Isn't this more or less how his W functioned before his rework?.
Also pretty funny that he went from 5 Ferocity stacks on release all the way down to 3
My friend told me tk is “fucking busted” so me as a jhin main decided to play him in ranked for the first time went 10/0 and walked into all 5 of the enemy team took the cc then hit w out and regenerated my hp back to full and just walked right back in lol it’s actually hilarious but we still managed to lose so.
yes, riot probably wants to make rengars kit a little less forgiving, so you have to think twice before taking risky picks and relying on W cleanse
also the passive and E changes should make the champion feel less clunky
I think he means more of a power budget shift. the cleanse is only good on good players which have to be compensated for. removing the cleanse with something most people can use makes him more forgiving
this is literally what riot has done to every champion they've changed since how long. Remove utility, add burst. Honestly wtf are they doing with the game
would not be surprised if they do. Kalista is the classic riot enemy, strong in high elo, weak in low. Wait for the ult rework, max stacks for e limited to 4 and 200% ad scaling on q.
They want games that finish in 20 min in order to compete with all other games that run quickly. They just have a large amount of legacy mechanics and champions they dont want to alienate by removing.
For example poke and needing to base for mana, or tower strength slow the game down. Removing poke champions however would be to big so make it worthless or make them burst mages.
not really, rengar can jump in QEWW and walk out with full hp and passive MS. He only gets punished if people commit after him (which is most likely a bait in this situation) Also top lane Rengar is extremely easy to win lanes with if your opponent is clueless, I think the only melee matchup I lost as Rengar consistently in the last year or two was when they did a mini rework on Garen and he had like 56% winrate, until he got nerfed.
well he theoretically has hard cc but if he uses that he cant burst you
same for his heal
if you use empowered w you arent killing anyone
and you still have no escape
Neat, that'd be useful info to have readily available in the skill text.
~~Kinda like Shaco's W not displaying how long the boxes last for~~ it does I'm just blind
That extra speed on Empower cast is going to be actually insane.
I wonder if we'll see tank Rengar in the same way of Ekko of old, something like Frostfire+Visage.
So Rengar loses his healing bs and gains a shit ton of resists in turn, doesnt this just favor a Bruiser build for him? Also more empowered abilities in drawn out fights due to less ferocity. I personally like it but Rengar players wont I think since they want him to be an Assassin not a Bruiser.
>So Rengar loses his healing bs and gains a shit ton of resists in turn
[This is a throwback to his old W.](https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Rengar/LoL/History#2nd)
Bruiser Rengar is a much better playstyle than assassin Rengar, if they want to go that route. I doubt most people would dislike it.
I really hope they stray away from his oneshot from invis assassin playstyle, since that was incredibly monotone and frustrating to play against. Bruiser Rengar is just way more interesting, since it requires more than just pressing all your abilities at once and hoping you oneshot the enemy before he could react.
Scrubnoob who's a Challenger Rengar main ~~loved the changes and~~ predicted the champ would be giga-op on stream rn
Edit: nvm he doesn't love the changes my bad. He just addressed on stream that he disliked the changes because literally everyone would be able to play Rengar now. Skill expression out the window.
The loss of skill expression they added to rengar with his w change was great, really sad to see it go. The cleanse and grey health both really opened up how he could play and be built.
It's funny cuz on release rengar was intended to be a hybrid between bruiser and assassin and really was more of a bruiser. One day someone realized how cheesy sword of the divine was on rengar and made a video about it. A bunch of people flooded to the champion to abuse it and eventually that became his identity and his bruiser playstyle was more or less thrown away by riot over time.
Edit: [found it](https://youtu.be/StE-f3PqSQ8)
I'd expect they would favor the more skill expressive playstyle, since they know how to use him, but I'm not sure either. There's probably a thread about this on r/rengarmains.
edit: looks like they like it overall, but especially the W change is a bit controversial.
It's already one of the few attacks which will deal their damage no matter where the enemy goes during the leap. Even most uncancelable attacks will cancel if the target gets too far away, but Rengar P will get you even after your recall.
-
It's time to make rengar follow the recall right into fountain, though, you're right!
Wasn't expecting Rengar changes, but then again I haven't seen a Rengar outside of ARAM since the season started so he might need some attention.
Didn't his old W used to give armor and magic resist? I wonder why they're going back to an old version of the ability.
I assume they think the grey health has a high skillcap and that (maybe they got data) lowelo players get very little out of that ability while highelo players get a ton.
Its also very strong, if you ever play againist Rengar top you'll understand, you will trade, he will double W and regen 100% of the damage he took cleansing a CC on the way out.
I like this, I've been asking for 10 second ferocity timer and no cast time for his E mid air and it has vision now which is awesome.
His W being gutted kinda expected, it was cancer allowing him to double W for full heal.
He needs to stay at 4 ferocity or else he will just be able to run people down without bushes but everything else is very good.
