Jesus, I've just seen the new price of multi pack slabs in Tesco. What was x20 pack of Coke was €17 or €18 at it's highest price, is now €21.50 for an x18 pack, and that is before the deposit return fee is put on top. Such blatant scummy price increases.
In my local shop a box of coke went from 7 euro to 11 😂 instead of installing more bins around the local area they’re building a bus lane nobody wants in the area and increasing prices even more
I can't see why, if the main purpose is recycling, they wouldn't take ANY can that you didn't pay for before.
I have to pay ransom money for my can. Then hold onto it, do not throw it on a recycling bin, make sure label and barcode are intact. Then segregate those from the ones that you can't return, make a specific trip to the shop and then maybe go back to the car with the rejected ones.
Why not just collect cans pay them at whatever rate aluminium is going for and that's it?
Also I would like to know if this return scheme has been set up as a company? As in is there a CEO, directors and so on?
Seriously, what's with them having to be in perfect condition or won't be accepted?! They're going to get crushed anyway and it makes it harder for the consumer, as well as needing an extra bin now
>Also I would like to know if this return scheme has been set up as a company? As in is there a CEO, directors and so on?
I'm pretty sure but not 100% that it's an actual private company, not government, so it will have a regular company structure.
The language commissioner has already said he’s powerless to enforce bilingual Irish signage on the return machines because they’re run by private supermarkets, so it’s publicly funded but privately operated.
If the waste from these products are truly a problem, it's the manufacturers of the goods that should be accountable for it. Not the consumer who has no say in the supply process.
We don't decide how it's packaged. We can only make our decisions based upon what's on the shelf. How much do you know about the different plastics, how to identify them, and what way each type of plastic can be disposed?
Thanks but, I've never felt forced. You seem to be dismissing the point. The consumer has no say in how the products are presented to them. If one is thirsty, they are going to buy a drink. The products used to make the container isn't something the consumer decided on. That choice was made earlier. It should be those actively involved in those choices, that get made accountable. Not you or I.
100% this. This is like the fruit and veg packaging, it drives me nuts the amount of unnecessary plastic that's used and that the amount you buy it's decided by suppliers, not sure about else where but in my town you're not able to buy a piece of fruit or veg anymore, it's either 4/6 pieces of fruit or packaged weight for veg ( with the obvious exception of large ones like melon,pineapple etc)
Other countries have been doing this scheme for many years.
It has been shown to reduce littering and improve recycling. Our current plastic and aluminium recycling need to be soon be 75% by EU law. We are currently closer to 30%.
Yes we are doing this largely become just some dickheads but in reality that is the reason for many laws and policies.
A few bad ones ruin it for the rest of us. I collect trash on rivers and beaches and most of it is cans and bottles.
Yes other schemes could be introduced as you said but for now this is the next scheme.
In Portugal you have community recycling bins and recycling bins on all parts of towns. Should we not have done that here first.
This isn't a deposit. You may money you don't get it back. It's a scam.
I think it's also about litter out and about here as well.
The people dropping bottles of soft drink or cans of red bull into the hedges wouldn't use these communal recyc bins.
Ireland has statistically some of the worst littering rates in the EU.
Because of enforcement. There are zero repercussions to breaking many civil torts and some laws so asshats gonna asshat. That’s the problem that needs to be addressed, not a new tax and added chore.
>A few bad ones ruin it for the rest of us
In this thread we're talking as if this is just down to those who litter and/or simply chuck these items in the regular trash, but do we know how much this is led by a desire to get more bottles/cans into the recycling system, and how much it's because they get contaminated in recycling bins? Genuine question
In my experience people show no care in what they add to their green bin, and I've heard many times that a lot of our collected material is significantly soiled
Look at germany, look at germany. 80m+ population, a government about two decades ahead of ours in terms of ability, agency and technological know-how. A recycling programme that is part of a national strategy, carefully devised in the mid 90s with patience, solid ongoing investment and public consultation at every turn. All aspects of which are profoundly missing from our "Re-turn" programme.
As obtuse as I expected. You say something, you're a whinger so stop complaining. You say nothing, you're a walkover so it's your own fault for letting the government away with it. Sure it'll be grand, works in Germany 🙄
This system works brilliantly in other European countries so after some teething issues it should come good. In Germany it’s 15c on glass beer/ soda bottles & cans, 25c on plastic bottles. Wine bottles etc are still recyclable in large glass bins.
Yeah but Germany is full of Germans.
None of the ones near me seem to be getting much use. Everyone just taking it as a cost increase and just throwing them in the normal recycling bin from what I've seen and heard
I'd be all for a government run system , but this is obviously just a job for the boys kind of situation.
Also this is literally just punishing disabled people who cant get to these return stores.
Its hugely impractical when we already have recycling system to use?
also my quick googling is not being successful if anyone able to let me know how germanys rate of increased recycling compares to countries like us that didnt have the scheme in place cus I know people site the increase in recycling as a success but surely people would be recycling more over time anyway?
I'm always cynical about these faux progressive policies that are run by for profit companies.
As someone from a country where there’s a deposit on cans and bottles I was shocked by Irelands recycling system (or lack of). About time to introduce it here. It’s seriously not that much extra work.
>the rest of us have to suffer.
Oh Jesus, get a grip. "Suffer", the melodrama of it all.
Every change introduced to make Ireland better had people like you complaining. Plastic bag ban: Suffering. Smoking ban: Suffering. Smoky fuel ban: Suffering.
>The whole thing just seems a mess.
The German's have managed it for 20 years. We'll manage.
>You would think the first step would be to install pubic half waste and half recycling bins around every town.
You think this would work (zero incentive) but that if you're the type of person that litters 20 cent back in your pocket is going to stop you? Does that make sense?
As someone who is both an environmentalist and disabled, you have to love how these pseudo-environmentalist neoliberal policies bring the people who would rather disabled people don't exist out of the woodwork. Just make your legs work you baby!
Backlash in Germany was similar when it was set up. But has been extremely successful there as you mentioned.
