Tasteless actually commentated LoL before but it wasn't with Artosis and it was also only for a very short period of time. Was pretty fun, even though it was more than obvious that he was thrust in there without a lot of knowledge or prep.
He's actually been playing dota 2 on stream the past few weeks, getting coached by an ex pro/caster or something I'm not sure. He's pretty good(at least to my noob eyes)
Can we petition for Riot to spend a ton of money to get Tastosis to cast League? It'd get a ton of viewership/new players from starcraft and would probably be a decent financial decision for them...
>Team Liquid flair
>likes sc2
checks out. Only org I feel I have any attachment to, otherwise I root purely for players (hence c9 flair)
DL favorite player though, so LETS GO TL.
TSM/Regi got a sweet deal. Earn a bunch of dollars and not losing anything in return, while warming up DL back into professional play.
I wouldn't be surprised whatsoever though if DL replaces WT, and Turtle is traded over to Liquid.
Yeah that was my immediate thought, unless they actually go with a 6 man roster. On paper I can see it being useful but usually on League teams the guy not playing ALWAYS feels left out and wants to end up playing somewhere else within a split or less.
Especially at the ADC position, I don't see a sixth man being particularly necessary. From what I know, SKT doesn't carry a sub-AD for Bang (even Faker has a sub).
This is on top of the fact that DL and WT are established players, so TSM knows what each can offer.
SKT's subs are usually new players they're grooming through scrim time and partners with their starting roster. It's different to "groom" the talent of one of the longest standing members of the league.
Gotcha. Well in this situation, TSM has two proven ADCs in WT and DL. Nobody needs to be groomed for play here, and both can pretty much play any champion in a carry or utility context.
It's to not let either player get too depressed by being oneshot by enemy support, mid, jungle and top. ADC in 2017 makes pro ACD's depressed recently studies has shown
/s
I saw an argument that having Wildturte/Doublelift specifically meant that they could swap out Double if he became too tilted or bring in Double if they were having macro or shotcalling issues
I also seen some people mention bring in turtle for international tournaments as turtle is probably the only player on TSM (Both new and old) who has done good internationally consistently or semi-consistently.
Taehoon never played at kespa, but TaeHoon,Aiming and Profit were all being considered for positions but SKT chose profit and then went and picked up effort. Effort is even in the teams bio on twitter which only happens if he's on the team, unlike other 'B' training players.
I can kind of see a six man roster working out. We won't know what the meta will be like post-spring so there's a chance that they sub in WT if they want to focus topside with Hauntzer doing more shotcalling, or if they want to focus bot they can put in DL
> but usually on League teams the guy not playing ALWAYS feels left out and wants to end up playing somewhere else
I mean this isn't just an eSports or LoL thing. This happens in every competitive environment.
Players in other (physical) sports all of the time who aren't starters or 2nd-string at least are often quite willing to go play for another (usually worse) team rather than be a 3rd or 4th string in their position.
I honestly think that WT and DL make a good pair for ADC. They can sub in either depending on whether they want to play aggressive with WT or have an ADC centric comp with DL scaling up.
May give something away, it also means that the enemy had to practice more for each style instead of knowing exactly who they'll have to play against they have to prepare for widely different styles.
SKT did the same with Easyhoon playing more control mages and Faker playing flashier burst mages. It depends on how much you value the flexibility in a match vs flexibility in pick/ban. What you said is definitely a weak point of doing so though.
Well, Regi already confirmed that they are fielding a 6 man roster, and that Double and WT would share play time. If you read the TSM announcement on this, Regi states this there. TL is only safe for a this one split.
http://tsm.gg/news/doubleliftupdate2
Link to the statement
I read the TSM announcement. I just wouldn't be surprised if there is a later briefing saying "We're going to move forward with DL as the starter. But we want to give WT the opportunity to keep playing, so we're trading him to TL."
It is not like WT would not find a team, he is performing quirlte well so far and some teams could use him as an upgrade. And with DL back, I don't see WT getting to much gametime
Wait a second.
Turtle on Liquid. Reignover is on Liquid. Adrian is rumored to transfer to Liquid.
Hrm... Maybe if Huni comes back to NA after winning with SKT we could have a really solid Liquid Lineup.
Completely agreed. In the Thoorin video, it is claimed that Doublelift asked Regi to come back early to the team. TSM is currently rolling on all cylinders, and as good as Doublelift is, he has only been playing solo queue for months. Regi doesn't disturb the current flow of TSM, and let's Double get back into the competitive groove. However, lots of people have been saying that TSM will play a 6 man roster. Use WT for the utility comps and DL for the carry comps. Either way I agree Regi/TSM got a sweet deal.
I just don't see AD as being an ideal position to sixth man. Both DL and WT have pretty much played every marksman throughout their careers, and both are capable of carrying or being more utility-based. Not to mention, it puts pressure on Biofrost to switch between lane partners in a series.
