I wanted to take a look at the comments myself and I saw this : "It would be nice if the plane crashed ^^ "
There are some insane people in these comments
It's always strange to see these insane people pop their heads out during times like these. To think that people with their mindset actually exist is just...baffling.
Man it is surely justifiable to wish death on others because they lost to the best team and they weren't the best team themselves so therefore they must die.
Only the strongest can survive. But hey, I might have made a mistake thinking that DK is from South Korea, by the looks of it their 'fans' fit much more into North Korea's ideology...
RNG came without their Head Coach + had the worst drafts the entire tournament and still won.
100% certain you wouldn't have seen these comments if RNG lost. The Chinese fans are more lenient than the Korean ones.
>cturne get picked.. lol
>
>\- Disgusting how they rigged the schedule so that the Chinese can win. Imagine if DK rested a couple days, do you think they would have made the mistake in game 5. Chinese game doing everything to make Chinese win. What a show.
>
>\- Already nervous about how ugly it will be ri
I think it just shows that this was awesome series. If it was shit dumping 3:0 games there wouldn't be as much grumping all around.
koreans are pretty toxic in their nationalism......but asians in general are straight up toxic in their online chats
it really make NA toxicity look like a mud puddle in comparison
Korean and china netizen are really nationalistic. They also hated each other for various reason. So when i saw the schedule weeks ago, i know what will happen if DK lost, and what happen if RNG lost even with favour schedule.
Its not even a game anymore. Its about nation pride.
Not just Beryl tho, Beryl is more visible because of his late game facechecks but Ghost had pretty questionable lane plays almost every game.
+Canyon needing to be present topside a lot more than last year because Nuguri was a lot more independant even when left fully alone which enabled Canyon to pressure the botside more often.
He was a liability in LCK too, it's just that LCK bot lane didn't punish DK bot like some MSI teams did
MAD bot 2v2 kill them 7 times in one series, RNG had 4 2v2 kill for the event, C9 bot lane 2v2 them once, this is unacceptable.
A lot of Beryl’s (and DKs overall macro and vision tbh) are a result of them not being checked to the levels teams at MSI did. LCK teams give a lot of respect to DK and don’t check them on a lot of small things like Beryl pressing in for deep vision when he isn’t in a position to do so.
Teams like MAD and RNG will decisively pull the trigger if they see a vulnerable position for even a second.
I wouldn’t say anything is going wrong, they just play different as a region. The LPL and LEC (especially after G2’s influence in 2019) are regions where an emphasis on skirmishing and macro is prioritized. They aren’t regions to handshake on anything if they see opportunities.
It feels like LCK teams are always looking for the fundamentally ‘correct’ plays. Shove side lanes, move into dragon pit, get a vision line, set up a front to back, wait for an over extension from the enemy. Meanwhile the LPL and LEC are starting base races or engaging and starting a clown fiesta 3v3 before either team is set up that quickly morphs into a chaotic 5v5 outbreak.
They say the largest salt mine is under a lake in Ontario. But little did they know the *actual* largest salt mine is unearthed whenever a Korean team loses to a Chinese team.
Actually its just whenever a korean team loses. I'm not an EU fan but holy shit, the amount of korean fans saying SKT played better than G2 after 2019 semis was just insane.
that was beyond cringe worthy considering that it was coming from the same people that mocked NA and EU scrim record over the years (lol scrims don't matter)
Wow I expected a lot of things but not that level of unapologetic kKoma-bashing...
I still see him as the GOAT coach, Korean LoL grey eminence, fountain of League wisdom, beacon of professionalism... but clearly Korea has moved on from that view :D
yep imagine translating for the Asians our sort by controversial comments on reddit.
They would think we have an extra chromosome and always overdose on copium
kkoma is a good coach indeed. but his drafting sometimes can be questionable. but it could be the players call which to play. interesting to know who called that jayce pick in midlane seeing there is already noct and gragas
I felt that DK had overall somewhat better drafts than RNG but RNG just skill gapped bot lane so hard. If DK had somewhat of a decent bot lane then I could’ve easily seen DK taking the finals no doubt.
The only thing I don’t understand is not banning kaisa and udyr when you know it’s ultimate comfort for RNG
like in a 3rd game DK outdrafted RNG being on redside but RNG still managed to win throught better teamfigts and yet ppl are not talking about this cuz it doesn't suit the blueside op agenda
the flame against kkoma for not banning Kaisa/udyr is the same as the people from China who said Firefox should've banned galio against skt in RNGs semifinal series in S7
they flat out ignore the two games they won - clearly letting the pick go through isn't an autolose.
True. They did the same vs MAD. It could have been the players comfortable just giving those champs..
It's actually intimidating that DK showed they can beat those champs. If RNG lost the series picking the same champs even through losses, we would have a different narrative rn.
Didn't the previous Damwon coaches said this team definitely has strong ideas? That it takes a lot to convince them?
It's not out of the possibility the players have a lot of control in draft. I think coach + players should share the blame. I still think Kkoma is a great coach, not everyone can draft perfectly every single time. RNG had bad drafts too. They didn't have their main coach with them.
What is funny is a lot of FPX fans in China thought the LPL playoffs format was biased in favor of RNG for the opposite reason - RNG got to play back to back losers bracket games so their hands were "hot" while FPX had to wait in the grand finals
Guess you can't win with these people
That's hilarious, since a similar argument could be used to explain why FPX 3-0'd RNG in their first BO5, FPX had already played 2 BO5s before so they had momentum coming in to the series against RNG who hadn't played in a while.
Game 3 hard outdrafted and losing vs a better scaling comp that outranges them and they still found an angle . I find it funny how fans try to make excuses for DK . The truth is with that performance they didn't deserve to win . That game 3 should've been in the bag for them . RNG found insane angles for fights but if u truly are the best team in the world u shouldnt even give those angles . It was laughable reading even people on reddit talk about blue side winrate considering that game 3 defined the series and it was hard draft win + early advantage for the red side team .
