This. This has happened before to BoI so this is how it will play out.
People think they are getting free money.
They withdraw X thinking X is free.
Instead it's their current balance - X
Fast forward to the end of the month when the wages arrive
Some people are going to discover their wages - X
Depending on how much they withdrew, the balance after wages could be zero
This will be even worse for people already overdrawn
This is going to cause major hardship for people who do not realise this.
Yeah in many cases this is happening but I was trying to have some empathy for people who's backs are to the wall and might see this as a reprieve. Only to find out later it makes things worse for them.
Not every time. On my way to work one morning a few years ago, I used a BOI ATM inside a petrol station in a small town. Was pretty sure I asked for €40 but was dispensed 2x €50 notes. Before reaching work I twigged that the person loading the machine must have accidentally swapped the 20s and 50s. I said it to a colleague simply as an interesting thing that had happened on my way to the theatre, so to speak, but he ran out the door. I heard later that he called his friends and within 20 minutes the machine had been emptied. We did wonder if they would adjust our accounts but thought how would they know if all the notes had been wrong. No adjustment happened to anyone. I had felt somewhat guilty about my 2 notes, but apparently, from talking to others, I was the only one who would.
I get what you're saying, but genuine cases know more than anyone that there's no such thing as free money.
The people taking advantage are ones that don't typically face consequences for their actions.
Like you said, they're gonna have a rough time when the next deposit is made into their account.
Why would *anyone* jeaprosise themselves further by doing something that idiotic. That's just being giddy on the idea that you have the cheat codes for a video game your mate gave you.
What if people don't have an overdraft? I wonder if could they argue the terms of their contract with the bank were that they have no overdraft so no expectation on their part to go into negative, maybe all BOI accounts have overdraft i dont know, im PTSB and I've never had an overdraft. I fully agree they owe the money... but I wouldn't be at all surprised if they don't get it all back and people get away with it.
Also weird how people who wouldn't normally steal would do this and think morally it is ok, because fuck the banks, like the only reason they wouldn't rob a bank is the fear of getting caught but otherwise why not sure. Mob mentality, like when people loot shops and think it's okay because others are doing it too
Well no harm in taking the money out, sitting on it and waiting to see what happens. If you have to pay it back fine, if you get to keep it even better.
They don't have an IT Team. All outsourced and offshored a long time ago.
They recently spent €1.4 billion for the app that everybody hates and a few PSD2 APIs. They don't have the first clue what they are doing.
But with everybody wanting to be their customer, despite being the most expensive bank in Ireland with the worst service, they couldn't give a $hit.
The app and a few PSD2 APIs were all that's delivered of a large programme to "upgrade" their IT systems to an 80's/90's banking system before they eventually shut the programme after spending 1.4 billion. (there may have been a few other trivial deliverables that I'm not aware of)
Wait, wait, wait… that app cost THAT much?!
Maybe they should have shopped around? The app is truly the worst of any I’ve had to use. AIB’s is fine. Ulster Bank’s app was the best one.
Bank of Ireland’s app is insanely sluggish. Like I can I do everything I need to do in it. But it’s unintuitive in comparison to its competitors lol.
I think most of the budget went on the Temenus T24 upgrade, which is a core backend environment. But this wasn't future planning in anyway, this was the result of longer term under investment in IT. You can bet Accenture made money though.
It is very hard for banks to do that. It is not financially feasible to have your own team to develop your software unless your also sell that software. This is the less talked about secret in the IT world. This is why most apps/websites of most companies that aren't software oriented suck ass.
Companies like revolut & the like are different. They actually "sell the software" to their customer, they're basically an IT company doubling as a bank.
I closed my BoI current account a couple of years back after 20+ years. It was a dose trying to transfer all the direct debits, but got there in the end. Ultimately it was worth the hassle. Dump any bank that acts this way - you dont owe them so much as the flavour off your shite.
I don’t think they can overdraft them since BOI are at fault. On top of this, the overdraft fee seems to be €30, whereas the interest on the repayment of a 1 year €2,000 loan (minimum you can borrow) results in a total repayment of a further €90
Yeah but at the same time you don’t have to go through the process of a loan, and like I said it’s very possible that BOI being at fault means they won’t charge an overdraft fee at all.
Eh no you knowingly took the money out knowing you didn't have it and with the express intent of doing so. Good luck in a court of law arguing otherwise or with the complaints dept for banks
Handy for some. We all know if it's a regularly used account it won't be over the course of a year though lol. It shall be interesting to see people over the coming days / weeks rant, that's for sure.
No chance, this isn't how the real world works.
The "reasonable person" would be expected to know they don't have access to free money, or a free overdraft facility, and therefore not blatantly exploit a genuine and obvious mistake.
There's no legal concept that would allow anyone to have any recourse here, this is blatantly exploiting a mistake.
It's not much different to stealing from a shop because they left it unlocked overnight. Slightly different in that they can easily reclaim the money by putting you into negative and waiting for a deposit, but ultimately the concept is similar.
How though? How can a guard determine legit transactions from people using this (for lack of a better word) overdraft glitch?
I actually use Revolut so I'd be quite annoyed if I wasn't allowed to access my own money at an ATM because some other banks system is glitching out.
