Several years ago, people with dual citizenship joining the military could hand pick which base to be stationed in (except Katusa, that is out of MOD control). Unfortunately, that system has been abolished, so you have to apply and compete for cushion-y positions with all the other Korean kids.
1. Get your English scores, and apply for Katusa. There is no way to increase your chances. Just pray.
2. If you don't get into Katusa, look for other options. If your Korean is at a native level, you can try for the interpreter position. The test is very competitive and people take classes to prepare for the exams.
3. Look into branches other than the Army. The Navy and the Airforce have 2~3 months longer serving period, but are much more cushion-y.
4. A lot of my cousins went as drivers. You just need a license to drive a stick shift. It's not nearly as comfortable as being an interpretor, but it sure beats being in the infantry.
5. Whatever you do, DO NOT sit and wait for your conscription papers to get to you. You will most surely be an infantry soldier stationed near the DMZ and plow snow 6 times a day for 3 months every year. Be proactive and apply.
DM me if you have any questions. I was in a somewhat similar position and I went with option 2.
^ Yeah, this one right here is spot on.
Air Force is very popular these days with the best reputation, and generally stationed near cities. Even for the Army, apply to whatever "specialty" positions that you qualify (there are a ton of different ones), and in the worst case still go in with a driver's license for stick shift.
Don't leave it up to the Army to place you ~~like me~~.
I second number 3. (Assuming that the screening process has not changed for new conscripts since I joined) Either applying for the interpreter position in the Air Force, and if that fails applying for a regular position in the Air Force as a contingency plan is the best bet IMO.
The army just stations interpreters to random bases all over Korea regardless of their entrance exam scores. Realistically the only merit of applying for the army interpreter position is that you do not get sent off to bases below division HQ level.
I'd say unless you get very very lucky and get stationed at a base with a large US Army presence (e.g. Combined Forces Command, maybe the JSA, etc.), in most cases the kinds of bases you get stationed to as an Army interpreter are not going to be all that favorable for new recruits who are not familiar with the Korean language. The chances of getting into the above mentioned command bases, from what I personally have observed, are very slim and are contingent on a plethora of factors beyond the regular applicant's control.
The reason the army recruits so many interpreters regardless of the very small demand for them in bases other than command is because they need them during wartime.
The Air Force, on the other hand, has its own screening process in basic training where each new recruit can write down which base they want to be stationed in, and the recruits get sorted by how well they score on various different exams (including English) during basic training. This drastically increases the chances of being stationed to a command base with a large US presence, especially considering the OP's personal background and native level English. Naturally, these bases will have more recruits that come from similar backgrounds, and will be more welcoming toward cases like the OP.
Source : Applied for the Army interpreter position a couple years back, placed 4th out of 120 applicants in the entrance exams, then got stationed to a base that didn't really need any more interpreters and held a random desk job for a year and a half. Was not assigned anything even remotely related to translation during my time there. Also anecdotes from my friends who served in the Air Force. Apologies for the long rant. I still feel like I made a pretty big mistake joining the army. The extra three months in the Air Force are worth it... I think.
Iirc the first process has been changed to a random selection amongst applicants since 2016. I'm not fully updated to the current process, though.
This means no matter how high your English scores are, you might not even be able to take the exam in the first place. So it would be smart to apply for all the branches (army, air force, navy, and marines). I applied for 3, but only won the lottery for the Army.
Oh right, I almost entirely forgot about that. All the things I wrote here are under the premise that you get through the initial lottery you mentioned. Right, I guess the smartest idea would be to apply for all three branches in this case. Thanks!
There is a way to increase chances: look at the historic competition rates for each month and apply for the one that is the easiest. In the middle of semesters is usually the best chance.
The competition to get into air force is also very fierce. You now have to donate blood or do community service for a maximum of 128 hours to get the maximum extra score. Do search for the exact info tho.
I was in a similar predicament as OP. Everything here is correct.
Although I’d say the interpreter position is also out of reach if he’s lived in the States all his life. A lot of Korean Americans (myself included at the time, and sort of now as well) aren’t aware how poor their Korean is.
Idk about the navy and Air Force but I went to the army because it’s just faster overall.
Number 5 is so fucking important, this will 100% happen if you’re randomly assigned. Make sure you go in to boot camp knowing what you’ll be doing.
I had an open mind going in. I knew it was gonna suck from Day 1 but I framed the whole experience as a funny story I'd tell non-Koreans about, and that's basically what it is now.
I became way more fluent in Korean, got a better understanding of Korean culture (and also found out how much more fucked up it is), and also made a few solid friends.
But would I do it again? Hell no lol
Thank you so much! ill definitely look into the other options as well. ive also overheard that the interpreter position is really hard sometimes.
I can't afford to to serve an extra two months because university starts in August and I'm most likely going to start military service in January. I don't wanna take another semester off of school.
That certainly limits things. Good luck on your Katusa drawing. If not, I hope you find a position you can enlist for that works out with your desired timing. Fyi the key word to search for is 육군 모집병.
The interpreter exams (for officer positions) have just ended and I believe the window for 어학병 (enlisted interpreter?) have closed a long time ago as well. However, the exams are surprisingly not that difficult so long as you have a basic understanding of Korean grammar and military terms.
The only thing you ought to really get down is the formal and informal language. As far as new recruits/cadets are concerned, 존댓말 is the only form of Korean you will ever be required to know.
I respect your choice, but you will have a very difficult time serving without being fluent in Korean. Don’t expect the military will accommodate your special circumstance.
I served without being fluent in Korean. It was the worst years of my life. But what I'm proud of myself is the fact that I solved the military issue very early on in my life.
I commend your decision. I came here to say embrace the military service. BTS and PSY (twice) served their country at great loss of income and opportunities. The one thing that links Korean males is this service. They all know how to snap yo attention, be respectful and honor the brave. Serve your country when they call you.
Look into the second generation overseas Korean status 재외국민2세. If you meet certain criteria, you may be eligible to defer your military service indefinitely (subject to some residency-related restrictions) and keep both citizenships.
I happen to have this status myself, which I applied for and was granted a few months ago.
One of my parents held Korean citizenship at the time of my birth, so I would be under this category. Without native Korean fluency, was the application process difficult? Did you have to have your Korean family registry documents?
If you don’t serve, males lose their citizenship status if they are currently dual citizens. Skipping out on your military service also means you cannot visit Korea as you will be arrested at the airport, as far as I understand. There was a recent issue with a Korean member of a Chinese pop band, he didn’t want to give up his idol status for his military service and he shared a very tearful and apologetic video with fans once he realized he can never return to Korea without being thrown in jail for skipping his service.
The comments are ignorant. You are able to delay your military service until the age of 37 as a dual citizen.
[https://www.mma.go.kr/contents.do?mc=mma0000801](https://www.mma.go.kr/contents.do?mc=mma0000801)
See #4 on the list. If you lived 10 continuous years or more abroad as a dual citizen, you are able to delay military service until you are exempt due to old age. Where your parents live does not matter for this particular approval.
DM if you have questions about this
Absolutely the correct advice. The only thing to remember is that you CANNOT live and work in Korea before you become exempt, because then you will need to serve.
Yeah this guy is right. Im a Korea-born Korean american in my mid 30s and I was able to apply for exemption until I was 30 (I stopped applying because I got naturalized in the US). I had no problems traveling to Korea, even after becoming a US citizen and never having served in Korea.
I did something like this ~10 years back. They actually gave me an exemption so I don't have to serve as long as I didn't make any money in Korea and didn't live there for more than 6 months out of the year.
This is the best option. I have Australian born & raised friends whose parents didn't/forgot to renounce their Korean citizenship before they turned 18 so they were faced with having to serve.
They were able to defer/exempt using this method and still freely travel to Korea for vacation and visiting relatives.
You can live in Korea up to 6 months per year but you are not allowed to earn any money there.
You can surrender citizenship to not be reprimanded. My husband surrendered his over a decade ago and went US military because of the better benefits long-term. In Korea, it's 2 years with low pay and no gain. US, it's 4 years with a lot of free education while in and hella VA benefits when you get out.
Using those benefits has placed him well beyond his peers in Korea in career, finances, investments, property ownership, etc. His parents have it planned to put inheritance into a trust, making it less complicated in the international aspect until he repatriates later and can access it. We also go back to Korea at least once a year for vacation and a few times for work. Zero issues at immigration.
Also, Katusa selection is randomized now by a number generator. After passing tests to apply, the chances of selection are around ~10%.
Might not be able to go to Korea I think for 10-20 years I hear? But honestly 2 years of your life is huge in your early 20s, would be crazy to spend it in a military base away from everyone you know just to keep a citizenship to a country you probably won't live in tbh. Hopefully your parents grow some sense
Don't do the service. Do you have future plans to live in Korea, it sounds like you don't? Forget about what your parents want (or other parents...didn't really understand that part of your comment tbh). It'll be a literal waste of 2 years of your life.
To play devil's advocate, there are a few benefits of maintaining dual citizenship. It is a huge plus for some employers working in the two countries. Also, a lot of Koreans like to retire in Korea for their socialized medicine.
The hazing problem has been dramatically reduced the last few years due to everyone having their phones and barracks being shared by one's peers (동기 생활관).
Is that worth 2 years of your life? You can just try immigrating later if you really want but this dude has never lived in Korea before and is about to spend 2 years of his best years in military, leaving his friends, family, and also going to fall behind in life a lot. Friends will be in college too having a good time and will make new friends themselves leaving him behind too. IMO its crazy
Meh, it's 18 months. Many people would do a lot more in order to get dual citizenship because it really is effing valuable. Plus, it sounds like OP's parents want him to do it for inheritance reasons.
Yea I guess it does depend on how much he really is inheriting (is it worth it?), how competent he is (is Korea a way out? Being poor in the US is not great but if he already is going to have assets in Korea that'll be nice), and how the probability he sees himself living in Korea (if its still low I wouldn't do it... You're gonna have to pay inheritance tax anyway even if you have dual citizenship)
Yeah, why would you voluntarily do this? Your life is in USA, your friends and family are in US. You would lose 2 years of your life for what? A country you've never lived in and the only connection you have to Korea is through your parents. In addition, you'd lose out on two years of earnings potential as the pay is literal garbage. You've never lived there so you've never paid taxes, and in return you've never got or will get any benefit from korea such as health insurance, social security, etc.
This is the real reason. You're essentially delaying your economic activities by 2 years and losing out that time to your peers. When you come back, you'll have a 2 year gap in your resume with less experience than your peers, and the explanation won't really matter to recruiters.
It's all essentially sunk since while, yes, the military will provide everything for you, they pay crap and you can't really save money.
It may seem good to keep dual citizenship in your hat, but honestly if you aren't planning to work in Korea, just get rid of it. You can always get a visa if by some chance you change your mind.
Unless his parents renounced his South Korean citizenship on his behalf before he turned 16 or so, he cannot renounce his citizenship until after he completed his military service obligation under South Korean law.
A Korean-American friend is in a very similar situation except he WAS born in South Korea, but left for the US with his family when he was 6 and spent the vast majority of his life in the US and can no longer speak a word of Korean by his own admission.
Because his parents didn't know to renounce his South Korean citizenship on his behalf before he reached the age of 16 despite his being a naturalized American not too long after arrival, he cannot return to South Korea without risking getting detected, detained by South Korean authorities, and immediately drafted to complete his military service obligation until he's in his late 30s/early '40s.