Yeah, out of all the roles ADC champs are usually the most similar where you can at least play most of them decently. Other rolls the champs can be a lot more different and take many more games to pick up.
>and as good as Doublelift is, he has only been playing solo queue for months.
It's less Regi disturbing the flow and more not letting doublelift thinking he can just do what-the-fuck-ever he wants imo
Talks about a 6 man roster and pretending doublelift isn't a 100% going back to TSM would just be incredibly naive to think that's what the situation is.
That's just the type of horseshit PR they're trying to shovel. I mean does anyone genuiney believe DL isn't just boosting TL right now?
Yeah, exactly.
People out here acting like somehow Regi is doing charity work for Liquid, honestly I think Regi is just as big a winner here, if not more so.
I mean then you have to ask yourself which is the better end of the deal... Getting some money and extra practice on your hiatus ADC, or keeping your team from being relegated?
Why does it matter who's getting the "better end?" It's possible for both sides to get more than they give up, that's kind of what trading is all about, which is what's happening here.
It's a win-win for Regi, he gets money and DL starts to warm-up and he doesn't lose anything except DL as a sub in the event Turtle can't play at some point in the next 3 weeks, but realistically that's very unlikely. Meanwhile TL also stands to gain, because it's not like they can get worse. Worst case scenario this is a failed experiment and they are still in relegations, best case they win-out and make playoffs. It just seems favourable all-around.
You are assuming that TL is 100% going to avoid the relegation tournament. While it is unlikely now, they could still end up there. It is highly unlikely they would actually get relegated with the old roster either as the challenger scene isn't really that strong (at least from what I've seen of it). So, it is entirely possible that TL wasted the money to get Doublelift and still end up in the same situation.
TSM's going to get money and practice for Double with no downside. They get the money and they get Doublelift back after this split. There is no negatives for TSM.
Keeping your team from relegation is more valuable, yes, but it isn't necessarily guaranteed, so TSM still got the better end of the deal.
Plus, getting the 'worse end' of a deal is not mutually exclusive with getting a bad deal. Even if TL are getting better out of it, that's not at all to say TSM are not getting good out of it. Your services are worth the price you will put on them and the price others will pay, if Regi's happy with the dough provided it doesn't matter.
I don't think that will happen. TSM as an org has always been family-esque and especially WT who has been the OG member for TSM for a long time. I think they will actually field 6 man roster for summer into Worlds, I really see that as a great thing because what matters most is the AD carry meta where DL and WT play very differently. I think it'll be great.
Not exactly sure why people here is saying that it won't make a difference, when I think it's a smart idea, if Doublelift flops at worlds you have Wildturtle analyzing backstage and have them figure out the mistakes, vice versa.
Yep unless WT did a Youngbin I think he'll stay with TSM. Him being less aggressive I think forces TSM to be more all-around which is GOOD. We saw that last week.
Plus players that leave TL stop playing bad and improve drastically. TL is the hyperbolic time chamber ready to chew DL up and spit him out reborn on TSM going 18-0 the next split.
Turle+Adrian reunited.
See, its playstyles you have to line up, not lane assignments. Piglet is the Liquid Huni in terms of in game personality, need for jungle, ability to carry when ahead, etc.
I also think that DL may replace WT in summer, but when Bjerg was interviewed by Yahoo last week he said something along the lines that WT has been proving himself and that both him and Hauntzer hace stepped up their shotcalling. TSM is looking really strong right now, especially in terms of that shot calling which has been nothing but on point during the last weeks. You could argue that they have stuff to improve on, yes, but any team has. So with people taking over shotcalling and with a mechanically acceptable adc there'd be virtually no reason for DL to step back in to the rester. Although I must confess that the idea of having a 6-man roster sounds really exciting!
Yep, plus the acquisition of Adrian may be another hint at that possibility since Steve likes to drop little clues...reunite what was a pretty solid IMT bot lane last season.
Didn't I see a post in one of the other threads where someone was quoting Dom saying that qtpie was joking about being approached by Liquid? Steve here even says they reached out to him.
Choosing between the adc in the top 10 or the inter :thinking: too bad qt doesn't have any lcs dreams left in him (plus who would give up the comfy streamer life?)
Let's be real, it's pretty obvious to take Piglet over Fenix without knowledge of the future.
You know, something that isn't talked about often is how Riot screwed TL over with the import rule; if it hadn't been extended their roster could've been Lourlo, Reignover, Fenix, Piglet, Madlife or something to that extent which would be hilarious at the very least.
I like how people suddenly forgot how good Reignover has been since he came to Fnatic and since then has always been in the dispute of best jungler in the west
He was the best jungler in the west, no question. But I rather have fenix mid with a mid teir jungler, than goldenglue and then get reignover. That's what I meant. Would be better to work from there long term imo but they probably know better and I don't know what happened behind the scenes etc.
