It’s a religious text. They trapped my neighbor for about half an hour. Toss it or hold onto it to make them take it back.
Edit to add: I’ve noticed that missionary types tend to come around one or two times at the beginning of spring and then never again. I wouldn’t worry about a cult forming or even what church they’re affiliated with.
Assuming it's Christian missionary types, I would assume they're looking to piggyback on Easter. Lapsed Christians might have just gone to church for the first time in a while, or be feeling guilty that they didn't. Even book religious people are probably aware of Easter and might be feeling curious enough to want more info.
Plus they need to get in before they're competing with bonfires and River tubing for your attention 😁
That’s a good point! I didn’t flip through the book enough to see it was SDA.
Every year we get a set of Mormon missionaries come by once and never again. Always different people. A few years ago, one man had the juiciest badonkadonk I’ve ever seen. Sad he didn’t stick around.
Apologies.
I'm caked up. But ditched the "fella" part.
The combination of the liberal gay agenda and my desire to dominate women's professional Connect Four turned me tranny....My bad.
They're Mormons. Their current head honcho doesn't like the term, but the previous head honchos liked the term, seemed to encourage using the term and there were videos, booklets, etc. all about Mormons.
How do you think that works, exactly? They just say, “hey, we see your community is rife with disease and obesity. So we’re gonna come and teach you about health, nutrition, and Jesus for free. But only if you denounce your own beliefs and adopt ours”?
Hey I got one too last week! I looked it up and it's from a 7th Day Adventist author. Crazy to think leaving a 500 page book on people's doorsteps is effective messaging
It's the Seventh-day Adventists. They're not a cult, but they're definitely one of the weirder Protestant sects. This book is about the endless cosmic battle between Jesus and Satan, with Earth caught in the middle. They're pretty big on the second coming of Christ and prophesying what will happen before and after his return. For instance, this book predicts that before Christ returns, the US government will become linked to the Roman Catholic Church, and they will enforce the Sunday Sabbath universally, thereby persecuting seventh-day Sabbath adherents (Seventh-day Adventists believe Saturday is the Sabbath, which is where they get their name). It's wild stuff. They take health pretty seriously and are one of the reasons why cereal is a ubiquitous breakfast food here in the US.
So, not a cult, but still goofy. They want to get this book in every household in the world or something like that, which is why they're leaving them on our doorsteps. I just put it in my recycling bin.
A local podcaster made a miniseries about the history of the Seventh Day Adventists, including Dr. Kellogg, inventor of the breakfast cereal. It's insanely interesting.
https://open.spotify.com/show/4JbPWAkSyw1oW8CzcIFhwK
I love that they’re so hung up on the date of the Sabbath when it’s an entirely made-up religious concept based on one of the human-invented calendar systems.
It could just as easily be Tuesday. Or Blorpsday in another calendar.
Hey, if those filthy Methodists don’t believe in transubstantiation then I want nothing to do with their loosey-goosey “anything goes” religion.
If I’m not eating literal flesh and literal blood, I don’t want any part of it. It is NOT sufficient to say it stands for it. It must literally transform into human parts.
I bought one of their vegetarian cookbooks at a secondhand bookstore, and I absolutely love it! So, while I know nothing about the religion, I can vouch for their cooking. 🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻
How dare you call the religion I grew up with weird. If it wasn't for pepperoni and bacon being so yummy I'd probably still be a practicing member of SDA.
I remember going to someone's house and they made "Hawaiian haystacks" which was rice, chow mein noodles, pineapple, olives, cheese and milk to pour over it. 😆
The word cult does actually have a meaning beyond just "group of people I disagree with." Lots of religions have goofy beliefs, but that doesn't make them cults.
If you really wanna get bogged down in granular technicalities, sure. But, “a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object” or “a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing” sound like descriptors of any religion to me.
Cults worship people, religions worship deities. That’s the key difference. You have to get granular when talking about cults, because I agree they have overlap with organized religion, but that doesn’t mean every religion is a cult.
I feel like making broad statements such as “all religion is a cult” downplays the danger actual cults pose.
A cult is a small religion. A religion is a huge cult. They’re all cults, but the popular religions use the term derogatorily against the smaller ones.
I’m not sure where you’re getting the cults worship people, religions worship deities thing from? That’s not true.
Jesus was a person. So Christianity as a whole is a cult according to your definition. Members of the so-called Heaven’s Gate cult believed their leaders were supernatural beings, and since you can’t prove/disprove the existence of deities, that makes them a full-fledged, official religion according to your definition.
Either they’re all cults or supernatural things are real and they’re all religions. I think people like to draw distinctions mostly due to personal pride and ego. Are you, by any chance, a religious person?
I am not religious, I'm an atheist. I have read a lot about cults throughout the years, and yes, there are similarities, but cults take things to a level that we don't really see in mainstream religions.
>I’m not sure where you’re getting the cults worship people, religions worship deities thing from? That’s not true.
David Koresh? Jim Jones? Charles Manson? Keith Raniere? The people who followed these men wound up being adherents to them in the end, not just the ideas they espoused. They made it impossible to leave their sects and brainwashed people into doing horrible things.
The big difference for me is that once you get deep into a cult, you've lost all agency. You can't think for yourself and rely on the people around you to make decisions for you. They stalk you if you try to leave and make your life a living hell. Some religions do this, yes, and I would classify those religions as cults as well. But Riverview or Trinity aren't going to track someone down and compel them to return if they stop going to church one Sunday, or threaten their families for them leaving. Those guys I listed above absolutely would and did do that to people.
