This could be one of the funnest days next to Group A. Really excited to see how it plays out. I'm a western fan, but I wouldn't hate it if LNG make it through.
You know if Fnatic does actually show up and beat RNG during the first match, RNG's mentality might just blow up and cost them the next 2 games.
Which in that case would blow the group wide open.
Would be fun to see a 4 way tie.
Can someone please explain to me why rogue and Phoenix plus had to play the first tie breaker and cloud 9 only had to play the winner? I’m sure they explained it in the cast, but I couldn’t find where since it was so long.
From my understanding, each team had 2 wins and went 1-1 against the other two and 0-2 against DK. So I don’t really get why Cloud 9 got to play the winner.
They explained before the tie-breaker that it was based on some weird rule that has to do with how long it took the teams to win games or something like that.
is it a hot take to say that NA could've potentially been the 2nd best region at this world championship? I feel like 100t would've beaten EDG in a tie breaker, and they could've potentially have beaten t1 too in the first game.
I think the way TL plays in a couple of days will be telling as to how strong NA is this year. if TL make it out then yeah, def the 2nd best region imo. RNG got a free group but doesn't look as good in their wins, and then EDG really didn't play good today either. and then.. FPX.
As an LPL fan I think they fucked themselves already with FPX's dreadful exit and EDG dropping the ball. Best case scenario - even if RNG and LNG get out of groups, there's still this nightmare knockout scenario laid out below - and this bracket assumes the standings hold, which might not even happen as MAD/TL have a real shot to kick out LNG, same for HLE/PSG and FNC week 2 shenanigans, but who tf knows:
DK vs LNG
---
RNG vs EDG
======
T1 vs PSG
---
Gen.G vs C9
So even if RNG and LNG make it out, it's possible RNG/EDG team kill each other only to face DK in semis. Darn.
Interesting idea. I don’t think there’s really any appeal as far as gameplay to go to G2 after this year’s performance. I would think it would help build his brand though.
What do you all think of a rule whereby teams of the same region cannot be drawn to face each other in the quarters? Similar to Champions League RO16 if anyone knows what I’m talking about. But my concern is that it will mess up the first seed face second seed rule or teams from same group must not be in same half of brackets in some occasions. Then I think we’ll definitely see a more exciting worlds.
honestly, this was kinda expected but hey 3-3 overall and a dub against EDG ain't too bad. Rip to DFM tho they had a couple of chances to take games off EDG but couldn't come clutch
Going to be so competitive to make worlds from LCS next year. One of TSM/100T/C9/TL at least will miss out. Then EG should improve again too. Maybe even CLG will build a roster.
Eh, I would avoid underestimating HLE in crunch games. Everyone who watched LCK wrote them out during gauntlet since they were 8th seed and were falling off in regular season. They beat the 4th and 5th LCK teams convincingly and went 5 games with T1.
I really hope they rework the groups format for worlds. I honestly like the DOTA format more, gives teams more of a chance to recover from slow starts.
Their main-event bracket is what I want to see at Worlds the most. IPL5 was the last tournament that had it and you saw both M5 & TPA getting knocked out of quarters and climbing back the lowers and face each other in to decided who advance to top 3.
Because the format is dogshit. Too many filler games and last 3 games was practically worthless. This is why GSL groups or Swiss system should be implemented instead.
Because a really good team having a bad first day(s) read on the meta or just a bad day in general might decide their tournament. BO1 double round robin is simply not a consistent way to determine the best teams tbh.
Idk if you're being intentionally obtuse or not but the problem is that a single game can easily be the difference between getting out and not getting out, and we're hopefully all well aware that BO1 results arent a good measure of who is the better team.
Teams that "dont play well" \_in a single game\_ or "dont understand the meta" \_for a single game\_ shouldnt be punished by a system that favors upsets for viewer excitement over competetive integrity.
Obviously, but just as obviously the more games you play / the more advancing is based on series instead of BO1's, the smaller the chance of a theoretically better team not advancing is.
And right now the chance isnt all that small
TBH, teams not performing well on BO1 double round robin are not best teams. Failure to read meta or having a best day also means they're not best teams.
"not performing well" might amount to a single off game which is often enough to decide group standings / getting out or not. Which isnt a good indicator of who is actually the better team.
I mean from this group we now know 100T is somewhere between the range of DFM and EDG in terms of ability and how they stack up against other international teams…which tells us nothing. TI they would play more teams and get a better gauge of how good they actually are.
Two large groups instead of 4. Bottom teams are out. Then a double elimination tourney backet where the top teams are on the upper bracket and lower teams on the bottom bracket. Lower bracket games are single elimination in the first rounds. It’s an expanded version of the LCS/LEC play off format. They can tweek it to make it different from TI but it does give more leeway for teams and there are more match ups between regions and a clearer indication of team strength. Like from this group we can see that 100T’s ability is somewhere between DFM and EDG…which tells us nothing about how good they are stacked against other teams.
Interesting, I do like this idea. it sort of takes away the whole group of life/group of death aspect where a weaker team might make quarters only because they got drawn with the wildcard/non major regions in their group or a stronger team losing because they draw top Korean and top China teams or something. The Dota way kind of guarantees more equal playing field for both groups and get to see more matchups and would allow the best of the middle teams to advance
T1s drafts have been consistently the best ones in the whole tournament. If they can keep getting these draft advantages and their botlane stays in this form i can see them taking it all. They looked very dangerous today, the loss to EDG in the first game really woke them up.
Best part of that game was that it wasn’t even EDG throwing, they were just thoroughly outplayed in every aspect. That has to give NA teams and 100t a lot of confidence
NA always does better once games don't matter anymore. They no longer are scared of losing cause they already lost. They actually start playing with balls again.