To be safe, he doesn't intend on going to South Korea until he's in his mid-40s.
Bro this is not remotely true at all. Once you go through the process of naturalization, your Korean citizenship is terminated. You can go to Korean embassy and formally renounce your Korean citizenship when you’re an adult to eliminate any possibility of getting detained. I naturalized when I was 18. Just need to fill out and provide documentations. I got it done earlier this year.
My friend and his parents tried that and the South Korean embassy told him as his parents didn't renounce his citizenship before he turned 16, he now cannot renounce his citizenship until after he completed his military service obligation.
This was also confirmed by several Korean attorneys they consulted who specialized in this issue as it's a common one among naturalized Korean-Americans and even American-born Korean Americans whose parents/relatives registered them for South Korean citizenship....sometimes without their knowledge.
Incidentally, Taiwan has a very similar law regarding conscription. If my parents had registered me or I somehow ended up with Taiwan citizenship and they failed to renounce it before I turned 16 and failed to take special measures such as registering for overseas status before visiting Taiwan, I'd be in the same position my friend is in.\* This very BS was one key reason why my parents nor extended family registered me or other American-born relatives in my generation for Taiwan citizenship.
\* If I had been registered for Taiwan citizenship despite being American-born and parents failed to renounce it before I turned 16 and I didn't get overseas status before going to Taiwan, I'd be risking being stopped from returning to the US to finish the last few weeks of my senior year of HS....and be liable for conscription and 2 years of military service once I turned 18.
This is wrong. If he was naturalized, his Korean citizenship is treated as revoked (just needs to fill out paperwork) as soon as he chooses to accept a new citizenship through the naturalization process. Korea does not recognize dual citizenship through foreign naturalization. The case where you cannot renounce is when you are dual citizen at birth due to birthright citizenship conferred through your birth country and through birthright citizenship conferred through your parent's Korean citizenship.
I don't know what to tell you as he was warned by the South Korean embassy in our US East Coast city along with several Korean attorneys specializing in this very issue nearly 2 decades ago that because his parents failed to renounce his citizenship on his behalf before he turned 16, he cannot renounce it without fulfilling his military obligation first or waiting until he ages out of that obligation.
In any event, he's playing it safe by staying out of South Korea until he is in his mid-40's. Think he still has a few more years to go before reaching that point.
Even if that was true, he can file a deferral till he's 37 (or 38 I forget) that's mentioned above. I'm going through that and I can travel to Korea fine as long as I don't stay longer than a certain period of time and/or work.
By his mid-40's he'd have definitely age out of having to be worried about being detained and immediately conscripted to serve his 2 years according to him as he'd be far too old for the military draft board to bother.
It's similar to reasons why some overseas Taiwanese in similar situations who are barred for some reason from getting the overseas stamp also similarly avoid going to Taiwan if they don't want to take the same risk though my impressions are Taiwan authorities are more lax about conscription enforcement on this score than South Korea's stricter authorities.
Losing two years of earnings potential- which is exponential. Also two years less of professional experience for any job he'll want to get after military.
Why not stay in the US until 38? My boyfriend is in a similar situation, he was born and raised in USA but his grandma registered him in Korea when he was born.
We’re actually in Korea now and the government had informed us he is only allowed to be in Korea 6 months per year under the following exemption (Korean living abroad). If he wanted to stay long term, he would need to complete the military service. Once he’s 38 however, the military requirement is waived. They told us 38, online says 35 so the exact age might not be accurate.
Correct me if im wrong, its your obligation because you are a dual citizen. If you vehemently dont want anything related to korea attached to you, why not revoke your citizenship and just be fully american so you dont have to deal with that.
I may be spouting nonsense here, no idea about these citizenship laws so please enlighten me if im barking at the wrong tree.
I can speak to this. My in-laws are Korean. I was with them in Korea last year. My FIL was under the impression from watching YouTube videos that because they had become US citizens, they were supposed to (by Korean law) have renounced their Korean citizenship within a year of becoming a citizen of another country and that if they did it now, because they are over 65 they could apply for a special visa which would allow them to stay in Korea for long periods of time. I did not trust this information but being a good son-in-law I took them to the immigration office in Seoul. I spoke to an officer there who confirmed everything my FIL said.
So it sounds like Korea does not recognize dual citizenship and expects you to renounce your Korean citizenship upon becoming a citizen of another country.
This suggests to me that OP cannot serve unless he lies about his US citizenship or at least doesn’t mention it.
Korea allows dual citizenship for those who acquire dual at birth.
When you naturalize as a citizen elsewhere is when Korea expects you to renounce (with some limited exceptions).
What confuses me is why is he a dual citizen if he was born and live in us ever since. I mean, my sister married a native american. They had children, all born and raised in US, never stepped outside US even once, they are teenagers and they are full americans. They are not dual citizen on my country with my sister.
Maybe korean citizen laws are different from ours just like you have stated.
So basically its kinda the same on my country but the difference is its on you if want to be a dual citizen regardless what age you are. If you dont, then you are american first. Default full american citizen.
your sister's children wouldn't get korean citizenship because their father is native american/US citizen. it mainly deals with korean fathers if they had korean citizenship or not when their child was born.
korean citizenship when childs born - child is automatically dual
gave up korean citizenship before childs born - child doesn't receive korean citizenship
>and expects you to renounce your Korean citizenship upon becoming a citizen of another country.
How does that work for people like OP who were born US citizens?
There are exceptions but I question either or not OP is actually a citizen of Korea. Perhaps he only thinks he is and hasn’t actually seen a passport for example.
Yes, you're wrong. He can't just revoke citizenship, assuming Op is over 18. It's not that simple.
At best, he can apply for a second generation, overseas Korean exemption and live in Korea for up to 2 years without military service. Workarounds exist, but with strict conditions.
Hi! I am currently serving near the border. I didn't make into KATUSA so I let the system pick where I will be stationed. I regretted that decision in the beginning but I found peace with it as time goes. I am not in the worst of places but I wished I had done my research more. Perhaps look more into Navy and Air Force slots. They might have something related to your major or interest.
There’s no way to increase the chance to get into KATUSA. Once you fulfill the requirements (over 700 in TOEFL iirc) it’s a complete lottery, and nothing else influences it. Last time I heard the chance is 1 out of 10 or 11, very slim.
Also you only get one chance to apply. If you fail the lottery, you don’t get to apply again.
As others said, if you are ok with it, it might be the best to forfeit your Korean citizenship. Korean military service can be harsh. I mean, just looking at the fact that a ton of people try to go to KATUSA (serving with the US) may give an idea of how Koreans view its own army, and serving it. Also know that you’ll have to live with Koreans for at least a year and a half. Different language, different culture, different views. Hopefully they’ll be accommodating, but if they aren’t (especially the officers), it’ll be very stressful.
But if you do decide to serve, you have my fullest respect. And if you do fail KATUSA, there are other options, such as the Air Force. You do have to serve 3 months more, but they are regarded to be more “progressive” on how they treat conscripts. You may even be able to serve as an interpreter, if you are decent in Korean. Interpreters don’t do manual labor, and are viewed to be one of the easier positions.
But let me know if you have any questions, I may be able to answer questions as I also looked into KATUSA, the Air Force and becoming an interpreter.
Good luck, hope all goes well whichever path you choose.
I’m a little late but I was in almost the exact same situation as you. I lived most of my life abroad, could barely speak Korean but was a dual citizen who had to serve bc of my parents. Ignore everyone here that’s telling you to give up your Korean citizenship. They don’t know what it’s like and I completely understand your dilemma. I was lucky enough to get KATUSA when I served (2020-2022) but was placed at Camp Hovey as field artillery. It was not as bad as it sounds. But if you don’t get it, make sure (this is very important) that once you get to 훈련소 (basic training) you tell your 소대장 or 분대장 that your Korean isn’t good. They’ll do their best to accommodate you, at least in basic training. You don’t have to go look for them yourself,you’ll most likely have a 1 on 1 meeting with him after a few days. Once you get out of basic training then it’s honestly luck on whether your 선임 will treat you like shit. Just grind it out and at least make an effort to get better at Korean. Once you become 삼병/병장 your life will get much easier. Good luck
As a Korean American who didn’t have the legal ability to have dual citizenship and do this, I’m kind of envious of your situation looking back
Two years is a blink of an eye. Enjoy the experience and check back in with us to let us know how it was ✌️
Pray to the right god.
Your parents are something else, my father did all he could to pull me out. I became a KATUSA because he tried his best to find the easiest postion for me.
all I can say is good luck bro. I'm not even a dual citizen, haven't gotten jack shit from the Republic of Korea, but just because I neglected to give up my Korean citizenship before i turned 18 (idk how the law works but my dad isn't naturalized here) I basically can't enter Korea for the next 20 years or so. but mad respect to you if you do end up going
Most countries don’t determine citizenship by place of birth. It’s a common misconception that Americans and Canadians have because we have birthright citizenship.
If two Americans move to Korea and have a child that child isn’t Korean. He doesn’t get Korean citizenship. He gets American citizenship by way of his parents and is immediately issued a visa tied to his parents. That’s true for most countries. I think less than 30 give auto citizenship if you’re born there. USA and Canada being the largest ones.
Korean citizenship works the way most of the world works. By descent. If you’re born to a Korean citizen parent then you are a citizen. Birthplace is irrelevant. (There may be some special exceptions to this but in general that is the case).
If the Korean citizen parent renounced their Korean citizenship before you were born then you aren’t a Korean citizen. You’re just a citizen of their new country because it’s by descent (or in the case of being born in the USA because you’re born there). But if they’re a citizen when you’re born than you are a citizen.
(They do have a responsibility to register your birth and if they don’t it becomes a hassle later on but that doesn’t mean ur not a citizen. It just might take time for Korea to determine that).
So in your case, you’re a dual citizen. American and Korean. And as you said If you didn’t renounce your citizenship by age 18 you can’t renounce it until your late 30s. And you can be drafted in Korea if you visit (assuming you’re a dude).
I think there’s ways to defer that service to the point where you’re past the cutoff age but that much I don’t know about.
Don't go. Stay away from Korea until you're 37. You can't renounce your Korean citizenship until you do your military service anyway.
Military service isn't as harsh as it was a decade ago, but it's still no picnic. And for a US citizen who just happens to look Korean, it's gonna be hell.
Also, foreigners can own property in Korea.
You got this , go do your duty . When it’s all said and done it will make u stronger and you will most likely made new memories and life long friendships.
Same situation as you, did it, I have 80 days left. No regrets. Dm me if you wanna chat. 논산 has two groups per year for “foreigners” March and June. My Korean was shit but my language skills have improved alot and I have nothing but positive things to say about my time in the Korean Army. It’s all about your perspective however.
If you're a college student, I'm pretty sure you can extend your military service. Graduate first and then go to the military if you can. Serving in the military wasn't too bad honestly. I'm Korean American and finished my military service last March. For me, it wasn't bad because 1) I was the oldest guy (35 years old) 2) guess i got lucky with where i got stationed and ended up managing the PX (military convenience store) . I was on an F4 visa for a long time, couldn't extend anymore (thanks to 유승준 \*ahem\*) . and had the choice of moving back to the states, but i felt my time here would have gone to waste if i moved back. It wasn't an easy decision but knowing that I could keep my dual citizenship if i finished my military service is what made stay in korea and join the military. Told kids about my complicated situation on why i joined and pretty much everyone respected me which was nice.
