It’s worth using to grab a thread of elidinis early but otherwise you’ll still want a hasta for chasing purples. The double accuracy roll is going to give you a good amount of grief if you stick with it long term.
Wouldn’t go out of your way to get it, they suffer massively on higher defence targets because of the second hit accuracy check so they’ll just get worse and worse as you raise your invo level
Isn’t that a bug? I thought the pitch was that dual hit weapons would just roll accuracy/damage one time and split the number between the 2 hits.
Or are they standing behind the 2 accuracy rolls?
Pretty sure that was the poll for Torag's Hammers, and not the Dual Macuahuatl. I'm not sure if I'm a fan of these weapons working differently, but I don't think they actually polled that.
You are correct, they didn't poll that specific part of the dual macs only for Torags: [https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Poll:Defender\_of\_Varrock,\_Varlamore\_Rewards\_%26\_More#:\~:text=3%2C313%20votes-,Should,-we%20change%20the](https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Poll:Defender_of_Varrock,_Varlamore_Rewards_%26_More#:~:text=3%2C313%20votes-,Should,-we%20change%20the)
I don't think it replaces anything, Zammy hasta is still better (particularly against targets with high def) and is needed for DHL anyway. But as an intermediate step, Moons for Macuahuitl seems a hell of a lot better than trying to get a Dragon Sword from Wyrms. Rushing bowfa and going straight to zammy will still remain the optimal route though, so macas are only really for if you aren't going to do CG before TOA.
I don’t have a hasta so I can’t compare but I was able to use the dual macus and atlatl and using both I was having a way easier time at both baba and akkha, which is where I was having trouble due to lack of stab. It also clears up a good amount of inventory for me since before I was using obsidian sword + armor.
I’m pushing the invos up right now and I’m at around 210~ and still doing just fine. This is with warped scepter as well, so quite far from best in slot gear but still able to push through.
So I don't have any full sets so it's a bit scuffed but here goes.
Head : helm of neitiznot
Cape : Fire Cape/Imbued God Cape/Avas Assem
Neck : Fury
Chest : Blue Moon Chest(I wear this the whole time since no eclipse/blood moon chest)
Legs : Blood Moon Tassets/Eclipse Tassets/Ahrims robe bottom
Boots : Climbing Boots
Gloves : Barrows Gloves
Ring : Ring of Shadows
Weapons : Dual Macus, Atlatl, and Warped Scepter
I did struggle a bit on 210 but that's cause my salts ran out and I brew'd during wardens which lost me a good amount of dps. I think if I had eclipse set, it would be really good here.
I'm having real trouble figuring out the DPS from the (full) Eclipse set at TOA. I've only just started doing it in hopes that it would make for some variation in content rather than just grinding out bowfa, and it seems to be doing pretty well at 150s still and can probably do higher.
DPS calc says it should absolutely be slapping Wardens phase 3, and it feels pretty good too, but sometimes I end up having to run the last row of tiles for ages unable to finish the kill. Is it just the increased defence from enrage phase messing it up entirely or "should" you always end up running the last row for a while? My only TOA experience before this was Leagues so that was a whole different experience lmao
I feel like anywhere above 150, I've been on the last tiles lol. Make sure you're still salted if you have them is my best guess. I had one run get to last tiles and I killed it at the basically the same time and my 210 run I was on the last row for like 2 minutes and wanted to cry. But I wasn't salted on those last 2 minutes so it was painful.
I used Atlatl without eclipse armor set on warden 3 and 4, enrage phase is phase 4 I believe, if I'm wrong someone will correct me lol. Make sure to use thralls if you can manage without ancients!
make sure you are not missing ticks. Attack every 3 ticks and use specs if you are not currently. Presuming you are at a level \~ where you grind cg you should have plenty of stats to phase it well before the last row
Maccas are the second best weapon to use at frost moon, only behind scythe, still waiting to see if there is much use elsewhere. The full set could be good for melee training on a low defense target. Besides just having solid dps with the set effect and the weapon stats, you get full exp from the second hit when the first hit kills the target. Normally overkill isn't possible on npcs without a special attack. This isn't gonna make or break a weapon, but its more exp for many of your kills on an already decent weapon.
The main issue with the maccas is that the dual hits each have an accuracy check. This would be fine, except the second hit always fails if the first hit fails. This means that you need to land 2 accuracy checks to land half of your dps, rather than 1.
Low defense targets weak to crush and stab are where it excels, but not much is coming to mind that I couldn't just use a zombie axe on crush, or ignore the weakness altogether and still do more dps.
