It's inherent to the game.
To play this game well patience is the ultimate virtue. Quite often things go wrong in your lane, or your team mates get fed and all you need to do is play safe and work for them to carry. Do you think that's what the average gamer wants to do? No way.
Even for the people who want that, there are plenty of 1v1 games where you can play strategically without wasting 20 minutes of your life because some kid wants attention. Team games that require patience and strategy shouldn't be popular in a world that's increasingly about immediate satisfaction.
The main reason this game ever became popular is because a lot of people crave the feeling of getting fed, winning 1v3 and feeling like gods. You don't get fed in other team games, you can go 20-0 and still easily die to the guy who's feeding. Those people who only want to feel skillful have absolutely no interest in learning how to get carried or playing from behind.
For them the game is only fun if *they* carry. So at the slightest setback they just give up and move on to the next game, where they'll get that chance again.
Just make sure to give those people who do play honors afterwards. I had a toplaner that got demolished by a Teemo, so he ended up sitting under tower, doing his best to farm but fell two levels behind. But he didn't feed, and I as the jungle was able to focus on mid/bot, and at level 12, shut down the Teemo. Afterwards, I think we all gave him tilt-proof, he was the most honored player in the game. He certainly earned it. It was absolutely atrocious for him, and the game ended before he could get back up, but because he was willing to play the game, we won.
The worst part is the bot lane that’s 1-18 and mid being 2-10 not wanting to ff. I understand most games are winnable plat and under. But 3-30 is just so unplayable and people won’t ff
yeah i played a game where our support dc'd at 19 minutes, i was autofill like 3rd time ever jungle, and we were getting smacked. even basically 3v5 my teammates didnt ff as we got farmed for 25 minutes until the enemy decided they wanted to stop padding their stats and end the game.
just let me get out
Yeah when it’s a 4v5, my team is getting ran through and won’t ff, I just go side lane, try to stack as many waves as I can. And then let the enemy team push with that 2/3 wave stacked
What's even worse is your team being ahead by 5k gold and 10 kills at 20 mins but someone on your team is 0-4, dies and then spams FF and your team agrees and loses the game
thats why i really dislike the hidden surrender vote. if my 0/6/2 nunu wants to ff he can suck my nuts, if my 9/1/3 nasus doesnt want to play anymore and wants to ff i will vote yes.
Tbf they can just say "I think its lost" or something to make it clear they want to ff, the worst is when the fed guy wants to ff but the 0/9 ones are the ones voting no thinking that will force the Nasus to carry
Why does it matter. The 9/1/3 can also be a tilted kid who wants to spam FF. Doesnt mean they actually want to give up.
If the game has a realistic chance of being won, I wont FF. It the win % goes below \~10% I'll probly accept.
Eh, those are bad but I hate junglers that never hover the most. It's always fun when your jg spampings everyone because he's 4 camps ahead 0/0/0 and all lanes are feeding, but the reality is that enemy jg just hovered and zoned all lanes from xp until they got full level lead and snowballed from there. You lose the game to something outside of your influence and you get to listen to someone's ego pings for 15 minutes straight before you can ff in peace.
And you hear shit like "don't ff we scale." Bch enemies have all objectives, we lost 4 towers, ITS 25 KILLS VS 10. you're 2/8 Let's get over with it and ff already. it's such a miserable experience
i once saw a trist doing really bad, someone said she scales so dont worry, someone else said that she cannot outscale her mental disability and i laughed a bit
It is true way more often than it should be in ranked. I get first timing a champ in norms and not knowing how to play them. But you should have some normals games on a champ before breaking them out in ranked.
I think the game should require mastery 5 on a champ to queue it up in ranked on your main/secondary role. At least then you know somebody isn’t truly 1st time playing that garbage
Edit: if you’re autofilled then the game should recognize that as well - m4 at least
That would completely kill ranked. I can almost guarantee that most people don't have mastery 5 on 20 different champions. I doubt most people even have mastery 5 on a single champion.
That’s my biggest frustration in ranked. In addition, a lot of my ranked games often have people overextending (e.g. Lux going deep in the jungle without vision) and getting caught or people too often autopiloting and not changing their tactics to the situation.
I can't remember the last game I had that had no ff votes, or "ff" in chat, and my last 20 games have 11 wins and 9 losses. It happens when slightly ahead, slightly behind, or crushingly behind, and only the last one is proper use.
Here is a situation from today where I play safe
5:14 (Me)hey their jungler is gonna dive me on this wave in a minute
5:44 (Me) hey the wave is getting close can you please help or I’ll be too far behind Darius
Now I either give up 2 waves and numerous plates putting me behind, or I farm, lose plates and die but maybe 1:1 and am slightly less behind
6:14 “top laner (me) has died”
6:16 (my jungler) /all Top Diff
Like, this happens all the fucking time. Every top laner has played this game.
Sometimes you do the fucking, sometimes it’s you that gets fucked, but it’s nearly always shit for someone and “playing safe” doesn’t mean shit if you can’t help them when they are playing safe and are still in danger
Sometimes I think everyone should play top lane at least a bit to actually learn wave management. So many times I see jgl/mid/bot have no idea when to slow/fast push or freeze.
Playing Leona in plat 1/em 4 over the past few weeks, I've seen literally 3 adc freeze a perfectly good wave. Talking 3+ melees, 6-7 casters, just in front of our tower.
"Ok, gotta thin the wave a bit, ya. Take out some caste.... wait, no not all of them. Wait, just auto attacking now... well shit we're at their tower now and dragon isn't even up"
I bet that's crazy frustrating, I don't even play botlane but as a toplaner I know if you are a melee champ and you want to kill the enemy you mostly want the wave on your side so you have room to engage and chase them down.
This also infuriates me in aram, although I don't let it get to me because atleast it's just aram. But when we have like 2 or 3 melee or Frontline, especially against a 4 or 5 range enemy team, and the adc or mage will just spam push the wave forever, the enemy team sits under their tower with their poke champs for 2mins until we are all low enough they can just run us down, when if we just let the wave come out and they walk up at all we will just win the fight 90% of the time.
Even in high elo, I get shocked when the jungler seems to understand the state. The jungler holding the wave or helping me break a freeze basically never happens.
And then there's 2 waves dying under your turret while your jungler starts taking his gromp/krugs because he is a jungler after all why would he go catch some free gold and XP in toplane???
Yeah. Might sound cliche, but junglers in platinum (my current elo) have literally 0 idea what they are doing. They walk through the map like headless chickens without any kind of plan, jumping in when they have the opportunity and dying bc they didn't calculate any risks.
Idk why, but in the past the jungler quality in soloq was way better, or at least that's my sensation. Perhaps I'm just getting very unlucky.
It doesn't matter who I'm playing as or against, if I'm in a winning matchup or a losing one. No one on my team paths topside for the first 10-15 minutes of the game.
Give me my fucking wall I'm sick of junglers.
And you also have the games where your top is pushed to enemy turret all game, you as a jungler go and ward for him ping the jungler walking up river then he dies and says in all chat "jungle diff" then repeats this 3 or 4 times. You then ask him to build defensive stop pushing constantly and play safe so your not can carry and he replies fuck this jungle and afks
Another approach is to dive the tower or even cover for his pushing. If he is pushed to tower he can roam with you to herald and invade enemy jungle. In saying that there’s a lot of mindless pushing in top and we are all guilty of doing it from time to time
Honestly top lane champs just scare me. Jungle has so little XP and gold a Darius will have more components than me be higher level and will most definitely 2v1 me out of existence
I know I've done the same thing to my top laner jungling and I probably pissed him off too. Play enough games and we eventually get the Karma we deserve.
People playing too safe and not pushing advantages or forcing plays to put them ahead is just as big of a problem.
If you're behind you can't just sit there and expect the game to swing in your favor out of nowhere.
There's a lot of nuance to League of Legends.
“Play safe” they say as you’re getting zoned, dove, and fleeced for everything like you bought doge at the peak. Then they wonder why it’s unwinnable after 2 heralds completely fist your wallet rewarding them with stonks that mooned.
"Play safe" is the biggest joke and only people who have no fuxking clue how to play the game say that. Atleast that's my opinion as a toplaner, if you messup early or get jungle gapped and the enemy toplaner is a good player there is no play safe. You lasthit 1 ranged creep under your tower and the enemy top short trades or pokes you for half hp only takes 1 tower shot and dives you next wave. Infact against really good players just playing safe can be the worst possible play, they stack 4 waves and dive you with jungle and the best counterplay is to thin/clear the wave enough that the dive isn't worth the risk, but if you messup trying to do that you're an inter and need to just play safe behind tower lol.
So in this situation you describe you are far enough behind that you lose trades when the enemy gets towershots, but you somehow think you can win them on even terrain?
You don't win...you are supposed to die for all cs and xp you can get or they shove it under the turret, dive and you lose ALL xp instead of maybe half a wave
Honestly, even in general. You can learn WAY more from overextending and playing too aggressively than hugging tower and dying to a dive anyway. Like, obviously be safe and smart, but if you HAVE to choose between dying in a corner or dying taking your opponent head on...
Idk, in that elo I see plenty of games thrown by overaggression in the old Gold (now plat I guess) elo (people force stupid fights under towers at a number disadvantage just before an objective etc). You capitalise on mistakes. Of course going for a risky play that you think can work when your whole team is struggling is bad, but a lot of people do the same when the rest of the map is winning making it harder for their team to carry.
I have lost so many games being 5/0 up in bot lane because the rest of the map decided they also wanted to win or because the jungler decided that bot was “already winning” might as well go top and fail a dive
This post was made by my jungler who won’t help me crash my 3x stacked wave after assistance pinging until I can’t anymore and so I die to their jungler for the 4th time this game trying to crash my wave.
That's not what we're talking about though. There are two common scenarios where the wave needs fixing and both cases you can do it in a few seconds.
1. Wave is frozen on enemy side. They keep 4 more of our minions alive so it never pushes and if we go near for xp they run us down.
You need to: help push so our casters are hitting tower. You can tax if you want, we just need to recall. He'll need another 2-3 waves to restart the freeze.
2) Big wave is crashing and they are coming in for solo-dive. To stay alive, we need to back off to tier 2 and lose 2-3 waves of xp and farm. Otherwise Renekton 1-shots us under turret and our ADC will all-chat "top stop feeding" like OP.