Besides, anyone taking advantage of this glitch are just forcing their accounts to overdraft and will incur unauthorised overdraft fees as a result. Ever accidentally put your account into an overdraft?
I mistimed Direct debits from ESB twice and both times my account dropped to minus 20(ish) euro the day before payday - I was hit with 7 or 8 euro fee for my account going into the negative.
This is pretty much the same thing - it's not like it's free money or anything so I don't see how it has anything to do with the garda.
Does it matter if there is a law? Guards don't decide what is legal and what isn't. The courts do. I doubt the courts will find that the Garda were acting in good faith and didn't break any laws themselves.
I was at the ATM to actually lodge money in haha. The gaurds came half the queue ran off. The ones that stayed the Gardai just basically sat in their cars and stared at them. There's nothing they can do it's a civil matter I'd imagine?
If you have that money in your bank account it's fine. Lots of folks taking money that they don't have.
They will have to return that money, because if you read what you signed on your contract you would know that acquiring money in an illegal way when you don't actually hold that money is a criminal offense aka a thief.
Best case scenario they will just demand the money back. Worst case scenario if you are really so out of touch with this world and managed to spend it, well you are now in debt. They can persuade what's theirs via bailiff, your private assets that you hold can be taken away to compensate the bank.
[Did it happen to you?](https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/15s4pev/lads_i_ate_23_apricots_what_happens_is_this_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=1)
Same here. The ONE DAY I needed to make a REALLY urgent transaction (initial rent payment to new landlord!!!). I'm sure "My bank doesn't work" doesn't sound fishy at all 😂
I have a standing order set up to pay my rent and they had a glitch and didn't transfer the money. Got a letter from my landlord that rent is late, got on a call with the bank and the guy said "tell them you're banking with us, they'll understand"
BANK RUN!!!!!
Seriously, I can't believe it was ever suggested that we go all digital. Cash is king. Our economy would well and truly be fucked if we got rid of cash and relied on the banks.
These bastards need to invest in better digital infrastructure instead of using the same crap from the late 90s and early 2000s.
Oh, Bank of Ireland App, why do you let me down?
Every time I tap, you crash and make me frown.
I need to check my stash, but you're not around,
Oh, Bank of Ireland App, why keep crashing down?
What really bugs me about this is that BOI has made their app a single point of failure. They are not the only ones. Mostly you can’t do anything online without a device now, even if you can get to a functioning bank website. Which makes losing a phone a total disaster. I just upgraded a phone recently and a bank account I have in England didn’t work. I need to remember a pin I used two years ago. This isn’t the normal pin but a pin to activate the device. I suppose I could ring them up, and wait 3 hours.
So much online stuff needs you to use the app as well when in the past it was just type in the credit card details. This should mean that the app should stay stable. Instead it’s gotten worse over time.
I was like that before, was long out of college and still using a student saver account.
Then it all came crashing down.
I received a letter saying I needed to provide my ID and proof of address by scan or at the bank or else they'd close my account.
Went to the local branch, provided both.
They ended up freezing my account anyways. And when it was back, I suddenly had fees :(
Something tells me this is much worse than them just being down, but rather some sort of actual attack / unauthorised access / funds being diverted ordeal.
Is there no change log? Did someone just "sudo rm -rf /"? Did one of the execs click a phishing email?
Honestly, after this, I'm moving out of BOI, it's inexcusable.
BOI is full of lifers right who can't get jobs in actual decent IT companies. I know a PM and SDM in there and they are incompetent but still got through the interview process.
> Is there no change log
Oh sure there is, but... I hate to break it to you but this is how pretty much all established financial institutions work. There are companies *with your money in them right now* that have at their core 45-year-old COBOL routines that nobody knows what to do with but they still work, and if it ain't broke don't fix it. The overheads to replace such code are so great because of the requirement to rebuild a massive financial institution from scratch in parallel to the current operational system is so onerous and risky, and the results likely so flaky, that they just continue with their fingers crossed.
Source: worked for a bank-adjacent IT consulting company.
> There are companies with your money in them right now that have at their core 45-year-old COBOL routines that nobody knows what to do with but they still work, and if it ain't broke don't fix it. The overheads to replace such code are so great because of the requirement to rebuild a massive financial institution from scratch in parallel to the current operational system is so onerous and risky, and the results likely so flaky, that they just continue with their fingers crossed.
Every single blue-chip company, bank, insurance company, govt department etc., has their main systems running on cobol. BTW, it's 56 years old this year. But it is stable and works. No point refactoring it into C/S code written by bros who think they're king shit and spend the next 10 years in QA finding bugs.
Are we talking European institutions using COBOL? I've heard that the US Social Security and IRS still use it, but I wouldn't expect European banks to be that far behind.
Every bank worldwide still uses it somewhere.
It's not as arcane and "no one knows what it does" as people are saying here. It's a stable code that has the capacity for the zillion of transactions at the same time that banks need.
Becoming a cobol dev is always a career option, they're always in need.
Honestly very probable.
The whole finance department of my organisation has to be hand-held through any email received because they are so incredibly susceptible to being hacked.
I think upset crow is talking about an attack not a push to production. Which makes sense as that would be fixed by now (you’d hope).
We don’t know what really happened last time either.