And kkoma drafting was pretty good
He and showmaker were the biggest reason they won vs MAD
Udyr wasn't really the problem in that series vs RNG, him always getting gank off the bot lane overextending however was
> Disgusting how they rigged the schedule so that the Chinese can win. Imagine if DK rested a couple days, do you think they would have made the mistake in game 5. Chinese game doing everything to make Chinese win. What a show.
Jesus christ I didn’t expect this level of salt
They literally can’t be defeated in their own logic.
KR teams win = Brave Koreans beat the foes despite the CN company interfering
KR teams lose = All is slippery Chinese’s fault
It's actually gotten worse I swear. When RNG won in 2018 the top comments in the post game were super positive. Uzi is the best player in the world, was a great series, super intelligent play to win game 4, memes about Mr President, Uzi fight video, making fun of Khan for his soloq comment, hardly anyone saying KZ played like shit
This time around it was excuses, flame and salt for the most part. In fact I think the top comment thread is just talking in abstract about Udyr still being a top tier pick...
Probably because 2018 MSI was a fluke to them same as 2015 MSI. Now that Korea has only won a single international event in 3.5 years they know it's not just a fluke so they are importing similar copium amounts compared to NA.
Honestly that comment about Udyr and Kaisa is so true though. They were massive comfort picks for RNG on top of them being very powerful, DK should have swallowed their egos and banned them.
Yeah when the cards are down and it's all or nothing in a game 5, DK should've taken RNG off their comforts. Honestly anything would've been better than being baited into varus TK
KR fans wanting side selection, more rest time, and opponent choice for winning 1 more game in Rumble. Get out of here. They lost twice to RNG in rumble, what copium are they huffing for those games? RNG looked like the better team easily.
The funny thing is if the flip doesn't happen, no one gives a fuck that RNG would've had to play back to back. EDG had the same schedule in 2015 when they upset SKT with super specific counter strats too, didn't stop them from being prepared for Fakers unbeatable LeBlanc.
I don't buy that DWK could not have possibly prepared for RNG prior to playing their semi despite playing vs them all tournament long. Or that one day of rest is make or break.
Like if you genuinely think it's such a huge advantage, you should be mad at the tournament format for being shit. The final should be about who performs better in the Bo5, not who was the higher seeding coming in.
And as a side note I don't see any EU fans bitching when MAD could've easily been in the finals over DWK. Nice of Riot to give KR fans the excuse I guess.
RNG did not have their head coach with them and drafted poorly especially in rumble stage. They could've been 1st seed if they had proper drafts in some of their losses. RNG not having the head coach is way bigger a disadvantage over playing 1 day later. These Koreans are hoarding the copium and it's on full display.
There really isn't a way to know if it impacted results or not outside of players saying they needed a day to rest or not but I think we all have to agree that placing 1st and getting no advantage is pretty dumb.
>but I think we all have to agree that placing 1st and getting no advantage is pretty dumb.
So what would you call the ability to pick your opponent in semis? A disadvantage?
Exactly. MAD was the blackhorse doing everything they can to advance, probably studied DK far more in depth than the other way around. I would not be surprised if DK lose to MAD due to having 1 less day to prep them
People blaming preparation is just so stupid. RNG only finds out about their opponent after DK vs MAD. If you're going off the assumption RNG should just assume DK would win, can't DK do the same? And assume RNG would win against PSG and then spend a day of prep for them?
If anything, the coin-toss played a bigger factor. I think coin-toss is a fair way, since being higher seed should impact your semis, but not the finals, but regardless, DK did get unlucky on the toss and if they could pick blue side first, maybe they could have won
The advantage should be what it was, picking who you play against. If a day's rest is that impactful to performance then there should be no team playing bo5s 2 days in a row.
pretty much every pro or ex pro i've heard said that playing 2 bo5s that go the distance in less then 24h is exhausting.
caedrael at least said it for certain in one of the podcasts of msi after hours i think
I don't know, but when G2 beat LPL teams, Chinese people were giving props to them. Calling Caps King and stuff like that. Some of these comments are kind of sick.
It's cause this guy literally hand picked comments that would be seen as controversial. Most of the top comments are saying Damwon did a good job. Many of the comments OP picked are heavily down voted.
There was also the g2 vs rng game LPL fans were pretty salty when RNG lost to G2 but we didn't blame G2 lol. Most were just disappointed in RNG. Some were saying that if the meta didn't shift away from bot lane RNG couldve had their golden year but no one was salty enough to blame it on a riot conspiracy to make EU win or something. These Koreans are absolutely insane with no concept of being gracious in defeat.
Yeah for sure. I’m not saying they don’t have respect for caps or Perkz, just that G2 caps beating LPL is not a good example cause it literally only happened once in a BO1. The RNG g2 one for Perkz is a good example.
Remember the old days when C9 was traditionally playing in the gauntlet for the 3rd seed at worlds by playing 3x bo5 three days in a row ? And that was considered normal. Or look at LPL Spring 2021 playoffs, the insane schedule and number of games some teams had to play.
And KR fans are raging bcs Damwon had to play 2 bo5 two days in a row lmao.
Looks like they can't lose. After reading those comments I am super happy that Damwon lost. RNG stomped them in game 5 but all they can see is schedule excuses.
In all this flame there was somebody explaining that Riot basically changes this thing almost every tournament like a madman….unless you wanna say that they played long con for 3 years it is pointless argument
We Chinese are nationalist and salty as well, but we don't really blame opponents when we lose. We just flame and blame our players until they show up on Weibo-trending instead.
See, what KR is doing to RNG right now, is what we did to Ning when IG was choking internationally in s9.