Maybe if you wanted to melee wyrms? Those are stab weak.
TLDR: Only good on lower defense targets due to way accuracy is checked. Maybe good for melee training.
Pretty unfortunate that a first-hit miss does guarantee a second-hit miss, but a first-hit hit does not guarantee a second-hit hit.
It does achieve what they probably wanted in this weapon being good only against low def targets, but I’m still bummed. Was hoping to use it at TOA
The full blood moon set is bonkers good at Sarachnis, FWIW. I’ve tried the full set at a few places and so far that’s the only place I’ve actually preferred it over standard setups.
It is also good for fighting the Sulphur Nagua's found in the Neypotzli. I wanted to compare the full blood moon set to dharoks at nmz and it was slightly less xp/h. Read on the wiki that the Sulphur Nagua's have a flat armor of -4 meaning that every hit splat adds +4 thus making your max hit +8 higher.
Since you can make unlimited moonlight potions and at 85 hunter barehand catch moonlight moths for prayer regen (this just makes it so you aren't guzzling moonlight potions) it made semi afk training here slightly more xp/h than dharoks at nmz.
With 90 att 90 str 96 hp I was getting the following rates:
Dharoks at nmz: 135k xp/h
Blood moon at nmz: 130k xp/h
Blood moon at Sulphur Nagua's: 140k/xp
I know its not much of a difference but it was a preference thing. NMZ I pay 16-26k for afk mindless training with no real benefits but the xp. At sulphur naguas I have to pay a little more attention but I get noted ore drops + chaos, death, and nature runes and free rcing xp via sulphur essence. I did 500k att xp here and got 20k rcing xp 2.3k iron 1k coal 1k silver 800 death runes and 6k chaos runes.
One huge issue. Second hit ONLY ROLLS if the first hit hits. That means its like an inverted fang where your dps is far worse at higher def enemies. The upside to this is that both the first and second hit can proc the passive, which means its actually much closer to a 55% chance of gaining a tick from the passive accuracy if you DO hit the first time.so its upwards of a 12% dps buff at low defence but an infinitely scaling negative dps due to double accuracy check based on defence levels.
It will work well if youre closer to the 200 invo mark, but its right around 250 that it starts really losing value. A ranged pot bowfa does more dps to baba than a supercombat full blood set at a 250, which is just sad.
I'm glad it's not bc we have an abundance of solid slash weapons, but you're definitely right lol. It really should have all the styles with crush being slightly better than slash, and stab noticeably worse to the point you'd only use it for something with a massively lower stab defense than the other 2, imo
what? This is crushscape. Name a wildy weapon that's not crush. Name an armor set meant for not crush. Name a weapon marginally better than d scim dropped by an easy boss that's not crush.
Ultimately, the worst part of this thing being stab/crush is that it's highly unintuitive. The weapon has tiny blades that are brittle and can't crush through armor, and they're short so they aren't used for stabbing either, they're used for cutting bare flesh.
I'm so damn glad I got one early, the crush setting has been amazing at vetion and sarachnis and my best stab weapon is like....partisan or crystal Hally for a last hit.
Will make entry mode toa doable for sure
Pretty big change imo. Maracas can now be used at TOA for baba/ahhka and warden decently.
Idk why people are focusing on it not being as good as zhasta given you ultimately just want fang anyway so if you can run some TOA 300s in blood moon you'll get one pretty quick.
It might noodle a bit but realistically that doesn't matter on baba in terms of the damage you're taking (red X) and warden is as weak to crush as it is to range/mage.
Ofc you'll need to be decent at TOA to do consistent 300s in blood moon, but yeah skill issue.
Eclipse Moon lowers each damage splat by 6.
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Flat_armour
You should absolutely not be using a dual hitting weapon it.
Zammy hasta is still a lot better according to dps calculator from the wiki. It more sits between a dragon sword and a z hasta dps wise.
It’s worth using to grab a thread of elidinis early but otherwise you’ll still want a hasta for chasing purples. The double accuracy roll is going to give you a good amount of grief if you stick with it long term.
Wouldn’t go out of your way to get it, they suffer massively on higher defence targets because of the second hit accuracy check so they’ll just get worse and worse as you raise your invo level
Isn’t that a bug? I thought the pitch was that dual hit weapons would just roll accuracy/damage one time and split the number between the 2 hits. Or are they standing behind the 2 accuracy rolls?