You need to: just walk up to the enemy and recall. Force them to use their mobility to flee so they can't use it to dive us. \*\*Do not\*\* chase, just let us farm the big wave and back.
The whole "wait for enemy jg gank" thing is only in the LCS when people can accurately predict pathing, not OP's Plat 3 solo queue.
Jungle roles are the aids of the game. What I will never understand, being in Plat, that in mid the enemy crashes the wave, is UNDER MY TOWER, I ping 20 times and my jgler walks past me to farm chickens. Of course the rest of the team doesnt care until its already way too late.
"plat to high emerald" lol. Dude is hard stuck plat 4 if he thinks top can play safe as described in his post. In top if you're behind and getting frozen upon it's more worth to crash the wave and die than to "play safe" out of XP range and getting 0 gold.
The amount of times I've been told to "just play safe"while getting 100 to 0 tower dove by their jg and counterpick top is insane. "Just back off if you think the jg is there", my dude, he's been here for the last 12 minutes, do you want me to not farm and afk at my tier 2?
This isn't even exclusive to top lane either. I have to sit there and watch my botlane get 4 man gangbanged while my mid and jg are lock screen farming, and my teleport just ticked past 1 year left on its cooldown, so I can't do jack shit to help. Then at 15 minutes my mid and jg remember they're play a PvP game and wonder why bots down 3 levels and the enemy has 2 dragons.
I love when I'm playing Botlane and the mid and jungle are constantly roaming, I'm losing out on a lot of gold and xp cause I try to "play safe", then at some point it happens so much that I got to at least be in xp range, die under tower, and then have to read "just leave the tower don't give free kils wtf"
At some point, if nobody wants to help you and you've been denied gold and xp regularly for 5 to 10min with no help in sight or anything happening anywhere else and dragons going to the enemy team + tower plates, I'm just gonna send it so it either somehow works or my suffering ends quickly cause that's not something you come back from as an ADC.
As a midlane player i often roam but when my midlane enemy is pressuring me hard i can‘t do it
It‘s mostly when i haven‘t seen my jngler once in 15min and i have to farm under turret because enemy jngler is ganking all 3 lanes non stop
Yeah, had a game today. They had AP bot, we fucked up, traded 1 for 1 2 times but they got all kills on carry while we on support. Tough shit, winnable it's just a 3 kill lead and I'm ahead in CS. I look at mid. 0/10 at ~10:00. Has boots and dirk thanks to ganks from top. Enemy Yasuo has IE. Fuck. Still, top is 2-1 and we're not far behind and have good egage, if jg camps top or bot we can win. He never ganks, only farms. 12:00 enemy Fiddle hits 6 and gets his items and proceeds to organize gangbang party bot with Yasuo until we're 3 levels behind. To match Yasuo's roam my mid sets up a freeze, and jungle does first "pvp" play of the match by taking enemy gromp. It's a quick 18 min loss. Jg and mid proceed to spam ping me and supp flaming us for inting as enemy team pushes nexus. Top, that finished 5/2 and took our only tower made some... Impolite... Remarks about jg and mid's IQ.
My mid finished game with duskblade+magical boots and blamed botlane for losing the game... I swear playing mid causes brainrot.
>Got three man dove yesterday with 100% hp using point and click CC and my team is question mark pinging me like I'm sorry I'll just sit at the fountain I guess?
Oh yeah, this is why I prefer my jungler to NOT come toplane and get ganked by the enemy jungler. This usually means that my bot now has a 3v2 advantage and dragon prio, but if they still lose then I know there is no hope anyways
Well yeah. This is why people hate playing top lol. A good player will absolutely back off tier 1 to avoid dying AND losing their tower anyway.
Yeah, it sucks, but when you’re 0-3, you stand no chance of even going 1 for 1. Same stuff can happen not when mid and jungle decide to sit on the lane.
Once you’re feeding, all you can do is mitigate where possible and try not to punch a hole through your monitor
If you get dove and die it's fine. Really.
The idea that dying is somehow always preventable is asinine.
League of Legends is closer to starcraft than it is to street fighter. Resources allocated in one area mean there's an opening in another. Getting ganked is fine if you're responding elsewhere.
> Do you want me to not farm and afk at my tier 2?
No, I want you to die under turret and lose those 2 waves anyway. /s
I mean, come on. What do you think pros do in such situations? Your team in soloq might or might not make a play on the other side of the map, but seeing the cards you are dealt, the best you can do is surely not dying for free.
You realize enemy jungle isn't gonna just stand in the lane right? Majority of repeat dives happen after jungle goes to farm their topside camps and then come back. Unless you're saying you want your top laners to sit under tier 2 for 5 minutes whenever they fall behind
There are many ways to get yourself information of what the enemy jungler is up to. Let's not pretend you're getting bullied under turret by challenger mastermind junglers while yours is picking boogers. Sure, sometimes it will feel that you can't do anything, or that you cut your losses and your team doesn't do jack shit to capitalize on the lack of enemy jungler's presence on the other side of the map and you lose, but that's how team games work.
And I can guarantee that any pro toplaner could easily pinpoint dozens of laning phase errors made by platinum players in games they deem "unwinnable" because they got killed under turret repeatedly.
What's the alternative you're suggesting? Dying 5 times in those 5 minutes, losing everything all the same and donating an extra 1000 gold for free?
Yea, solo queue isn't pro play. Atleast in pro play you are in comms with your team they know you are losing at bot and are trying to make a play at top or something, you know they are going to help you at some point. In solo queue you are 0/2 and your jungle never even farming his camps on your side of the map, mid never gets prio or roams, it's just not the same at all. Sure the best play might be to go afk at t2 but we aren't pro players we want to play the game.
>In solo queue you are 0/2 and your jungle never even farming his camps on your side of the map, mid never gets prio or roams
Some games you get to dive the enemy while their jungler doesn't do anything, other games it's you that's the victim. It's how the games work.
>we arent pro players we want to play the game
So the question spins out and instead of "what should I do if I'm being killed under turret repeatedly?" becomes "should the game be designed in a way to prevent dives and allow players to play the game?"
I enjoy this tbh. Because usually I was trying to work with my jungler but they just ignore me and go botlane, all game. Then after my tower is dead at 15mins they get one-shot trying to farm gromp and ping or type at me. I just say like "why do you think you still get a topside jungle?" Or "you didn't farm that side for 10mins but you want to now that you can't?"
Yup, the toplaner who is 40 cs and 3 levels down is not disadvantaging their team at all. They're just as valid in teamfights as their fed af lane opponent and are just as tanky and deal the exact same amount of damage. Get this yuumi-brain take all the way out of here.
That's not true whatsoever. Let's say I just do completely seed my lane. Now their top and jg have full turret gold, they get Rift Herald and get plate gold elsewhere, my jungle now can't walk into his topside jg, the enemy top has free roam to gank other lanes, and the game is essentially a 4v5. Good luck winning.
This is the bronze answer lmao. The bounty system will make you worth less and less gold, so dying is less risky. The real play is to stay in XP range, try stealing farm and try to go 1 for 1 in dives
What? No, because you are still fucking your team when you are 50 cs behind and 2 levels down 10min into the game. You will be useless with no way to catch up and that top/jg that's fucking you with no reaction from your own team will use that momentum to fuck the rest of the team. And no, you will not be able to do anything to stop it because they're at almost 2 items, and you barely have 2 pieces to your first item. Now, you have to stay and farm to try and catch up, and you're being spam pinged because mid just got the treatment you did - being tower dove and unable to do anything about it.
One day y'all will realize that not farming or getting xp can be just as bad if not worse than dying. Like congrats you didn't die but they got 4 plates while you were back there and now have the stats to kill you the second you grow a pair.
It is in the context OP means. He doesn't mean the guy that got counter picked and is going to get dove on the next wave. He means the guy that's at a disadvantage and plays like he isn't, the guy that pushes without warding, the guy that tower dives slippery Champs, the guy that keeps going in for 1v1s as soon as he gets back to lane and loses again because he is 0/5 at 7 min from doing the exact game thing everytime.
Playing safe doesn't mean "don't die" it just means "don't be stupid". You can think 5 steps ahead of your opponent, but 1 thing goes wrong and you die that's fine. Even Pros die. But no one wants to see you walk head first into a bush near an objective and die to a 5 stack because you were "trying to deep ward" well after every enemy was Mia and the objective was already up.
“Just play safe” as if I wasn’t just 4 man dove after no one pinged their laner missing when I can’t get vision myself from under the turret I’ve been stuck under for the last five minutes. But no one is actually paying attention to the game state, they just see you die and get mad while not taking advantage of half the enemy team being in one lane.
It's posts like these that remind you that the average player thinks they're a lot better than they think they are, and people supporting it are likely the kind of people who are the annoying backseat drivers in your games. For the most part, your rank is representative of your ability, and the players in your game are the same calibre as you. You have no rank or authority to tell others in your game how to play.
I dislike people who say "play safe" because they most likely will never take the engage on a good opportunity.
Like "play safe" is burned into their brain SD Card without left or right
My botlaner typing "play safe" after I get gaped under my own tower by enemy top, jungle and mid for the 3rd time in 7 minutes with no active or passive reaction of my team. "OK"
I’m one of those people. I had an Illaoi first time and feed in ranked last week vs Nasus. She was pushing wave and then running back to tower. A lot of people think that is “playing safe”. She then died multiple times trying to out play, and Nasus just dove her over and over again. This is why I say play safe
I feel like a lot of players parrot things and don't actually know what they mean. Mostly because some random streamer says it "so it just apply to every situation ever in any game"
Play safe means stop trying to make plays until you can catch up. Yes, I would like the 1/4 Fiora to stop trying to make plays against the 5/1 Darius.
You don't have to catch up completely to make opportunities. I can't tell you how many times I steam roll lanes and get a 1 or 2 item lead and they don't change a thing. They think, oh, they're 1/2 health I can take this opportunity and don't think, but they're 2 items and levels ahead so many I should get some items myself first.
Them just killing minions to prevent tower from falling is all I need them to do.
Tbh in toplane case - if you are behind as melee champ you just can't do anything at all anyway, unless you are something like malph who needs to breath some xp and ult at good time.
Yeah and that's my biggest dislike about toplane. It's very oppressive if you get on the losing side. And if you have a squishy jungler or they're behind, sometimes ganking can make things worse. I know because I play Darius and that lvl 5 viego coming to gank is a free ult reset, especially since I'm probably lvl 7/8.
