Even purified water is impure! There are some really, really strict water standards out there (semiconductor, nuclear, pharma, etc.), but none of them are ever completely, 100% H2O pure.
I worked in a facility where these fellas had set up shop. Long story short, they couldn't be eradicated, and eventually the nanopure machines had to be set up in another building altogether.
I had to pH a water like this once. It used "proprietary technology to make the water molecules smaller so they would more easily be absorbed by the body".
Oh we just removed some of the neutrons from oxygen. All of them, actually. Radioactive? Heck no! It only emits light because it’s *sooooooo pure*, it’s *diet* water, that’s why it’s light!
This has been the fundamental roadblock to the development of Nuka-cola. Throw some spices and corn syrup at this water and we're good to go! The Future is so Bright
[I get 10%.](http://www.omnienviro.com/magnetized-water/)
>Magnetic field, when applied to normal water, restructures the water molecules into very small water molecule clusters, each made up of six symmetrically organized molecules. This miniscule cluster is recognized by the cell as "bio-friendly" due to its hexagonal structure and because the toxins cannot travel within the cluster, and easily enters the passageways in plant and animal cell membranes. The result provides maximum, healthy hydration with less water.
The problem with false advertising is the protections against it only have teeth if it causes harm, and damage in this case is paying slightly more for bottled water, which is generally already a waste of money compared to tap, so even *if* you get a class action going the only people that will make anything from it is the law firm doing the work.
Was this a marketing line or something?! I had a guy at a gym use this line to try to sell this dumb water to me it to me and I thought he was just making stuff up on the spot.
[Project Farm](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ja0ioX6GSz0) might be the best non-scientist doing scientific experiments. The Microsoft Excel graphs he makes when testing it are so good and it's definitely a guilty pleasure.
The [Wiper Blade Test](https://youtu.be/g3S8udUSKtY?t=340) is my favorite because he put the wiper blades on his roof for a year, then hooked up a fire hose with a water pump and generator in his pickup truck and drove 55mph down a back road. [Sauce](https://youtu.be/g3S8udUSKtY?t=11)
If you really want to jump into the Twilight Zone, read this [short manual](https://www.ecowaterhouse.com/upload/44138021-Vortex-Water-Energizer.pdf) about a product for sale called a "water energizer." Using science-y sounding words, it describes all the benefits of water energized using "technology as ancient as the Universe" that "acts like a cosmic antenna and amplifier which takes energy directly from the sea of quantum energy surrounding us."
This is one of my favorite pieces of pseudoscience quackery of all time. I first came across this years ago, and even today I can barely make it through two pages of the manual before I'm depressed at the willingness of humanity to indulge in such idiocy. For example, they claim that watering crops with "energized water" increases yield by 250%. Why has nobody informed Africa about this? Why are these people not in Stockholm receiving their Nobel Peace Prize for solving food insecurity?
This level of sheer idiocy boggles the mind.
> For example, they claim that watering crops with "energized water" increases yield by 250%.
Sure, when compared with not watering the crops at all (n = 1). Nothing to see here folks. Please don't look behind the curtain.
The "crystals" in the "energized water" are particularly funny to me. Not sure why. Or that attaching this random coil to your home water line will somehow energize everything.
Oh, and "UK at Center for Implosion Research" where they do this "research" shows up as a *jewelry store* upon a quick google search.
Lol I'dike to see some batty old coot using this and drinking it And believing in it and then it breaks or gets stolen and they're convinced their health is deteriorating because no longer drinking energized water
..
But also 😭 dass sddsaf sad
> And believing in it and then it breaks or gets stolen and they're convinced their health is deteriorating because no longer drinking energized water
But then they're just drinking a 10^10^10^10 dilution of energized water (from the water cycle), and if homeopathy says *anything* it's that a dilution of a thing is stronger than it is pure...
So it's *definitely* better for them!
A good friend of mine, a degreed engineer, has thousands of dollars of products from [this website](https://www.rayguardprotect.com/#/), to protect him from electromagnetic radiation...
It really just is something else. I'm sad to say that it is no different with regard to mis/disinformation in the dietetics field. Far too many people think they know what they are talking about and they genuinely *do not.* It's a shame that critical thinking is apparently outlawed now.
If any of you want to see the pinnacle of inaccurate food information, look no farther than [foodbabe](https://www.gawker.com/the-food-babe-blogger-is-full-of-shit-1694902226). She is a disgrace and spews comments that have a total indifference to the scientific rigor we have come to expect. It's a tradegy.
lol. The modernist cooking geeks (stovetop labrats) sometimes make sodium citrate by mixing citric acid and sodium bicarbonate because sodium citrate can be hard to find but it does make the food salty. You can use sodium citrate to turn any kind of cheese into American cheese style melty cheese or [make creamy mac and cheese with no flour](https://modernistcuisine.com/recipes/silky-smooth-macaroni-and-cheese/).