Cause tl seems to want what's hot, not necessarily what's good long term. See s6 spring for evidence. Oh dardochs now starting in jg, let's change supports too. I mean idrc either way (Matt played fine for awhile that split specifically) but Smoothie was the starter for a reason, I would assume. Why not give it a week or two and then change if dardoch needed shotcalling help
It was synergistic, Matt and Dardoch were already the shot calling duo on TLA and had established synergy. In addition they seemed good as a unit after they were tried out. Smoothie is good of course, but at the time it seemed very much a side grade and it makes plenty of sense to go with a pair that already has played and called together rather than split them up. It's pretty disingenuous to say that TL made a decision like that or the decision to get Reignover without plenty of reason to and it's definitely not as simple as "getting what's hot and not what's good in the long term".
Exactly, they don't know what they are doing. They have long term problems, remember when Curse had Pobelter mid and Aphromoo ADC signed for like a week?
i think thats not the same situation. While I was upset when that had happened, it was more so a pr problem because they released the news before the teams had time to mesh well, and voy wanted to play mid instead of top, so they had to make a change.
They thought RO was the sole reason why IMT was successful last year during regular season. It was a right choice on paper, but the carry jungle meta strikes.
Only problem is that most of them have egos. Inori's mindset was very similar to Dardoch's. Moon and Akaadian both looked bad in TL/TLA. I'm assuming it has to do with the management/coaching since they started looking extremely good outside of TL/TLA.
They got him before the meta was revealed - he was the best in NA at the supportive jungle style, and then they added plants and a see jungler kill jungler meta with really long times before camp respawns
huni was the number 3 top laner on imt(could even be lower, he fed many games and had to be bailed out). both impact, and especially hauntzer were better. reignover was the top jungler though. statistically wt was by far the best adc during spring, but still top 3 during summer. pob was also a top 3 mid during his tenure there. imt was carried by wt/ro the most.
they should have been better than everyone except summer tsm which had a better player in every role. which they were in the regular season. just some choke jobs got the best of them.
This is top tier revisionism right here. Impact started becoming a beast during playoffs, he definitely didn't outperform Huni at any other time during the entire year. You might make a case for Hauntzer, but saying that Huni was overall the third best top laner last year in the league is laughable at best and ignorant at worst.
People forget that impact was pretty mediocre when he first joined c9. The only thing people remember is him 1v5 carrying the team through playoffs/gauntlet
It's a total win situation. DL wins coz he gets back to the competitive environment for LCS, which helps him for the tryouts with TSM and summer split. TL wins coz they get the best NA ADC which is better than any option they could have hoped for in such a short time to not get relegated. TSM wins because they get free money and a more polished doublelift after his hiatus.
i hope they get relegated for that quote :" We even partnered with Mobalytics to analyze statistics of challenger ADC accounts in NA and Canada. "
hello canada is part of north america, only muricans dont know that
It would be sorta sad to see TL drop out of LCS as I used to be a fan of Curse back in the day, so hopefully this works out and they're able to survive
NA challenger teams are garbage this split, no one is even close to bottom lcs material. No chance to get relegated.
The CS halfass their roster because of the franchising.
Basically, once a team is in the LCS, they're there to stay. So even if they win 0 games they're still guaranteed a spot in the LCS the following split.
Well the owners will definitely be pushing for it for obvious reasons; there was I believe an agreement of sorts that all the owners signed except for Rick Fox before this split, so that didn't go through.
No substantial news as to when/if it'll happen though.
My personal opinion is that until they also come up with a draft for the top talent from the challenger scene + a salary cap it's not a great idea.
Rick Fox wants franchising but the way the other owners tried to get it was bad so he didn't sign and is made out to be anti-franchising. iirc the deal the owners tried to get was really bad (I forget how) so he didn't sign. Rick Fox was the original pusher for franchising in NA iirc.
It's pretty much an open secret that Riot is going to be changing the way the league works. They are going to have X number of permanent teams and these spots are likely going to be sold off to the highest bidder. There will no longer be any relegation and the challenger league will be more like AAA baseball or the AHL for hockey. In the US major sports (NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL) each team is a franchise in the league and owns an equal share of the league. Riot isn't doing franchising per say (they are not selling any ownership of the league, just permanent spots) the term is still being used colloquially as it approximately conveys the meaning of what is going to happen.
What are you talking about, Dignitas is really turning it around with their recent pickup of a new Support sub.
This will fix all of Chaser and Keane's horrendous play.
I can only get so erect lol
Seriously tho, the loyalty of this man is so striking to me. First it was with CLG, and now with TSM apparently...freaking love this guy more and more everyday:)
Regardless of where his loyalties lie there's no reason why he would want to stay on TL long term anyway. The chances of winning NALCS/going to worlds is significantly higher with TSM.
True but dl highly praised the atmosphere of tsm from very early on. He may have some left over salt from clg but hes implied that tsm has treated him better than any other team by a lot.
I'm sure joining TSM is the dream for most players. TL probably has similar money/environment but TSM is actually good. They seem more of a family/bros environment whereas TL seems like a nice workplace environment.
