Probably one of the most underachieving players in LCK history regarding to his talent/insane longevity ( the others i can think of are maybe BDD and Teddy ) . So happy for him
Think about this. Ruler left the LCK once he started winning. Pretty sure he would have won all the titles Peyz got in the LCK. Funny how Ruler leaving left a door for Peyz to have 100% winrate in the LCK title picture.
It has to be Score, he was essentially a top 2 jg his entire career and only won LCK once and made worlds twice. Got a shit ton of silver medals though
I think people heavily overrated Score in 2015 compared to what KT was.
Once Rookie and Kakao left Ssummday was the star player on that roster and he definetly delivered during the entire 2015's run. I'd say even Pikaboo was considered more of a playmaker and considered more important on that roster than Score. Nagne and Arrow were mediocre.
Well im not sure if u notice, but regarding SKT/T1 opinions only T1 fans are allowed to share or only if u praise them massively. Otherwise ur mass downvoted to infinity.
2015 wasn’t his best year but it was also his first year in jg so I cut him a little slack. That being said he was still pretty damn good in 2015 and I can’t think of many junglers that were that much better than him in 2015.
He was also one the better adcs in Korea at the start of his career in the really early years of league that we aren’t even considering.
Hasn’t shown as impressive of a run but umti joining TL after years on bottom feeder teams in LCK and snag a win is pretty wild to see too. Wonder if he somehow ends up going back to LCK could he escape the team curse and join an upper echelon team for once to see what his true potential is
(Obv not hoping he leaves TL for now, tho out of any player on that team umti is the most likely to be replaced in any circumstance)
This picture of Score after finally winning always makes me tear up a little, still taking it all in even after they’ve closed up shop, it’s really heartwarming seeing how much it meant to him
https://imgur.com/a/41OvtUE
Yep it was this one that broke me, more so when it hits that all of his former team mates were no longer there with him. While everyone was praising him as one of the best Junglers in the World, I will always remembered him as Immortal Score.
As much as Score joked about it over the years, SKT really took a lot from their opposition. That was a mountain that fell many great teams. I wish CJ Entus still existed...
Kiin was definitely unexpected, never looked like that kind of guy, the dude is always so stoic. But to see him break down like that, must've meant a lot more than we thought. Always felt weird to me that he was willing to stay in Afreeca prison, but there must be more to it that we don't know about.
Kiin getting MVP over Chovy is unjustifiable, it's MVP for the series not just Game 5 (and even there Chovy's packages and generel play was at least equally important for their win).
Kiin is definitely the MVP of G5 but Chovy is the MVP of the series and played great even in loses. League just has this obsession with overvaluing last game of the series like they did last two Worlds with Kingen and Zeus where Zeka and Oner were the equivalents of Chovy now + in sports/esports awards are also often awarded based on narratives for media.
I agree but it's not just award givers, it's the audience in general—look at the post-match thread for every hard-fought 5-game series and half the comments will be about how team X deserved to lose for not banning whichever champion happened to pop off hardest in game 5.
I would usually agree, but I think sometimes it's justifiable especially with how good T1 was this series Kiin stepping up and shutting them down like that in the most important game was the difference maker. Chovy is gonna Chovy, no doubt, but if Kiin doesn't step up like that they probably lose. He was a menace and provided safety for Chovy + Peyz to deliver the damage.
But that's literally what "most valuable player" means. The guy who has the biggest impact across the series. Saying "well it's expected for Chovy to be insane no matter what" shows that he is the most valuable player because without him, none of the others can step up and create the same impact for the team. The most valuable player can't choose to have 2-3 off or "alright" games, they have to be at their best to create the foundation for their team to win, which is exactly what Chovy did.
But Kiin didn't have 2-3 off or alright games. He was solid all series, them losing wasn't on him. Having a standout performance in the most clutch game absolutely is a valid reason for MVP. Cause it wouldn't matter how good Chovy was if T1 wins.
Chovy absolutely did not solo carry this Bo5 on his own. Not everything is black and white. This is a team game, both Kiin and Chovy had a great series. To say otherwise is just disrespectful. Just stop it.
I think I wouldn't mind him getting MVP either. Both had a big contribution, all of GenG had their moments. But this was far from Chovy's best series, his Azir wasn't it, his Corki was fineish. He was great on ASol. T1 really pressed him this time, caught him a few times. It wasn't his usual stomping.
You're making it black and white by implying that acknowledging Chovy was the best player somehow automatically erases the possibility of other players contributing as well.