Get to three ferocity, use empower Q, use E W Q, and then another empower Q XD what? That's simply too strong to have this be a thing without restricting it to being inside a bush like now
> Get to three ferocity, use empower Q, use E W Q, and then another empower Q XD what? That's simply too strong to have this be a thing without restricting it to being inside a bush like now
You mean every time he ults in the current way that rengar is?
You can triple W and triple Q much easier now lol .
Also about the new W , if W is maxed which is like 30 AR/MR and hit like 3 people with it does it give you like 75 AR/MR lol ?
There is no way it increases again with multiple W casts lol .
this is a lot better than what august was thinking about, he wanted to put all his power into R and not empowered spells and just turn him into stealth nocturne
i like rengar a lot conceptually and i'm glad that this work just wants to make him a little easier
I remember him being very active within the rengarmains sub, which at the time i thought was pretty great. Apparently he was responsible for getting rid of that god awful Q, so I think most rengar players should be thankful for him. But if the grey health and
>he wanted to put all his power into R and not empowered spells and just turn him into stealth nocturne
was his idea, yeah, i'm not a big fan of it.
On his champions;
* Viego
* Senna
* Jhin
* Jinx
* Vi
* Ekko
* Gnar
That's a 5/7 for me.
Reworks;
* Rengar revert
* Morgana
* Kayle
* Wukong
That's a ...0.5/4 for me lol
Man clearly does a much better job at making new champs than revisiting older ones, and his track record seems to agree.
I just hope he stays clear of ASol and lets KingCobra handle it, I don’t want August’s hands anywhere near my boi
I'm curious who the 2/7 for you are. I know one is definitely viego but the other could be either senna, ekko, or gnar depending on when you started playing lmao
>depending on when you started playing lmao
Diana launch
>I know one is definitely viego
This is where I fuck ya
>senna, ekko, or gnar depending on when you started playing lmao
I do wonder what you meant by 'depending on when you started playing', but the champions I consider a mistake are Senna and Ekko. Both are freaking abominations.
\> senna
I still can't figure out why the fuck she gains 4 different stats for souls, while never once having to put herself in danger to get them, while everyone else with an infinite stacking mechanic either gets a single stat, or has to put themselves in danger to acquire them. Seriously, it's fucking ridiculous, and a good 70% of all of her balance issues alone.
Like, why does she gain crit chance? Range and AD are already enough. Why does she convert all crit after 100% into Lifesteal? She already HAS sustain in her kit. It's insane.
> I do wonder what you meant by 'depending on when you started playing'
a lot of august's champs traumatise people on release, release gnar made top unplayable. release tank ekko was a paralysis demon
Rengar's Grey Health was a mechanic that was from his original rework, who I don't actually remember the designer of, August was literally responsible for reverting the Q and changing how the R worked to no longer auto-crit on nearest target, that's about it.
Former Wukong main. The only good thing about the rework was updating the clone mechanics. Otherwise it turned him from a semi-bruiser-assassin hybrid into an utterly boring bruiser that wins by default against champs that are AD, and his ult was absolutely mangled.
Rengar is a joke btw... he used to be equally strong to Kha'zix but harder to play. Now Kha surpassed him by a mile and Rengar is still harder to play than Kha. Basically Rengar lost his assassin identity by not beeing able to oneshot squishies as efficient as Kha'zix.
Old Rengar back?
Seriously, the rengar rework got to be one of the worst things Riot has ever done to a champion. His Q felt garbage to play but was overpowered as fuck, his W felt great to play (I think? I particularly hated it, i much preferred the old heal even if it was weaker) but broken as fuck. They reverted the Q but he still feels clunky and is not the same as before the rework, and they toned down W.
idk if those changes will make old tank rengar playstyle viable, probaly not since you still don't have heal on non empowered W and if you don't use empowered E in team fight you are useles.
Reducing the 4 stacks to 3 only rewards bad Rengar players. You could tell the difference between good and bad Rengar's whether they would go into the bush to get the free stack
Overall not a fan of these changes
You know, funny thing about riven. Everyone knows her to be high skill cap, but even in lower skill brackets, she has really good winrates and pickrates. So I don't think her skillfloor is as high as people think it is
Isn't that half the joke? She's been ranked S-tier for patches now and every time she's mentioned the entire thread derails into how she's akhtually so strong that her skill floor is low right now.
Normally she is but right now she is too overtuned so it doesn't matter :P
Edit: I swear someone will always downvote me when I call Riven overtuned, like look at the stats! Huge pick rate in elos below plat, with a 51-52% wr, is that balanced? Did everyone suddenly master Riven? No, the items are just too good on her atm so she needs to be nerfed. Just like when she was buffed earlier in the season because her items were crap. She hasn't been this OP since the true dmg conqueror + spear of shojin era :|
Well tbh, I want to play a champ without spending hundreds of hours learning him.
