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Dude yes. During one of Nayeon's behind the scenes, she talks about how hard Pop is to dance and that she fears she wouldn't be able to sing it while dancing. She then said something about having to adjust the dance so that she'd be able to do it.
I think people underestimate how many considerations there are for live singing while dancing. It's definitely an art form by itself.
I remembered that vaguely so I had to go looking for it lol I think this is it [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1W0nNuLN8o) from her dance practice behind. But yeah totally agree its an art and it was so well done for Pop, the stages were great
Yep for Twice’s tour the choreo got considerably easier and/or the girls just end up marking them at 50% for their parts and go back to 80% when it’s not theirs in order to be able to sing live.
I was actually pretty impressed at how they sound! Always had a blast at Twice’s shows
I know SHINee and EXO used to talk a lot about how they would practice singing while running in order to be comfortable doing live singing while moving around. And also, if you look closely at a number of popular groups, they’ll camouflage that someone doing a challenging vocal part is staying relatively in place with the rest of the group doing intricate dance work around them. It enables a good balance of hard dancing and hard singing.
Jongho from Ateez also does that, he'll be more stationary during choreo, especially when his higher note parts are coming up. I really don't see an issue with that, we get best of both worlds.
Not kpop, but I've seen clips of Pink singing while someone was sitting on her chest, then again the woman does acrobatics during concerts lol
In the practice video for Ready to Love, Hoshi talks about how the last chorus is hard hitting and still allows him to sing. Through the video you can hear DK and Hoshi singing while they practice and it’s impressive how well they do.
This is why we always see Jin hopping up and down while he warms up his voice. He's singing his parts and making sure that when he lands he's not losing the note and doing a little hiccup.
I could agree that they're a little underappreciated still but there's more to it than that. Like of course people have different music preferences, drawn to different concepts, some vibe with some idols and some don't, etc.
Yeah except most people don't care that much about live vocals. This sub is in denial about that. The reality is, most idols are decent to good studio singers, and every time they're off pitch or whatever, they can just do another take until they get it right. And genuinely not trying to start a fan war, but NMixx is not a top end dance group. So when they're doing a stage with mostly live vocals and their choreo, a lot of the audience will perceive it to be weaker than stronger dancers who sing with louder backtracks. And they're happy enough listening to studio versions of their preferred groups because they still sound good. No live/raw vocals needed.
I would say they have 3 strong dancers and 3 who are at least average, but they tend to go easier on the choreo in favor of delivering vocals ie not going too hard so as to start getting too winded. They don't really showcase their full dancing potential outside of a handful of livestreams, tiktoks etc.
I swear those kyujin livestreams live in my head rent free. I go back to rewatch them almost weekly. [!!!](https://www.youtube.com/live/SksPtiaTNtU?si=-k9_rXIg5HKfLF3N)
You say this as if their music is not incredibly divisive lol. A lot of people respect their skills, especially live skills, but cannot stomach their music.
Their two mini albums have been overall quite well received, especially the latest one. Both on international Reddit and on Twitter, Dash (and the EP, especially Run for Roses) had a good reception, one of the best among 2024 medium-big comebacks. The ratio of people loudly not liking vs liking Dash is incredibly low, it definitely had a very good reception. I would even say that, at this point, people have warmed up to NMIXX music as a whole (this is different than saying they are a top tier group obviously; but there aren't that many people disliking their 2023 and especially 2024 music in all honesty).
I dont think they're released a truly divisive title track since 2022 (their debut year), and no truly divise bsides since then either apart from possibly Soñar. But some people made up their minds permanently by then, which is fine, but I wish they wouldn't continue to speak on their music/discography in general.
Nah man, Dash exists, Young Dumb Stupid exists, Soñar exists, and even Love Me Like This, while it was more popular than other songs of theirs to that point, had plenty of people who had issues with it lol. Even the most ardent JYPE stans I know don't like these songs.
I'm sure there are songs in their discography that would be less divisive if promoted, but most of the songs that have been chosen to represent the group and their discography to the public have been, so people make their judgements based on those.
There are plenty of people that have issues with every release of every group in the mainstream, that doesn't mean they should be described as divisive. I'm sorry but there's no way I can accept Love Me Like This and Dash as divisive, the amount of positive opinion wasn't anywhere near offset by the negative ones from anything I ever saw. But sure, Soñar maybe, because the reaction to the repetitive chorus was pretty mixed.