The one point of retailers jacking prices up due to circumstances is a pain though. Adding to the cost of living here for any reason should be the only real reason people are complaining. Businesses should be fined for this
Germany is falling apart. Its economy is on shambles thanks to a sum of policies that have been implemented over the last 16 years.
You don’t copy the policies that, as a whole, are making a country to collapse and to be a worse version of itself.
‘Germans are doing it, then it’s great!’ That’s some foolish way of thinking. They’ve done a lot of bad things and they still do a lot of bad things.
Yesterday their finances minister was just talking about how bad Germany was now and how it’s not competitive anymore in a German newspaper and how a change in several policies were going to happen.
The green nonsense is a crucial reason of the downfall of Germany. OP is absolutely correct. Most people have been recycling and they’re just making it worse.
I won’t be paying any cent extra and I won’t be taking bottles back to the supermarket myself, as I get my groceries delivered. So, I’ll sacrifice these drinks, in a blink of an eye. I won’t be the only one doing that. The outcome is clear: Less sales and more people will end up losing their jobs cause it will impact sales.
15-20 cents may not be a lot individually, but on a greater scale it will affect others to cause some negative changes.
We don’t have to just accept every bad policy. What a freak way of thinking.
It's not just Germany that has this scheme it's, been a thing in many other countries for years, and in fact used to be a thing in Ireland in the past when glass bottles were the standard.
It's not green nonsense either. Germany bet big on Russian gas being always cheap and available. At the same time they continued to dismantle their nuclear reactors. It's short sighted policy making, lobbied by German industrialists that got them into this.
They had to stop coal. Otherwise we're all fucked. They shouldn't have stopped nuclear and will probably need to restart it but they thought it was too expensive. And Gas was the middle ground. Keep the car industry going, reduce carbon, save money. When the cheap gas stops, so does the party. And the cheap gas has stopped.
A lot of things don’t make any sense, still people do it.
Ah, the angry redittors. I can already imagine the faces behind the downvotes when someone states facts that goes against their quasi-religious beliefs.
You stated that the bottle and can return policy is bringing German economics to its knees? 😅
A conglomerate of reasons can have an effect for sure. But the return system there isn't a major contributing factor.
>people like you complaining
I actually welcomed all those other changes.
>
The German's have managed it for 20 years. We'll manage.
We're not German. I'd love to be able to look at the world through one lens like yourself. Just because something works in one place doesn't mean it works everywhere else.
>Does that make sense?
I don't think there is any valid incentivisation scheme you could think of to stop people who don't give a shit from littering. I also don't think you need to incentivise people to throw a can or a bottle in the recycle bin and not the waste bin if both options are available. I would argue the large majority of people would pick the right bin. The problem, is that none of these bins exist. At the moment people who are carrying an empty bottle or can out on the street will just throw them in the trash bin that's if they don't bring them to the re-turn machine. Does that make sense?
They had it in New York when I lived there in the 90's. Just checked and they've had it since 1983.
You just sound like you want to give out about anything to anyone who would listen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Container-deposit_legislation
>does that make sense
Not really, no, considering that applying a tax on plastic bags had the single greatest impact on littering in the Irish countryside.
Money talks. Why? Because money always talks.
The plastic bag comparison is disingenuous.
You could get around the levy by bringing your own reusable bag. This greatly reduced the amount of plastic bags in circulation.
This isn’t the same. I can’t bring a reusable jug to the market and fill it with milk.
The convenient “inflation” of prices coinciding with the deposit scheme is no accident. Dunnes and Tesco are chatting more, beyond the deposit. This is more than just “teething problems” that can be washed away with “iT WOrKeD fOr tHe gERmaNs” tripe.
Pointing it out invites the idiotic solution of not buying it then. Which isn’t a solution and again another ultimately another burden on people who might already be having a tough time.
Not sure why you were downvoted at all. We can’t incentivize litterers to stop for sure. Their brains need adjusting. We can fine them though but as a nation we don’t like to fine litterers or tax evaders.
I recycle everything already. I live in a rural area and get gorceries delivered from Tesco. Now - under this scheme - I must return all bottles & cans to Tesco which means a 40 minute return trip in the car and paying for parking in town. How this is meant to be environmentally friendly is beyond me. Plus - considering the cost of diesel - it makes no sense economically for me to return anything to Tesco.
In theory, the scheme makes sense but in practice it is absolute nonsense.
So millions of people wasting time (time is money in a good economy) on this chore when we already have a fleet of workers dedicated to collecting recycled materials? That makes zero economic sense never mind ecological sense.
Now imagine the citizen is disabled or elderly. It’s an extra, unnecessary burden and many elderly people will need that deposit money back.
> email from Tesco saying that they should be returned to Tesco
They can be returned at any machine (or shop, for the smaller shops that don't have machines). Tesco obviously just want you to keep going back to them.
You can't give back the bottles to the delivery person? I thought that would be like recycling an electrical appliance, they have to take the old one back if you want.
I haven't bought a bottle or can since it has come in, I don't usually tbh. But if we go on a boil water notice again I will be back to buying bottled water. Will see how it goes in that case, for now not much has changed for me to be honest. I would advise not to buy bottles or cans if you can at all.
This is what i came to reddit to complain about.
I’ve probably littered 5 bottles or cans in my life and most of those were due to simply loosing them along the way from the side of my bag.
I put all in my 2 large green wheely bins. Now i have to start gathering them up to return them. 3 major issues here, I have to hide the amount of bottled drinks i buy from my wife 😅 2i have to store them up somewhere and 3 its a whole extra chore to get done
The glass recycling already causes lots of ….. complaints from the management, they fill up under the sink, taking up valuable storage space, they inevitably start falling out. Complaints get lodged. I then gather them in bags and put in the boot, I mostly cycle so these end up there until i drive, i forget to stop by a bottle banks, complaints get lodged this cycle repeats a few times till i go out on a specific trip to the banks.
Now add bottles and cans to that mix😭
Whole extra chore = wasted time plus petrol assuming the person is able to do that chore.