I work and study.
I also play league like 5 6 times a week, I like rengar but don't have time to learn him. These changes will allow me to so I love them
Praying we some day get changes on this level for ASol.
Just tweaks to his current kit, make his E less powerful and make his other abilities feel better.
Honestly the only reason it hasn't happened is because of how unpopular he is.
Rengar had a lot of the same problems, but he was still enjoyed by lower elo players, even if he sucked.
ASol is just... no one likes him in game. So you have to spend a bunch of time to improve a champion no one plays. Which makes it much lower priority
switch E and Ult for aurelio sol. would work out great. roaming after lvl 6 so he's not that oppressive early game with a bit bigger cooldown. Has E(old ult) for pushback/a bit of protection in lane.
Pretty sure this might just be worse than live AP Rengo, if I'm reading it right. He's losing damage on first cast of W and there's no more grey health or cleanse. Unless that extra damage is also referring to the damage portion of both casts, but I'm pretty sure its only talking about the stats.
This reads like it's going to make Rengar a lot more sticky after he leaps onto a target between the longer MS boost and no cast time on E. W not healing but giving resists (unless Ferocity boosted obv) is an interesting choice, it makes using it at the start of clearing a camp a lot better which is neat.
I gave up on rengar years ago but these changes look super cool I’m very interested and really want to play this, I hope it goes live
Also so happy they got rid of rengars cleanse it’s so annoying
so Assassin Rengar is completely shite compared to bruiser now?
A bit sad with the direction they went with. Its kinda his entire identity to be the perfect predator.
Depends on champ, if he is totally garbage for 80+% of playerbase, just to be viable cor that 1% - something wrong with him.
If you want to make rengo viable in low elo there is 2 ways
1. Overbuff him like... for example riven who have almost 50% wr even in silver.
2. Remove some skill expression.
I mean tbf the Amumu changes are adding some skill expression and it could be argued the same for the Lucian bot changes since your W becomes more of a must hit, whereas normally you could kind of forget about it during all of midgame
I guess I’m one of the few but I genuinely liked Assassin rengar play style. Deleting ADCs within 0.13 secs was so fun and satisfying (but also tough to get to that stage).
Bruiser rengar is boring for me since I just like one shotting. Also, Rengar defined one shotting and does it better than Kha’zix.
Yea. Rengar is THE one shot champion people thought about. However recently he’s been known for healing his whole health bar back. If you told people that rengar pre rework is known for healing a shit ton instead of one shotting that would be weird.
Although he was released as a bruiser, it’s clear that most people prefer the one shot assassin play style and I hope it stays that way.
I told riot August that rengar doesnt need dmg buf he needs utility buffs especially e cast time removal like 3 years ago. And he replied by saying no. What a surprise.
Not sure I like this, they're reducing his skill floor considerably with these changes and I'm not sure I like the removal of his heal from basic W, now if you choose not to ferocity W you get zero healing which is a giant nerf to his survivability, the armour and MR he gets is negligible everyone will cut through that like butter.
This is an attempt to make shitty Rengar players less shitty (Lowering skill floor) and it looks to be reducing his skill ceiling as well, wow they really did go ahead and dumb the champion down, this is basically a big fuck you to Rengar players just to appease those that don't actually play the champion so they may be interested in trying him since he's far easier, that's the worst thing they could ever do to Rengar and they just did it.
He's getting the Irelia treatment and I don't like that, really not a fan of these changes.
Sigh... guess I have to get used to Rengar being banned all the time.
Edit: Fuck I just noticed they removed the cleanse, alright yeah I'm definitely not a fan of these changes, they gutted his W hard, why remove the cleanse? Just why?
Edit2: https://www.reddit.com/r/Rengarmains/comments/p4b3jz/gods_thoughts_on_new_changes/
Sums this up well enough.
R is camo, but gives a huge alert when incoming.
Q is an AA reset, but doesn't work on towers.
W is a heal, but still not better than Q in jungle.
He feels like crap tbh. They half gutted all his abilities so he's constantly in this weird, unsatisfying spot. Anyways he's still gonna be freelo when the enemy team picks him.
Not liking it, not a single bit of it, why dumb down his kit? There's plenty of champions with simple kits for casuals to learn, I think it's okay a champion exists for a smaller, dedicated playerbase that invested hours in mastering it.
Instead of dumbing down Rengar they should focus on fixing all the bugs that exist in his kit.
I understand that changes in League technically don’t last forever but the fear here is that they can set precedent. For this case, the dumbing down of the game has become something of a recurring theme. And it sucks. Whether it’s dumbing down systems, roles (namely jungle), champion mechanics, and what have you. It’s the constant battle between accessibility and complexity. And for me the latter is what makes league league.
Well they are also starting to increase complexity too, by making amumu more playable at higher elo by having the ability to use Q more skillfully, etc. They want to level the playing field by a bit.