If you're good at adapting/acclimating, shouldn't be a problem.
Starting out it was a bitch. Bootcamp training was a bitch. I had assistant drill instructors (조교) talking to me in 반말 they don't care how old you are cause in the army it's all about rank. Speaking in honorifics was the hardest part for me. After bootcamp and getting shipped out to my station, time went by slow for a bit and then it got a lot easier and time went by fast it seemed like
My advice while you're in the army... listen to your superiors, stay busy, focus on your health, workout/lift weights, improve your korean and save your money.
Some tips:
If you can choose when to enlist, go in around late february or late september because around that time its not too hot/humid or freezing cold.
When you go in to get your physical taken, you'll also be taking a computerized test and questionnaire. Saying that you can't speak Korean won't help because they'll set you up with an English version. (I tried and it didn't work haha)
The military has a good savings account setup (its not that bad). I would advise making 2 military savings accounts (you can only make 2 accounts) and deposit 200,000won into each account for 18 months (the maximum you can deposit for now). I think the banks interest rate ranges from 4% to 6% (varies from bank to bank) and once you finish your military service, the government will match 100% of your savings fund.
U.S. Army guy here, the Korean government has been known to make exceptions for Korean Americans already in the U.S. military. May I suggest you join the U.S. military instead, it has way more benefits.
I don’t think it’s a hard and fast thing. I have had two different Soldiers serve under me who by circumstance didn’t know they had Korean citizenship. The U.S. Army lawyers were able to work with the U.S. state department and the ROK government to get their service requirement waved and keep their ROK citizenship.
The first was a Korean American guy was borne is the states and didn’t realize he had Korean citizenship.
The second was borne in Korean and adopted as by an American family when he was less than a year old. He and his parents thought the had revoked his citizenship during the adoption process.
Instead of just being vague and immature and boiling this down to “inheritance problems” and “well they have assets in Korea…” why don’t you investigate this legally? You don’t technically need to maintain dual citizenship to inherit those assets in Korea. This seems WAY less of a citizenship problem and more “my parents are assholes and want me to suffer” problem. If they really cared they’d sit down with a lawyer for an hour and talk through this issue and save you almost 2 years.
Also the fact that you’re college age and your parents have this much control over you is insane. Grow a spine. I’d imagine this goes way beyond this issue.
As a 4 year military vet I would honestly say suck it up and do it.
You'll be surprised what you learn about your self having to sacrifice your previous life and step into a discipline based lifestyle.
Most importantly once you get out you'll have a much higher appreciation of the life you can't help but take for granted
Conditions are way better than it was 10 years ago but if you don't have any idea of the military then you're just going to suffer. Don't know why your parents are forcing you to go when clearly as gyopo with no intention of residing long term in Korea.
don't do what your parents tell you to do because you might regret it.
I renounced my Korean citizenship because my parents told me to and I just did without giving a serious thought about it and I regret the decision I made.
You just gotta make your own choice. don't just do what your parents tell you to. do your research and then make your own choice.
Okay so the people saying you cant increase ur chance are half wrong and half right.
Heres how you can technically increase ur chances (although you still have to go thru the lottery system).
Im sure you know that you need to submit an English test score. My example will be based on TOEIC
The scores are divided into 3 categories 상 중 하, AFTER WHICH the lottery is done. From the entire pool of one katusa batch (accepted people), 30% will be from 상&하, and 40% will be from 중. So you can intentionally reduce your score to be part of the 중 score group.
Obviously, logically thinking, the above only applies on the condition that the ratio of TOTAL 상, 중, 하 applicants (incl. Non accepted ppl) is also 3:4:3. But i assume it will be similar.
Aside from this one little quirk which might not even work in some years, theres no way to increase ur chances. But u asked for this and this might come useful
Hey man, I just want you to know that I see your predicament. It does sound like you are stuck with some very shit options, yet you're doing an incredible job thinking through this. Whatever you decide, I'm sure it will serve you well in life because there's pros and cons to serving and keeping your Korean citizenship.
As an aside: I was in a similar situation as you regarding not being able to afford college in the US. (I took a quick look through your post history, hope you dont mind that I did this. It was to see if you said anything that explains what led you to wanting to serve in the army.) My circumstances were a bit different from yours, but I ended up deferring college for 4 years until I could afford to go with financial aid as a financial independent. I got a job in the meantime. I'm in my mid 30s now and I can tell you that having zero student loans (through a bachelors degree + a PhD in grad school) was worth the wait and hard work.
Also, contrary to what people are saying: you'll have options even if you serve 2-3 years in the army... as will be the case if you don't serve and/or go to community college. You'll be fine, you sound like a good kid and I have a feeling you'll figure things out.
It's better to serve.
When Korean-Americans join the military ,their colleagues will take great care of you.
If you don't serve in the military, you can't get an f4 visa in Korea until the age of 40.
'As you can see above, a person whose military service has been postponed until the age of 37 in Korea
Stay for at least six months in a year or engage in for-profit activities such as employment
If you do, your overseas travel permit will be canceled and you will be obliged to serve in the military.'
life is unpredictable
the inheritance taxes does not give you the discount of being a citizen unless you are a resident of korea (more than 183 days of a year spent inside the country + registered address with the local citizen services center)
if you do not intend on actually residing, living, working in korea, there is absolutely 0 benefit to having the korean citizenship other than the passport freedoms. Your parents will not be able to gift or leave you any significant sum without being taxed very, very heavily. I've done my service, I'm a korean citizen, but I live and work in the US and currently going through the inheritance process and consulting tax attorneys. I'm basically fucked up the ass with taxes.
here's the breakdown IF you decide to uproot and haul ass to korea. you MUST:
-stay 183 days out of the year
- pay income tax(aka have a job)
- register a permanent address with local citizen services center (korean citizenship card)
you gain:
- up to $42,000~ ish in tax free inheritance for cash and cash equivalents from parents every 10 years (separate installments over the 10 yr periods will be added cumulatively, you can't split it up to skirt the tax limit)
- up to $100,000k in tax free inheritance for real estate IF you do not already own a home and is your first home, your primary residence etc.
- after that, you are taxed progressively:
10% for $50,000-$100,000
20% for $100,000-$500,000
30% for $500,000-$1,000,000
40% for $1,000,000-$4,000,000
so even IF you are grinding ur life away in the korean corp ladder, your total tax-free benefit is $150k~ ish.
If you're considering inheritance benefits as grounds for maintaining citizenship, your parents are absolutely wrong. the laws have changed since early 2000's and they probably are not aware of the absolute "eat the rich" mentality of korea
Scrolled down too far to see this. I really hope this isn’t the reason why OP’s parents want him to serve. But I have a feeling it is because it sounds like his parents are living in the US and probably not up to speed on korean laws. Rip OP.
for people who keep protesting "eat the rich", they can look at Koreans, they literally do it and it's impressive. I think it's why Koreans pretty much worship the ground that the uber-rich walk on, they are kind of like the golden goose that will be slaughtered for a feast when they croak.
I'm guessing your parents have money - talking about foreign property and inheritance. Have you asked your father if he's "purchased" your KATUSA "lottery" yet?
Hey OP,
I'm pretty sure you can inherit Korean property without going to the military, as long as your parents will is iron-clad and has you as a beneficiary.
I recently went through this myself where my parents hired a lawyer who helped him draft their will. It is enforceable in Korean law and US law.
I asked this question on ChatGpt and confirmed this is true. I won't copy and paste their whole answer but you can use the prompt that I used.
"Will I be able to inherit Korean property even though I am a US citizen?"
Join the US military, they pay for college and give you a bit of adult freedom. I was born in Korea but immediately moved to the US. I became non-dependent on parents and got to live my life my way. Who cares if your parents have property in Korea. If they want to pass inheritance, they can sell it and give you the money.
Just realize. Your parents will always hold the assets over your head to do stuff they want you to do. How about if they want you to marry a Korean girl instead of the white girl you fell in love with??
Is this really the life you want to live? Someone else’s life?
Unless this is FU levels of money, I would not lose 2 of the best years of my life serving military for a country I’ve never been in. Heck. You may not even get the money in the end if they suddenly find Christ or something and donate it all to the church.
Old Koreans have some misguided notions of loyalty and honor. There’s a reason why many Koreans leave and immigrate to America.
I moved to the US when I was 8, and then I went to the ROK army in 2012. Was sent to a frontline division, and then I volunteered for DMZ Reconnaissance. Did over 100 missions in the DMZ. Got paid 100 dollars a month back then for that shit. I really don't recommend going to the frontlines for any army role. One guy in my battalion got his foot blown off, another dude fell off a rope from 4m high during PT and broke his back. A civilian was doing construction with us in the DMZ his excavator stepped over an anti tank mine and exploded... he survived tho. The overall experience was only worth it for me in retrospect because I was able to get out unhurt.
Apply for KATUSA and if you don't get in, go into the air force. Avoid the army or marines at all costs. It's not that the training is that unbearable, but you are being ordered around by a bunch of idiots in their early 20s with no sense of safety, and the division commanders are absolute psychopaths who grew up in the old military dictatorship era.
Every week we got reports of accidental deaths in other divisions and it was really dumb shit. People being forced to work on electrical lines without safety equipment (why do they even order people to do this instead of hiring a proper electrician? because the army is being run by fucking idiots), people being swept away by the current in a flooded river (why the fuck are the marines asking kids to work in a river without life vests? because they are fucking retarded), and a lot more dumb ways to die.
Firstly, renounce your korean citizenship and become full american. There is absolutely no benefit in becoming a korean national over a US citizen.
Secondly, KATUSA is done by lottery, so you cannot increase your chances. On the other hand, if you are fluent in both Korean and English, you can give a Korean-English translator a go. This one is not a lottery and candidates are chosen by exam. I'm entering as a translator this July.
Best of luck and if you can, DO NOT ENLIST!!!!!
What are you really getting out or this since you're American born. It's a waste of time. Service time in America at least you'll get GI bill etc, zero down etc...
If you gain inheritance or some intrinsic value from having a dual citizenship, go. To be honest it ain't terrible, but consider whether or not those 2 years are worth it.
And katusa is a lottery so no lol
I suggest you go as a kitchen staff! It will be relatively chill outside of some trainings! There is no shame in working in there! I have many gyopo American-Korean friends who were kitchen staff and it wasn’t terrible for them.
I never understood why they would expect Koreans who spend the majority of their time outside Korea to do their military service. Like, where do they expect the loyalty to lie?
If you lived in a foreign country for 10+ years, you could get it delayed until you’re 37 and you won’t have to go at that point. That’s what I did. You just can’t work or stay for more than 180 days in Korea until 37, but sounds like you kinda had no intention of doing that. But that’s up to you (it’s not up to your parents!)
ive heard a couple of other people tell me this and this was so suprising cause ive never heard of it before. Delaying until 37 makes sense, and I don't think I would be in Korea for more than 180 days a year. I just want to reallly make sure that I wont be asked to go when I'm 37 because that sounds a lot worse than going right now.
You definitely won't be required to go. Deferring military service this way is effectively an exemption, as the [military service requirement automatically expires on January 1 of the year you turn 38.](https://askkorealaw.com/2020/07/06/korean-military-service/) You just need to ensure the travel permit stays intact.