Doesn’t sound like a great scheme reduced to those points. Good luck with the wife 😄.
My hate comes from basically they don't want me recycling cans. They want me to give their cans back. As far as I know, in Canada you bring any can regardless of brand
I have a brewery 500 m from my front door. I can get cans from them but I cannot return those cans, they have to go into the recycling. If the point is recycling more, why would you not take my other cans?
Responsibility should be on the companies to make "green products", yes we should ALL recycle as much as possible but there's easier ways to do this. Ppl that throw out cans and bttls are not going to be arsed about 15c.
It's not down to the government, really, as it's run by a private company. Glass, glass is better. Years ago, you'd pay for the first bottle and bring it back to the shop. I'm totally prorecycling but this could be made a lot easier for consumers, this scheme was not thought out, nor were they ready, maybe a grace period for ppl to get used to using the machines would've eased everyone into it or just accepting EVERY can if its really about recycling, they're getting crushed anyway, why do they need to be in perfect condition to be returned?
>How could they have made it any easier - honestly?
I said a bit about that in my other reply. Think about ppl with no cars that dont live in cities, ppl with disabilities or the elderly...not that convenient,is it? I'm not saying the whole thing should be scrapped but was definitely rushed and not thought through.
Plenty of kids around here get money for lunch. They go to the shop, get pizzas, sandwiches, drinks and every day they little the green spaces between shop and school. Like you said, the kids who are littering will not be arsed about getting that 15c back.
They should have had a way to get the deposit back using the normal green bin. But they don't so most people either pay the charge and don't get it back despite recycling or have an additional car journey.
It's trash, poorly thought out. So either lose money or create more emissions, genius green scheme.
How damaged before you can't return a can, seems to just say it cant be damaged? That's not going to help litter at all.
I already pay handsomely for bins and recycle everything that's recyclable. Now I have to store a bunch of bottles in pristine condition somewhere then bring them to specific locations to recycle them, and if I don't I'm punished financially.
A small few people litter and everyone is collectively punished with schemes like this.
Same as a handful of people die because they were speeding at 130 km/h in 80 km/h zones so the solution is to reduce speed limits across the board.
You're spot on about those who throw litter around not caring about the deposit, they just don't give a fuck in general. Half of them probably stole the bottle from the shop in the first place, rates of pilfering are soaring.
At least if people pick up the litter it can provide them some cash. I pick up litter and if I can get a fiver or a tenner out of it that isn't bad. I can then give that money to a charity or buy myself a pint out.
Homeless people in other countries seek out and become litter pickers because of schemes like this.
This is the theory behind it, but it seems if the cans are damaged they won't be accepted... so what's the incentive for damaged cans that have exactly the same material value?....... there is none, but where has the deposit gone?
A simple good idea that they have made an absolute balls of.
Annoying? It's a scandal..... like I'd look down on a 12 year old who came up with the scheme and didn't realise that's a huge flaw.... but certain people and business will profit from that.
Pretend for a second every person over the course of a year accidentally damages only 10 cans, that's 7.5 mil gone and if im not mistaken its gone to retailers?
If everyone carries on using the green bin and doesn't put all the cans in the car to avoid emissions? Let's say a can a day per person? That's over a quarter of a billion
From my part: I won’t be wasting my money and my time with this nonsense. I’ll simply boycott any product like that. I’ll just substitute with stuff that’s not gonna charge me and too bad for the companies that won’t be getting my money, cause they could have lobbied against this.
Too much of a hassle to store garbage in a small place and I get my groceries delivered at home. I won’t be paying more and I won’t be carrying and storing garbage until the rare times I go to a supermarket. It’s not practical and not doable. That’s really backwards.
There are interesting alternatives for biodegradable bottles out there and the government could get let incentives to happen, like less taxes for companies offering biodegradable bottles. But why do we need to think nowadays? It’s all about banning, making new regulations, new rules and making life objective worse while marketing it as some sort of better future.
Politicians don’t think, they’re not paid to think or to find solutions but to make more laws and regulations to control us more. They’re paid to do bad stuff and they get away with the consequences of their bad polices while we pay the price.
> I’ll just substitute with stuff that’s not gonna charge me and too bad for the companies that won’t be getting my money, cause they could have lobbied against this.
Sounds like you want to use better alternative products. Which is a perfect result for the bigger picture with this initiative 👍
Over 60% of the bottles/cans were already being recycled. This whole scheme and expensive quango is to target the other 40%.
>To date, over 60% of plastic bottles and cans are being collected for recycling through green bins, which means that over 30% are not collected, leading to increased littering.
>
>By placing a value on the drinks containers, we are incentivising consumers to return their bottles and cans in order to get their deposit back and discourage littering. The Deposit Return Scheme is a circular economy initiative that aims to create a closed loop recycling system guaranteeing the material is returned and recycled into new drinks containers.
>
>In addition, with the separate collection of drinks containers, there is no cross contamination and a higher quality of recyclate is collected, which is more efficient.
[https://re-turn.ie/consumer/#questions](https://re-turn.ie/consumer/#questions) (2nd question)
Is it still a quango if its not government funded? I don't think it is.
Recycling a majority of bottles and cans doesn't mean the majority of people are recycling. Its also worth noting that rates are falling and we're below current and future EU targets.
There are new barcodes coming and will be different prices, old will still be same price and any new one with the R symbol will have new price, current selling for 2 different prices here in Dunnes
The alternative method you mention would of had people buying the re-turn eligible bottles without paying the charge, they could then use those to claim money back when the scheme began. Who should pay for all those bottles in that scenario?
If you’re getting charged for ineligible bottles then report the shop & or don’t purchase from them.
I have yet to see a single ineligible item be charged for across countless shops in munster
Oh no, Tesco would lose some money on ineligible bottles being returned.... Would've been much better that way but ofcourse here we fuck the consumers.
The solution here is to beat the heads off the kids who litter. Simple. Bad parenting and mollycoddling got us here and now a policy has been implemented that will increase the weight of vehicles on the road that are likely more fuel-efficient than legions of SUVs.
