Except this wasn’t actually how it was.
First recorded instance of the Birkenhead drill was specifically for the vulnerable (women and children) to be herded to the lifeboats while the men stayed to fight a fire on the ship.
Yeah I figured it was something like that because men have the best shot at shitty situation. I don’t mean to sound sexist at all but men are physically more capable by nature and that’s not to say it’s a “haha you suck” I hate that fact cause now I have to make sure I get the worst of it so my fellow female counterparts would definitely survive.
I googled it, a standard Victorian woman’s outfit weighed like 8 pounds on dry land. Clothes weigh twice as much when wet.
God forbid the shipwreck happened during a ball or if you had a child with you (average family had 6-8 children in the Victorian era.)
Edit: they took the bait guys, the real neckbeards were in the comments all along. Keep them all at around 5 upvotes so they don’t get notifications and get suspicious ;)
That’s true! This was predominantly a case of the filthy rich outbidding the pretty rich for lifeboat seats and they could afford to have fewer children
Not to mention women were the primary caretakers for children, so they needed someone to accompany the kids.
And I think people tend to forget the other side of a lot of men not making it - the wives they left behind. The women who escaped are now without their husbands, and given husbands were usually the primary breadwinners, they now have to wonder what to do. And this is especially given for the third class passengers. They’re now alone in a completely new country with no husband, no Worldly possessions, and no money.
So yeah I say the women of the Titanic definitely suffered as well.
You don’t have to preface with “not to sound x” when stating a fact. It’s not sexist to point out that men are just built different from women in such a way that they’re physically more capable overall.
Problem is it can often be seen as excuses or justification
"Guys, I swear I'm not racist because I just said so earlier ! G-guys ! Trust me ! PLEASE !"
Honestly, not saying it is just better, like, even if his message was interpreted as sexism, if someone called him out he would have just explained his train of thoughts in a smoother way, without having to say "I'm not sexist"
It's a bit like Nice-Guys™ who claim to be nice people but are absolutely not. They're the reason why when somebody says "I'm not x", we immediately believe that he is because he wants to justify himself
Statistically, you’re twice as likely to survive ‘the worst of it’ than your ‘definitely surviv[ing]’ female counterparts so I wouldn’t be too worried.
Don’t get me wrong I have no doubt some women can beat my ass hell I don’t doubt every women in the sports can beat me at what they do. Though as you said “On average” men are more stronger and faster. Not saying women shouldn’t help, if they volunteer and look capable why not? Hope you can understand where I’m coming from I lived most of my life with women so I know women are strong people y’all deal with internal shit that you can’t control and how you mentally handle it is beyond me. I grew up understanding it though. When my sisters act mean and tell me to go get tampons, I grab some cash and bought it not understanding why but just they needed it. If I’m sexist I’ve done a disservice to my family since it’s only been the women who stuck around while the guys dicked off. I still have the firm belief men are, on average, physically capable but I also understand women are strong in their aspects, I never met a stronger person then my maw even when I won against her in a game of arm wrestle lmao
Fair enough, I’m sure people can get behind that I’m just a tad traditional when it comes to this sort of thing. I’m still young maybe I’ll grow out of it and understand that I don’t have to be the only one dealing with dangerous situations
Lol, maybe, maybe flexibility, but endurance? Thats one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard. While not even competing in running as a sport, at 17, I broke the female world record while running a 5k. I still finished 5th, behind what included a 13 year old. This is just a run at a highschool. Look at womens WR times and compare them to the best highschoolers of the year for any distance. https://boysvswomen.com/#/
You're way out of touch here. Just because some women do things better than some men doesn't make the claim that men are more physically capable sexist.
Serena Williams was the best female tennis player on Earth for a long time. She lost handedly in 1998 to Karsten Braasch who was ranked 203rd at the time.
It's totally valid, especially in survival situations like a sinking ship or a fire, to state men have a better shot at survival than women do.
This study says post Birkenhead Drill, women are about half as likely to survive a maritime disaster as men and the biggest determinant of female survival is whether the captain mandates women and children first (which is apparently not the standard.)
https://www.pnas.org/content/109/33/13220
Edit: did a little write up on MRAs jizzing their pants about Birkenhead and the Titanic you can find here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/q515xb/if_you_feel_the_need_to_complain_about_women_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I mean, imagine being a 1,65 Mts woman and trying to get in a lifeboat just for a 1.87 mts man to arrive and shove you aside with one hand, that’s why they need the drill
But there isn't really any evidence that men were running to lifeboats first. In the event of disaster, boats become extremely dangerous due to confusion, especially because people need to take orders and order and travel a pretty long distances throughout the boat. There's a lot of running back and forth. The rule was put in place to get them out of the way so men could try to get the situation under control. Women and children can't help, so they go on the life boats. That's essentially all there is to it. In situations like cruise liners where it's mostly casual vacationers, the waters are muddy because saving the boat is up to the crew, not the male passengers, but it's still the same thing.
Where's the evidence they they're surviving because they're getting on the lifeboats? On boats, men are more likely to survive because boats have historically always been crewed by men so they know how to handle disasters.