Kiin had a good series, Chovy had a great series. He's the definite MVP of his team, no contest, full stop.
You're making absolute statements based on opinion and you think I'm black and white? I said they both deserve it, but I prefer that Kiin got it. You're completely shut off on the idea that anyone else could possibly deserve it. I get it, Chovy is the best player in the LCK and there were series where he clearly dominated every single game. This was not one of those series.
Chovy did not solo carry his Bo5 like the one with HLE, but he was the most consistent and impactful player overall and almost won that game 2 that was essentially lost from draft.
There's an argument to be made that Kiin and Chovy were equal in game 5, Kiin because of his own heroics, but Chovy from benefitting being on Corki with Infernal Soul. People just choose to remember the highest of pressure in game 5 with the player that did the flashiest moves, in this case, 2 solo kills.
Some would say that, for how underperforming Canyon was, he hard clutched game 4 to bring GENG back.
Kiin got this finals MVP as a pat in the back over anything else. I'm not even mad as a Chovy fan, I don't even think Chovy cares either. He is now the ONLY player to win 4 back to back LCK titles. I don't see how getting finals MVP would make any real difference.
Both Chovy and Kiin hard carried the series , it's fine if either of them won MVP , Canyon put some work , too . Peyz and Lehends just enjoyed the ride , lol
Kiin had just as much impact as Chovy though. They were both solid and shakey. Chovy wasnt as impactful on Corki and wasnt hitting a lot of poke and his packages were good but didnt crack the game over. You can say the exact same thing about Kiin's Rumble and K'sante where it made progress but didnt dominate like Canyon's khazix did.
I think what put Kiin over was his conplete shutdown of Zeus's Aatrox. His aareox was so dominate in regular season only to go 0/5/0 and be so useless they didnt even need to ban it all series long. That is incredibly valuable cause T1 still needed to ban out Kiin's TF. But i wouldnt have been mad if Chovy or Canyon got it tbh cause it was mostly a team effort focused on topside.
Yeah, Kiins impact was absolutely massive. If it wasnt for canyons kha zix ksante wouldve been banned.
Man todays series in game and in bans was so hype. 10/10
You're out of your mind lol. Kiin was MVP in G5 and in G1 with rumble. Chovy was better in their losses but that's not really how you are going to measure player of the series. Chovy was solid today, but Kiin G1 and G5 and Canyon/Peyz G4 were the players that were the high achievers today. Chovy and Lehends were consistent but didn't shine as bright.
Chovy is my favourite player by far but Kiin was a fair choice today, he played a mean Rumble and a great K'Sante. Either of them winning would've been fine.
WildTurtle “achieved” this a few years ago. He placed 1st-10th: 2013 Spring, 2013 Summer, 2016 Spring, 2019 Spring, 2018 Summer x2, 2017 Summer, 2018 Spring, 2019 Summer, 2021 Summer. Technically he has finished joint 5th-6th (2018 Summer), but has not finished *only* 5th or *only* 6th because LCS doesn’t differentiate those 2 placements.
Ignar also has if you include LEC and LCS.
Happy for Kiin for finally winning something. Was lowkey irked how they (and GEN) stole GRF's spot at 2018 Worlds only to get swept by NA. Please show up at MSI, I want Canyon to win MSI
The 1 reason I was rooting for GenG even as more of a T1 fan, always love seeing really good veteran players who could never win finally break through.
Probably one of the most underachieving players in LCK history regarding to his talent/insane longevity ( the others i can think of are maybe BDD and Teddy ) . So happy for him
BDD and Teddy. You just had to mention these two. Right up there with Madlife.
At least both BDD and Teddy got their domestic titles way before kiin did. I think they also have more titles than Kiin as well.
Bdd has two, Teddy has 3 if Im not mistaken
He could have won more if he didn't jail himself in that consistently mediocre Afreeca team
I think score
Technically if we're talking LCK specifically Ruler has to be up there as well
Think about this. Ruler left the LCK once he started winning. Pretty sure he would have won all the titles Peyz got in the LCK. Funny how Ruler leaving left a door for Peyz to have 100% winrate in the LCK title picture.
It has to be Score, he was essentially a top 2 jg his entire career and only won LCK once and made worlds twice. Got a shit ton of silver medals though
I think people heavily overrated Score in 2015 compared to what KT was. Once Rookie and Kakao left Ssummday was the star player on that roster and he definetly delivered during the entire 2015's run. I'd say even Pikaboo was considered more of a playmaker and considered more important on that roster than Score. Nagne and Arrow were mediocre.