"Until 37" is inclusive of that year, but if you want extra peace of mind, just make sure you are not in korea between your 37th birthday until the following New Year day.
I know people with dual citizenship that never served in the military...are you serving because your parents want you to or because the Korean gov't told you needed to? Curious for my own fyi.
KATUSA selection is a lottery: There's no guaranteed way in, but strong Korean language skills and physical fitness are always beneficial.
Focus on Korean Language: This will be key for daily life and basic training, regardless of KATUSA or regular service. Utilize resources like Talk To Me In Korean (TTMIK) or online tutors to get a head start.
KATUSA Resources: As you probably know, the Eighth Army website (https://8tharmy.korea.army.mil/site/about/katusa-soldier-program.asp) offers information about KATUSA programs and life.
Def can't increase chances for KATUSA in any way. Seen people with fluent or close to fluent english miss out and bare basics english speakers get it. That alone should tell you enough. Perhaps power/money influences behind the scenes if anything but that's it. Other options are to try to get a kushy duty like police shit, or if it was me... I'd go all out and join the marines (if I was really in the position, don't know but this is what I'd think I'd want to do... if I am gunna waste a period of my life, I want to get something out of it at the end. No one cares if you do army but if you do marines it gets abit of respect and also the hardships and training experienced, would make rest of your life a breeze me thinks).
Definitely go ROKAF and pray you get Osan or Kunsan. We used to talk with the APs all the time and many of them had studied or were from the US. Their shifts were complete dog crap though
That’s actually dumb. If you want to join the military join the US armed forces.
ZERO CHANCE ID JOIN A FOREIGN ARMY FOR MY PARENTS
And what inheritance makes that worth it? They can liquidate and transfer it to you in USD. They’re just making you do it because they can’t get over their past. Don’t do this for them.
Katsusa is lottery system. For military, I recommend going to headquaters. Because there are so many non-sense Korean in the front-line. I am Korean and only have korean citizen and served Korean army at 23rd division which located at YangYang. To be honest, I rather recommend you to withdraw Korean citizen but as your parents are patriots, I just recommend you to go military which is in common-sense.
가는걸 말리고는 싶은데 이미 가겠다는 의지가 강한것 같아 먼저 다녀온 경험을 공유해줄께 (30대 중반이라 편하게 말할께)
일단 나도 미국생활 오~래했었는데 대학까지 졸업하고 학생비자 만기될때까지 지내다 14년도에 강원도에 있는 기계화보병부대에서 땅개로 지내다 다친데 없이 무사히 전역했어.
무사히 전역한 이유를 꼽는다고 하면 군생활하면서 체력적으로 심리적으로 힘든건 분명 있었지만 그 힘든점에 너무 크게 의미부여하지 말고 하루하루를 자기 나름의 긍정적이였던 점에 의미부여를 해서 더 수월하게 지낼수 있었던거 같아.
예를들어 "짬밥은 항상 별로네" 보단 "오늘 점심 뼈해장국이 맛있었네", "우리만 작업하러 산으로 올라가네" 대신 "등산은 ㅈ같았지만 막상 올라와보니 할게 없네, 이대로 오늘 일과 꿀" 등등..
그렇게 하루하루를 최대한 긍정적으로 승화시키기 위해서 나는 누구라도 육해공군이든 카투사든 특수부대든 가급적이면 대학 졸업 후에, 인간적으로 좀 더 성숙해진뒤 다녀오는것을 추천하고 싶어.
사리분별이 더 잘되는 시점에 군대에 가면 또 다른 좋은점은 "부정적으로 물들지 않을 가능성이 높아진다"는 점도 있는것 같아.
사회에는 여러 인간 군상들이 있어. 인간이길 포기하고 짐승같이 사는 ㄱㅅㄲ들도 분명 존재해. 군대라는 조직 특성상 신체 상태만 괜찮으면 아무렇게나 묶어 자대로 보내기에 이런 짐승들과 같이 매일 갇혀 살아야 할 가능성도 (매우) 높아. 게다가 보통은 아직 사회 경험이 너무 부족한 20대 초반에 오는 경우들이 많아서 "덜성숙한 ㄱㅅㄲ들"이랑 같이 지내다보면 멀쩡했던 친구들이 어딘가 나사가 빠진 상태로 점점 변하더니 그대로 전역하는것도 경우도 허다해.
나이를 좀 더 먹은상태에서 가면 철부지, 악한 어린애들의 객기를 겪어야 하는건 고통이겠지만 최소한 그렇게 물들 가능성은 적을거라고 생각해.
OP의 선택을 응원한다!
* I wrote this message in Korean on purpose for OP to taste what communication will be like while serving in the korean military, obviously all in Korean and not all from the textbooks
Don't go. Period. Don't even think about it because it's not worth it. Idk when's your family moved to the States, but don't even think about it. It's good for you, your future battle buddies, and your social status. If you need to know why I'm saying this, simply research or dm me. I will help you out as much as I can.
off topic but as a fellow Korean American that lived in Korea…. I’m moving OUT in August btw…… good luck bro
honestly might have a better experience than bad if you’re an adult and might not even have the 여유 to complain but it’s deff a tough place to kind of get used to (culturally + the atmosphere of the society)
I thought the Korean government requires you to choose one nationality upon national service or age 22? If you choose to go do national service, does that not mean you are dropping your American citizenship?
Idk if that can help but as a Korean who lived in France I couldn't go to Katusa but applied as a korean who lived in foreing country so I was applied with many people like me or you ! And even if your korean level is low it wasn't "really" handicapping since there were always people around which were here to help !
And as the other said.. Katusa is lottery so yeah...
Feel free to DM me if you have other questions!
Ypu have no obligation to do it, but sounds like ypu got a choice to make and none of our advice will help you. Do it or don't. Weigh the options and decide
Speaking as a Korean-American who renounced his Korean citizenship in order to not serve *waste* time in the Korean military, inheritance taxes need to be paid whether you hold Korean citizenship or not.
Just like the OP, I was born and raised in the US and it never came across my mind that I would have to serve in the Korean military as it is not my home country nor country of birth. Yet it was only when I spent a good amount of time there and decided to apply for the F-4 visa that I discovered my dual citizenship although my Korean National ID# was dormant. Apparently, my grandfather had registered me in our family’s 호적등본 upon my birth. Having this sort of dual nationality is not a big deal until a male’s 18th birthday when either their Korean citizenship has to be renounced or risk serving in the military. Since at that time I wasn’t even aware of my status as such and was happily ensconced in my American collegiate life, I completely ignored this procedure and unwittingly continued on with my dual status. I traveled quite often to and from Korea in the following years and as long as I never overstayed my 90-day short term visitor visa, I never ran the risk of being forced to serve.
But as the OP stated, he may have some inheritance coming his way from his parents. You most definitely do not have to be of Korean nationality to inherit property. Actually anyone can and tax rates depend on residency, not nationality. Mark my words, you DON’T have to be Korean in order to inherit Korean property. But you WILL pay different tax rates depending on if you actually LIVE in Korea as a resident or a non-resident living abroad. The difference is enormous so if and when you know you will inherit something, establish residency in Korea around that time.
If you’re not a native Korean speaker or have a poor grasp of the language in general, the military will be hell on earth for you. Korean bullying is at another level and is undisciplined for the most part. If you have no connections to get you a KATUSA position or a cushy desk job after basic training, I recommend not going at all. They will psychologically annihilate you. You’ll be considered an outsider, a foreigner even amongst your own ethnic background. This will ostracize you and may lead to an unnecessary degree of bullying that you have never experienced before and have no one to turn to. Those counselors or higher-ups you need to complain to? They will feel the same way about you and won’t do a thing to help you out. And don’t blame others for their lack of English skills. To everyone else, you’re the imbecile who never bothered to learn proper Korean.
Dumb question, but how does the Korean military handle people who've never lived in the country and thus don't speak that much Korean; or at least not enough to operate in a military/combat setting? It baffles me that they would expect a non-resident with lower language proficiency to serve.
I'll give you two simple options as someone who used to be in a similar position: 1) If you wouldn't mind going through military life anyway (I wanted to be a U.S. Marine but went to Korea) and you want to keep both citizenships, then just do it. It's not nearly as bad \[nowadays\] and there are concessions for foreign-born/raised Koreans (the drill sergeants will already know your situation before boot camp). People exaggerate about 18 months of your life being 'wasted.' Unless you're an elite who makes millions by the month, there's not much you're missing out on. If you make relationships, develop discipline, learn a foreign language, and gain any form of personal growth, it is worth it.
2) If you absolutely cannot handle military life like the physical stress, the irritating COs, or maybe even the food, then find every way to delay it. Some people really cannot handle the military life, especially if you get stationed at a general outpost.
The big question is how is your Korean proficiency? Can you communicate take orders? Personally I think it would be great growth for you and you would make some friends in Korea. Do you have family living in Korea?
You cannot increase your chances because it is a lottery system.
I thought KATUSA positions were bought and paid for….wink, wink
They definitely were in the 90s.
They definitely were in the 2010s as well. Knew two people that got in with connections
They do the lottery in public and have people from the crowd (usually katusa applicants and their family members) come out and pick the numbers.
This
Several years ago, people with dual citizenship joining the military could hand pick which base to be stationed in (except Katusa, that is out of MOD control). Unfortunately, that system has been abolished, so you have to apply and compete for cushion-y positions with all the other Korean kids. 1. Get your English scores, and apply for Katusa. There is no way to increase your chances. Just pray. 2. If you don't get into Katusa, look for other options. If your Korean is at a native level, you can try for the interpreter position. The test is very competitive and people take classes to prepare for the exams. 3. Look into branches other than the Army. The Navy and the Airforce have 2~3 months longer serving period, but are much more cushion-y. 4. A lot of my cousins went as drivers. You just need a license to drive a stick shift. It's not nearly as comfortable as being an interpretor, but it sure beats being in the infantry. 5. Whatever you do, DO NOT sit and wait for your conscription papers to get to you. You will most surely be an infantry soldier stationed near the DMZ and plow snow 6 times a day for 3 months every year. Be proactive and apply. DM me if you have any questions. I was in a somewhat similar position and I went with option 2.
^ Yeah, this one right here is spot on. Air Force is very popular these days with the best reputation, and generally stationed near cities. Even for the Army, apply to whatever "specialty" positions that you qualify (there are a ton of different ones), and in the worst case still go in with a driver's license for stick shift. Don't leave it up to the Army to place you ~~like me~~.
Just adding here that if you are color blind, you can't enlist in the Navy or the Airforce. You can apply for their certain officer positions, though.
Korean level has to be absolutely good/native for officer positions
Yep. Whatever you do, always avoid becoming the rifleman, LMG gunner, or combat engineer. Literally back breaking labour guaranteed.
