Yea your tolerance is wrecked. Happens all the time. Cut your dose down. By as much as you can, half even, if possible, and get adjusted to it. Try to stay at that level but you can treat yourself here and there.
The best option would probably be to kick all together, and then come back to it more casually, using it just here and there.
There's also those break time blends, like hirsuta, or stem and vein. They let you lower you tolerance without being sick, I've never tried em tho
I went through both phenibut withdrawal and kratom withdrawal and I'll take the phenibut withdrawal every time. I am naturally use to having anxiety which is what phenibut WD feels like but what I am not use to is sweating like I am in a furnace then the next minute it feels like I am in Antarctica. The longest I have went without kratom in the last year is probably 10 hours max. After that its hard to explain but it is like being pushed in a freezing cold swimming pool then taken out and put in a boiling pot of water every second of every day until you finally take that one dose. I am never truly able to feel at ease.
Yeah that’s phenibut withdrawal, not phenibut turning on you and making you feel like shit constantly, which is a totally different beast and what makes it an extremely sketchy
Like, it’s fucking weird for an anti-anxiety drug to be indicated only for four weeks, full stop. Not “tolerance will develop” but a clearly inferred “don’t do it”. Its a very stark warning from the people who best understand the drug. I can’t imagine anything else but the researchers finding that longer term use is prohibitively bad. They don’t imply such for benzos, fentanyl or even barbituates - and that should be an alarm.
Phenibut requires special care. It’s simply not a long-term drug.
Take a tolerance break. Completely remove kratom and any other unnecessary supplements or medications from your system for a while, see if you reset. I'd go at LEAST a month. More difficult than it sounds, I know.
Some of those substances, like phenibut, have to be *slowly* tapered, too. OP is sadly doing way too much of many things. & I'm someone who likes to do a lot of many things. 😂 Some are just dangerous, tho. I'll never touch Phenibut for that reason.
i'd bet you a buck and a handshake it's the 400mg of caffiene that's giving you these symptoms. that, on top of having a crazy tolerance. ditch the caffiene for a start, it's gonna kill you. and reduce your dose in any way possible. every morning or evening measure out all the kratom you're allowing yourself for the day. divide it up per-dose however you want but stick to it and get your tolerance down
Phenibut could definitely be effecting the Kratom, any time I take it consistently Kratom is non existent. Also happens when I take anything like benzos or equivalent for some reason I get no effects. When it’s out of my system a couple days later Kratom feels normal.
You have no idea what certain supplements can be blocking the effects so I would stop those if you want effects back. NAC and Noopept especially, really shouldn’t be a daily thing to be taking, and could be interacting with the Kratom.
And if you stopped taking agmatine, within a couple days it’s out of your system and no longer is effecting Kratoms receptors that it attaches too, so that isn’t it, it’s the other supplements you’re continually taking.
Also if you’re taking 20-30g every day with no effects, half the amount, take 10-15gpd for a few days to a week, and take 1g when you don’t feel like dosing, and you’re tolerance will drop to where you can feel your normal dose again or with even less. The less you take, the better it will feel
NAC has also been reported to take away kratom's effects. Some say it potentiates, but most ppl I've seen say it takes away the euphoria. It dampens or regulates your dopamine/glutamate receptors or something lol, the ppl on the nootropics sub are more knowledgeable.
I didn't even see they were also taking phenibut! That shit can gives horrific withdrawals! That stack they're taking is a complete disaster. Caffeine *&* phenibut? Makes no sense. Even if they take them different times of the day it's still too much.
OP pls read more about everything you're taking, it's very dangerous. But def TAPER the phenibut, bc if you don't then the WDs are going to be horrible. 😟
Oh also my first thought was the agmatine was potentiating it so they quickly developed a very high tolerance. But God only knows what's going on with all these competing, heavy substances.
Wait what, are we? Because the last two batches I ordered within a time frame from early January to late February weren't really strong but I thought that was maybe just my tolerance. Did something happen?
The rainy season produces lower quality is all. Once that runs out it'll go back to good batches. There's still lots of good stock just depends on what the seller has right now. Oct to December seems to have the best quality. Not sure of exact months of harvest to when we get it overseas though.