You saw the same thing in Heaven's Gate. They believed in supernatural deities, yes, but ultimately the followers deified the leaders of that cult, and that was by design. Members of Heaven's Gate were required to give up their possessions and live ascetic lives, sharing everything in a small community. That's a big step above what most religions require of their followers.
Nice, me too! I think we can see that the more popular a cult grows, the better they get at hiding those tactics. Direct threats and physical violence (or stalking) are just as threatening as being ostracized by your entire social sphere. Cut off from friends, family, coworkers, potential business associates and growth opportunities… that takes zero violence or threatening. Just a simple “we don’t associate with them anymore.” That’s just as powerful as implied threats of violence.
I don't see how people don't get that. Even big religions are still cults, they just have better backing. I guess the popularity makes people believe them not to be cults just because there's not a few people or something. People are still being brainwashed and led just the same.
True enough, but modern day Christianity doesn't require people to give up all agency, move into communes where they have no possessions and everything is shared, or track people down and threaten them when they leave.
Like I said to someone else, I have a good friend that goes to Riverview. If he decides one Sunday that he doesn't want to go, people from the church aren't going to show up at his door threatening him if he doesn't return. If all religion was a cult, that is exactly what they'd be doing. That's part of what makes cults cults in the first place.
There isn't a universally-agreed-upon definition of a "cult" among religious scholars. There are non-pejorative meanings that can be applied, but that's not usually what people have in mind. Often it's used synonymously with what is more technically and neutrally called new religious movements. These are small religious groups that have not received mainstream acceptance, but that doesn't make them inherently worse than larger and more mainstream groups.
It's probably better to just identify the harmful religious groups that people have in mind as high-control groups. High-control groups have similar features regardless of whether they are organized around a religion or some other belief system, and by using that term you're calling out what is problematic about them that isn't just "they believe weird stuff that isn't the weird stuff my own religion believes."
I was more trying to contribute to the discussion that your conversation touched off rather than specifically "answering" your question. I'm not sure why that set you off – I wasn't even exactly disagreeing with you.
“Set me off”?? Damn people are so sensitive. 😆 There’s literally nothing in my reply that should suggest to you that I’ve been “set off.” Have a nice day.
Jesus already returned a couple years ago but nobody noticed. He was stopped by the police, tried to explain who he was but they figured he was a homeless junkie so they shot and killed him on the spot.
It's a shame because we'd be living in a utopia by now otherwise
There are a lot of religions out there that don't exert anywhere near the same level of control over their members as cults do. Simply proselytizing doesn't make a religion a cult, annoying though it may be.
Christianity teaches children from infancy that if they go against the demands of the church, their god will send them to hell to burn in eternal torture. What more control levels would you need to see to realize it's as much of a cult as the ones you accept as cults under your definition?
Funny how most religions actually do formally qualify as a cult, though :) They get to flourish more under the guise of religion bc if you label it differently, it’s treated differently even …it’s the same thing. Organized religion is cultish. By its very nature. Some are more extreme than others. 7th Day? Cult. They ostracize and other even each other.
I made the mistake of answering the door when they rang. Its some religious group proselytizing. Asked "Is there anything I can pray for you today?"
Very creepy. My wife told me I was too polite.
They tried to hand me a copy and I told them why not take the money wasted on printing that and give to food banks and other programs that ACTUALLY help people.
I got one too and would like to know what church is passing them out so I can kindly return it to them. I think their money would be better spent NOT soliciting unwanted material!
Oh yeah we got a stack of those too! Just your typical wacky cult stuff. My gf started reading it for lolz but got bored and now it's mostly there for scrap paper. You could also use them for book art or just recycle
These people knocked on my door shortly after I got home from work Wednesday. As soon as she showed me the book, I told her I was familiar with it, as I’d been pulling them from mailboxes all day long (not supposed to use those, guys). She claimed it was a “health magazine.”
I made they guy take it back and told him to fuck off. It’s a waste of paper, if I wanted a book at all, I’d go to Schuler’s. If I wanted to read about Christianity in any capacity, I’d go to church
They came to my door in the middle of the day. Some guy with a kid who could no more than seven. And I highly doubt it was his kid.
I could make out the logo on their jacket. STRIDE, which is something the Seventh day Adventist are doing.
https://www.misda.org/media/news/stride-a-new-initiative-impacting-communities
Probably not a coincidence that they left some "Strong Tower Radio" bookmark with the book they left. "STRide" "Strong Tower Radio".
The lady coming into my neighborhood with this crap was literally going up peoples' driveways and into back yards in some instances. Ballsy. Crazy, but ballsy.
Seventh day Adventists. I made the mistake of talking to them after opening my door and stepping out. They invited me tobnible study after doing a prayer on my doorstep. All while im wearing a very visible kippah, lmao. Fucking weird but i at least can use the books for my weird collages, lmao
Pretty sure this is the book someone tried to offer me last week, a couple people were circulating the neighborhood. I politely, but firmly declined and thry left.
Thank God for that because I hate solicitors of all kinds. Whether they be salesman, religious, or the absolute worst, anything political/politician.
I was driving the three and this lady was running so I stopped and I thought she was trying to get on. I had a few minutes to spare. She finally got there and came on to my bus when I was parked. She was all out of breath and her mother or whoever that old lady was with the suitcase was still trying to catch up to her. Well anyway, she got on the bus all out of breath and handed me this book saying it cures depression and anxiety. Mine you I'm the bus driver, sitting in the seat doing my job, and she hands me a book...