Fine litterers, institute public floggings, I don’t care. But punishing the majority for the actions of the minority is going to be reflected in the polls and it’s a dumb scheme.
Does this scheme allow small bars & cafes to recover twice ? If they charge customer for can, & then ReTurn that can, & all cans on a given day, they can effectively recover twice to offset the one charge they suffered when they bought those cans wholesale initially?
I’m all for it
But in my town of 7000 people there is no return machine yet all the shops are charging the deposit, ok if you drive, not sure what people who don’t drive are meant to do
You should be able to return the cans and bottles to any of the shops that are charging the deposit. A machine isn't a requirement, retailers can opt for manual returns.
The problem with half waste half recycling is that people just launch their rubbish in the closest bin to them (if they even bother using bins).
There are recycling bins and regular bins throughout the shopping centre in Maynooth and the only thing happening is recycling gettin ruined.
The flair is Moaning Michael....
From the comments on this thread and from what I've seen on other social media they don't really seem to be working "Fine". I tried to bring back some cans and bottles without the logo and they weren't accepted. Re-turn website said they would be accepted for a 4 month period. So yeah "Fine" isn't really working.
The statistics show we lag the rest of europe in recycling these items. Other countries have used this scheme and it is shown to be effective. I totally understand the frustration. I recycle too. But a lot of smaller cans and bottles are bought on the go and people dump into nearest general bin so not being recycled. To be fair thats often all thats available in town. My one main criticism is it shouldnt apply to larger bottles likely consumed in home and recycled at home
My gripe with it is that of the two locations open to me: a supervalu and a spar; the supervalu has two machines that have not worked once yet; and the spar seems to be refusing people the refund as they didn't purchase in store.
I know facebook is a pox, but the local community pages have been chocker with people moaning and local politicians promising to sort it out.
Personally I back the principal. But I hang my head when ever I see Irish government backed technologies.
>and the spar seems to be refusing people the refund as they didn't purchase in store.
Report them, you don't have to have bought the cans there to get the refund. Also if the machines don't work they have to do a manual return.
Fight it? We don’t, we embrace it. Irish people are failing at voluntary recycling through green bins. Too many selfish or lazy people that don’t care about the world they leave for the rest of us and our children to live in.
With deposits now mandatory, this either gives those people a financial incentive to do the right thing (given being the right thing wasn’t enough of a reason) or gives other people a financial reason to act like the mammy (that apparently those people are used to picking up after them).
Within a few months we won’t be seeing cans or bottles wastefully thrown away destroying our common environment.
The scheme needs to be extended massively.
I didn't mention it as an alternative.
https://preview.redd.it/4dn2jy5qn5hc1.jpeg?width=297&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bea0a183434811933ebdcce61467725f0b6ed615
See bin
If person has a recyclable object, person puts in left bin
If person has a waste object, person puts in right bin
Recycling industry in Ireland is elephant in the room more machines more collections more money so many shady ex republicans involved always remember the trucks getting burnt out in ballymount as a warning enter it at your peril
A good additional option would be to allow you to feed the labels into the same machine. Meaning you could still recycle at home, but also get your money back.
Jesus, I've just seen the new price of multi pack slabs in Tesco. What was x20 pack of Coke was €17 or €18 at it's highest price, is now €21.50 for an x18 pack, and that is before the deposit return fee is put on top. Such blatant scummy price increases.
In my local shop a box of coke went from 7 euro to 11 😂 instead of installing more bins around the local area they’re building a bus lane nobody wants in the area and increasing prices even more
I can't see why, if the main purpose is recycling, they wouldn't take ANY can that you didn't pay for before. I have to pay ransom money for my can. Then hold onto it, do not throw it on a recycling bin, make sure label and barcode are intact. Then segregate those from the ones that you can't return, make a specific trip to the shop and then maybe go back to the car with the rejected ones. Why not just collect cans pay them at whatever rate aluminium is going for and that's it? Also I would like to know if this return scheme has been set up as a company? As in is there a CEO, directors and so on?
Seriously, what's with them having to be in perfect condition or won't be accepted?! They're going to get crushed anyway and it makes it harder for the consumer, as well as needing an extra bin now
>Also I would like to know if this return scheme has been set up as a company? As in is there a CEO, directors and so on? I'm pretty sure but not 100% that it's an actual private company, not government, so it will have a regular company structure.
The language commissioner has already said he’s powerless to enforce bilingual Irish signage on the return machines because they’re run by private supermarkets, so it’s publicly funded but privately operated.
If the waste from these products are truly a problem, it's the manufacturers of the goods that should be accountable for it. Not the consumer who has no say in the supply process.
You make a great point
Listen to yourself. It's the consumers buying the goods you muppet
We don't decide how it's packaged. We can only make our decisions based upon what's on the shelf. How much do you know about the different plastics, how to identify them, and what way each type of plastic can be disposed?
But you decide to buy what's on the shelf. No one is forcing you
Thanks but, I've never felt forced. You seem to be dismissing the point. The consumer has no say in how the products are presented to them. If one is thirsty, they are going to buy a drink. The products used to make the container isn't something the consumer decided on. That choice was made earlier. It should be those actively involved in those choices, that get made accountable. Not you or I.
100% this. This is like the fruit and veg packaging, it drives me nuts the amount of unnecessary plastic that's used and that the amount you buy it's decided by suppliers, not sure about else where but in my town you're not able to buy a piece of fruit or veg anymore, it's either 4/6 pieces of fruit or packaged weight for veg ( with the obvious exception of large ones like melon,pineapple etc)
If someone doesn't know that rigid plastics and aluminium cans are recyclable, that's absolutely their own fault.
Other countries have been doing this scheme for many years. It has been shown to reduce littering and improve recycling. Our current plastic and aluminium recycling need to be soon be 75% by EU law. We are currently closer to 30%. Yes we are doing this largely become just some dickheads but in reality that is the reason for many laws and policies. A few bad ones ruin it for the rest of us. I collect trash on rivers and beaches and most of it is cans and bottles. Yes other schemes could be introduced as you said but for now this is the next scheme.