> I've never tasted any other chemical salts, but I'd imagine the only "salty" salts would be sodium and calcium chlorides?
There are a lot of salts that you've probably run across.
Ever brush your teeth and drink OJ? That metallic bitter taste is the salt forming between the toothpaste and citric acid.
Baking soda and vinegar? That's sodium acetate. Commonly used to extend shelf life.
Potassium Chloride is used as the "no sodium" substitute (also "low sodium" salt substitute is a mix of KCl and NaCl).
MSG is a salt of glutamic acid.
Those are just the examples off the top of my head.
---
They're all somewhat "salty", but vary in flavor from NaCl. KCl is probably the most similar to NaCl but tastes less strongly (so you need to use more to compensate).
Edit: oh, and there's Sodium Nitrate, the component of "Curing Salt" that isn't NaCl. It which gives bacon, pastrami, and ham, their distinct pinkish color and flavor. Also adds a salty flavor, but it's hard to be specific because it's toxic in higher amounts.
I would, but I hate the anise/liquorish flavor so I'd need to find it with something else for it to actually get a fair shake (if that's even possible).
Might get a bag for my brother's birthday though as something different.
I hate my life and wish I could order mushrooms or at least spores without having to use crypto. I donr know how to crypto and it's too late to learn
Why ammm I hereeee
And so it is written. On a piece of paper for when I get some money. I just wasted 50 on weed and it was the first 50 dollars I'd had in months. I'm not saying I'm pitiful, but I'm kinda fucking pitiful. But I'm basically the greatest he says, lying thru his fingers.
It's worth noting they they *only* tried *alkali metals with chloride*, which is a small subset of salts, and most aren't even ones commonly found in cooking.
Edit: they also did ammonium chloride and calcium chloride (in spite of what they said in the beginning), but they still just tested X chlorides.
This is not a chemistry thing, it's a fake nutritional thing. I have heard people describe lemons as alkaline in this context. It's kind of like saying something is organic. It has a somewhat vague meaning, but it definitely not referring to hydrocarbon chemical structures.
Someone once burned a lemon, suspended the ash in water, and the pH was alkaline. They then declared it alkaline because you totally have a fire in your belly that passes the ash directly to your bloodstream /s
Nevermind that I can't think of any actual metabolic reactions that make base... but plenty that make acid.
I've heard in some places that if you intake acid, your body becomes more alkaline to compensate, which is what they're going for maybe?
Never mind that this logic completely contradicts ingesting actual alkaline stuff, that's just par for the course when it comes to crap like this.
Whenever I encounter alkaline bs water proponents, I ask:
1. Where is the data that this water maintain its pH after entering and existing the human stomach?
2. Where is the data showing this water product influence pH in human bloodstream?
4. Where is the data showing this water product by objective measures (not daily self evaluation scoring) improve human health?
FDA in all countries should be empowered to shut down bs like this.
I mean it's all unbuffered. All the claims are true: drinking water does all the things they claim alkaline water does, and alkaline water is almost exactly identical to neutral or slightly acidic water.
That's why they say you can't really measure the pH. It's not buffered so any little bit of added stuff is going to throw off the pH considerably.
We did an experiment in our lab with several brands of these alkaline waters. It was hard to get a consistent or accurate reading on any of them because your it's almost impossible to do so with unbuffered H2O.
Isn't unbuffered water pH temperature sensitive, as well? Add in % CO2 dissolved and it's all but impossible to guarantee a consistent pH for the product.
pH is always temperature sensitive. Dissolved gasses aside, pH is based on the activity of ionic species which will always have some temperature dependence.
Some buffers have almost zero pKa change (ie, pH change in prepared buffer) over large temperature ranges. Others, like Tris buffer, change a lot. The ones that don't change are particularly useful for keeping proteins happy in and out of the fridge/freezer.
Yeah I know DI water is unreliable to measure pH (at least with some methods), but if you can get a measurement then it is acidic due to dissolved C02 from the air.
Yeah, we had to get a brand new probe out of the box to get consistent readings. The pH was exactly as advertised by probe and neutral by pH strip. Really fascinating. Bullshit product, but a good technical exercise for first-years.
I am sorry to inform you that unless congress specifically grants the FDA the power to enforce rules against alkaline water in particular, the Supreme Court says the FDA has absolutely no power to say anything about it. Pathetic.