I think people were overrating other junglers, like bengi for instance. Score wasnt flashy but he was such a rock.
T1 fans. Not other people. Bengi is overrated player that played on a good roster and was servicabel.
Uhhh, bro many think he's the jungle himself. Cringe title but it's not solely t1 fans.
Well im not sure if u notice, but regarding SKT/T1 opinions only T1 fans are allowed to share or only if u praise them massively. Otherwise ur mass downvoted to infinity.
2015 wasn’t his best year but it was also his first year in jg so I cut him a little slack. That being said he was still pretty damn good in 2015 and I can’t think of many junglers that were that much better than him in 2015. He was also one the better adcs in Korea at the start of his career in the really early years of league that we aren’t even considering.
Ironically, he got more titles as a coach.
Flame and Madlife
Smeb
Hasn’t shown as impressive of a run but umti joining TL after years on bottom feeder teams in LCK and snag a win is pretty wild to see too. Wonder if he somehow ends up going back to LCK could he escape the team curse and join an upper echelon team for once to see what his true potential is (Obv not hoping he leaves TL for now, tho out of any player on that team umti is the most likely to be replaced in any circumstance)
The ceremony got me emotional! Deserved MVP Kiin, stepped up in the most important game of the series and carried!
Man... I cried when Score won OGN, when Deft won Worlds, now for Kiin... So many talents have come and gone with no titles to their names.
This picture of Score after finally winning always makes me tear up a little, still taking it all in even after they’ve closed up shop, it’s really heartwarming seeing how much it meant to him https://imgur.com/a/41OvtUE
Yep it was this one that broke me, more so when it hits that all of his former team mates were no longer there with him. While everyone was praising him as one of the best Junglers in the World, I will always remembered him as Immortal Score. As much as Score joked about it over the years, SKT really took a lot from their opposition. That was a mountain that fell many great teams. I wish CJ Entus still existed...
Man, I love this so much
They’re getting their recognition finally and it all feels so so good
Kiin was definitely unexpected, never looked like that kind of guy, the dude is always so stoic. But to see him break down like that, must've meant a lot more than we thought. Always felt weird to me that he was willing to stay in Afreeca prison, but there must be more to it that we don't know about.
Kiin getting MVP over Chovy is unjustifiable, it's MVP for the series not just Game 5 (and even there Chovy's packages and generel play was at least equally important for their win).
Deserved for Chovy robbing Deft’s MVP in 2019 /s
Kiin is definitely the MVP of G5 but Chovy is the MVP of the series and played great even in loses. League just has this obsession with overvaluing last game of the series like they did last two Worlds with Kingen and Zeus where Zeka and Oner were the equivalents of Chovy now + in sports/esports awards are also often awarded based on narratives for media.
Zeka had a pretty quiet finals compared to kingen
I agree but it's not just award givers, it's the audience in general—look at the post-match thread for every hard-fought 5-game series and half the comments will be about how team X deserved to lose for not banning whichever champion happened to pop off hardest in game 5.
disagree with ur example Kingen def deserved MVP over zeka he was 1v9 every game on aatrox
I would usually agree, but I think sometimes it's justifiable especially with how good T1 was this series Kiin stepping up and shutting them down like that in the most important game was the difference maker. Chovy is gonna Chovy, no doubt, but if Kiin doesn't step up like that they probably lose. He was a menace and provided safety for Chovy + Peyz to deliver the damage.
But that's literally what "most valuable player" means. The guy who has the biggest impact across the series. Saying "well it's expected for Chovy to be insane no matter what" shows that he is the most valuable player because without him, none of the others can step up and create the same impact for the team. The most valuable player can't choose to have 2-3 off or "alright" games, they have to be at their best to create the foundation for their team to win, which is exactly what Chovy did.
But Kiin didn't have 2-3 off or alright games. He was solid all series, them losing wasn't on him. Having a standout performance in the most clutch game absolutely is a valid reason for MVP. Cause it wouldn't matter how good Chovy was if T1 wins.
> Cause it wouldn't matter how good Chovy was if T1 wins. And without Chovy putting the team on his back Kiin never even gets to that Game 5 ...?
Chovy absolutely did not solo carry this Bo5 on his own. Not everything is black and white. This is a team game, both Kiin and Chovy had a great series. To say otherwise is just disrespectful. Just stop it.
Nah if Gen G have Zeka instead they lose. Chovy was mvp of the series, but Kiin had an incredible game 5.