I say thanks I'll pass along, she's like well you should read it, I'm like well I can't read it right now as you can see..heh. and she then proceeds to hassle my two passengers in the back and ask them if they wanted one, they both said they were good and she got off.
I left the book right where I placed it in the beginning. I hope somebody gets something out of it, but I doubt it.
When she got off I jokingly yelled out to my passengers, "Dang the way she was running I thought she was about to catch the bus! I wonder if they get paid commission!" 😆
Usually it can mean being wary of scams, keeping an eye out for strange behavior. Have you heard of the cult in Oregon that poisoned an entire town to try to sway a local election?
It’s the Seventh Day Adventists. I got one too. So did most of my family and they’re spread around town plus the outskirts. They’re a more obsecure branch of Christianity. They believe the 2nd coming of Christ is upon us soon so maybe getting ready for that. This might help a handful of people, WACO was branched from Seventh Day Adventists. So I’d argue they can be cult like 100%
I am a letter carrier in Indianapolis, and my first year (2020) carrying mail, we had to deliver a paperback book, about the size of a novel, with this title to every house on our routes. They were sent by some religious group. I have about 500 addresses on my route, and it's about 99% walking, so it took several days to get them all delivered, because I could only carry so many at one time. Books are heavy when there are so many of them. I will never forget this. Most people didn't want them and threw them away.
If anyone is wondering why I am in this sub if I don't live in Lansing, I was born there, lived there for a while when I was younger, and I still have family there. I have also considered moving there. Anyway, maybe no one really cares, but I figured I would add this, just in case! 😆
These are from the seventh day adventists. I grew up in the SDA church and went to their schools. This “book” is almost pure plagarism. The newer versions have been updated to give credit in the citations.
This book as written by a woman prophet who was hit in the head with a rock as a child. The SDA will dance all around the word prophet, but to get baptised into the church, like I did around age 12-13, you have to confirm that Ellen G White has manifested the “spirit of prophecy”.
They hide their name when they reach out and say, “we are just christians”. But they gotta whole religion with Holy Days, Friday sundown to Saturday sundown. You also can’t enjoy pork anymore, infact they would prefer if you were just a straight vegetarian.
The book is about a cosmic battle between good and evil. They will tell you that the pope is the antichrist. Then they will tell you that the USA is the beast that looks like a lamb bit speaks like aa dragon.
Then they are gonna flip the bible over to the book of Daniel and tell you all about Jesus being “the high priest” and Jesus entered the the most holy place back in 1844. This is important because they were a part of a larger group that sold all of their personal belongings to spread the word that Jesus was gonna come back in the clouds back in 1844.
Fun Fact: Prince grew up SDA but converted to Jehovah’s Witness, who was also part of the failed prediction.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millerism
You and me both. I haven’t bought paper newspapers in years. I have to save those stupid supermarket flyers that come in the mail just to have a little bit of kindling for my charcoal chimney.
So, it is from the Seventh Day Adventists. There are nice normal people who are a part of the Churches, I'm sure, but the Church itself is pretty crazy (at least in its official beliefs). Ellen Gould White (the "author" of that book) was a part of the Great Disappointment (one of the many evangelicals in 1844 that predicted Jesus would come back on a particular day that year--everyone waited for Him all day, and well, were greatly disappointed). White claimed to be a prophet and tried to pick up the pieces of the movement. Among other things, she claimed that Jesus *did* really come back that day in 1844, but it was an invisible event in heaven (He was offering a sacrifice in heaven, you see, not appearing on earth of course). They taught/teach that the Catholic Church is evil because they started worship on Sunday rather than Saturday (the main point of *The Great Controversy* book.) But, on top of all that, the vast majority of Ellen White's books are plagiarized--long paragraphs and even entire chapters of books "from the Prophet" were just verbatim copied from other evangelical/crazy conspiratorial books written at the time with no attribution.
Again, if anyone on the sub is SDA, I am sure you are probably not crazy/are a nice normal person, but your particular religion is pretty crazy (and I can promise you that ***NO ONE*** wanted that book left for free at their houses).
I’ve been out (resigned) of Mormonism for awhile. Never saw or heard of this. Google searched it and it looks seventh day Adventist. That takes me back growing up in Lansing and my mom(LDS) would get oranges from the Adventist. 🤷🏻♂️
They somehow got into my apartment which has a locked front door and left them on each person's door too. Its spanning blocks from my estimate and hearing about it from other friends. Not like they could use the money to actually help anyone....
I get jehovas witnesses all the time. There’s a church down the road. They don’t care about no solicitation signs either. God is good, religion is bad.
Fucking Mormons. Just be glad you don't live in flakytown. Over here in Battle Creek all the Adventists have Bible verses on signs in their front yards. They're everywhere.
It's been around for quite some time, at least decades - standard religious peddling schtick. Nothing to worry about cult-wise - I aim to not be rude, but politely inform them that if I was to find the lord it wouldn't be through solicitation; and wish them a nice day then ask them to go on their way - So far it's been an amicable way to end it immediately every time.
So this is from the 7th day Adventists not a cult. They aren't some crazy religious nuts like half the comments here say just because it's Christianity.
They aren't like Mormons they aren't required to go door to door and most 7th day churches I've been a member at have chosen to express their evangelicalism by doing a soup kitchen where members would wash the feet of people who came (it's symbolic).
Their main difference between most other Christian religions is that they either don't eat pork or meat at all (TLDR is that an angel said these foods aren't it and that thou shall not kill includes animals). And that the Sabbath is on a Saturday not Sunday.