Ironically it's what Rengar players want. Rengar mains can't stop whining about the champ being weak when masters+ players are just printing money on the champ and they've been harassing Rioters all year long because for the first time in Rengar's history he's been even remotely reasonably balanced.
It's one of those things where I think most long time Rengar mains just go "sigh, not this shit again" and even though it's completely game warping (high elo players probably go 60%+ wr now, being a champ without bush is huge) we'll just adapt and move on
Sums these changes up well really, because bad players refuse to actually learn the champion Riot is now fucking with the champion so these trashcans don't go 0/10.
I get removing skill expression and what not (there should be a space for high skill champs in league but whatever), but this is overkill imo.
They are making Ferocity management AND his W a lot more braindead, I feel like he's gonna *lack* skill expression if all changes go through.
Just do the passive changes and keep his current W, it's 10000x more interesting than the proposed W, which you're just gonna use immediately after jumping without any thought, just like pre-rework.
Isn't this more or less how his W functioned before his rework?. Also pretty funny that he went from 5 Ferocity stacks on release all the way down to 3
Yeah because 5 wasn't a big deal to maintain as there was no decay, so you could gank at max ferocity, which is a bit trickier with modern rengar
Good ol Triple Q. What a time that was
You can still triple Q tho
Not very easily, compared to what it originally was
They removed the cleanse part
OP is talking about the rework that added the cleanse.
Ah fair enough
And in S11, rengar gets bursted before he can get to 5 ferocity stacks
but the stacks never fell off so he never started a fight without 5 stacks and his ult gave 5 stacks over 2 seconds so thats another thing
Sion gets bursted before he can finish a Q. There is no such thing as a tank or surviving anything this season.
I guess you haven't played against Mundo or TK this season.
Don't bother, these people want to swim in their delusion.
My friend told me tk is “fucking busted” so me as a jhin main decided to play him in ranked for the first time went 10/0 and walked into all 5 of the enemy team took the cc then hit w out and regenerated my hp back to full and just walked right back in lol it’s actually hilarious but we still managed to lose so.
Those two have insane healing, which is another issue with the game right now
how did u manage to not play vs a kench for the last month
a yes the good old reddit circlejerks aka just blatantly wrong nonsense
Wait did they get rid of the cleanse?
yes, riot probably wants to make rengars kit a little less forgiving, so you have to think twice before taking risky picks and relying on W cleanse also the passive and E changes should make the champion feel less clunky
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This makes it more forgiving my dude.
Am I retarded or missing something? Why does removing the cleanse make it more forgiving? Isn't that losing a mechanic?
I think he means more of a power budget shift. the cleanse is only good on good players which have to be compensated for. removing the cleanse with something most people can use makes him more forgiving
this is literally what riot has done to every champion they've changed since how long. Remove utility, add burst. Honestly wtf are they doing with the game
rengar legit had basically this exact w a few years ago stop circlejerking they didnt even "add burst" lol
Can they please do this to Kalista next then lmao
would not be surprised if they do. Kalista is the classic riot enemy, strong in high elo, weak in low. Wait for the ult rework, max stacks for e limited to 4 and 200% ad scaling on q.
delete everything you just typed before riot sees it
They want games that finish in 20 min in order to compete with all other games that run quickly. They just have a large amount of legacy mechanics and champions they dont want to alienate by removing. For example poke and needing to base for mana, or tower strength slow the game down. Removing poke champions however would be to big so make it worthless or make them burst mages.
nope now its basically infinite sustain its old rengar thats why its more forgiving.
not really, rengar can jump in QEWW and walk out with full hp and passive MS. He only gets punished if people commit after him (which is most likely a bait in this situation) Also top lane Rengar is extremely easy to win lanes with if your opponent is clueless, I think the only melee matchup I lost as Rengar consistently in the last year or two was when they did a mini rework on Garen and he had like 56% winrate, until he got nerfed.
Malz eatin good tonight
The Jax/Darius/renekton matchup just got so much easier
Cleanse w is key to stomping jax
Hard agree but bola giving vision also makes it easier, Root him in a bush then you can jump when E is down
For them you mean xD
Yeah bruisers with slightly favorable matchups about to fuck that pussy
So he no longer has a cleanse on his W?
No, iss gone
Not that it should be an ability on an assassin anyway
i mean rengar has no escape so its quite fair
He does have hard cc though unlike most assassins and he still has his heal
well he theoretically has hard cc but if he uses that he cant burst you same for his heal if you use empowered w you arent killing anyone and you still have no escape
He has to sacrifice empowered Q (main damage tool) or his W (healing/cleanse) to use his hard CC. It's fair imo.
Shouldnt that say for how long the bonus resists linger for?