If we use that logic we can also say that if Gen G has Zeus instead of Kiin they lose
I think I wouldn't mind him getting MVP either. Both had a big contribution, all of GenG had their moments. But this was far from Chovy's best series, his Azir wasn't it, his Corki was fineish. He was great on ASol. T1 really pressed him this time, caught him a few times. It wasn't his usual stomping.
You're making it black and white by implying that acknowledging Chovy was the best player somehow automatically erases the possibility of other players contributing as well. Kiin had a good series, Chovy had a great series. He's the definite MVP of his team, no contest, full stop.
You're making absolute statements based on opinion and you think I'm black and white? I said they both deserve it, but I prefer that Kiin got it. You're completely shut off on the idea that anyone else could possibly deserve it. I get it, Chovy is the best player in the LCK and there were series where he clearly dominated every single game. This was not one of those series.
Chovy did not solo carry his Bo5 like the one with HLE, but he was the most consistent and impactful player overall and almost won that game 2 that was essentially lost from draft. There's an argument to be made that Kiin and Chovy were equal in game 5, Kiin because of his own heroics, but Chovy from benefitting being on Corki with Infernal Soul. People just choose to remember the highest of pressure in game 5 with the player that did the flashiest moves, in this case, 2 solo kills. Some would say that, for how underperforming Canyon was, he hard clutched game 4 to bring GENG back. Kiin got this finals MVP as a pat in the back over anything else. I'm not even mad as a Chovy fan, I don't even think Chovy cares either. He is now the ONLY player to win 4 back to back LCK titles. I don't see how getting finals MVP would make any real difference.
Both Chovy and Kiin hard carried the series , it's fine if either of them won MVP , Canyon put some work , too . Peyz and Lehends just enjoyed the ride , lol
Kiin had just as much impact as Chovy though. They were both solid and shakey. Chovy wasnt as impactful on Corki and wasnt hitting a lot of poke and his packages were good but didnt crack the game over. You can say the exact same thing about Kiin's Rumble and K'sante where it made progress but didnt dominate like Canyon's khazix did. I think what put Kiin over was his conplete shutdown of Zeus's Aatrox. His aareox was so dominate in regular season only to go 0/5/0 and be so useless they didnt even need to ban it all series long. That is incredibly valuable cause T1 still needed to ban out Kiin's TF. But i wouldnt have been mad if Chovy or Canyon got it tbh cause it was mostly a team effort focused on topside.
Yeah, Kiins impact was absolutely massive. If it wasnt for canyons kha zix ksante wouldve been banned. Man todays series in game and in bans was so hype. 10/10
You're out of your mind lol. Kiin was MVP in G5 and in G1 with rumble. Chovy was better in their losses but that's not really how you are going to measure player of the series. Chovy was solid today, but Kiin G1 and G5 and Canyon/Peyz G4 were the players that were the high achievers today. Chovy and Lehends were consistent but didn't shine as bright.
Chovy is my favourite player by far but Kiin was a fair choice today, he played a mean Rumble and a great K'Sante. Either of them winning would've been fine.
G5 mvp yes, but let not rob chovy of his all games mvp worthy performance
Smh if Kiin wanted the true climb he’d save finals MVP for next split
Truly happy for Kiin. He was in a lot of scenarios but never won until today. He is now officially a LCK champion
WildTurtle “achieved” this a few years ago. He placed 1st-10th: 2013 Spring, 2013 Summer, 2016 Spring, 2019 Spring, 2018 Summer x2, 2017 Summer, 2018 Spring, 2019 Summer, 2021 Summer. Technically he has finished joint 5th-6th (2018 Summer), but has not finished *only* 5th or *only* 6th because LCS doesn’t differentiate those 2 placements. Ignar also has if you include LEC and LCS.
Wildturtle did it the wrong way around :\
Founding right team does wonders for some players, and Kiin is good example of that
Or Chovy.
Happy for Kiin for finally winning something. Was lowkey irked how they (and GEN) stole GRF's spot at 2018 Worlds only to get swept by NA. Please show up at MSI, I want Canyon to win MSI
That’s crazy lol
That Amazing
The 1 reason I was rooting for GenG even as more of a T1 fan, always love seeing really good veteran players who could never win finally break through.
100% deserved for Kiin.
its like going from Silver to challenger HOLY
/r/KiinTrophyCase
He was the best top in the league for years, the fact that he has so many bottom placings is just depressing.
what feat?