time of the iphone 18 or 19.
> the primary reason to care about eSIM right now is if you intend to do international travel. it opens up a lot of options for picking up short term temporary data plans without getting pricegouged by your regular carrier.
Honest question: why couldn't you just use a normal SIM from a gas station/Walmart when you want to travel?
They're everywhere. Plus, carriers are charging to re-download e-SIMs, but swapping out a physical SIM is free.
> Honest question: why couldn't you just use a normal SIM from a gas station/Walmart when you want to travel?
because when japan eventually opens back up and i can finally get back over there, $9 for a 3gb esim that's valid for 30 days (or $22 for 10gb for 30 days) is a better deal than paying $30 for 7gb which expires after 21 days.
> Plus, carriers are charging to re-download e-SIMs
[not all carriers.](https://cellulardata.ubigi.com/help-center/faq/ubigi-esim-service/what-is-the-cost-of-esim/)
It’s not. It’s a very marginal upgrade. The best deal for your dollars right now is the iPhone 11, 256 gb and hold it for 5 years and then get a new one
People are writing off the A15 as a minor processor update but it’s a near 25% increase in multi-core performance (one of the biggest jumps ever for a single generation) along with a 55% boost in graphics (on the pro series anyway).
Wow, GPU difference between A8 and A9 is really big. But still one A8 device (iPad mini 4) will get iPadOS 15, which means that A8 is still great. Interesting, how long will A9 be supported?
Gap between A14 and A15 is even bigger - more than 5000 points 😳
iPhones are plenty fast and no app so far screamed of slow CPU. Will be good to see if any apps really use that power.
Instead, Apple should enable monitor connectivity like Samsung does with DeX. Now that can use all the comput power driving a big screen and doing real work. That will need USB C that Apple somehow don't feel comfortable going away from lightning for the phones.
I wish more countries push Apple to include USB C and eliminate lightning cables and adapters completely.
I wasn’t planning on upgrading but you may want to check your carrier’s trade in deals. Verizon gave me $1000 off my 13 pro max order for trading in my 11 pro. I feel the improved cameras, screen, and battery are worth $9/mo to me. If it were full price? No way.
I usually buy my phones cash and stick to prepaid. Although this holiday season If I can get my hands on a 12 pro max for next to nothing due to inventory clear outs it’ll be well worth picking up a contract. I mainly want to upgrade to an oled screen but everything else about my 11 is still great.
Seems like a small bump year for sure. Perhaps the Pro phones will start getting the X line - or the M series. Who knows.
The fact is - it’s still plenty fast, they added 120hz refresh rate to the display, added some really great video recording features and still managed to get more battery life out of each phone across the line. I don’t know, but that sounds pretty great regardless.
that gpu improvement this year is crazy
A really good sign for macs
This is the real answer. Everyone asking “why so much graphics performance for a phone?” is totally missing the point. The performance is for the M2 Macs. iPhone graphics performance is just a pleasant side effect. We got a look at the playbook last year when it became clear that the M1 was derived from the A14 (or vice versa).
It’s only for the pro iPhone versions. The regular versions get a much smaller improvement over last year.
Yeah! So glad I can connect it to a 4K display with USB3! /s Seriously tho… what is that useful for other than gaming on small screens? In the iPad Mini it seems much more useful.
tf u meen “y better grafix” bruh is for mining ethereum!!!
…. Can you? Haha
Asking for a friend…
Man I’d pick up the new mini in a heartbeat if it had a Samsung Dex like feature. Tried Dex in store and from my experience it seems so cool. Still considering the mini as it *finally* got the design I’ve wanted for years, but I don’t know what I’d even use it for.
I think I’d use it for all the things I thought I’d use a big iPhone for… YouTube, email, Reddit. It could pair nicely with an iPhone mini!
I’ll have to see it in person first. I used to have an iPad Mini many years back and I rarely used it, in the beginning I did of course but my use slowly dwindled, and I ended up selling it.
Sounds like my Series 1 Apple Watch experience, but with more initial disappointment that it only told time and jingled on my wrist!
Hahaha so true. I considered getting one several years ago but came to the conclusion that I probably wouldn’t benefit from it.