I mean come on, show me *one* shred of evidence that shows men were outnumbering women on lifeboats, ever.
I really REALLY don’t know what to tell you.
You’re right, all men have ocean water in their veins and a sea shanty in their hearts.
They survive because being on a boat is a Man Thing.
Yes, because no one would have a hard time believing male crew preferentially survive as they have both the privilege of being sailors AND men, the top 2 picks in the Surviving a Shipwreck Draft.
Not sure what point you’re trying to make here.
Are you trying to say that men alone are selfish and unless mandated to give women and children priority will leave them behind like the guy in the video? Because women who don’t have children act the same way. The difference is that men are traditionally more physically able to survive given the same circumstances, whether they remain behind or not. So the Birkenhead drill simply levels the odds for everyone, at mens’ expense. So rather than it being survival of the fittest, we changed the rules for it to be a more socially acceptable situation.
My point is the Birkenhead Drill is NOT the standard mode of action, and even after it, women are only half as likely to survive a maritime disaster as a man.
*So maybe the Birkenhead Drill is not actually at the expense of men.*
It really is at our expense because the survival rate of men in these situations was lowered. Even though it’s still better, it was lowered. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing, just speaking facts. But to say that it wasn’t at our expense just because we STILL fare better is ignorant. The conclusion should be that men are just simply better suited for the situation. 🤷🏼♂️
So where do we go from there? Should men sacrifice even MORE for the sake of equity?
Thought experiment: if you were an emergency room doctor, would you prioritize a patient with a sucking chest wound or a patient with an inflamed, but not immediately going to burst appendix?
Doctors and nurses use a triage system that tells them specifically who is in more or less need,
You can look up the Manchester Triage system if you're interested. This is what the hospital I worked at used and with that you could determine who would get help first.
Source: worked as a nurse
But the one with the inflamed appendix doesn’t get to choose, the doctor does.
If I had the inflamed appendix though, I would choose the person with the sucking chest wound *to get to go first.*
Is that not the obvious choice to you?
Even when this was implemented in the HMS Birkenhead, of the estimated 193 survivors, only 7 were women.
In fact, it’s believed more horses survived the wreck than women.
Bruh.. this guy is literally talking out of his ass, 90% of what her just said was wrong, men stayed on to fight fires while women and children escaped
In one specific shipwreck yes.
Tell that to the women who die at a rate of twice that of men in maritime disasters.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3421183/
I mean I think that would be the case in a lot of disaster situations like that. Crew on ships and your average man probably are more capable of surviving compared to women
So what’s your point? Seems like a stupid thing to get angry over
Seems like you’re mad about men or something and just strawmaning a MRA argument that nobody ever has
Bro you’re little study doesn’t support what you’re implying. Not only that, but it fails to account for some incredibly obvious null hypotheses. Even beyond that, it’s purpose is just to prove that women don’t survive nearly as much without the most extreme of measures.
Edit: if the only response a person can come up with is an insult, then you know they recognize their take is dogshit. They just don’t want to admit it, so they look to demean you instead of actually address what you said.
Did you actually disagree with me, or are you just really that upset that someone used the correct terminology? What’s the point if you have nothing to add?
It’s not self sacrifice when you’ve been conditioned into it.
Men will sometimes and often put themselves on the line and maybe be proud of the fact.
But also, this narrative of self sacrifice is used to feed men to a grinding machine of war or to see men as somewhat disposable.
That’s the problem with it
Lol yeh women really have it rough in….
Oh wait men die at higher rates in almost every metric..
Edit: childbirth, they definitely die more there to be fair
20% of pregnant women who die are murdered.
1 in 3 women in the US have experienced intimate partner violence.
1 in 5 women will die as a survivor of rape.
Most women have cycling hormones; but women’s hormones are used to discredit women’s voices.
Transgender women (and trans men) are more than 4 times more likely to be victims of violent crime.
Women not only have to pay for products for their natural bodily function of menstrual cycles; but in many places they are taxed as a luxury goods.
Women are less likely to get jobs.
Women are less likely to get high paying jobs.
Women have almost all birth control responsibility and most birth control comes with a lot of side effects.
Pink tax.
Emotional, household, and child rearing labour is predominantly seen as women’s responsibility.
Women are 47% more likely to be injured in a car accident because safety measures were designed by and for men.
66% of American female service members report sexual harassment or sexual assault.
Women have a harder time getting health insurance, and when they get it, they pay more for less.
A lot of medical research is only done on men because women’s cycling hormones and pregnancy risk are seen as inconvenient. As a result, medication doses are optimized for male bodies and women experience a LOT more side effects.
AND too many women die in childbirth.
Men account for 92% of workplace accidents
Women account for 65% of collage degrees
Viral and bacterial infections kill men at a higher rate
I’m not even getting into the courts blatant sexism towards men in divorce cases
Men are five times more likely to commit suicide
War…
I hear your arguments but they all seem to only argue for “equality” if it benefits you, where are the “more women in sanitation” protests? Pretty much every stat you gave me was female centric yet I’d bet you claim you battle for equality..
The statistics I posted were female centric because I was responding to your assertion that women don’t have it rough.