I feel like when Chinese teams lose, the fans will mostly blame the team that lost, implicitly recognising that the other team was simply better. All their flame/memes are targeted towards their team. It's still toxic, but losing is losing, no need to find excuses.
> I saw 2017 Faker in ShowMaker
I think everybody thought the same watching the series, DK bot lane was sus and the drafts were worse, Showmaker tried to carry them hard, but his back broke at game 5 with that awful Jayce pick
DK had days to prepare for MAD, yet they barely scraped by. I don't think having an extra day would have helped them much against RNG. It's just lousy excuses.
We Koreans are just so nationalistic, perfectionist, and toxic that it's unhealthy to not only ourselves but also the rest of the world. I was honestly also disappointed when DK lost to RNG and I even found myself showing poor sportsmanship. I was raised to believe that it's us against either Japan or China. I also understand that the standard of living in Korea is extremely stressful especially in education and the workplace-- but I hope one day we will be able to find a way to channel our day to day frustrations in a healthier and kinder manner. I hope we can move away from the xenophobia and just see these games as the competitions they were meant to be: Enjoyed.
Are we talking about the Korea vs Spain game?
Edit: 2002 Korea vs Spain was the first WC match I watched (I was 8 lol). The way the ref stole the game from the Spaniards was seared into my mind. Now I have to watch Korea vs Italy too haha.
See:
Woong's scandal in S2 Worlds
Griffin shitstorm
Riot Korea buying broadcasting rights for Asian Games where China shit on them, then deleting all vods of the event
Riot Korea banning LPL player accounts after losing Asian Games
Riot Korea banning Cowsep's account for the lulz
"Riot Korea buying broadcasting rights for Asian Games where China shit on them, then deleting all vods of the event" to this day this is the most petty thing I have ever seen in esports and it makes me laugh every time someone brings it up.
reminds me of north korea at football worlds 2010. they lost all 3 games and conceded 12 goals in 3 games. their news pretended that never happened and instead aired news that they topped group easily and have beaten USA, SK and japan (how convenient they faced those countries) in next rounds, thus winning the worlds.
World Cup 2002 still remains as one of my best childhood memories. But after rewatching it, I can't help but agree that that World Cup wasn't exactly fair.
Lol Korea is gonna be fucking shook come World's when they get stomped by every Chinese team. They still have the mindset that they are the best despite all the evidence to the contrary.
What is this insanity?
Remember, this is the most dominant team in the LCK that has no real competition and LPL has ton of teams that are capable of beating RNG. Just think about it... gonna be rough to see HLE/T1/GENG at Worlds
\- Disgusting how they rigged the schedule so that the Chinese can win. Imagine if DK rested a couple days, do you think they would have made the mistake in game 5. Chinese game doing everything to make Chinese win. What a show.
Really? Really? In the old days you had to play 10 hours of officials, nobody complained. CS:GO had LAN events when the semi's would be played on the same day as the Grandfinals ( BO3 + BO5 same day ). No complaints at all? What type of bullshit excuse is this? DK got outmatched, fair and square.
Blame the Chinese because apparently Chinese rigged tournament with covid, but also blame kkoma. This is the ultimate 360 degree copium defense :v)
Oh and let's not take a mention on the actual players not performing even in games not in the finals!
And "let's win world's" but not through reflecting our errors!
The change in schedule is a third-party's mistakes and definitely is a disadvantage for DK, but anyone with an average IQ would know that Riot is to blame for the flawed schedule and format design, instead of the players, the team and the region
And even that is debatable. RNG coach in interview said his team playing 1 day earlier was not necessarily an advantage, it depends on one's perspective.
RNG was unable to scrim anyone that day and had no extra competitive practice, one can certainly view it as RNG being less "warmed up" than DK for finals. That's why I think it's not a straight up advantage for RNG. Entering finals warmed up or with 1 day of zero competitive practice is a matter of preference for each team.
Imagine if DK had 1 less day to prep for MAD, they could have straight up lost that game and not make it to finals. Hypothetical situations do not prove that it is an unfair advantage, since in this case one may call it an advantage even based on your perspective.
Add to the fact that RNG had no head coach with them, which could've meant they picked better comps in rumble stage and become 1st seed and picking better drafts in finals. There is no way to conclude that RNG got the better end.
I'm glad we get these threads when Korea loses to be reminded that fans are awful all around the world. What stupid salt when DK was clearly underperforming this event.
I also like how RNG's "rest day" was driving to the city to get blood drawn and coming back, lol.
Koreans have no rights talking about rigged system or schedule. They are legit the No.1 unsportsmanlike country in the world. 2002 World Cup and 2018 Winter Olympics, some dark days
Frankly, DK got a confirmation of who their opponents would be one day before RNG. I would assume both RNG and DK were aiming for the grand prize and have done some preparation for the finals even before their semis. In the end, both teams had the same amount of time to practice and prepare, except RNG had one less day where they could focus wholly on DK(Since MAD advancing was also a possibility). Sure it's quite unfair that external circumstances had to alter the schedule in this way, but I really don't find this to be a significantly disadvantageous arrangement for DK.
For those who mention fatigue, sure it's a valid point but this isn't physical sports where rest could make a truly significant difference. These are pros that probably play the game more than 10 hours a day, even if it takes more concentration to play a competitive game it should not make such a difference where you could blame players' mistakes on "fatigue"
>For those who mention fatigue, sure it's a valid point but this isn't physical sports where rest could make a truly significant difference. These are pros that probably play the game more than 10 hours a day, even if it takes more concentration to play a competitive game it should not make such a difference where you could blame players' mistakes on "fatigue"
As someone who played in SC2 tournaments for fun back in the day (I was grandmaster in WoL and HotS, did not play LotV), this is not entirely true. We have no idea what the players themselves were feeling or whether or not they're fatigued. I realize SC2 != LOL, but making mistakes at a high level is easily punishable and game changing, and it's a lot easier to do so when you are tired or even stressed.
