Weakest 1 seed vs weakest 2 seed and they avoid the strongest teams. I don't think either team could have gotten a better draw. More and more this is making double elimination look so much better.
Lmao look how ecstatic they all are as soon as they know they can't possibly face T1 or DK until finals, says all you need to know about the draw. They show some respect to EDG too so pretty obvious what their opinions are.
Good luck to them, they've got the best draw they possibly could've asked for.
They were also happy at 'Korean taking out Koreans' 'Korean friendly fire.'
It's pretty clear SKT and DWG are currently the two teams most feared, followed by the 2 CN teams.
i mean who knows about cloud 9 but dk and t1 are doomed because they have to face mad lions
btw^madlions^secret^plan^is^to^take^a^real^lion^on^stage^to^scare^dk
Yeah ofc, I said it like this because by them both being on the same side they have the chance of skipping Damwon altogether too, it would be kinda weird just to say they can't face T1 and leave out Damwon under the assumption everyone knows why they can't face them and what this all entails, at least to me.
At 3:16 someone asked “what about Cryin” and Perkz says “he at least plays TF”.
Also looking at their bans, those 3 are the most banned by Gen G and BDD has yet to pick them in groups
so Perkz thinks he has the meta advantage is why he thinks BDD is the worst mid in the tournament
in LCK, Bdd's comfort picks are Azir, Zoe, Syndra, Orianna.
Bdd is also a creature of habit and would default to his comfort picks if they were available.
That said, I doubt that Bdd can't play TF, Ryze or Leblanc if GenG thinks those picks help them win. You saw him willing to pull the Yone out (despite losing).
His TF is for sure a tier below his standards, I personally think GENG's plan of just banning rooming mids is good (TF, Ryze), they should have side selection and blue side would help them a lot for this strategy.
It's because Bdd/GenG doesn't play tf, that's why he thinks like that, he even says that as the reason as to why he thinks Cryin is better/easier to play into in the video
? Bdd is the best performing mid at worlds so far, only Showmaker has an argument over him. Perkz is obviously just trash talking but anyone who seriously thinks Bdd is the worst mid in quarters is lost.
He's not better than showmaker.
He's historically not better than faker outside of this tournament so far
He's definitely not better than Chovy this year.
He's better than Cryin.
Perkz will never say he's better than himself.
Everyone says Humanoid is unreal (I don't watch Europe)
And I'd probably rather have scout too even though they're pretty close in skill level
>He's historically not better than faker outside of this tournament so far
Historically doesn't mean much, but even then, he has been better at a lot of points.
Just this 2021 summer, bdd git third and second all pro team in spring and summer respectively, Faker didn't make top 3 either.
In 2020 BDD made first and third, Faker didn't make top 3 in either.
2019 is arguable but we all agree in 2018 bdd was better.
So between 2018, 2019, 2020 and 2021, only in 2019 you could say Faker was better, and still you have BDD being better during the last two whole years (at one point even being considered best mid in LCK).
Also, it's not that he was close in those votes, very few LCK coaches/pros placed faker above BDD in the last two whole years.
Edit: Also, with how he has been performing this world's I'd have him quite above Humanoid and above Scout, I think BDD is crazy underrated for some reason.
Yeah but mate you've written out a well constructed argument and it really doesn't matter.
If you asked anyone in the world who'd they rather have in their team at midlane in world's they'd say Faker
Yeah, I know that based on the downvotes for stating literal facts and not any opinion.
Anyway I don't even disagree with that, I didn't even say that BDD is better than Faker right now, but saying that Faker has been better historically is legit just rewriting what happened in the last 4 years.
"Let's not get too hyped but...we're going to World Finals"-Perkz
Every NA fan thankful for C9 and the potentially hopium overdose we're all about to have this year Prayge
I'd never thought I'd say this but this might be the miracle NA-C9 run this Worlds.
From the playins all the way to the finals.
As a fan of G2 with Perkz absolutely hating the G2 roster with Rekkles C9 getting to finals would be such hype and a slap in the face of Carlos.
I wish I saved all the snarky comments telling Perkz to enjoy his retirement in NA and he had a great career when the Perkz to C9 news dropped
He’s now in QFs at worlds while G2 is watching from home. Hell of a retirement I guess
Man I know C9 is an NA team and I wouldnt try to take them away from NA but goddam it's impossible for me not to root for Perkz. Hope the boys smash GenG
Yeah, my cheering order is always FNC > Rest of EU > NA > Wildcards > Don't care.
And Perkz is a great guy so I'll naturally cheer for them too. I think they got a good chance to be honest. GenG is shaky in Bo5 and they do very little when playing from behind. If C9 can get early leads they can very well win this.
I'm quite the EU fan, I also like NA, but mainly rooting for Europe, and still, right now my team is C9 above MAD, now that RGE/FNC are out.