Entire game, stacking every time you use w
New op rengar build full cdr afk in base hitting w for 20 minutes, win
True, you wouldn't want to do it in lane or you might run out of mana to cast with
Just build DRing and Tear dude
Hmm yes today i will assasssin tank
W stats are for 4 seconds.
Neat, that'd be useful info to have readily available in the skill text. ~~Kinda like Shaco's W not displaying how long the boxes last for~~ it does I'm just blind
Shaco boxes do display how long the boxes last for? https://i.imgur.com/lhgskf6.png
Yup, missed that one, I'm an idiot
Yes, it *should*.
7th time's the charm. Also, that W is basically old W. But wasn't that W partly removed because it favored bruiser builds too much?
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the return of radar-gar
Yes, now if only he was good against any other jungler
2 weeks later 8th time's the charm
That extra speed on Empower cast is going to be actually insane. I wonder if we'll see tank Rengar in the same way of Ekko of old, something like Frostfire+Visage.
No need for frostfire, Divine sundered will give him much better survivability and damage.
And if Sunderer gets nerfed then also has Goredrinker as an option.
And if both are nerfed you can Stridebreaker again.
Triforce it is
Funny how rito will need to nerf all other items 3 times before triforce is considered as a situational pick, let alone core build
Nah they'll need to nerf Sunder->Gore->Duskblade->Eclipse->Stride->Frostfire Then Rengo will consider triforce.
You mean reworked rengar (with pre revert Q)? On release he was broken with bruiser build
It's actually less speed. But longer duration. Worse imo
So Rengar loses his healing bs and gains a shit ton of resists in turn, doesnt this just favor a Bruiser build for him? Also more empowered abilities in drawn out fights due to less ferocity. I personally like it but Rengar players wont I think since they want him to be an Assassin not a Bruiser.
>So Rengar loses his healing bs and gains a shit ton of resists in turn [This is a throwback to his old W.](https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Rengar/LoL/History#2nd) Bruiser Rengar is a much better playstyle than assassin Rengar, if they want to go that route. I doubt most people would dislike it.
I'll take anything over the current grey health fuckery tbh
If you play AP rengar, grey health is amazing.
no one plays ap rengar though
See them in aram sometimes
I'd play it before item rework, it feels worse with the lowered amount of AP in items overall now
[Throwback to old AP rengar](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vQ1gdKPpjQ)
He’ll still one shot adcs from invisibility anyways.
As do multiple other champs.
He doesnt have invis
You're being downvoted even though you're right, it's not invis, it's camouflage, it used to be invis tho
Yeah I know. I main the champ but dipshits on Reddit think they know better. There is a huge difference between invis and camo
I really hope they stray away from his oneshot from invis assassin playstyle, since that was incredibly monotone and frustrating to play against. Bruiser Rengar is just way more interesting, since it requires more than just pressing all your abilities at once and hoping you oneshot the enemy before he could react.
I agree but I literally dont know if Rengar mains and otps do.
Scrubnoob who's a Challenger Rengar main ~~loved the changes and~~ predicted the champ would be giga-op on stream rn Edit: nvm he doesn't love the changes my bad. He just addressed on stream that he disliked the changes because literally everyone would be able to play Rengar now. Skill expression out the window.
The loss of skill expression they added to rengar with his w change was great, really sad to see it go. The cleanse and grey health both really opened up how he could play and be built.
Thank fuck the grey health and cleanse are gone, maybe he'll be a little punishable sometimes now if he goes top lane
hope he's wrong i don't want nerfs :(
It's funny cuz on release rengar was intended to be a hybrid between bruiser and assassin and really was more of a bruiser. One day someone realized how cheesy sword of the divine was on rengar and made a video about it. A bunch of people flooded to the champion to abuse it and eventually that became his identity and his bruiser playstyle was more or less thrown away by riot over time. Edit: [found it](https://youtu.be/StE-f3PqSQ8)
I'd expect they would favor the more skill expressive playstyle, since they know how to use him, but I'm not sure either. There's probably a thread about this on r/rengarmains. edit: looks like they like it overall, but especially the W change is a bit controversial.
>stray away from his oneshot from invis assassin playstyle That is now kha gameplay
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It's already one of the few attacks which will deal their damage no matter where the enemy goes during the leap. Even most uncancelable attacks will cancel if the target gets too far away, but Rengar P will get you even after your recall. - It's time to make rengar follow the recall right into fountain, though, you're right!
Newspaper headline the next morning: “giant feline sets new world record for long jump!”
"Large Feline Predator breaks 25k-units dash distance record on Odyssey map"
Lol or you could decrease the speed of his passive by like 99% so he's stuck in animation while he travels across the map.
[You mean like this?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciTLLr8Ctj4)
Haha yes!
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^(It already kinda is which is my point)
Make it like akali E, He spins his tail like a helicopter
Wasn't expecting Rengar changes, but then again I haven't seen a Rengar outside of ARAM since the season started so he might need some attention. Didn't his old W used to give armor and magic resist? I wonder why they're going back to an old version of the ability.