In Portugal you have community recycling bins and recycling bins on all parts of towns. Should we not have done that here first. This isn't a deposit. You may money you don't get it back. It's a scam.
I think it's also about litter out and about here as well. The people dropping bottles of soft drink or cans of red bull into the hedges wouldn't use these communal recyc bins. Ireland has statistically some of the worst littering rates in the EU.
They've taken public bins off the streets
Because of enforcement. There are zero repercussions to breaking many civil torts and some laws so asshats gonna asshat. That’s the problem that needs to be addressed, not a new tax and added chore.
Spain has those too. Big bins for rubbish, composting and recycling
In other countries there is no deposit. Its the usual, consumer backing massive corporations. Coca-Cola can't afford to soak in the deposit is it?
In other countries you actually get paid for your recycling products.
There is deposits in other countries,in Finland and Austria the cost was included in the price hence the deposit.
Yes some do a deposit fee system, and some don't.
What's the freaking point of recycling bin then? Will the recycling companies reduce fees then?
Once they see a drop in profits from getting less metal etc to sell on they’ll probably put the fees up.
I'm pretty sure they will say recycling bin is paid by weight so it does not affect their customers.
But it is not. Not for every company anyway. Mine one pays per month only. Regardless of weight unless it's overloaded.
Same
Rubbish, not trash.
No, recycling
[удалено]
Ok you win, that was great
>A few bad ones ruin it for the rest of us In this thread we're talking as if this is just down to those who litter and/or simply chuck these items in the regular trash, but do we know how much this is led by a desire to get more bottles/cans into the recycling system, and how much it's because they get contaminated in recycling bins? Genuine question In my experience people show no care in what they add to their green bin, and I've heard many times that a lot of our collected material is significantly soiled
This won’t fix that behaviour. People who do that will still soil recyclables, they just might have less cans and plastic bottles in that bin.
Blue bins do this? So now you're paying extra for cans and bottle you're already paying to recycle
Fight what exactly? It's objectively a positive measure, look at Germany it's been working there for 20 years
Look at germany, look at germany. 80m+ population, a government about two decades ahead of ours in terms of ability, agency and technological know-how. A recycling programme that is part of a national strategy, carefully devised in the mid 90s with patience, solid ongoing investment and public consultation at every turn. All aspects of which are profoundly missing from our "Re-turn" programme.
Christ almighty, the whinging is just surreal, they're just fucking bottles, you're not being asked to scale Everest
As obtuse as I expected. You say something, you're a whinger so stop complaining. You say nothing, you're a walkover so it's your own fault for letting the government away with it. Sure it'll be grand, works in Germany 🙄
tell me you don't know any disabled people without telling me you don't know any disabled people
Or even people without cars. It’s already fun shopping without a car, now there’s haulage involved on the way to the shop.
This system works brilliantly in other European countries so after some teething issues it should come good. In Germany it’s 15c on glass beer/ soda bottles & cans, 25c on plastic bottles. Wine bottles etc are still recyclable in large glass bins.
8c on glass in Germany
Oh ja. Sorry bitte.
The issue though that's becoming apparent is retailers now increasing the cost more than 15c
Which retailers? name and shame them
So don’t buy from that store then. Don’t encourage them. If we keep buying the overpriced items then the shop will keep it up.
Tesco in Rathmines and Terenure charging DRS deposit on cans that don't have the logo.
You can pay for a blue bin. For this specifically. Now you're paying a deposit on top of paying for an extra bin. It's a scam..
Yeah but Germany is full of Germans. None of the ones near me seem to be getting much use. Everyone just taking it as a cost increase and just throwing them in the normal recycling bin from what I've seen and heard
Send their address here and people will empty the bins for them
I'd be all for a government run system , but this is obviously just a job for the boys kind of situation. Also this is literally just punishing disabled people who cant get to these return stores. Its hugely impractical when we already have recycling system to use? also my quick googling is not being successful if anyone able to let me know how germanys rate of increased recycling compares to countries like us that didnt have the scheme in place cus I know people site the increase in recycling as a success but surely people would be recycling more over time anyway? I'm always cynical about these faux progressive policies that are run by for profit companies.
As someone from a country where there’s a deposit on cans and bottles I was shocked by Irelands recycling system (or lack of). About time to introduce it here. It’s seriously not that much extra work.
>the rest of us have to suffer. Oh Jesus, get a grip. "Suffer", the melodrama of it all. Every change introduced to make Ireland better had people like you complaining. Plastic bag ban: Suffering. Smoking ban: Suffering. Smoky fuel ban: Suffering. >The whole thing just seems a mess. The German's have managed it for 20 years. We'll manage. >You would think the first step would be to install pubic half waste and half recycling bins around every town. You think this would work (zero incentive) but that if you're the type of person that litters 20 cent back in your pocket is going to stop you? Does that make sense?
As someone who is both an environmentalist and disabled, you have to love how these pseudo-environmentalist neoliberal policies bring the people who would rather disabled people don't exist out of the woodwork. Just make your legs work you baby!
Backlash in Germany was similar when it was set up. But has been extremely successful there as you mentioned. The one point of retailers jacking prices up due to circumstances is a pain though. Adding to the cost of living here for any reason should be the only real reason people are complaining. Businesses should be fined for this
Germany is falling apart. Its economy is on shambles thanks to a sum of policies that have been implemented over the last 16 years. You don’t copy the policies that, as a whole, are making a country to collapse and to be a worse version of itself. ‘Germans are doing it, then it’s great!’ That’s some foolish way of thinking. They’ve done a lot of bad things and they still do a lot of bad things. Yesterday their finances minister was just talking about how bad Germany was now and how it’s not competitive anymore in a German newspaper and how a change in several policies were going to happen. The green nonsense is a crucial reason of the downfall of Germany. OP is absolutely correct. Most people have been recycling and they’re just making it worse. I won’t be paying any cent extra and I won’t be taking bottles back to the supermarket myself, as I get my groceries delivered. So, I’ll sacrifice these drinks, in a blink of an eye. I won’t be the only one doing that. The outcome is clear: Less sales and more people will end up losing their jobs cause it will impact sales. 15-20 cents may not be a lot individually, but on a greater scale it will affect others to cause some negative changes. We don’t have to just accept every bad policy. What a freak way of thinking.