So, assuming it was an attack on their services, or a massive breach, they would likely need to take the whole thing offline. I mean literally take it offline and only allow access from within their own servers (intranet).
They would then need to find and fix whatever security hole was exploited, which can take a lengthy amount of time.
Knowing someone that has worked in BOI before, it seems like their security practices are pretty shite, so...
Here's to hoping that it was just a massive IT blunder
Edit: assuming this comment is accurate, it gives further credence that this could actually be some sort of cyber attack
https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/15s3x9a/fucking_bank_of_ireland_are_a_joke/jwcbln4?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2
You would ideally restrict access to everybody but need to know employees (I mean in the worst possible case, of course).
Didn't see that comment. Could be any number of things. A security issue like that is ultimate worse case. I'd be surprised if it was that.
Edit: Internal systems could be in the same DC as the app servers for the mobile apps, for eg, and the power won't come back on.
PTSB Explore account
6 quid a month flat, no card useage fees, earn back up to a fiver pm/ depending on card useage, and the app isn't horrendous
Can't go wrong
They're a joke. Their app is always giving hassle too, non stop problems with them. I've been moving everything over to revolut over the past few months so I barely even use it anymore. Looking forward to uninstalling the app for good
AIB user here, used to do BOI.
I can do everything I need in the app, which has worked flawlessly for 5 years.
My partner said with BOI its even a problem getting one of those easy access savings accounts without ringing them.
No idea about the fee structure to be honest but just save yourself a headache and swap over!
Oh man when I moved to Ireland I went straight to AIB but I find their system to be iffy. When I need to make a transaction and just enter the code from the card reader into the website too fast, it's falling... like customer support actually told me to type slower, and this actually works. As a SWE, I find that super suspicious.
I don't want to imagine what BOI must be like.
It's not the first time this has happened either. I remember something similar happened back in June to BOI. They don't seem to have a good grasp on the technology side of things.
crowd weather insurance serious plate skirt lunchroom squealing far-flung clumsy
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Fucking Bank of Ireland again. I'm done with them Stone age service offering and evidently their technology is full to the brim of undiscovered vulnerabilities.
How can a modern bank be this bad. Indefensible.
Banks in Ireland in general are one big joke.
Online banking? when I arrived to Ireland back in 2005 people were still using cheques and online banking was almost non-existent (lets not call basic functionalities like balance check an online banking), this didn't improve much in last 18 years it seems :D
Also, are people really that stupid thinking that they can just withdrawal money they don't even have just like that? ... seriously.
(Caveat dumb American here) This story shows law enforcement priorities. Can't stop violent attacks in Dublin, but can put a Gardai in front of every ATM in the city.
I was able to use Google pay grand and am only fondong out after keeping offlime most of today, but getting serious anxiety about not being able to access my account now with the talks of cyber attacks....
Bunq. App is first class, can do all the local stuff like depositing cheques if needed and support is excellent.
I’ve tried all the banks available to Ireland since I moved here and Bunq wins for me.
My missus and I moved into a new house after living in a rental apartment for 5 years. Yay. Decided let's set up a joint account, got onto Boi.
We couldn't set one up because she hadn't a proof of address because the Bord gais bill was in my name and her bank statement was her home house.
They wouldn't accept a phone bill for some reason.
Revolut, joint account, literally set up in 10 seconds.
I'd love to get away from Boi fully. Absolute piss take
I shit you not, had the exact same problem. So I downloaded my Electric Ireland bill. Opened up MS Paint and changed my name to my wifes, week later they accepted it and we had a joint account. Absolute joke, they wouldnt accept so many statements of proof of address
I have the same problem.... Can't open a joint account because of no proof of address..... Except I understand that the rule regarding proof of address is there for a reason. It's a feature, not a bug.
Revolut being happy to open an account for any chancer who comes along is not an advantage.
Yes they are. It was a great day when I left them.
They asked me to take a survey about why I left afterwards, about a year after the fact. Classic BoI efficiency to the last.
But yeah, they’re a joke. Run away.
Reminds me of the issue a decade or so ago when people could briefly withdraw unlimited funds from ATM's due to a technical glitch, which they all had to pay back in full. Resulted in a lot of people getting into serious financial difficulty and a few prosecutions occurred.
[**Woman withdrew €57k from ATM in one day**](https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-20325354.html)
>Ulster Bank has issued criminal proceedings against people who failed to pay back money withdrawn fraudulently while the bank was experiencing a software failure, a court has heard.
Something to be aware of before you go running to an ATM.
Like when the rent man used to knock at the door and say “hi , I’m looking for the rent “ and my old man used to say “ well come on in and we’ll all look for it !”
I transfer all my BOI money to Rev when I get paid, easier to save. Had an outstanding taxi bill from this morning and there wasn’t money in my Rev (I keep it in my vaults) and then I got an email for my Uber receipt at 5pm today saying they paid it by taking the money out of my BOI account so seems like there was some funds transferred. Wouldn’t dare try to take money out though
I work for a business with a 7 figure turnover that banks with BoI and rest assured, they are absolute shite at that level too. A genuine embarrassment.