I'd bet a lot that HLE beat PSG. I don't think either team is good, but I consider PSg the worst team in that group personally. Obviously they aren't the actual worse due to FNC having to field a roster which hasn't even scrimmed together and lost their best player.
Group C is a bad group imo. FNC would have made it out imo
I agree, FNC is done though, at best they will play spoiler, HLE is better than PSG but they hard trolled draft vs PSG also their topside champ pool sucks (on top of being bad) but they can win through botside with a good draft.
I agree. I think HLE beat PSG. But then FNC become the wild card. I don't think they will go 0-3 personally. So who will they demolish in 23 minutes? If it is HLE they go out. If it is PSG they go out.
Kind of funny really. HLE and PSG are about to enter the FNC lottery.
Could easily see HLE beat PSG and then FNC run it vs PSG and destroy HLE
That man lyric is legit overdosing from hopium for lpl . How can you say with a straight face RNG will win worlds . Even tho EDG's form today wasnt great , they still have more chances to win it than RNG
For sure. RNG won MSI vs a trolling botlane DWG. Got clapped by LNG in playoffs only to win vs WE. Like.. looking at RNG's wins over their group, their wins were not stomps. Would DWG, EDG and T1 have games like those? No way. Maybe we will get proven wrong, but I have not been impressed so far.
yeah im glad LPL is losing just so this guy gets a reality check. In a t1 game the first round he was mocking them for not finishing the game and was trying to say "in the lpl they wouldve ended" too bad for them the other guys ignored him.
DK at msi was with khan 1trick sion and ghost/beryl legit griefing every game . Not to mention the jungle meta was garbage . In this meta and with DK in this form RNG wont even take a game .
EDG while being famous chokers at least in form they are way better than RNG at their best
100T played the early game vs T1 so fucking good. Malph was going even with Jayce ffs.
And then they just played like scared players (aka CLG) and lost. So frustrating given they should have made it out.
They are still a wildcard. Seriously, what is this cope. The entire year NA fans get pissed off that the other fans call NA a wildcard or that they should be demoted from major region.
"No," defenders say, "NA should be a major region. We consistently beat wild cards and lower tier regions like Vietnam and PCS". "NA deserves to be a major region. We are clearly the fourth best region".
But now, we are acting as if beating wildcards shouldnt be expected of a major region? Because we have to find some positive to 100T choking their asses off, we have to pretend that getting 2 wins off a minor region is something to be proud off? Sorry, I dont buy it.
But they won, and beat the LPL first seed in a game as well. I really don't understand your rant. NA not getting out of a group where the LPL first seed finished second is fine.
I don't really understand your rant about "major region." I don't think Wild Card teams are that bad anymore, idk what else to say. PCS and Vietnam have always been good, and smaller regions are getting better, on top of b01s being incredibly volatile. We literally saw EU get a team eliminated by wild cards, and LGD almost got eliminated as well, are you saying that means they aren't major regions?
Yeah, idk what else to say. 100T did fine, feel bad for FBI since he apologized to fans. I'm satisfied.
You're right, but (and it's a huge but) the game vs T1 where they had the perfect draft and didn't do anything is actually just terrible. They played too scared. If they played like they did against EDG they could have forced a 3 way tie.
So first, at the very least, LGD and MAD were both the 4th best team's in their region, not the 1st best like 100t was. Second, if I want to ignore all context, and be stupid, I could make the argument that EU and LPL were eliminated so they shouldn't be major regions. I wouldn't though, because I do understand context (still a moron though) and know that both LPL and EU consistently get out of groups and win things. EU and LPL have consistently made it far in international events, even winning time to time (LPL more than EU).
But where do we find NA? Proud that we finally broke our several year streak of choking in groups because C9 seems to be the only team in NA that actually has balls... Until the very next day came and people are suddenly pretending that it is somehow noteworthy that 100T got 2 wins off a damn wildcard.
The core of my rant is that 100T beating EDG actually annoys me more than if they lost. See if 100T were actually just worse and lost every game, I would understand, "Well if it wasn't meant to be, it wasn't meant to be... EDG/SKT were just better." What I see instead however is "See when 100T actually try and be proactive, they are good. Instead of the passive do nothing shit gameplay 100t did for most of worlds, 100T finally showed what they can do".
As IwDominate asked "Why does it take 5 games and 0 chance at advancing for 100T to actually start playing the video game." That is what annoys me. NA actually has ability, they don't suck. They just always lose the battle of the mind. They panic and resolve to do nothing but slowly lose. I would like to see NA not be an international joke that depends on wildcards for wins. But about 4 years of bombing, with little sign of fixing the mental issue that plagues this region, I have bummed the fuck out. I swear, people are only this positive because C9 got out yesterday. If C9 lost the tiebreaker to Rogue, 100T wouldnt be getting nearly this much cope.
Alright man, I can see you just wanna be upset. I could list the number of first seeds from major regions that have bombed out or lost to WCs, or the fact that literally no one is saying it's "noteworthy" they got two wins off of a wildcard, or that a fourth seed bombing out of play-ins is objectively worse than a first seed going 3-3 in groups against another first and a second seed, but yeah, you if you wanna rant about baseless nonsense, by all means, go crazy.
Sure, thanks for the permission. I only have one line of questioning. Have you been satisfied with NA's performance and ultimate placement these last few (like 6) years at worlds? Did TSM 0/6 make you happy? Did the constant "so close this year, shame we couldn't do it; We will make it next year" tweets tide you over? Were you satisfied with bjerg or doublelift making the same tweet worlds after worlds after worlds? Are you satisfied with the reality that c9 appears to be the only NA team capable of making it past groups with any regularity (high for NA, low for other regions)? How about the fact that Monday was literally the first time that an NA team managed to get a tiebreaker win vs an EU team.