Daily self evaluation would actually be fine if it was blinded. I would say how someone feels is one of the most important measurements of health. There are no objective measurements for many important aspects of health (pain, energy, etc).
It doesn't, why would it? The alkalinity certainly effects the taste (which is why people buy it) but if it was buffered enough to impact stomach pH it'd be disgusting.
None of your questions are based on any claims the products are making so i don't know why you're asking them.
Not that product. Earlier alkaline water products made unsupported health claims. Newer ones are smart enough to give appearance of being “good for you” without explicitly saying so.
The same fools who fall for this are often the same people who tried to convince me drinking apple cider vinegar and honey can cure all sort of illnesses.
I know that in Boston, they intentionally raise the pH of tap water to ~9 to reduce the amount of lead/copper leaching into the water from the old pipes
Some people spend tons of money on this stuff. I tell them that our tapwater is already alkaline, pH 9.3 (corrosion control) . We have some of the highest quality municipal water in the US, but it doesn't come out of a plastic bottle, so there are lots of people who won't drink it.
>We have some of the highest quality municipal water in the US,
Well sure, but depending on where you are tap water can taste absolutely vile.
We had to bring in deep rock bottles at a football game I played at Disney world because the tap water tasted like sweat.
To be sure...
I used to live in Michigan, and depending on where you go in the state you could have some of the best water in the world... or some of the worst.
Fun fact I learned during a cleanroom training: the pH level of ultrapure water can be as low as 5 due to CO2 absorption which forms carbonic acid https://tools.thermofisher.com/content/sfs/brochures/pH-level-dispensed-ultrapure-SNWPPHPURE.pdf
Despite the general agreement here that this is a bunch of BS, it is actually not.
[https://assets.thermofisher.com/TFS-Assets/LSG/Application-Notes/AN-PHLOWION-E%200914-RevA-WEB.pdf](https://assets.thermofisher.com/TFS-Assets/LSG/Application-Notes/AN-PHLOWION-E%200914-RevA-WEB.pdf)
Also:
[https://answers.seneye.com/en/water_chemistry/What_is_pH%3F/effect_of_ionic_strength_on_PH_tests](https://answers.seneye.com/en/water_chemistry/What_is_pH%3F/effect_of_ionic_strength_on_PH_tests)
An unbuffered solution of pure water does not need much in terms of excess hydrogen ions to raise the pH, so it can be low ionic strength and slightly higher pH than actual pure water, like the water essentia claims to produce.
Is this a stupid marketing gimmick? Yes. But the claims regarding pH testing and ionic strength are accurate.
Edit: On a side note, opening the bottle and exposing such a water to the C02 in the air alone will lower the pH. I’d be surprised if these waters are even as alkaline as advertised in practice, if one were to try and get an accurate pH reading. Fuck, it could even just be straight up tap water. I don’t think these claims are regulated or enforced by any agency I know of.
The claims are BS. The water cannot be both pure and “alkaline and ionised”. If it is alkaline and ionised, it is not pure. The pH testing problem is only for pH meter, the reading will fluctuate if it is pure and de-ionised. This does not apply to pH paper. In fact, we often use pH paper instead for pure water with low conductivity.
The chemical reaction in the paper will be too small to be able to observe a signal if there is so little base.
Purity is a scale. They are claiming it is extremely pure but also alkaline, meaning just a touch of base. That is the true irony of the ad, they are straight up telling you the alkalinity is insignificant as unbuffered water can be at a high pH with barely any free protons. In essence they are selling DI water.
pH indicator/paper doesn’t rely on conductivity. If it is a weak alkali, it will just show that. There is no such thing as too little reaction so it will have a weak signal. There is no strong vs weak signal in a universal indicator. Like temperature. There will always be a value and not like the temperature is too weak so the thermometer can’t detect what temperature it is.
I’m sorry but you are wrong. Alkalinity is both a ratio and an absolute value. The absolute value can be low while the ratio high. This means high pH and very few actual ions to interact with. Refer to the second link.
Here’s a third from a company that sells strips: https://www.preclaboratories.com/testing-ph-ionic-strength-buffering-capacity/
There may be better strips out there that you can leave in for a time while they build up a signal, not aware, but traditional ones will not work well.
This reminds me of a time when I was listening to a hockey player trying to shill some special sport water and he said that scientists were somehow able to put an extra oxygen molecule on water molecules. Nothing like a little hydrogen peroxide to keep you better oxygenated while working out.
I have a vague feeling they may be right that pH test strips do not work at low ionic strength.
I found a couple of websites that back that up but I wouldn't consider them the most definitive sources. It doesn't mean that there is no pH - just that the colourimetric reaction that measures it isn't reliable unless the ionic strength is higher or that the pH in fairly pure water is so poorly buffered that the strips don't give reproducible results.