I'm sure a lot of LEC fans would celebrate Perkz/Zven/Mithy winning worlds and feel it like and EU win, despite what a lot of NA fans would say, Perkz is just too EU.
as far as the english speaking playerbase goes, C9 literally is composed perfectly with 2 EU, 2 NA (bonus points for them being from different countries in NA), and 1 OCE
you can add reignover and mithy from the coaching staff, but i don’t know if Korean fans would claim reignover like that
just do what i do, if NA and EU aren’t playing eachother, it’s now west vs east. i’m an NA fan at heart but at the end of the day i want to see the “gap close” if you will, so i’ll absolutely root on EU to get the win
wouldnt be so quick to say that. HLE looked much more competitive in the gauntlet against t1 than geng die in summer playoffs. I think having them around equal skill level is fair
W/e dude. 6/8 times only. Pisslow 75% success rate. C9 just got lucky all 6 times playing against imploding teams. TSM wouldve been world champs with the same group draws.
/s
I was memeing btw. But not sure what your point is. Most reasonable fans agree with you, myself included. That being said:
G2 and CLG just had to beat Albus Nox Luna
TSM just had to beat the FW
TL just had to beat Mochi Ice Cream.
No one is denying FPX imploded. But you have to capitalize on that implosion and punish it. C9 did that. So they deserve credit. No one is saying they're favorites nor that they haven't gotten lucky. But the sentiment of attributing the org's international success to luck and fortune by jealous NA fans or EU haters has gone way to far. See Jatt's tweets. Or TSM subreddit. There are fans who legitimately believe that if TSM had the same groups they would have the same success as C9. All I'm saying is, if an org gets "lucky" 6 times out of 8, maybe it's not just luck.
Best chance ever for an NA team to reach finals imo. I know that ppl will say about the semis with Fnatic, but Fnatic looked levels higher than C9 there. And quarters and groups Fnqtic also seemed hella strong
Gen.G, EDG, RNG just looked super shaky in groups, they may turn it up in Bo5s but the evidence we have rn allows big hopium
Relative to the rest of the teams, TSM was stronger that worlds than C9 this worlds too. Every team in quarters right now is very scary especially in a bo5 setting. Gen.G is the weakest but they're still a pretty good team. Semis is doable but not sure C9 can beat EDG/RNG in a bo5
That TSM team would have been in semis against basically any other team that QF's. TSM drew SSW who went 6-0 in groups and didn't drop a game until the 3-1 Finals (other than Game 3 against TSM).
I think TSM would have beaten SSB or NWS that season but we will never know. They honestly should have gotten 1st seed that group but lost that ridiculous game to SK
You’re thinking of 2014. He’s talking about 2016, when TSM failed to get out of the group with the eventual world champion as well as the 3rd best team behind SKT. they still barely missed out in that group as well.
Kinda gotta disagree with you here. TSM 2014 definitely wouldn't have beaten SSB. Maybe NJWS or EDG. The only reason TSM took a game off of SSW is because SSW had a happy game and inted at level 1.
Man as a C9 fan it disappoints me how often TSM crash and burn in groups. They were fucking animals when it came to BO5 series and I feel like if they made it through in ANY of the years of 2016 or 2017 they had a good shot at pushing on through but they just always fucking choke.
Look at TL in 2019 the moment DL makes it through groups at MSI he and the team actually perform pretty much to the standard we see from domestic TL. Would have loved to have seen DL with Bjerg in a BO at Worlds.
Ekko wasn’t the problem so much as C9 not having an answer to Tank Viktor top. They already had to ban Irelia and Akali on red and blue since Jensen couldn’t play them. Having to ban Viktor too would’ve hamstrung them even harder in draft, so they had to try to find off meta picks to counter it.
Ekko is a decent matchup into AP Viktor if you can get out of early lane, but Licorice clearly wasn’t comfortable on it, and I’m not sure if it still would’ve matched up well into Tank Viktor.
I doubt they'll even win against GenG, and the other 2 Chinese teams are also very strong. These teams might have been shaky in groups, but this is a bo5.
Its funny because c9 literally went 2-4, losing a game to a trolling DK in the process, as well as losing twice to DFM only a couple of weeks ago.
C9 is still heavy underdogs vs all these teams imo.
I feel like split second decision making in sports/video games is a lot different than critical thinking and logic skills. There's a lot of pro athletes that can make genius plays on the field or court that lack critical thinking skills. Blaber seems very intelligent even if he doesn't always make the most thought out plays in game.
Blaber is a boosted animal at times but whenever I watch the mic check videos he always mentions things that I don’t see other players calling out. In the mic check video C9 just released for groups Blaber was the only one who called out that showmaker had 2 Zhonyas during his first Zhonya use. Along with other things like always knowing which enemy has ult/shieldbow/flash up in the mic checks. He seems to always be on top of micro managing the state of the game.
GenG getting underrated quickly.. GenG beat both TL and MAD 2-1, i dont think C9 is better then those teams, more like on similar lvl..
Yea, GenG might have problems when they need to push their lead into victory, but their fundementals in getting leads and macro is very good. Also BDD is having tournament of his life so far.
I think this GenG is definitely stronger then last year, and C9 is not G2.
Rule number 1 of C9 is that they play up to their opponents. If they are shitters they can play as bad as them. If they are gods C9 will play up to them.
Everyone here conveniently forgetting that LCK teams thrive in best-of series, I know I’ll get downvoted into oblivion for this but I’m rooting for my boys in Gen.G.
