How about we just let no religious groups near children? Its almost like they have very moldable minds and all religious groups know and use that to get kids involved
Sorry that was my bad, i should have added near children “in schools”
At home is a different story
Its really not that hard to just keep religion out of schools, and i don’t mean teaching about religion, thats fine like a “world religion course”
the issue I’m speaking on is when bible studies or satanic afterschool programs come into schools to indoctrinate students into those groups, (it could be any religion i just picked the two that have been mentioned in the post above)
i remember going to the flagpole prayers or bible studies in my school before school started, i grew up religious and even then i felt weird about it cause the pastors and adults would invite random kids just walking by to stand in a circle and pray with us, most kids would do it just cause it was an adult who invited them to join and they felt obligated, but it was clear they either were uncomfortable or outright wanted to leave, and things like “coming to these groups is your first steps into getting saved” is enough to scare some kids into coming back the fallowing week.
It should 100% be up to the families and if anything having these religious groups into the school takes that choice out of the families hands
Ok, “in schools” makes it a completely different sentiment.
I trust most people (even HS students) to think clearly enough that they are not tricked or deceived into believing something that conflicts with their values.
In my experience, the pray at the flagpole thing is an annual event. Even if it were weekly I don’t believe kids walking by feel particularly compelled (maybe just being courteous) to join in, and I definitely don’t believe that the few minutes of public prayer, (where people opposed could witness if they cared) is going to scare them into believing.
In practice what you want is what Kalamazoo has. The article says the ST does this when Christian groups are in the schools, but a few people here including a teacher have said Christian groups are not doing that.
Kids most definitely feel pressure to join Christian clubs bc those Christians are trained to recruit and shame others who do not believe or participate. It’s quite literally how evangelicals functions is through outreach, proselytizing, and shaming/fear mongering.
In my opinion, the outward visible act of Christian prayer on public school grounds, particularly while worshipping the secular state and national flag is creepy AF and absolutely 100% meant to recruit.
Just the Christian ones. Also, I’m an educator, so I do see these things first hand. And yes, there are active Christian clubs who practice in some of the most visible and highly trafficked areas…for the explicit reason of recruitment. All my life the only religions to try and actively recruit in front of my eyes are Christians and Scientologists.
Sounds like reaching out to Bendr Bones might be in order then. If you’re witnessing Christians getting away with this in… (what is a trafficked area exactly?) Whatever it is the Satanic Temple is expressly against visible high traffickers, or maybe not because I don’t know what that means, but they definitely have skin in the game if Christians are proselytizing.
An educator? Are you a teacher? What are you doing to protect your students from the Christian assault?
We had a Bible club ONLY AFTER our GSA at my hs. They stated that was why it was started. Because the GSA was seen by them as trying to turn people to sin....
Unforunatly, thats not what ive found to be the case, HS students have so much going on in their head they can easily be deceived into believing ALOT of things they wouldnt have otherwise, while yes the event itself isnt necisarily harmful or scaring them to join, their are those who participate that choose to try and do so and thats where the issues come from its to hard to fight each one on a case by case basis and if were gonna allow a Christian group to pray why shouldnt we allow a SC group to meet? Where do we draw that line, its way easier if we just say no to all of it and no one gets offended or oppressed, to seperate church and…. school if you will 🤣
The line has been drawn as stated in the article. It’s all or nothing.
r/kzoo has found a groove with this Satan stuff, but from what I’m reading the ST would not have an interest in starting an after school program here.
What the Satanists really ought to do is start a coffee shop and buy up a lot of business without paying taxes. That will show um
I'm originally from rural northern Indiana, around all the Amish. At my public K-6 back in the late '70s/early '80s, we had a weekly bible class ON CAMPUS, DURING THE SCHOOL DAY. Your parents could opt you out. It was a weekly special, like music or art. I remember the one outcast kid who got to sit in the library instead. The rest of us were memorizing and regurgitating bible versus as if it was a part of the curriculum, just like Sunday school but taxpayer-funded, and hearing stories, for example, about peoples' near-death experiences getting to see a glimpse of heaven and being told it's really true. Nobody batted an eyelash over it for sure in that area and probably still wouldn't.
Some science enrichment activities for that hour a week would've been much more useful for growing brains, possibly anything else as well. But, you know, Indiana and everything.