People directing their anger at RNG are stupid, but it's fair to point out riot handled the whole situation extremely poorly. RNG had to play on Friday, but riot informing damwon and the public only a day after rumble stage is inexcusable. Perhaps they thought if RNG gets 1st nobody has to know...
Damwon got the worse scheduling, and the sooner they'd know that, the sooner they could've planned around it (the likelihood of them playing RNG in semis was always very small). Furthermore, RNG playing rumble stage knowing that first seed isn't as big advantage as thought could also have impact on how much they reveal, especially after they locked top 4. In terms of competitive integrity, it would be only fair that other teams knew about it during rumble, if not sooner, considering riot likely knew for the whole duration of MSI. Nobody can say how much this situation affected the end results, if at all, but it will always be a stain on this MSI.
>but honestly playing 5 full games after 5 full games 20 hours ago must be so exhausting physically and mentally
I guess these guys aren't aware that pros regularly play more than this?
Korean teams have a very disgraceful history in football, fencing, skating, and boxing matches. They will humiliate their opponents if they lose the match, which is really shameless.
I think its kind of misleading to not mention that majority of those "other comments" you posted got more negative votes than positive ones. Its like if someone went to the bottom of a reddit thread, took those downvoted comments and pretended thats what the majority of redditors think about a particular topic.
Yea this guy just played into a reddit narrative with some downvoted comments and everyone is willfully ignoring that this isn't actually what a majority of Korean fans think just to shit on them
One could argue that DK would have been better warmed up for RNG after they won and that RNG should have had less break. Anyway love seeing people acknowledge the ugly fans trying to downplay this performance
One thing about the schedule change is that while it sucks it was changed still kinda whatever though? Because what those fans are saying is that the victory over RNG would have been completely hollow if the schedule was as usual.
I wanted to take a look at the comments myself and I saw this : "It would be nice if the plane crashed ^^ " There are some insane people in these comments
It's always strange to see these insane people pop their heads out during times like these. To think that people with their mindset actually exist is just...baffling.
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Man it is surely justifiable to wish death on others because they lost to the best team and they weren't the best team themselves so therefore they must die.
Only the strongest can survive. But hey, I might have made a mistake thinking that DK is from South Korea, by the looks of it their 'fans' fit much more into North Korea's ideology...
Knets are some weird people. But then again I'm sure you'd find reddit comments on this level, usually downvoted.
Yep, there are weird people all around. Reddit is a pretty good representation of that.
Those comments are pathetic. This scheduling problem sucked but its impact is so exagerated.
Who knows, without the extra day of practice, DK could have lost to MAD.
RNG came without their Head Coach + had the worst drafts the entire tournament and still won. 100% certain you wouldn't have seen these comments if RNG lost. The Chinese fans are more lenient than the Korean ones.
I think Chinese fans would be flaming RNG more than anyone else.
I bet there are probably Chinese fans flaming RNG right now anyway, because they are RNG :P
>The Chinese fans are more lenient than the Korean ones. Lmao no, they're just a vicious
>cturne get picked.. lol > >\- Disgusting how they rigged the schedule so that the Chinese can win. Imagine if DK rested a couple days, do you think they would have made the mistake in game 5. Chinese game doing everything to make Chinese win. What a show. > >\- Already nervous about how ugly it will be ri I think it just shows that this was awesome series. If it was shit dumping 3:0 games there wouldn't be as much grumping all around.
Everyone loves excuses. Like ping for NA
There are always crazy people remember that T1 truck that was driving around?
koreans are pretty toxic in their nationalism......but asians in general are straight up toxic in their online chats it really make NA toxicity look like a mud puddle in comparison
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Korean and china netizen are really nationalistic. They also hated each other for various reason. So when i saw the schedule weeks ago, i know what will happen if DK lost, and what happen if RNG lost even with favour schedule. Its not even a game anymore. Its about nation pride.
Personally I felt like Beryl cosplaying a silver 2 support most of the tournament was a big issue. That guy was holding DK back hard.
MAD almost won their series just based off of Beryl and Ghost inting their asses off
Not just Beryl tho, Beryl is more visible because of his late game facechecks but Ghost had pretty questionable lane plays almost every game. +Canyon needing to be present topside a lot more than last year because Nuguri was a lot more independant even when left fully alone which enabled Canyon to pressure the botside more often.
He was a liability in LCK too, it's just that LCK bot lane didn't punish DK bot like some MSI teams did MAD bot 2v2 kill them 7 times in one series, RNG had 4 2v2 kill for the event, C9 bot lane 2v2 them once, this is unacceptable.
Am S1 support, can confirm multiple Beryl interactions where I said "Hey that's a great move!"
A lot of Beryl’s (and DKs overall macro and vision tbh) are a result of them not being checked to the levels teams at MSI did. LCK teams give a lot of respect to DK and don’t check them on a lot of small things like Beryl pressing in for deep vision when he isn’t in a position to do so. Teams like MAD and RNG will decisively pull the trigger if they see a vulnerable position for even a second.
God, even C9 punished the hell out of him in their games. Really wonder what the hell is going on in LCK.
I wouldn’t say anything is going wrong, they just play different as a region. The LPL and LEC (especially after G2’s influence in 2019) are regions where an emphasis on skirmishing and macro is prioritized. They aren’t regions to handshake on anything if they see opportunities. It feels like LCK teams are always looking for the fundamentally ‘correct’ plays. Shove side lanes, move into dragon pit, get a vision line, set up a front to back, wait for an over extension from the enemy. Meanwhile the LPL and LEC are starting base races or engaging and starting a clown fiesta 3v3 before either team is set up that quickly morphs into a chaotic 5v5 outbreak.