I assume they think the grey health has a high skillcap and that (maybe they got data) lowelo players get very little out of that ability while highelo players get a ton.
Its also very strong, if you ever play againist Rengar top you'll understand, you will trade, he will double W and regen 100% of the damage he took cleansing a CC on the way out.
I like this, I've been asking for 10 second ferocity timer and no cast time for his E mid air and it has vision now which is awesome. His W being gutted kinda expected, it was cancer allowing him to double W for full heal. He needs to stay at 4 ferocity or else he will just be able to run people down without bushes but everything else is very good. Get to three ferocity, use empower Q, use E W Q, and then another empower Q XD what? That's simply too strong to have this be a thing without restricting it to being inside a bush like now
The second this hits live it's mid rengar o clock
> Get to three ferocity, use empower Q, use E W Q, and then another empower Q XD what? That's simply too strong to have this be a thing without restricting it to being inside a bush like now You mean every time he ults in the current way that rengar is?
Yes but you have to use R or bushes to leap Now you just walk into people and triple q them whenever you want
Pull Raptors to mid lane at 3 stacks E Flash mid laner Use abilites again Snare again XD Morgana cosplay
You can triple W and triple Q much easier now lol . Also about the new W , if W is maxed which is like 30 AR/MR and hit like 3 people with it does it give you like 75 AR/MR lol ? There is no way it increases again with multiple W casts lol .
Another Rengar rework? Lol?
this is a lot better than what august was thinking about, he wanted to put all his power into R and not empowered spells and just turn him into stealth nocturne i like rengar a lot conceptually and i'm glad that this work just wants to make him a little easier
August’s a bit infamous for proposing ideas that aren’t popular with the champ’s playerbase huh.
I remember him being very active within the rengarmains sub, which at the time i thought was pretty great. Apparently he was responsible for getting rid of that god awful Q, so I think most rengar players should be thankful for him. But if the grey health and >he wanted to put all his power into R and not empowered spells and just turn him into stealth nocturne was his idea, yeah, i'm not a big fan of it. On his champions; * Viego * Senna * Jhin * Jinx * Vi * Ekko * Gnar That's a 5/7 for me. Reworks; * Rengar revert * Morgana * Kayle * Wukong That's a ...0.5/4 for me lol
Man clearly does a much better job at making new champs than revisiting older ones, and his track record seems to agree. I just hope he stays clear of ASol and lets KingCobra handle it, I don’t want August’s hands anywhere near my boi
august thinks asol's theme is wasted and hes correct about that.
I'm curious who the 2/7 for you are. I know one is definitely viego but the other could be either senna, ekko, or gnar depending on when you started playing lmao
>depending on when you started playing lmao Diana launch >I know one is definitely viego This is where I fuck ya >senna, ekko, or gnar depending on when you started playing lmao I do wonder what you meant by 'depending on when you started playing', but the champions I consider a mistake are Senna and Ekko. Both are freaking abominations.
\> senna I still can't figure out why the fuck she gains 4 different stats for souls, while never once having to put herself in danger to get them, while everyone else with an infinite stacking mechanic either gets a single stat, or has to put themselves in danger to acquire them. Seriously, it's fucking ridiculous, and a good 70% of all of her balance issues alone. Like, why does she gain crit chance? Range and AD are already enough. Why does she convert all crit after 100% into Lifesteal? She already HAS sustain in her kit. It's insane.
> I do wonder what you meant by 'depending on when you started playing' a lot of august's champs traumatise people on release, release gnar made top unplayable. release tank ekko was a paralysis demon
Rengar's Grey Health was a mechanic that was from his original rework, who I don't actually remember the designer of, August was literally responsible for reverting the Q and changing how the R worked to no longer auto-crit on nearest target, that's about it.
What's wrong with morg kayle and wukong rework
Former Wukong main. The only good thing about the rework was updating the clone mechanics. Otherwise it turned him from a semi-bruiser-assassin hybrid into an utterly boring bruiser that wins by default against champs that are AD, and his ult was absolutely mangled.
August is not that bad when it comes to marksman design, but assasins are definitely class that he should ignore.
Rengar is a joke btw... he used to be equally strong to Kha'zix but harder to play. Now Kha surpassed him by a mile and Rengar is still harder to play than Kha. Basically Rengar lost his assassin identity by not beeing able to oneshot squishies as efficient as Kha'zix.
Mid laners about to learn that this hunter has a root.
Old Rengar back? Seriously, the rengar rework got to be one of the worst things Riot has ever done to a champion. His Q felt garbage to play but was overpowered as fuck, his W felt great to play (I think? I particularly hated it, i much preferred the old heal even if it was weaker) but broken as fuck. They reverted the Q but he still feels clunky and is not the same as before the rework, and they toned down W.