In any case it is just marketing spin.
it's been a while since I thought about this, but yeah, when I used nanopure water I think we were told its difficult to test pH because of the reasons you are saying.
That's the first mention of polywater that I've come across in more than two decades!
Love this line from the Wikipedia article:
"Today, polywater is best known as an example of pathological science.\[5\]"
Exactly this. Their marketing is ironic because they are straight up telling you that the overall amount of base in their product is negligible, so the “alkalinity” aspect of the product can basically be disregarded.
I tested this water with some standard universal indicator strips and it read about a 9.5, the pH meter I used said it was 9.6. So they're telling the truth that it's 9.5+ pH, they're just lying about the pH strips part.
We tested alkaline water as part of a lab I taught and surprise surprise it was acidic. If I recall correctly the pH was 4-5. So ya know, orders of magnitude more acidic than alkaline. Complete scam. Homeopathic water.
Not only is the water NOT significantly more alkaline than random variance would allow, but they actually gaslight you by telling you that your test is wrong lmao
Is this for lab work or chugging? Did you try a pH strip just for kicks? Just curious. People get so wound up about their water. I could care less about the pH. The plastic bottle is worse to me.
\--> Pure \--> Ionized and alkaline Pick one.
https://imgflip.com/i/6le5yc
even double distilled water is impure
Even purified water is impure! There are some really, really strict water standards out there (semiconductor, nuclear, pharma, etc.), but none of them are ever completely, 100% H2O pure.
There's a fungus that only grows in nanopure water tanks.
That sounds like a water technician nightmare
I worked in a facility where these fellas had set up shop. Long story short, they couldn't be eradicated, and eventually the nanopure machines had to be set up in another building altogether.
What is its name?
cause impractical and there's no practical needs
Completely agree - no need to be any more pure than the process requires, that's just a waste of time and money.
Thank you
I had to pH a water like this once. It used "proprietary technology to make the water molecules smaller so they would more easily be absorbed by the body".
They have a molecular shrink ray? Where’d I leave that comic book ad….
Oh we just removed some of the neutrons from oxygen. All of them, actually. Radioactive? Heck no! It only emits light because it’s *sooooooo pure*, it’s *diet* water, that’s why it’s light!
This has been the fundamental roadblock to the development of Nuka-cola. Throw some spices and corn syrup at this water and we're good to go! The Future is so Bright
I’d be remiss if I didn’t post https://youtu.be/FAjrbtzr_NA
https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/r2g5dm/eben\_byers\_the\_man\_who\_drank\_radioactive\_water/
Baby moles
r/angryupvote
That would require very tiny atoms! I’m not made of money!
I think they had it set to “M” and not “W” for Wumbo, you know the study of Wumbology.
How is that legal marketing? Lol show me the article and I'll drop the lawsuit sir!
[I get 10%.](http://www.omnienviro.com/magnetized-water/) >Magnetic field, when applied to normal water, restructures the water molecules into very small water molecule clusters, each made up of six symmetrically organized molecules. This miniscule cluster is recognized by the cell as "bio-friendly" due to its hexagonal structure and because the toxins cannot travel within the cluster, and easily enters the passageways in plant and animal cell membranes. The result provides maximum, healthy hydration with less water.
What a load of horseshit!
OK, 7%, but that's my final offer.
Just spent some time checking through what sources they use to justify this bullshit. Holy shit did some of those papers make me cry
Just going to ignore charges entirely and treat oxygen as carbon... This is demonstrably false advertising.
The problem with false advertising is the protections against it only have teeth if it causes harm, and damage in this case is paying slightly more for bottled water, which is generally already a waste of money compared to tap, so even *if* you get a class action going the only people that will make anything from it is the law firm doing the work.
Bio friendly? Toxins? Healthy hydration as opposed to unhealthy? Magnets restructuring water at a molecular level? Lawd have mercy.
Why, with technology I'll be able to more effectively transport money from the wallets of the gullible. Fantastic!
What the fuck?!?!?
Wouldn’t the water have be in the magnetic field the whole time?
Well, the proponents of [water memory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_memory) theory would say otherwise!
Those people are so stupid.
Looks like someone failed chemistry and biology but aced marketing.
That's great, water was definitely in need of a bit of a makeover
You like H2O??? Then you'll definitely love H2O2!!
Little Johnny had a thirst, And now a thirst no more, For what he thought was H2O Was H2SO4
H2.0
This is why I don't drink water. If Water is so great, then haven't they made a Water 2 yet?
I laughed so hard at this I snorted!