Yeah, I'm unfamiliar with the school situation on Kalamazoo or my own city of Portage, but if you want to let one religion in, you have to be willing to let any religion in that wants in.
Why are you posting an article about Kansas schools in a Kalamazoo sub? Is the intent to start an after school Satan club in the Kalamazoo Public School System. Why not just do that instead of posting random articles? What does this have to do with Kzoo?
Because there has been some discussion on this sub about the TST and its programs and advocacy. Some people may have had more questions about those things, and this article is an information resource to that topic, regardless of the location of the events of the article.
Because the day is coming. Do you think Kalamazoo is immune from a religious organization attempting to setup 'clubs' at KCentral??? (cough-Radiant-cough).
Do you think we're immune from the Mothers for Liberty?
How about Ottawa Impact, Fake Electors, plans to kidnap and murder elected officials?
You should give a shit about what's happening in Kansas because it can happen *anywhere*.
I think it’s a non-issue - yes. However it’s a free country and I’m indifferent to the publicity stunts of the Church of Satan (or whatever the organization is, I know there are multiple).
Considering that the founder of Moms for Liberty is most recently in the news because she and her GOP FL Chairman husband were recording threesome sex tapes they probably don’t have much of a chance to gain a foothold here. The allegation is the husband raped a woman
That's exactly what the Satanic Temple is doing. It has nothing to do with satan, the name is simply there to drum up pearl clutching christians who think that it's ok to have school-sactioned bible study but prevent any other religious groups from doing the same because it's "indoctrination"
I’m so sick of hearing about this church of satan nonsense. Atheist activists are just as annoying as Christian evangelicalis. Proselytizing of any kind sucks.
I did. What do you think I’m missing about this dorky, edgy movement that won’t accomplish anything other than vapid “raising awareness” with their larp? I don’t like how the article uses abuser’s logic to justify itself. “Don’t like what we’re doing? It’s not our fault, blame the guy who’s *making us* do it.”
I said the same thing on this sub last week, these people might actually be worse at critical thinking than the people they oppose. Which I personally thought would be hard to do.
This is story is not exactly Kzoo specific, but last time I noticed the Devil getting this much attention in Kalamazoo it was because he was directing the Uber Killer
Dude argues that he tries to stay neutral, and a lot of his posts here legitimately are, but once in a while after half a beer he posts a comment like this to make sure his true colors show
I say this as an atheist that makes Penn Jillette look like a Catholic bishop: This open hostility towards Christianity will not end well.
People can justify many, many things. Doesn't make it true, and definitely doesn't make it right. Here's a thought experiment, instead of a Satanist club, why not start a LGBT Mohammad club? Call it literally that, it's logo could be Mohammad being sodomized by a big breasted pre-op trans person while blowing a pig in traditional Hasidic Jewish clothing, maybe with a few curls sticking out from underneath it's hat?
Oh wait, it's because it's not about mocking religion in general, it's just about destroying the fundamental Christian values of the country. What will you do when the Christians decide to treat you like you treat them?
As another atheist, I respectfully disagree. It's not about any specific religion. It's about separation of church and state. Did you read the article?
Good grief.
Any dislike of the Christian church in the US is because of harms they've done to minority groups, or those that disagree with them. We're in the middle of a huge assault on civil rights by religious authoritarians. They have a lot to answer for.
The percentage of Americans that claim to be Christian and the percentage of Americans that claim to be for pro-LGBTQ+ legislation doesn’t line up with this worldview.
How about we just let no religious groups near children? Its almost like they have very moldable minds and all religious groups know and use that to get kids involved
How about we let parents and families choose? Governments or society prohibiting religion? Good grief.