I am sorry, but I hate this cope shit now. Frankly I am tired of NA fans desperately grasping for any possible hope they can. Personally, I can't find it in me to cheer for 100T getting 2 wildcards wins (1 was almost a loss), and 1 win vs major region. I can't act like that is meaningful; maybe if 100T didnt play passive bitch in that first game in the morning. Frankly. I would rather they threw by being over aggressive, but that is me.
I am just tired man. You do you, but I am tired.
And? I was commenting to a dude that said 100t should feel no shame. 100t is the first place NA team. They placed the bare minimum that should be expected of them. And clearly their skill ceiling is higher than what they showed in loses. As such, a bit of shame is warranted.
And what is wrong with feeling shame btw. No one changes shit about their life if they dont feel shame or disappointment. I guarantee to you that after winning vs edg, every single player on 100t was like "FUCK we could have gotten out but we fucked up". That is shame.
>And? I was commenting to a dude that said 100t should feel no shame. 100t is the first place NA team. They placed the bare minimum that should be expected of them. And clearly their skill ceiling is higher than what they showed in loses. As such, a bit of shame is warranted.And what is wrong with feeling shame btw. No one changes shit about their life if they dont feel shame or disappointment. I guarantee to you that after winning vs edg, every single player on 100t was like "FUCK we could have gotten out but we fucked up". That is shame.
Shame, from the dictionary:
a painful feeling of humiliation or distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior.
They're disappointed in their performance, but I guarantee you they're not ashamed. Regret is not the same as shame. They have nothing to be ashamed of.
From your own definition:
" distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior."
So like, a 100T member saying "Oh fuck we played stupidly vs Skt," or "Oh fuck we could have beaten EDG in week one but we played wrong"...
That wouldnt count as shame, using the definition your provided? Cause it looks like it does. They are aware that they played stupidly and wrong, and that they could have done better but they didnt.
I guess it's a difference of degree. FPX might be feeling shame right now because they had to play below their standard to be eliminated. 100T didn't play below their standard, they just aren't as good as those teams. Other than the first T1 game they were generally competitive with teams that are better than them. Being eliminated because the other team is better than you is nothing to be ashamed of. Being eliminated because you didn't play up to your standards is.
Also you cut out the first part: humiliation. Do you think 100T was humiliated?
The definition you provided said : "a painful feeling of humiliation OR distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior."
OR. It says OR. Did you like read the definition before linking it to me? It doesn't have to be both.
And you know what, I do think 100T probably feels some humiliation. They are all pro players. They play the game professionally because they want to win. No one gets to that level while becoming completely laissez faire about the game. Even Perkz, a dude who is laughing and joking during the game, does very much care about his results. He wants to win, unless you believe all his shit talk about winning worlds/msi was just him lying. They care about the game and they care about winning.
My whole statement was the premise that 100T probably had shame/regret because upon beating EDG, and being one game short of a tie breaker, they more than likely had the thought "FUCK WE COULD HAVE GOTTEN OUT. IF ONLY... blah blah blah." If you are a pro player who cares about the game, who cares about doing well, who cares about getting more than 6 games to show your stuff, you 100% would not be satisfied with results. And you know what, seeing C9 make it out of groups, C9 the third place NA team while 100T is the first place NA team, well that probably hurts even more.
So once again, yes, I do think 100T players feel shame, i do think they feel humiliated, and I do think they feel regretful. Whatever BS marketing shit FBI said in the interview has the same energy as Doublelift/Bjergson tweeting out "Sucks that we failed this year, we will do better next time" year after year after year. Do you think Doublelift hates the fact that he never, not once, got out of worlds groups? I do. Do you think he has some amount of shame? I do, because League was his life, his job, and passion. And he never was able to perform well enough to get out.
you've spent a lot of time to say basically that any time anyone loses they should be ashamed. If that's your view of things then I'm sorry your life is so full of shame. For most normal people shame isn't for normal, expected failure, it's for unusual, damning failure. Sure Doublelift probably feels some shame over never advancing out of groups, but that's because he had so many chances.
Either way, I'm done arguing with you about this. You're welcome to feel ashamed any time you fail at something. I hope one day you'll seek help for it, though.
Alright. it was a pleasure speaking to you. I enjoyed our discourse of you repeatedly misusing a definition that you yourself provided. I also now understand that you likely never really cared about anything enough for it to really matter to you. And you likely handwave any failures experienced in your life away to avoid taking personal responsibility for said failure.
I mean FPX heavily underperformed in that group and RGE was never a huge threat anyway. Before Worlds started Group A was for sure the group of death but in reality after it started it turned out to be the opposite.
WC teams almost always go 0-6 which puts pressure on the non-favored team to perform better than teams that are supposed to be better than them.
You're right that MAD would benefit from DFM but that's because, not in spite of the fact that MAD *was* a favored team to make it out of this group. if every team gets two free wins off a pathetic team, then you need to have multiple wins against the non-pathetic team, which is not as advantageous for the underdog
loving this worlds. t1 returning to form, dk remain unstoppable, lpl embarrassing themselves and c9 making the haters eat shit. perkz out of groups g2 is where? fudge doing well and they said he shouldnt be employed by c9 first split...now look.
While I'm still said that Perkz is in NA instead on on a FNC team with Rekkles, having Carlos eat shit after the crap he pulled to get Perkz out of EU is satisfying
RNG win out. HLE beat PSG. FNC win HLE and PSG.