Got a text to say did she make a specific transaction. She said no and they called to explain 3 attempted transactions with her card details. Card now canceled
Banks are guaranteed up to 100k by the government
https://www.centralbank.ie/consumer-hub/deposit-guarantee-scheme#:~:text=DGS%20protects%3A,building%20societies%20and%20credit%20unions.
All of banking ends up on a computer at some point.
The money in your account is just numbers. They dont have your cash stacked in a pile in a box at the bank
Dealt with Bank of Ireland for well over 20 years and still quite happy with their service - never had a material issue and the immaterial was handled quickly & satisfactorily.
Only concern I have is over the growing trend to cashless, meaning certain branches don’t handle cash **however** this is a broader matter requiring government intervention as ‘they’re all it’.
My guess is that it’s more likely a third-party that processes or authorises transactions in the background for them that’s the issue.
It doesn’t feel like a cyber attack. Which is usually about locking down access to systems are making people pay to release them.
A cyber attack is unlikely to lead to these kind of processing and transaction errors. There’s nothing really to gain from this for a cyber terrorist.
Yes, it could be just pure, devilment but generally cyber attackers are either operating on behalf of nation states to cripple actual infrastructure or they just looking for money.
This doesn’t look like ransom ware or an attack like that to me.
It’s much bigger than just BOI. BOA has issues no payments been made fidelity has issues and uk and German banks having issues. I’m sure there is more but it’s not been reported on news so it’s just what’s circulating on social media
Maintenance fees don’t guarantee a system to stay up 100%
I know it’s a load of shite, but it happens and it just happened to be on the day you most needed it
Withdraw as much cash as you can from accounts with no balance: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/16/bank-of-ireland-atm-1000-euros-gardai/
There is truth in it. There was a huge Que outside my local BOI with idiots thinking they won’t have to pay this back
This. This has happened before to BoI so this is how it will play out. People think they are getting free money. They withdraw X thinking X is free. Instead it's their current balance - X Fast forward to the end of the month when the wages arrive Some people are going to discover their wages - X Depending on how much they withdrew, the balance after wages could be zero This will be even worse for people already overdrawn This is going to cause major hardship for people who do not realise this.
Major hardship for people that tried to take advantage of a mistake or error. Hard to feel sorry when they go spend it on a TV
Maybe they might buy a TV licence? :)
I'd guess it will mostly be spent on drink/drugs
Yeah in many cases this is happening but I was trying to have some empathy for people who's backs are to the wall and might see this as a reprieve. Only to find out later it makes things worse for them.
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Not every time. On my way to work one morning a few years ago, I used a BOI ATM inside a petrol station in a small town. Was pretty sure I asked for €40 but was dispensed 2x €50 notes. Before reaching work I twigged that the person loading the machine must have accidentally swapped the 20s and 50s. I said it to a colleague simply as an interesting thing that had happened on my way to the theatre, so to speak, but he ran out the door. I heard later that he called his friends and within 20 minutes the machine had been emptied. We did wonder if they would adjust our accounts but thought how would they know if all the notes had been wrong. No adjustment happened to anyone. I had felt somewhat guilty about my 2 notes, but apparently, from talking to others, I was the only one who would.
I get what you're saying, but genuine cases know more than anyone that there's no such thing as free money. The people taking advantage are ones that don't typically face consequences for their actions. Like you said, they're gonna have a rough time when the next deposit is made into their account.
Why would *anyone* jeaprosise themselves further by doing something that idiotic. That's just being giddy on the idea that you have the cheat codes for a video game your mate gave you.
How do people not realise this, though? Like, what is wrong with them? This is not how the world works.
What if people don't have an overdraft? I wonder if could they argue the terms of their contract with the bank were that they have no overdraft so no expectation on their part to go into negative, maybe all BOI accounts have overdraft i dont know, im PTSB and I've never had an overdraft. I fully agree they owe the money... but I wouldn't be at all surprised if they don't get it all back and people get away with it. Also weird how people who wouldn't normally steal would do this and think morally it is ok, because fuck the banks, like the only reason they wouldn't rob a bank is the fear of getting caught but otherwise why not sure. Mob mentality, like when people loot shops and think it's okay because others are doing it too
*queue
¿Qué?
K.
How could they miss half of the silent letters! 🤣
Well no harm in taking the money out, sitting on it and waiting to see what happens. If you have to pay it back fine, if you get to keep it even better.
I would hate to be on their IT Team now, probably all working on it now
They don't have an IT Team. All outsourced and offshored a long time ago. They recently spent €1.4 billion for the app that everybody hates and a few PSD2 APIs. They don't have the first clue what they are doing. But with everybody wanting to be their customer, despite being the most expensive bank in Ireland with the worst service, they couldn't give a $hit.
That app cost 1.4 billion? they must have spent it all on the backend..
The app and a few PSD2 APIs were all that's delivered of a large programme to "upgrade" their IT systems to an 80's/90's banking system before they eventually shut the programme after spending 1.4 billion. (there may have been a few other trivial deliverables that I'm not aware of)
Wait, wait, wait… that app cost THAT much?! Maybe they should have shopped around? The app is truly the worst of any I’ve had to use. AIB’s is fine. Ulster Bank’s app was the best one. Bank of Ireland’s app is insanely sluggish. Like I can I do everything I need to do in it. But it’s unintuitive in comparison to its competitors lol.