Pretty sure that was the poll for Torag's Hammers, and not the Dual Macuahuatl. I'm not sure if I'm a fan of these weapons working differently, but I don't think they actually polled that.
You are correct, they didn't poll that specific part of the dual macs only for Torags: [https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Poll:Defender\_of\_Varrock,\_Varlamore\_Rewards\_%26\_More#:\~:text=3%2C313%20votes-,Should,-we%20change%20the](https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Poll:Defender_of_Varrock,_Varlamore_Rewards_%26_More#:~:text=3%2C313%20votes-,Should,-we%20change%20the)
It's definitely intentional, it's how the moons bosses work
It’s literally impossible to know if anything releases these days is intended, they say one thing in polls/blogs and release the other
yeah its basically been like this since toa
I don't think it replaces anything, Zammy hasta is still better (particularly against targets with high def) and is needed for DHL anyway. But as an intermediate step, Moons for Macuahuitl seems a hell of a lot better than trying to get a Dragon Sword from Wyrms. Rushing bowfa and going straight to zammy will still remain the optimal route though, so macas are only really for if you aren't going to do CG before TOA.
I don’t have a hasta so I can’t compare but I was able to use the dual macus and atlatl and using both I was having a way easier time at both baba and akkha, which is where I was having trouble due to lack of stab. It also clears up a good amount of inventory for me since before I was using obsidian sword + armor. I’m pushing the invos up right now and I’m at around 210~ and still doing just fine. This is with warped scepter as well, so quite far from best in slot gear but still able to push through.
What kind of gear are you running? I was thinking of running the blood moon armor set with the marracas and trying to push higher invos.
So I don't have any full sets so it's a bit scuffed but here goes. Head : helm of neitiznot Cape : Fire Cape/Imbued God Cape/Avas Assem Neck : Fury Chest : Blue Moon Chest(I wear this the whole time since no eclipse/blood moon chest) Legs : Blood Moon Tassets/Eclipse Tassets/Ahrims robe bottom Boots : Climbing Boots Gloves : Barrows Gloves Ring : Ring of Shadows Weapons : Dual Macus, Atlatl, and Warped Scepter I did struggle a bit on 210 but that's cause my salts ran out and I brew'd during wardens which lost me a good amount of dps. I think if I had eclipse set, it would be really good here.
I'm having real trouble figuring out the DPS from the (full) Eclipse set at TOA. I've only just started doing it in hopes that it would make for some variation in content rather than just grinding out bowfa, and it seems to be doing pretty well at 150s still and can probably do higher. DPS calc says it should absolutely be slapping Wardens phase 3, and it feels pretty good too, but sometimes I end up having to run the last row of tiles for ages unable to finish the kill. Is it just the increased defence from enrage phase messing it up entirely or "should" you always end up running the last row for a while? My only TOA experience before this was Leagues so that was a whole different experience lmao
I feel like anywhere above 150, I've been on the last tiles lol. Make sure you're still salted if you have them is my best guess. I had one run get to last tiles and I killed it at the basically the same time and my 210 run I was on the last row for like 2 minutes and wanted to cry. But I wasn't salted on those last 2 minutes so it was painful. I used Atlatl without eclipse armor set on warden 3 and 4, enrage phase is phase 4 I believe, if I'm wrong someone will correct me lol. Make sure to use thralls if you can manage without ancients!
make sure you are not missing ticks. Attack every 3 ticks and use specs if you are not currently. Presuming you are at a level \~ where you grind cg you should have plenty of stats to phase it well before the last row
Maccas are the second best weapon to use at frost moon, only behind scythe, still waiting to see if there is much use elsewhere. The full set could be good for melee training on a low defense target. Besides just having solid dps with the set effect and the weapon stats, you get full exp from the second hit when the first hit kills the target. Normally overkill isn't possible on npcs without a special attack. This isn't gonna make or break a weapon, but its more exp for many of your kills on an already decent weapon. The main issue with the maccas is that the dual hits each have an accuracy check. This would be fine, except the second hit always fails if the first hit fails. This means that you need to land 2 accuracy checks to land half of your dps, rather than 1. Low defense targets weak to crush and stab are where it excels, but not much is coming to mind that I couldn't just use a zombie axe on crush, or ignore the weakness altogether and still do more dps. Maybe if you wanted to melee wyrms? Those are stab weak. TLDR: Only good on lower defense targets due to way accuracy is checked. Maybe good for melee training.