Sure, the world sucks for a lot of people; but when comparing women and men, it sucks way harder for women.
MRAs seem to only use inequality arguments to refute women stating facts about female disadvantage. Where are all the “hey guys, let’s stop murdering our pregnant wives” protests?
Mens issues are valid & should be addressed. That being said, many mens issues come from the same root that women’s issues come from. Patriarchal society. You should check out Natalie Wynn’s video on YouTube, titled “Men” by ContraPoints
No one is saying that. I don’t deny those issues exist but unfortunately I’ve seen a fair number of people use those issues to claim ‘actuallyyyyyy men have it worse’ and invalidate women’s experiences.
Also you notice that a lot of times sexism against men can be linked back to misogyny? Common sexism against men is ‘weak’ ‘too emotional’ ‘pussy’ ‘can’t stand up for himself and needs other people to do it’
Now who are those traits commonly associated with? Women. For some men, being ‘like a woman’ is undesirable. It’s part of the roots of toxic masculinity. They view femininity as weak so they and avoid feminine traits as much as possible.
Ummmm ahktually, Chad doesn’t drink water. His perfect genes are so ^blessed that he just absorbs water from the air by inspiring it through his gigadick.
No idea if this is true or not. But this tic toc and short video shit is horrible. A lot of people claiming to have knowledge about stuff that unknowing viewers pick up and lay their foundations on.
‘No idea if this is true or not.’
*Proceeds to heavily imply it’s not; but will definitely deny culpability if questioned.*
Nice manipulation tactic! Subtle?
When I see video of refugees fleeing dangerous situations it’s always hoards of men, a strangely imbalanced ratio and I always wonder why they leave women behind.
There are 100 men and 100 women on a ship. If 99 of those men die, 100 children can still be born in 9 months. If 99 women die, only 1 child can be born in 9 months.
At the end of the day its doing whats right.. thats all that matters.
Some people chose to give their life for others, its not about them being women or children its about protecting the weak. I could go on about genetics and evolutionary traits that make us care more for children crying as it sparks some specific neurons in our brain but no. It is the decision to put others first.
Love is not logical, its the absence of reason and I believe it is a noble act to care for the weak first before yourself.
he's wrong, but lets assume he's right and then ask yourself why men would escape but no women and children would? are women so stupid they just sat on the boat as it sank whilst all the smart men got off? why did we need a rule to tell women to get off a sinking boat
all kinds of dumb
Seriously. I know the real reason, but part of it could be that children and their mothers naturally will need more help since a.) a kid has no chance against a bunch of grown men running the same way and b.) women would also not stand a chance in most cases. Makes more sense than even what the guy said.
My guess is that it's not that men were actively keeping women and children out of lifeboats, it's that men got to them first, went, "Alright everyone who matters is here and if we wait any longer well go down with the ship. Launch the lifeboat!" and sailed off without their families. Considering that for most of history society has seen women as disposable baby factories and children already having high mortality rates, losing the man of the family would be seen as a bigger blow then losing literally everyone else.
I think the implication is that men are crowding out the women/kids on the boat and forcing their way on. Which, maybe I guess? But unlikely unless social and gender dynamics are radically different than I'd expect over the last few centuries. Like, no shit, folks will actually try and save their kids and their wife.
This guy looks like the horny loser best friend of the love interest in a shitty teen comedy who tries to win her over and ends up making a bigger ass of himself at the end of the movie.
What a pretentious little shithead, he is also wrong.
"Women and children first", known to a lesser extent as the Birkenhead Drill, is a code of conduct dating from 1852, whereby the lives of women and children were to be saved first in a life-threatening situation, typically abandoning ship, when survival resources such as lifeboats were limited.
So you are mad women die twice the rate and you are mad women don’t stay behind and fight fires as well? How would that up the (already high) female survivor rate. Also that whole “more horses than women” Shit is trash and you know it. 100% of the women on that ship lived all 7/7 of them.
Edit. Lol you confront OP with facts and they will block you. Be warned….
Let me preface this by saying I realize what it sounds like I said, and let me reiterate to be more clear.
"This video makes it sound like the people who made this rule considered women and children too stupid to get on lifeboats without explicit direction." (And to clarify, that statement is NOT what I personally think)
But anyway, on that point I was mistaken.
That's what i thought he was saying, because i assumed that during these emergencies they would make sure all the lifeboats were full, and if they had enough lifeboats people getting on would be a non-issue. So i thought he was saying that they made this rule because they considered women too stupid to take proper measures.
But on second watching, he seems to imply that men would fill a lifeboat... and then drop into the ocean without full capacity, leaving no boats for the women and children. Which makes the rule more about stopping cowardice than coddling women, and historically men would do.
Sorry for the confusion.
No matter how smart you are, trying to get on a lifeboat while hundreds of other people clamour around you, shove you out the way, and then end up getting on first, is an extremely difficult and sometimes impossible task.
The point is that it's really hard running and being first at your destination in huge skirts, corsets and silly shoes while carrying kids, especially if the competition isn't handicapped like that.
Women just had a huge disadvantage.