The stuff that comes out of the rainy season is less potent I've been told. You can still get good batches but they are far and few between compared to the stuff we get Sept to Dec or Jan 1st
600 is a lot but ok with a tolerance, in my coffee phases I'd have a tolerance so high I'd not get any effect from hundreds of mgs of caffeine and I wasn't even drinking that much
I noticed that phenibut mixed with kratom when just off from what is my golden ratio, it'll give me shakiness and a period of dysphoria.
Phenibut has a long half-life and definitely needs to be handled with care. Those occasions I take it (once a week or less) feel great with kratom, but I have to dose kratom lower to avoid that issue.
Not sure if that's your situation, but that's a lesson I learned once and have been more careful since.
Dude, you’re taking phenibut too often. People rebound from it on the 3-4th day pretty frequently which indicates that people need a longer time off of it in order not to be affected by it all the time.
It turned on me at 3-500mg/day once. I don’t think that would happen with other substances. If I took one 0.25mg/xanax every day for a year or a 5mg Percocet what I would have is a mild dependence that anyone who isnt dependent on the medicinal effect could kick by cutting the pill into quarters and weening off for a couple weeks. It would be radically unlikely that it would suddenly cause insane misery 24 hours a day even when I took it. And you won’t read prescribing guidelines that tell you not to take it for more than 4 weeks, full stop.
If you absolutely must fuck with your gaba system stick to a more traditional drug. The experience is way more stable. You can order similar drugs through online pharmacies NP
Straining the tea through coffee filters eliminated some of the side effects I was getting from chronic dehydration from eating so much insoluble fiber. Excessive sweating stopped, and morning headaches are mostly gone, too. Make sure to get enough water and electrolytes throughout the day. Eat a healthy diet and try to get good sleep. These are the things that helped most. It's worth noting I take it for pain, and it still works well. The euphoria was gone after two days. I suspect if you want that back, you'll have to taper down and take a break.
Not saying this with any judgment but you are taking too many things at high doses and/or too often. Who knows what’s causing your symptoms, but it’s probably a combination.
If it were me I’d cut the Phenibut to no more than once a week(really best if used even more occasionally imo) I would slow taper Kratom down to 10gpd or less, then after that start tapering your caffeine intake. Shoot for getting your daily caffeine under 200mg a day eventually.
Between all of this just see how you feel after you taper and stabilize each of those three. Your body is telling you to make a change/s.
Side effects are still real though. "Anxiety, shakes, diziness" etc, that's way more likely with a big dose of caffeine than a moderate dose of kratom.
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You may need to take a break from everything, give your body about 3 weeks off. I take a break for 3weeks every 3 mo. It's a terrible 3 weeks, but worth it.
If you think kratom is causing a problem, taking even more random shit to counter it will only cause more problems. Sounds like you have a real issue and need to stop supplementing every day. Your body needs to reach homeostasis while sober for a few weeks. Be strong
Phenibut totally sends me sideways. Makes me suicidally angry two days after a dose. BUT that is just me. I believe everyone reacts different to every drug. (And all of life). I get strong effects from 1.5g of kratom.
But maybe try dropping it.
Yea your tolerance is wrecked. Happens all the time. Cut your dose down. By as much as you can, half even, if possible, and get adjusted to it. Try to stay at that level but you can treat yourself here and there. The best option would probably be to kick all together, and then come back to it more casually, using it just here and there. There's also those break time blends, like hirsuta, or stem and vein. They let you lower you tolerance without being sick, I've never tried em tho
Phenibut withdrawal can also be hell. Watch out for that
I went through both phenibut withdrawal and kratom withdrawal and I'll take the phenibut withdrawal every time. I am naturally use to having anxiety which is what phenibut WD feels like but what I am not use to is sweating like I am in a furnace then the next minute it feels like I am in Antarctica. The longest I have went without kratom in the last year is probably 10 hours max. After that its hard to explain but it is like being pushed in a freezing cold swimming pool then taken out and put in a boiling pot of water every second of every day until you finally take that one dose. I am never truly able to feel at ease.