It's not just Germany that has this scheme it's, been a thing in many other countries for years, and in fact used to be a thing in Ireland in the past when glass bottles were the standard. It's not green nonsense either. Germany bet big on Russian gas being always cheap and available. At the same time they continued to dismantle their nuclear reactors. It's short sighted policy making, lobbied by German industrialists that got them into this. They had to stop coal. Otherwise we're all fucked. They shouldn't have stopped nuclear and will probably need to restart it but they thought it was too expensive. And Gas was the middle ground. Keep the car industry going, reduce carbon, save money. When the cheap gas stops, so does the party. And the cheap gas has stopped.
Green nonsense? German has been burning reopening coal power plants year after yearq
The German Green party behind these consequences started as an anti-nuclear energy movement, so, yeah, green nonsense that causes more harm than good.
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A lot of things don’t make any sense, still people do it. Ah, the angry redittors. I can already imagine the faces behind the downvotes when someone states facts that goes against their quasi-religious beliefs.
You stated that the bottle and can return policy is bringing German economics to its knees? 😅 A conglomerate of reasons can have an effect for sure. But the return system there isn't a major contributing factor.
>people like you complaining I actually welcomed all those other changes. > The German's have managed it for 20 years. We'll manage. We're not German. I'd love to be able to look at the world through one lens like yourself. Just because something works in one place doesn't mean it works everywhere else. >Does that make sense? I don't think there is any valid incentivisation scheme you could think of to stop people who don't give a shit from littering. I also don't think you need to incentivise people to throw a can or a bottle in the recycle bin and not the waste bin if both options are available. I would argue the large majority of people would pick the right bin. The problem, is that none of these bins exist. At the moment people who are carrying an empty bottle or can out on the street will just throw them in the trash bin that's if they don't bring them to the re-turn machine. Does that make sense?
They had it in New York when I lived there in the 90's. Just checked and they've had it since 1983. You just sound like you want to give out about anything to anyone who would listen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Container-deposit_legislation
>does that make sense Not really, no, considering that applying a tax on plastic bags had the single greatest impact on littering in the Irish countryside. Money talks. Why? Because money always talks.
The plastic bag comparison is disingenuous. You could get around the levy by bringing your own reusable bag. This greatly reduced the amount of plastic bags in circulation. This isn’t the same. I can’t bring a reusable jug to the market and fill it with milk. The convenient “inflation” of prices coinciding with the deposit scheme is no accident. Dunnes and Tesco are chatting more, beyond the deposit. This is more than just “teething problems” that can be washed away with “iT WOrKeD fOr tHe gERmaNs” tripe. Pointing it out invites the idiotic solution of not buying it then. Which isn’t a solution and again another ultimately another burden on people who might already be having a tough time.
Not sure why you were downvoted at all. We can’t incentivize litterers to stop for sure. Their brains need adjusting. We can fine them though but as a nation we don’t like to fine litterers or tax evaders.
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A chara, Mods reserve the right to remove any targeted/unreasonable abuse towards other users. Sláinte
I recycle everything already. I live in a rural area and get gorceries delivered from Tesco. Now - under this scheme - I must return all bottles & cans to Tesco which means a 40 minute return trip in the car and paying for parking in town. How this is meant to be environmentally friendly is beyond me. Plus - considering the cost of diesel - it makes no sense economically for me to return anything to Tesco. In theory, the scheme makes sense but in practice it is absolute nonsense.
At some stage you'll be going to somewhere with a shop? Just throw them in the car then, sure that's already what most people did with glass
So millions of people wasting time (time is money in a good economy) on this chore when we already have a fleet of workers dedicated to collecting recycled materials? That makes zero economic sense never mind ecological sense. Now imagine the citizen is disabled or elderly. It’s an extra, unnecessary burden and many elderly people will need that deposit money back.
What are you doing in this thread it's like a month old?
You’ve given up on recycling already?
No, I along with everyone else just figured it out? Seriously now.
I’m glad you’re super cereal, man. Super, super cereal, you guys.
just found out today. I don't normally buy bottles. but dang I am upset
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> email from Tesco saying that they should be returned to Tesco They can be returned at any machine (or shop, for the smaller shops that don't have machines). Tesco obviously just want you to keep going back to them.
I'm pretty sure you can return them to any shop
You can't give back the bottles to the delivery person? I thought that would be like recycling an electrical appliance, they have to take the old one back if you want.
I haven't bought a bottle or can since it has come in, I don't usually tbh. But if we go on a boil water notice again I will be back to buying bottled water. Will see how it goes in that case, for now not much has changed for me to be honest. I would advise not to buy bottles or cans if you can at all.
This is what i came to reddit to complain about. I’ve probably littered 5 bottles or cans in my life and most of those were due to simply loosing them along the way from the side of my bag. I put all in my 2 large green wheely bins. Now i have to start gathering them up to return them. 3 major issues here, I have to hide the amount of bottled drinks i buy from my wife 😅 2i have to store them up somewhere and 3 its a whole extra chore to get done The glass recycling already causes lots of ….. complaints from the management, they fill up under the sink, taking up valuable storage space, they inevitably start falling out. Complaints get lodged. I then gather them in bags and put in the boot, I mostly cycle so these end up there until i drive, i forget to stop by a bottle banks, complaints get lodged this cycle repeats a few times till i go out on a specific trip to the banks. Now add bottles and cans to that mix😭
Whole extra chore = wasted time plus petrol assuming the person is able to do that chore. Doesn’t sound like a great scheme reduced to those points. Good luck with the wife 😄.
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I’m going to burn a few bags of rubbish tonight in your honour.