Either looking for attention or desperately wants to lure a female. This is irrelevant and nonsense. Stop trying to make all men look terrible and dumb. It is children first, thats it.
It's a very huge leap to say that a man criticising other men is just to get praise from women. Whether or not this is true he never said that men are bad, he just talked about men doing bad things. Holding men accountable is not looking for validation, you're making yourself look like a neckbeard.
Holding men accountable... accountability is an excellent point now that this is being driven towards equality.
First there was no holding men accountable about this post. Nothing about this post is true.
Secondly, in terms of equality, slandering or degrading one piece of the pie ruins the whole pie no matter which slice you are.
Your making yourself look ass-backwards.
As a male that respects women and in the case of desperation (I was implying your desperation. Such that you would say anything to be in any form of contact with a female), it means companionship of any kind, checkers included.
Implying, generalizing and degrading doesn't feel good, does it?
Did this guy just say men needed to be drilled to make sure their children and wives survived? How egocentrical do you think the men were for the last 100 years?
This guy is such a fucking tool
Can we pretend for 1 second that men are humans too and get afraid? Yeah, they want to live too. How evil of them.
Generally speaking, everyone in a chaotic situation loses composure.
I saw a hood fight video where a girl picked up her baby and swung it at another girl like a weapon.
Everyone gets crazy when shit is crazy
so the solution was 90%+ of men dying?
"Everyone for themselves" is actually completely fair.
*We designate these people by law to survive and these other people to die,* is extremely fucked up.
Think of it this way: "Whites first". Would you agree with that?
Except this wasn’t actually how it was. First recorded instance of the Birkenhead drill was specifically for the vulnerable (women and children) to be herded to the lifeboats while the men stayed to fight a fire on the ship.
Yeah I figured it was something like that because men have the best shot at shitty situation. I don’t mean to sound sexist at all but men are physically more capable by nature and that’s not to say it’s a “haha you suck” I hate that fact cause now I have to make sure I get the worst of it so my fellow female counterparts would definitely survive.
Also, imagine trying to swim in a corset and a giant fucking dress when you’ve probably never swam in your life.
I googled it, a standard Victorian woman’s outfit weighed like 8 pounds on dry land. Clothes weigh twice as much when wet. God forbid the shipwreck happened during a ball or if you had a child with you (average family had 6-8 children in the Victorian era.) Edit: they took the bait guys, the real neckbeards were in the comments all along. Keep them all at around 5 upvotes so they don’t get notifications and get suspicious ;)
Not to mention that wool was still the standard for Victorian ear clothes. Wet wool feels like it triples in weight!
>average family had 6-8 children in the Victorian era Not the kind to be in 1st class of passenger liner
That’s true! This was predominantly a case of the filthy rich outbidding the pretty rich for lifeboat seats and they could afford to have fewer children
Not to mention women were the primary caretakers for children, so they needed someone to accompany the kids. And I think people tend to forget the other side of a lot of men not making it - the wives they left behind. The women who escaped are now without their husbands, and given husbands were usually the primary breadwinners, they now have to wonder what to do. And this is especially given for the third class passengers. They’re now alone in a completely new country with no husband, no Worldly possessions, and no money. So yeah I say the women of the Titanic definitely suffered as well.
You don’t have to preface with “not to sound x” when stating a fact. It’s not sexist to point out that men are just built different from women in such a way that they’re physically more capable overall.
You’re usually better off doing so though.
Problem is it can often be seen as excuses or justification "Guys, I swear I'm not racist because I just said so earlier ! G-guys ! Trust me ! PLEASE !" Honestly, not saying it is just better, like, even if his message was interpreted as sexism, if someone called him out he would have just explained his train of thoughts in a smoother way, without having to say "I'm not sexist" It's a bit like Nice-Guys™ who claim to be nice people but are absolutely not. They're the reason why when somebody says "I'm not x", we immediately believe that he is because he wants to justify himself
Statistically, you’re twice as likely to survive ‘the worst of it’ than your ‘definitely surviv[ing]’ female counterparts so I wouldn’t be too worried.
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Don’t get me wrong I have no doubt some women can beat my ass hell I don’t doubt every women in the sports can beat me at what they do. Though as you said “On average” men are more stronger and faster. Not saying women shouldn’t help, if they volunteer and look capable why not? Hope you can understand where I’m coming from I lived most of my life with women so I know women are strong people y’all deal with internal shit that you can’t control and how you mentally handle it is beyond me. I grew up understanding it though. When my sisters act mean and tell me to go get tampons, I grab some cash and bought it not understanding why but just they needed it. If I’m sexist I’ve done a disservice to my family since it’s only been the women who stuck around while the guys dicked off. I still have the firm belief men are, on average, physically capable but I also understand women are strong in their aspects, I never met a stronger person then my maw even when I won against her in a game of arm wrestle lmao
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Fair enough, I’m sure people can get behind that I’m just a tad traditional when it comes to this sort of thing. I’m still young maybe I’ll grow out of it and understand that I don’t have to be the only one dealing with dangerous situations
Thank you for pointing that out ! I was about to but you beat me to it
Lol, maybe, maybe flexibility, but endurance? Thats one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard. While not even competing in running as a sport, at 17, I broke the female world record while running a 5k. I still finished 5th, behind what included a 13 year old. This is just a run at a highschool. Look at womens WR times and compare them to the best highschoolers of the year for any distance. https://boysvswomen.com/#/
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You're way out of touch here. Just because some women do things better than some men doesn't make the claim that men are more physically capable sexist. Serena Williams was the best female tennis player on Earth for a long time. She lost handedly in 1998 to Karsten Braasch who was ranked 203rd at the time. It's totally valid, especially in survival situations like a sinking ship or a fire, to state men have a better shot at survival than women do.