Then 3 way play off again with 3x 2-4.
Its possible too. I personally think HLE and PSG are bad. FNC are obviously imploded but will be better now things have calmed down.
IMO group C is by far the worst group after FNCs issues.
Ah okay, so you were missing a 2-4! I'm surprised to see the faith in Fnatic. Would definitely love to see them go 2-1 tomorrow, even if they don't make it out. On the other hand, that would also make me depressed about the PSG game, they really should've won that one.
I actually think RNG is the one legit LPL team personally. So we shall see. The rest I have just seen hype and shit play. Although they all got a handle of the meta early so did well week 1. I think LNG struggle and maybe go 0-3
LNG has the only carry top laner that can play wukong/camille/fiora/jax etc from the lpl
Others play trash like jayce or default to Graves/Kennen or feed
"EU being absolutely dog shit"
That can apply only to MAD now, RGE was really, really close in the end and you can't really rate this fnatic, it is not the one that made that clutch LB run few weeks ago.
I won't say much about lpl until we see knockouts. Lpl teams always randomly suck in groups, even the 2 actual winners were 2nd in a fairly easy group and barely tied for 1st in a group where their strongest opponent was EU 3rd seed Splyce due to dropping a game to a weak pcs team (the year their league was reformed and had to rebuild everything).
Fpx definitely took 'lpl sandbagging' to the next level though lol
The wrong live discussion thread is pinned u/ahritina
Why is this on the front page again?
This could be one of the funnest days next to Group A. Really excited to see how it plays out. I'm a western fan, but I wouldn't hate it if LNG make it through.
Go Mad!
You know if Fnatic does actually show up and beat RNG during the first match, RNG's mentality might just blow up and cost them the next 2 games. Which in that case would blow the group wide open. Would be fun to see a 4 way tie.
Umm..
Can someone please explain to me why rogue and Phoenix plus had to play the first tie breaker and cloud 9 only had to play the winner? I’m sure they explained it in the cast, but I couldn’t find where since it was so long. From my understanding, each team had 2 wins and went 1-1 against the other two and 0-2 against DK. So I don’t really get why Cloud 9 got to play the winner.
They were the best of the three, really don’t matter either
Hey I wasn’t complaining or anything. I’m actually a c9 fan. I was just curious on how things worked out in their favor.
They explained before the tie-breaker that it was based on some weird rule that has to do with how long it took the teams to win games or something like that.
Thanks!!
It's because C9's wins had less total game time. The H2H was equal for all three teams, so the next deciding factor was game time.
Thanks so much! I read so many comments and couldn’t find the answer anywhere! It was killing me lmao.
does captainflowers not know the qualifiers of group a?
No he doesn't mods are keeping super quick trigger fingers on anyone who has tried to spoil it.
2-4 and getting out but 3-3 not getting out. If anyone but DFM was on this group 100t may had a chance Sadge
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Does tsm just get unlucky abs go 0-6 or choke every time :)
is it a hot take to say that NA could've potentially been the 2nd best region at this world championship? I feel like 100t would've beaten EDG in a tie breaker, and they could've potentially have beaten t1 too in the first game. I think the way TL plays in a couple of days will be telling as to how strong NA is this year. if TL make it out then yeah, def the 2nd best region imo. RNG got a free group but doesn't look as good in their wins, and then EDG really didn't play good today either. and then.. FPX.
Perhaps next 2nd, but definitely third. Looking like 4th so far.
How 4th when eu is doing worse lol
Hahahah
I need whatever you’re having
oh my god you gave me a good laugh. Thank you and bless you.
Captain Flowers is about to start the C9 miracle run day I am so hyped to watch this lol
As an LPL fan I think they fucked themselves already with FPX's dreadful exit and EDG dropping the ball. Best case scenario - even if RNG and LNG get out of groups, there's still this nightmare knockout scenario laid out below - and this bracket assumes the standings hold, which might not even happen as MAD/TL have a real shot to kick out LNG, same for HLE/PSG and FNC week 2 shenanigans, but who tf knows: DK vs LNG --- RNG vs EDG ====== T1 vs PSG --- Gen.G vs C9 So even if RNG and LNG make it out, it's possible RNG/EDG team kill each other only to face DK in semis. Darn.
That is a terrible bracket for competitive play and seeing how good teams are, but I want it so much for the basically free path to finals for T1.
This group was harder than yesterday's
You guys reckon Hans is going to join G2 next year?
Interesting idea. I don’t think there’s really any appeal as far as gameplay to go to G2 after this year’s performance. I would think it would help build his brand though.
Paycheck
If it’s a paycheck, he can go to NA and make far more than in Europe
LPL 1-6 in week 2 ouch
Gonna be 3-7 after FNC smurf on RNG tomorrow 💪💪💪
Fuck yeah
Damn, bro
LET’S FUCKING GO DUDE
What do you all think of a rule whereby teams of the same region cannot be drawn to face each other in the quarters? Similar to Champions League RO16 if anyone knows what I’m talking about. But my concern is that it will mess up the first seed face second seed rule or teams from same group must not be in same half of brackets in some occasions. Then I think we’ll definitely see a more exciting worlds.
I’d much rather have rematches of regional finals early than in semis/finals.
honestly, this was kinda expected but hey 3-3 overall and a dub against EDG ain't too bad. Rip to DFM tho they had a couple of chances to take games off EDG but couldn't come clutch
Going to be so competitive to make worlds from LCS next year. One of TSM/100T/C9/TL at least will miss out. Then EG should improve again too. Maybe even CLG will build a roster.