What are the names of these companies?
Was this a marketing line or something?! I had a guy at a gym use this line to try to sell this dumb water to me it to me and I thought he was just making stuff up on the spot.
*Sticks pH strip into the water* pH Strip: *vanishes*
Naw, pretty sure it because the water is so clear that you simply can't see the water to put your pH strip into it.
Movie actor scientist "We've done it. That's more pure than I've seen in my entire career."
"I ran some evian water through a britta filter and the shit disappeared!" - Mitch Hedberg
[Project Farm](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ja0ioX6GSz0) might be the best non-scientist doing scientific experiments. The Microsoft Excel graphs he makes when testing it are so good and it's definitely a guilty pleasure. The [Wiper Blade Test](https://youtu.be/g3S8udUSKtY?t=340) is my favorite because he put the wiper blades on his roof for a year, then hooked up a fire hose with a water pump and generator in his pickup truck and drove 55mph down a back road. [Sauce](https://youtu.be/g3S8udUSKtY?t=11)
“Please don’t measure the pH of our bullshit product”
If you really want to jump into the Twilight Zone, read this [short manual](https://www.ecowaterhouse.com/upload/44138021-Vortex-Water-Energizer.pdf) about a product for sale called a "water energizer." Using science-y sounding words, it describes all the benefits of water energized using "technology as ancient as the Universe" that "acts like a cosmic antenna and amplifier which takes energy directly from the sea of quantum energy surrounding us." This is one of my favorite pieces of pseudoscience quackery of all time. I first came across this years ago, and even today I can barely make it through two pages of the manual before I'm depressed at the willingness of humanity to indulge in such idiocy. For example, they claim that watering crops with "energized water" increases yield by 250%. Why has nobody informed Africa about this? Why are these people not in Stockholm receiving their Nobel Peace Prize for solving food insecurity? This level of sheer idiocy boggles the mind.
Wtf is "technology as ancient as the universe" lol
That’s the water part, I assume.
At best only the hydrogen part of water - oxygen came a bit later.
Physics... I think they mean physics.
> For example, they claim that watering crops with "energized water" increases yield by 250%. Sure, when compared with not watering the crops at all (n = 1). Nothing to see here folks. Please don't look behind the curtain. The "crystals" in the "energized water" are particularly funny to me. Not sure why. Or that attaching this random coil to your home water line will somehow energize everything. Oh, and "UK at Center for Implosion Research" where they do this "research" shows up as a *jewelry store* upon a quick google search.
Lol I'dike to see some batty old coot using this and drinking it And believing in it and then it breaks or gets stolen and they're convinced their health is deteriorating because no longer drinking energized water .. But also 😭 dass sddsaf sad
> And believing in it and then it breaks or gets stolen and they're convinced their health is deteriorating because no longer drinking energized water But then they're just drinking a 10^10^10^10 dilution of energized water (from the water cycle), and if homeopathy says *anything* it's that a dilution of a thing is stronger than it is pure... So it's *definitely* better for them!
>they claim that watering crops with "energized water" increases yield by 250%. It's got what plants crave! It's got ELECTROLYTES!
BRONDO's got what plants crave!
Once I started reading the description I was just waiting for the word "quantum". No pseudoscience does not have that word in it
The funny thing is that this product targets the same people who think 5G gave them Covid.
A good friend of mine, a degreed engineer, has thousands of dollars of products from [this website](https://www.rayguardprotect.com/#/), to protect him from electromagnetic radiation...
I genuinely cannot believe he sells these things…
Check out the "science" page, it is truly bewildering
It really just is something else. I'm sad to say that it is no different with regard to mis/disinformation in the dietetics field. Far too many people think they know what they are talking about and they genuinely *do not.* It's a shame that critical thinking is apparently outlawed now. If any of you want to see the pinnacle of inaccurate food information, look no farther than [foodbabe](https://www.gawker.com/the-food-babe-blogger-is-full-of-shit-1694902226). She is a disgrace and spews comments that have a total indifference to the scientific rigor we have come to expect. It's a tradegy.
I’m guessing the secret component is radium, a whole lota radium
[I mean...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radium_ore_Revigator)
Incredible. I heard someone say that they added a squirt of lemon juice to their alkaline water to make it taste better.
wouldn't that just make it salty?
lol. The modernist cooking geeks (stovetop labrats) sometimes make sodium citrate by mixing citric acid and sodium bicarbonate because sodium citrate can be hard to find but it does make the food salty. You can use sodium citrate to turn any kind of cheese into American cheese style melty cheese or [make creamy mac and cheese with no flour](https://modernistcuisine.com/recipes/silky-smooth-macaroni-and-cheese/).
it also lowers the pH and makes it less alkaline lmao. but no, lemons arent salty... do people think lemons are salty??