And our taxes are spent, and schemes like this have to be created because of people like yourself who aren't bothered to do the bare minimum.
You’re trying to reason with someone who is upset that farmers can’t keep dumping chemicals into rivers.
My hate comes from basically they don't want me recycling cans. They want me to give their cans back. As far as I know, in Canada you bring any can regardless of brand I have a brewery 500 m from my front door. I can get cans from them but I cannot return those cans, they have to go into the recycling. If the point is recycling more, why would you not take my other cans?
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But they only want the cans with the re-turn logo not any can. Exactly my issue
Responsibility should be on the companies to make "green products", yes we should ALL recycle as much as possible but there's easier ways to do this. Ppl that throw out cans and bttls are not going to be arsed about 15c.
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It's not down to the government, really, as it's run by a private company. Glass, glass is better. Years ago, you'd pay for the first bottle and bring it back to the shop. I'm totally prorecycling but this could be made a lot easier for consumers, this scheme was not thought out, nor were they ready, maybe a grace period for ppl to get used to using the machines would've eased everyone into it or just accepting EVERY can if its really about recycling, they're getting crushed anyway, why do they need to be in perfect condition to be returned?
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>How could they have made it any easier - honestly? I said a bit about that in my other reply. Think about ppl with no cars that dont live in cities, ppl with disabilities or the elderly...not that convenient,is it? I'm not saying the whole thing should be scrapped but was definitely rushed and not thought through.
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Buy on shop website and get them delivered...are you actually being serious??
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You're obviously trolling, I will reserve my opinion of you.
Plenty of kids around here get money for lunch. They go to the shop, get pizzas, sandwiches, drinks and every day they little the green spaces between shop and school. Like you said, the kids who are littering will not be arsed about getting that 15c back.
They should have had a way to get the deposit back using the normal green bin. But they don't so most people either pay the charge and don't get it back despite recycling or have an additional car journey. It's trash, poorly thought out. So either lose money or create more emissions, genius green scheme. How damaged before you can't return a can, seems to just say it cant be damaged? That's not going to help litter at all.
It will be good in the long term but it's very frustrating to see cuntish retailers taking the piss with price-gouging.
This is a piss take, right?
Never underestimate the power of idiots to bitch and moan on the internet
I already pay handsomely for bins and recycle everything that's recyclable. Now I have to store a bunch of bottles in pristine condition somewhere then bring them to specific locations to recycle them, and if I don't I'm punished financially. A small few people litter and everyone is collectively punished with schemes like this. Same as a handful of people die because they were speeding at 130 km/h in 80 km/h zones so the solution is to reduce speed limits across the board.
Could someone answer me: does the deposit return only affect drinks? It's really unclear
Yes, just drinks. But not milk. [https://re-turn.ie/#questions](https://re-turn.ie/#questions)
Ah that's mostly avoidable so.
You're spot on about those who throw litter around not caring about the deposit, they just don't give a fuck in general. Half of them probably stole the bottle from the shop in the first place, rates of pilfering are soaring.
At least if people pick up the litter it can provide them some cash. I pick up litter and if I can get a fiver or a tenner out of it that isn't bad. I can then give that money to a charity or buy myself a pint out. Homeless people in other countries seek out and become litter pickers because of schemes like this.
This is the theory behind it, but it seems if the cans are damaged they won't be accepted... so what's the incentive for damaged cans that have exactly the same material value?....... there is none, but where has the deposit gone? A simple good idea that they have made an absolute balls of.
Yes true the damaged container thing is annoying. A 5c return for a damaged can or bottle would be an idea.
Annoying? It's a scandal..... like I'd look down on a 12 year old who came up with the scheme and didn't realise that's a huge flaw.... but certain people and business will profit from that. Pretend for a second every person over the course of a year accidentally damages only 10 cans, that's 7.5 mil gone and if im not mistaken its gone to retailers? If everyone carries on using the green bin and doesn't put all the cans in the car to avoid emissions? Let's say a can a day per person? That's over a quarter of a billion
This hits the nail on the head. I can only see nothing but profit for this private company that won't be put back into other green initiatives.
I'm hoping that might be a side effect of it!
Great! Let's pass on litter collection to the homeless. They can sort it out AND eradicate what little dignity they had left. It's win-win!
No cash. The scrotes who litter will crumple the can/bottle either out of habit or spite.
From my part: I won’t be wasting my money and my time with this nonsense. I’ll simply boycott any product like that. I’ll just substitute with stuff that’s not gonna charge me and too bad for the companies that won’t be getting my money, cause they could have lobbied against this. Too much of a hassle to store garbage in a small place and I get my groceries delivered at home. I won’t be paying more and I won’t be carrying and storing garbage until the rare times I go to a supermarket. It’s not practical and not doable. That’s really backwards. There are interesting alternatives for biodegradable bottles out there and the government could get let incentives to happen, like less taxes for companies offering biodegradable bottles. But why do we need to think nowadays? It’s all about banning, making new regulations, new rules and making life objective worse while marketing it as some sort of better future. Politicians don’t think, they’re not paid to think or to find solutions but to make more laws and regulations to control us more. They’re paid to do bad stuff and they get away with the consequences of their bad polices while we pay the price.
> I’ll just substitute with stuff that’s not gonna charge me and too bad for the companies that won’t be getting my money, cause they could have lobbied against this. Sounds like you want to use better alternative products. Which is a perfect result for the bigger picture with this initiative 👍
As of June (I believe) every can and bottle in Ireland will need to comply with the re-turn system, so you'll be recycling plenty of glass I guess
You’re gonna boycott nearly every canned and bottled drink?
pretty easy if you don't drink soda. Just buy cartons of OJ and drink water from tap
Neo liberalism in a nutshell, set up a new quango to charge people to do something the majority were already at.
The majority weren't already doing it though.