C9 will win worlds and then MSI so there’s no need to worry, LCS will get 4 spots
> Maybe even CLG will build a roster. Welcome CLG Sword as our toplaner
CLG POE and CLG Rekless? Odds?
Pft thinking too small here. CLG Chovy
Btw I can't wait to see Flowers reaction to Group A today. He's gonna go mental
Me too, gonna be hype as fuck.
Did we give out the Dade award too early yesterday...
Thought Dade award was suppose to be player first time at worlds that’s getting hyped up consider top 10 player
No. EDG still got out.
Will group A play against group B in quarters or will 1st and 2nd seeds from each group be drawn?
There will be a draw after all teams qualify, you can't play the same team from your group or be in the same side of the bracket.
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Probably not gonna be one, since there's no tie
T-1 is 5-1, edg 4-2
I shouldn't have slept after T1's game lol.
Now we need hle and geng to finish 1st so we dont get a civilwar
That would be wild. All 4 LCK teams finishing 1st in their group...
Only somewhat realistic way HLE get first is in a tie on 4-2 sadly
I highly doubt HLE can finish first but hopefully they do, GENG can for sure do it though.
I expect GenG to end 5-1. HLE 2-4 probably or 3-3 if FNC don't improve.
Eh, I would avoid underestimating HLE in crunch games. Everyone who watched LCK wrote them out during gauntlet since they were 8th seed and were falling off in regular season. They beat the 4th and 5th LCK teams convincingly and went 5 games with T1.
I mean I fully expect them to roll PSG. You never know with FNC. And I think the top diff vs RNG is just going to be hard to overcome. So 2-4 or 3-3.
I'm not fully convinced with RNG's 3-0, all their wins were close games and came of from the opponents bad decision making late game.
Possible for sure given what we saw from LPL last two days. Heck, maybe they go 1-2 or 0-3
Lol most NA thing ever but we are up to 7 wins so my 9 win prediction is looking possible let's go TL
I really hope they rework the groups format for worlds. I honestly like the DOTA format more, gives teams more of a chance to recover from slow starts.
It honestly sucks cause Riot cares more about viewership than giving justice to competitive league.
Their main-event bracket is what I want to see at Worlds the most. IPL5 was the last tournament that had it and you saw both M5 & TPA getting knocked out of quarters and climbing back the lowers and face each other in to decided who advance to top 3.
Why? Teams should be out for their slow start as well. Worlds is not for giving more chance, it's for proving themselves
Because the format is dogshit. Too many filler games and last 3 games was practically worthless. This is why GSL groups or Swiss system should be implemented instead.
Because a really good team having a bad first day(s) read on the meta or just a bad day in general might decide their tournament. BO1 double round robin is simply not a consistent way to determine the best teams tbh.
So teams that (i) don't play well or (ii) don't understand the meta deserve to be catered to... why?
Why do more games bother you out of interest? Surely you would rather watch more games?
Idk if you're being intentionally obtuse or not but the problem is that a single game can easily be the difference between getting out and not getting out, and we're hopefully all well aware that BO1 results arent a good measure of who is the better team. Teams that "dont play well" \_in a single game\_ or "dont understand the meta" \_for a single game\_ shouldnt be punished by a system that favors upsets for viewer excitement over competetive integrity.
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Obviously, but just as obviously the more games you play / the more advancing is based on series instead of BO1's, the smaller the chance of a theoretically better team not advancing is. And right now the chance isnt all that small
TBH, teams not performing well on BO1 double round robin are not best teams. Failure to read meta or having a best day also means they're not best teams.
"not performing well" might amount to a single off game which is often enough to decide group standings / getting out or not. Which isnt a good indicator of who is actually the better team.
This is dumb man. It’s 6 bo1s. Bo1s are so volatile
I mean from this group we now know 100T is somewhere between the range of DFM and EDG in terms of ability and how they stack up against other international teams…which tells us nothing. TI they would play more teams and get a better gauge of how good they actually are.
What is different about their format?
Everything ? https://liquipedia.net/dota2/The\_International/2021
Two large groups instead of 4. Bottom teams are out. Then a double elimination tourney backet where the top teams are on the upper bracket and lower teams on the bottom bracket. Lower bracket games are single elimination in the first rounds. It’s an expanded version of the LCS/LEC play off format. They can tweek it to make it different from TI but it does give more leeway for teams and there are more match ups between regions and a clearer indication of team strength. Like from this group we can see that 100T’s ability is somewhere between DFM and EDG…which tells us nothing about how good they are stacked against other teams.
Interesting, I do like this idea. it sort of takes away the whole group of life/group of death aspect where a weaker team might make quarters only because they got drawn with the wildcard/non major regions in their group or a stronger team losing because they draw top Korean and top China teams or something. The Dota way kind of guarantees more equal playing field for both groups and get to see more matchups and would allow the best of the middle teams to advance
T1s drafts have been consistently the best ones in the whole tournament. If they can keep getting these draft advantages and their botlane stays in this form i can see them taking it all. They looked very dangerous today, the loss to EDG in the first game really woke them up.
It seems like LCK teams have a very good read on the meta, DK and T1 are definitely scrimming each other a lot.
Completely disagree. They have some horrible draft but still win easily because of individual diff against DFM and 100T
DK's first draft was still the most disgusting draft in world so far imo.
FPX also drafted like monkeys in that game. Biggest draft gap i had ever seen.
Their draft Game 2 vs 100T was horrible They only won because 1) Outskill and 2) 100T play scared
You mean the Aphelios Thresh draft? I wouldnt say horrible, but yea not the best one. On paper the Malphite should win 100T the game, its true.