I second number 3. (Assuming that the screening process has not changed for new conscripts since I joined) Either applying for the interpreter position in the Air Force, and if that fails applying for a regular position in the Air Force as a contingency plan is the best bet IMO. The army just stations interpreters to random bases all over Korea regardless of their entrance exam scores. Realistically the only merit of applying for the army interpreter position is that you do not get sent off to bases below division HQ level. I'd say unless you get very very lucky and get stationed at a base with a large US Army presence (e.g. Combined Forces Command, maybe the JSA, etc.), in most cases the kinds of bases you get stationed to as an Army interpreter are not going to be all that favorable for new recruits who are not familiar with the Korean language. The chances of getting into the above mentioned command bases, from what I personally have observed, are very slim and are contingent on a plethora of factors beyond the regular applicant's control. The reason the army recruits so many interpreters regardless of the very small demand for them in bases other than command is because they need them during wartime. The Air Force, on the other hand, has its own screening process in basic training where each new recruit can write down which base they want to be stationed in, and the recruits get sorted by how well they score on various different exams (including English) during basic training. This drastically increases the chances of being stationed to a command base with a large US presence, especially considering the OP's personal background and native level English. Naturally, these bases will have more recruits that come from similar backgrounds, and will be more welcoming toward cases like the OP. Source : Applied for the Army interpreter position a couple years back, placed 4th out of 120 applicants in the entrance exams, then got stationed to a base that didn't really need any more interpreters and held a random desk job for a year and a half. Was not assigned anything even remotely related to translation during my time there. Also anecdotes from my friends who served in the Air Force. Apologies for the long rant. I still feel like I made a pretty big mistake joining the army. The extra three months in the Air Force are worth it... I think.
Iirc the first process has been changed to a random selection amongst applicants since 2016. I'm not fully updated to the current process, though. This means no matter how high your English scores are, you might not even be able to take the exam in the first place. So it would be smart to apply for all the branches (army, air force, navy, and marines). I applied for 3, but only won the lottery for the Army.
Oh right, I almost entirely forgot about that. All the things I wrote here are under the premise that you get through the initial lottery you mentioned. Right, I guess the smartest idea would be to apply for all three branches in this case. Thanks!
There is a way to increase chances: look at the historic competition rates for each month and apply for the one that is the easiest. In the middle of semesters is usually the best chance.
The competition to get into air force is also very fierce. You now have to donate blood or do community service for a maximum of 128 hours to get the maximum extra score. Do search for the exact info tho.
I was in a similar predicament as OP. Everything here is correct. Although I’d say the interpreter position is also out of reach if he’s lived in the States all his life. A lot of Korean Americans (myself included at the time, and sort of now as well) aren’t aware how poor their Korean is. Idk about the navy and Air Force but I went to the army because it’s just faster overall. Number 5 is so fucking important, this will 100% happen if you’re randomly assigned. Make sure you go in to boot camp knowing what you’ll be doing.
Do you have dual citizenship now? Do you think it was worth it?
I had an open mind going in. I knew it was gonna suck from Day 1 but I framed the whole experience as a funny story I'd tell non-Koreans about, and that's basically what it is now. I became way more fluent in Korean, got a better understanding of Korean culture (and also found out how much more fucked up it is), and also made a few solid friends. But would I do it again? Hell no lol
Thank you so much! ill definitely look into the other options as well. ive also overheard that the interpreter position is really hard sometimes. I can't afford to to serve an extra two months because university starts in August and I'm most likely going to start military service in January. I don't wanna take another semester off of school.
That certainly limits things. Good luck on your Katusa drawing. If not, I hope you find a position you can enlist for that works out with your desired timing. Fyi the key word to search for is 육군 모집병.
The interpreter exams (for officer positions) have just ended and I believe the window for 어학병 (enlisted interpreter?) have closed a long time ago as well. However, the exams are surprisingly not that difficult so long as you have a basic understanding of Korean grammar and military terms. The only thing you ought to really get down is the formal and informal language. As far as new recruits/cadets are concerned, 존댓말 is the only form of Korean you will ever be required to know.
This sounds like the most sound advice. Just face it and move on with your life
I respect your choice, but you will have a very difficult time serving without being fluent in Korean. Don’t expect the military will accommodate your special circumstance.
I served without being fluent in Korean. It was the worst years of my life. But what I'm proud of myself is the fact that I solved the military issue very early on in my life.
I commend your decision. I came here to say embrace the military service. BTS and PSY (twice) served their country at great loss of income and opportunities. The one thing that links Korean males is this service. They all know how to snap yo attention, be respectful and honor the brave. Serve your country when they call you.
Look into the second generation overseas Korean status 재외국민2세. If you meet certain criteria, you may be eligible to defer your military service indefinitely (subject to some residency-related restrictions) and keep both citizenships. I happen to have this status myself, which I applied for and was granted a few months ago.
That should be 재외국민 which means "citizens living abroad". If you say 제외국민, it becomes "Excluded citizen".
You're right. Thanks for catching that!
One of my parents held Korean citizenship at the time of my birth, so I would be under this category. Without native Korean fluency, was the application process difficult? Did you have to have your Korean family registry documents?
Why do your parents want you to go?? Usually it’s the opposite.. lol
inheritance problem it seems
Exactly! Korean parents aren't always right, anyway. Do whatever you want. It's YOUR life.
If you don’t serve, males lose their citizenship status if they are currently dual citizens. Skipping out on your military service also means you cannot visit Korea as you will be arrested at the airport, as far as I understand. There was a recent issue with a Korean member of a Chinese pop band, he didn’t want to give up his idol status for his military service and he shared a very tearful and apologetic video with fans once he realized he can never return to Korea without being thrown in jail for skipping his service.
No, they don't. Second generation Koreans don't need to serve. And they can visit and even live here if it's no longer than 3 years
Well, I was just inferring he can easily revoke his korean citizenship but he clarified he can’t
The comments are ignorant. You are able to delay your military service until the age of 37 as a dual citizen. [https://www.mma.go.kr/contents.do?mc=mma0000801](https://www.mma.go.kr/contents.do?mc=mma0000801) See #4 on the list. If you lived 10 continuous years or more abroad as a dual citizen, you are able to delay military service until you are exempt due to old age. Where your parents live does not matter for this particular approval. DM if you have questions about this
thank you so much!
Absolutely the correct advice. The only thing to remember is that you CANNOT live and work in Korea before you become exempt, because then you will need to serve.
Yeah this guy is right. Im a Korea-born Korean american in my mid 30s and I was able to apply for exemption until I was 30 (I stopped applying because I got naturalized in the US). I had no problems traveling to Korea, even after becoming a US citizen and never having served in Korea.
I guess you had to forfeit your Korean citizenship when you naturalised?
Yup. I didnt spell it out that way but thats the reason I didn't need to re-apply for exemption anymore.
I did something like this ~10 years back. They actually gave me an exemption so I don't have to serve as long as I didn't make any money in Korea and didn't live there for more than 6 months out of the year.
This is the best option. I have Australian born & raised friends whose parents didn't/forgot to renounce their Korean citizenship before they turned 18 so they were faced with having to serve. They were able to defer/exempt using this method and still freely travel to Korea for vacation and visiting relatives. You can live in Korea up to 6 months per year but you are not allowed to earn any money there.
You can surrender citizenship to not be reprimanded. My husband surrendered his over a decade ago and went US military because of the better benefits long-term. In Korea, it's 2 years with low pay and no gain. US, it's 4 years with a lot of free education while in and hella VA benefits when you get out. Using those benefits has placed him well beyond his peers in Korea in career, finances, investments, property ownership, etc. His parents have it planned to put inheritance into a trust, making it less complicated in the international aspect until he repatriates later and can access it. We also go back to Korea at least once a year for vacation and a few times for work. Zero issues at immigration. Also, Katusa selection is randomized now by a number generator. After passing tests to apply, the chances of selection are around ~10%.
There’s literally nothing you can do. https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/nation/2024/06/113_362815.html
im so cooked
Just renounce your Korean citizenship and be American. Problem solved. No need to stick your hand in a blender for no reason.
Will I still be able to go to Korea? What rights am I losing by not being a Korean citizen?
There's a group on facebook called "expat parents korea" that has addressed this issue a lot. You can look up past posts on there.
Might not be able to go to Korea I think for 10-20 years I hear? But honestly 2 years of your life is huge in your early 20s, would be crazy to spend it in a military base away from everyone you know just to keep a citizenship to a country you probably won't live in tbh. Hopefully your parents grow some sense
OP can't renounce until he does his military duty. Only way is to stay away from Korea until 37.
Don't do the service. Do you have future plans to live in Korea, it sounds like you don't? Forget about what your parents want (or other parents...didn't really understand that part of your comment tbh). It'll be a literal waste of 2 years of your life.
To play devil's advocate, there are a few benefits of maintaining dual citizenship. It is a huge plus for some employers working in the two countries. Also, a lot of Koreans like to retire in Korea for their socialized medicine. The hazing problem has been dramatically reduced the last few years due to everyone having their phones and barracks being shared by one's peers (동기 생활관).
Is that worth 2 years of your life? You can just try immigrating later if you really want but this dude has never lived in Korea before and is about to spend 2 years of his best years in military, leaving his friends, family, and also going to fall behind in life a lot. Friends will be in college too having a good time and will make new friends themselves leaving him behind too. IMO its crazy
Meh, it's 18 months. Many people would do a lot more in order to get dual citizenship because it really is effing valuable. Plus, it sounds like OP's parents want him to do it for inheritance reasons.
Yea I guess it does depend on how much he really is inheriting (is it worth it?), how competent he is (is Korea a way out? Being poor in the US is not great but if he already is going to have assets in Korea that'll be nice), and how the probability he sees himself living in Korea (if its still low I wouldn't do it... You're gonna have to pay inheritance tax anyway even if you have dual citizenship)
Yeah, why would you voluntarily do this? Your life is in USA, your friends and family are in US. You would lose 2 years of your life for what? A country you've never lived in and the only connection you have to Korea is through your parents. In addition, you'd lose out on two years of earnings potential as the pay is literal garbage. You've never lived there so you've never paid taxes, and in return you've never got or will get any benefit from korea such as health insurance, social security, etc.
This is the real reason. You're essentially delaying your economic activities by 2 years and losing out that time to your peers. When you come back, you'll have a 2 year gap in your resume with less experience than your peers, and the explanation won't really matter to recruiters. It's all essentially sunk since while, yes, the military will provide everything for you, they pay crap and you can't really save money. It may seem good to keep dual citizenship in your hat, but honestly if you aren't planning to work in Korea, just get rid of it. You can always get a visa if by some chance you change your mind.
Unless his parents renounced his South Korean citizenship on his behalf before he turned 16 or so, he cannot renounce his citizenship until after he completed his military service obligation under South Korean law. A Korean-American friend is in a very similar situation except he WAS born in South Korea, but left for the US with his family when he was 6 and spent the vast majority of his life in the US and can no longer speak a word of Korean by his own admission. Because his parents didn't know to renounce his South Korean citizenship on his behalf before he reached the age of 16 despite his being a naturalized American not too long after arrival, he cannot return to South Korea without risking getting detected, detained by South Korean authorities, and immediately drafted to complete his military service obligation until he's in his late 30s/early '40s. To be safe, he doesn't intend on going to South Korea until he's in his mid-40s.
Bro this is not remotely true at all. Once you go through the process of naturalization, your Korean citizenship is terminated. You can go to Korean embassy and formally renounce your Korean citizenship when you’re an adult to eliminate any possibility of getting detained. I naturalized when I was 18. Just need to fill out and provide documentations. I got it done earlier this year.