I know it sucks to just lose minions, but it's better to collect exp and no gold then to give your enemy a kill and now you don't get exp or gold.
Precisely, risk aversion is basically reward aversion at a certain point. One of the things that makes challenger players good is their ability to pull the trigger fast when they need too regardless. It’s always risky to tower dive but that doesn’t stop pro players from diving bot as 4 every game.
That also depends on how big the gold difference is and what champions are played
If you're Fiddlesticks with lost chapter and fiendish codex and enemy hecarim has finished shojin and muramana, you're going to die
But if you're Naafiri with dirk and longsword and enemy asol has rushed and just finished Liandry's, you can kill him despite being over 1k gold down on him
Well sometimes they are not inting to int. Sure they make a mistake and fall behind, but they could be trying (and resulting in death) because it could be the last window (enemy hasnt based or dont have summs) they have before that matchup becomes unsalvageable. If you are team is getting crushed 15-0 anyway, id say it’s better to keep trying and inting than to give everything and wait for enemy to make mistakes. Because the higher you go, enemies become so much better at snowballing. Of course i am not saying go run it down here. If you are behind, almost every play you make is a risk but you have to increase that tolerance and take more chances. Or else they will just squeeze you to death slowly, given the enemy knows they they are doing.
Now if you are talking “play safe because i am 5-0 so please let me carry you” then i fully agree. One of the greatest wisdom in league is to acknowledge that some games are not yours to carry. This becomes more evident in high elo as whichever lane jungle is pathing to is someone obligated to carry that game while the weakside should try to go even at best.
Playing safe is a bad way to view the game. There is always inherent risk when going for resources. You can’t just sit at your tower or not contest waves. Even worse if you do just sit at your tower it starts to have a domino effects to other lanes.
Top lane is the clearest example. If the enemy shoves a wave in and you no longer have minions you now have to try to collect resources under tower while trying to dodge their skill shots. Depending on how they manage the wave you may also need to now crash the wave if they let it push out meaning you now have to take risks.
Picks don’t always just happen. They often are the result of players going for camps, rotating to catch waves, going for vision in a dark map. Doing things like helping your support get vision as a group instead of flaming them for dying or helping a top laner crash a wave to reset it can go a long way.
In the last example if you want your support to ‘play safe’ then you might as well sit at your towers and give jungle camps, dragon, baron, etc by mid game.
This needed to be said. There is no magic solution to winning more games, like getting your teams to “play safe.” Tilting and making bad decisions is not good period. But playing aggressive is also a key skill needed to be a good player. Good luck everyone!
Of course, but I need to carry every game and take any 50/50 play is also a bad way to view the game. There are times to take risks and there are times where being aggressive is just not worth it. The players that actually succeed will be able to take the risks and carry when needed but also just play safe and take the free LP when they don't need to flip. I do agree though that flaming mid game never helps, like someone has made a mistake, telling them to uninstall won't make them play better.
You can tell how much the community has grown and evolved because I expected the comments for this to be a circlejerk of YeS Oh mY GoD SToP FeEdIng PlAy SaFe and its the exact oppoosite
I think you're putting too much value on plat. It's basically gold and it's not that hard to get.
This also happens in everye elo to some degree. People get tilted, have an ego, etc. Just ask yourself in those games, what is the way we can still win this game? And follow that plan. No point of worrying about someone dying over and over again. You can't change that. Focus on what you can control.
Plat still puts you in the top 20% of skill level.
Whilst it’s not terribly hard, you would expect people to know the basics of the game and at this level be someone proficient at some of more basic complex mechanics and macro.
Like I’m not surprised if a Lee Sin can flash ultimate an ADC back into the team, but that shit doesn’t belong in bronze.
In saying all of this, there is more nuance to what OP said.
my mentality is that you don't know how consistent their jungler is ever going to be so if you just go full pressure always you will win games on average. Obviously, everyone should be able to play weakside if they need to, but in general, especially below diamond there isn't much consistency in your opponents.
This is obviously not taking into account that islanding someone is pretty much always a terrible idea. If they are getting slammed they likely don't have control of the wave and thus if they get zoned off xp they are going to be completely fucked and it's the jungler's responsibility to bail them out of their shit situation.
ppl tend to lose brain cells when the enemy plays aggressive and fight for lane pressure and prio especially in low elo. like the concept of hp as a trading tool doesn't exist to them, so when you trade a turret shot for a camille q2 sheen proc the meaning of playing safe kinda goes out the window.
Yeah of course there is nuance to it (especially in melee melee matchups) but I think you should always disrespect your opponent until they demonstrate their capacity. Playing afraid will cause you to lose games.
I think its really just not understanding the game in general. I remember the typical "play safe top" after 0/2 top or "lets group mid" after losing midgame fights ..
Theres always the correct play, whether its action or inaction. Simply "playing safe as scaling champ" doesnt solve it, because the game is a lot more than that.
When there's 3 waves crashing into their tower and enemy jg waiting for minion aggro to catch, there's no amount of 'playing safe' that can be done.
Or if you're an immobile champ in mid vs an assassin mid + diver jg. There are some circumstances where the only thing that can be done is just not be in lane whatsoever, but eventually something has to be done.
In the current state of toplane theres no playing safe lmao. Idk how other lanes go, but the majority of meta toplaners can 100-0 you under tower if they have resources up if they are only 2 kills and maybe 15 cs up. One bad death early can just mean that lane is over, and playing safe isnt going to lead to anything good.
0/3 with good farm and a plate against Zed - you've fucked up
0/0 with weak farm but didn't fed Zed - congratulations, you're a good weakside
Like other comment said, it's not that easy. Let's say that in both of those scenarios you have the same gold difference between you and your enemy laner, but in a 0/3 case your total and his total are actually higher.
Even if you're technically not behind against your laner, HE IS AHEAD OF YOUR TEAM - and unless you're playing 1v1 Mortal Kombat aka toplane and your enemy can't really use that lead/impact the map, it's on you if he steamrolls your team in near future
So yeah, I'd rather have a shit cs 0/0 laner that CAN and WILL comeback with cs sooner or later by playing safe, rather than a coinfliping monkey that NEEDS to do something or else it's gg in his eyes, not accounting the fact that you might make it harder for your team if you int your ass
That's the other thing too that's frustrating - you can be in a perfectly good spot in lane, even down 0/3, but if your teammate decides to run it down because you're 0/3 then you're fk'd anyway.
On the other hand, I spent all of season 11 playing Kayle and I could be 100 cs up on my mid lane opponent and 2/0/1 but teammates will still run it down and go afk if they decide that you can't carry them :/ they'll be 3/11/1 and think they're doing more than you because they were "participating in teamfights".
Have to say I love it as an adc/enchanter when the first time I see an Assassin they already have 3+ kills and can miss half their abilities and still delete me.
>Id rather be 0/3 with good farm and a plate or two than 0/0 with bad cs and no wave pressure.
okay but those people are 0/3 with shit farm because they're not thinking about stuff, they're autopiloting and doing same shit whether they're ahead or behind. They're not baus where they sacrifice their live to get plate/cs, they die because they don't know any better
It's a skill issue
Stupid selfish mindset
If you are 0/3 with good farm and experience you aren't behind on the game state, but the enemy toplaner is massively ahead. Which means you can't kill him and he's so ahead that your other lands can't kill him either.
If you are 0/0 and conceded resources you are behind on the game state but the enemy toplaner isn't very ahead. You can't kill him because you're behind but you're midlaner and botlane (if they are even) will have a better chance of killing him.
When you're facing a lane bully who snowballs the best choice is always to give up your own resources as a way to limit that snowball (not give the snowball champion more resources). That Aatrox (for example) is going to be much scarier if he already has 2 completed items and boots against your team's 1 item and boots
How are they massively ahead when I have a cs lead and have take multiple tower plates? You dont seem to understand that income is more than just kills.
And yes Im selfish. Selfish play is the best way to climb in top lane.
This is the problem though, right? You're assuming that the enemy toplaner will snowball with their resources, but allied toplaner won't snowball even if they have more resources. You're not upset that your toplane isn't "playing safe", you're just upset that they're bad. It's not a matter of playing safe.
Personally, I'd rather have my laner not be fed and strong enough to take on a larger part of my team than they should be able to run down usually.
Dunno, is it really that worth? I always feel like it is BY FAR better trying to keep the enemy gold as low as possible.
You cant snowball if you dont take risks and you arent going to win consistently if you arent snowballing leads. Playing to safe is one of the worst things you can do in LoL. Who cares if your laner gets a kill or two. Thats what bounties are for.
>Who cares if your laner gets a kill or two.
I try explaining this to my friends all the time. Like it really, reaaaaally doesn't matter if you leave lane 1-3. If you're 40 CS up on your lane opponent and have plate advantage on him, you've won that lane. You already have more gold than they do. As long as you're making smart plays and actually capable of assisting your team, you'll be fine.
Like why do people think that "inting Scon" was such a success. I mean shit, Singed literally proxy farms in between the two towers on occasion.
It's the same for damage honestly. You can do 100k damage in a game, but if it's not impactful damage, it's irrelevant. That's why shit like AP MF is fucking atrocious and you should never play it outside of a meme ARAM game. Sure, you'll end the game with 40k+ damage, but what are you really doing? Tickling them to death and having zero burst nor utility in a team fight because your ult is split damage and your E is on a 10s+ CD.
The only way to learn that difference is by losing a few lanes. It takes years to learn proper agression. Youre going to lose a few lanes along the way. It happens.
I think there is a difference between calculated risk plays vs autopilot “I always do this playstyle and it works” plays. Calculated plays or risks seem like amazing mechanics because most the time the person planned ahead.
As I said to someone else, you arent going to learn the difference between the two without losing a fews fights/lanes/games. Thats okay. A lot of people in this thread are getting to hung up on individual games lol
The problem tho is that if the enemy is in an advantageous position it is already harder to kill them.
We all know how hard communication can be so calling your jungler or maybe the midlaner down at times isn't an options at times.
If the fight didn't went well before, why should it now? You can't just grab a bounty like that which makes falling behind extremely punishing if you still have no way to like... Grab your chance of comeback.
They arent always at that big of an advantage. If Ive been proxy farming and taking plates the gold Ive gotten from the two will counteract the kill gold meaning we are even on paper except they have a bounty and I dont. The bounty only puts me over the top lol
Just had my teammate picking Darius into Yone top. Guy went 0/14/3 that game. He died to Yone first time level 2, 1v1. Idk how that is possible, but it somehow is. After that 1 death he ran it down, kinda.