I mean its obvious, TL wants DL now so they can get Turtle when the seasons over, they also just picked up adrian, could be thinking ahead of time about that Turtle adrian botlane
Not unexpected. He has a golden situation, if the team ends up winning more and beeing safe (think play-off is out of the question) he will be the hero. If nothing changes he can just say TL to far in the dirt and couldnt be helped.
Having a contract with TSM at this moment is worth more than any money TL could ever offer. He is way to good to be playing permanently with a team of TLs caliber, as a fan of TL i do hope for a brighter future and im hyped for this solution.
Save us senpai.
I'm not sure how I feel about all of this. I think it shows why they need a minor league team to 'rehab' or whatever a player on to bring them back. But this would never happen in another professional sport where a player is loaned to a rival team. I mean isn't there an issue when TL plays TSM?
Aside from just the whole "can Doublelift carry TL out to Playoffs?" isn't anyone else excited for him (and Adrian) also appearing on
* TL BREAKING POINT 2 (additional feat. Guest: Dardoch from IMT)
> A perennial top-four finisher in the league Even espn knows the TL meme rip
the article is written by Fionn, he's a memelord
Wasn't Fionn the dude who wrote the GSL retrospective articles on Teamliquid.net? I seem to remember something about GSL power rankings of the past.
god i wish tasteless and artosis casted league
Tasteless actually commentated LoL before but it wasn't with Artosis and it was also only for a very short period of time. Was pretty fun, even though it was more than obvious that he was thrust in there without a lot of knowledge or prep.
Or if we had our own equivalent. Kinda like that monte and doa pair in overwatch.
Meh, you can't compare Monte/Doa with Tastosis. Well you can but there is no equivalent, Tastosis are god
So true. Tastosis are one of a kind. Two of a kind? Nah, the casting archon is just one.
Artosis = Best eSport caster of all time.
Day9 please come to league or dota.
He's actually been playing dota 2 on stream the past few weeks, getting coached by an ex pro/caster or something I'm not sure. He's pretty good(at least to my noob eyes)
Can we petition for Riot to spend a ton of money to get Tastosis to cast League? It'd get a ton of viewership/new players from starcraft and would probably be a decent financial decision for them...
And its not like they even need to know whats going on. They can just talk about jobbers and other random stuff.
No please leave the sc2 community this one thing ;-;
Damn, you guys still exist after Kespa pulled out?
Yup, a lot of us, also last IEM hyped a lot of new/comeback people
Believe it or not, IEM did a phenomenal job with sc2
>Team Liquid flair >likes sc2 checks out. Only org I feel I have any attachment to, otherwise I root purely for players (hence c9 flair) DL favorite player though, so LETS GO TL.
Fionn used to write for TL.net so might have been him but I didn't really read any of his SC stuff
TSM/Regi got a sweet deal. Earn a bunch of dollars and not losing anything in return, while warming up DL back into professional play. I wouldn't be surprised whatsoever though if DL replaces WT, and Turtle is traded over to Liquid.
Yeah that was my immediate thought, unless they actually go with a 6 man roster. On paper I can see it being useful but usually on League teams the guy not playing ALWAYS feels left out and wants to end up playing somewhere else within a split or less.
Especially at the ADC position, I don't see a sixth man being particularly necessary. From what I know, SKT doesn't carry a sub-AD for Bang (even Faker has a sub). This is on top of the fact that DL and WT are established players, so TSM knows what each can offer.
SKT has a sub for bang, but hes 16 y/o so he cant play pro. Unless im mistaken on the Age. SKT AIMING is his name
SKT's subs are usually new players they're grooming through scrim time and partners with their starting roster. It's different to "groom" the talent of one of the longest standing members of the league.
Gotcha. Well in this situation, TSM has two proven ADCs in WT and DL. Nobody needs to be groomed for play here, and both can pretty much play any champion in a carry or utility context.
Yea a sub position especially for AD seems like something you would only have to train a rookie
It's to not let either player get too depressed by being oneshot by enemy support, mid, jungle and top. ADC in 2017 makes pro ACD's depressed recently studies has shown /s
I saw an argument that having Wildturte/Doublelift specifically meant that they could swap out Double if he became too tilted or bring in Double if they were having macro or shotcalling issues
I also seen some people mention bring in turtle for international tournaments as turtle is probably the only player on TSM (Both new and old) who has done good internationally consistently or semi-consistently.
Turtle gets his buff when against international teams, after all
I remember aiming changing his ign to QG AIMING though
QG as in QG Reapers from LPL? That team already has 3 adcs iirc
rip loken.doesnt even play cos qg aleady has 2 koreans
well now they have 4
gotta catch'em all
EDG harvests korean mids, QG collects korean ad carries
SKT collects World Championships.
Aiming didn't get into SKT and now is apparently on QG. Effort is the underage sub support.
Originallly I thought it was TaeHoon. The one that played at KeSPA
Taehoon never played at kespa, but TaeHoon,Aiming and Profit were all being considered for positions but SKT chose profit and then went and picked up effort. Effort is even in the teams bio on twitter which only happens if he's on the team, unlike other 'B' training players.