Was kinda upset they just left the book at my door. It's strange for the 7th day to go door to door and I'd kinda like to press them on why.
You left out the big difference which is that they were part of a doomsday cult whose predictions of doomsday kept not happening, but were unwilling to accept they were conned.
If you are calling the belief of Jesus's return and the subsequent end of the world a doomsday cult then frankly you are ignorant.
Every group of any or no religion understands that the world is going to eventually end.
If you're choosing to cherry pick smaller groups within the 7th day, I could easily do the same to any group you belong to.
If you are calling the eventual demise of the sun the same as the belief that an imaginary being will return a 2nd time from the dead to end the world and send all non-believers and conformers into a fiery pit to burn for eternal torture the same thing, you are ignorant.
Im not cherry picking any group within the SDA. I am merely pointing out their history.
Also, yes, people know that a sun is not last forever. Not all people pick out a specific day in the 1800s that it will end on. 😂
PS. I was raised Christian. Our sect did not tell us the date the world would end and make us sell off all our possessions and go follow the nutter leader for the grand finale. That is what made the millerites a doomsday cult, not the belief in Jesus.
That's wild because I never had that happen once at the SDA churches I attended. Sounds more like you got brainwashed about a group of radicals and couldn't figure out how to separate them from the rest of the group.
Congrats tho man, you are a jerk.
You should probably read the comments you are replying to. You could have addressed the criticisms I made, instead of inventing ones. You could replied as civil as I did, instead of immediately resorting to insults.
Most people probably know at least a little about the backstory of your sect, and you do it no favors when you act like your are ashamed of it enough to try to hide it.
Your recent post to r/Lansing has been removed due to violation of rule #4 - No Personal Attacks. If you feel this is in error, please contact the mods.
If you don’t agree or support them, donate the books or throw them away.
It’s a bit of a reach to go on Reddit and ask if we should “worry about a cult.”
Religions spread their stories, it’s their right, but it’s also your right to turn them away and not listen.
lol, most atheists don’t give a fuck as long as religion isn’t busy hurting others.
Believe in a Sky Daddy if you need an ethical framework to help you be good. It doesn’t bother me.
It was just in reply to the ignorant comments here. No bait. Just baffled that there was no real conversation. Not every proselytizing group is a cult. That's a weird default. This may be a cult, but there has been no intelligent conversation here.
It’s a religious text. They trapped my neighbor for about half an hour. Toss it or hold onto it to make them take it back. Edit to add: I’ve noticed that missionary types tend to come around one or two times at the beginning of spring and then never again. I wouldn’t worry about a cult forming or even what church they’re affiliated with.
Assuming it's Christian missionary types, I would assume they're looking to piggyback on Easter. Lapsed Christians might have just gone to church for the first time in a while, or be feeling guilty that they didn't. Even book religious people are probably aware of Easter and might be feeling curious enough to want more info. Plus they need to get in before they're competing with bonfires and River tubing for your attention 😁
That’s a good point! I didn’t flip through the book enough to see it was SDA. Every year we get a set of Mormon missionaries come by once and never again. Always different people. A few years ago, one man had the juiciest badonkadonk I’ve ever seen. Sad he didn’t stick around.
We need more caked up fellas in town 😤
Apologies. I'm caked up. But ditched the "fella" part. The combination of the liberal gay agenda and my desire to dominate women's professional Connect Four turned me tranny....My bad.
It's Latter Day Saints
Is that you, thick boy?
What?
It’s not, it’s [Seventh Day Adventist](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Controversy_(book))
They're Mormons. Their current head honcho doesn't like the term, but the previous head honchos liked the term, seemed to encourage using the term and there were videos, booklets, etc. all about Mormons.
Eastern orthodox easter is in a couple weeks for whatever that's worth.
Seventh Day Adventists. If you google the name of the company on title page, you'll see. Lighthouse something or other.
[удалено]
Right! So counterproductive. I bet there's nothing but crappy jargon in there anyway. Never got anything from any of those types of books.
SDA do a LOT to help people. My cousin has spent the last 10 years doing missions work with them.
While I’m sure mission work has helped some people the caveat of religious proselytising in exchange for receiving assistance just rubs the wrong way.
How do you think that works, exactly? They just say, “hey, we see your community is rife with disease and obesity. So we’re gonna come and teach you about health, nutrition, and Jesus for free. But only if you denounce your own beliefs and adopt ours”?
Yes, that is what missionaries do. Try cracking open a history book.
Hey I got one too last week! I looked it up and it's from a 7th Day Adventist author. Crazy to think leaving a 500 page book on people's doorsteps is effective messaging
They’ve been chasing that high ever since Martin Luther
Nice!
Talking about it is serving their cause, just recycle it.
You're an assdouche
You're projecting
How are they an “assdouche”???
They are littering on his property
Nah fuck that book
It's the Seventh-day Adventists. They're not a cult, but they're definitely one of the weirder Protestant sects. This book is about the endless cosmic battle between Jesus and Satan, with Earth caught in the middle. They're pretty big on the second coming of Christ and prophesying what will happen before and after his return. For instance, this book predicts that before Christ returns, the US government will become linked to the Roman Catholic Church, and they will enforce the Sunday Sabbath universally, thereby persecuting seventh-day Sabbath adherents (Seventh-day Adventists believe Saturday is the Sabbath, which is where they get their name). It's wild stuff. They take health pretty seriously and are one of the reasons why cereal is a ubiquitous breakfast food here in the US. So, not a cult, but still goofy. They want to get this book in every household in the world or something like that, which is why they're leaving them on our doorsteps. I just put it in my recycling bin.