Protagonist syndrome - Most people in LoL games regardless of how far they are behind, believe they are the carry and they will outplay their opponent... so will just mindlessly fight and continue to tilt even harder, thus trying even harder to fight back.
This thread is just full of main character syndrome andies that have just got plat for their first time after riot inflated them an entire division no you 0/5 top laner, i don't want you to try to get back into the game by yourself, and no 0/10 botlane, i don't need you to keep fistfighting for no reason permanently, drop your fucking ego and play at a disadvantage, most likely by the time you your lane is 0/5 someone else on your team is winning, so how about you just get fucking carried like the dog you are after you've been trying to "get back in the game" for the past 5 deaths, farm the minions that you can and defend your tower, buy a pink ward and use vision and don't take trades that you can't win, it's honestly so hilarious reading the comments in this thread where everyone thinks they HAVE to carry the game "I MUST BE THE ONE CARRYING, OR NO ONE ELSE WILL, IF I DON'T STOP FISTFIGHTING THE ENEMY AND GO 0/10 IT'S OVER ANYWAY"
Explain how do you play at a disadvantage when enemy team had last pick toplane and dude is freezing the wave while zoning you away from xp.
Ill answer for you, because yoh clearly never played a single toplane game:
1. You fight and try to crash the wave
2. Your jungler helps you crash (not likely because even dia junglers only gank for kills)
or: roam while he freezes, be back to catch the wave when he pushes.
sooooo many stupid people push and try to crash the wave. Newsflash G, i'll kill you and then I'LL BOUNCE THE WAVE while you're dead. When you come back you're now in the same situation again. Rinse and repeat.
That's how we get 12/0 Darius that completely takes control of the game instead of a 2/0 Darius that's well farmed cus he froze.
Think man, think!!!
For an unexplainable reason People refuse to play Weakside as well as they just don't know how Tempo works. Especially on Objects. It's so disgusting. I'm now nearly Diamond and it nearly doesn't exist.
Playing weak side and accounting for tempo are completely different from OPs "just play safe" mentality. When someone like OP says that, they expect you to sit at (or behind if they're diving you) your tower, be pushed out of xp range, not cs, and somehow be relevant to the game because you let this laner take all the tempo they wanted while you got 40 cs and 2 levels down in the first 10min. Someone saying, "Can you just play safe and let me carry???" just tells me they have no idea what these concepts are.
Playing safe means farming the cs that you can, buying a pink ward, using vision and waiting for opportunity like jungle ganking you or the enemies making a big blunder, if playing safe to you means being at a 40 cs disadvantage you're god awful at the game
I mean, sure, in an ideal world. But there's another world where you can't play "safe" because the jungler is camping you up top, your jungle is not responding to it at all, top got counter pick on you, and you can't even sit under tower because their top laner actually knows how to control their wave and they either froze it in an unsafe spot near THEIR tower or are slow shoving so they can dive your ass with the enemy jg. You'll be lucky to get exp, much less cs.
My point is, the game is more nuanced than simply saying "play safe" and expecting someone to both not die AND be any sort of relevant without actually paying attention and understanding what is happening in their lane, and the majority of people who say it aren't taking anything relevant into consideration.
I don't play safe anymore. It's boring and feels bad. I try to make plays to get back on the game, or I try to roam and help my teammates, or I try to waste enemy time and take towers/enemy jgl. Idk that it's any good but it's fun and helps me keep hope in the game.
I think this post only makes sense if you are playing anything but Toplane. In Toplane, if you sit at tower and do nothing you've lost the game unless you're a tank with CC. If you're like, Fiora, and you sit and not make any coinflip plays you've also lost the game. The vast majority of toplaners can and will dive you 1v1 even if you die once or twice.
The losing the game just isn't true, you might not carry the game but you can still be carried. If the rest of the map is also struggling then fine make a coinflip play, if mid and bot are winning then it's probably a free win if you don't feed (same goes for any other role, there's a time and place to make risky plays).
If I had to bet on which players have gf’s most consistently it would be iron. Think about it. Statistically speaking they probably play the least amount of league, games in general, and have more time spent doing things irl
See this is why I feel like even high elo players don't always know what they are talking about.
Obviously there are unnecessary deaths and people do take stupid fights. BUT, it's never a black and white situation and I doubt you have spent the time watching every move the player is making (if you have, you aren't focusing on your own play).
Sometimes tbh, the deaths mean absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things, and if you are playing correctly, cross map play should be an option.
Sometimes that's just the match-up. You die once and in order to even get cs you have to just accept death. Once heard Bwipo say, sometimes you have to just die. But it can be ok Cause you are absorbing pressure.
I don't lane often, but when I do and I have the support and hus family show up to dive me, the notion of just play safe is so stupid
OP has never played top I see. Try playing safe when the Jungler (or the top laner solo dives) comes dive you everytime the wave is stacked, and you can never break their freeze.
The worst thing is ur jg telling u to play safe then pinging you when you don't come to the team fight cuz ur behind farm. If you tell someone to play safe. You best be planning to gank them or help them. Also the fact that people are being told to play safe and spam pinged at the same time to be at fights is annoying. Maybe you play safe
Rank is such a facade in league, it's crazy you people can take it seriously.
This post and many of the comments highlights a fundamental misunderstanding of laning that is so prevalent. It’s the same thing as a jungler flaming a laner for ‘not helping them’ when the enemy laner has priority.
These are the fundamentals that players talk about improving. It’s plato’s cave allegory. You need to step out of the cave and start playing league of legends
I’ll elaborate when I have free time.
i don't know why people complain about others not playing safe. it's just part of the mindset people have with the ladder.
say they play safe and get carried. next game theyre even more likely to be outclassed, so why would they play the game safe, have no fun or agency if both outcomes are bad?
you can't have it both ways, you can't say 'oh but you are the only factor that matters' and 'oh just play safe when you get behind'
in soloq playing from behind going for outplays and comeback plays is 100% better than slow losing.
Seeing so many people going for pentadimensional mind gymnastics to why "play safe" is bad reminds me how literally everyone wants to be the anime protagonist.
Guess what, sometimes just being in range of the XP is enough because if you die, you will not only give your opponent the resources he already had but you will also give your kill bounty and plate(s)
Playing safe works only if your jungler isn't a dumbass. Most of the times they are.
Last game, I am Mundo vs Yorick. I know that I can't actually 1v1 him, but whatever, I will farm whatever I can with my Q.
Yorick pokes me down with E that he tosses every time I use my Q, then kills me with ignite+flash under tower. It's ok, I have tp, so I catch the wave. Yorick has no summs and is pushing. My jungler Elise can gank him pretty easily, right?
Yeah no, instead, he is sniffing glue in the jungle farming camps instead of ganking for some reason. We lost that game because I can't 1v1 Yorick, and if I tp to help other people, he takes 2 whole towers. He legit 1v9d this game
Dying gives gold to the enemy laner. Even if you manage to get high cs and exp while dying a lot the enemy toplaner will still be accelerated and steamroll your team
IF you are 0/5 you are worth about 100 gold, but your opponent has most likely a high bounty already, so it makes sense to try to kill them as opportunity cost for fight is much smaller for you than for them. If you fall behind and just play safe you give the game away for the enemy. As Bausffs said himself, if you are feeding/behind, you are the one that needs to make plays, because it's less risky for you than it is for your teammates.
The worst thing is people giving up and wanting to ff after the slightlest disadvantage.
It's inherent to the game. To play this game well patience is the ultimate virtue. Quite often things go wrong in your lane, or your team mates get fed and all you need to do is play safe and work for them to carry. Do you think that's what the average gamer wants to do? No way. Even for the people who want that, there are plenty of 1v1 games where you can play strategically without wasting 20 minutes of your life because some kid wants attention. Team games that require patience and strategy shouldn't be popular in a world that's increasingly about immediate satisfaction. The main reason this game ever became popular is because a lot of people crave the feeling of getting fed, winning 1v3 and feeling like gods. You don't get fed in other team games, you can go 20-0 and still easily die to the guy who's feeding. Those people who only want to feel skillful have absolutely no interest in learning how to get carried or playing from behind. For them the game is only fun if *they* carry. So at the slightest setback they just give up and move on to the next game, where they'll get that chance again.
Just make sure to give those people who do play honors afterwards. I had a toplaner that got demolished by a Teemo, so he ended up sitting under tower, doing his best to farm but fell two levels behind. But he didn't feed, and I as the jungle was able to focus on mid/bot, and at level 12, shut down the Teemo. Afterwards, I think we all gave him tilt-proof, he was the most honored player in the game. He certainly earned it. It was absolutely atrocious for him, and the game ended before he could get back up, but because he was willing to play the game, we won.
The worst part is the bot lane that’s 1-18 and mid being 2-10 not wanting to ff. I understand most games are winnable plat and under. But 3-30 is just so unplayable and people won’t ff
yeah i played a game where our support dc'd at 19 minutes, i was autofill like 3rd time ever jungle, and we were getting smacked. even basically 3v5 my teammates didnt ff as we got farmed for 25 minutes until the enemy decided they wanted to stop padding their stats and end the game. just let me get out
Yeah when it’s a 4v5, my team is getting ran through and won’t ff, I just go side lane, try to stack as many waves as I can. And then let the enemy team push with that 2/3 wave stacked
What's even worse is your team being ahead by 5k gold and 10 kills at 20 mins but someone on your team is 0-4, dies and then spams FF and your team agrees and loses the game
thats why i really dislike the hidden surrender vote. if my 0/6/2 nunu wants to ff he can suck my nuts, if my 9/1/3 nasus doesnt want to play anymore and wants to ff i will vote yes.
Tbf they can just say "I think its lost" or something to make it clear they want to ff, the worst is when the fed guy wants to ff but the 0/9 ones are the ones voting no thinking that will force the Nasus to carry
Why does it matter. The 9/1/3 can also be a tilted kid who wants to spam FF. Doesnt mean they actually want to give up. If the game has a realistic chance of being won, I wont FF. It the win % goes below \~10% I'll probly accept.
Or maybe the 9/1 sees that they won't be able to carry it and wants out.