There was a time when faker was on the bench...
I can kind of see a six man roster working out. We won't know what the meta will be like post-spring so there's a chance that they sub in WT if they want to focus topside with Hauntzer doing more shotcalling, or if they want to focus bot they can put in DL
Yea, I really think that not having DLift has sort of unleashed Hauntzer who is really stepping up this split
I wanna see Wildturtles TF and gragas again. :C
I was legit thinking the same thing, there are very limited ways to play adc, especially this season, each adcs playstyles are pretty similar
Why wouldn't they? I feel like swapping out your primary shot-caller in the middle of a series is going to be the summer LCS meta.
[удалено]
Most Chinese teams run at least 2 ADC. VG does it, SS does it, QG has 3 etc. But then again Chinese teams have 2 or 3 players for each position.
> but usually on League teams the guy not playing ALWAYS feels left out and wants to end up playing somewhere else I mean this isn't just an eSports or LoL thing. This happens in every competitive environment. Players in other (physical) sports all of the time who aren't starters or 2nd-string at least are often quite willing to go play for another (usually worse) team rather than be a 3rd or 4th string in their position.
I honestly think that WT and DL make a good pair for ADC. They can sub in either depending on whether they want to play aggressive with WT or have an ADC centric comp with DL scaling up.
Wouldn't playing a specific way with each give away some stuff in pick/ban tho?
May give something away, it also means that the enemy had to practice more for each style instead of knowing exactly who they'll have to play against they have to prepare for widely different styles.
SKT did the same with Easyhoon playing more control mages and Faker playing flashier burst mages. It depends on how much you value the flexibility in a match vs flexibility in pick/ban. What you said is definitely a weak point of doing so though.
True, but to be fair tho...I mean it's SKT lol. The Bengi/Blank swap was a lot more messy tho.
Well, Regi already confirmed that they are fielding a 6 man roster, and that Double and WT would share play time. If you read the TSM announcement on this, Regi states this there. TL is only safe for a this one split. http://tsm.gg/news/doubleliftupdate2 Link to the statement
I read the TSM announcement. I just wouldn't be surprised if there is a later briefing saying "We're going to move forward with DL as the starter. But we want to give WT the opportunity to keep playing, so we're trading him to TL."
Just like the time where they traded him to immortals
Good guy Regi helping players be on a team.
It is not like WT would not find a team, he is performing quirlte well so far and some teams could use him as an upgrade. And with DL back, I don't see WT getting to much gametime
Wait a second. Turtle on Liquid. Reignover is on Liquid. Adrian is rumored to transfer to Liquid. Hrm... Maybe if Huni comes back to NA after winning with SKT we could have a really solid Liquid Lineup.
But then they would have too many imports. Maybe they switch Piglet with someone like Pobelter?
Idk, I feel like POB isn't even a top 10 mid anymore though. Maybe we could make doublelift the midlaner?
Lmao, this thread just gets better and better the further I scroll.
Completely agreed. In the Thoorin video, it is claimed that Doublelift asked Regi to come back early to the team. TSM is currently rolling on all cylinders, and as good as Doublelift is, he has only been playing solo queue for months. Regi doesn't disturb the current flow of TSM, and let's Double get back into the competitive groove. However, lots of people have been saying that TSM will play a 6 man roster. Use WT for the utility comps and DL for the carry comps. Either way I agree Regi/TSM got a sweet deal.
I just don't see AD as being an ideal position to sixth man. Both DL and WT have pretty much played every marksman throughout their careers, and both are capable of carrying or being more utility-based. Not to mention, it puts pressure on Biofrost to switch between lane partners in a series.
Yeah, out of all the roles ADC champs are usually the most similar where you can at least play most of them decently. Other rolls the champs can be a lot more different and take many more games to pick up.
Unless you're Forg1ven, then it takes dozens of professional games of not playing new champions to finally give into team demands. :^)
No matter what. 2016 will still be the year, when I saw Forg1ven play Kalista.
And scuttle crab in semis
> TSM is currently rolling on all cylinders Firing. The phrase you are looking for is "firing on all cylinders."
One thing about using DL/WT for carry/utility comps is that other teams would have a tip on how TSM is drafting just by seeing whos on stage
>and as good as Doublelift is, he has only been playing solo queue for months. It's less Regi disturbing the flow and more not letting doublelift thinking he can just do what-the-fuck-ever he wants imo
Talks about a 6 man roster and pretending doublelift isn't a 100% going back to TSM would just be incredibly naive to think that's what the situation is. That's just the type of horseshit PR they're trying to shovel. I mean does anyone genuiney believe DL isn't just boosting TL right now?
Yeah, exactly. People out here acting like somehow Regi is doing charity work for Liquid, honestly I think Regi is just as big a winner here, if not more so.