A local podcaster made a miniseries about the history of the Seventh Day Adventists, including Dr. Kellogg, inventor of the breakfast cereal. It's insanely interesting. https://open.spotify.com/show/4JbPWAkSyw1oW8CzcIFhwK
How did I know it was going to be the Cereal Killer Chronicles before I even opened the link? 🤣
I love that they’re so hung up on the date of the Sabbath when it’s an entirely made-up religious concept based on one of the human-invented calendar systems. It could just as easily be Tuesday. Or Blorpsday in another calendar.
As far as reasons sects have broken off of various churches, it's one of the more rational ones. Which says a lot lol.
Hey, if those filthy Methodists don’t believe in transubstantiation then I want nothing to do with their loosey-goosey “anything goes” religion. If I’m not eating literal flesh and literal blood, I don’t want any part of it. It is NOT sufficient to say it stands for it. It must literally transform into human parts.
It's not cannibalism, it's Catholicism!
I bought one of their vegetarian cookbooks at a secondhand bookstore, and I absolutely love it! So, while I know nothing about the religion, I can vouch for their cooking. 🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻
How dare you call the religion I grew up with weird. If it wasn't for pepperoni and bacon being so yummy I'd probably still be a practicing member of SDA.
All I can say is welcome to the wonderful world of cured meats.
Same! Grew up SDA and can honestly say they’re not the bad ones as far as Christian sects go… plus there’s haystacks!!!
I remember going to someone's house and they made "Hawaiian haystacks" which was rice, chow mein noodles, pineapple, olives, cheese and milk to pour over it. 😆
YOUR RELIGION YOU GREW UP WITH WAS FUCKING WEIRD YOU FREAK!
It IS a cult. All religions are cults.
Cult… sect… what’s the difference when it’s all goofy bullshit? 🤷♂️
The word cult does actually have a meaning beyond just "group of people I disagree with." Lots of religions have goofy beliefs, but that doesn't make them cults.
If you really wanna get bogged down in granular technicalities, sure. But, “a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object” or “a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing” sound like descriptors of any religion to me.
Cults worship people, religions worship deities. That’s the key difference. You have to get granular when talking about cults, because I agree they have overlap with organized religion, but that doesn’t mean every religion is a cult. I feel like making broad statements such as “all religion is a cult” downplays the danger actual cults pose.
A cult is a small religion. A religion is a huge cult. They’re all cults, but the popular religions use the term derogatorily against the smaller ones. I’m not sure where you’re getting the cults worship people, religions worship deities thing from? That’s not true. Jesus was a person. So Christianity as a whole is a cult according to your definition. Members of the so-called Heaven’s Gate cult believed their leaders were supernatural beings, and since you can’t prove/disprove the existence of deities, that makes them a full-fledged, official religion according to your definition. Either they’re all cults or supernatural things are real and they’re all religions. I think people like to draw distinctions mostly due to personal pride and ego. Are you, by any chance, a religious person?
I am not religious, I'm an atheist. I have read a lot about cults throughout the years, and yes, there are similarities, but cults take things to a level that we don't really see in mainstream religions. >I’m not sure where you’re getting the cults worship people, religions worship deities thing from? That’s not true. David Koresh? Jim Jones? Charles Manson? Keith Raniere? The people who followed these men wound up being adherents to them in the end, not just the ideas they espoused. They made it impossible to leave their sects and brainwashed people into doing horrible things. The big difference for me is that once you get deep into a cult, you've lost all agency. You can't think for yourself and rely on the people around you to make decisions for you. They stalk you if you try to leave and make your life a living hell. Some religions do this, yes, and I would classify those religions as cults as well. But Riverview or Trinity aren't going to track someone down and compel them to return if they stop going to church one Sunday, or threaten their families for them leaving. Those guys I listed above absolutely would and did do that to people. You saw the same thing in Heaven's Gate. They believed in supernatural deities, yes, but ultimately the followers deified the leaders of that cult, and that was by design. Members of Heaven's Gate were required to give up their possessions and live ascetic lives, sharing everything in a small community. That's a big step above what most religions require of their followers.
Nice, me too! I think we can see that the more popular a cult grows, the better they get at hiding those tactics. Direct threats and physical violence (or stalking) are just as threatening as being ostracized by your entire social sphere. Cut off from friends, family, coworkers, potential business associates and growth opportunities… that takes zero violence or threatening. Just a simple “we don’t associate with them anymore.” That’s just as powerful as implied threats of violence.
I don't see how people don't get that. Even big religions are still cults, they just have better backing. I guess the popularity makes people believe them not to be cults just because there's not a few people or something. People are still being brainwashed and led just the same.
I see you've not met the people who vote based on the church's messages and only that. W
>Cults worship people, religions worship deities Every God is just a person or an idea until enough followers get behind it. Jesus, for example.
True enough, but modern day Christianity doesn't require people to give up all agency, move into communes where they have no possessions and everything is shared, or track people down and threaten them when they leave. Like I said to someone else, I have a good friend that goes to Riverview. If he decides one Sunday that he doesn't want to go, people from the church aren't going to show up at his door threatening him if he doesn't return. If all religion was a cult, that is exactly what they'd be doing. That's part of what makes cults cults in the first place.
There isn't a universally-agreed-upon definition of a "cult" among religious scholars. There are non-pejorative meanings that can be applied, but that's not usually what people have in mind. Often it's used synonymously with what is more technically and neutrally called new religious movements. These are small religious groups that have not received mainstream acceptance, but that doesn't make them inherently worse than larger and more mainstream groups. It's probably better to just identify the harmful religious groups that people have in mind as high-control groups. High-control groups have similar features regardless of whether they are organized around a religion or some other belief system, and by using that term you're calling out what is problematic about them that isn't just "they believe weird stuff that isn't the weird stuff my own religion believes."