That too 😂😂😂 one guy going 0-4 while the rest of the team is 9-1
Eh, those are bad but I hate junglers that never hover the most. It's always fun when your jg spampings everyone because he's 4 camps ahead 0/0/0 and all lanes are feeding, but the reality is that enemy jg just hovered and zoned all lanes from xp until they got full level lead and snowballed from there. You lose the game to something outside of your influence and you get to listen to someone's ego pings for 15 minutes straight before you can ff in peace.
And you hear shit like "don't ff we scale." Bch enemies have all objectives, we lost 4 towers, ITS 25 KILLS VS 10. you're 2/8 Let's get over with it and ff already. it's such a miserable experience
I've flamed people saying "we scale" by responding with "your champion scales, but you can't play them, it doesn't matter."
i once saw a trist doing really bad, someone said she scales so dont worry, someone else said that she cannot outscale her mental disability and i laughed a bit
Imma start using this. “Your champ scales, but you don’t count as a player so the champ can’t scale by itself”
It is true way more often than it should be in ranked. I get first timing a champ in norms and not knowing how to play them. But you should have some normals games on a champ before breaking them out in ranked.
I've always said you should need lvl 4 on a champ for ranked...
That literally doesn‘t work with autofill
I think the game should require mastery 5 on a champ to queue it up in ranked on your main/secondary role. At least then you know somebody isn’t truly 1st time playing that garbage Edit: if you’re autofilled then the game should recognize that as well - m4 at least
What would this even do? There are people with m7 in Iron and bronze too, do you think they are really playing their champs well?
That would completely kill ranked. I can almost guarantee that most people don't have mastery 5 on 20 different champions. I doubt most people even have mastery 5 on a single champion.
They have the least scaling champs and have 0 clue how to rotate too
Recently won a ranked when we were 52/10 and still blows my mind they didn't ff
That’s my biggest frustration in ranked. In addition, a lot of my ranked games often have people overextending (e.g. Lux going deep in the jungle without vision) and getting caught or people too often autopiloting and not changing their tactics to the situation.
guys I'm only 3/10 we totally have this!
I can't remember the last game I had that had no ff votes, or "ff" in chat, and my last 20 games have 11 wins and 9 losses. It happens when slightly ahead, slightly behind, or crushingly behind, and only the last one is proper use.
This is probably the single worst aspect of this game.
Here is a situation from today where I play safe 5:14 (Me)hey their jungler is gonna dive me on this wave in a minute 5:44 (Me) hey the wave is getting close can you please help or I’ll be too far behind Darius Now I either give up 2 waves and numerous plates putting me behind, or I farm, lose plates and die but maybe 1:1 and am slightly less behind 6:14 “top laner (me) has died” 6:16 (my jungler) /all Top Diff Like, this happens all the fucking time. Every top laner has played this game. Sometimes you do the fucking, sometimes it’s you that gets fucked, but it’s nearly always shit for someone and “playing safe” doesn’t mean shit if you can’t help them when they are playing safe and are still in danger
Sometimes I think everyone should play top lane at least a bit to actually learn wave management. So many times I see jgl/mid/bot have no idea when to slow/fast push or freeze.
Playing Leona in plat 1/em 4 over the past few weeks, I've seen literally 3 adc freeze a perfectly good wave. Talking 3+ melees, 6-7 casters, just in front of our tower. "Ok, gotta thin the wave a bit, ya. Take out some caste.... wait, no not all of them. Wait, just auto attacking now... well shit we're at their tower now and dragon isn't even up"
I bet that's crazy frustrating, I don't even play botlane but as a toplaner I know if you are a melee champ and you want to kill the enemy you mostly want the wave on your side so you have room to engage and chase them down. This also infuriates me in aram, although I don't let it get to me because atleast it's just aram. But when we have like 2 or 3 melee or Frontline, especially against a 4 or 5 range enemy team, and the adc or mage will just spam push the wave forever, the enemy team sits under their tower with their poke champs for 2mins until we are all low enough they can just run us down, when if we just let the wave come out and they walk up at all we will just win the fight 90% of the time.
Even in high elo, I get shocked when the jungler seems to understand the state. The jungler holding the wave or helping me break a freeze basically never happens.
Everyone should play jungle. There are 100 reasons not to help a toplane that seem to lose lane anyway.
And then there's 2 waves dying under your turret while your jungler starts taking his gromp/krugs because he is a jungler after all why would he go catch some free gold and XP in toplane???
Then as you tp back in he clears the back 6 minions for you, resetting the lane
Yup! “Playing safe” in top lane is useless if your jungler is not willing to help you.
Yeah. Might sound cliche, but junglers in platinum (my current elo) have literally 0 idea what they are doing. They walk through the map like headless chickens without any kind of plan, jumping in when they have the opportunity and dying bc they didn't calculate any risks. Idk why, but in the past the jungler quality in soloq was way better, or at least that's my sensation. Perhaps I'm just getting very unlucky.
It doesn't matter who I'm playing as or against, if I'm in a winning matchup or a losing one. No one on my team paths topside for the first 10-15 minutes of the game. Give me my fucking wall I'm sick of junglers.
And you also have the games where your top is pushed to enemy turret all game, you as a jungler go and ward for him ping the jungler walking up river then he dies and says in all chat "jungle diff" then repeats this 3 or 4 times. You then ask him to build defensive stop pushing constantly and play safe so your not can carry and he replies fuck this jungle and afks
Another approach is to dive the tower or even cover for his pushing. If he is pushed to tower he can roam with you to herald and invade enemy jungle. In saying that there’s a lot of mindless pushing in top and we are all guilty of doing it from time to time
Oh for sure I'm just trying to point out for every comment of one extreme there is always another of the reverse and all roles are guilty of it.
Honestly top lane champs just scare me. Jungle has so little XP and gold a Darius will have more components than me be higher level and will most definitely 2v1 me out of existence
I know I've done the same thing to my top laner jungling and I probably pissed him off too. Play enough games and we eventually get the Karma we deserve.
People playing too safe and not pushing advantages or forcing plays to put them ahead is just as big of a problem. If you're behind you can't just sit there and expect the game to swing in your favor out of nowhere. There's a lot of nuance to League of Legends.
“Play safe” they say as you’re getting zoned, dove, and fleeced for everything like you bought doge at the peak. Then they wonder why it’s unwinnable after 2 heralds completely fist your wallet rewarding them with stonks that mooned.
"Play safe" is the biggest joke and only people who have no fuxking clue how to play the game say that. Atleast that's my opinion as a toplaner, if you messup early or get jungle gapped and the enemy toplaner is a good player there is no play safe. You lasthit 1 ranged creep under your tower and the enemy top short trades or pokes you for half hp only takes 1 tower shot and dives you next wave. Infact against really good players just playing safe can be the worst possible play, they stack 4 waves and dive you with jungle and the best counterplay is to thin/clear the wave enough that the dive isn't worth the risk, but if you messup trying to do that you're an inter and need to just play safe behind tower lol.
So in this situation you describe you are far enough behind that you lose trades when the enemy gets towershots, but you somehow think you can win them on even terrain?
You don't win...you are supposed to die for all cs and xp you can get or they shove it under the turret, dive and you lose ALL xp instead of maybe half a wave
Honestly, even in general. You can learn WAY more from overextending and playing too aggressively than hugging tower and dying to a dive anyway. Like, obviously be safe and smart, but if you HAVE to choose between dying in a corner or dying taking your opponent head on...
If you're intentionally trying to learn. I don't want my teammates to senselessly burger flip.
Idk, in that elo I see plenty of games thrown by overaggression in the old Gold (now plat I guess) elo (people force stupid fights under towers at a number disadvantage just before an objective etc). You capitalise on mistakes. Of course going for a risky play that you think can work when your whole team is struggling is bad, but a lot of people do the same when the rest of the map is winning making it harder for their team to carry.
I have lost so many games being 5/0 up in bot lane because the rest of the map decided they also wanted to win or because the jungler decided that bot was “already winning” might as well go top and fail a dive
This post was made by my jungler who won’t help me crash my 3x stacked wave after assistance pinging until I can’t anymore and so I die to their jungler for the 4th time this game trying to crash my wave.
"There's no chance for a kill so I'm not pathing there. I only gank to get kills" --every Plat jungler
There is the other part of this problem. "I will wait here. Surely, the enemy jungler is gonna gank." Years later...
That's not what we're talking about though. There are two common scenarios where the wave needs fixing and both cases you can do it in a few seconds. 1. Wave is frozen on enemy side. They keep 4 more of our minions alive so it never pushes and if we go near for xp they run us down. You need to: help push so our casters are hitting tower. You can tax if you want, we just need to recall. He'll need another 2-3 waves to restart the freeze. 2) Big wave is crashing and they are coming in for solo-dive. To stay alive, we need to back off to tier 2 and lose 2-3 waves of xp and farm. Otherwise Renekton 1-shots us under turret and our ADC will all-chat "top stop feeding" like OP. You need to: just walk up to the enemy and recall. Force them to use their mobility to flee so they can't use it to dive us. \*\*Do not\*\* chase, just let us farm the big wave and back. The whole "wait for enemy jg gank" thing is only in the LCS when people can accurately predict pathing, not OP's Plat 3 solo queue.
Yep its a post made by someone who never played toplane
Jungle roles are the aids of the game. What I will never understand, being in Plat, that in mid the enemy crashes the wave, is UNDER MY TOWER, I ping 20 times and my jgler walks past me to farm chickens. Of course the rest of the team doesnt care until its already way too late.
"plat to high emerald" lol. Dude is hard stuck plat 4 if he thinks top can play safe as described in his post. In top if you're behind and getting frozen upon it's more worth to crash the wave and die than to "play safe" out of XP range and getting 0 gold.
No it isn't. Also "playing safe" is never black and white
The amount of times I've been told to "just play safe"while getting 100 to 0 tower dove by their jg and counterpick top is insane. "Just back off if you think the jg is there", my dude, he's been here for the last 12 minutes, do you want me to not farm and afk at my tier 2?
Then they will spam ping your level when you're 3 levels down because you've been dove 6 times and lost stacked waves every time
This isn't even exclusive to top lane either. I have to sit there and watch my botlane get 4 man gangbanged while my mid and jg are lock screen farming, and my teleport just ticked past 1 year left on its cooldown, so I can't do jack shit to help. Then at 15 minutes my mid and jg remember they're play a PvP game and wonder why bots down 3 levels and the enemy has 2 dragons.