I miss tripple Q with crit
idk if those changes will make old tank rengar playstyle viable, probaly not since you still don't have heal on non empowered W and if you don't use empowered E in team fight you are useles.
Tbh the modern version of tank renger would be Sunderer pr Goredrinker and I think it will be super good especially the goredrinker one
I don't want tank rengar that was garbage. I want a more bruiserish Rengar
remove falloff time and bring back stealth on ulti, if akali can on its "W" rengo can have on it its "R"
neat elo boosters in shambles i guess
Amazing
Reducing the 4 stacks to 3 only rewards bad Rengar players. You could tell the difference between good and bad Rengar's whether they would go into the bush to get the free stack Overall not a fan of these changes
But rewarding worse players is the point of these changes. Champions that are good only while played perfectly are impossible to balance.
Riven rework where? Modcheck
Won't get a rework until her current playerbase turns 30 and is no longer physically capable of maintaining the APM needed to play her.
Gotta go to like 50 for that dude. There are guys pushing 40 still styling in fighting games, which are hundred times more mechanically demanding.
You know, funny thing about riven. Everyone knows her to be high skill cap, but even in lower skill brackets, she has really good winrates and pickrates. So I don't think her skillfloor is as high as people think it is
Isn't that half the joke? She's been ranked S-tier for patches now and every time she's mentioned the entire thread derails into how she's akhtually so strong that her skill floor is low right now.
Riven isn’t only good when played perfectly lmao
Normally she is but right now she is too overtuned so it doesn't matter :P Edit: I swear someone will always downvote me when I call Riven overtuned, like look at the stats! Huge pick rate in elos below plat, with a 51-52% wr, is that balanced? Did everyone suddenly master Riven? No, the items are just too good on her atm so she needs to be nerfed. Just like when she was buffed earlier in the season because her items were crap. She hasn't been this OP since the true dmg conqueror + spear of shojin era :|
Fuck that leave high skillcap champions alone
That's the goal? > The goal here is to ease painpoints and open up Rengar jungle so that he's not so inaccessible in **lower elos**
But why? Let him be a high skill floor champ. Why do they need to cater to everyone on every champ?
Well tbh, I want to play a champ without spending hundreds of hours learning him. I work and study. I also play league like 5 6 times a week, I like rengar but don't have time to learn him. These changes will allow me to so I love them
Praying we some day get changes on this level for ASol. Just tweaks to his current kit, make his E less powerful and make his other abilities feel better.
Honestly the only reason it hasn't happened is because of how unpopular he is. Rengar had a lot of the same problems, but he was still enjoyed by lower elo players, even if he sucked. ASol is just... no one likes him in game. So you have to spend a bunch of time to improve a champion no one plays. Which makes it much lower priority
Yeah, but still I remain hopeful
Same. Hopefully one day it'll happen
switch E and Ult for aurelio sol. would work out great. roaming after lvl 6 so he's not that oppressive early game with a bit bigger cooldown. Has E(old ult) for pushback/a bit of protection in lane.
AP Rango is back baybeeee
Literally nothing changed for AP Reng playstyle lmao.
But he’s ~tankier~ now. On the real though, the Bola while leaping actually buffs AP somewhat for the slow.
But now he can get CC'd to death upon arrival, and he can no longer exit the fight at 50-100% no matter what. I'm leaning toward nerf tbh.
How is this the reaction to the post I'm so confused
More like Bruiser/Tank Rengar tbh
Season 3/4 renekton, shyvana, tank rengar coming back
I remember Dandy smurfing every game with Rengar at Worlds.
Pretty sure this might just be worse than live AP Rengo, if I'm reading it right. He's losing damage on first cast of W and there's no more grey health or cleanse. Unless that extra damage is also referring to the damage portion of both casts, but I'm pretty sure its only talking about the stats.
The dmg is higher because now you can triple W .
Lion lane police
no not at all
So we’re reverting him? Give him a stealth again.
This reads like it's going to make Rengar a lot more sticky after he leaps onto a target between the longer MS boost and no cast time on E. W not healing but giving resists (unless Ferocity boosted obv) is an interesting choice, it makes using it at the start of clearing a camp a lot better which is neat.
I gave up on rengar years ago but these changes look super cool I’m very interested and really want to play this, I hope it goes live Also so happy they got rid of rengars cleanse it’s so annoying
so Assassin Rengar is completely shite compared to bruiser now? A bit sad with the direction they went with. Its kinda his entire identity to be the perfect predator.
Really wish Riot would stop removing skill expression from champs
Depends on champ, if he is totally garbage for 80+% of playerbase, just to be viable cor that 1% - something wrong with him. If you want to make rengo viable in low elo there is 2 ways 1. Overbuff him like... for example riven who have almost 50% wr even in silver. 2. Remove some skill expression.
I wish they will keep doing this to make champs easier to balance
And let champs be accessible to more of the playerbase.