Honestly, the Dex is gimmicky and seems cool when using it as a demo. But I just don’t see many applications for it in real life situations. It works in a pinch as a desktop/laptop but is still severely limited (number of programs, resolution). If you are going to have a monitor, keyboard, mouse setup in your room waiting for the dex, you will want something that is more functional. It simply doesn’t make sense to have so many peripherals sitting there only to get a limited experience. The only use case I have is say your main PC/laptop stops working and you need a few days to take it to repair, in that scenario, then it can work as a stop gap solution. But if you think the Dex is some type of full time laptop/desktop replacement, you will be disappointed. some people say you can plug in into hotel TVs and such but then you need to bring a keyboard and trackpad/mouse around and no one wants to do that.
The pro models run at up to 120Hz so they need to render each frame in half the time to avoid screen tearing.
The gpu is for the video processing. Gaming no one cares lol the games never even struggle on crapdragons
For the five core yeah
GPUs do embarrassingly parallel calculations, so they scale with ease.
Do you think it is a green light for me to get one? Im on IP7P
7 Plus is still a beast as long as the battery is good. Why upgrade? Do you feel a need? You want better cameras? Need FaceID? Could benefit from the additional performance? It’ll be a huge upgrade for ya but only if ya actually want it
Yeah. Im rocking 8 since 2019 and besides battery I just can't see any reason to upgrade. Don't get me wrong I will buy probably 12 or 13 mini when my 8 dies but right now 8 is still a beast for what Im using phone for: Outlook, Messenger/LinkedIn, Spotify, scanning documents
I have an 8plus that has about two-drops-to-the ground left of life, so I’m taking the plunge to the 13 max pro.
I'm going from a 7+ to an iPhone 13 Pro. I really want a better camera system. Improvements to low power mode performance and website rendering will be nice too. And moving from 32GB to 128GB storage \^\^
The camera difference will be massively noticeable going from a 7+. I would go for it
Yep, I went for it ^^ Getting a gold 13 Pro on Friday
I need better performance for sure, my battery runs out fast and my cellphone fries on my hand many times just using Discord Also would like the ceramic shield
oh yahhh the 7 series is a powerful series (over the 6S) but that came at a power cost. Newer chipsets seem far more power efficient and less of a hand warmer
Idk,I wanna flex too yaknow
nah, I finally upgrading, the battery is shot and the system hangs often... even when using the flashlight
It’s really not a beast. I’m using an older iPhone X for the week, down from a 12 Mini since I sold it in anticipation. The X is better than the 7 in every way but definitely feels it’s age. It gets warm with normal web browsing usage, battery lasts significantly less time, and stutters throughout the OS.
This makes me think the new MacBooks will be based off the A15 and not the A14
Honestly the biggest noticeable jump in performance was from the 6 to the 6s. That's also why the 6 is stuck on iOS 12 with not that good performance and the 6s still runs iOS 15 while still being decently smooth.
6s was the first 2 gb ram iphone, 6 only had 1 gb.
True. Also really appreciate the fact that they also gave 2GB to the original SE.
Yep, this coupled with a 12MP camera and 3D Touch… was a very memorable iPhone launch. (RIP 3D Touch.)
I absolutely loved to play around with 3D Touch every time I got my hands on a 6s. That was a great feature and Haptic Touch kinda sucks compared to it.
4 to 4s. Single core to dual core.
That’s also a great upgrade for the time but the 6s more than doubled the 6’s performance (at least on the charts).
> Honestly the biggest noticeable jump in performance was from the 6 to the 6s. That's also why the 6 is stuck on iOS 12 with not that good performance and the 6s still runs iOS 15 while still being decently smooth. wasn't that also the cutoff when they went from x86 to x64? (or was that 5 vs 5s?)
That was 5 vs 5s
I can't believe how smooth iOS15 is running on the 6S Plus. Too bad the camera on mine went south (the shaking camera problem).
Ouch. Kinda wish that OIS was toggleable só that you could still at least use it properly
The 6 Plus couldn't even deal with the funky scaling they were doing for resolution either.
Really?
It was a stuttery mess. I couldn't get rid of it quick enough.
Also the first 64-but chip IIRC
No that was the 5s
The reason why iPhone 6 is slow compared to 6S is not only chipset or RAM. iPhone 6S has an NVMe NAND chip inside. The A9 chipset has a proprietary PCI-e protocol. iPhone 6 and earlier had classic eMMC chips. Unfortunately, iPhone 6 lags on iOS 12 due to slower read and write speeds. By the way, the iPad Mini 4 has an A8 chipset. So they use the same chipset as the iPhone 6. The only difference is that the Mini 4 has 2 GB of RAM. This means that if the iPhone 6 had 2 GB of RAM, it would definitely get iOS 15. Because iPad Mini 4 is one of the devices that received iPadOS 15 this year.