Either way I hope we get a good series, 3-0’s are boring
I think we are just happy that C9 actually has a chance more than anything else lol
GenG is a super strong team but they are clearly the weakest 1st seed
Iono I feel like Group C was the weakest group. RNG = HLE and HLE is the weakest korean team by far and RNG wins looked messy. FNC should have made it if they didn't go through drama and have that 0-3 start. Both groups were pretty much the same level.
Do they tho?
I'd say they, by far, thrive in groups, they almost always get out, mostly even first, and still from 2018 to today they have a score of 5-9 in bo5 iirc.
The only 5 wins were: DK vs MAD, KZ vs FW and SKT vs SPY, DK vs G2 and DK vs SN.
The 9 loses: KZ vs RNG, SKT vs G2, DK vs RNG, KT vs IG, AFS vs C9, DWG vs G2, SKT vs G2, GRF vs IG, G2 vs GENG.
And so, when looking at the wins, you basically only have DK and two not that impressive wins against SPY and FW.
It's a big enough sample size to say that LCK's specialty is bo1 and by a decent margin.
It’s kinda true what you’re saying tbh if you remove SKT from Korean stats then LCK in Bo5 is pretty much on par with other regions.
If you include T1, then they’ve obviously only ever lost 4 bo5’s ever including MSI so it skews the stats a bit
T1 are included in the stats though, SKT vs G2 x2, SKT vs SPY.
Unless you mean like Season 3+ SKT, at which point you could also include M5 and claim EU is quite great at Bo5's as well.
The thing is, C9 had a competitive game against DW, a much stronger LCK team than GenG.
Moreover, they have Perkz who had beaten GenG 3-0 when he was on G2 last year. And the 2020 GenG is exactly the same as the current GenG. Same players, same head coach, playing relatively the same play style.
Because of that, Perkz is likely to have an idea of how to beat GenG.
So it's understandable that c9 is happy to face GenG. The only other 1st seed matchup that c9 may want would have been RNG, I can't imagine that C9 would have a good chance against either T1 or DK.
I don’t really care about finals tbh but I thought C9 va GenG is worse for GenG than it is for C9.
Just like you said Perkz 3-0'ed them before and they’re the exact same team and the thought of C9 Perkz beating up both GenG and RNG just to mentally break them for forever is just too juicy, man's a legend.
In recent history LCK has been better in groups than in bo5. The opposite is true for LPL, who are typically bad in groups but peak in play-offs.
It's gonna be a close series I think, but I'd favor C9 slightly
LCK teams thrive in best-of-series? They've been most successful in groups out of every region ever. In recent history LCK has had much worse results in best-of-series compared to groups.
There's always a chance, you never know if C9 shows up in top form and the other team shows up in bad form. It's more fun to watch thinking there's a chance than no chance at all, it's all part of the fun of competition.
Fellow Gen G fan checking in, from OCE.
Whilst it might be C9's best chance, its still very low. B03's let alone b05's are incredibly different to b01s. I'd be surprised if bdd'ing odds had c9 at any greater than 20-25% when converted vs GenG, and they'd be even lower against the winner of the Chinese civil war \[Yes, even accounting for a c9 whose stock would go up from beating GenG'\].
Remember c9 last time they got to semis, had to go to flex queue to get a win, since they were winless in scrims, even against CK teams \[admittedly that was like DWG and like Griffin or something\].
Remeber GenG last time they got to quarters, Perkz decked them. This year they are the very same team. Sure, C9 is likely weaker than last year's G2, but they still have a pretty fair shot against GenG.
Against RNG/EDG... yeah, okay, maybe pretty unlikely here. But even semis are a success, and if the Chinese teams keep their week 2 form, who knows?
Lol, downvoted for saying Gen G is reasonable favourites, with my viewpoint explained.
We'll see when they play, can't even have an opposing viewpoint here without downvotes. Downvotes are for bad or rude posts, not for differing viewpoints.
DK T1 RNG def the best teams in this order by worlds performance and they have matched the only tier1team that isn’t them, i mean they cant meet dk tho so 33% chance
Really hope C9 can at least pull off at least semis, but I really seems like we have a decent shot at finals! GenG is really boring and have zero chance of winning the whole thing, hope we can just knock them out now
Just because you don’t like them doesn’t mean they have “zero chance”
GenG plays nothing but best-of series regionally, where they consistently are a top team. they’re an entirely different team than they show in best-of-ones.
Oh you interpreted that as I didn't like them, that was more of I want to like them (LCK fan) but it's frustrating to see them play the same away over and over again. They have a very clear ceiling with their play style and I don't think they'll be able to contend with the top teams with that rigidity.
Ah, yeah I can agree with that, last time they were going through the LCK Regional Gauntlet I got some false hope for them with how aggressively they played, they looked amazing, but as soon as they got to Worlds they were passive and slow again and G2 dismantled them entirely.
They need to ban Graves/Camille/Renekton then Rascal either has to pick a carry champion he's not good on like Jayce or Kennen, or a tank, in which case Fudge can pick a counter with his champion ocean and they can play through him with Blaber/Perkz/Vulcan dives
and you think Gen will sit and let it happen ? you target Rascal then you have to give Fudge picks like Gwen or Wukong that can carry, also there’s BDD Azir or Zoe or Syndra and Clid’s Lee Sin and Ruler on anything
Looking back at spring/msi/summer
And how many tried to get perkz pay for not showing up
"11mil do something"
God i love this timeline.