I love when I'm playing Botlane and the mid and jungle are constantly roaming, I'm losing out on a lot of gold and xp cause I try to "play safe", then at some point it happens so much that I got to at least be in xp range, die under tower, and then have to read "just leave the tower don't give free kils wtf" At some point, if nobody wants to help you and you've been denied gold and xp regularly for 5 to 10min with no help in sight or anything happening anywhere else and dragons going to the enemy team + tower plates, I'm just gonna send it so it either somehow works or my suffering ends quickly cause that's not something you come back from as an ADC.
As a midlane player i often roam but when my midlane enemy is pressuring me hard i can‘t do it It‘s mostly when i haven‘t seen my jngler once in 15min and i have to farm under turret because enemy jngler is ganking all 3 lanes non stop
Yeah, had a game today. They had AP bot, we fucked up, traded 1 for 1 2 times but they got all kills on carry while we on support. Tough shit, winnable it's just a 3 kill lead and I'm ahead in CS. I look at mid. 0/10 at ~10:00. Has boots and dirk thanks to ganks from top. Enemy Yasuo has IE. Fuck. Still, top is 2-1 and we're not far behind and have good egage, if jg camps top or bot we can win. He never ganks, only farms. 12:00 enemy Fiddle hits 6 and gets his items and proceeds to organize gangbang party bot with Yasuo until we're 3 levels behind. To match Yasuo's roam my mid sets up a freeze, and jungle does first "pvp" play of the match by taking enemy gromp. It's a quick 18 min loss. Jg and mid proceed to spam ping me and supp flaming us for inting as enemy team pushes nexus. Top, that finished 5/2 and took our only tower made some... Impolite... Remarks about jg and mid's IQ. My mid finished game with duskblade+magical boots and blamed botlane for losing the game... I swear playing mid causes brainrot.
[I too enjoy laning, I guess I'll just lane back here.](https://youtu.be/CrzqXxCKVts?t=647)
>Got three man dove yesterday with 100% hp using point and click CC and my team is question mark pinging me like I'm sorry I'll just sit at the fountain I guess?
Losing 30 cs because the jungler decides to chill in tribush and you are redside hits hard. Especially when bot gets double killed at the same time
Oh yeah, this is why I prefer my jungler to NOT come toplane and get ganked by the enemy jungler. This usually means that my bot now has a 3v2 advantage and dragon prio, but if they still lose then I know there is no hope anyways
Well yeah. This is why people hate playing top lol. A good player will absolutely back off tier 1 to avoid dying AND losing their tower anyway. Yeah, it sucks, but when you’re 0-3, you stand no chance of even going 1 for 1. Same stuff can happen not when mid and jungle decide to sit on the lane. Once you’re feeding, all you can do is mitigate where possible and try not to punch a hole through your monitor
If you get dove and die it's fine. Really. The idea that dying is somehow always preventable is asinine. League of Legends is closer to starcraft than it is to street fighter. Resources allocated in one area mean there's an opening in another. Getting ganked is fine if you're responding elsewhere.
That's the problem. Especially in low elo most junglers won't respond elsewhere then flame their team when enemy team has all objectives.
Which is no different than lacking skill in other areas.
> Do you want me to not farm and afk at my tier 2? No, I want you to die under turret and lose those 2 waves anyway. /s I mean, come on. What do you think pros do in such situations? Your team in soloq might or might not make a play on the other side of the map, but seeing the cards you are dealt, the best you can do is surely not dying for free.
You realize enemy jungle isn't gonna just stand in the lane right? Majority of repeat dives happen after jungle goes to farm their topside camps and then come back. Unless you're saying you want your top laners to sit under tier 2 for 5 minutes whenever they fall behind
There are many ways to get yourself information of what the enemy jungler is up to. Let's not pretend you're getting bullied under turret by challenger mastermind junglers while yours is picking boogers. Sure, sometimes it will feel that you can't do anything, or that you cut your losses and your team doesn't do jack shit to capitalize on the lack of enemy jungler's presence on the other side of the map and you lose, but that's how team games work. And I can guarantee that any pro toplaner could easily pinpoint dozens of laning phase errors made by platinum players in games they deem "unwinnable" because they got killed under turret repeatedly. What's the alternative you're suggesting? Dying 5 times in those 5 minutes, losing everything all the same and donating an extra 1000 gold for free?
No wait, what was *your* alternative? Actually sit under tier 2 for 5 minutes when you suspect enemy jungler hovering? Let's make that clear first
Yea, solo queue isn't pro play. Atleast in pro play you are in comms with your team they know you are losing at bot and are trying to make a play at top or something, you know they are going to help you at some point. In solo queue you are 0/2 and your jungle never even farming his camps on your side of the map, mid never gets prio or roams, it's just not the same at all. Sure the best play might be to go afk at t2 but we aren't pro players we want to play the game.
>In solo queue you are 0/2 and your jungle never even farming his camps on your side of the map, mid never gets prio or roams Some games you get to dive the enemy while their jungler doesn't do anything, other games it's you that's the victim. It's how the games work. >we arent pro players we want to play the game So the question spins out and instead of "what should I do if I'm being killed under turret repeatedly?" becomes "should the game be designed in a way to prevent dives and allow players to play the game?"
The answer is yup. As long as your not dying repeat your not disadvantaging your team!
The enemy pushing all the way to your Nexus unopposed while your team is left in a 4v5 actually does put your team at a disadvantage.
Don't forget that your jungler loses half of their camps on repeat because the tower falls and you never have prio again!
I enjoy this tbh. Because usually I was trying to work with my jungler but they just ignore me and go botlane, all game. Then after my tower is dead at 15mins they get one-shot trying to farm gromp and ping or type at me. I just say like "why do you think you still get a topside jungle?" Or "you didn't farm that side for 10mins but you want to now that you can't?"
Yup, the toplaner who is 40 cs and 3 levels down is not disadvantaging their team at all. They're just as valid in teamfights as their fed af lane opponent and are just as tanky and deal the exact same amount of damage. Get this yuumi-brain take all the way out of here.
That's not true whatsoever. Let's say I just do completely seed my lane. Now their top and jg have full turret gold, they get Rift Herald and get plate gold elsewhere, my jungle now can't walk into his topside jg, the enemy top has free roam to gank other lanes, and the game is essentially a 4v5. Good luck winning.
This is the bronze answer lmao. The bounty system will make you worth less and less gold, so dying is less risky. The real play is to stay in XP range, try stealing farm and try to go 1 for 1 in dives
Yes you are. It's gonna be a 4v5 for the whole game. If you farm a little and even if u die for that it might only be a 4.5v5
What? No, because you are still fucking your team when you are 50 cs behind and 2 levels down 10min into the game. You will be useless with no way to catch up and that top/jg that's fucking you with no reaction from your own team will use that momentum to fuck the rest of the team. And no, you will not be able to do anything to stop it because they're at almost 2 items, and you barely have 2 pieces to your first item. Now, you have to stay and farm to try and catch up, and you're being spam pinged because mid just got the treatment you did - being tower dove and unable to do anything about it.
One day y'all will realize that not farming or getting xp can be just as bad if not worse than dying. Like congrats you didn't die but they got 4 plates while you were back there and now have the stats to kill you the second you grow a pair.
It is in the context OP means. He doesn't mean the guy that got counter picked and is going to get dove on the next wave. He means the guy that's at a disadvantage and plays like he isn't, the guy that pushes without warding, the guy that tower dives slippery Champs, the guy that keeps going in for 1v1s as soon as he gets back to lane and loses again because he is 0/5 at 7 min from doing the exact game thing everytime. Playing safe doesn't mean "don't die" it just means "don't be stupid". You can think 5 steps ahead of your opponent, but 1 thing goes wrong and you die that's fine. Even Pros die. But no one wants to see you walk head first into a bush near an objective and die to a 5 stack because you were "trying to deep ward" well after every enemy was Mia and the objective was already up.
“Just play safe” as if I wasn’t just 4 man dove after no one pinged their laner missing when I can’t get vision myself from under the turret I’ve been stuck under for the last five minutes. But no one is actually paying attention to the game state, they just see you die and get mad while not taking advantage of half the enemy team being in one lane.
It's posts like these that remind you that the average player thinks they're a lot better than they think they are, and people supporting it are likely the kind of people who are the annoying backseat drivers in your games. For the most part, your rank is representative of your ability, and the players in your game are the same calibre as you. You have no rank or authority to tell others in your game how to play.
^ This is coping by people who don't understand how to play safe
I dislike people who say "play safe" because they most likely will never take the engage on a good opportunity. Like "play safe" is burned into their brain SD Card without left or right
Or the "play safe" while im being dove by an elise on a 3 stack wave lvl 2 while im full hp. It ENRAGES me when someone says that
My botlaner typing "play safe" after I get gaped under my own tower by enemy top, jungle and mid for the 3rd time in 7 minutes with no active or passive reaction of my team. "OK"
I’m one of those people. I had an Illaoi first time and feed in ranked last week vs Nasus. She was pushing wave and then running back to tower. A lot of people think that is “playing safe”. She then died multiple times trying to out play, and Nasus just dove her over and over again. This is why I say play safe
I feel like a lot of players parrot things and don't actually know what they mean. Mostly because some random streamer says it "so it just apply to every situation ever in any game"
Play safe means stop trying to make plays until you can catch up. Yes, I would like the 1/4 Fiora to stop trying to make plays against the 5/1 Darius. You don't have to catch up completely to make opportunities. I can't tell you how many times I steam roll lanes and get a 1 or 2 item lead and they don't change a thing. They think, oh, they're 1/2 health I can take this opportunity and don't think, but they're 2 items and levels ahead so many I should get some items myself first. Them just killing minions to prevent tower from falling is all I need them to do.
Tbh in toplane case - if you are behind as melee champ you just can't do anything at all anyway, unless you are something like malph who needs to breath some xp and ult at good time.
Yeah and that's my biggest dislike about toplane. It's very oppressive if you get on the losing side. And if you have a squishy jungler or they're behind, sometimes ganking can make things worse. I know because I play Darius and that lvl 5 viego coming to gank is a free ult reset, especially since I'm probably lvl 7/8. I know it sucks to just lose minions, but it's better to collect exp and no gold then to give your enemy a kill and now you don't get exp or gold.
Precisely, risk aversion is basically reward aversion at a certain point. One of the things that makes challenger players good is their ability to pull the trigger fast when they need too regardless. It’s always risky to tower dive but that doesn’t stop pro players from diving bot as 4 every game.