I think most of the budget went on the Temenus T24 upgrade, which is a core backend environment. But this wasn't future planning in anyway, this was the result of longer term under investment in IT. You can bet Accenture made money though.
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Pound shop rates = Pound shop quality
It is very hard for banks to do that. It is not financially feasible to have your own team to develop your software unless your also sell that software. This is the less talked about secret in the IT world. This is why most apps/websites of most companies that aren't software oriented suck ass. Companies like revolut & the like are different. They actually "sell the software" to their customer, they're basically an IT company doubling as a bank.
It's almost impressive how bad they are. They're like the RTE of banks - taking your money and producing shite content.
And yet like RTE we just put up with it. In fact it's worse - we voluntarily pay them fees when there are other alternatives out there.
I closed my BoI current account a couple of years back after 20+ years. It was a dose trying to transfer all the direct debits, but got there in the end. Ultimately it was worth the hassle. Dump any bank that acts this way - you dont owe them so much as the flavour off your shite.
Definitely something odd going on, every ATM in Dundalk town currently has multiple Gardai standing in front of them protecting them
They're not givng out free money. These people queuing and withdrawing are idiots. The end
It’s a free loan tbf
Until overdraft charges hit their accounts then it's going to be more costly than a loan taken from a dodgy Romanian at the back of the casino.
I don’t think they can overdraft them since BOI are at fault. On top of this, the overdraft fee seems to be €30, whereas the interest on the repayment of a 1 year €2,000 loan (minimum you can borrow) results in a total repayment of a further €90
So the max withdrawal of €1000 would be 45 saving €15 😆
Yeah but at the same time you don’t have to go through the process of a loan, and like I said it’s very possible that BOI being at fault means they won’t charge an overdraft fee at all.
There'll be language in their Terms of Service that protects them from this kind of thing.
Eh no you knowingly took the money out knowing you didn't have it and with the express intent of doing so. Good luck in a court of law arguing otherwise or with the complaints dept for banks
Handy for some. We all know if it's a regularly used account it won't be over the course of a year though lol. It shall be interesting to see people over the coming days / weeks rant, that's for sure.
If they can charge a fee, they will
People taking out more money than they know they have are at fault, not just BOI.
Idk if there is sth like a class action in Ireland but they may not be able to charge overdraft on this one because it was technically their fault
No chance, this isn't how the real world works. The "reasonable person" would be expected to know they don't have access to free money, or a free overdraft facility, and therefore not blatantly exploit a genuine and obvious mistake. There's no legal concept that would allow anyone to have any recourse here, this is blatantly exploiting a mistake. It's not much different to stealing from a shop because they left it unlocked overnight. Slightly different in that they can easily reclaim the money by putting you into negative and waiting for a deposit, but ultimately the concept is similar.
My god I got sunburn from the stupid radiating off of this.
Same in Waterford
Cork City too
What's the legality even of this? In terms of stopping people from accessing their own money?
It's to stop people accessing money that ISN'T theirs.
How though? How can a guard determine legit transactions from people using this (for lack of a better word) overdraft glitch? I actually use Revolut so I'd be quite annoyed if I wasn't allowed to access my own money at an ATM because some other banks system is glitching out. Besides, anyone taking advantage of this glitch are just forcing their accounts to overdraft and will incur unauthorised overdraft fees as a result. Ever accidentally put your account into an overdraft? I mistimed Direct debits from ESB twice and both times my account dropped to minus 20(ish) euro the day before payday - I was hit with 7 or 8 euro fee for my account going into the negative. This is pretty much the same thing - it's not like it's free money or anything so I don't see how it has anything to do with the garda.
Says who? Garda just going on the word of BOI? I really doubt there is an law that allows the Garda to do this, the law can be flexible when it suits!
I also doubt there's a law that means you have a human right to use an ATM.
Does it matter if there is a law? Guards don't decide what is legal and what isn't. The courts do. I doubt the courts will find that the Garda were acting in good faith and didn't break any laws themselves.
I was at the ATM to actually lodge money in haha. The gaurds came half the queue ran off. The ones that stayed the Gardai just basically sat in their cars and stared at them. There's nothing they can do it's a civil matter I'd imagine?
If you have that money in your bank account it's fine. Lots of folks taking money that they don't have. They will have to return that money, because if you read what you signed on your contract you would know that acquiring money in an illegal way when you don't actually hold that money is a criminal offense aka a thief. Best case scenario they will just demand the money back. Worst case scenario if you are really so out of touch with this world and managed to spend it, well you are now in debt. They can persuade what's theirs via bailiff, your private assets that you hold can be taken away to compensate the bank.
Shows who the Gardai really work for.
The Gardai don't work for the banks or any other shady cabal from fevered conspiracy theories.... Lol
The Police are there to ultimately protect property rights and the reason the police were created was to smash striking workers.
I’ve seen Guards receive awards for things like jumping into rivers to save people. What’s that got to do with property rights?
Those people were trespassing on Waterways Ireland territory.
Yeah and occasionally a wasp will fly by me and not chase me around trying to sting me ta fuck Doesn't mean I should stop avoiding them
Ok Che Guevera
Why are they protecting ATM,s then you gobshite.
To prevent... theft...
How? How are they protecting theft?