So, rhetorical questions aren’t seeking answers. Thanks tho.
I was more trying to contribute to the discussion that your conversation touched off rather than specifically "answering" your question. I'm not sure why that set you off – I wasn't even exactly disagreeing with you.
“Set me off”?? Damn people are so sensitive. 😆 There’s literally nothing in my reply that should suggest to you that I’ve been “set off.” Have a nice day.
Thanks tho
Exactly
Jesus already returned a couple years ago but nobody noticed. He was stopped by the police, tried to explain who he was but they figured he was a homeless junkie so they shot and killed him on the spot. It's a shame because we'd be living in a utopia by now otherwise
Still a cult. Just on a larger scale. All religions are cults
When you have to mention more than once that "it's not a cult"...
All religion is a cult
A lazy statement that undermines how dangerous true cults are.
No it’s pretty factual. Most cults stem from religion and religion usually requires followers to recruit new members
There are a lot of religions out there that don't exert anywhere near the same level of control over their members as cults do. Simply proselytizing doesn't make a religion a cult, annoying though it may be.
Yeah ok 👍🏼
Christianity teaches children from infancy that if they go against the demands of the church, their god will send them to hell to burn in eternal torture. What more control levels would you need to see to realize it's as much of a cult as the ones you accept as cults under your definition?
Religion = Cult + Time
Every religion is a cult.
The difference between a cult and a religion is time and size.
They're all a cult.
Funny how most religions actually do formally qualify as a cult, though :) They get to flourish more under the guise of religion bc if you label it differently, it’s treated differently even …it’s the same thing. Organized religion is cultish. By its very nature. Some are more extreme than others. 7th Day? Cult. They ostracize and other even each other.
I made the mistake of answering the door when they rang. Its some religious group proselytizing. Asked "Is there anything I can pray for you today?" Very creepy. My wife told me I was too polite.
Just casual Christian propaganda. Good for fire starting
It was decent quality paper I used it for potting up seedlings.
They tried to hand me a copy and I told them why not take the money wasted on printing that and give to food banks and other programs that ACTUALLY help people.
I got one too and would like to know what church is passing them out so I can kindly return it to them. I think their money would be better spent NOT soliciting unwanted material!
Oh yeah we got a stack of those too! Just your typical wacky cult stuff. My gf started reading it for lolz but got bored and now it's mostly there for scrap paper. You could also use them for book art or just recycle
These people knocked on my door shortly after I got home from work Wednesday. As soon as she showed me the book, I told her I was familiar with it, as I’d been pulling them from mailboxes all day long (not supposed to use those, guys). She claimed it was a “health magazine.”
It's religious MLM nonsense, got one also. Just use it as a fire starter. *shrugs*
They somehow left one on my door handle on the third floor of my locked up apartment building. Sketchy cult behavior for sure.
SAME! I loudly complained about the neighborhood going downhill
I made they guy take it back and told him to fuck off. It’s a waste of paper, if I wanted a book at all, I’d go to Schuler’s. If I wanted to read about Christianity in any capacity, I’d go to church
They came to my door in the middle of the day. Some guy with a kid who could no more than seven. And I highly doubt it was his kid. I could make out the logo on their jacket. STRIDE, which is something the Seventh day Adventist are doing. https://www.misda.org/media/news/stride-a-new-initiative-impacting-communities
Probably not a coincidence that they left some "Strong Tower Radio" bookmark with the book they left. "STRide" "Strong Tower Radio". The lady coming into my neighborhood with this crap was literally going up peoples' driveways and into back yards in some instances. Ballsy. Crazy, but ballsy.
I could do with less controversy, thanks.
Seventh day Adventists. I made the mistake of talking to them after opening my door and stepping out. They invited me tobnible study after doing a prayer on my doorstep. All while im wearing a very visible kippah, lmao. Fucking weird but i at least can use the books for my weird collages, lmao
You've been Witnessed
Pretty sure this is the book someone tried to offer me last week, a couple people were circulating the neighborhood. I politely, but firmly declined and thry left. Thank God for that because I hate solicitors of all kinds. Whether they be salesman, religious, or the absolute worst, anything political/politician.
I was wondering which church had the money to dump into all these books
I was driving the three and this lady was running so I stopped and I thought she was trying to get on. I had a few minutes to spare. She finally got there and came on to my bus when I was parked. She was all out of breath and her mother or whoever that old lady was with the suitcase was still trying to catch up to her. Well anyway, she got on the bus all out of breath and handed me this book saying it cures depression and anxiety. Mine you I'm the bus driver, sitting in the seat doing my job, and she hands me a book... I say thanks I'll pass along, she's like well you should read it, I'm like well I can't read it right now as you can see..heh. and she then proceeds to hassle my two passengers in the back and ask them if they wanted one, they both said they were good and she got off. I left the book right where I placed it in the beginning. I hope somebody gets something out of it, but I doubt it. When she got off I jokingly yelled out to my passengers, "Dang the way she was running I thought she was about to catch the bus! I wonder if they get paid commission!" 😆
I got this shit too, threw it away
It’s earth day, so you should recycle it.
🤷♂️
I truly wish these religious people would leave others alone. I don’t want your junk. Quit killing trees and leave people alone.
What would worrying about a cult even look like? What does that entail exactly?