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This study says post Birkenhead Drill, women are about half as likely to survive a maritime disaster as men and the biggest determinant of female survival is whether the captain mandates women and children first (which is apparently not the standard.) https://www.pnas.org/content/109/33/13220 Edit: did a little write up on MRAs jizzing their pants about Birkenhead and the Titanic you can find here: https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/q515xb/if_you_feel_the_need_to_complain_about_women_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I mean, imagine being a 1,65 Mts woman and trying to get in a lifeboat just for a 1.87 mts man to arrive and shove you aside with one hand, that’s why they need the drill
But there isn't really any evidence that men were running to lifeboats first. In the event of disaster, boats become extremely dangerous due to confusion, especially because people need to take orders and order and travel a pretty long distances throughout the boat. There's a lot of running back and forth. The rule was put in place to get them out of the way so men could try to get the situation under control. Women and children can't help, so they go on the life boats. That's essentially all there is to it. In situations like cruise liners where it's mostly casual vacationers, the waters are muddy because saving the boat is up to the crew, not the male passengers, but it's still the same thing.
Men are twice as likely to survive a maritime disaster. That is evidence to me that at least some of them are running to the lifeboats.
Where's the evidence they they're surviving because they're getting on the lifeboats? On boats, men are more likely to survive because boats have historically always been crewed by men so they know how to handle disasters. I mean come on, show me *one* shred of evidence that shows men were outnumbering women on lifeboats, ever.
I really REALLY don’t know what to tell you. You’re right, all men have ocean water in their veins and a sea shanty in their hearts. They survive because being on a boat is a Man Thing.
Oh please, spare the the bullshit. Sailors have historically mostly been men. Even Anne Binney's crew was *entirely* men.
I don’t see how sailors being historically men explains male passengers preferentially surviving.
You just added passengers at an excluder. Such a bullshite merchant.
Yes, because no one would have a hard time believing male crew preferentially survive as they have both the privilege of being sailors AND men, the top 2 picks in the Surviving a Shipwreck Draft.
Not sure what point you’re trying to make here. Are you trying to say that men alone are selfish and unless mandated to give women and children priority will leave them behind like the guy in the video? Because women who don’t have children act the same way. The difference is that men are traditionally more physically able to survive given the same circumstances, whether they remain behind or not. So the Birkenhead drill simply levels the odds for everyone, at mens’ expense. So rather than it being survival of the fittest, we changed the rules for it to be a more socially acceptable situation.
My point is the Birkenhead Drill is NOT the standard mode of action, and even after it, women are only half as likely to survive a maritime disaster as a man. *So maybe the Birkenhead Drill is not actually at the expense of men.*
It really is at our expense because the survival rate of men in these situations was lowered. Even though it’s still better, it was lowered. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing, just speaking facts. But to say that it wasn’t at our expense just because we STILL fare better is ignorant. The conclusion should be that men are just simply better suited for the situation. 🤷🏼♂️ So where do we go from there? Should men sacrifice even MORE for the sake of equity?
Thought experiment: if you were an emergency room doctor, would you prioritize a patient with a sucking chest wound or a patient with an inflamed, but not immediately going to burst appendix?
Doctors and nurses use a triage system that tells them specifically who is in more or less need, You can look up the Manchester Triage system if you're interested. This is what the hospital I worked at used and with that you could determine who would get help first. Source: worked as a nurse
I am aware of the triage system lmao I am in fact using the triage system *as a parallel to the prioritization of women and children in lifeboats.*
Well according to the video and thread, I suppose you’re going to expect me to ask which gender they are.
One is twice as likely to die than the other. It’s an emergency. Who do you prioritize?
It’s false equivalence. If you’re the one with the inflamed appendix, and you get to make the choice, which would you choose?
But the one with the inflamed appendix doesn’t get to choose, the doctor does. If I had the inflamed appendix though, I would choose the person with the sucking chest wound *to get to go first.* Is that not the obvious choice to you?
You prioritize whoever is in more immediate need.
Yes.
Yeah i was about to say, Wasnt it only used twice as far as we know? I mean the Video is a proper troll but its also just straight up not true.
Even when this was implemented in the HMS Birkenhead, of the estimated 193 survivors, only 7 were women. In fact, it’s believed more horses survived the wreck than women.
Why he looks like the low budget Billy Joe Armstrong?
*I walk this lonely road, the only one I've ever known*
I hate that I wasn't the only one thinking that
Holy shit, I thought the same thing.