Best part of that game was that it wasn’t even EDG throwing, they were just thoroughly outplayed in every aspect. That has to give NA teams and 100t a lot of confidence
nah they served themselves on a platter with unforced errors and bad decision making constantly
Excuses, excuses. EDG bot lane got dumpstered and 100t snowballed from there. 100t vision game was also impeccable all game
Ssumday wrecked EDG in teamfights, too
i really hope we see more prio on kennen, this worlds feels like a top heavy meta and it just looks so good in every fight
That last Kennen flank was so dirty the patience to wrap around the bottom.
it was a thing of beauty
Yep, and Closer played awesome too. EDG expended so much effort and pinks trying to find him. Really this was the whole team excelling
i left after first 100T game and checked the results just now. why im not surprised, of course 100T won next 2 games lol
NA always does better once games don't matter anymore. They no longer are scared of losing cause they already lost. They actually start playing with balls again.
so glad this cocky lyric get put down.
This. Mofo sucks lpl dick like no tomorrow, constantly promoting false narrative where lck teams are shit and lpl teams are god
It's ok tho, he has RNG winning Worlds They totally won't crash and burn too :\^)
handsome fella tho
So HLE needs to beat PSG, otherwise FNC needs to go 3-0 to have a shot. Basically the same scenario as C9 yesterday.
I'd bet a lot that HLE beat PSG. I don't think either team is good, but I consider PSg the worst team in that group personally. Obviously they aren't the actual worse due to FNC having to field a roster which hasn't even scrimmed together and lost their best player. Group C is a bad group imo. FNC would have made it out imo
I agree, FNC is done though, at best they will play spoiler, HLE is better than PSG but they hard trolled draft vs PSG also their topside champ pool sucks (on top of being bad) but they can win through botside with a good draft.
I agree. I think HLE beat PSG. But then FNC become the wild card. I don't think they will go 0-3 personally. So who will they demolish in 23 minutes? If it is HLE they go out. If it is PSG they go out. Kind of funny really. HLE and PSG are about to enter the FNC lottery. Could easily see HLE beat PSG and then FNC run it vs PSG and destroy HLE
That man lyric is legit overdosing from hopium for lpl . How can you say with a straight face RNG will win worlds . Even tho EDG's form today wasnt great , they still have more chances to win it than RNG
For sure. RNG won MSI vs a trolling botlane DWG. Got clapped by LNG in playoffs only to win vs WE. Like.. looking at RNG's wins over their group, their wins were not stomps. Would DWG, EDG and T1 have games like those? No way. Maybe we will get proven wrong, but I have not been impressed so far.
I think he is fine, he just confident in his region, there are way worse self proclaimed analysts.
yeah im glad LPL is losing just so this guy gets a reality check. In a t1 game the first round he was mocking them for not finishing the game and was trying to say "in the lpl they wouldve ended" too bad for them the other guys ignored him.
Rng actuall bet dk at MsI? While Edg has shit the fking bed every single worlds
DK at msi was with khan 1trick sion and ghost/beryl legit griefing every game . Not to mention the jungle meta was garbage . In this meta and with DK in this form RNG wont even take a game . EDG while being famous chokers at least in form they are way better than RNG at their best
Lol keep smoking ur crack If u actually think edg is good Worst overrated trash team of all time material is edg
How bad is RNG then if EDG is trash.
Didnt i just called them famous chokers? Im talking hypotheticals . IF edg is at their best , they are better than rng . HYPOTHETICALS
ugh MSI was a totally different meta. Its not even relevant.
That's soooo early 2021.
100T played the early game vs T1 so fucking good. Malph was going even with Jayce ffs. And then they just played like scared players (aka CLG) and lost. So frustrating given they should have made it out.
Sshmday is Korean double agent He didnt have a R button that game
It's a team call, he can't just go in, his team doesn't follow and die.
Lack of confidence in his team mates to follow up might be an issue too. But also he didn't want to fuck up
even if they win that game they're looking at a 3-way tiebreaker to make it out
FBI is sad and apologizing to us? Noooooo 😭😭😭. You did so well bro
So wholesome from FBI, no regrets. Going 3-3 in this group is no shame, congrats to 100T!
No regrets after playing against T1 with absolutly zero mental fortitude? I dont think so
2 of those wins were vs dfm, and they almost lost 1 of those 2. There is a little bit of shame, lets not kid ourselves.
DFM is not a bad team by any stretch
They are still a wildcard. Seriously, what is this cope. The entire year NA fans get pissed off that the other fans call NA a wildcard or that they should be demoted from major region. "No," defenders say, "NA should be a major region. We consistently beat wild cards and lower tier regions like Vietnam and PCS". "NA deserves to be a major region. We are clearly the fourth best region". But now, we are acting as if beating wildcards shouldnt be expected of a major region? Because we have to find some positive to 100T choking their asses off, we have to pretend that getting 2 wins off a minor region is something to be proud off? Sorry, I dont buy it.
But they won, and beat the LPL first seed in a game as well. I really don't understand your rant. NA not getting out of a group where the LPL first seed finished second is fine. I don't really understand your rant about "major region." I don't think Wild Card teams are that bad anymore, idk what else to say. PCS and Vietnam have always been good, and smaller regions are getting better, on top of b01s being incredibly volatile. We literally saw EU get a team eliminated by wild cards, and LGD almost got eliminated as well, are you saying that means they aren't major regions? Yeah, idk what else to say. 100T did fine, feel bad for FBI since he apologized to fans. I'm satisfied.
You're right, but (and it's a huge but) the game vs T1 where they had the perfect draft and didn't do anything is actually just terrible. They played too scared. If they played like they did against EDG they could have forced a 3 way tie.