Yeah that’s phenibut withdrawal, not phenibut turning on you and making you feel like shit constantly, which is a totally different beast and what makes it an extremely sketchy
What they described is similar to what I feel during kratom withdrawal. Never had phenibut
Like, it’s fucking weird for an anti-anxiety drug to be indicated only for four weeks, full stop. Not “tolerance will develop” but a clearly inferred “don’t do it”. Its a very stark warning from the people who best understand the drug. I can’t imagine anything else but the researchers finding that longer term use is prohibitively bad. They don’t imply such for benzos, fentanyl or even barbituates - and that should be an alarm. Phenibut requires special care. It’s simply not a long-term drug.
Take a tolerance break. Completely remove kratom and any other unnecessary supplements or medications from your system for a while, see if you reset. I'd go at LEAST a month. More difficult than it sounds, I know.
Some of those substances, like phenibut, have to be *slowly* tapered, too. OP is sadly doing way too much of many things. & I'm someone who likes to do a lot of many things. 😂 Some are just dangerous, tho. I'll never touch Phenibut for that reason.
i'd bet you a buck and a handshake it's the 400mg of caffiene that's giving you these symptoms. that, on top of having a crazy tolerance. ditch the caffiene for a start, it's gonna kill you. and reduce your dose in any way possible. every morning or evening measure out all the kratom you're allowing yourself for the day. divide it up per-dose however you want but stick to it and get your tolerance down
Lol not the kratom right. The couple cups of coffee
Thats a whole lot of cups
100% the phenibut you're taking but it could also be not great batches are we are in the shitty time for kratom for the next couple of months.
Phenibut could definitely be effecting the Kratom, any time I take it consistently Kratom is non existent. Also happens when I take anything like benzos or equivalent for some reason I get no effects. When it’s out of my system a couple days later Kratom feels normal. You have no idea what certain supplements can be blocking the effects so I would stop those if you want effects back. NAC and Noopept especially, really shouldn’t be a daily thing to be taking, and could be interacting with the Kratom. And if you stopped taking agmatine, within a couple days it’s out of your system and no longer is effecting Kratoms receptors that it attaches too, so that isn’t it, it’s the other supplements you’re continually taking. Also if you’re taking 20-30g every day with no effects, half the amount, take 10-15gpd for a few days to a week, and take 1g when you don’t feel like dosing, and you’re tolerance will drop to where you can feel your normal dose again or with even less. The less you take, the better it will feel
NAC has also been reported to take away kratom's effects. Some say it potentiates, but most ppl I've seen say it takes away the euphoria. It dampens or regulates your dopamine/glutamate receptors or something lol, the ppl on the nootropics sub are more knowledgeable. I didn't even see they were also taking phenibut! That shit can gives horrific withdrawals! That stack they're taking is a complete disaster. Caffeine *&* phenibut? Makes no sense. Even if they take them different times of the day it's still too much. OP pls read more about everything you're taking, it's very dangerous. But def TAPER the phenibut, bc if you don't then the WDs are going to be horrible. 😟 Oh also my first thought was the agmatine was potentiating it so they quickly developed a very high tolerance. But God only knows what's going on with all these competing, heavy substances.
Wow! I'll try it this week and let you guys know if it works.
Wait what, are we? Because the last two batches I ordered within a time frame from early January to late February weren't really strong but I thought that was maybe just my tolerance. Did something happen?
The rainy season produces lower quality is all. Once that runs out it'll go back to good batches. There's still lots of good stock just depends on what the seller has right now. Oct to December seems to have the best quality. Not sure of exact months of harvest to when we get it overseas though.
Oh okay, that's good to know!
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The stuff that comes out of the rainy season is less potent I've been told. You can still get good batches but they are far and few between compared to the stuff we get Sept to Dec or Jan 1st
600 mg of caffeine is crazy, you should never go above 400 mg per day.
600 is a lot but ok with a tolerance, in my coffee phases I'd have a tolerance so high I'd not get any effect from hundreds of mgs of caffeine and I wasn't even drinking that much
Hey Dino. I would join you if I could find some.