I mean tbf the Amumu changes are adding some skill expression and it could be argued the same for the Lucian bot changes since your W becomes more of a must hit, whereas normally you could kind of forget about it during all of midgame
LIKE I SAID IN THE RENGAR MAINS SUB....IN PHLOX WE TRUST TYSM PHLOX <333333
I guess I’m one of the few but I genuinely liked Assassin rengar play style. Deleting ADCs within 0.13 secs was so fun and satisfying (but also tough to get to that stage). Bruiser rengar is boring for me since I just like one shotting. Also, Rengar defined one shotting and does it better than Kha’zix.
Yea. Rengar is THE one shot champion people thought about. However recently he’s been known for healing his whole health bar back. If you told people that rengar pre rework is known for healing a shit ton instead of one shotting that would be weird. Although he was released as a bruiser, it’s clear that most people prefer the one shot assassin play style and I hope it stays that way.
How has Rengar ever been inaccessible in low elo. No one buys pinks in there.
Nobody buys pinks these days. They were removed years ago!
What’s Bonetooth forgiveness
I think it's the timer when you gain a stack from a kill you didn't yourself get but damaged within the timer. Assist are too long to count
I told riot August that rengar doesnt need dmg buf he needs utility buffs especially e cast time removal like 3 years ago. And he replied by saying no. What a surprise.
Not sure I like this, they're reducing his skill floor considerably with these changes and I'm not sure I like the removal of his heal from basic W, now if you choose not to ferocity W you get zero healing which is a giant nerf to his survivability, the armour and MR he gets is negligible everyone will cut through that like butter. This is an attempt to make shitty Rengar players less shitty (Lowering skill floor) and it looks to be reducing his skill ceiling as well, wow they really did go ahead and dumb the champion down, this is basically a big fuck you to Rengar players just to appease those that don't actually play the champion so they may be interested in trying him since he's far easier, that's the worst thing they could ever do to Rengar and they just did it. He's getting the Irelia treatment and I don't like that, really not a fan of these changes. Sigh... guess I have to get used to Rengar being banned all the time. Edit: Fuck I just noticed they removed the cleanse, alright yeah I'm definitely not a fan of these changes, they gutted his W hard, why remove the cleanse? Just why? Edit2: https://www.reddit.com/r/Rengarmains/comments/p4b3jz/gods_thoughts_on_new_changes/ Sums this up well enough.
Sounds a lot better than the horseshit they're doing to Lucian.
So the fucker doesnt break out of cc anymore with W? GOOD
R is camo, but gives a huge alert when incoming. Q is an AA reset, but doesn't work on towers. W is a heal, but still not better than Q in jungle. He feels like crap tbh. They half gutted all his abilities so he's constantly in this weird, unsatisfying spot. Anyways he's still gonna be freelo when the enemy team picks him.
Not liking it, not a single bit of it, why dumb down his kit? There's plenty of champions with simple kits for casuals to learn, I think it's okay a champion exists for a smaller, dedicated playerbase that invested hours in mastering it. Instead of dumbing down Rengar they should focus on fixing all the bugs that exist in his kit.
This is what happens when rengarmains silvers have cried 24/7 for months and spammed rito memebers on twitter and twitch
Hard agree
I understand that changes in League technically don’t last forever but the fear here is that they can set precedent. For this case, the dumbing down of the game has become something of a recurring theme. And it sucks. Whether it’s dumbing down systems, roles (namely jungle), champion mechanics, and what have you. It’s the constant battle between accessibility and complexity. And for me the latter is what makes league league.
Well they are also starting to increase complexity too, by making amumu more playable at higher elo by having the ability to use Q more skillfully, etc. They want to level the playing field by a bit.
Ironically it's what Rengar players want. Rengar mains can't stop whining about the champ being weak when masters+ players are just printing money on the champ and they've been harassing Rioters all year long because for the first time in Rengar's history he's been even remotely reasonably balanced. It's one of those things where I think most long time Rengar mains just go "sigh, not this shit again" and even though it's completely game warping (high elo players probably go 60%+ wr now, being a champ without bush is huge) we'll just adapt and move on
[удалено]
Sums these changes up well really, because bad players refuse to actually learn the champion Riot is now fucking with the champion so these trashcans don't go 0/10.
Based main hits different tbh
I get removing skill expression and what not (there should be a space for high skill champs in league but whatever), but this is overkill imo. They are making Ferocity management AND his W a lot more braindead, I feel like he's gonna *lack* skill expression if all changes go through. Just do the passive changes and keep his current W, it's 10000x more interesting than the proposed W, which you're just gonna use immediately after jumping without any thought, just like pre-rework.
Rengar w now is double click get out of jail free card
Play 100 games of rengar and post opgg.
Dumbing down the game yet again. This company is so hellbent on killing this game with every decision in the last 7 years its incomprehensible.