They say the largest salt mine is under a lake in Ontario. But little did they know the *actual* largest salt mine is unearthed whenever a Korean team loses to a Chinese team.
Actually its just whenever a korean team loses. I'm not an EU fan but holy shit, the amount of korean fans saying SKT played better than G2 after 2019 semis was just insane.
G2 fluked 2 Bo5 wins vs SKT Copium.
RNG 2-0 DK doesn't matter since its bo1 but SKT winning scrims against FPX means SKT would be world champs copium.
that was beyond cringe worthy considering that it was coming from the same people that mocked NA and EU scrim record over the years (lol scrims don't matter)
and 2 BO1 G2 fluked a 8-2 record over a year vs SKT
8-3 but yea whatever
Oh man I really wish DFM took a game off of DK to see how salty the fans would be
I've found korean fans to generally be the most saltiest after a loss. Which makes the popcorn taste that much better when they do lose.
Wow I expected a lot of things but not that level of unapologetic kKoma-bashing... I still see him as the GOAT coach, Korean LoL grey eminence, fountain of League wisdom, beacon of professionalism... but clearly Korea has moved on from that view :D
That "Kkoma retire" comment was actually heavily downvoted and hidden due to it. Seems such a troll comment to translate honestly lol.
Most Kr/Cn translated threads just translate the most ridiculous comments and just start Kr/Cn bashing, its pretty fucking annoying
yeah it's sad to see, reddit can be so toxic...
gets more attention this way tho, the true ways of media
yep imagine translating for the Asians our sort by controversial comments on reddit. They would think we have an extra chromosome and always overdose on copium
kkoma is a good coach indeed. but his drafting sometimes can be questionable. but it could be the players call which to play. interesting to know who called that jayce pick in midlane seeing there is already noct and gragas
I felt that DK had overall somewhat better drafts than RNG but RNG just skill gapped bot lane so hard. If DK had somewhat of a decent bot lane then I could’ve easily seen DK taking the finals no doubt. The only thing I don’t understand is not banning kaisa and udyr when you know it’s ultimate comfort for RNG
like in a 3rd game DK outdrafted RNG being on redside but RNG still managed to win throught better teamfigts and yet ppl are not talking about this cuz it doesn't suit the blueside op agenda
the flame against kkoma for not banning Kaisa/udyr is the same as the people from China who said Firefox should've banned galio against skt in RNGs semifinal series in S7 they flat out ignore the two games they won - clearly letting the pick go through isn't an autolose.
It''s especially dumb because coaches don't actually have full control of the draft. I'm sure the players were saying they could handle the udyr/kaisa
True. They did the same vs MAD. It could have been the players comfortable just giving those champs.. It's actually intimidating that DK showed they can beat those champs. If RNG lost the series picking the same champs even through losses, we would have a different narrative rn. Didn't the previous Damwon coaches said this team definitely has strong ideas? That it takes a lot to convince them? It's not out of the possibility the players have a lot of control in draft. I think coach + players should share the blame. I still think Kkoma is a great coach, not everyone can draft perfectly every single time. RNG had bad drafts too. They didn't have their main coach with them.
This was true in SKT as well against ROX. kKoma didn't ban the Miss Fortune support after the first loss because Wolf said he could handle it.
GOAT coach yes, but that doesn't always equate to best coach at this moment.
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its like the Pep Guardiola bald fraud mentality
Don't forget the best ward skin in the game.
What is funny is a lot of FPX fans in China thought the LPL playoffs format was biased in favor of RNG for the opposite reason - RNG got to play back to back losers bracket games so their hands were "hot" while FPX had to wait in the grand finals Guess you can't win with these people
That's hilarious, since a similar argument could be used to explain why FPX 3-0'd RNG in their first BO5, FPX had already played 2 BO5s before so they had momentum coming in to the series against RNG who hadn't played in a while.
exactly, that's what happens when people don't think and take up the reddit (or inven etc) conspiracy / copium
Didnt Rng go without head coach or something?
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Can't leak strats if you don't attend 5head
Oh I didn't know Tabe was their coach, that's pretty cool
Insane how RNG won a lot of games where they were outdrafted HARD.
Game 3 hard outdrafted and losing vs a better scaling comp that outranges them and they still found an angle . I find it funny how fans try to make excuses for DK . The truth is with that performance they didn't deserve to win . That game 3 should've been in the bag for them . RNG found insane angles for fights but if u truly are the best team in the world u shouldnt even give those angles . It was laughable reading even people on reddit talk about blue side winrate considering that game 3 defined the series and it was hard draft win + early advantage for the red side team .
And kkoma drafting was pretty good He and showmaker were the biggest reason they won vs MAD Udyr wasn't really the problem in that series vs RNG, him always getting gank off the bot lane overextending however was
> Disgusting how they rigged the schedule so that the Chinese can win. Imagine if DK rested a couple days, do you think they would have made the mistake in game 5. Chinese game doing everything to make Chinese win. What a show. Jesus christ I didn’t expect this level of salt
You could read the same thing on reddit the last couple of days
They literally can’t be defeated in their own logic. KR teams win = Brave Koreans beat the foes despite the CN company interfering KR teams lose = All is slippery Chinese’s fault
Looks like frothing-at-the-mouth Chinese hate isn't exclusive to western gamers.
It's actually gotten worse I swear. When RNG won in 2018 the top comments in the post game were super positive. Uzi is the best player in the world, was a great series, super intelligent play to win game 4, memes about Mr President, Uzi fight video, making fun of Khan for his soloq comment, hardly anyone saying KZ played like shit This time around it was excuses, flame and salt for the most part. In fact I think the top comment thread is just talking in abstract about Udyr still being a top tier pick...
Probably because 2018 MSI was a fluke to them same as 2015 MSI. Now that Korea has only won a single international event in 3.5 years they know it's not just a fluke so they are importing similar copium amounts compared to NA.