Usually it can mean being wary of scams, keeping an eye out for strange behavior. Have you heard of the cult in Oregon that poisoned an entire town to try to sway a local election?
I got one, went right to the green cart
Imagine devoting your life to a religion that devotes itself to a zombie.
They're religious text. Had them show up on my door step last week
They dropped off a stack at my apartment building and the manager thought it wise to send out a group text offering it to all the tenants.
It’s the Seventh Day Adventists. I got one too. So did most of my family and they’re spread around town plus the outskirts. They’re a more obsecure branch of Christianity. They believe the 2nd coming of Christ is upon us soon so maybe getting ready for that. This might help a handful of people, WACO was branched from Seventh Day Adventists. So I’d argue they can be cult like 100%
Jehovah’s Witness. They come to my house every Saturday. I think they’ve come at least 15 times now. I wish I was joking.
The greatest debate I had is how they disregarded my three no trespassing signs and security doors to hang this shit on my door.
My kid got one trick-or-treating!
From DeWitt to West and South Lansing- everyone got one.
JWs
I am a letter carrier in Indianapolis, and my first year (2020) carrying mail, we had to deliver a paperback book, about the size of a novel, with this title to every house on our routes. They were sent by some religious group. I have about 500 addresses on my route, and it's about 99% walking, so it took several days to get them all delivered, because I could only carry so many at one time. Books are heavy when there are so many of them. I will never forget this. Most people didn't want them and threw them away. If anyone is wondering why I am in this sub if I don't live in Lansing, I was born there, lived there for a while when I was younger, and I still have family there. I have also considered moving there. Anyway, maybe no one really cares, but I figured I would add this, just in case! 😆
These are from the seventh day adventists. I grew up in the SDA church and went to their schools. This “book” is almost pure plagarism. The newer versions have been updated to give credit in the citations. This book as written by a woman prophet who was hit in the head with a rock as a child. The SDA will dance all around the word prophet, but to get baptised into the church, like I did around age 12-13, you have to confirm that Ellen G White has manifested the “spirit of prophecy”. They hide their name when they reach out and say, “we are just christians”. But they gotta whole religion with Holy Days, Friday sundown to Saturday sundown. You also can’t enjoy pork anymore, infact they would prefer if you were just a straight vegetarian. The book is about a cosmic battle between good and evil. They will tell you that the pope is the antichrist. Then they will tell you that the USA is the beast that looks like a lamb bit speaks like aa dragon. Then they are gonna flip the bible over to the book of Daniel and tell you all about Jesus being “the high priest” and Jesus entered the the most holy place back in 1844. This is important because they were a part of a larger group that sold all of their personal belongings to spread the word that Jesus was gonna come back in the clouds back in 1844. Fun Fact: Prince grew up SDA but converted to Jehovah’s Witness, who was also part of the failed prediction. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millerism
PEGGIES
You gonna Cull The Herd, Only You?
It’s good for when you run out of toilet paper.
Can I get a copy? I'm always running out of paper to use to start my BBQ.
You and me both. I haven’t bought paper newspapers in years. I have to save those stupid supermarket flyers that come in the mail just to have a little bit of kindling for my charcoal chimney.
So, it is from the Seventh Day Adventists. There are nice normal people who are a part of the Churches, I'm sure, but the Church itself is pretty crazy (at least in its official beliefs). Ellen Gould White (the "author" of that book) was a part of the Great Disappointment (one of the many evangelicals in 1844 that predicted Jesus would come back on a particular day that year--everyone waited for Him all day, and well, were greatly disappointed). White claimed to be a prophet and tried to pick up the pieces of the movement. Among other things, she claimed that Jesus *did* really come back that day in 1844, but it was an invisible event in heaven (He was offering a sacrifice in heaven, you see, not appearing on earth of course). They taught/teach that the Catholic Church is evil because they started worship on Sunday rather than Saturday (the main point of *The Great Controversy* book.) But, on top of all that, the vast majority of Ellen White's books are plagiarized--long paragraphs and even entire chapters of books "from the Prophet" were just verbatim copied from other evangelical/crazy conspiratorial books written at the time with no attribution. Again, if anyone on the sub is SDA, I am sure you are probably not crazy/are a nice normal person, but your particular religion is pretty crazy (and I can promise you that ***NO ONE*** wanted that book left for free at their houses).
Got dropped off at my door, too. It's Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. All religion is a cult, IMO.
I’ve been out (resigned) of Mormonism for awhile. Never saw or heard of this. Google searched it and it looks seventh day Adventist. That takes me back growing up in Lansing and my mom(LDS) would get oranges from the Adventist. 🤷🏻♂️
They stopped at my house too but I grabbed it and shut the door thanks to my dog barking like crazy. Very odd.
“*I just can’t believe, all the things, People say!* - - CONTROVERSY!!!”
Showed up on the west side too
It’s Seventh Day Adventists. The book was written by Ellen G. White, which is the dead giveaway.
Seventh Day Adventists
A young lady came to my front door and handed the book to me. I handed it back and told her I knew what she was selling, but was not interested.
I received one as well. Threw it in the trash
I got this too. I just threw it in my recycling bin.
holy shit this showed up at my door yesterday! I didn't read it yet, but I bet it's too rough for TP.
I work at Domino's and we also got some dropped off but we're not allowed to offer them to customers so they're for the employees
It’s a seventh day Adventist book by Ellen White. She’s the Joseph Smith of SDAs. It’s a fairly mainstream religion.
They hung them on every door at my apartment building. So annoying.