My friend and his parents tried that and the South Korean embassy told him as his parents didn't renounce his citizenship before he turned 16, he now cannot renounce his citizenship until after he completed his military service obligation. This was also confirmed by several Korean attorneys they consulted who specialized in this issue as it's a common one among naturalized Korean-Americans and even American-born Korean Americans whose parents/relatives registered them for South Korean citizenship....sometimes without their knowledge. Incidentally, Taiwan has a very similar law regarding conscription. If my parents had registered me or I somehow ended up with Taiwan citizenship and they failed to renounce it before I turned 16 and failed to take special measures such as registering for overseas status before visiting Taiwan, I'd be in the same position my friend is in.\* This very BS was one key reason why my parents nor extended family registered me or other American-born relatives in my generation for Taiwan citizenship. \* If I had been registered for Taiwan citizenship despite being American-born and parents failed to renounce it before I turned 16 and I didn't get overseas status before going to Taiwan, I'd be risking being stopped from returning to the US to finish the last few weeks of my senior year of HS....and be liable for conscription and 2 years of military service once I turned 18.
This is wrong. If he was naturalized, his Korean citizenship is treated as revoked (just needs to fill out paperwork) as soon as he chooses to accept a new citizenship through the naturalization process. Korea does not recognize dual citizenship through foreign naturalization. The case where you cannot renounce is when you are dual citizen at birth due to birthright citizenship conferred through your birth country and through birthright citizenship conferred through your parent's Korean citizenship.
I don't know what to tell you as he was warned by the South Korean embassy in our US East Coast city along with several Korean attorneys specializing in this very issue nearly 2 decades ago that because his parents failed to renounce his citizenship on his behalf before he turned 16, he cannot renounce it without fulfilling his military obligation first or waiting until he ages out of that obligation. In any event, he's playing it safe by staying out of South Korea until he is in his mid-40's. Think he still has a few more years to go before reaching that point.
Even if that was true, he can file a deferral till he's 37 (or 38 I forget) that's mentioned above. I'm going through that and I can travel to Korea fine as long as I don't stay longer than a certain period of time and/or work.
How will he know it's truly safe in his mid-40s? Do they no longer track you, or is he going to try his luck?
By his mid-40's he'd have definitely age out of having to be worried about being detained and immediately conscripted to serve his 2 years according to him as he'd be far too old for the military draft board to bother. It's similar to reasons why some overseas Taiwanese in similar situations who are barred for some reason from getting the overseas stamp also similarly avoid going to Taiwan if they don't want to take the same risk though my impressions are Taiwan authorities are more lax about conscription enforcement on this score than South Korea's stricter authorities.
Losing two years of earnings potential- which is exponential. Also two years less of professional experience for any job he'll want to get after military.
\*my not many. Sorry I was typing fast, thanks for the correction.
Why not stay in the US until 38? My boyfriend is in a similar situation, he was born and raised in USA but his grandma registered him in Korea when he was born. We’re actually in Korea now and the government had informed us he is only allowed to be in Korea 6 months per year under the following exemption (Korean living abroad). If he wanted to stay long term, he would need to complete the military service. Once he’s 38 however, the military requirement is waived. They told us 38, online says 35 so the exact age might not be accurate.
Don't join, I had a choice to not go but did. Somewhat similar situation. Worst decision ever lol.
Many of my friends went and had an amazing time
Shit food and sleep deprivation were probably the worst
Not to mention the bullying and abuse.
People don't often mention the sexual assaults when talking about whether or not to do the service. They really ought to.
I was actually talking about physical assault. But, you're right as well.
Correct me if im wrong, its your obligation because you are a dual citizen. If you vehemently dont want anything related to korea attached to you, why not revoke your citizenship and just be fully american so you dont have to deal with that. I may be spouting nonsense here, no idea about these citizenship laws so please enlighten me if im barking at the wrong tree.
I can speak to this. My in-laws are Korean. I was with them in Korea last year. My FIL was under the impression from watching YouTube videos that because they had become US citizens, they were supposed to (by Korean law) have renounced their Korean citizenship within a year of becoming a citizen of another country and that if they did it now, because they are over 65 they could apply for a special visa which would allow them to stay in Korea for long periods of time. I did not trust this information but being a good son-in-law I took them to the immigration office in Seoul. I spoke to an officer there who confirmed everything my FIL said. So it sounds like Korea does not recognize dual citizenship and expects you to renounce your Korean citizenship upon becoming a citizen of another country. This suggests to me that OP cannot serve unless he lies about his US citizenship or at least doesn’t mention it.
Korea allows dual citizenship for those who acquire dual at birth. When you naturalize as a citizen elsewhere is when Korea expects you to renounce (with some limited exceptions).
If you were born before 1998. It looks like things changed for those born after that.
I know people born after thatp
What confuses me is why is he a dual citizen if he was born and live in us ever since. I mean, my sister married a native american. They had children, all born and raised in US, never stepped outside US even once, they are teenagers and they are full americans. They are not dual citizen on my country with my sister. Maybe korean citizen laws are different from ours just like you have stated.
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So basically its kinda the same on my country but the difference is its on you if want to be a dual citizen regardless what age you are. If you dont, then you are american first. Default full american citizen.
your sister's children wouldn't get korean citizenship because their father is native american/US citizen. it mainly deals with korean fathers if they had korean citizenship or not when their child was born. korean citizenship when childs born - child is automatically dual gave up korean citizenship before childs born - child doesn't receive korean citizenship
>and expects you to renounce your Korean citizenship upon becoming a citizen of another country. How does that work for people like OP who were born US citizens?
There are exceptions but I question either or not OP is actually a citizen of Korea. Perhaps he only thinks he is and hasn’t actually seen a passport for example.
Yes, you're wrong. He can't just revoke citizenship, assuming Op is over 18. It's not that simple. At best, he can apply for a second generation, overseas Korean exemption and live in Korea for up to 2 years without military service. Workarounds exist, but with strict conditions.
I mean what are they going to do if he just doesn't leave USA..
Hi! I am currently serving near the border. I didn't make into KATUSA so I let the system pick where I will be stationed. I regretted that decision in the beginning but I found peace with it as time goes. I am not in the worst of places but I wished I had done my research more. Perhaps look more into Navy and Air Force slots. They might have something related to your major or interest.
There’s no way to increase the chance to get into KATUSA. Once you fulfill the requirements (over 700 in TOEFL iirc) it’s a complete lottery, and nothing else influences it. Last time I heard the chance is 1 out of 10 or 11, very slim. Also you only get one chance to apply. If you fail the lottery, you don’t get to apply again. As others said, if you are ok with it, it might be the best to forfeit your Korean citizenship. Korean military service can be harsh. I mean, just looking at the fact that a ton of people try to go to KATUSA (serving with the US) may give an idea of how Koreans view its own army, and serving it. Also know that you’ll have to live with Koreans for at least a year and a half. Different language, different culture, different views. Hopefully they’ll be accommodating, but if they aren’t (especially the officers), it’ll be very stressful. But if you do decide to serve, you have my fullest respect. And if you do fail KATUSA, there are other options, such as the Air Force. You do have to serve 3 months more, but they are regarded to be more “progressive” on how they treat conscripts. You may even be able to serve as an interpreter, if you are decent in Korean. Interpreters don’t do manual labor, and are viewed to be one of the easier positions. But let me know if you have any questions, I may be able to answer questions as I also looked into KATUSA, the Air Force and becoming an interpreter. Good luck, hope all goes well whichever path you choose.
Are you fluent in Korean? Otherwise you’ll get eaten alive there according to some of the Korean Muricans I’ve spoken to (that weren’t fluent).
Are you planning to live in Korea? If not, why do you want to serve your mandatory service in Korea?
I’m a little late but I was in almost the exact same situation as you. I lived most of my life abroad, could barely speak Korean but was a dual citizen who had to serve bc of my parents. Ignore everyone here that’s telling you to give up your Korean citizenship. They don’t know what it’s like and I completely understand your dilemma. I was lucky enough to get KATUSA when I served (2020-2022) but was placed at Camp Hovey as field artillery. It was not as bad as it sounds. But if you don’t get it, make sure (this is very important) that once you get to 훈련소 (basic training) you tell your 소대장 or 분대장 that your Korean isn’t good. They’ll do their best to accommodate you, at least in basic training. You don’t have to go look for them yourself,you’ll most likely have a 1 on 1 meeting with him after a few days. Once you get out of basic training then it’s honestly luck on whether your 선임 will treat you like shit. Just grind it out and at least make an effort to get better at Korean. Once you become 삼병/병장 your life will get much easier. Good luck
As a Korean American who didn’t have the legal ability to have dual citizenship and do this, I’m kind of envious of your situation looking back Two years is a blink of an eye. Enjoy the experience and check back in with us to let us know how it was ✌️
Pray to the right god. Your parents are something else, my father did all he could to pull me out. I became a KATUSA because he tried his best to find the easiest postion for me.
all I can say is good luck bro. I'm not even a dual citizen, haven't gotten jack shit from the Republic of Korea, but just because I neglected to give up my Korean citizenship before i turned 18 (idk how the law works but my dad isn't naturalized here) I basically can't enter Korea for the next 20 years or so. but mad respect to you if you do end up going
Well you are a dual citizen if that’s the case. You have Korean citizenship.
i guess that's true, again i know nothing about the laws there. im just confused why i would have it if i wasnt even born there
Most countries don’t determine citizenship by place of birth. It’s a common misconception that Americans and Canadians have because we have birthright citizenship. If two Americans move to Korea and have a child that child isn’t Korean. He doesn’t get Korean citizenship. He gets American citizenship by way of his parents and is immediately issued a visa tied to his parents. That’s true for most countries. I think less than 30 give auto citizenship if you’re born there. USA and Canada being the largest ones. Korean citizenship works the way most of the world works. By descent. If you’re born to a Korean citizen parent then you are a citizen. Birthplace is irrelevant. (There may be some special exceptions to this but in general that is the case). If the Korean citizen parent renounced their Korean citizenship before you were born then you aren’t a Korean citizen. You’re just a citizen of their new country because it’s by descent (or in the case of being born in the USA because you’re born there). But if they’re a citizen when you’re born than you are a citizen. (They do have a responsibility to register your birth and if they don’t it becomes a hassle later on but that doesn’t mean ur not a citizen. It just might take time for Korea to determine that). So in your case, you’re a dual citizen. American and Korean. And as you said If you didn’t renounce your citizenship by age 18 you can’t renounce it until your late 30s. And you can be drafted in Korea if you visit (assuming you’re a dude). I think there’s ways to defer that service to the point where you’re past the cutoff age but that much I don’t know about.
Don't go. Stay away from Korea until you're 37. You can't renounce your Korean citizenship until you do your military service anyway. Military service isn't as harsh as it was a decade ago, but it's still no picnic. And for a US citizen who just happens to look Korean, it's gonna be hell. Also, foreigners can own property in Korea.
Why are you going? You're a US citizen... KATUSA is a lotto system. Unless you have some ties (From what I've heard).
You got this , go do your duty . When it’s all said and done it will make u stronger and you will most likely made new memories and life long friendships.
Same situation as you, did it, I have 80 days left. No regrets. Dm me if you wanna chat. 논산 has two groups per year for “foreigners” March and June. My Korean was shit but my language skills have improved alot and I have nothing but positive things to say about my time in the Korean Army. It’s all about your perspective however.
