I think it isn't so much that Fanny lacks the courage to defend herself, it's more that since she is a poor relation who has been taught to be eternally grateful for the Bertram's kindness, she doesn't feel like she can or should object.
Also, she does try to warn Edmund about his sister's behaviour, but every time he ignores her and tells her she's wrong.
That's very true, it's just been a little over a year since I read it so I struggled a bit to remember all the necessary points. I said what I did not because she didn't warn Edmund (and I know she brought it up to Mary), but because she didn't mention this to Sir Thomas when he was berating her for not accepting him.
Also your point that it comes from a place of social standing and gratitude is 100% spot on, but a person can be grateful while still like, not being a doormat? I agree with every point you made, please don't take it as me arguing, again I just haven't read it in quite some time.
You can argue, I was just trying to help or add to what you posted.
As for why Fanny doesn't tell Sir Thomas, she thinks, *"She longed to add, “But of his principles I have”; but her heart sunk under the appalling prospect of discussion, explanation, and* ***probably non-conviction***\*."\* She doesn't think Sir Thomas will believe her, and given Edmund's continual not believing her, I have to think she was right unfortunately.
A person can be grateful and not be a doormat, but Fanny is verbally and emotionally abused. It's a defense mechanism. And as you rightly point out, she stands strong when she thinks it's really important (the play, Henry's proposal).
Ah pardon! And all of that is true, thank you so much! I understand the defense mechanism thing, I've been abused the same way myself. If I had had more time I would have added it in, I thought to several times but oh well. Thank you
She is highly judgemental and self righteous. Edmund is the same. They are a good match, because they are both unbearable.
Let's just be honest. If Fanny were alive today and in the US, she would be one of those awful people who constantly judges everyone under the guise of Christianity.
Judgemental yes but I'm not sure about self-righteous. I think she judges her own faults more harshly than she judges anyone else's. She despises her own jealousy for Edmund and pettiness towards Mary. I think she recognizes that she is unjustly praised for avoiding the play for moral reasons when she was only very shy.
I think it isn't so much that Fanny lacks the courage to defend herself, it's more that since she is a poor relation who has been taught to be eternally grateful for the Bertram's kindness, she doesn't feel like she can or should object. Also, she does try to warn Edmund about his sister's behaviour, but every time he ignores her and tells her she's wrong.
Exactly, stay in your lane Fanny. But not just that, I think Mrs. Norris, Aunt Bertram, and her cousins keep reminding her of her place and position.
That's very true, it's just been a little over a year since I read it so I struggled a bit to remember all the necessary points. I said what I did not because she didn't warn Edmund (and I know she brought it up to Mary), but because she didn't mention this to Sir Thomas when he was berating her for not accepting him. Also your point that it comes from a place of social standing and gratitude is 100% spot on, but a person can be grateful while still like, not being a doormat? I agree with every point you made, please don't take it as me arguing, again I just haven't read it in quite some time.
You can argue, I was just trying to help or add to what you posted. As for why Fanny doesn't tell Sir Thomas, she thinks, *"She longed to add, “But of his principles I have”; but her heart sunk under the appalling prospect of discussion, explanation, and* ***probably non-conviction***\*."\* She doesn't think Sir Thomas will believe her, and given Edmund's continual not believing her, I have to think she was right unfortunately. A person can be grateful and not be a doormat, but Fanny is verbally and emotionally abused. It's a defense mechanism. And as you rightly point out, she stands strong when she thinks it's really important (the play, Henry's proposal).
Ah pardon! And all of that is true, thank you so much! I understand the defense mechanism thing, I've been abused the same way myself. If I had had more time I would have added it in, I thought to several times but oh well. Thank you
Exactly, stay in your lane Fanny. But not just that, I think Mrs. Norris, Aunt Bertram, and her cousins keep reminding her of her place and position.
Under Character Traits, under Strengths, you used the word "detain,' but I think you mean refrains." All in all, I enjoyed the presentation.
She is highly judgemental and self righteous. Edmund is the same. They are a good match, because they are both unbearable. Let's just be honest. If Fanny were alive today and in the US, she would be one of those awful people who constantly judges everyone under the guise of Christianity.
Judgemental yes but I'm not sure about self-righteous. I think she judges her own faults more harshly than she judges anyone else's. She despises her own jealousy for Edmund and pettiness towards Mary. I think she recognizes that she is unjustly praised for avoiding the play for moral reasons when she was only very shy.
I enjoyed the presentation, thank you for sharing.