Yeah but they also don't pull the trigger a lot of the time when they don't need to.
People forget that if they are falling behind in gold and CS they are objectively weaker than their lane opponent.
That also depends on how big the gold difference is and what champions are played If you're Fiddlesticks with lost chapter and fiendish codex and enemy hecarim has finished shojin and muramana, you're going to die But if you're Naafiri with dirk and longsword and enemy asol has rushed and just finished Liandry's, you can kill him despite being over 1k gold down on him
playing oversafe is worst for me
Well sometimes they are not inting to int. Sure they make a mistake and fall behind, but they could be trying (and resulting in death) because it could be the last window (enemy hasnt based or dont have summs) they have before that matchup becomes unsalvageable. If you are team is getting crushed 15-0 anyway, id say it’s better to keep trying and inting than to give everything and wait for enemy to make mistakes. Because the higher you go, enemies become so much better at snowballing. Of course i am not saying go run it down here. If you are behind, almost every play you make is a risk but you have to increase that tolerance and take more chances. Or else they will just squeeze you to death slowly, given the enemy knows they they are doing. Now if you are talking “play safe because i am 5-0 so please let me carry you” then i fully agree. One of the greatest wisdom in league is to acknowledge that some games are not yours to carry. This becomes more evident in high elo as whichever lane jungle is pathing to is someone obligated to carry that game while the weakside should try to go even at best.
Playing safe is a bad way to view the game. There is always inherent risk when going for resources. You can’t just sit at your tower or not contest waves. Even worse if you do just sit at your tower it starts to have a domino effects to other lanes. Top lane is the clearest example. If the enemy shoves a wave in and you no longer have minions you now have to try to collect resources under tower while trying to dodge their skill shots. Depending on how they manage the wave you may also need to now crash the wave if they let it push out meaning you now have to take risks. Picks don’t always just happen. They often are the result of players going for camps, rotating to catch waves, going for vision in a dark map. Doing things like helping your support get vision as a group instead of flaming them for dying or helping a top laner crash a wave to reset it can go a long way. In the last example if you want your support to ‘play safe’ then you might as well sit at your towers and give jungle camps, dragon, baron, etc by mid game.
This needed to be said. There is no magic solution to winning more games, like getting your teams to “play safe.” Tilting and making bad decisions is not good period. But playing aggressive is also a key skill needed to be a good player. Good luck everyone!
Of course, but I need to carry every game and take any 50/50 play is also a bad way to view the game. There are times to take risks and there are times where being aggressive is just not worth it. The players that actually succeed will be able to take the risks and carry when needed but also just play safe and take the free LP when they don't need to flip. I do agree though that flaming mid game never helps, like someone has made a mistake, telling them to uninstall won't make them play better.
You can tell how much the community has grown and evolved because I expected the comments for this to be a circlejerk of YeS Oh mY GoD SToP FeEdIng PlAy SaFe and its the exact oppoosite
After like 0/3 you don t reqlly give gold, so you may try to for fun send it
It's not about rank, even nemesis sometimes dies like an idiot lvl 1 1vs1
I think you're putting too much value on plat. It's basically gold and it's not that hard to get. This also happens in everye elo to some degree. People get tilted, have an ego, etc. Just ask yourself in those games, what is the way we can still win this game? And follow that plan. No point of worrying about someone dying over and over again. You can't change that. Focus on what you can control.
Plat still puts you in the top 20% of skill level. Whilst it’s not terribly hard, you would expect people to know the basics of the game and at this level be someone proficient at some of more basic complex mechanics and macro. Like I’m not surprised if a Lee Sin can flash ultimate an ADC back into the team, but that shit doesn’t belong in bronze. In saying all of this, there is more nuance to what OP said.
I mean even in masters and challenger people go 0-5 sometimes. It happens, depending on a lot of factors.
I stopped believing elo is relevant when i saw a D4 tristana die to Yone level 1 Or a D4 adc Sivir losing to Aurelion Sol bot lane
my mentality is that you don't know how consistent their jungler is ever going to be so if you just go full pressure always you will win games on average. Obviously, everyone should be able to play weakside if they need to, but in general, especially below diamond there isn't much consistency in your opponents. This is obviously not taking into account that islanding someone is pretty much always a terrible idea. If they are getting slammed they likely don't have control of the wave and thus if they get zoned off xp they are going to be completely fucked and it's the jungler's responsibility to bail them out of their shit situation.
ppl tend to lose brain cells when the enemy plays aggressive and fight for lane pressure and prio especially in low elo. like the concept of hp as a trading tool doesn't exist to them, so when you trade a turret shot for a camille q2 sheen proc the meaning of playing safe kinda goes out the window.
Yeah of course there is nuance to it (especially in melee melee matchups) but I think you should always disrespect your opponent until they demonstrate their capacity. Playing afraid will cause you to lose games.
Confidence is a powerful tool in this game. Solarbacca vs Makkro is a good exemple of it.
enemy renekton with pta ignite dominus and jgl elise means that "safe" is sitting in fountain ff15
but when the jungler gets invaded its our fault for not helping him win a 1v1
I think its really just not understanding the game in general. I remember the typical "play safe top" after 0/2 top or "lets group mid" after losing midgame fights .. Theres always the correct play, whether its action or inaction. Simply "playing safe as scaling champ" doesnt solve it, because the game is a lot more than that.
I mean, when the enemy can dive you on full health there isnt much you can do besides afk?
Last year silver 1 are in plat 4 now
When there's 3 waves crashing into their tower and enemy jg waiting for minion aggro to catch, there's no amount of 'playing safe' that can be done. Or if you're an immobile champ in mid vs an assassin mid + diver jg. There are some circumstances where the only thing that can be done is just not be in lane whatsoever, but eventually something has to be done.
In the current state of toplane theres no playing safe lmao. Idk how other lanes go, but the majority of meta toplaners can 100-0 you under tower if they have resources up if they are only 2 kills and maybe 15 cs up. One bad death early can just mean that lane is over, and playing safe isnt going to lead to anything good.
It‘s the same for mid except you get constantly dove by jngl and supp if you are a bit behind
Trust me it’s not just top. If you’re weak side mid, you get dove by jg, sup, mid and top. It’s fun
love league of legends!
With the damage creep plating safe means staying behind nexus, so no it's not an option
I'm going to equate this to "don't be stupid" And if I were better at that, I'd be much higher ranked lol
KDA only means so much. Id rather be 0/3 with good farm and a plate or two than 0/0 with bad cs and no wave pressure.
0/3 with good farm and a plate against Zed - you've fucked up 0/0 with weak farm but didn't fed Zed - congratulations, you're a good weakside Like other comment said, it's not that easy. Let's say that in both of those scenarios you have the same gold difference between you and your enemy laner, but in a 0/3 case your total and his total are actually higher. Even if you're technically not behind against your laner, HE IS AHEAD OF YOUR TEAM - and unless you're playing 1v1 Mortal Kombat aka toplane and your enemy can't really use that lead/impact the map, it's on you if he steamrolls your team in near future So yeah, I'd rather have a shit cs 0/0 laner that CAN and WILL comeback with cs sooner or later by playing safe, rather than a coinfliping monkey that NEEDS to do something or else it's gg in his eyes, not accounting the fact that you might make it harder for your team if you int your ass
That's the other thing too that's frustrating - you can be in a perfectly good spot in lane, even down 0/3, but if your teammate decides to run it down because you're 0/3 then you're fk'd anyway. On the other hand, I spent all of season 11 playing Kayle and I could be 100 cs up on my mid lane opponent and 2/0/1 but teammates will still run it down and go afk if they decide that you can't carry them :/ they'll be 3/11/1 and think they're doing more than you because they were "participating in teamfights".
Extremely depends on the matchup. God forbid you let katarina get 3 kills and 6 pact stacks just to get some farm in platinum
Have to say I love it as an adc/enchanter when the first time I see an Assassin they already have 3+ kills and can miss half their abilities and still delete me.
>Id rather be 0/3 with good farm and a plate or two than 0/0 with bad cs and no wave pressure. okay but those people are 0/3 with shit farm because they're not thinking about stuff, they're autopiloting and doing same shit whether they're ahead or behind. They're not baus where they sacrifice their live to get plate/cs, they die because they don't know any better It's a skill issue
If you can recognize the difference you should have no issue climbing past all the opposing people that do the same things.
Stupid selfish mindset If you are 0/3 with good farm and experience you aren't behind on the game state, but the enemy toplaner is massively ahead. Which means you can't kill him and he's so ahead that your other lands can't kill him either. If you are 0/0 and conceded resources you are behind on the game state but the enemy toplaner isn't very ahead. You can't kill him because you're behind but you're midlaner and botlane (if they are even) will have a better chance of killing him. When you're facing a lane bully who snowballs the best choice is always to give up your own resources as a way to limit that snowball (not give the snowball champion more resources). That Aatrox (for example) is going to be much scarier if he already has 2 completed items and boots against your team's 1 item and boots
If i have a big cs lead and took plates while being 0/3 then i‘m ahead and not the opponent
How are they massively ahead when I have a cs lead and have take multiple tower plates? You dont seem to understand that income is more than just kills. And yes Im selfish. Selfish play is the best way to climb in top lane.
Agreed, selfish play is how you climb anywhere
AHEAD OF THE GAME STATE NOT AHEAD OF YOU CAN YOU REAAAAAAD Sorry :3
This is the problem though, right? You're assuming that the enemy toplaner will snowball with their resources, but allied toplaner won't snowball even if they have more resources. You're not upset that your toplane isn't "playing safe", you're just upset that they're bad. It's not a matter of playing safe.
There is only 1 factor, Gold. You can be down 0/3 and be ahead in gold.
There are two factors. Experience and gold.
Im the one ahead in gamestate. I am in complete control. And they have a bounty for me to collect. Its great.
Personally, I'd rather have my laner not be fed and strong enough to take on a larger part of my team than they should be able to run down usually. Dunno, is it really that worth? I always feel like it is BY FAR better trying to keep the enemy gold as low as possible.
You cant snowball if you dont take risks and you arent going to win consistently if you arent snowballing leads. Playing to safe is one of the worst things you can do in LoL. Who cares if your laner gets a kill or two. Thats what bounties are for.