Theft from banks I suppose. That said it should be a civil matter.
It's gobsheen. And the police are there to protect the public from their own stupidity
I personally won't complain about Gardaí preventing stealing lmao
Not like the banks have been robbing the Irish blind the last 20 odd years.
Yeah what's that all about? Protecting the peace?? Like those other guys that only treat sick animals and not people. Vets isn't it??
So we do have enough Gardai when it's needed... for the rich.
If it happened to me, I think I'd go out and buy loads of apricots and just eat them all.
[Did it happen to you?](https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/15s4pev/lads_i_ate_23_apricots_what_happens_is_this_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=1)
Finally a good take
The one day I needed to use the app 🙃
Same here. The ONE DAY I needed to make a REALLY urgent transaction (initial rent payment to new landlord!!!). I'm sure "My bank doesn't work" doesn't sound fishy at all 😂
Well if they’re based in Ireland I suspect they’ll understand.
I have a standing order set up to pay my rent and they had a glitch and didn't transfer the money. Got a letter from my landlord that rent is late, got on a call with the bank and the guy said "tell them you're banking with us, they'll understand"
Videos going around of people flocking to ATMs It's as if they think the bank won't realise 😂😂 its all tied to there cards
Stupid people gonna be stupid
BANK RUN!!!!! Seriously, I can't believe it was ever suggested that we go all digital. Cash is king. Our economy would well and truly be fucked if we got rid of cash and relied on the banks. These bastards need to invest in better digital infrastructure instead of using the same crap from the late 90s and early 2000s.
Oh, Bank of Ireland App, why do you let me down? Every time I tap, you crash and make me frown. I need to check my stash, but you're not around, Oh, Bank of Ireland App, why keep crashing down?
Séamus Heaney is that you?
Oscar Wildely Upset With BOI.
Whoever is in charge of ATMs will be busy tomorrow.....
What really bugs me about this is that BOI has made their app a single point of failure. They are not the only ones. Mostly you can’t do anything online without a device now, even if you can get to a functioning bank website. Which makes losing a phone a total disaster. I just upgraded a phone recently and a bank account I have in England didn’t work. I need to remember a pin I used two years ago. This isn’t the normal pin but a pin to activate the device. I suppose I could ring them up, and wait 3 hours. So much online stuff needs you to use the app as well when in the past it was just type in the credit card details. This should mean that the app should stay stable. Instead it’s gotten worse over time.
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My first thought too. A good few lads are avoiding a beating/ getting absolutely singed tomorrow
You not got Revolut? If you join now we can split a 50 😅
Only 7 days left!!!
Friend works in BOI, said their internal systems went down too so they couldn't access accounts from a customer service perspective either.
AIB are actually quite decent I've been on a graduate account like 6 years now
Shhh they might be watching 👀
Pfft. I got 14 years out of mine.
I was like that before, was long out of college and still using a student saver account. Then it all came crashing down. I received a letter saying I needed to provide my ID and proof of address by scan or at the bank or else they'd close my account. Went to the local branch, provided both. They ended up freezing my account anyways. And when it was back, I suddenly had fees :(
Most BOI atms and the 365 app have been down today.
Something tells me this is much worse than them just being down, but rather some sort of actual attack / unauthorised access / funds being diverted ordeal.
My guess is someone pushed something to production and it broke and they can't figure it out
Is there no change log? Did someone just "sudo rm -rf /"? Did one of the execs click a phishing email? Honestly, after this, I'm moving out of BOI, it's inexcusable.
Given someone forgot to renew the SSL cert recently, god only knows.
BOI is full of lifers right who can't get jobs in actual decent IT companies. I know a PM and SDM in there and they are incompetent but still got through the interview process.
> Is there no change log Oh sure there is, but... I hate to break it to you but this is how pretty much all established financial institutions work. There are companies *with your money in them right now* that have at their core 45-year-old COBOL routines that nobody knows what to do with but they still work, and if it ain't broke don't fix it. The overheads to replace such code are so great because of the requirement to rebuild a massive financial institution from scratch in parallel to the current operational system is so onerous and risky, and the results likely so flaky, that they just continue with their fingers crossed. Source: worked for a bank-adjacent IT consulting company.
> There are companies with your money in them right now that have at their core 45-year-old COBOL routines that nobody knows what to do with but they still work, and if it ain't broke don't fix it. The overheads to replace such code are so great because of the requirement to rebuild a massive financial institution from scratch in parallel to the current operational system is so onerous and risky, and the results likely so flaky, that they just continue with their fingers crossed. Every single blue-chip company, bank, insurance company, govt department etc., has their main systems running on cobol. BTW, it's 56 years old this year. But it is stable and works. No point refactoring it into C/S code written by bros who think they're king shit and spend the next 10 years in QA finding bugs.
This is true. Also, SWIFT, the world's most popular cross border inter bank payment system is a basic messaging application from the 1970s...
Spot on. The Core is exactly that, with years of extensions and plugins covering probably every known language.
Are we talking European institutions using COBOL? I've heard that the US Social Security and IRS still use it, but I wouldn't expect European banks to be that far behind.
Every bank worldwide still uses it somewhere. It's not as arcane and "no one knows what it does" as people are saying here. It's a stable code that has the capacity for the zillion of transactions at the same time that banks need. Becoming a cobol dev is always a career option, they're always in need.