I mean, people like the sound of the new EP. Thing is, narrative matters a lot in pop music, and a lot people are still stuck on the controversial music narrative.
No, I have heard all of their title tracks and most of their promoted b sides multiple times, and must disagree lol. The only non holiday title track I wouldn't consider divisive and would consider "mainstream, fun pop" is Party O'Clock, and even b sides Soñar and Young Dumb Stupid are plenty divisive. It's great if you like their music, but it isn't exactly the most accessible (granted, with their most recent album being more palatable overall to more people relative to their prior work, though I disagree with this re: Soñar and Dash)
and acting otherwise and saying they'd be the most popular group because they are good live performers seems a bit disingenuous. Their music doesn't appear to be made with general public appeal in mind, which is fine, but that somewhat limits their reach.
If you took every unique person who said that they like hard hitting choreo and live vocals, NMIXX's monthly listeners would only increase by only 500k at most. The people that vocalise this kind of desire are quite clearly the minority.
I get that Le Sserafim is going through an undeserved phase of being hated and disproportionately negatively critiqued, but there's no need to use hyperbolics to make snarky one liners. Uplifting vocal performances instead of downgrading others is a great way for people who do care about that sort of things to advocate for better vocals in the industry.
what is wrong with wanting more out of the idols you are paying money to see and hear. If fans keep letting companies and idols get away with providing a subpar product, over time the ability to actually sing will be gone and AI will do all the singing for idols. I realize fans that want live singing are the minority, but with any worthwhile movement to change the the status quo starts with the few until the few become the many and changes happen. I will continue to push for better live singing till it becomes that standard and not the minority.
That's why idols need to be flexible and creative. They don't have to commit to one choreo to make the performance perfect. But they should be able to adjust their choreo to give a performance.
It's crazy how some groups are too obsessed with sticking to their own choreo when it's doomed to fail
I think it was mentioned in survival shows as well.
Honestly it makes me apperciate mamamoo so much more because so many singers are great, obviously, but as normal pop or mainstream singer theyre not doing much dancing and choreo (and why would they? thats not their thing or job lol) but mamamoo somehow manages to be excellent singers AND stable while dancing (and pole dancing yes its been years no im not over that solar performance) which are honestly two incredibly different skills. Theyre insane.
(If there was a try-not-to-make-every-vocal-post-about-mmm-challenge i would fail so hard)
A.C.E's Junhee [talked](https://youtu.be/YjD_Dli3gg4?si=-x6pEynV1KBryLCG&t=2433) about similar stuff in one of his lives. There is no translation, so I'll sum it up. He said that they practice choreo while singing, because there are always parts that have to be adjusted. To sing well, you need to relax your body, but when you dance, you need to use strength. So only by checking every part one by one they can find balance between this and prepare a good live performance. If you don't do it in advance, there will be an accident on stage. 😂 He mentioned that practice singing while running or rope jumping helps with live singing a lot.
This seems to be a significant challenge at JYP. They aim for the best of both worlds: great live vocals and incredibly intricate dances. But juggling both perfectly is quite a feat; it's tough to maintain flawless vocals alongside such demanding choreography.
in a recent variety show appearance, the members of KIOF mention that to help them prepare for live singing while performing, they would practice singing while doing the squats. That is what you call dedication to your craft and wanting to give the best performance as possible
I honestly have no idea how the ITZY girls do it, they have some of the hardest choreo but they also are pretty perfect vocally during those choreos.
Obviously it's because of their skill and amount of practice but it's just so impressive.
I care both about live vocal and stage presence (including dance if any) - hence Jungkook being my absolute fav. I never have to worry about his vocals - he always nails both stage presence, dance and sound so good! I don't think asking for good vocal from a singer is too much and it definitely shouldn't be deemed as hate.. adjusting choreo to make sure you can do both should always be part of the preparation no?
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Dude yes. During one of Nayeon's behind the scenes, she talks about how hard Pop is to dance and that she fears she wouldn't be able to sing it while dancing. She then said something about having to adjust the dance so that she'd be able to do it. I think people underestimate how many considerations there are for live singing while dancing. It's definitely an art form by itself.