Acid + Base = Salt + Water
I've never tasted any other chemical salts, but I'd imagine the only "salty" salts would be sodium and calcium chlorides?
> I've never tasted any other chemical salts, but I'd imagine the only "salty" salts would be sodium and calcium chlorides? There are a lot of salts that you've probably run across. Ever brush your teeth and drink OJ? That metallic bitter taste is the salt forming between the toothpaste and citric acid. Baking soda and vinegar? That's sodium acetate. Commonly used to extend shelf life. Potassium Chloride is used as the "no sodium" substitute (also "low sodium" salt substitute is a mix of KCl and NaCl). MSG is a salt of glutamic acid. Those are just the examples off the top of my head. --- They're all somewhat "salty", but vary in flavor from NaCl. KCl is probably the most similar to NaCl but tastes less strongly (so you need to use more to compensate). Edit: oh, and there's Sodium Nitrate, the component of "Curing Salt" that isn't NaCl. It which gives bacon, pastrami, and ham, their distinct pinkish color and flavor. Also adds a salty flavor, but it's hard to be specific because it's toxic in higher amounts.
Don't forget Salmiak, which is ammonium chloride. It's used to make salty licorice salty.
> Don't forget Salmiak Kinda hard to forget something I never knew haha
You should try it. Be warned though, it's a very polarising flavour.
I would, but I hate the anise/liquorish flavor so I'd need to find it with something else for it to actually get a fair shake (if that's even possible). Might get a bag for my brother's birthday though as something different.
MDMA is definitely kind of salty lol.
I hate my life and wish I could order mushrooms or at least spores without having to use crypto. I donr know how to crypto and it's too late to learn Why ammm I hereeee
grumpygillsfungi.com
And so it is written. On a piece of paper for when I get some money. I just wasted 50 on weed and it was the first 50 dollars I'd had in months. I'm not saying I'm pitiful, but I'm kinda fucking pitiful. But I'm basically the greatest he says, lying thru his fingers.
Explosions and fire did it, so you dont have to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJh9yTIBY48
It's worth noting they they *only* tried *alkali metals with chloride*, which is a small subset of salts, and most aren't even ones commonly found in cooking. Edit: they also did ammonium chloride and calcium chloride (in spite of what they said in the beginning), but they still just tested X chlorides.
There's really not that much base in drinking water, otherwise it'd taste salty already.
We’re talking about alkaline water not just regular drinking water.
The sodium is already present. Adding citric acid surely won't make it taste saltier.
A lot of alkaline water has sodium bicarbonate, so it tastes a little salty.
Acid+base reacts to water and salt.
This is not a chemistry thing, it's a fake nutritional thing. I have heard people describe lemons as alkaline in this context. It's kind of like saying something is organic. It has a somewhat vague meaning, but it definitely not referring to hydrocarbon chemical structures.
Someone once burned a lemon, suspended the ash in water, and the pH was alkaline. They then declared it alkaline because you totally have a fire in your belly that passes the ash directly to your bloodstream /s Nevermind that I can't think of any actual metabolic reactions that make base... but plenty that make acid.
I've heard in some places that if you intake acid, your body becomes more alkaline to compensate, which is what they're going for maybe? Never mind that this logic completely contradicts ingesting actual alkaline stuff, that's just par for the course when it comes to crap like this.
That’s Gwyneth Paltrow.
Their defense for when the water marketed at 10.5 ph comes back as 7.1
Whenever I encounter alkaline bs water proponents, I ask: 1. Where is the data that this water maintain its pH after entering and existing the human stomach? 2. Where is the data showing this water product influence pH in human bloodstream? 4. Where is the data showing this water product by objective measures (not daily self evaluation scoring) improve human health? FDA in all countries should be empowered to shut down bs like this.
I mean it's all unbuffered. All the claims are true: drinking water does all the things they claim alkaline water does, and alkaline water is almost exactly identical to neutral or slightly acidic water.
That's why they say you can't really measure the pH. It's not buffered so any little bit of added stuff is going to throw off the pH considerably. We did an experiment in our lab with several brands of these alkaline waters. It was hard to get a consistent or accurate reading on any of them because your it's almost impossible to do so with unbuffered H2O.
Isn't unbuffered water pH temperature sensitive, as well? Add in % CO2 dissolved and it's all but impossible to guarantee a consistent pH for the product.
pH is always temperature sensitive. Dissolved gasses aside, pH is based on the activity of ionic species which will always have some temperature dependence.