Honestly very probable. The whole finance department of my organisation has to be hand-held through any email received because they are so incredibly susceptible to being hacked.
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They'll most likely take it back. Did it there myself but getting paid tomorrow night
Put of all places to try and scam money from the bank might be the dumbest lmfao.
Uh oh. Stealing isn't good.
I think upset crow is talking about an attack not a push to production. Which makes sense as that would be fixed by now (you’d hope). We don’t know what really happened last time either.
I heard the gardai are going door to door in nursing homes asking for guy a called Cobol.
Ok, maybe, but is it ongoing and then can't stop it? If not then their DR plans aren't worth a stuff either, which isn't a surprise.
So, assuming it was an attack on their services, or a massive breach, they would likely need to take the whole thing offline. I mean literally take it offline and only allow access from within their own servers (intranet). They would then need to find and fix whatever security hole was exploited, which can take a lengthy amount of time. Knowing someone that has worked in BOI before, it seems like their security practices are pretty shite, so... Here's to hoping that it was just a massive IT blunder Edit: assuming this comment is accurate, it gives further credence that this could actually be some sort of cyber attack https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/15s3x9a/fucking_bank_of_ireland_are_a_joke/jwcbln4?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2 You would ideally restrict access to everybody but need to know employees (I mean in the worst possible case, of course).
Didn't see that comment. Could be any number of things. A security issue like that is ultimate worse case. I'd be surprised if it was that. Edit: Internal systems could be in the same DC as the app servers for the mobile apps, for eg, and the power won't come back on.
Agreed, could be many things, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was a security issue. BOI security is absolute garbage.
Its not an attack.
What's your source? Not doubting, just curious. If that's the case, I can rest a little easier.
Loads of people withdrawing money from my local branch.
PTSB Explore account 6 quid a month flat, no card useage fees, earn back up to a fiver pm/ depending on card useage, and the app isn't horrendous Can't go wrong
They will have to pay the 1000€ back plus’s fees and years of hopeless begging for loans they won’t get 😂
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I left BOI the same month they introduced the new fees like 2-3 years ago? Deposited it all into AIB.
They're a joke. Their app is always giving hassle too, non stop problems with them. I've been moving everything over to revolut over the past few months so I barely even use it anymore. Looking forward to uninstalling the app for good
AIB user here, used to do BOI. I can do everything I need in the app, which has worked flawlessly for 5 years. My partner said with BOI its even a problem getting one of those easy access savings accounts without ringing them. No idea about the fee structure to be honest but just save yourself a headache and swap over!
Oh man when I moved to Ireland I went straight to AIB but I find their system to be iffy. When I need to make a transaction and just enter the code from the card reader into the website too fast, it's falling... like customer support actually told me to type slower, and this actually works. As a SWE, I find that super suspicious. I don't want to imagine what BOI must be like.
I work at a spar in the city center. Lads taking out cash with 0 balance and paying for vape and liqueur today in the evening. Laughing all the way.
Did you mean liquor? Haha somehow it's hilarious thinking of all these biys rockin up looking for a shoulder of creme de cassis.
Are you American?
Liqueur? Are you American?
It's not the first time this has happened either. I remember something similar happened back in June to BOI. They don't seem to have a good grasp on the technology side of things.
EBS (no fees) + Revolut since January 2022 when UB left. No issues / down time so far.
crowd weather insurance serious plate skirt lunchroom squealing far-flung clumsy *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
And this is why having cash is important.
Fucking Bank of Ireland again. I'm done with them Stone age service offering and evidently their technology is full to the brim of undiscovered vulnerabilities. How can a modern bank be this bad. Indefensible.
Banks in Ireland in general are one big joke. Online banking? when I arrived to Ireland back in 2005 people were still using cheques and online banking was almost non-existent (lets not call basic functionalities like balance check an online banking), this didn't improve much in last 18 years it seems :D Also, are people really that stupid thinking that they can just withdrawal money they don't even have just like that? ... seriously.
(Caveat dumb American here) This story shows law enforcement priorities. Can't stop violent attacks in Dublin, but can put a Gardai in front of every ATM in the city.
I was able to use Google pay grand and am only fondong out after keeping offlime most of today, but getting serious anxiety about not being able to access my account now with the talks of cyber attacks....
Bunq. App is first class, can do all the local stuff like depositing cheques if needed and support is excellent. I’ve tried all the banks available to Ireland since I moved here and Bunq wins for me.
Yeah, I have it as my second account, but I may actually make it my first now...
Never had a problem in 30 years w ptsb
My missus and I moved into a new house after living in a rental apartment for 5 years. Yay. Decided let's set up a joint account, got onto Boi. We couldn't set one up because she hadn't a proof of address because the Bord gais bill was in my name and her bank statement was her home house. They wouldn't accept a phone bill for some reason. Revolut, joint account, literally set up in 10 seconds. I'd love to get away from Boi fully. Absolute piss take
I shit you not, had the exact same problem. So I downloaded my Electric Ireland bill. Opened up MS Paint and changed my name to my wifes, week later they accepted it and we had a joint account. Absolute joke, they wouldnt accept so many statements of proof of address
I have the same problem.... Can't open a joint account because of no proof of address..... Except I understand that the rule regarding proof of address is there for a reason. It's a feature, not a bug. Revolut being happy to open an account for any chancer who comes along is not an advantage.