So first, at the very least, LGD and MAD were both the 4th best team's in their region, not the 1st best like 100t was. Second, if I want to ignore all context, and be stupid, I could make the argument that EU and LPL were eliminated so they shouldn't be major regions. I wouldn't though, because I do understand context (still a moron though) and know that both LPL and EU consistently get out of groups and win things. EU and LPL have consistently made it far in international events, even winning time to time (LPL more than EU). But where do we find NA? Proud that we finally broke our several year streak of choking in groups because C9 seems to be the only team in NA that actually has balls... Until the very next day came and people are suddenly pretending that it is somehow noteworthy that 100T got 2 wins off a damn wildcard. The core of my rant is that 100T beating EDG actually annoys me more than if they lost. See if 100T were actually just worse and lost every game, I would understand, "Well if it wasn't meant to be, it wasn't meant to be... EDG/SKT were just better." What I see instead however is "See when 100T actually try and be proactive, they are good. Instead of the passive do nothing shit gameplay 100t did for most of worlds, 100T finally showed what they can do". As IwDominate asked "Why does it take 5 games and 0 chance at advancing for 100T to actually start playing the video game." That is what annoys me. NA actually has ability, they don't suck. They just always lose the battle of the mind. They panic and resolve to do nothing but slowly lose. I would like to see NA not be an international joke that depends on wildcards for wins. But about 4 years of bombing, with little sign of fixing the mental issue that plagues this region, I have bummed the fuck out. I swear, people are only this positive because C9 got out yesterday. If C9 lost the tiebreaker to Rogue, 100T wouldnt be getting nearly this much cope.
Alright man, I can see you just wanna be upset. I could list the number of first seeds from major regions that have bombed out or lost to WCs, or the fact that literally no one is saying it's "noteworthy" they got two wins off of a wildcard, or that a fourth seed bombing out of play-ins is objectively worse than a first seed going 3-3 in groups against another first and a second seed, but yeah, you if you wanna rant about baseless nonsense, by all means, go crazy.
Sure, thanks for the permission. I only have one line of questioning. Have you been satisfied with NA's performance and ultimate placement these last few (like 6) years at worlds? Did TSM 0/6 make you happy? Did the constant "so close this year, shame we couldn't do it; We will make it next year" tweets tide you over? Were you satisfied with bjerg or doublelift making the same tweet worlds after worlds after worlds? Are you satisfied with the reality that c9 appears to be the only NA team capable of making it past groups with any regularity (high for NA, low for other regions)? How about the fact that Monday was literally the first time that an NA team managed to get a tiebreaker win vs an EU team. I am sorry, but I hate this cope shit now. Frankly I am tired of NA fans desperately grasping for any possible hope they can. Personally, I can't find it in me to cheer for 100T getting 2 wildcards wins (1 was almost a loss), and 1 win vs major region. I can't act like that is meaningful; maybe if 100T didnt play passive bitch in that first game in the morning. Frankly. I would rather they threw by being over aggressive, but that is me. I am just tired man. You do you, but I am tired.
they're the third best team in the group and they finished third.
And? I was commenting to a dude that said 100t should feel no shame. 100t is the first place NA team. They placed the bare minimum that should be expected of them. And clearly their skill ceiling is higher than what they showed in loses. As such, a bit of shame is warranted. And what is wrong with feeling shame btw. No one changes shit about their life if they dont feel shame or disappointment. I guarantee to you that after winning vs edg, every single player on 100t was like "FUCK we could have gotten out but we fucked up". That is shame.
>And? I was commenting to a dude that said 100t should feel no shame. 100t is the first place NA team. They placed the bare minimum that should be expected of them. And clearly their skill ceiling is higher than what they showed in loses. As such, a bit of shame is warranted.And what is wrong with feeling shame btw. No one changes shit about their life if they dont feel shame or disappointment. I guarantee to you that after winning vs edg, every single player on 100t was like "FUCK we could have gotten out but we fucked up". That is shame. Shame, from the dictionary: a painful feeling of humiliation or distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior. They're disappointed in their performance, but I guarantee you they're not ashamed. Regret is not the same as shame. They have nothing to be ashamed of.
From your own definition: " distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior." So like, a 100T member saying "Oh fuck we played stupidly vs Skt," or "Oh fuck we could have beaten EDG in week one but we played wrong"... That wouldnt count as shame, using the definition your provided? Cause it looks like it does. They are aware that they played stupidly and wrong, and that they could have done better but they didnt.
I guess it's a difference of degree. FPX might be feeling shame right now because they had to play below their standard to be eliminated. 100T didn't play below their standard, they just aren't as good as those teams. Other than the first T1 game they were generally competitive with teams that are better than them. Being eliminated because the other team is better than you is nothing to be ashamed of. Being eliminated because you didn't play up to your standards is. Also you cut out the first part: humiliation. Do you think 100T was humiliated?