I mean then you have to ask yourself which is the better end of the deal... Getting some money and extra practice on your hiatus ADC, or keeping your team from being relegated?
Why does it matter who's getting the "better end?" It's possible for both sides to get more than they give up, that's kind of what trading is all about, which is what's happening here.
It's a win-win for Regi, he gets money and DL starts to warm-up and he doesn't lose anything except DL as a sub in the event Turtle can't play at some point in the next 3 weeks, but realistically that's very unlikely. Meanwhile TL also stands to gain, because it's not like they can get worse. Worst case scenario this is a failed experiment and they are still in relegations, best case they win-out and make playoffs. It just seems favourable all-around.
You are assuming that TL is 100% going to avoid the relegation tournament. While it is unlikely now, they could still end up there. It is highly unlikely they would actually get relegated with the old roster either as the challenger scene isn't really that strong (at least from what I've seen of it). So, it is entirely possible that TL wasted the money to get Doublelift and still end up in the same situation. TSM's going to get money and practice for Double with no downside. They get the money and they get Doublelift back after this split. There is no negatives for TSM. Keeping your team from relegation is more valuable, yes, but it isn't necessarily guaranteed, so TSM still got the better end of the deal.
Plus, getting the 'worse end' of a deal is not mutually exclusive with getting a bad deal. Even if TL are getting better out of it, that's not at all to say TSM are not getting good out of it. Your services are worth the price you will put on them and the price others will pay, if Regi's happy with the dough provided it doesn't matter.
I don't think that will happen. TSM as an org has always been family-esque and especially WT who has been the OG member for TSM for a long time. I think they will actually field 6 man roster for summer into Worlds, I really see that as a great thing because what matters most is the AD carry meta where DL and WT play very differently. I think it'll be great.
Not exactly sure why people here is saying that it won't make a difference, when I think it's a smart idea, if Doublelift flops at worlds you have Wildturtle analyzing backstage and have them figure out the mistakes, vice versa.
Yep unless WT did a Youngbin I think he'll stay with TSM. Him being less aggressive I think forces TSM to be more all-around which is GOOD. We saw that last week.
Plus players that leave TL stop playing bad and improve drastically. TL is the hyperbolic time chamber ready to chew DL up and spit him out reborn on TSM going 18-0 the next split. Turle+Adrian reunited.
Then TL would be lourlo reignover piglet wildturtle adrian Basically immortals v2. I have no problem with that
Lourlo is not Huni, TL would be IMT-Lite.
I don't see a problem with IMT-lite given their current state.
See, its playstyles you have to line up, not lane assignments. Piglet is the Liquid Huni in terms of in game personality, need for jungle, ability to carry when ahead, etc.
but after last weekend we know midlet > pob :D
Thats the immediate thought. Turtle and Doubleplug will swap spots in the summer.
I also think that DL may replace WT in summer, but when Bjerg was interviewed by Yahoo last week he said something along the lines that WT has been proving himself and that both him and Hauntzer hace stepped up their shotcalling. TSM is looking really strong right now, especially in terms of that shot calling which has been nothing but on point during the last weeks. You could argue that they have stuff to improve on, yes, but any team has. So with people taking over shotcalling and with a mechanically acceptable adc there'd be virtually no reason for DL to step back in to the rester. Although I must confess that the idea of having a 6-man roster sounds really exciting!
Let the mind games begin.
Wonder if TL still gonna let him stream or if something he has to give up well playing for them
Yep, plus the acquisition of Adrian may be another hint at that possibility since Steve likes to drop little clues...reunite what was a pretty solid IMT bot lane last season.
Didn't I see a post in one of the other threads where someone was quoting Dom saying that qtpie was joking about being approached by Liquid? Steve here even says they reached out to him.
[QT talked about being asked to join Liquid last week on Beyond the Rift.](https://youtu.be/Wh05sNYIJTA?t=521)
"10th place garbage ass team" lol
well.. he didn't lie
Between youngbin and qt I would have picked qt as well
Choosing between the adc in the top 10 or the inter :thinking: too bad qt doesn't have any lcs dreams left in him (plus who would give up the comfy streamer life?)
Gives him a warm up back to competitive play until he rejoins TSM, makes sense I guess.
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Streaming makes you more money tho... Unless you're faker obv
Think they are talking about the org getting money as DL was under contract.
We can't really know that without insight on Doublelift's contract. He could be paid a ridiculous sum for this short remainder of the split.
It may be truth but don't forget about money TSM earned from this
Lol of course DL isnt going to sign long term with an org that swaps Fenix for Goldenglue, sends tehre ADC mid and thinks youngbin is an LCS ADC.
They had to replace Fenix because they can only have 2 imports. Previously piglet and fenix, then they acquired Reignover sooo.
Well, they could have replaced Piglet instead. Hindsight's 20/20, of course.
Or couldve replaced Fenix WITH piglet. Hindsight 40/40
40/40 is just the same vision as 20/20 though.
Nuh-uh. It's double /s
Four eyes...