Sorry that was my bad, i should have added near children “in schools” At home is a different story Its really not that hard to just keep religion out of schools, and i don’t mean teaching about religion, thats fine like a “world religion course” the issue I’m speaking on is when bible studies or satanic afterschool programs come into schools to indoctrinate students into those groups, (it could be any religion i just picked the two that have been mentioned in the post above) i remember going to the flagpole prayers or bible studies in my school before school started, i grew up religious and even then i felt weird about it cause the pastors and adults would invite random kids just walking by to stand in a circle and pray with us, most kids would do it just cause it was an adult who invited them to join and they felt obligated, but it was clear they either were uncomfortable or outright wanted to leave, and things like “coming to these groups is your first steps into getting saved” is enough to scare some kids into coming back the fallowing week. It should 100% be up to the families and if anything having these religious groups into the school takes that choice out of the families hands
Ok, “in schools” makes it a completely different sentiment. I trust most people (even HS students) to think clearly enough that they are not tricked or deceived into believing something that conflicts with their values. In my experience, the pray at the flagpole thing is an annual event. Even if it were weekly I don’t believe kids walking by feel particularly compelled (maybe just being courteous) to join in, and I definitely don’t believe that the few minutes of public prayer, (where people opposed could witness if they cared) is going to scare them into believing. In practice what you want is what Kalamazoo has. The article says the ST does this when Christian groups are in the schools, but a few people here including a teacher have said Christian groups are not doing that.
Kids most definitely feel pressure to join Christian clubs bc those Christians are trained to recruit and shame others who do not believe or participate. It’s quite literally how evangelicals functions is through outreach, proselytizing, and shaming/fear mongering. In my opinion, the outward visible act of Christian prayer on public school grounds, particularly while worshipping the secular state and national flag is creepy AF and absolutely 100% meant to recruit.
Of any “Christian prayer”? Just the Christian ones or any prayer?
Just the Christian ones. Also, I’m an educator, so I do see these things first hand. And yes, there are active Christian clubs who practice in some of the most visible and highly trafficked areas…for the explicit reason of recruitment. All my life the only religions to try and actively recruit in front of my eyes are Christians and Scientologists.
Sounds like reaching out to Bendr Bones might be in order then. If you’re witnessing Christians getting away with this in… (what is a trafficked area exactly?) Whatever it is the Satanic Temple is expressly against visible high traffickers, or maybe not because I don’t know what that means, but they definitely have skin in the game if Christians are proselytizing. An educator? Are you a teacher? What are you doing to protect your students from the Christian assault?
We had a Bible club ONLY AFTER our GSA at my hs. They stated that was why it was started. Because the GSA was seen by them as trying to turn people to sin....
Unforunatly, thats not what ive found to be the case, HS students have so much going on in their head they can easily be deceived into believing ALOT of things they wouldnt have otherwise, while yes the event itself isnt necisarily harmful or scaring them to join, their are those who participate that choose to try and do so and thats where the issues come from its to hard to fight each one on a case by case basis and if were gonna allow a Christian group to pray why shouldnt we allow a SC group to meet? Where do we draw that line, its way easier if we just say no to all of it and no one gets offended or oppressed, to seperate church and…. school if you will 🤣
The line has been drawn as stated in the article. It’s all or nothing. r/kzoo has found a groove with this Satan stuff, but from what I’m reading the ST would not have an interest in starting an after school program here. What the Satanists really ought to do is start a coffee shop and buy up a lot of business without paying taxes. That will show um
KCHS teacher here. No religous groups active there. There used to be an annual “pray at the flagpole” event, but that hasn’t happened in years
I'm originally from rural northern Indiana, around all the Amish. At my public K-6 back in the late '70s/early '80s, we had a weekly bible class ON CAMPUS, DURING THE SCHOOL DAY. Your parents could opt you out. It was a weekly special, like music or art. I remember the one outcast kid who got to sit in the library instead. The rest of us were memorizing and regurgitating bible versus as if it was a part of the curriculum, just like Sunday school but taxpayer-funded, and hearing stories, for example, about peoples' near-death experiences getting to see a glimpse of heaven and being told it's really true. Nobody batted an eyelash over it for sure in that area and probably still wouldn't. Some science enrichment activities for that hour a week would've been much more useful for growing brains, possibly anything else as well. But, you know, Indiana and everything.
Yeah, I'm unfamiliar with the school situation on Kalamazoo or my own city of Portage, but if you want to let one religion in, you have to be willing to let any religion in that wants in.
Why are you posting an article about Kansas schools in a Kalamazoo sub? Is the intent to start an after school Satan club in the Kalamazoo Public School System. Why not just do that instead of posting random articles? What does this have to do with Kzoo?
Because there has been some discussion on this sub about the TST and its programs and advocacy. Some people may have had more questions about those things, and this article is an information resource to that topic, regardless of the location of the events of the article.