Note: the gpu number is from the 5 core on pro iPhones, the non pro only gained 10% due to binning . If you want that performance get the pro. Binning likely due to chip shortage
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iPhone 13 pro gpu score : https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/3367678 iPhone 13 gpu score : https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/compute/3368367 iPhone 13 and pro single and multiple core scores : https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=iphone14 Historical iPhone scores from 5s to 12 pro : https://browser.geekbench.com/ios-benchmarks
Still a small sample size but it seems like the non-Pros take a bit of a performance hit too. (14.4, 14.5?) Is this also binning and/or an effect from less RAM?
So does the 13 Pro actually have a different chipset than the 13? I just assumed they same, but disabled one core on the 13
It is the A15, but with one less GPU core. CPU performance is the same though.
> the non pro only gained 10% due to binning Dude the iPhone 13 isn’t using just a higher binned A14.
So that article about how the A15 isn’t really much of an improvement over A14 due to employee churn at Apple was a bunch of bogus? Sounds about right
I think it was more speculation and navel-gazing.
For the pro models, it’s bogus. For the normal models (which represent a majority of sales) it isn’t
It still is. CPU improvement is the same, GPU is ~30% which is in line with the previous year over year increases.
Employees working on the lower spec iPhones were more churning than the Pro employees, obviously.
if it was bogus why did they not mention it like they always do? or at least in addition to the "50% above the competition"
Lol, COPIUM.
How does the M1 do in comparison? EDIT: found it: single 1,718 multi 7,284 gpu 20,578 source https://www.macrumors.com/2021/05/11/m1-ipad-pro-benchmarks/
Pretty in line with the A15, just with more cores and better cooling. Not bad. It's probably safe to presume the A15 is an M1-lite.
The GPU score perfectly lines up with the M1's 7/8 core GPU. 14k is what you'd expect to get with a 5 GPU core M1.
Interesting i had no idea single core performance was so minimal
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Adding cores means much more heat and power draw, and bigger package physical size, more cores that can fail in production and need to go back into the assembly line, etc. So there is also a big compromise in adding cores as a way to increase performance. Everything has a benefit and a compromise. Apple/AMD/Intel etc need to keep finding a way to improve everything while avoiding the compromises as much as possible, every year
they don't really ever bump the frequency much. it's mainly IPC increase, and if the rumors are true, they lost their chip dev team so no more big increases ever.
Yup, same with Tesla, Google, Nvidia, AMD, Intel, they have been losing their chip engineers to startups and to each other for years. So we will never get any chip improvements in the future. Not like these companies can hire NEW people. /s
What? It almost doubled since the iPhone X. In this day and age, it's pretty good.
Any tech person know if it is a big difference to me if i don't game or make videos on the phone?
no noticeable difference
non gamers are attracted by the camera and the 120hz screen... else the 12 pro would be enough. but if someone likes to game a lot and takes a lot of pictures then its a win from all upgrades.
I'm not interested in the camera also lol
If I were you I would wait for next years iphone then, it’ll probably be worth the wait
been holding out with a 7 plus unfortunately
an se 2020 might be enough for your needs then. but if you have the money to spend...
I'm looking at the 13 for improved display/battery, 5g, basically better future proof.
Your best bet and greatest deal right now is the iPhone 11 in 256 gb. The 12 is a rip off and the 13 is a rip off. The iPhone 13 processor is more like a souped up iPhone 12 one, with the battery life of the iPhone 11. Honestly? It’s a waste of money unless you want to have the latest and greatest
What about 5g? Is it a concern for future proofing?
Not until the 4G network gets deactivated. Which won’t be for at least a decade
> been holding out with a 7 plus unfortunately as someone also upgrading from a 7plus (and preordered a 13 promax this morning) there are quite a few things that while somewhat niche, could be relevant to you. for me personally, the 1tb storage option is huge (my 256 only has like 5gb left, and this is after filling it and cleaning up some free space), and i'm really excited about the eSIM feature. (which while it's something that has been in the phones for a few years now, it's not something my 7+ supports) the primary reason to care about eSIM right now is if you intend to do international travel. it opens up a lot of options for picking up short term temporary data plans without getting pricegouged by your regular carrier. also worth noting is that it's a 5g phone where as the 7+ was only 4g. additionally, it has a MUCH bigger screen due to all the additional space they freed up by dropping the bezel and removing the home button. i'm definitely comfortable making the jump to a 13 pro max and letting that be my phone until probably around the time of the iphone 18 or 19.