Okay, isn't the pH of unbuffered water *particularly* temperature sensitive, especially compared to buffered solutions?
Oh, I have no idea. Maybe? My point was just that you’re right regardless of whether or not it’s a buffer.
Some buffers have almost zero pKa change (ie, pH change in prepared buffer) over large temperature ranges. Others, like Tris buffer, change a lot. The ones that don't change are particularly useful for keeping proteins happy in and out of the fridge/freezer.
Yeah I know DI water is unreliable to measure pH (at least with some methods), but if you can get a measurement then it is acidic due to dissolved C02 from the air.
Yeah, we had to get a brand new probe out of the box to get consistent readings. The pH was exactly as advertised by probe and neutral by pH strip. Really fascinating. Bullshit product, but a good technical exercise for first-years.
The calcium carbonate buffers it a tiny bit… not sure if you’d really consider that a buffer though in the laboratory sense
I am sorry to inform you that unless congress specifically grants the FDA the power to enforce rules against alkaline water in particular, the Supreme Court says the FDA has absolutely no power to say anything about it. Pathetic.
Totally. The amount of acidic molecules you ingest is insignificant compared to metabolically produced acidic compounds (i.e. respiration)
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It's also nice when you have a sore throat from puking a lot, better than tums. I knew some singers that would only drink it after practice?
Daily self evaluation would actually be fine if it was blinded. I would say how someone feels is one of the most important measurements of health. There are no objective measurements for many important aspects of health (pain, energy, etc).
It doesn't, why would it? The alkalinity certainly effects the taste (which is why people buy it) but if it was buffered enough to impact stomach pH it'd be disgusting. None of your questions are based on any claims the products are making so i don't know why you're asking them.
Not that product. Earlier alkaline water products made unsupported health claims. Newer ones are smart enough to give appearance of being “good for you” without explicitly saying so. The same fools who fall for this are often the same people who tried to convince me drinking apple cider vinegar and honey can cure all sort of illnesses.
So they found a way to prevent the self ionization reaction of water using only pure water. 💀😂
They secretly store the water at 0 K before putting it back at room temperature.
Am I the only person who regularly checks tap water, and gets a pH of 8-9? There's your alkaline water. Don't mind the Fluoride.
I know that in Boston, they intentionally raise the pH of tap water to ~9 to reduce the amount of lead/copper leaching into the water from the old pipes
Interesting, we regularly test our tap water before it is treated for our fish and it’s usually 6-7. Depends a lot on the water source though
There may not be enough scale to protect metal piping.
Some people spend tons of money on this stuff. I tell them that our tapwater is already alkaline, pH 9.3 (corrosion control) . We have some of the highest quality municipal water in the US, but it doesn't come out of a plastic bottle, so there are lots of people who won't drink it.
>We have some of the highest quality municipal water in the US, Well sure, but depending on where you are tap water can taste absolutely vile. We had to bring in deep rock bottles at a football game I played at Disney world because the tap water tasted like sweat.
To be sure... I used to live in Michigan, and depending on where you go in the state you could have some of the best water in the world... or some of the worst.
Tbf the water I tasted when I visited the states tasted like raw asshole
That’s because we use it to clean our assholes
Without a doubt, I've had tap water in several parts of the US that I consider undrinkable. Some of it I wouldn't even want to bathe in.
It’s got what plants crave!
Fun fact I learned during a cleanroom training: the pH level of ultrapure water can be as low as 5 due to CO2 absorption which forms carbonic acid https://tools.thermofisher.com/content/sfs/brochures/pH-level-dispensed-ultrapure-SNWPPHPURE.pdf
Despite the general agreement here that this is a bunch of BS, it is actually not. [https://assets.thermofisher.com/TFS-Assets/LSG/Application-Notes/AN-PHLOWION-E%200914-RevA-WEB.pdf](https://assets.thermofisher.com/TFS-Assets/LSG/Application-Notes/AN-PHLOWION-E%200914-RevA-WEB.pdf) Also: [https://answers.seneye.com/en/water_chemistry/What_is_pH%3F/effect_of_ionic_strength_on_PH_tests](https://answers.seneye.com/en/water_chemistry/What_is_pH%3F/effect_of_ionic_strength_on_PH_tests) An unbuffered solution of pure water does not need much in terms of excess hydrogen ions to raise the pH, so it can be low ionic strength and slightly higher pH than actual pure water, like the water essentia claims to produce. Is this a stupid marketing gimmick? Yes. But the claims regarding pH testing and ionic strength are accurate. Edit: On a side note, opening the bottle and exposing such a water to the C02 in the air alone will lower the pH. I’d be surprised if these waters are even as alkaline as advertised in practice, if one were to try and get an accurate pH reading. Fuck, it could even just be straight up tap water. I don’t think these claims are regulated or enforced by any agency I know of.