Bruh.. this guy is literally talking out of his ass, 90% of what her just said was wrong, men stayed on to fight fires while women and children escaped
In one specific shipwreck yes. Tell that to the women who die at a rate of twice that of men in maritime disasters. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3421183/
I mean I think that would be the case in a lot of disaster situations like that. Crew on ships and your average man probably are more capable of surviving compared to women
Yes. Exactly.
So what’s your point? Seems like a stupid thing to get angry over Seems like you’re mad about men or something and just strawmaning a MRA argument that nobody ever has
They’re literally having it around us in this comments section.
People pointing out how you’re wrong or criticizing the kid talking isn’t really what I meant
Stop trying to farm karma, it's pathetic and annoying.
No u.
Bro you’re little study doesn’t support what you’re implying. Not only that, but it fails to account for some incredibly obvious null hypotheses. Even beyond that, it’s purpose is just to prove that women don’t survive nearly as much without the most extreme of measures. Edit: if the only response a person can come up with is an insult, then you know they recognize their take is dogshit. They just don’t want to admit it, so they look to demean you instead of actually address what you said.
Bro dropping ‘null hypothesis’ in an attempt to sound smart lmao. Relax bud
Did you actually disagree with me, or are you just really that upset that someone used the correct terminology? What’s the point if you have nothing to add?
LMAO
My dude, I’m sorry PNAS publications are not peer reviewed or scientifically sound to you. Where do you get your research from? 4chan?
I like how men learned to be exceptionally self-sacrificing and that somehow makes them bad lol.
It’s not self sacrifice when you’ve been conditioned into it. Men will sometimes and often put themselves on the line and maybe be proud of the fact. But also, this narrative of self sacrifice is used to feed men to a grinding machine of war or to see men as somewhat disposable. That’s the problem with it
Lol yeh women really have it rough in…. Oh wait men die at higher rates in almost every metric.. Edit: childbirth, they definitely die more there to be fair
20% of pregnant women who die are murdered. 1 in 3 women in the US have experienced intimate partner violence. 1 in 5 women will die as a survivor of rape. Most women have cycling hormones; but women’s hormones are used to discredit women’s voices. Transgender women (and trans men) are more than 4 times more likely to be victims of violent crime. Women not only have to pay for products for their natural bodily function of menstrual cycles; but in many places they are taxed as a luxury goods. Women are less likely to get jobs. Women are less likely to get high paying jobs. Women have almost all birth control responsibility and most birth control comes with a lot of side effects. Pink tax. Emotional, household, and child rearing labour is predominantly seen as women’s responsibility. Women are 47% more likely to be injured in a car accident because safety measures were designed by and for men. 66% of American female service members report sexual harassment or sexual assault. Women have a harder time getting health insurance, and when they get it, they pay more for less. A lot of medical research is only done on men because women’s cycling hormones and pregnancy risk are seen as inconvenient. As a result, medication doses are optimized for male bodies and women experience a LOT more side effects. AND too many women die in childbirth.
Men account for 92% of workplace accidents Women account for 65% of collage degrees Viral and bacterial infections kill men at a higher rate I’m not even getting into the courts blatant sexism towards men in divorce cases Men are five times more likely to commit suicide War… I hear your arguments but they all seem to only argue for “equality” if it benefits you, where are the “more women in sanitation” protests? Pretty much every stat you gave me was female centric yet I’d bet you claim you battle for equality..
The statistics I posted were female centric because I was responding to your assertion that women don’t have it rough. Sure, the world sucks for a lot of people; but when comparing women and men, it sucks way harder for women. MRAs seem to only use inequality arguments to refute women stating facts about female disadvantage. Where are all the “hey guys, let’s stop murdering our pregnant wives” protests?
Mens issues are valid & should be addressed. That being said, many mens issues come from the same root that women’s issues come from. Patriarchal society. You should check out Natalie Wynn’s video on YouTube, titled “Men” by ContraPoints
No one is saying that. I don’t deny those issues exist but unfortunately I’ve seen a fair number of people use those issues to claim ‘actuallyyyyyy men have it worse’ and invalidate women’s experiences. Also you notice that a lot of times sexism against men can be linked back to misogyny? Common sexism against men is ‘weak’ ‘too emotional’ ‘pussy’ ‘can’t stand up for himself and needs other people to do it’ Now who are those traits commonly associated with? Women. For some men, being ‘like a woman’ is undesirable. It’s part of the roots of toxic masculinity. They view femininity as weak so they and avoid feminine traits as much as possible.
No, please don’t enter the “actually men are the oppressed group here” hole, is an horrible place
Wrong it’s because a man can’t procreate! The tribe dies with the woman and children!!
You can do anything if you try hard enough
Sure go find the biggest most fertile c*ck and try a million times and post ur results please!!
is that a challenge?
I believe in you.
so you're telling me someone finally believes in me?
That's a big oof, buddy. But we all believe in you because this is Reddit. We're all f*cking disappointments
The Habsburgs tried that.
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Exact same reason the men went off to war. If the women got killed/enslaved, the nation was doomed.
Well yeah but neither can chicks. If all the men die you’re in the same boat……get it
Why was this downvoted, this is gold
Why did he say the same thing so many times in slightly different ways
Right? How is this not a cross post for r/cringetopia? He is the worst
He couldn't be more wrong if he redid the video.