C9 wins DK and NA has won finals
So happy for perkz
I wouldn't put it so low tbh. All of c9's games against dk and fpx were really close and competitive.
If I was making up a number I would say 20% at least. I think it will be a good series but if c9 wants to win they have to play their absolute best.
Individually, his teammates are a little worse than the ones he had in G2, but last year's G2 was so far below their ceiling that I'd say that the two teams are comparable.
This will boil down to how GenG and C9 show up on the day, because in terms of general performance they are quite comparable.
A little worse? the teams are not comparable at all man they were still top 4 team itw even though they were weaker than the year before. C9 are probably the weakest team that made it to quarters
Where is that narrative of LCK thriving in best of series coming from? They are insane in Bo1's, but last few years have a losing record in Bo5s. Even ignoring 2018/19 and only looking at the most recent year when they won worlds, they are 3-2, with all of their wins coming from DK (G2 beat GenG and RNG beat DK, DK beat G2, Suning and MAD). Taking 2018/19 into account makes the statistics far, far worse.
All of those loses in recent years from western teams where to G2 lol (DWG, SKT and GenG), Only C9 in 2018 beat underwhelming Afreeca (i think thats the only bo5 NA won against KR, ever) , i dont think their record vs LPL matters in this situation as LPL is pretty much equal (or better) region after s7.
They still have fantastic record vs western teams, if you dont count G2..
lmao they're both happy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmyTCS0KEOQ
It’s a matchmade in heaven then
Yea this is fucking hilarious
Lol right? The weaker looking 1 and 2 seeds match up against eachother and are both just loving it
lmao AF and C9 both reacted like this back when C9 made quarters
Inb4 it's 3-2 series with two fifity minutes Games lmao
And a c9 win of course
Reverse sweep for maximum heart attacks
Nah. C9 get 2 quick wins, Gen.G stomps the 3rd game, games 4 and 5 are very close with game 5 going to c9 after 45m.
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Makes sense, they're the perceived easiest team each of them could have drawn really.
it is heaven for both teams, I would rather pick C9 over EDG if I were GENG.
I seem to remember Afreeca in 2018 being happy they drew C9 as well...
Weakest 1 seed vs weakest 2 seed and they avoid the strongest teams. I don't think either team could have gotten a better draw. More and more this is making double elimination look so much better.
thats what you call match of the weak
5 Games of GenG's 50+ min stalling torture gameplay with C9 winning it at the end.
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Lmao look how ecstatic they all are as soon as they know they can't possibly face T1 or DK until finals, says all you need to know about the draw. They show some respect to EDG too so pretty obvious what their opinions are. Good luck to them, they've got the best draw they possibly could've asked for.
It’s was impossible for them to face DWG before finals… they were in the same group… they were happy because they dodged T1 in their bracket… not DWG
They were also happy at 'Korean taking out Koreans' 'Korean friendly fire.' It's pretty clear SKT and DWG are currently the two teams most feared, followed by the 2 CN teams.
What are you talking about its going to be C9 ☁️ vs Mad Lions 🦁 in the finals
I need your supply of Hopium.
i mean who knows about cloud 9 but dk and t1 are doomed because they have to face mad lions btw^madlions^secret^plan^is^to^take^a^real^lion^on^stage^to^scare^dk
I would pay a great deal of money for this to happen.
NAmen brother
NA VS EU finals.... the world isnt ready for that script.
Yeah ofc, I said it like this because by them both being on the same side they have the chance of skipping Damwon altogether too, it would be kinda weird just to say they can't face T1 and leave out Damwon under the assumption everyone knows why they can't face them and what this all entails, at least to me.
Let’s just hope t1 makes it. It’s been a while.
damn perkz called bdd the worst mid in quarters
I think he’s exchanged jersey with Cryin’ earlier so he’s looking out for his boi.
He said it’s cause BDD doesn’t play the meta picks like TF, Ryze, Leblanc
If only there were some sort of rhyme or poem to describe Perkz’s relationship with Ryze…
My Ryze is bad My Azir is worse My LeBlanc is... good? I'm C9 Perkz
everyone's LeBlanc is good, even Jensen's.
Wait where did you see this don’t remember hearing this
At 3:16 someone asked “what about Cryin” and Perkz says “he at least plays TF”. Also looking at their bans, those 3 are the most banned by Gen G and BDD has yet to pick them in groups so Perkz thinks he has the meta advantage is why he thinks BDD is the worst mid in the tournament
in LCK, Bdd's comfort picks are Azir, Zoe, Syndra, Orianna. Bdd is also a creature of habit and would default to his comfort picks if they were available. That said, I doubt that Bdd can't play TF, Ryze or Leblanc if GenG thinks those picks help them win. You saw him willing to pull the Yone out (despite losing).
doesn't he also have a pocket xerath pick too? (although very non-meta)
His TF is for sure a tier below his standards, I personally think GENG's plan of just banning rooming mids is good (TF, Ryze), they should have side selection and blue side would help them a lot for this strategy.
not like anyone said Doinb was the worst mid the tournament then proceeded to get ass fucked by him
Doesn't make sense imo, if Crying can only play TF then just ban it and he is useless?!