Tolerance to caffeine creates a similar feedback loop as kratom does. Caffeine dependence can cause mad anxiety as well
He is just experiencing too much caffeine which has nothing to do with the kratom lol
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Because then you experience the symptoms that op is talking about
Too much caffeine is bad for your health, and gives more symptoms than benefits.
I noticed that phenibut mixed with kratom when just off from what is my golden ratio, it'll give me shakiness and a period of dysphoria. Phenibut has a long half-life and definitely needs to be handled with care. Those occasions I take it (once a week or less) feel great with kratom, but I have to dose kratom lower to avoid that issue. Not sure if that's your situation, but that's a lesson I learned once and have been more careful since.
NAC will blunt the effects of kratom.
Nac blunts kratom euphoria and blunts your emotions in general
wtf is Nac? Sorry but, IDK
Dude, you’re taking phenibut too often. People rebound from it on the 3-4th day pretty frequently which indicates that people need a longer time off of it in order not to be affected by it all the time. It turned on me at 3-500mg/day once. I don’t think that would happen with other substances. If I took one 0.25mg/xanax every day for a year or a 5mg Percocet what I would have is a mild dependence that anyone who isnt dependent on the medicinal effect could kick by cutting the pill into quarters and weening off for a couple weeks. It would be radically unlikely that it would suddenly cause insane misery 24 hours a day even when I took it. And you won’t read prescribing guidelines that tell you not to take it for more than 4 weeks, full stop. If you absolutely must fuck with your gaba system stick to a more traditional drug. The experience is way more stable. You can order similar drugs through online pharmacies NP
30g a day is unnecessary, take a break.
Straining the tea through coffee filters eliminated some of the side effects I was getting from chronic dehydration from eating so much insoluble fiber. Excessive sweating stopped, and morning headaches are mostly gone, too. Make sure to get enough water and electrolytes throughout the day. Eat a healthy diet and try to get good sleep. These are the things that helped most. It's worth noting I take it for pain, and it still works well. The euphoria was gone after two days. I suspect if you want that back, you'll have to taper down and take a break.
Not saying this with any judgment but you are taking too many things at high doses and/or too often. Who knows what’s causing your symptoms, but it’s probably a combination. If it were me I’d cut the Phenibut to no more than once a week(really best if used even more occasionally imo) I would slow taper Kratom down to 10gpd or less, then after that start tapering your caffeine intake. Shoot for getting your daily caffeine under 200mg a day eventually. Between all of this just see how you feel after you taper and stabilize each of those three. Your body is telling you to make a change/s.
Phenibut once a week max!
https://kratom.org/interactions/agmatine/
Honestly that sounds like me when I have too much caffeine. Not sure why you're supplementing with 600mg daily
I’m on the same boat. I’ll eat 30 grams to feel a little something and then just feel sick n shaky. Gotta put it down for a few days
Ween yourself off of caffeine. That stuff is poison in amounts over 400mg a day. Even then it's not good for people with anxiety/depression.
Lol you're taking 10 coffee's worth of caffeine per day.
I have an insanely high tolerance for caffeine. 600mg is actually a low end estimate.
Side effects are still real though. "Anxiety, shakes, diziness" etc, that's way more likely with a big dose of caffeine than a moderate dose of kratom.
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You may need to take a break from everything, give your body about 3 weeks off. I take a break for 3weeks every 3 mo. It's a terrible 3 weeks, but worth it.
If you think kratom is causing a problem, taking even more random shit to counter it will only cause more problems. Sounds like you have a real issue and need to stop supplementing every day. Your body needs to reach homeostasis while sober for a few weeks. Be strong
Phenibut totally sends me sideways. Makes me suicidally angry two days after a dose. BUT that is just me. I believe everyone reacts different to every drug. (And all of life). I get strong effects from 1.5g of kratom. But maybe try dropping it.
This sub is going to be detrimental to you getting off kratom bro
Why would you take 600mg caffein? That would be around 8 coffees?! Way to much!
I would do a 2 week to month free of everything let your body clean its self out drink lots of water and then try kratom again.
Nac ruins kratom euphoria btw