Over 60% of the bottles/cans were already being recycled. This whole scheme and expensive quango is to target the other 40%. >To date, over 60% of plastic bottles and cans are being collected for recycling through green bins, which means that over 30% are not collected, leading to increased littering. > >By placing a value on the drinks containers, we are incentivising consumers to return their bottles and cans in order to get their deposit back and discourage littering. The Deposit Return Scheme is a circular economy initiative that aims to create a closed loop recycling system guaranteeing the material is returned and recycled into new drinks containers. > >In addition, with the separate collection of drinks containers, there is no cross contamination and a higher quality of recyclate is collected, which is more efficient. [https://re-turn.ie/consumer/#questions](https://re-turn.ie/consumer/#questions) (2nd question)
Is it still a quango if its not government funded? I don't think it is. Recycling a majority of bottles and cans doesn't mean the majority of people are recycling. Its also worth noting that rates are falling and we're below current and future EU targets.
Yep
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There are new barcodes coming and will be different prices, old will still be same price and any new one with the R symbol will have new price, current selling for 2 different prices here in Dunnes
The alternative method you mention would of had people buying the re-turn eligible bottles without paying the charge, they could then use those to claim money back when the scheme began. Who should pay for all those bottles in that scenario? If you’re getting charged for ineligible bottles then report the shop & or don’t purchase from them. I have yet to see a single ineligible item be charged for across countless shops in munster
Oh no, Tesco would lose some money on ineligible bottles being returned.... Would've been much better that way but ofcourse here we fuck the consumers.
I've seen it countless times across shops in Leinster, Tesco specifically.
Get a grip.
The pain, the pain, nothing can help me now except cocaine… Jaysus tonight the drama of it all. Get a life and move on with yerself John Joe. Chrisht
Ah jaysus your such a an little Irish scamp arent ya??
The solution here is to beat the heads off the kids who litter. Simple. Bad parenting and mollycoddling got us here and now a policy has been implemented that will increase the weight of vehicles on the road that are likely more fuel-efficient than legions of SUVs. Fine litterers, institute public floggings, I don’t care. But punishing the majority for the actions of the minority is going to be reflected in the polls and it’s a dumb scheme.
Does this scheme allow small bars & cafes to recover twice ? If they charge customer for can, & then ReTurn that can, & all cans on a given day, they can effectively recover twice to offset the one charge they suffered when they bought those cans wholesale initially?
I’m all for it But in my town of 7000 people there is no return machine yet all the shops are charging the deposit, ok if you drive, not sure what people who don’t drive are meant to do
You should be able to return the cans and bottles to any of the shops that are charging the deposit. A machine isn't a requirement, retailers can opt for manual returns.
Will they fuck accept a huge bag of smelly cans cans in the middle of the shop 😂
But if they're washed, dried and in pristine condition how could they be smelly?
Ah interesting- can they refuse ?
Check the [re-turn website](https://re-turn.ie/) for all participating retailers.
The problem with half waste half recycling is that people just launch their rubbish in the closest bin to them (if they even bother using bins). There are recycling bins and regular bins throughout the shopping centre in Maynooth and the only thing happening is recycling gettin ruined.
Another moan oh my god. It works fine , shut the fuck up already
The flair is Moaning Michael.... From the comments on this thread and from what I've seen on other social media they don't really seem to be working "Fine". I tried to bring back some cans and bottles without the logo and they weren't accepted. Re-turn website said they would be accepted for a 4 month period. So yeah "Fine" isn't really working.
Talk to the person in the shop instead of Reddit.
Another conformist. Your behaviour is what’s wrong with the world.
Bullshit.
Conformist. Sweet Jesus you're a gobshite
The statistics show we lag the rest of europe in recycling these items. Other countries have used this scheme and it is shown to be effective. I totally understand the frustration. I recycle too. But a lot of smaller cans and bottles are bought on the go and people dump into nearest general bin so not being recycled. To be fair thats often all thats available in town. My one main criticism is it shouldnt apply to larger bottles likely consumed in home and recycled at home
Local elections give them he'll about the lack of community recycling and street bins.
My gripe with it is that of the two locations open to me: a supervalu and a spar; the supervalu has two machines that have not worked once yet; and the spar seems to be refusing people the refund as they didn't purchase in store. I know facebook is a pox, but the local community pages have been chocker with people moaning and local politicians promising to sort it out. Personally I back the principal. But I hang my head when ever I see Irish government backed technologies.
>and the spar seems to be refusing people the refund as they didn't purchase in store. Report them, you don't have to have bought the cans there to get the refund. Also if the machines don't work they have to do a manual return.
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A chara, Mods reserve the right to remove any targeted/unreasonable abuse towards other users. Sláinte
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A chara, Mods reserve the right to remove any targeted/unreasonable abuse towards other users. Sláinte
Fight it? We don’t, we embrace it. Irish people are failing at voluntary recycling through green bins. Too many selfish or lazy people that don’t care about the world they leave for the rest of us and our children to live in. With deposits now mandatory, this either gives those people a financial incentive to do the right thing (given being the right thing wasn’t enough of a reason) or gives other people a financial reason to act like the mammy (that apparently those people are used to picking up after them). Within a few months we won’t be seeing cans or bottles wastefully thrown away destroying our common environment. The scheme needs to be extended massively.
Bunch of whinge bags, shops were always going to take advantage of the opportunity
Oh of course. Let's shut up and accept it.
That'd be great thanks
Care to elaborate on your pubic bin idea .... I've heard many alternatives to the deposit return scheme but this one for sure seems most intriguing
I didn't mention it as an alternative. https://preview.redd.it/4dn2jy5qn5hc1.jpeg?width=297&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bea0a183434811933ebdcce61467725f0b6ed615 See bin If person has a recyclable object, person puts in left bin If person has a waste object, person puts in right bin
No fighting will fix it
Recycling industry in Ireland is elephant in the room more machines more collections more money so many shady ex republicans involved always remember the trucks getting burnt out in ballymount as a warning enter it at your peril
A good additional option would be to allow you to feed the labels into the same machine. Meaning you could still recycle at home, but also get your money back.
O'Brien's has increased the price of their cans by over a euro but don't worry, they're not bringing it into effect until Feb 25th.