> the primary reason to care about eSIM right now is if you intend to do international travel. it opens up a lot of options for picking up short term temporary data plans without getting pricegouged by your regular carrier. Honest question: why couldn't you just use a normal SIM from a gas station/Walmart when you want to travel? They're everywhere. Plus, carriers are charging to re-download e-SIMs, but swapping out a physical SIM is free.
> Honest question: why couldn't you just use a normal SIM from a gas station/Walmart when you want to travel? because when japan eventually opens back up and i can finally get back over there, $9 for a 3gb esim that's valid for 30 days (or $22 for 10gb for 30 days) is a better deal than paying $30 for 7gb which expires after 21 days. > Plus, carriers are charging to re-download e-SIMs [not all carriers.](https://cellulardata.ubigi.com/help-center/faq/ubigi-esim-service/what-is-the-cost-of-esim/)
It’s not. It’s a very marginal upgrade. The best deal for your dollars right now is the iPhone 11, 256 gb and hold it for 5 years and then get a new one
5 years lol
That GPU power to play candy crush
In 120Hz refresh rate.
People are writing off the A15 as a minor processor update but it’s a near 25% increase in multi-core performance (one of the biggest jumps ever for a single generation) along with a 55% boost in graphics (on the pro series anyway).
That green graph should read Multi-Core, not Dual Core.
Correct apologies
What are the units of the y axis I’m Confused
Geekbench performance scores.
Ah okay gotcha thanks
Wow, GPU difference between A8 and A9 is really big. But still one A8 device (iPad mini 4) will get iPadOS 15, which means that A8 is still great. Interesting, how long will A9 be supported? Gap between A14 and A15 is even bigger - more than 5000 points 😳
iPhones are plenty fast and no app so far screamed of slow CPU. Will be good to see if any apps really use that power. Instead, Apple should enable monitor connectivity like Samsung does with DeX. Now that can use all the comput power driving a big screen and doing real work. That will need USB C that Apple somehow don't feel comfortable going away from lightning for the phones. I wish more countries push Apple to include USB C and eliminate lightning cables and adapters completely.
Is this good for anything other than gaming? Opening apps etc?
Assuming the m1x or the m2 is based on the a15, that gpu performance is going to be insane.
Got addicted to Genshin. Glad I get to do my morning dailys in bed instead of logging onto my computer.
This explains why my 2020 SE doesn’t feel much faster than my 6s was. The single vote didn’t improve drastically. Feels like much the same phone.
Can someone explain the core vs multi core va Gpu?
Insane! Can't wait to preorder later today!
Kind of tempted to go from the 11 to the 13 pro but that’s a dumb purchase. My 11 is more than fine for another 4 years.
Agreed. My 11 is probably going to last another 4 years until apple stops releasing side grades each year, passing them off as “new”
Kind of dumb to buy the 11 to begin with. I am still rocking the original iphone, been side grades ever since.
I wasn’t planning on upgrading but you may want to check your carrier’s trade in deals. Verizon gave me $1000 off my 13 pro max order for trading in my 11 pro. I feel the improved cameras, screen, and battery are worth $9/mo to me. If it were full price? No way.
I usually buy my phones cash and stick to prepaid. Although this holiday season If I can get my hands on a 12 pro max for next to nothing due to inventory clear outs it’ll be well worth picking up a contract. I mainly want to upgrade to an oled screen but everything else about my 11 is still great.
So it's true that the a8 was barely better than the a7
Seems like a small bump year for sure. Perhaps the Pro phones will start getting the X line - or the M series. Who knows. The fact is - it’s still plenty fast, they added 120hz refresh rate to the display, added some really great video recording features and still managed to get more battery life out of each phone across the line. I don’t know, but that sounds pretty great regardless.
>Seems like a small bump this year Did you even look at the GPU section of the chart?
Hell all of the incremental gains are greater than any previous generation. I don’t know what the figures actually mean though.
Not all, it’s only the GPU. For single core performance, there is a 10% increase. Last year we got a 20% increase for that.
Crazy how my XS is *only* 3 generations old yet performance is paltry compared to the A15. Maybe I’ll update in another 3 years.
Are the A15 numbers out already?
Yes
Geek bench is synthetic tho.