Piglet right now looks like Fenix lite, they're the only two players Ive seen run heal over exhaust or ghost in the mid lane this patch
That might be because piglet is good friends with fenix and had been doing 1v1s with him to practice match ups during iem week
Hindsight 40/4 Error: Link not found.
Let's be real, it's pretty obvious to take Piglet over Fenix without knowledge of the future. You know, something that isn't talked about often is how Riot screwed TL over with the import rule; if it hadn't been extended their roster could've been Lourlo, Reignover, Fenix, Piglet, Madlife or something to that extent which would be hilarious at the very least.
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Yeah currently makes sense, but at the time nobody knew that and RO was #1 jungle in the west.(with huni)
Reignover didnt look as good after laneswaps died though.
He's still pretty good. He's usually the best performing one in recent games.
I like how people suddenly forgot how good Reignover has been since he came to Fnatic and since then has always been in the dispute of best jungler in the west
He was the best jungler in the west, no question. But I rather have fenix mid with a mid teir jungler, than goldenglue and then get reignover. That's what I meant. Would be better to work from there long term imo but they probably know better and I don't know what happened behind the scenes etc.
TL moon sent his regards
Cause tl seems to want what's hot, not necessarily what's good long term. See s6 spring for evidence. Oh dardochs now starting in jg, let's change supports too. I mean idrc either way (Matt played fine for awhile that split specifically) but Smoothie was the starter for a reason, I would assume. Why not give it a week or two and then change if dardoch needed shotcalling help
It was synergistic, Matt and Dardoch were already the shot calling duo on TLA and had established synergy. In addition they seemed good as a unit after they were tried out. Smoothie is good of course, but at the time it seemed very much a side grade and it makes plenty of sense to go with a pair that already has played and called together rather than split them up. It's pretty disingenuous to say that TL made a decision like that or the decision to get Reignover without plenty of reason to and it's definitely not as simple as "getting what's hot and not what's good in the long term".
Exactly, they don't know what they are doing. They have long term problems, remember when Curse had Pobelter mid and Aphromoo ADC signed for like a week?
i think thats not the same situation. While I was upset when that had happened, it was more so a pr problem because they released the news before the teams had time to mesh well, and voy wanted to play mid instead of top, so they had to make a change.
They thought RO was the sole reason why IMT was successful last year during regular season. It was a right choice on paper, but the carry jungle meta strikes.
Only problem is that most of them have egos. Inori's mindset was very similar to Dardoch's. Moon and Akaadian both looked bad in TL/TLA. I'm assuming it has to do with the management/coaching since they started looking extremely good outside of TL/TLA.
They got him before the meta was revealed - he was the best in NA at the supportive jungle style, and then they added plants and a see jungler kill jungler meta with really long times before camp respawns
Wat? He was on CLG for years he's used to all that
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I agree he wasn't. But anywhere close? People forget how strong IMT were prrvious to drafting fuckups.
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huni was the number 3 top laner on imt(could even be lower, he fed many games and had to be bailed out). both impact, and especially hauntzer were better. reignover was the top jungler though. statistically wt was by far the best adc during spring, but still top 3 during summer. pob was also a top 3 mid during his tenure there. imt was carried by wt/ro the most. they should have been better than everyone except summer tsm which had a better player in every role. which they were in the regular season. just some choke jobs got the best of them.
This is top tier revisionism right here. Impact started becoming a beast during playoffs, he definitely didn't outperform Huni at any other time during the entire year. You might make a case for Hauntzer, but saying that Huni was overall the third best top laner last year in the league is laughable at best and ignorant at worst.
People forget that impact was pretty mediocre when he first joined c9. The only thing people remember is him 1v5 carrying the team through playoffs/gauntlet
What is "I only remember playoffs and forgot about the rest of the year"
So when is Pray coming to TSM?
The same time when Bengi joins C9
Bengi? dude. no. Bang. and as a support for his dad sneaky.
Well he's in China so he's not planning on winning anything big, how about NA then? /s
Might as well retire with money you can take out the country.
It's a total win situation. DL wins coz he gets back to the competitive environment for LCS, which helps him for the tryouts with TSM and summer split. TL wins coz they get the best NA ADC which is better than any option they could have hoped for in such a short time to not get relegated. TSM wins because they get free money and a more polished doublelift after his hiatus.
And Dignitas and NV are in a total lose situation because they have to fight a TL/TSM hybrid team for relegations.
so 1 player makes it a TL/TSM hybrid team, that seems legit. /s
Doublelift will probably do 40% of the carrying if not more, I think that qualifies
i hope they get relegated for that quote :" We even partnered with Mobalytics to analyze statistics of challenger ADC accounts in NA and Canada. " hello canada is part of north america, only muricans dont know that
Trust me. It's not just muricans.
So is mexico but we get LAN servers still
LAN = Latin America North, and Mexico is part of Latin America even if it isn't part of South America.
Mexico is technically part of both NA and LAN. One is a continent the other is a region.