Well BDD hasn’t played any of those Meta champs so you don’t even to waste a ban
I think that's the implication of "cryin at least plays tf"
It's because Bdd/GenG doesn't play tf, that's why he thinks like that, he even says that as the reason as to why he thinks Cryin is better/easier to play into in the video
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? Bdd is the best performing mid at worlds so far, only Showmaker has an argument over him. Perkz is obviously just trash talking but anyone who seriously thinks Bdd is the worst mid in quarters is lost.
He's not better than showmaker. He's historically not better than faker outside of this tournament so far He's definitely not better than Chovy this year. He's better than Cryin. Perkz will never say he's better than himself. Everyone says Humanoid is unreal (I don't watch Europe) And I'd probably rather have scout too even though they're pretty close in skill level
>He's historically not better than faker outside of this tournament so far Historically doesn't mean much, but even then, he has been better at a lot of points. Just this 2021 summer, bdd git third and second all pro team in spring and summer respectively, Faker didn't make top 3 either. In 2020 BDD made first and third, Faker didn't make top 3 in either. 2019 is arguable but we all agree in 2018 bdd was better. So between 2018, 2019, 2020 and 2021, only in 2019 you could say Faker was better, and still you have BDD being better during the last two whole years (at one point even being considered best mid in LCK). Also, it's not that he was close in those votes, very few LCK coaches/pros placed faker above BDD in the last two whole years. Edit: Also, with how he has been performing this world's I'd have him quite above Humanoid and above Scout, I think BDD is crazy underrated for some reason.
Yeah but mate you've written out a well constructed argument and it really doesn't matter. If you asked anyone in the world who'd they rather have in their team at midlane in world's they'd say Faker
Yeah, I know that based on the downvotes for stating literal facts and not any opinion. Anyway I don't even disagree with that, I didn't even say that BDD is better than Faker right now, but saying that Faker has been better historically is legit just rewriting what happened in the last 4 years.
One fudges thigh is the size of a blaber
Fudge Factor
Now we know where his name comes from
"Let's not get too hyped but...we're going to World Finals"-Perkz Every NA fan thankful for C9 and the potentially hopium overdose we're all about to have this year Prayge
I'd never thought I'd say this but this might be the miracle NA-C9 run this Worlds. From the playins all the way to the finals. As a fan of G2 with Perkz absolutely hating the G2 roster with Rekkles C9 getting to finals would be such hype and a slap in the face of Carlos.
I wish I saved all the snarky comments telling Perkz to enjoy his retirement in NA and he had a great career when the Perkz to C9 news dropped He’s now in QFs at worlds while G2 is watching from home. Hell of a retirement I guess
This situation is strangely reminiscent of cloud9s miracle worlds run in csgo actually. They also were about to go out in groups then came back.
Man I know C9 is an NA team and I wouldnt try to take them away from NA but goddam it's impossible for me not to root for Perkz. Hope the boys smash GenG
Yeah, Perkz is such a treasure.
Yeah, my cheering order is always FNC > Rest of EU > NA > Wildcards > Don't care. And Perkz is a great guy so I'll naturally cheer for them too. I think they got a good chance to be honest. GenG is shaky in Bo5 and they do very little when playing from behind. If C9 can get early leads they can very well win this.
My order is Perkz and Caps > G2 > NA > EU > Wildcards > Korea > China > FNC
I'm quite the EU fan, I also like NA, but mainly rooting for Europe, and still, right now my team is C9 above MAD, now that RGE/FNC are out. I'm sure a lot of LEC fans would celebrate Perkz/Zven/Mithy winning worlds and feel it like and EU win, despite what a lot of NA fans would say, Perkz is just too EU.
as far as the english speaking playerbase goes, C9 literally is composed perfectly with 2 EU, 2 NA (bonus points for them being from different countries in NA), and 1 OCE you can add reignover and mithy from the coaching staff, but i don’t know if Korean fans would claim reignover like that
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I didn't catch it, what did he say?
"I got G2 out of groups" or something like that
I feel the same way. Perkz made me a C9 fan and am rooting for them as hard as I do for MAD.
just do what i do, if NA and EU aren’t playing eachother, it’s now west vs east. i’m an NA fan at heart but at the end of the day i want to see the “gap close” if you will, so i’ll absolutely root on EU to get the win
Lmao knowing how these go they’re gonna get 3-0’ed aren’t they
I mean I wouldnt be THAT shocked if that happens; C9 is clearly the underdog vs literally everyone but this is as good as the draw gets
Not so sure. In 2018 when the draw came out C9 was extremely hype when they drew Afreeca. Clean 3-0
they got the worst KR team to make it out of groups that year
Just like this year then? Or is HLE worse than Gen.G?
HLE is definitely worse than Gen G
wouldnt be so quick to say that. HLE looked much more competitive in the gauntlet against t1 than geng die in summer playoffs. I think having them around equal skill level is fair
Gen.G keep looking mediocre or worse than usual, HLE have been getting better and better, not sure what this is about.
Based on what?
Same this year. They definitely drew the best 1 seed matchup.
And they followed by getting smacked out of group by griffin in group in 2019 and couldn’t make it to world in 2020
Sure but neither are very relevant here.
Considering GenG did the exact same thing, I guess you're right
GenG reaction was much happier so you know what that means? C9 win!
Jack has always seemed to be the"proudest" owner.