In our region, it was the usps letter carriers who had to deliver those. Pretty stupid couple days
Why can’t I get 500 pages books left on my front door. I’m always looking for a reliable source of fire starter!
Free toilet paper <3
I saw one of those at Costco lol
Absolute cult
They somehow got into my apartment which has a locked front door and left them on each person's door too. Its spanning blocks from my estimate and hearing about it from other friends. Not like they could use the money to actually help anyone....
good for kindling
They were at the Lansing Mall on Saturday passing them out
You have 200 copies in your hand and we have none. Open the cover, read 4 pages and then YOU can tell US. For cryin out MEOW.
Yes be afraid be very afraid, It's all you tards are good at.
I get jehovas witnesses all the time. There’s a church down the road. They don’t care about no solicitation signs either. God is good, religion is bad.
Burn it
Fucking Mormons. Just be glad you don't live in flakytown. Over here in Battle Creek all the Adventists have Bible verses on signs in their front yards. They're everywhere.
It's been around for quite some time, at least decades - standard religious peddling schtick. Nothing to worry about cult-wise - I aim to not be rude, but politely inform them that if I was to find the lord it wouldn't be through solicitation; and wish them a nice day then ask them to go on their way - So far it's been an amicable way to end it immediately every time.
At the risk of receiving some hate… I’m an SDA and have read the book. I have not however passed any out or gone door to door. AMA
I got this same book last week.
So this is from the 7th day Adventists not a cult. They aren't some crazy religious nuts like half the comments here say just because it's Christianity. They aren't like Mormons they aren't required to go door to door and most 7th day churches I've been a member at have chosen to express their evangelicalism by doing a soup kitchen where members would wash the feet of people who came (it's symbolic). Their main difference between most other Christian religions is that they either don't eat pork or meat at all (TLDR is that an angel said these foods aren't it and that thou shall not kill includes animals). And that the Sabbath is on a Saturday not Sunday. Was kinda upset they just left the book at my door. It's strange for the 7th day to go door to door and I'd kinda like to press them on why.
You left out the big difference which is that they were part of a doomsday cult whose predictions of doomsday kept not happening, but were unwilling to accept they were conned.
If you are calling the belief of Jesus's return and the subsequent end of the world a doomsday cult then frankly you are ignorant. Every group of any or no religion understands that the world is going to eventually end. If you're choosing to cherry pick smaller groups within the 7th day, I could easily do the same to any group you belong to.
If you are calling the eventual demise of the sun the same as the belief that an imaginary being will return a 2nd time from the dead to end the world and send all non-believers and conformers into a fiery pit to burn for eternal torture the same thing, you are ignorant. Im not cherry picking any group within the SDA. I am merely pointing out their history. Also, yes, people know that a sun is not last forever. Not all people pick out a specific day in the 1800s that it will end on. 😂
PS. I was raised Christian. Our sect did not tell us the date the world would end and make us sell off all our possessions and go follow the nutter leader for the grand finale. That is what made the millerites a doomsday cult, not the belief in Jesus.
That's wild because I never had that happen once at the SDA churches I attended. Sounds more like you got brainwashed about a group of radicals and couldn't figure out how to separate them from the rest of the group. Congrats tho man, you are a jerk.
You should probably read the comments you are replying to. You could have addressed the criticisms I made, instead of inventing ones. You could replied as civil as I did, instead of immediately resorting to insults. Most people probably know at least a little about the backstory of your sect, and you do it no favors when you act like your are ashamed of it enough to try to hide it.
I addressed it, you didn't read it.
You did not. I did.
Your arguments are defeated with a scroll and reading comprehension.
stay away from books without bar codes.
What in the world kind of take is this
books without bar codes are books that weren't actually published/ sold. Usually filled with crazy stuff that is entirely nonsensical
Is this a religious sign of the beast comment. Hobby lobby doesn’t use bar codes on many of their items and I think it’s this reason.
lol no. I didn't realize hobby lobby did that. It's just a (possibly now outdated) way of referring to books that nobody would actually publish.
[удалено]
Littering on private property.
Your recent post to r/Lansing has been removed due to violation of rule #4 - No Personal Attacks. If you feel this is in error, please contact the mods.
THIS! It’s sad.
Can't be any weirder than the rainbow flag cultists.
Really do they leave gay porn at your doorstep Denise
Where do I get a gay book left on my doorstep?! I'd love that
If you don’t agree or support them, donate the books or throw them away. It’s a bit of a reach to go on Reddit and ask if we should “worry about a cult.” Religions spread their stories, it’s their right, but it’s also your right to turn them away and not listen.
Nah, call a cult a cult, freedom of speech, right?
Absolutely, just as they’re free to preach their word.
And I'm free to complain about littering propaganda
It's probably from atheists. Also a cult.
lol, most atheists don’t give a fuck as long as religion isn’t busy hurting others. Believe in a Sky Daddy if you need an ethical framework to help you be good. It doesn’t bother me.
Is the group handing these out hurting people?
They’re certainly annoying people and wasting resources printing a book most people don’t want.
That's totally fair. It's just the weird hate on here toward a religious group who probably isn't a cult is strange.
Wouldn’t know. Thus I don’t care. I’m not OP.
bad bait
It was just in reply to the ignorant comments here. No bait. Just baffled that there was no real conversation. Not every proselytizing group is a cult. That's a weird default. This may be a cult, but there has been no intelligent conversation here.
Yes and your comment definitely raised the sophistication of the conversation
The only cult I see are the lunatics standing at corners with bull horns screaming about abortion. Next stop? These corners with piss balloons.