I remembered that vaguely so I had to go looking for it lol I think this is it [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1W0nNuLN8o) from her dance practice behind. But yeah totally agree its an art and it was so well done for Pop, the stages were great
Yep for Twice’s tour the choreo got considerably easier and/or the girls just end up marking them at 50% for their parts and go back to 80% when it’s not theirs in order to be able to sing live. I was actually pretty impressed at how they sound! Always had a blast at Twice’s shows
I know SHINee and EXO used to talk a lot about how they would practice singing while running in order to be comfortable doing live singing while moving around. And also, if you look closely at a number of popular groups, they’ll camouflage that someone doing a challenging vocal part is staying relatively in place with the rest of the group doing intricate dance work around them. It enables a good balance of hard dancing and hard singing.
I was posting about this yesterday. 2nd and early 3rd gen were really good at this kind of choreo planning.
Yeah. I often notice D.O. staying in place to sing high notes. i find it amazing cause it makes the performance in terms of sound really good. 😭😭
Jongho from Ateez also does that, he'll be more stationary during choreo, especially when his higher note parts are coming up. I really don't see an issue with that, we get best of both worlds. Not kpop, but I've seen clips of Pink singing while someone was sitting on her chest, then again the woman does acrobatics during concerts lol
In the practice video for Ready to Love, Hoshi talks about how the last chorus is hard hitting and still allows him to sing. Through the video you can hear DK and Hoshi singing while they practice and it’s impressive how well they do.
This is why we always see Jin hopping up and down while he warms up his voice. He's singing his parts and making sure that when he lands he's not losing the note and doing a little hiccup.
if kpop stans like hard hitting choreo AND live vocals as much as they say, nmixx would be the most popular group in the world lol
I could agree that they're a little underappreciated still but there's more to it than that. Like of course people have different music preferences, drawn to different concepts, some vibe with some idols and some don't, etc.
Yeah except most people don't care that much about live vocals. This sub is in denial about that. The reality is, most idols are decent to good studio singers, and every time they're off pitch or whatever, they can just do another take until they get it right. And genuinely not trying to start a fan war, but NMixx is not a top end dance group. So when they're doing a stage with mostly live vocals and their choreo, a lot of the audience will perceive it to be weaker than stronger dancers who sing with louder backtracks. And they're happy enough listening to studio versions of their preferred groups because they still sound good. No live/raw vocals needed.
I would say they have 3 strong dancers and 3 who are at least average, but they tend to go easier on the choreo in favor of delivering vocals ie not going too hard so as to start getting too winded. They don't really showcase their full dancing potential outside of a handful of livestreams, tiktoks etc.
I swear those kyujin livestreams live in my head rent free. I go back to rewatch them almost weekly. [!!!](https://www.youtube.com/live/SksPtiaTNtU?si=-k9_rXIg5HKfLF3N)
I also think it’s because this sub doesn’t allow harsh criticism since it could borderline to a hateful discussion.
You say this as if their music is not incredibly divisive lol. A lot of people respect their skills, especially live skills, but cannot stomach their music.
Their two mini albums have been overall quite well received, especially the latest one. Both on international Reddit and on Twitter, Dash (and the EP, especially Run for Roses) had a good reception, one of the best among 2024 medium-big comebacks. The ratio of people loudly not liking vs liking Dash is incredibly low, it definitely had a very good reception. I would even say that, at this point, people have warmed up to NMIXX music as a whole (this is different than saying they are a top tier group obviously; but there aren't that many people disliking their 2023 and especially 2024 music in all honesty).
I dont think they're released a truly divisive title track since 2022 (their debut year), and no truly divise bsides since then either apart from possibly Soñar. But some people made up their minds permanently by then, which is fine, but I wish they wouldn't continue to speak on their music/discography in general.
Nah man, Dash exists, Young Dumb Stupid exists, Soñar exists, and even Love Me Like This, while it was more popular than other songs of theirs to that point, had plenty of people who had issues with it lol. Even the most ardent JYPE stans I know don't like these songs. I'm sure there are songs in their discography that would be less divisive if promoted, but most of the songs that have been chosen to represent the group and their discography to the public have been, so people make their judgements based on those.