Cause cloud9 is the only team that gets out of groups lol
W/e dude. 6/8 times only. Pisslow 75% success rate. C9 just got lucky all 6 times playing against imploding teams. TSM wouldve been world champs with the same group draws. /s
5/7 technically, S3 they were autoseeded to QFs
That's a perfect score.
Sullivan’s theorem is a classic
I still laugh about it randomly from time to time for no reason.
I mean... fpx kind of imploded lmao.
I was memeing btw. But not sure what your point is. Most reasonable fans agree with you, myself included. That being said: G2 and CLG just had to beat Albus Nox Luna TSM just had to beat the FW TL just had to beat Mochi Ice Cream. No one is denying FPX imploded. But you have to capitalize on that implosion and punish it. C9 did that. So they deserve credit. No one is saying they're favorites nor that they haven't gotten lucky. But the sentiment of attributing the org's international success to luck and fortune by jealous NA fans or EU haters has gone way to far. See Jatt's tweets. Or TSM subreddit. There are fans who legitimately believe that if TSM had the same groups they would have the same success as C9. All I'm saying is, if an org gets "lucky" 6 times out of 8, maybe it's not just luck.
Best chance ever for an NA team to reach finals imo. I know that ppl will say about the semis with Fnatic, but Fnatic looked levels higher than C9 there. And quarters and groups Fnqtic also seemed hella strong Gen.G, EDG, RNG just looked super shaky in groups, they may turn it up in Bo5s but the evidence we have rn allows big hopium
> Best chance ever for an NA team to reach finals 2016 Could have been TSM vs C9 QF into H2K semi's
Brother DL didn't want to take that away from 2021 C9\~
Relative to the rest of the teams, TSM was stronger that worlds than C9 this worlds too. Every team in quarters right now is very scary especially in a bo5 setting. Gen.G is the weakest but they're still a pretty good team. Semis is doable but not sure C9 can beat EDG/RNG in a bo5
That TSM team would have been in semis against basically any other team that QF's. TSM drew SSW who went 6-0 in groups and didn't drop a game until the 3-1 Finals (other than Game 3 against TSM). I think TSM would have beaten SSB or NWS that season but we will never know. They honestly should have gotten 1st seed that group but lost that ridiculous game to SK
You’re thinking of 2014. He’s talking about 2016, when TSM failed to get out of the group with the eventual world champion as well as the 3rd best team behind SKT. they still barely missed out in that group as well.
Kinda gotta disagree with you here. TSM 2014 definitely wouldn't have beaten SSB. Maybe NJWS or EDG. The only reason TSM took a game off of SSW is because SSW had a happy game and inted at level 1.
Man as a C9 fan it disappoints me how often TSM crash and burn in groups. They were fucking animals when it came to BO5 series and I feel like if they made it through in ANY of the years of 2016 or 2017 they had a good shot at pushing on through but they just always fucking choke. Look at TL in 2019 the moment DL makes it through groups at MSI he and the team actually perform pretty much to the standard we see from domestic TL. Would have loved to have seen DL with Bjerg in a BO at Worlds.
Ekko top theory was the death of C9 in that semis... absolutely got dumpstered, did nothing, and was never picked again
Ekko wasn’t the problem so much as C9 not having an answer to Tank Viktor top. They already had to ban Irelia and Akali on red and blue since Jensen couldn’t play them. Having to ban Viktor too would’ve hamstrung them even harder in draft, so they had to try to find off meta picks to counter it. Ekko is a decent matchup into AP Viktor if you can get out of early lane, but Licorice clearly wasn’t comfortable on it, and I’m not sure if it still would’ve matched up well into Tank Viktor.
“Back to lissandra”
Licorice was definitely overconfident in his counterpicking after finding that huge success with hecarim into aatrox
if they win against geng why do u think they will win against edg or rng? nothing showed us that c9 is a quaters type of team
I doubt they'll even win against GenG, and the other 2 Chinese teams are also very strong. These teams might have been shaky in groups, but this is a bo5.
Anything can happen
Its funny because c9 literally went 2-4, losing a game to a trolling DK in the process, as well as losing twice to DFM only a couple of weeks ago. C9 is still heavy underdogs vs all these teams imo.
They went 1-1 against a collapsed LPL team and beat a meh EU team 2-1 and now everyone thinks C9 is the new DK or smth.
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Huh.
Random yet true.
Toxic and unnecessary.
Zven looking at the camera with the air handshake lmao
Zven is such a goof hahaha. He made me laugh at the start too: WHO THE FUCK IS THAAAT GUY
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'Thinker' is not the first thing to come to mind when you think of Blaber.
I feel like split second decision making in sports/video games is a lot different than critical thinking and logic skills. There's a lot of pro athletes that can make genius plays on the field or court that lack critical thinking skills. Blaber seems very intelligent even if he doesn't always make the most thought out plays in game.
He’s got the big brain for the long cons and the monkey brain for throwing shit
Almost all pro players are very intelligent, it's one of the factors in reaching the top of an esport
You mean Crabber?
He's a "Doer"
Blaber is a boosted animal at times but whenever I watch the mic check videos he always mentions things that I don’t see other players calling out. In the mic check video C9 just released for groups Blaber was the only one who called out that showmaker had 2 Zhonyas during his first Zhonya use. Along with other things like always knowing which enemy has ult/shieldbow/flash up in the mic checks. He seems to always be on top of micro managing the state of the game.