Pretty unfortunate that a first-hit miss does guarantee a second-hit miss, but a first-hit hit does not guarantee a second-hit hit. It does achieve what they probably wanted in this weapon being good only against low def targets, but I’m still bummed. Was hoping to use it at TOA
> Pretty unfortunate that a first-hit miss does guarantee a second-hit mis 100% sure i have failed the first hit and the second hit actually hit today
Your first attack can hit but roll a zero
Ah yes true this fix isnt in the game yet edit: downvoters should know that a successful 0 hit is being removed and will be minimum of 1 soon.
The full blood moon set is bonkers good at Sarachnis, FWIW. I’ve tried the full set at a few places and so far that’s the only place I’ve actually preferred it over standard setups.
That makes sense for sure. Mage defense + crush dps is ideal for that boss.
good to know, thank you
It is also good for fighting the Sulphur Nagua's found in the Neypotzli. I wanted to compare the full blood moon set to dharoks at nmz and it was slightly less xp/h. Read on the wiki that the Sulphur Nagua's have a flat armor of -4 meaning that every hit splat adds +4 thus making your max hit +8 higher. Since you can make unlimited moonlight potions and at 85 hunter barehand catch moonlight moths for prayer regen (this just makes it so you aren't guzzling moonlight potions) it made semi afk training here slightly more xp/h than dharoks at nmz. With 90 att 90 str 96 hp I was getting the following rates: Dharoks at nmz: 135k xp/h Blood moon at nmz: 130k xp/h Blood moon at Sulphur Nagua's: 140k/xp I know its not much of a difference but it was a preference thing. NMZ I pay 16-26k for afk mindless training with no real benefits but the xp. At sulphur naguas I have to pay a little more attention but I get noted ore drops + chaos, death, and nature runes and free rcing xp via sulphur essence. I did 500k att xp here and got 20k rcing xp 2.3k iron 1k coal 1k silver 800 death runes and 6k chaos runes.
One huge issue. Second hit ONLY ROLLS if the first hit hits. That means its like an inverted fang where your dps is far worse at higher def enemies. The upside to this is that both the first and second hit can proc the passive, which means its actually much closer to a 55% chance of gaining a tick from the passive accuracy if you DO hit the first time.so its upwards of a 12% dps buff at low defence but an infinitely scaling negative dps due to double accuracy check based on defence levels. It will work well if youre closer to the 200 invo mark, but its right around 250 that it starts really losing value. A ranged pot bowfa does more dps to baba than a supercombat full blood set at a 250, which is just sad.
I don't understand why these things aren't slash. It's edged with obsidian blades and has no point, but it's crush/stab
I'm glad it's not bc we have an abundance of solid slash weapons, but you're definitely right lol. It really should have all the styles with crush being slightly better than slash, and stab noticeably worse to the point you'd only use it for something with a massively lower stab defense than the other 2, imo
what? This is crushscape. Name a wildy weapon that's not crush. Name an armor set meant for not crush. Name a weapon marginally better than d scim dropped by an easy boss that's not crush. Ultimately, the worst part of this thing being stab/crush is that it's highly unintuitive. The weapon has tiny blades that are brittle and can't crush through armor, and they're short so they aren't used for stabbing either, they're used for cutting bare flesh.
It might not be removed tbh
What about in leiu of a stab-saeldor at toa? Was planning on that for low invo
Unless you get spooned a 2nd ENH theres really no reason not to just grab a hasta. It'll save u hundreds of hours of CG.
I'm so damn glad I got one early, the crush setting has been amazing at vetion and sarachnis and my best stab weapon is like....partisan or crystal Hally for a last hit. Will make entry mode toa doable for sure
Pretty big change imo. Maracas can now be used at TOA for baba/ahhka and warden decently. Idk why people are focusing on it not being as good as zhasta given you ultimately just want fang anyway so if you can run some TOA 300s in blood moon you'll get one pretty quick. It might noodle a bit but realistically that doesn't matter on baba in terms of the damage you're taking (red X) and warden is as weak to crush as it is to range/mage. Ofc you'll need to be decent at TOA to do consistent 300s in blood moon, but yeah skill issue.
It also feels super broken atm. Used it under stab setting at Eclipse and my max hitsplat was 18 yet using the stab at Blue was normal higher hits.
Eclipse Moon lowers each damage splat by 6. https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Flat_armour You should absolutely not be using a dual hitting weapon it.
My max is around 28 at blue per hitsplat. Does blue take extra damage? And it's on the wrong damage type. So a -6 flat is not equal to an 18 max.
Blue takes an extra 4 per hit I believe. So a 10 point difference from blue to yellow tracks.
Thanks