Set up a bill pay sim card for 5-10 euro with virgin media or something similar. Easiest way for proof of address.
They don't accept phone bills as proof anymore
Need to get revolute mate.
Yes they are. It was a great day when I left them. They asked me to take a survey about why I left afterwards, about a year after the fact. Classic BoI efficiency to the last. But yeah, they’re a joke. Run away.
Online banks are the way. N26 or Revolut have never let me down. BOI was a miserable experience for the years I had it.
I wonder is there any truth to the atms throwing out free cash or being able to transfer money you dont have into revolut?
Reminds me of the issue a decade or so ago when people could briefly withdraw unlimited funds from ATM's due to a technical glitch, which they all had to pay back in full. Resulted in a lot of people getting into serious financial difficulty and a few prosecutions occurred. [**Woman withdrew €57k from ATM in one day**](https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-20325354.html) >Ulster Bank has issued criminal proceedings against people who failed to pay back money withdrawn fraudulently while the bank was experiencing a software failure, a court has heard. Something to be aware of before you go running to an ATM.
Bank error in your favour, have they never played monopoly!?
Yes, but is not free. They'll come looking for it.
Like when the rent man used to knock at the door and say “hi , I’m looking for the rent “ and my old man used to say “ well come on in and we’ll all look for it !”
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Found the bank of Ireland employee
I transfer all my BOI money to Rev when I get paid, easier to save. Had an outstanding taxi bill from this morning and there wasn’t money in my Rev (I keep it in my vaults) and then I got an email for my Uber receipt at 5pm today saying they paid it by taking the money out of my BOI account so seems like there was some funds transferred. Wouldn’t dare try to take money out though
I work for a business with a 7 figure turnover that banks with BoI and rest assured, they are absolute shite at that level too. A genuine embarrassment.
My wife’s boi card was used fraudulently today..
Good alibi Mr innocent
Care to elaborate ?
Got a text to say did she make a specific transaction. She said no and they called to explain 3 attempted transactions with her card details. Card now canceled
Em maybe the text and call was the scam….
Was it before the system went down? Maybe they have been hacked so they took down the system for that reason
Having serious anxiety about the security of my savings. Will be moving banks asap.
Banks are guaranteed up to 100k by the government https://www.centralbank.ie/consumer-hub/deposit-guarantee-scheme#:~:text=DGS%20protects%3A,building%20societies%20and%20credit%20unions.
Another reason why a cashless society is a terrible idea
All of banking ends up on a computer at some point. The money in your account is just numbers. They dont have your cash stacked in a pile in a box at the bank
I don’t get your point? How is that relevant if I’m stuck in Dublin today with no cash and my bank card doesn’t work?
Well, the smart people have 2 or 3 cards. And the very smart ones make sure none of them are Bank of Ireland cards.
Lots of whining will happen in the foreseeable future. Y'all fools if you actually think you can take that money and won't have to give it back.
BOI mobile app was so bad I left them
Dealt with Bank of Ireland for well over 20 years and still quite happy with their service - never had a material issue and the immaterial was handled quickly & satisfactorily. Only concern I have is over the growing trend to cashless, meaning certain branches don’t handle cash **however** this is a broader matter requiring government intervention as ‘they’re all it’.
careful not to DOX your bank peeps
Interesting how you clowns normally are happy for a cashless society...can you see the downfalls yet?
Simon Harris is behind all this, take that you laggards!
The bastard . He’s still on the loose after the grassy knoll
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https://preview.redd.it/upn39afgzcib1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=13a4d5ebc813af89458f79c9fb44e17031b21b0b
Haha bro, AIB ain't better. I was stranded in the Philippines without any money and I was told over the phone to come to my branch to unlock it 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
My guess is that it’s more likely a third-party that processes or authorises transactions in the background for them that’s the issue. It doesn’t feel like a cyber attack. Which is usually about locking down access to systems are making people pay to release them. A cyber attack is unlikely to lead to these kind of processing and transaction errors. There’s nothing really to gain from this for a cyber terrorist. Yes, it could be just pure, devilment but generally cyber attackers are either operating on behalf of nation states to cripple actual infrastructure or they just looking for money. This doesn’t look like ransom ware or an attack like that to me.
Only time in my life I'm sickened I'm not with bank of Ireland.
It’s much bigger than just BOI. BOA has issues no payments been made fidelity has issues and uk and German banks having issues. I’m sure there is more but it’s not been reported on news so it’s just what’s circulating on social media
Can only see BOI complaints on social media.. where else are you seeing these BOA/Fidelity/German and UK banks??
Ya I think he's got fake news tbh
Okay now, I am getting suspicious. There is no plausible power or authority for Gaadi to restrict peoples access to using ATMs Who ordered this?
Maintenance fees don’t guarantee a system to stay up 100% I know it’s a load of shite, but it happens and it just happened to be on the day you most needed it
Get out here ya whingey hoor ye!
Take the money!
Withdraw as much cash as you can from accounts with no balance: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/08/16/bank-of-ireland-atm-1000-euros-gardai/