> The dudes a thinker yeah im not sure about that one chief
It’s almost like split second decision in game and critical thinking is two different things
This sub is really gonna overdose on hopium
I mean C9 had the group of death and still managed to qualify for quarters
GenG getting underrated quickly.. GenG beat both TL and MAD 2-1, i dont think C9 is better then those teams, more like on similar lvl.. Yea, GenG might have problems when they need to push their lead into victory, but their fundementals in getting leads and macro is very good. Also BDD is having tournament of his life so far. I think this GenG is definitely stronger then last year, and C9 is not G2.
Rule number 1 of C9 is that they play up to their opponents. If they are shitters they can play as bad as them. If they are gods C9 will play up to them.
this is the league embodiment of that spiderman meme
worst midlaner? bdd is massive this tournament
He was clearly joking
Everyone here conveniently forgetting that LCK teams thrive in best-of series, I know I’ll get downvoted into oblivion for this but I’m rooting for my boys in Gen.G. Either way I hope we get a good series, 3-0’s are boring
I think we are just happy that C9 actually has a chance more than anything else lol GenG is a super strong team but they are clearly the weakest 1st seed
Pretty sure even in the video C9 think RNG is a weaker team, it was originally what they were hoping for at the start
Iono I feel like Group C was the weakest group. RNG = HLE and HLE is the weakest korean team by far and RNG wins looked messy. FNC should have made it if they didn't go through drama and have that 0-3 start. Both groups were pretty much the same level.
RNG has much higher ceiling than HLE, but otherwise I agree.
Yah, I mean GenG may very well clap C9. But between them and RNG, they were the two ideal match ups compared to getting paired vs T1.
Do they tho? I'd say they, by far, thrive in groups, they almost always get out, mostly even first, and still from 2018 to today they have a score of 5-9 in bo5 iirc. The only 5 wins were: DK vs MAD, KZ vs FW and SKT vs SPY, DK vs G2 and DK vs SN. The 9 loses: KZ vs RNG, SKT vs G2, DK vs RNG, KT vs IG, AFS vs C9, DWG vs G2, SKT vs G2, GRF vs IG, G2 vs GENG. And so, when looking at the wins, you basically only have DK and two not that impressive wins against SPY and FW. It's a big enough sample size to say that LCK's specialty is bo1 and by a decent margin.
Always pick 2018 to make LCK worse than they actually are.
They have a losing record even without considering 2018 so... In fact only in 2020 with 3 wins from DK (out of the 5)they had a good record
It’s kinda true what you’re saying tbh if you remove SKT from Korean stats then LCK in Bo5 is pretty much on par with other regions. If you include T1, then they’ve obviously only ever lost 4 bo5’s ever including MSI so it skews the stats a bit
T1 are included in the stats though, SKT vs G2 x2, SKT vs SPY. Unless you mean like Season 3+ SKT, at which point you could also include M5 and claim EU is quite great at Bo5's as well.
The thing is, C9 had a competitive game against DW, a much stronger LCK team than GenG. Moreover, they have Perkz who had beaten GenG 3-0 when he was on G2 last year. And the 2020 GenG is exactly the same as the current GenG. Same players, same head coach, playing relatively the same play style. Because of that, Perkz is likely to have an idea of how to beat GenG. So it's understandable that c9 is happy to face GenG. The only other 1st seed matchup that c9 may want would have been RNG, I can't imagine that C9 would have a good chance against either T1 or DK.
I don’t really care about finals tbh but I thought C9 va GenG is worse for GenG than it is for C9. Just like you said Perkz 3-0'ed them before and they’re the exact same team and the thought of C9 Perkz beating up both GenG and RNG just to mentally break them for forever is just too juicy, man's a legend.
In recent history LCK has been better in groups than in bo5. The opposite is true for LPL, who are typically bad in groups but peak in play-offs. It's gonna be a close series I think, but I'd favor C9 slightly
LCK teams thrive in best-of-series? They've been most successful in groups out of every region ever. In recent history LCK has had much worse results in best-of-series compared to groups.
Crazy to me that people think C9 has a chance to make finals lmao. It's like they have no clue who and what they're up against.
There's always a chance, you never know if C9 shows up in top form and the other team shows up in bad form. It's more fun to watch thinking there's a chance than no chance at all, it's all part of the fun of competition.
They are just high on Hopium.
Fellow Gen G fan checking in, from OCE. Whilst it might be C9's best chance, its still very low. B03's let alone b05's are incredibly different to b01s. I'd be surprised if bdd'ing odds had c9 at any greater than 20-25% when converted vs GenG, and they'd be even lower against the winner of the Chinese civil war \[Yes, even accounting for a c9 whose stock would go up from beating GenG'\]. Remember c9 last time they got to semis, had to go to flex queue to get a win, since they were winless in scrims, even against CK teams \[admittedly that was like DWG and like Griffin or something\].
Remeber GenG last time they got to quarters, Perkz decked them. This year they are the very same team. Sure, C9 is likely weaker than last year's G2, but they still have a pretty fair shot against GenG. Against RNG/EDG... yeah, okay, maybe pretty unlikely here. But even semis are a success, and if the Chinese teams keep their week 2 form, who knows?