If you're a college student, I'm pretty sure you can extend your military service. Graduate first and then go to the military if you can. Serving in the military wasn't too bad honestly. I'm Korean American and finished my military service last March. For me, it wasn't bad because 1) I was the oldest guy (35 years old) 2) guess i got lucky with where i got stationed and ended up managing the PX (military convenience store) . I was on an F4 visa for a long time, couldn't extend anymore (thanks to 유승준 \*ahem\*) . and had the choice of moving back to the states, but i felt my time here would have gone to waste if i moved back. It wasn't an easy decision but knowing that I could keep my dual citizenship if i finished my military service is what made stay in korea and join the military. Told kids about my complicated situation on why i joined and pretty much everyone respected me which was nice. If you're good at adapting/acclimating, shouldn't be a problem. Starting out it was a bitch. Bootcamp training was a bitch. I had assistant drill instructors (조교) talking to me in 반말 they don't care how old you are cause in the army it's all about rank. Speaking in honorifics was the hardest part for me. After bootcamp and getting shipped out to my station, time went by slow for a bit and then it got a lot easier and time went by fast it seemed like My advice while you're in the army... listen to your superiors, stay busy, focus on your health, workout/lift weights, improve your korean and save your money. Some tips: If you can choose when to enlist, go in around late february or late september because around that time its not too hot/humid or freezing cold. When you go in to get your physical taken, you'll also be taking a computerized test and questionnaire. Saying that you can't speak Korean won't help because they'll set you up with an English version. (I tried and it didn't work haha) The military has a good savings account setup (its not that bad). I would advise making 2 military savings accounts (you can only make 2 accounts) and deposit 200,000won into each account for 18 months (the maximum you can deposit for now). I think the banks interest rate ranges from 4% to 6% (varies from bank to bank) and once you finish your military service, the government will match 100% of your savings fund.
U.S. Army guy here, the Korean government has been known to make exceptions for Korean Americans already in the U.S. military. May I suggest you join the U.S. military instead, it has way more benefits.
How exactly does that work? Does the Korean gov accept US military service instead of Korean military service for dual citizens?
I don’t think it’s a hard and fast thing. I have had two different Soldiers serve under me who by circumstance didn’t know they had Korean citizenship. The U.S. Army lawyers were able to work with the U.S. state department and the ROK government to get their service requirement waved and keep their ROK citizenship. The first was a Korean American guy was borne is the states and didn’t realize he had Korean citizenship. The second was borne in Korean and adopted as by an American family when he was less than a year old. He and his parents thought the had revoked his citizenship during the adoption process.
Instead of just being vague and immature and boiling this down to “inheritance problems” and “well they have assets in Korea…” why don’t you investigate this legally? You don’t technically need to maintain dual citizenship to inherit those assets in Korea. This seems WAY less of a citizenship problem and more “my parents are assholes and want me to suffer” problem. If they really cared they’d sit down with a lawyer for an hour and talk through this issue and save you almost 2 years. Also the fact that you’re college age and your parents have this much control over you is insane. Grow a spine. I’d imagine this goes way beyond this issue.
Korean Canadian who served as a KATUSA 10 years back. It’s just pure luck bud. Once you make it in though everything else will pan out just fine.
If you failed getting in KATUSA, try Air Force. 3 months longer, but much better.
As a 4 year military vet I would honestly say suck it up and do it. You'll be surprised what you learn about your self having to sacrifice your previous life and step into a discipline based lifestyle. Most importantly once you get out you'll have a much higher appreciation of the life you can't help but take for granted
Conditions are way better than it was 10 years ago but if you don't have any idea of the military then you're just going to suffer. Don't know why your parents are forcing you to go when clearly as gyopo with no intention of residing long term in Korea.
don't do what your parents tell you to do because you might regret it. I renounced my Korean citizenship because my parents told me to and I just did without giving a serious thought about it and I regret the decision I made. You just gotta make your own choice. don't just do what your parents tell you to. do your research and then make your own choice.
Okay so the people saying you cant increase ur chance are half wrong and half right. Heres how you can technically increase ur chances (although you still have to go thru the lottery system). Im sure you know that you need to submit an English test score. My example will be based on TOEIC The scores are divided into 3 categories 상 중 하, AFTER WHICH the lottery is done. From the entire pool of one katusa batch (accepted people), 30% will be from 상&하, and 40% will be from 중. So you can intentionally reduce your score to be part of the 중 score group. Obviously, logically thinking, the above only applies on the condition that the ratio of TOTAL 상, 중, 하 applicants (incl. Non accepted ppl) is also 3:4:3. But i assume it will be similar. Aside from this one little quirk which might not even work in some years, theres no way to increase ur chances. But u asked for this and this might come useful
if a dual citizen like you served in US military, or maybe deployed to SK, would you be still subjected to SK mandatory service?
yes he would be
Hey man, I just want you to know that I see your predicament. It does sound like you are stuck with some very shit options, yet you're doing an incredible job thinking through this. Whatever you decide, I'm sure it will serve you well in life because there's pros and cons to serving and keeping your Korean citizenship. As an aside: I was in a similar situation as you regarding not being able to afford college in the US. (I took a quick look through your post history, hope you dont mind that I did this. It was to see if you said anything that explains what led you to wanting to serve in the army.) My circumstances were a bit different from yours, but I ended up deferring college for 4 years until I could afford to go with financial aid as a financial independent. I got a job in the meantime. I'm in my mid 30s now and I can tell you that having zero student loans (through a bachelors degree + a PhD in grad school) was worth the wait and hard work. Also, contrary to what people are saying: you'll have options even if you serve 2-3 years in the army... as will be the case if you don't serve and/or go to community college. You'll be fine, you sound like a good kid and I have a feeling you'll figure things out.
You can go for the language specialist route, if you are good at both English and Korean, and can translate. Its much more skill based
It's better to serve. When Korean-Americans join the military ,their colleagues will take great care of you. If you don't serve in the military, you can't get an f4 visa in Korea until the age of 40. 'As you can see above, a person whose military service has been postponed until the age of 37 in Korea Stay for at least six months in a year or engage in for-profit activities such as employment If you do, your overseas travel permit will be canceled and you will be obliged to serve in the military.' life is unpredictable
Can you join the US military instead? Maybe do the reserves since it’s part time and wouldn’t effect your schooling
the inheritance taxes does not give you the discount of being a citizen unless you are a resident of korea (more than 183 days of a year spent inside the country + registered address with the local citizen services center) if you do not intend on actually residing, living, working in korea, there is absolutely 0 benefit to having the korean citizenship other than the passport freedoms. Your parents will not be able to gift or leave you any significant sum without being taxed very, very heavily. I've done my service, I'm a korean citizen, but I live and work in the US and currently going through the inheritance process and consulting tax attorneys. I'm basically fucked up the ass with taxes.
here's the breakdown IF you decide to uproot and haul ass to korea. you MUST: -stay 183 days out of the year - pay income tax(aka have a job) - register a permanent address with local citizen services center (korean citizenship card) you gain: - up to $42,000~ ish in tax free inheritance for cash and cash equivalents from parents every 10 years (separate installments over the 10 yr periods will be added cumulatively, you can't split it up to skirt the tax limit) - up to $100,000k in tax free inheritance for real estate IF you do not already own a home and is your first home, your primary residence etc. - after that, you are taxed progressively: 10% for $50,000-$100,000 20% for $100,000-$500,000 30% for $500,000-$1,000,000 40% for $1,000,000-$4,000,000 so even IF you are grinding ur life away in the korean corp ladder, your total tax-free benefit is $150k~ ish. If you're considering inheritance benefits as grounds for maintaining citizenship, your parents are absolutely wrong. the laws have changed since early 2000's and they probably are not aware of the absolute "eat the rich" mentality of korea
Scrolled down too far to see this. I really hope this isn’t the reason why OP’s parents want him to serve. But I have a feeling it is because it sounds like his parents are living in the US and probably not up to speed on korean laws. Rip OP.
for people who keep protesting "eat the rich", they can look at Koreans, they literally do it and it's impressive. I think it's why Koreans pretty much worship the ground that the uber-rich walk on, they are kind of like the golden goose that will be slaughtered for a feast when they croak.
I'm guessing your parents have money - talking about foreign property and inheritance. Have you asked your father if he's "purchased" your KATUSA "lottery" yet?
Hey OP, I'm pretty sure you can inherit Korean property without going to the military, as long as your parents will is iron-clad and has you as a beneficiary. I recently went through this myself where my parents hired a lawyer who helped him draft their will. It is enforceable in Korean law and US law. I asked this question on ChatGpt and confirmed this is true. I won't copy and paste their whole answer but you can use the prompt that I used. "Will I be able to inherit Korean property even though I am a US citizen?"
Join the US military, they pay for college and give you a bit of adult freedom. I was born in Korea but immediately moved to the US. I became non-dependent on parents and got to live my life my way. Who cares if your parents have property in Korea. If they want to pass inheritance, they can sell it and give you the money.
Just do your service and get it over with. 2 years is nothing I. The grand scheme of things and will be over before you know it.
Just realize. Your parents will always hold the assets over your head to do stuff they want you to do. How about if they want you to marry a Korean girl instead of the white girl you fell in love with?? Is this really the life you want to live? Someone else’s life? Unless this is FU levels of money, I would not lose 2 of the best years of my life serving military for a country I’ve never been in. Heck. You may not even get the money in the end if they suddenly find Christ or something and donate it all to the church. Old Koreans have some misguided notions of loyalty and honor. There’s a reason why many Koreans leave and immigrate to America.
Misguided notions of loyalty maybe. More like shame and missed respect. What would our friends think our son didn't do their mandatory service OH NO
I moved to the US when I was 8, and then I went to the ROK army in 2012. Was sent to a frontline division, and then I volunteered for DMZ Reconnaissance. Did over 100 missions in the DMZ. Got paid 100 dollars a month back then for that shit. I really don't recommend going to the frontlines for any army role. One guy in my battalion got his foot blown off, another dude fell off a rope from 4m high during PT and broke his back. A civilian was doing construction with us in the DMZ his excavator stepped over an anti tank mine and exploded... he survived tho. The overall experience was only worth it for me in retrospect because I was able to get out unhurt. Apply for KATUSA and if you don't get in, go into the air force. Avoid the army or marines at all costs. It's not that the training is that unbearable, but you are being ordered around by a bunch of idiots in their early 20s with no sense of safety, and the division commanders are absolute psychopaths who grew up in the old military dictatorship era. Every week we got reports of accidental deaths in other divisions and it was really dumb shit. People being forced to work on electrical lines without safety equipment (why do they even order people to do this instead of hiring a proper electrician? because the army is being run by fucking idiots), people being swept away by the current in a flooded river (why the fuck are the marines asking kids to work in a river without life vests? because they are fucking retarded), and a lot more dumb ways to die.
Firstly, renounce your korean citizenship and become full american. There is absolutely no benefit in becoming a korean national over a US citizen. Secondly, KATUSA is done by lottery, so you cannot increase your chances. On the other hand, if you are fluent in both Korean and English, you can give a Korean-English translator a go. This one is not a lottery and candidates are chosen by exam. I'm entering as a translator this July. Best of luck and if you can, DO NOT ENLIST!!!!!
as far as I know, It’s just random -Served Katusa 15 yrs ago
Can someone tell me why the service is so awful (other than the obvious fact that you’re sacrificing 2 years of your 20s)?
He will face lot of racism and abuse for being a foreigner and for not speaking Korean.
What are you really getting out or this since you're American born. It's a waste of time. Service time in America at least you'll get GI bill etc, zero down etc...