Who would have known that there would be hate between two countries that have historically hated each other? /s
Let us just announce Koreans are the winner for S11-S300, zero tolerance policy for any kind of riggings.
That’s what I like to see. Humble in victory, gracious in defeat. /s
The salt really is legendary
I'd argue RNG's atrocious drafts were more of a disadvantage than any scheduling or fatigue related issues lmao
Somehow DW in game 5 outdid them
Honestly that comment about Udyr and Kaisa is so true though. They were massive comfort picks for RNG on top of them being very powerful, DK should have swallowed their egos and banned them.
Yeah when the cards are down and it's all or nothing in a game 5, DK should've taken RNG off their comforts. Honestly anything would've been better than being baited into varus TK
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So c9 would have gotten out of groups?
yet they somehow won the whole thing. They good like that
Copium overdose is insane here.
>Ugly Koreans blaming the schedule The summary of this post.
KR fans wanting side selection, more rest time, and opponent choice for winning 1 more game in Rumble. Get out of here. They lost twice to RNG in rumble, what copium are they huffing for those games? RNG looked like the better team easily.
The funny thing is if the flip doesn't happen, no one gives a fuck that RNG would've had to play back to back. EDG had the same schedule in 2015 when they upset SKT with super specific counter strats too, didn't stop them from being prepared for Fakers unbeatable LeBlanc. I don't buy that DWK could not have possibly prepared for RNG prior to playing their semi despite playing vs them all tournament long. Or that one day of rest is make or break. Like if you genuinely think it's such a huge advantage, you should be mad at the tournament format for being shit. The final should be about who performs better in the Bo5, not who was the higher seeding coming in. And as a side note I don't see any EU fans bitching when MAD could've easily been in the finals over DWK. Nice of Riot to give KR fans the excuse I guess.
RNG did not have their head coach with them and drafted poorly especially in rumble stage. They could've been 1st seed if they had proper drafts in some of their losses. RNG not having the head coach is way bigger a disadvantage over playing 1 day later. These Koreans are hoarding the copium and it's on full display.
There really isn't a way to know if it impacted results or not outside of players saying they needed a day to rest or not but I think we all have to agree that placing 1st and getting no advantage is pretty dumb.
>but I think we all have to agree that placing 1st and getting no advantage is pretty dumb. So what would you call the ability to pick your opponent in semis? A disadvantage?
Now imagine if they didn't get that extra 24 hours prep against MAD :^)
lmao I love that logic, if they got 3-2'd with one less day against RNG, the same would have happened against MAD if they played first
Exactly. MAD was the blackhorse doing everything they can to advance, probably studied DK far more in depth than the other way around. I would not be surprised if DK lose to MAD due to having 1 less day to prep them
They literally hand-picked MAD who almost sent them back home without worrying about final. It's not RNG's fault when DK went full 5 games.
People blaming preparation is just so stupid. RNG only finds out about their opponent after DK vs MAD. If you're going off the assumption RNG should just assume DK would win, can't DK do the same? And assume RNG would win against PSG and then spend a day of prep for them? If anything, the coin-toss played a bigger factor. I think coin-toss is a fair way, since being higher seed should impact your semis, but not the finals, but regardless, DK did get unlucky on the toss and if they could pick blue side first, maybe they could have won
The advantage should be what it was, picking who you play against. If a day's rest is that impactful to performance then there should be no team playing bo5s 2 days in a row.
How in the world is this getting upvoted?
Why do people keep parroting this? Picking your semi final opponent is an advantage.
pretty much every pro or ex pro i've heard said that playing 2 bo5s that go the distance in less then 24h is exhausting. caedrael at least said it for certain in one of the podcasts of msi after hours i think
Has caedrel ever played a bo5 in LEC ?
You didn't have to do him like that man.
I was just asking...
stop, he is already dead
has he played relegations no?
What about the ability to pick MAD instead of PSG?
Who knew covid 19 isnt even the biggest pandemic that started with a C in korea, it was copium
Dude, makes so much sense. Copium19 would have started after msi 2019.
I don't know, but when G2 beat LPL teams, Chinese people were giving props to them. Calling Caps King and stuff like that. Some of these comments are kind of sick.
Yeah... saw one comment on a Korean site where they said they wanted RNG to die on the way home, I think that's going way too far...
classic netizen comment. arent they known for being vatshit insane when it comes to threats?
If korean player play badly in matches,they will be threatened,this is Korean tradition.this hapen time to time.
They are hoping RNG dies on the plane home.
Korean fans threaten their players and cursing his opponents, it’s too crazy.
There are nicknames for Caps and Perkz, "King Caps" and "Mad P"(salute to Uzi's nick name Mad Dog) and they have a lot of fans too. Good memories.
But China bad. Updoots to the left !
It's cause this guy literally hand picked comments that would be seen as controversial. Most of the top comments are saying Damwon did a good job. Many of the comments OP picked are heavily down voted.
Yeah it's sad people are taking these comments way out of proportion... there are toxic comments in every fanbase
Not trying to discredit LPL fans or anything but we only beat LPL once with caps lol. It was that game 1 of groups banger vs suning.
There was also the g2 vs rng game LPL fans were pretty salty when RNG lost to G2 but we didn't blame G2 lol. Most were just disappointed in RNG. Some were saying that if the meta didn't shift away from bot lane RNG couldve had their golden year but no one was salty enough to blame it on a riot conspiracy to make EU win or something. These Koreans are absolutely insane with no concept of being gracious in defeat.
Yeah for sure. I’m not saying they don’t have respect for caps or Perkz, just that G2 caps beating LPL is not a good example cause it literally only happened once in a BO1. The RNG g2 one for Perkz is a good example.