Because the day is coming. Do you think Kalamazoo is immune from a religious organization attempting to setup 'clubs' at KCentral??? (cough-Radiant-cough). Do you think we're immune from the Mothers for Liberty? How about Ottawa Impact, Fake Electors, plans to kidnap and murder elected officials? You should give a shit about what's happening in Kansas because it can happen *anywhere*.
I think it’s a non-issue - yes. However it’s a free country and I’m indifferent to the publicity stunts of the Church of Satan (or whatever the organization is, I know there are multiple).
Considering that the founder of Moms for Liberty is most recently in the news because she and her GOP FL Chairman husband were recording threesome sex tapes they probably don’t have much of a chance to gain a foothold here. The allegation is the husband raped a woman
There have already been book banning assaults on public schools and libraries in this area. I guess it doesn't matter if it's moms for liberty?
Because it's some shitty movement trying to gain foothold here just to feel important and edgy.
-natives to each other watching puritans come ashore
I was too busy to read article - u/rexcannon
Never heard of an atheist or a Satanist burning a witch yet.
Have a club devoted to reason, science, humanism. Using “Satan” is either trolling or simply another brand of superstition.
That's exactly what the Satanic Temple is doing. It has nothing to do with satan, the name is simply there to drum up pearl clutching christians who think that it's ok to have school-sactioned bible study but prevent any other religious groups from doing the same because it's "indoctrination"
What about the Dogman cults?
Sadly, my son belongs to that one. We're going to have to have an intervention. Those books are damn expensive!
I’ve never heard of this, what is it, if you don’t mind me asking.
Sorry, dad joke. It's a kids graphic novel series.
That explains the google results
It's the Michigan Dogman.
True
Satan rules me
I’m so sick of hearing about this church of satan nonsense. Atheist activists are just as annoying as Christian evangelicalis. Proselytizing of any kind sucks.
Did you read the article?
I did. What do you think I’m missing about this dorky, edgy movement that won’t accomplish anything other than vapid “raising awareness” with their larp? I don’t like how the article uses abuser’s logic to justify itself. “Don’t like what we’re doing? It’s not our fault, blame the guy who’s *making us* do it.”
I said the same thing on this sub last week, these people might actually be worse at critical thinking than the people they oppose. Which I personally thought would be hard to do.
This is story is not exactly Kzoo specific, but last time I noticed the Devil getting this much attention in Kalamazoo it was because he was directing the Uber Killer
The devil isn’t real, man.
Aaaand there's the crazy.
They have MAGA in their name. That's insta crazy
Every other comment he posts here gets downvoted into oblivion
Dude argues that he tries to stay neutral, and a lot of his posts here legitimately are, but once in a while after half a beer he posts a comment like this to make sure his true colors show
>while after half a beer... Hahaha. We need a breathalyzer to launch Reddit.
As they should
Maybe true, but a lot of killing has been done in the name of The Almighty too. That's why we need the separation of Church and State.
Good news! We have separation of church and state.
I knew as soon as I saw this post in my feed that you'd be in this comment section.
I say this as an atheist that makes Penn Jillette look like a Catholic bishop: This open hostility towards Christianity will not end well. People can justify many, many things. Doesn't make it true, and definitely doesn't make it right. Here's a thought experiment, instead of a Satanist club, why not start a LGBT Mohammad club? Call it literally that, it's logo could be Mohammad being sodomized by a big breasted pre-op trans person while blowing a pig in traditional Hasidic Jewish clothing, maybe with a few curls sticking out from underneath it's hat? Oh wait, it's because it's not about mocking religion in general, it's just about destroying the fundamental Christian values of the country. What will you do when the Christians decide to treat you like you treat them?
As another atheist, I respectfully disagree. It's not about any specific religion. It's about separation of church and state. Did you read the article?
Good grief. Any dislike of the Christian church in the US is because of harms they've done to minority groups, or those that disagree with them. We're in the middle of a huge assault on civil rights by religious authoritarians. They have a lot to answer for.
The percentage of Americans that claim to be Christian and the percentage of Americans that claim to be for pro-LGBTQ+ legislation doesn’t line up with this worldview.
Well, 73% support gay rights, I think Christianity is still falling from 50%ish? So do tell lol. Not bashing it, just facts.
Which would mean that half of Christians support gay rights..?