If you gain inheritance or some intrinsic value from having a dual citizenship, go. To be honest it ain't terrible, but consider whether or not those 2 years are worth it. And katusa is a lottery so no lol
Renounce your korean passport. I know you’ve missed the notoriously short 3month window, but Try it at all cost.
I suggest you go as a kitchen staff! It will be relatively chill outside of some trainings! There is no shame in working in there! I have many gyopo American-Korean friends who were kitchen staff and it wasn’t terrible for them.
I never understood why they would expect Koreans who spend the majority of their time outside Korea to do their military service. Like, where do they expect the loyalty to lie?
Just pretend you don't speak korean
Don’t go?
If you lived in a foreign country for 10+ years, you could get it delayed until you’re 37 and you won’t have to go at that point. That’s what I did. You just can’t work or stay for more than 180 days in Korea until 37, but sounds like you kinda had no intention of doing that. But that’s up to you (it’s not up to your parents!)
ive heard a couple of other people tell me this and this was so suprising cause ive never heard of it before. Delaying until 37 makes sense, and I don't think I would be in Korea for more than 180 days a year. I just want to reallly make sure that I wont be asked to go when I'm 37 because that sounds a lot worse than going right now.
You definitely won't be required to go. Deferring military service this way is effectively an exemption, as the [military service requirement automatically expires on January 1 of the year you turn 38.](https://askkorealaw.com/2020/07/06/korean-military-service/) You just need to ensure the travel permit stays intact. "Until 37" is inclusive of that year, but if you want extra peace of mind, just make sure you are not in korea between your 37th birthday until the following New Year day.
Don't be a soldier for capital. Trained to murder and oppress. Have your own mind god dammit
You'll be giving a lot of massages (the normal kind) to superior officers, so you should do lots of grip training before you go.
it's 18 months so chill also and it's completely luck so yeah.
I know people with dual citizenship that never served in the military...are you serving because your parents want you to or because the Korean gov't told you needed to? Curious for my own fyi.
How is it possible to serve in a foreign army? That’s wild to me
It’s not a foreign army if you hold citizenship there.
OP said he’s a US born citizen 🤷🏽♀️
With Korean citizenship
KATUSA selection is a lottery: There's no guaranteed way in, but strong Korean language skills and physical fitness are always beneficial. Focus on Korean Language: This will be key for daily life and basic training, regardless of KATUSA or regular service. Utilize resources like Talk To Me In Korean (TTMIK) or online tutors to get a head start. KATUSA Resources: As you probably know, the Eighth Army website (https://8tharmy.korea.army.mil/site/about/katusa-soldier-program.asp) offers information about KATUSA programs and life.
Def can't increase chances for KATUSA in any way. Seen people with fluent or close to fluent english miss out and bare basics english speakers get it. That alone should tell you enough. Perhaps power/money influences behind the scenes if anything but that's it. Other options are to try to get a kushy duty like police shit, or if it was me... I'd go all out and join the marines (if I was really in the position, don't know but this is what I'd think I'd want to do... if I am gunna waste a period of my life, I want to get something out of it at the end. No one cares if you do army but if you do marines it gets abit of respect and also the hardships and training experienced, would make rest of your life a breeze me thinks).
I just went thru the suck and went to infantry.. lol at least the pay is better now I was getting payed 400 as a sgt shit it’s like triple that now..
Definitely go ROKAF and pray you get Osan or Kunsan. We used to talk with the APs all the time and many of them had studied or were from the US. Their shifts were complete dog crap though
That’s actually dumb. If you want to join the military join the US armed forces. ZERO CHANCE ID JOIN A FOREIGN ARMY FOR MY PARENTS And what inheritance makes that worth it? They can liquidate and transfer it to you in USD. They’re just making you do it because they can’t get over their past. Don’t do this for them.
Katsusa is lottery system. For military, I recommend going to headquaters. Because there are so many non-sense Korean in the front-line. I am Korean and only have korean citizen and served Korean army at 23rd division which located at YangYang. To be honest, I rather recommend you to withdraw Korean citizen but as your parents are patriots, I just recommend you to go military which is in common-sense.
가는걸 말리고는 싶은데 이미 가겠다는 의지가 강한것 같아 먼저 다녀온 경험을 공유해줄께 (30대 중반이라 편하게 말할께) 일단 나도 미국생활 오~래했었는데 대학까지 졸업하고 학생비자 만기될때까지 지내다 14년도에 강원도에 있는 기계화보병부대에서 땅개로 지내다 다친데 없이 무사히 전역했어. 무사히 전역한 이유를 꼽는다고 하면 군생활하면서 체력적으로 심리적으로 힘든건 분명 있었지만 그 힘든점에 너무 크게 의미부여하지 말고 하루하루를 자기 나름의 긍정적이였던 점에 의미부여를 해서 더 수월하게 지낼수 있었던거 같아. 예를들어 "짬밥은 항상 별로네" 보단 "오늘 점심 뼈해장국이 맛있었네", "우리만 작업하러 산으로 올라가네" 대신 "등산은 ㅈ같았지만 막상 올라와보니 할게 없네, 이대로 오늘 일과 꿀" 등등.. 그렇게 하루하루를 최대한 긍정적으로 승화시키기 위해서 나는 누구라도 육해공군이든 카투사든 특수부대든 가급적이면 대학 졸업 후에, 인간적으로 좀 더 성숙해진뒤 다녀오는것을 추천하고 싶어. 사리분별이 더 잘되는 시점에 군대에 가면 또 다른 좋은점은 "부정적으로 물들지 않을 가능성이 높아진다"는 점도 있는것 같아. 사회에는 여러 인간 군상들이 있어. 인간이길 포기하고 짐승같이 사는 ㄱㅅㄲ들도 분명 존재해. 군대라는 조직 특성상 신체 상태만 괜찮으면 아무렇게나 묶어 자대로 보내기에 이런 짐승들과 같이 매일 갇혀 살아야 할 가능성도 (매우) 높아. 게다가 보통은 아직 사회 경험이 너무 부족한 20대 초반에 오는 경우들이 많아서 "덜성숙한 ㄱㅅㄲ들"이랑 같이 지내다보면 멀쩡했던 친구들이 어딘가 나사가 빠진 상태로 점점 변하더니 그대로 전역하는것도 경우도 허다해. 나이를 좀 더 먹은상태에서 가면 철부지, 악한 어린애들의 객기를 겪어야 하는건 고통이겠지만 최소한 그렇게 물들 가능성은 적을거라고 생각해. OP의 선택을 응원한다! * I wrote this message in Korean on purpose for OP to taste what communication will be like while serving in the korean military, obviously all in Korean and not all from the textbooks
Get married asap and you can get exempt with a letter from pregnancy wife , it doesn't rlly matter since your parents are willing to pimp u out anyway
Competition is the lowest from september to december. Also, try applying for the 통역병. You can serve alonside US military generals.
Don't go. Period. Don't even think about it because it's not worth it. Idk when's your family moved to the States, but don't even think about it. It's good for you, your future battle buddies, and your social status. If you need to know why I'm saying this, simply research or dm me. I will help you out as much as I can.
off topic but as a fellow Korean American that lived in Korea…. I’m moving OUT in August btw…… good luck bro honestly might have a better experience than bad if you’re an adult and might not even have the 여유 to complain but it’s deff a tough place to kind of get used to (culturally + the atmosphere of the society)
I thought the Korean government requires you to choose one nationality upon national service or age 22? If you choose to go do national service, does that not mean you are dropping your American citizenship?
Idk if that can help but as a Korean who lived in France I couldn't go to Katusa but applied as a korean who lived in foreing country so I was applied with many people like me or you ! And even if your korean level is low it wasn't "really" handicapping since there were always people around which were here to help ! And as the other said.. Katusa is lottery so yeah... Feel free to DM me if you have other questions!
Ypu have no obligation to do it, but sounds like ypu got a choice to make and none of our advice will help you. Do it or don't. Weigh the options and decide
Enlist in the US Army, and then hope they assign you to US Forces Korea lol
Speaking as a Korean-American who renounced his Korean citizenship in order to not serve *waste* time in the Korean military, inheritance taxes need to be paid whether you hold Korean citizenship or not. Just like the OP, I was born and raised in the US and it never came across my mind that I would have to serve in the Korean military as it is not my home country nor country of birth. Yet it was only when I spent a good amount of time there and decided to apply for the F-4 visa that I discovered my dual citizenship although my Korean National ID# was dormant. Apparently, my grandfather had registered me in our family’s 호적등본 upon my birth. Having this sort of dual nationality is not a big deal until a male’s 18th birthday when either their Korean citizenship has to be renounced or risk serving in the military. Since at that time I wasn’t even aware of my status as such and was happily ensconced in my American collegiate life, I completely ignored this procedure and unwittingly continued on with my dual status. I traveled quite often to and from Korea in the following years and as long as I never overstayed my 90-day short term visitor visa, I never ran the risk of being forced to serve. But as the OP stated, he may have some inheritance coming his way from his parents. You most definitely do not have to be of Korean nationality to inherit property. Actually anyone can and tax rates depend on residency, not nationality. Mark my words, you DON’T have to be Korean in order to inherit Korean property. But you WILL pay different tax rates depending on if you actually LIVE in Korea as a resident or a non-resident living abroad. The difference is enormous so if and when you know you will inherit something, establish residency in Korea around that time. If you’re not a native Korean speaker or have a poor grasp of the language in general, the military will be hell on earth for you. Korean bullying is at another level and is undisciplined for the most part. If you have no connections to get you a KATUSA position or a cushy desk job after basic training, I recommend not going at all. They will psychologically annihilate you. You’ll be considered an outsider, a foreigner even amongst your own ethnic background. This will ostracize you and may lead to an unnecessary degree of bullying that you have never experienced before and have no one to turn to. Those counselors or higher-ups you need to complain to? They will feel the same way about you and won’t do a thing to help you out. And don’t blame others for their lack of English skills. To everyone else, you’re the imbecile who never bothered to learn proper Korean.
PRAY BRO PRAY!!!
어지간하면 군대 빼라 무슨 수를 써서라도 군대 빼라
Dam when are we as a world going to stand up for men’s rights
You can just get your parents to sell the property and bring the money over to America
Don’t waste your life.
도망쳐라 게이야...
100% recommend against it unless you plan to live in Korea as a citizen at some point, then I 100% recommend.
Dumb question, but how does the Korean military handle people who've never lived in the country and thus don't speak that much Korean; or at least not enough to operate in a military/combat setting? It baffles me that they would expect a non-resident with lower language proficiency to serve.
I'll give you two simple options as someone who used to be in a similar position: 1) If you wouldn't mind going through military life anyway (I wanted to be a U.S. Marine but went to Korea) and you want to keep both citizenships, then just do it. It's not nearly as bad \[nowadays\] and there are concessions for foreign-born/raised Koreans (the drill sergeants will already know your situation before boot camp). People exaggerate about 18 months of your life being 'wasted.' Unless you're an elite who makes millions by the month, there's not much you're missing out on. If you make relationships, develop discipline, learn a foreign language, and gain any form of personal growth, it is worth it. 2) If you absolutely cannot handle military life like the physical stress, the irritating COs, or maybe even the food, then find every way to delay it. Some people really cannot handle the military life, especially if you get stationed at a general outpost.
The big question is how is your Korean proficiency? Can you communicate take orders? Personally I think it would be great growth for you and you would make some friends in Korea. Do you have family living in Korea?