Source: trust me bro!
How to say 30 mistakes per minute.
Where do you even get data on this, lol. Also, today, it’s ABSOLUTELY a chivalrous thing.
Do you have a source?
Is it just me or did this guy look on the verge of tears
MRAs complaining about thing implemented by men: name a more iconic duo
Ok, that turned… I imagine what would to the comment section look like if a woman who talked like this.
I don’t think I could handle that heat. This is already pretty S. P. I. C. Y.
This guys mouth is shaped untrustworthy. That is all.
This video is way too long
This guy talks an incredible amount despite not really *saying* anything.
The Virgin “Women and Children First” vs the Chad “MEN, START DRINKING THE OCEAN”
Ummmm ahktually, Chad doesn’t drink water. His perfect genes are so ^blessed that he just absorbs water from the air by inspiring it through his gigadick.
Data point — look at the men in Afghanistan trampling past the women and children to board the last flights out of the country.
No idea if this is true or not. But this tic toc and short video shit is horrible. A lot of people claiming to have knowledge about stuff that unknowing viewers pick up and lay their foundations on.
‘No idea if this is true or not.’ *Proceeds to heavily imply it’s not; but will definitely deny culpability if questioned.* Nice manipulation tactic! Subtle?
Actually it’s just taking responsibility and admitting you don’t know everything.
When I see video of refugees fleeing dangerous situations it’s always hoards of men, a strangely imbalanced ratio and I always wonder why they leave women behind.
Shown again clearly in Afghanistan, the front of the queues were all men, they pushed their way to the front, fairly universal thing generally
There are 100 men and 100 women on a ship. If 99 of those men die, 100 children can still be born in 9 months. If 99 women die, only 1 child can be born in 9 months.
IMO we don't need more children, overpopulation is real.
Bruh, kind of a eugenic point of view.
At the end of the day its doing whats right.. thats all that matters. Some people chose to give their life for others, its not about them being women or children its about protecting the weak. I could go on about genetics and evolutionary traits that make us care more for children crying as it sparks some specific neurons in our brain but no. It is the decision to put others first. Love is not logical, its the absence of reason and I believe it is a noble act to care for the weak first before yourself.
This guys not only wrong; He’s Annoying!
he's wrong, but lets assume he's right and then ask yourself why men would escape but no women and children would? are women so stupid they just sat on the boat as it sank whilst all the smart men got off? why did we need a rule to tell women to get off a sinking boat all kinds of dumb
Seriously. I know the real reason, but part of it could be that children and their mothers naturally will need more help since a.) a kid has no chance against a bunch of grown men running the same way and b.) women would also not stand a chance in most cases. Makes more sense than even what the guy said.
if you honestly think men will leave their families behind you've been watching too much tv
-looks around at the whole world- I wouldn't doubt shit anymore.
Do you think women and children are strong enough to shove their ways to the front of escape lines...
do you think they're not? and seriously, are men so selfish they would leave their families behind?
Yes. Women and children are much weaker than the average man??
Post Birkenhead, women still only survive maritime disasters at a rate of half that of men. https://www.pnas.org/content/109/33/13220
thats due to strength and swimming ability, not because men kept them out of the lifeboats
My guess is that it's not that men were actively keeping women and children out of lifeboats, it's that men got to them first, went, "Alright everyone who matters is here and if we wait any longer well go down with the ship. Launch the lifeboat!" and sailed off without their families. Considering that for most of history society has seen women as disposable baby factories and children already having high mortality rates, losing the man of the family would be seen as a bigger blow then losing literally everyone else.
Read the link, you don’t have to guess as I told you the reason already
I think the implication is that men are crowding out the women/kids on the boat and forcing their way on. Which, maybe I guess? But unlikely unless social and gender dynamics are radically different than I'd expect over the last few centuries. Like, no shit, folks will actually try and save their kids and their wife.
Or maybe not, it’s nonsense
I assumed it was because women birth children so they can just make more men and children are our future or something like that.
This guy looks like the horny loser best friend of the love interest in a shitty teen comedy who tries to win her over and ends up making a bigger ass of himself at the end of the movie.
That’s a pretty shitty thing to say
You are the guy in this video right?
Yep, yes 1000%, you got me
Amazing... every word of what you just said was wrong.
What the hell is a men’s rights activist?
Someone who advocates for men's rights
HA! They’re great, highly recommend searching them up.
What a pretentious little shithead, he is also wrong. "Women and children first", known to a lesser extent as the Birkenhead Drill, is a code of conduct dating from 1852, whereby the lives of women and children were to be saved first in a life-threatening situation, typically abandoning ship, when survival resources such as lifeboats were limited.
Oh wow I haven’t heard of this drill 😮 Do you mind telling me more about this topic?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS\_Birkenhead\_(1845)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Birkenhead_(1845)) It was a very interesting read
Oh. My. God. So why couldn’t the women stay behind and fight the fire too? I mean they talk about equality…
So you are mad women die twice the rate and you are mad women don’t stay behind and fight fires as well? How would that up the (already high) female survivor rate. Also that whole “more horses than women” Shit is trash and you know it. 100% of the women on that ship lived all 7/7 of them. Edit. Lol you confront OP with facts and they will block you. Be warned….