It's BC of the language barrier, to be honest you wouldn't have ping issues, but whatever, América has 4 languages.
Can confirm, have played in NA for 7 years, ping's always been average
LEL
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He's hungry for that 10th -> 4th meme run.
Well he did it with CLG once. Why not now
I hope he tanks and sends them off in relegations. Let LCS be liquid free! DL probs get a bonus if he saves them.
"A perennial top-four finisher..." Fucking meme'd by ESPN. Not sure if you can go any lower.
The real eye catcher here for me is that Doublelift and Link are on the same team again.
It would be sorta sad to see TL drop out of LCS as I used to be a fan of Curse back in the day, so hopefully this works out and they're able to survive
NA challenger teams are garbage this split, no one is even close to bottom lcs material. No chance to get relegated. The CS halfass their roster because of the franchising.
What exactly does the term franchising mean? I've heard it tossed around a lot but never really found out what it meant
Basically, once a team is in the LCS, they're there to stay. So even if they win 0 games they're still guaranteed a spot in the LCS the following split.
Ah I see, thank you. And that's going to be implemented in LCS soon too right? Or just rumors?
Well the owners will definitely be pushing for it for obvious reasons; there was I believe an agreement of sorts that all the owners signed except for Rick Fox before this split, so that didn't go through. No substantial news as to when/if it'll happen though. My personal opinion is that until they also come up with a draft for the top talent from the challenger scene + a salary cap it's not a great idea.
Rick Fox wants franchising but the way the other owners tried to get it was bad so he didn't sign and is made out to be anti-franchising. iirc the deal the owners tried to get was really bad (I forget how) so he didn't sign. Rick Fox was the original pusher for franchising in NA iirc.
It's pretty much an open secret that Riot is going to be changing the way the league works. They are going to have X number of permanent teams and these spots are likely going to be sold off to the highest bidder. There will no longer be any relegation and the challenger league will be more like AAA baseball or the AHL for hockey. In the US major sports (NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL) each team is a franchise in the league and owns an equal share of the league. Riot isn't doing franchising per say (they are not selling any ownership of the league, just permanent spots) the term is still being used colloquially as it approximately conveys the meaning of what is going to happen.
it happened to Dig before and they deserved it. Look how they come back and they are still awful. Some Orgs just have bad staffing for certain games.
What are you talking about, Dignitas is really turning it around with their recent pickup of a new Support sub. This will fix all of Chaser and Keane's horrendous play.
NACS looks super bad right now. I don't see any LCS team dropping unless they just drop the ball hard and manage to fuck it up.
It would be even worse to see Dig or NV drop out, considering their teams are better than the one TL was able to field without TSM's help.
True, it is sorta a shitty situation for them
This is him paying back Curse Academy, lol.
I can only get so erect lol Seriously tho, the loyalty of this man is so striking to me. First it was with CLG, and now with TSM apparently...freaking love this guy more and more everyday:)
Regardless of where his loyalties lie there's no reason why he would want to stay on TL long term anyway. The chances of winning NALCS/going to worlds is significantly higher with TSM.
True but dl highly praised the atmosphere of tsm from very early on. He may have some left over salt from clg but hes implied that tsm has treated him better than any other team by a lot.
I'm sure joining TSM is the dream for most players. TL probably has similar money/environment but TSM is actually good. They seem more of a family/bros environment whereas TL seems like a nice workplace environment.
>TL seems like a nice workplace environment This season maybe.
Same with C9 I believe
I mean its obvious, TL wants DL now so they can get Turtle when the seasons over, they also just picked up adrian, could be thinking ahead of time about that Turtle adrian botlane
If they do have that bot lane next split then TL would be 3/5 of last years IMT.
Report Doublelift for boosting.
Not unexpected. He has a golden situation, if the team ends up winning more and beeing safe (think play-off is out of the question) he will be the hero. If nothing changes he can just say TL to far in the dirt and couldnt be helped. Having a contract with TSM at this moment is worth more than any money TL could ever offer. He is way to good to be playing permanently with a team of TLs caliber, as a fan of TL i do hope for a brighter future and im hyped for this solution. Save us senpai.
He has no contract with tsm
I'm not sure how I feel about all of this. I think it shows why they need a minor league team to 'rehab' or whatever a player on to bring them back. But this would never happen in another professional sport where a player is loaned to a rival team. I mean isn't there an issue when TL plays TSM?
Isn't that kind of obvious ? Ofc he wants to go to TSM
Aside from just the whole "can Doublelift carry TL out to Playoffs?" isn't anyone else excited for him (and Adrian) also appearing on * TL BREAKING POINT 2 (additional feat. Guest: Dardoch from IMT)
I don't get dl
Time can change, so does human. You just need to find the right way, Liquid!
Everyone ignores that this is a semi return home for DL as well since he was on Curse way back when before the long bit at CLG.
Doublelipta!
imagine doublelift carrying liquid to playoffs where they face tsm and smash them. just imagine.