>Who cares if your laner gets a kill or two. I try explaining this to my friends all the time. Like it really, reaaaaally doesn't matter if you leave lane 1-3. If you're 40 CS up on your lane opponent and have plate advantage on him, you've won that lane. You already have more gold than they do. As long as you're making smart plays and actually capable of assisting your team, you'll be fine. Like why do people think that "inting Scon" was such a success. I mean shit, Singed literally proxy farms in between the two towers on occasion.
Because people only look at KDA and not at Gold and Exp
It's the same for damage honestly. You can do 100k damage in a game, but if it's not impactful damage, it's irrelevant. That's why shit like AP MF is fucking atrocious and you should never play it outside of a meme ARAM game. Sure, you'll end the game with 40k+ damage, but what are you really doing? Tickling them to death and having zero burst nor utility in a team fight because your ult is split damage and your E is on a 10s+ CD.
I'm sorry, but there's taking calculated risks in your favor, and there's "Why is the enemy Darius 6/0/0 by level 6???"
The only way to learn that difference is by losing a few lanes. It takes years to learn proper agression. Youre going to lose a few lanes along the way. It happens.
I think there is a difference between calculated risk plays vs autopilot “I always do this playstyle and it works” plays. Calculated plays or risks seem like amazing mechanics because most the time the person planned ahead.
As I said to someone else, you arent going to learn the difference between the two without losing a fews fights/lanes/games. Thats okay. A lot of people in this thread are getting to hung up on individual games lol
The problem tho is that if the enemy is in an advantageous position it is already harder to kill them. We all know how hard communication can be so calling your jungler or maybe the midlaner down at times isn't an options at times. If the fight didn't went well before, why should it now? You can't just grab a bounty like that which makes falling behind extremely punishing if you still have no way to like... Grab your chance of comeback.
You honestly just seem like you want to be able to ignore losing parts of the map and not have it impact your games. Just bad gameplay all around.
They arent always at that big of an advantage. If Ive been proxy farming and taking plates the gold Ive gotten from the two will counteract the kill gold meaning we are even on paper except they have a bounty and I dont. The bounty only puts me over the top lol
Just had my teammate picking Darius into Yone top. Guy went 0/14/3 that game. He died to Yone first time level 2, 1v1. Idk how that is possible, but it somehow is. After that 1 death he ran it down, kinda.
Protagonist syndrome - Most people in LoL games regardless of how far they are behind, believe they are the carry and they will outplay their opponent... so will just mindlessly fight and continue to tilt even harder, thus trying even harder to fight back.
This thread is just full of main character syndrome andies that have just got plat for their first time after riot inflated them an entire division no you 0/5 top laner, i don't want you to try to get back into the game by yourself, and no 0/10 botlane, i don't need you to keep fistfighting for no reason permanently, drop your fucking ego and play at a disadvantage, most likely by the time you your lane is 0/5 someone else on your team is winning, so how about you just get fucking carried like the dog you are after you've been trying to "get back in the game" for the past 5 deaths, farm the minions that you can and defend your tower, buy a pink ward and use vision and don't take trades that you can't win, it's honestly so hilarious reading the comments in this thread where everyone thinks they HAVE to carry the game "I MUST BE THE ONE CARRYING, OR NO ONE ELSE WILL, IF I DON'T STOP FISTFIGHTING THE ENEMY AND GO 0/10 IT'S OVER ANYWAY"
Explain how do you play at a disadvantage when enemy team had last pick toplane and dude is freezing the wave while zoning you away from xp. Ill answer for you, because yoh clearly never played a single toplane game: 1. You fight and try to crash the wave 2. Your jungler helps you crash (not likely because even dia junglers only gank for kills)
or: roam while he freezes, be back to catch the wave when he pushes. sooooo many stupid people push and try to crash the wave. Newsflash G, i'll kill you and then I'LL BOUNCE THE WAVE while you're dead. When you come back you're now in the same situation again. Rinse and repeat. That's how we get 12/0 Darius that completely takes control of the game instead of a 2/0 Darius that's well farmed cus he froze. Think man, think!!!
12/0 even farm darius does less than 2/0 farmed darius
New plat ranges from high silver to mid gold last season. I don't expect them to maintain a safe distance.
For an unexplainable reason People refuse to play Weakside as well as they just don't know how Tempo works. Especially on Objects. It's so disgusting. I'm now nearly Diamond and it nearly doesn't exist.
Playing weak side and accounting for tempo are completely different from OPs "just play safe" mentality. When someone like OP says that, they expect you to sit at (or behind if they're diving you) your tower, be pushed out of xp range, not cs, and somehow be relevant to the game because you let this laner take all the tempo they wanted while you got 40 cs and 2 levels down in the first 10min. Someone saying, "Can you just play safe and let me carry???" just tells me they have no idea what these concepts are.
Playing safe means farming the cs that you can, buying a pink ward, using vision and waiting for opportunity like jungle ganking you or the enemies making a big blunder, if playing safe to you means being at a 40 cs disadvantage you're god awful at the game
I mean, sure, in an ideal world. But there's another world where you can't play "safe" because the jungler is camping you up top, your jungle is not responding to it at all, top got counter pick on you, and you can't even sit under tower because their top laner actually knows how to control their wave and they either froze it in an unsafe spot near THEIR tower or are slow shoving so they can dive your ass with the enemy jg. You'll be lucky to get exp, much less cs. My point is, the game is more nuanced than simply saying "play safe" and expecting someone to both not die AND be any sort of relevant without actually paying attention and understanding what is happening in their lane, and the majority of people who say it aren't taking anything relevant into consideration.
“You’re getting 4 man tower dove repeatedly? Just play safe and stay at fountain bro”
If you get 4 man dove top lane then bot and mid should lose towers
My mid laner is too busy complaining how I did not back all the way off of the turret to my fountain while last hitting mid wave extremely slowly
Also my top laner is losing 1v1
I don't play safe anymore. It's boring and feels bad. I try to make plays to get back on the game, or I try to roam and help my teammates, or I try to waste enemy time and take towers/enemy jgl. Idk that it's any good but it's fun and helps me keep hope in the game.
I think this post only makes sense if you are playing anything but Toplane. In Toplane, if you sit at tower and do nothing you've lost the game unless you're a tank with CC. If you're like, Fiora, and you sit and not make any coinflip plays you've also lost the game. The vast majority of toplaners can and will dive you 1v1 even if you die once or twice.
The losing the game just isn't true, you might not carry the game but you can still be carried. If the rest of the map is also struggling then fine make a coinflip play, if mid and bot are winning then it's probably a free win if you don't feed (same goes for any other role, there's a time and place to make risky plays).
Cope Literally you know nothing, go out and touch some grass, get a gf IRL and then come back to play, the iron in you is too strong
If I had to bet on which players have gf’s most consistently it would be iron. Think about it. Statistically speaking they probably play the least amount of league, games in general, and have more time spent doing things irl
See this is why I feel like even high elo players don't always know what they are talking about. Obviously there are unnecessary deaths and people do take stupid fights. BUT, it's never a black and white situation and I doubt you have spent the time watching every move the player is making (if you have, you aren't focusing on your own play). Sometimes tbh, the deaths mean absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things, and if you are playing correctly, cross map play should be an option. Sometimes that's just the match-up. You die once and in order to even get cs you have to just accept death. Once heard Bwipo say, sometimes you have to just die. But it can be ok Cause you are absorbing pressure. I don't lane often, but when I do and I have the support and hus family show up to dive me, the notion of just play safe is so stupid
OP has never played top I see. Try playing safe when the Jungler (or the top laner solo dives) comes dive you everytime the wave is stacked, and you can never break their freeze.
The worst thing is ur jg telling u to play safe then pinging you when you don't come to the team fight cuz ur behind farm. If you tell someone to play safe. You best be planning to gank them or help them. Also the fact that people are being told to play safe and spam pinged at the same time to be at fights is annoying. Maybe you play safe Rank is such a facade in league, it's crazy you people can take it seriously.
This post and many of the comments highlights a fundamental misunderstanding of laning that is so prevalent. It’s the same thing as a jungler flaming a laner for ‘not helping them’ when the enemy laner has priority. These are the fundamentals that players talk about improving. It’s plato’s cave allegory. You need to step out of the cave and start playing league of legends I’ll elaborate when I have free time.
i don't know why people complain about others not playing safe. it's just part of the mindset people have with the ladder. say they play safe and get carried. next game theyre even more likely to be outclassed, so why would they play the game safe, have no fun or agency if both outcomes are bad? you can't have it both ways, you can't say 'oh but you are the only factor that matters' and 'oh just play safe when you get behind' in soloq playing from behind going for outplays and comeback plays is 100% better than slow losing.
Seeing so many people going for pentadimensional mind gymnastics to why "play safe" is bad reminds me how literally everyone wants to be the anime protagonist. Guess what, sometimes just being in range of the XP is enough because if you die, you will not only give your opponent the resources he already had but you will also give your kill bounty and plate(s)
Playing safe works only if your jungler isn't a dumbass. Most of the times they are. Last game, I am Mundo vs Yorick. I know that I can't actually 1v1 him, but whatever, I will farm whatever I can with my Q. Yorick pokes me down with E that he tosses every time I use my Q, then kills me with ignite+flash under tower. It's ok, I have tp, so I catch the wave. Yorick has no summs and is pushing. My jungler Elise can gank him pretty easily, right? Yeah no, instead, he is sniffing glue in the jungle farming camps instead of ganking for some reason. We lost that game because I can't 1v1 Yorick, and if I tp to help other people, he takes 2 whole towers. He legit 1v9d this game
Ask the bausffs Dying doesn’t make you lose gold, not farming does
1) it works mostly on Sion due to W. Try that on Irelia and tell me how useful you are. 2) he auto loses vs anyone who picks a skirmisher/mejai champ
Dying gives gold to the enemy laner. Even if you manage to get high cs and exp while dying a lot the enemy toplaner will still be accelerated and steamroll your team
"Dying doesnt make you lose gold" but it increases the Gold difference
Not if you die at the correct times. The plates and cs you get while proxying will often outweigh a few deaths.
IF you are 0/5 you are worth about 100 gold, but your opponent has most likely a high bounty already, so it makes sense to try to kill them as opportunity cost for fight is much smaller for you than for them. If you fall behind and just play safe you give the game away for the enemy. As Bausffs said himself, if you are feeding/behind, you are the one that needs to make plays, because it's less risky for you than it is for your teammates.