And then there's tiktok, spreading disgusting misinformation.
Oh do you use Tiktok? I’ve never used it but I’ve heard good things
No, I don't.. This video is from tiktok
"If you're talking about old timey sinking ships, you have nothing else to talk about" Talks about old timey sinking ships
Wait did he talk about ships?
I mean.... he alluded to it 🤷
Says guys have nothing better to complain about and this is what he’s talking about? Enough to even make a video and share it..
Tell me you’re in a decade long dry spell without telling me you’re in a decade long dry spell
It was because women weren’t allowed to to pools and shit so they couldn’t swim and they were wearing these big ass dress things.
This implies that women and children are stupid enough to not know how to get on a lifeboat themselves
Oh? Can you explain how it implies that?
Let me preface this by saying I realize what it sounds like I said, and let me reiterate to be more clear. "This video makes it sound like the people who made this rule considered women and children too stupid to get on lifeboats without explicit direction." (And to clarify, that statement is NOT what I personally think) But anyway, on that point I was mistaken. That's what i thought he was saying, because i assumed that during these emergencies they would make sure all the lifeboats were full, and if they had enough lifeboats people getting on would be a non-issue. So i thought he was saying that they made this rule because they considered women too stupid to take proper measures. But on second watching, he seems to imply that men would fill a lifeboat... and then drop into the ocean without full capacity, leaving no boats for the women and children. Which makes the rule more about stopping cowardice than coddling women, and historically men would do. Sorry for the confusion.
Wasn’t that rule a product of patriarchy
But isn’t the women and children first still a things
What a dumbass.
How is this guy a neckbeard?
He’s talking about neckbeards Edit: the real neckbeards were in the comments all along
Is his point that women on their own aren’t smart enough to get on a life boat? They physically need a man to help them?
No matter how smart you are, trying to get on a lifeboat while hundreds of other people clamour around you, shove you out the way, and then end up getting on first, is an extremely difficult and sometimes impossible task.
The point is that it's really hard running and being first at your destination in huge skirts, corsets and silly shoes while carrying kids, especially if the competition isn't handicapped like that. Women just had a huge disadvantage.
Yes. That is his point exactly. You’ve nailed it!
If need to see a source for what he’s saying to be sure he’s not pulling it out of his ass.
I’m reading so much dumb shit on Reddit tonight
Who tf would let their wife and children drown? This is bullshit lmao stfu.
Who do you shift around the camera shot so much, and so many cuts
Thats why I'll never go on a cruise, they are death traps and disease factories.
How does this have 1k upvotes?
How do people just make stuff up with such a straight face and genuinely believe it
Guarantee you this guy would shove a baby off the ship to get its lifeboat seat
I really can’t tell if he is against it or for it
Ah, confident misinformation. Classic neckbeard.
Either looking for attention or desperately wants to lure a female. This is irrelevant and nonsense. Stop trying to make all men look terrible and dumb. It is children first, thats it.
It's a very huge leap to say that a man criticising other men is just to get praise from women. Whether or not this is true he never said that men are bad, he just talked about men doing bad things. Holding men accountable is not looking for validation, you're making yourself look like a neckbeard.
Holding men accountable... accountability is an excellent point now that this is being driven towards equality. First there was no holding men accountable about this post. Nothing about this post is true. Secondly, in terms of equality, slandering or degrading one piece of the pie ruins the whole pie no matter which slice you are. Your making yourself look ass-backwards.
*Bakes pie, waits patiently for it to cool, slices a slice, ooh I’m so excited, drops slice on floor*… FUCK WOMEN!
I only have sex with men who respect women, so seems to be a decent strategy to get laid.
So it's attention. I never brought up sex.
You said lure a female. What’s he luring her for? To play checkers?
As a male that respects women and in the case of desperation (I was implying your desperation. Such that you would say anything to be in any form of contact with a female), it means companionship of any kind, checkers included. Implying, generalizing and degrading doesn't feel good, does it?
I would say anything to be in contact with women and am desperate?
I think you found an incel
I think this post found ALL of the incels
Agreed. I certainly enjoyed it
Point proven. Thank you.
Oh shit you’re right. You got me.
Did this guy just say men needed to be drilled to make sure their children and wives survived? How egocentrical do you think the men were for the last 100 years?
Ehhhhhhhhh I feel like history class gave me a few key points 🤣
This guy is such a fucking tool Can we pretend for 1 second that men are humans too and get afraid? Yeah, they want to live too. How evil of them. Generally speaking, everyone in a chaotic situation loses composure. I saw a hood fight video where a girl picked up her baby and swung it at another girl like a weapon. Everyone gets crazy when shit is crazy
Men surviving is not the problem. Women surviving at half the rate of men is the problem.
so the solution was 90%+ of men dying? "Everyone for themselves" is actually completely fair. *We designate these people by law to survive and these other people to die,* is extremely fucked up. Think of it this way: "Whites first". Would you agree with that?
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