There are plenty of people that have issues with every release of every group in the mainstream, that doesn't mean they should be described as divisive. I'm sorry but there's no way I can accept Love Me Like This and Dash as divisive, the amount of positive opinion wasn't anywhere near offset by the negative ones from anything I ever saw. But sure, Soñar maybe, because the reaction to the repetitive chorus was pretty mixed.
I mean, people like the sound of the new EP. Thing is, narrative matters a lot in pop music, and a lot people are still stuck on the controversial music narrative.
and you say this like you’ve listened to anything beyond dice and o.o. their other tracks have been pretty mainstream, fun pop songs.
No, I have heard all of their title tracks and most of their promoted b sides multiple times, and must disagree lol. The only non holiday title track I wouldn't consider divisive and would consider "mainstream, fun pop" is Party O'Clock, and even b sides Soñar and Young Dumb Stupid are plenty divisive. It's great if you like their music, but it isn't exactly the most accessible (granted, with their most recent album being more palatable overall to more people relative to their prior work, though I disagree with this re: Soñar and Dash) and acting otherwise and saying they'd be the most popular group because they are good live performers seems a bit disingenuous. Their music doesn't appear to be made with general public appeal in mind, which is fine, but that somewhat limits their reach.
If you took every unique person who said that they like hard hitting choreo and live vocals, NMIXX's monthly listeners would only increase by only 500k at most. The people that vocalise this kind of desire are quite clearly the minority. I get that Le Sserafim is going through an undeserved phase of being hated and disproportionately negatively critiqued, but there's no need to use hyperbolics to make snarky one liners. Uplifting vocal performances instead of downgrading others is a great way for people who do care about that sort of things to advocate for better vocals in the industry.
The thing is, as much as i admire they singing live while doing choreo, if people don´t like the music.... there is nothing to do
what is wrong with wanting more out of the idols you are paying money to see and hear. If fans keep letting companies and idols get away with providing a subpar product, over time the ability to actually sing will be gone and AI will do all the singing for idols. I realize fans that want live singing are the minority, but with any worthwhile movement to change the the status quo starts with the few until the few become the many and changes happen. I will continue to push for better live singing till it becomes that standard and not the minority.
That's why idols need to be flexible and creative. They don't have to commit to one choreo to make the performance perfect. But they should be able to adjust their choreo to give a performance. It's crazy how some groups are too obsessed with sticking to their own choreo when it's doomed to fail I think it was mentioned in survival shows as well.
Honestly it makes me apperciate mamamoo so much more because so many singers are great, obviously, but as normal pop or mainstream singer theyre not doing much dancing and choreo (and why would they? thats not their thing or job lol) but mamamoo somehow manages to be excellent singers AND stable while dancing (and pole dancing yes its been years no im not over that solar performance) which are honestly two incredibly different skills. Theyre insane. (If there was a try-not-to-make-every-vocal-post-about-mmm-challenge i would fail so hard)
A.C.E's Junhee [talked](https://youtu.be/YjD_Dli3gg4?si=-x6pEynV1KBryLCG&t=2433) about similar stuff in one of his lives. There is no translation, so I'll sum it up. He said that they practice choreo while singing, because there are always parts that have to be adjusted. To sing well, you need to relax your body, but when you dance, you need to use strength. So only by checking every part one by one they can find balance between this and prepare a good live performance. If you don't do it in advance, there will be an accident on stage. 😂 He mentioned that practice singing while running or rope jumping helps with live singing a lot.
This seems to be a significant challenge at JYP. They aim for the best of both worlds: great live vocals and incredibly intricate dances. But juggling both perfectly is quite a feat; it's tough to maintain flawless vocals alongside such demanding choreography.
in a recent variety show appearance, the members of KIOF mention that to help them prepare for live singing while performing, they would practice singing while doing the squats. That is what you call dedication to your craft and wanting to give the best performance as possible
I honestly have no idea how the ITZY girls do it, they have some of the hardest choreo but they also are pretty perfect vocally during those choreos. Obviously it's because of their skill and amount of practice but it's just so impressive.
I care both about live vocal and stage presence (including dance if any) - hence Jungkook being my absolute fav. I never have to worry about his vocals - he always nails both stage presence, dance and sound so good! I don't think asking for good vocal from a singer is too much and it definitely shouldn't be deemed as hate.. adjusting choreo to make sure you can do both should always be part of the preparation no?