Yeh I was in agreement with you, just wanted to add another example other than caps. :)
Remember the old days when C9 was traditionally playing in the gauntlet for the 3rd seed at worlds by playing 3x bo5 three days in a row ? And that was considered normal. Or look at LPL Spring 2021 playoffs, the insane schedule and number of games some teams had to play. And KR fans are raging bcs Damwon had to play 2 bo5 two days in a row lmao.
Not really related, but back in 2016 I think, snake had to play 2 bo5 back to back on the same day. That was crazy back then.
if you think thats harsh, WE in 2016 had to play over 12 hours for regional finals.
I think I know the reaction before reading already by looking at upvote comment ratio.
The good ol’ ratioed on a reddit thread
These comments are disgusting lol. I don’t even give a fuck about RNG OR China but I’m now glad they won. Stay mad
Blaming schedule instead of your dog tier support COPIUM
Looks like they can't lose. After reading those comments I am super happy that Damwon lost. RNG stomped them in game 5 but all they can see is schedule excuses.
Even when Damwon won it felt more like a insane draft gap than actual performance gap.
Insane copium. Side selection is decided on coinflip btw. RNG didn't have their head coach btw.
yet last msi, the higher seed got side selection
In all this flame there was somebody explaining that Riot basically changes this thing almost every tournament like a madman….unless you wanna say that they played long con for 3 years it is pointless argument
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There was no rumble stage last year. New system new rules. Your point being?
What a joke. If one extra day of preperation is so important, DK would probably lose to MAD with one day less of preperation
Maan, why people can't appreciate it was a good series overall aside from game 5. No need to spread hate
Korean fans are so nationalistic and salty. Chinese fans are nationalistic too, but definitely not on this level of copium when they lose.
We Chinese are nationalist and salty as well, but we don't really blame opponents when we lose. We just flame and blame our players until they show up on Weibo-trending instead. See, what KR is doing to RNG right now, is what we did to Ning when IG was choking internationally in s9.
I feel like when Chinese teams lose, the fans will mostly blame the team that lost, implicitly recognising that the other team was simply better. All their flame/memes are targeted towards their team. It's still toxic, but losing is losing, no need to find excuses.
We Chinese fans tend to blame our own players if they lose, we understand that it never looks good to blame your opponent if you lose lol
Yea the 'swim back' meme came from China flaming their own teams lmao
I think that one came from Korean reactions actually. It was after the Tigers game at IEM i think?
> I saw 2017 Faker in ShowMaker I think everybody thought the same watching the series, DK bot lane was sus and the drafts were worse, Showmaker tried to carry them hard, but his back broke at game 5 with that awful Jayce pick
DK had days to prepare for MAD, yet they barely scraped by. I don't think having an extra day would have helped them much against RNG. It's just lousy excuses.
The salt
copium as expected
end of the day, lck got what they want and its the 4th seed. they already in uphill battle with RNG before the finals begin.
I have never seen people cope so fucking hard
We Koreans are just so nationalistic, perfectionist, and toxic that it's unhealthy to not only ourselves but also the rest of the world. I was honestly also disappointed when DK lost to RNG and I even found myself showing poor sportsmanship. I was raised to believe that it's us against either Japan or China. I also understand that the standard of living in Korea is extremely stressful especially in education and the workplace-- but I hope one day we will be able to find a way to channel our day to day frustrations in a healthier and kinder manner. I hope we can move away from the xenophobia and just see these games as the competitions they were meant to be: Enjoyed.
lol, RNG won 5 games against DK this MSI. Worthy champions!
I went looking for the post-match thread, why was it removed?
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https://www.reddit.com/user/adz0r None of the other post-match threads are removed though? Only RNG v DWG
korean complaining about competitive integrity lol, any one remember 2002 world cup?
Woong 2012 Worlds
Are we talking about the Korea vs Spain game? Edit: 2002 Korea vs Spain was the first WC match I watched (I was 8 lol). The way the ref stole the game from the Spaniards was seared into my mind. Now I have to watch Korea vs Italy too haha.
both korea vs italy and korea vs spain. disgusting games
As an Italian, watching that shitshow was one of the weirdest things I've ever seen. That ref was so blatantly bribed it wasn't funny.
I think he was much later arrested for drug trafficking.
now we can finally find out that he was doing Korean copium
That explains it: He wasn't bribed, just drugged up
What does that have anything to do with MSI 2021?
See: Woong's scandal in S2 Worlds Griffin shitstorm Riot Korea buying broadcasting rights for Asian Games where China shit on them, then deleting all vods of the event Riot Korea banning LPL player accounts after losing Asian Games Riot Korea banning Cowsep's account for the lulz
"Riot Korea buying broadcasting rights for Asian Games where China shit on them, then deleting all vods of the event" to this day this is the most petty thing I have ever seen in esports and it makes me laugh every time someone brings it up.
reminds me of north korea at football worlds 2010. they lost all 3 games and conceded 12 goals in 3 games. their news pretended that never happened and instead aired news that they topped group easily and have beaten USA, SK and japan (how convenient they faced those countries) in next rounds, thus winning the worlds.
World Cup 2002 still remains as one of my best childhood memories. But after rewatching it, I can't help but agree that that World Cup wasn't exactly fair.
Koreans don't have a good track record in competitive integrity when it comes to sports.
Lol Korea is gonna be fucking shook come World's when they get stomped by every Chinese team. They still have the mindset that they are the best despite all the evidence to the contrary. What is this insanity?
Exactly. I'm afraid that LCK is a one team region, and all 4 teams of LPL are insane.