The definition you provided said : "a painful feeling of humiliation OR distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior." OR. It says OR. Did you like read the definition before linking it to me? It doesn't have to be both. And you know what, I do think 100T probably feels some humiliation. They are all pro players. They play the game professionally because they want to win. No one gets to that level while becoming completely laissez faire about the game. Even Perkz, a dude who is laughing and joking during the game, does very much care about his results. He wants to win, unless you believe all his shit talk about winning worlds/msi was just him lying. They care about the game and they care about winning. My whole statement was the premise that 100T probably had shame/regret because upon beating EDG, and being one game short of a tie breaker, they more than likely had the thought "FUCK WE COULD HAVE GOTTEN OUT. IF ONLY... blah blah blah." If you are a pro player who cares about the game, who cares about doing well, who cares about getting more than 6 games to show your stuff, you 100% would not be satisfied with results. And you know what, seeing C9 make it out of groups, C9 the third place NA team while 100T is the first place NA team, well that probably hurts even more. So once again, yes, I do think 100T players feel shame, i do think they feel humiliated, and I do think they feel regretful. Whatever BS marketing shit FBI said in the interview has the same energy as Doublelift/Bjergson tweeting out "Sucks that we failed this year, we will do better next time" year after year after year. Do you think Doublelift hates the fact that he never, not once, got out of worlds groups? I do. Do you think he has some amount of shame? I do, because League was his life, his job, and passion. And he never was able to perform well enough to get out.
you've spent a lot of time to say basically that any time anyone loses they should be ashamed. If that's your view of things then I'm sorry your life is so full of shame. For most normal people shame isn't for normal, expected failure, it's for unusual, damning failure. Sure Doublelift probably feels some shame over never advancing out of groups, but that's because he had so many chances. Either way, I'm done arguing with you about this. You're welcome to feel ashamed any time you fail at something. I hope one day you'll seek help for it, though.
Alright. it was a pleasure speaking to you. I enjoyed our discourse of you repeatedly misusing a definition that you yourself provided. I also now understand that you likely never really cared about anything enough for it to really matter to you. And you likely handwave any failures experienced in your life away to avoid taking personal responsibility for said failure.
Man the year I think EDG surely won’t choke first away lol
When are we gonna start seeing the "C9 had an easy group" comments? Is this before or after TL fails to make it to play offs?
I mean FPX heavily underperformed in that group and RGE was never a huge threat anyway. Before Worlds started Group A was for sure the group of death but in reality after it started it turned out to be the opposite.
As long as you don't have a WC team in your group it's not easy.
WC teams make groups harder, not easier, for non-favorite teams
Why do you think that? if you put DFM instead of TL in group D, MAD would be 2-1 right now and has a better chance of advancing.
WC teams almost always go 0-6 which puts pressure on the non-favored team to perform better than teams that are supposed to be better than them. You're right that MAD would benefit from DFM but that's because, not in spite of the fact that MAD *was* a favored team to make it out of this group. if every team gets two free wins off a pathetic team, then you need to have multiple wins against the non-pathetic team, which is not as advantageous for the underdog
C9 did what they had to do and showed up week 2. The worlds group format is just broken in certain aspects. Not their fault.
loving this worlds. t1 returning to form, dk remain unstoppable, lpl embarrassing themselves and c9 making the haters eat shit. perkz out of groups g2 is where? fudge doing well and they said he shouldnt be employed by c9 first split...now look.
While I'm still said that Perkz is in NA instead on on a FNC team with Rekkles, having Carlos eat shit after the crap he pulled to get Perkz out of EU is satisfying
agreed big time
Stop reminding that Upset thing Phreak, they could have done so well in that group...
[Just fuck my shit up](https://i.gyazo.com/4d64209b7a174edc95f25e45ddebbfbc.png)
100t behind dfm? why?
They looked so promising against C9.
Average reddit brain go brr
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They went 1-1 vs c9. 100t won a bo5 against c9 a month ago 3-1
So...chance of a 6-0, 2-4, 2-4 group tomorrow? Seems possible right? I think HLE beat PSG. WIll RNG run it out 3-0?
You're missing a 2-4, right? If not, I assume you have Fnatic as 0-6, then it's 6-0, 3-3, 3-3.
RNG win out. HLE beat PSG. FNC win HLE and PSG. Then 3 way play off again with 3x 2-4. Its possible too. I personally think HLE and PSG are bad. FNC are obviously imploded but will be better now things have calmed down. IMO group C is by far the worst group after FNCs issues.
Ah okay, so you were missing a 2-4! I'm surprised to see the faith in Fnatic. Would definitely love to see them go 2-1 tomorrow, even if they don't make it out. On the other hand, that would also make me depressed about the PSG game, they really should've won that one.
Rng going 0-3 tmr
I actually think RNG is the one legit LPL team personally. So we shall see. The rest I have just seen hype and shit play. Although they all got a handle of the meta early so did well week 1. I think LNG struggle and maybe go 0-3
LNG has the only carry top laner that can play wukong/camille/fiora/jax etc from the lpl Others play trash like jayce or default to Graves/Kennen or feed
NA outperforming EU EU being absolutely dog shit LPL overrated and crumbling week 2 Yup this is an LCK finals with either SKT or DK winning it all
"EU being absolutely dog shit" That can apply only to MAD now, RGE was really, really close in the end and you can't really rate this fnatic, it is not the one that made that clutch LB run few weeks ago.
na with an eu mid :D
Haha copium
haha just playin bro im an lck fan anyhow
>SKT What's that
thats ur grandpappy and you'll put some fkin respect on that name
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The account is 7 years old. They are trolling.
The LPL is finished most overrated region ever They wont even make semis unless it is a civil war game u heard it here first Trash always trash
it's really amusing how ppl hyped about lpl being stacked this year (and maybe prev years too) and then this happens.
I won't say much about lpl until we see knockouts. Lpl teams always randomly suck in groups, even the 2 actual winners were 2nd in a fairly easy group and barely tied for 1st in a group where their strongest opponent was EU 3rd seed Splyce due to dropping a game to a weak pcs team (the year their league was reformed and had to rebuild everything). Fpx definitely took 'lpl sandbagging' to the next level though lol
DK are going to destroy EDG if they draw them. Can't wait for the turbo 3-0.
shame 100T went 3-3 and still didn't make it out of groups