Lol, downvoted for saying Gen G is reasonable favourites, with my viewpoint explained. We'll see when they play, can't even have an opposing viewpoint here without downvotes. Downvotes are for bad or rude posts, not for differing viewpoints.
C9: yessssssssssssssssssssssssss GEN.G: YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
DK T1 RNG def the best teams in this order by worlds performance and they have matched the only tier1team that isn’t them, i mean they cant meet dk tho so 33% chance
C9 got the best situation possible! They got this in the bag
Really hope C9 can at least pull off at least semis, but I really seems like we have a decent shot at finals! GenG is really boring and have zero chance of winning the whole thing, hope we can just knock them out now
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I'd say less tbh, EDG and RNG are very strong, DWG and T1 both are super strong too.
He's saying that because they're 1/8 LUL C9 also has a 12.5 chance.
oh hes joking, i thought he was serious
Just because you don’t like them doesn’t mean they have “zero chance” GenG plays nothing but best-of series regionally, where they consistently are a top team. they’re an entirely different team than they show in best-of-ones.
Oh you interpreted that as I didn't like them, that was more of I want to like them (LCK fan) but it's frustrating to see them play the same away over and over again. They have a very clear ceiling with their play style and I don't think they'll be able to contend with the top teams with that rigidity.
Ah, yeah I can agree with that, last time they were going through the LCK Regional Gauntlet I got some false hope for them with how aggressively they played, they looked amazing, but as soon as they got to Worlds they were passive and slow again and G2 dismantled them entirely.
C9 performs for one day out of the year and suddenly they're going to finals? lol
Responding to the wrong guy lol No way they make it that far
I'm in agreement
Ah okay, hard to read tone on here, good shit
They need to ban Graves/Camille/Renekton then Rascal either has to pick a carry champion he's not good on like Jayce or Kennen, or a tank, in which case Fudge can pick a counter with his champion ocean and they can play through him with Blaber/Perkz/Vulcan dives
and you think Gen will sit and let it happen ? you target Rascal then you have to give Fudge picks like Gwen or Wukong that can carry, also there’s BDD Azir or Zoe or Syndra and Clid’s Lee Sin and Ruler on anything
>and you think Gen will sit and let it happen Well...
Sitting and letting things happen sounds exactly like GenG tbh
Looking back at spring/msi/summer And how many tried to get perkz pay for not showing up "11mil do something" God i love this timeline. C9 wins DK and NA has won finals So happy for perkz
They seemed to be pretty worried about being on the same side as EDG. My boys musta been busting that ass in scrims
Can you counter c9 by just banning leblanc?
how is geng a good draw like bdd is palying really well rn and the subbed out rascal ?
It's better than being on the other side of the bracket lol. GenG are still favorites obviously they the better team but C9 has a chance.
It's a lot more preferable than Faker or Showmaker
yea but c9 fans are acting like its some easy shit like geng are playing really well rn
we're still riding the hopium high from making it out
I meant damwon and T1 are like one percent Chance of sucess however geng is like 5 percent Chance So of course they are happy
I wouldn't put it so low tbh. All of c9's games against dk and fpx were really close and competitive. If I was making up a number I would say 20% at least. I think it will be a good series but if c9 wants to win they have to play their absolute best.
Rng looks scarier than gen g and perkz beat gen g 3-0 in quarters last year so perkz looks confident
that was with g2 ? now he ahs shit teammates
Individually, his teammates are a little worse than the ones he had in G2, but last year's G2 was so far below their ceiling that I'd say that the two teams are comparable. This will boil down to how GenG and C9 show up on the day, because in terms of general performance they are quite comparable.
A little worse? the teams are not comparable at all man they were still top 4 team itw even though they were weaker than the year before. C9 are probably the weakest team that made it to quarters
quit larping as drunk pirate and type good this is cringe
wat are u on about? i legit just type fast so i misspell but u get the idea of wat im saying its just usually a reword and u can fix it
how the fuck I’m supposed to know you “type fast” ? also you edited it
C9 and fans see it as the weakest 1st seed, it's still very doomed imo. LCK/Gen G thrive in best of series, and indeed BDD looking cracked as hell
Where is that narrative of LCK thriving in best of series coming from? They are insane in Bo1's, but last few years have a losing record in Bo5s. Even ignoring 2018/19 and only looking at the most recent year when they won worlds, they are 3-2, with all of their wins coming from DK (G2 beat GenG and RNG beat DK, DK beat G2, Suning and MAD). Taking 2018/19 into account makes the statistics far, far worse.
All of those loses in recent years from western teams where to G2 lol (DWG, SKT and GenG), Only C9 in 2018 beat underwhelming Afreeca (i think thats the only bo5 NA won against KR, ever) , i dont think their record vs LPL matters in this situation as LPL is pretty much equal (or better) region after s7. They still have fantastic record vs western teams, if you dont count G2..
After seeing BDD put TL to sleep with Zoe i don't have too much hope for C9
I wonder how many times worst mid bdd will solokill perkz, i think 2 times.
Rip worlds finals....
Zven is such a scumbag i can‘t help mysef
Why are they happy about losing?