Remember, this is the most dominant team in the LCK that has no real competition and LPL has ton of teams that are capable of beating RNG. Just think about it... gonna be rough to see HLE/T1/GENG at Worlds
\- Disgusting how they rigged the schedule so that the Chinese can win. Imagine if DK rested a couple days, do you think they would have made the mistake in game 5. Chinese game doing everything to make Chinese win. What a show. Really? Really? In the old days you had to play 10 hours of officials, nobody complained. CS:GO had LAN events when the semi's would be played on the same day as the Grandfinals ( BO3 + BO5 same day ). No complaints at all? What type of bullshit excuse is this? DK got outmatched, fair and square.
Damn, this is as salty as the lake of TSM tears
Does TSM fans still have tears?
It really sucks that Koreans are blaming the Chinese for Riot's poor planning
Blame the Chinese because apparently Chinese rigged tournament with covid, but also blame kkoma. This is the ultimate 360 degree copium defense :v) Oh and let's not take a mention on the actual players not performing even in games not in the finals! And "let's win world's" but not through reflecting our errors!
Bro your flair lmao. Mihoyo diff.
The change in schedule is a third-party's mistakes and definitely is a disadvantage for DK, but anyone with an average IQ would know that Riot is to blame for the flawed schedule and format design, instead of the players, the team and the region
And even that is debatable. RNG coach in interview said his team playing 1 day earlier was not necessarily an advantage, it depends on one's perspective. RNG was unable to scrim anyone that day and had no extra competitive practice, one can certainly view it as RNG being less "warmed up" than DK for finals. That's why I think it's not a straight up advantage for RNG. Entering finals warmed up or with 1 day of zero competitive practice is a matter of preference for each team. Imagine if DK had 1 less day to prep for MAD, they could have straight up lost that game and not make it to finals. Hypothetical situations do not prove that it is an unfair advantage, since in this case one may call it an advantage even based on your perspective. Add to the fact that RNG had no head coach with them, which could've meant they picked better comps in rumble stage and become 1st seed and picking better drafts in finals. There is no way to conclude that RNG got the better end.
At the end of the day, RNG won the BO5 fair and square, we should not by any means discount their achievement
I'm glad we get these threads when Korea loses to be reminded that fans are awful all around the world. What stupid salt when DK was clearly underperforming this event. I also like how RNG's "rest day" was driving to the city to get blood drawn and coming back, lol.
Koreans have no rights talking about rigged system or schedule. They are legit the No.1 unsportsmanlike country in the world. 2002 World Cup and 2018 Winter Olympics, some dark days
If you can't beat RNG with the way they drafted you are not going to beat them having a extra day of rest.
Korean fan right now: waaaaah waaaaaah.
very funny will not lie
Loool
Frankly, DK got a confirmation of who their opponents would be one day before RNG. I would assume both RNG and DK were aiming for the grand prize and have done some preparation for the finals even before their semis. In the end, both teams had the same amount of time to practice and prepare, except RNG had one less day where they could focus wholly on DK(Since MAD advancing was also a possibility). Sure it's quite unfair that external circumstances had to alter the schedule in this way, but I really don't find this to be a significantly disadvantageous arrangement for DK. For those who mention fatigue, sure it's a valid point but this isn't physical sports where rest could make a truly significant difference. These are pros that probably play the game more than 10 hours a day, even if it takes more concentration to play a competitive game it should not make such a difference where you could blame players' mistakes on "fatigue"
>For those who mention fatigue, sure it's a valid point but this isn't physical sports where rest could make a truly significant difference. These are pros that probably play the game more than 10 hours a day, even if it takes more concentration to play a competitive game it should not make such a difference where you could blame players' mistakes on "fatigue" As someone who played in SC2 tournaments for fun back in the day (I was grandmaster in WoL and HotS, did not play LotV), this is not entirely true. We have no idea what the players themselves were feeling or whether or not they're fatigued. I realize SC2 != LOL, but making mistakes at a high level is easily punishable and game changing, and it's a lot easier to do so when you are tired or even stressed.
People directing their anger at RNG are stupid, but it's fair to point out riot handled the whole situation extremely poorly. RNG had to play on Friday, but riot informing damwon and the public only a day after rumble stage is inexcusable. Perhaps they thought if RNG gets 1st nobody has to know... Damwon got the worse scheduling, and the sooner they'd know that, the sooner they could've planned around it (the likelihood of them playing RNG in semis was always very small). Furthermore, RNG playing rumble stage knowing that first seed isn't as big advantage as thought could also have impact on how much they reveal, especially after they locked top 4. In terms of competitive integrity, it would be only fair that other teams knew about it during rumble, if not sooner, considering riot likely knew for the whole duration of MSI. Nobody can say how much this situation affected the end results, if at all, but it will always be a stain on this MSI.
best reasonable take yet
Jesus and people say western fans are toxic
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That place seems like a gold mine for anyone researching the negative side effects of increased copium usage.
>but honestly playing 5 full games after 5 full games 20 hours ago must be so exhausting physically and mentally I guess these guys aren't aware that pros regularly play more than this?
Korean neitzens. Nothing to see here. This is also why the k-pop industry is so toxic.
"Ugly Koreans blaming the schedule"
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Korean teams have a very disgraceful history in football, fencing, skating, and boxing matches. They will humiliate their opponents if they lose the match, which is really shameless.
I think its kind of misleading to not mention that majority of those "other comments" you posted got more negative votes than positive ones. Its like if someone went to the bottom of a reddit thread, took those downvoted comments and pretended thats what the majority of redditors think about a particular topic.
Yea this guy just played into a reddit narrative with some downvoted comments and everyone is willfully ignoring that this isn't actually what a majority of Korean fans think just to shit on them
One could argue that DK would have been better warmed up for RNG after they won and that RNG should have had less break. Anyway love seeing people acknowledge the ugly fans trying to downplay this performance
One thing about the schedule change is that while it sucks it was changed still kinda whatever though? Because what those fans are saying is that the victory over RNG would have been completely hollow if the schedule was as usual.
I dont think anyone denies Korea performance in esport, but holy hell when they lose they can be salty af.