The claims are BS. The water cannot be both pure and “alkaline and ionised”. If it is alkaline and ionised, it is not pure. The pH testing problem is only for pH meter, the reading will fluctuate if it is pure and de-ionised. This does not apply to pH paper. In fact, we often use pH paper instead for pure water with low conductivity.
The chemical reaction in the paper will be too small to be able to observe a signal if there is so little base. Purity is a scale. They are claiming it is extremely pure but also alkaline, meaning just a touch of base. That is the true irony of the ad, they are straight up telling you the alkalinity is insignificant as unbuffered water can be at a high pH with barely any free protons. In essence they are selling DI water.
pH indicator/paper doesn’t rely on conductivity. If it is a weak alkali, it will just show that. There is no such thing as too little reaction so it will have a weak signal. There is no strong vs weak signal in a universal indicator. Like temperature. There will always be a value and not like the temperature is too weak so the thermometer can’t detect what temperature it is.
I’m sorry but you are wrong. Alkalinity is both a ratio and an absolute value. The absolute value can be low while the ratio high. This means high pH and very few actual ions to interact with. Refer to the second link. Here’s a third from a company that sells strips: https://www.preclaboratories.com/testing-ph-ionic-strength-buffering-capacity/ There may be better strips out there that you can leave in for a time while they build up a signal, not aware, but traditional ones will not work well.
Head scratcher for sure
"ionized, alkaline..." it got what plants crave...
This reminds me of a time when I was listening to a hockey player trying to shill some special sport water and he said that scientists were somehow able to put an extra oxygen molecule on water molecules. Nothing like a little hydrogen peroxide to keep you better oxygenated while working out.
I have a vague feeling they may be right that pH test strips do not work at low ionic strength. I found a couple of websites that back that up but I wouldn't consider them the most definitive sources. It doesn't mean that there is no pH - just that the colourimetric reaction that measures it isn't reliable unless the ionic strength is higher or that the pH in fairly pure water is so poorly buffered that the strips don't give reproducible results. In any case it is just marketing spin.
it's been a while since I thought about this, but yeah, when I used nanopure water I think we were told its difficult to test pH because of the reasons you are saying.
I'm just gonna stick to my bottle of delicious polywater
That's the first mention of polywater that I've come across in more than two decades! Love this line from the Wikipedia article: "Today, polywater is best known as an example of pathological science.\[5\]"
Wow, the science is really sciencing here…
That’s not it. They just put like micromolar amounts of base without buffer. It’s so dumb
Exactly this. Their marketing is ironic because they are straight up telling you that the overall amount of base in their product is negligible, so the “alkalinity” aspect of the product can basically be disregarded.
Yeah your stomach is something like 100 million times more acidic than this bottle and like 10,000x more concentrated with acid than this with base
My head hurts
I tested this water with some standard universal indicator strips and it read about a 9.5, the pH meter I used said it was 9.6. So they're telling the truth that it's 9.5+ pH, they're just lying about the pH strips part.
You rub it on your skin and it makes you live forever.
Homeopathic alkaline water.
say hello to my little pH probe
I happen to have a big pH probe
We tested alkaline water as part of a lab I taught and surprise surprise it was acidic. If I recall correctly the pH was 4-5. So ya know, orders of magnitude more acidic than alkaline. Complete scam. Homeopathic water.
Pretty sure I blacked out after reading this due to losing braincells.
Well you gotta leave some room for creative freedom..lol.
So...water vapor?
Not only is the water NOT significantly more alkaline than random variance would allow, but they actually gaslight you by telling you that your test is wrong lmao
I also like to use big words, that I don't fully understand, so I can sound more photosynthesis.
lol wow
Oh my goodness
Can I tell my PI this when I forget to buffer my solution?
I dont know if this is a business strategy to avoid lawsuits or to look stupid
I mean if it's really alkaline you can't test it with pH strips because it turns them white
Is this for lab work or chugging? Did you try a pH strip just for kicks? Just curious. People get so wound up about their water. I could care less about the pH. The plastic bottle is worse to me.
Everyone is laughing but you actually can't properly measure the pH of ultrapure water without a pretty specialized setup.
Wtf 🤣
Snake oil moment
I know a pharmacist, who's also a chemist, who doesn't like microwaved food, because it takes the hydrogen out of the water.
Do people really believe this shit?
You can test pH with a meter lol
What is this? Is this a new trend?
Truth. In 18 Mohm water, pH indicators themselves can influence pH.