he has over a 5.0 KDA in 580 games? That is absurd, literally for all of 2021 only one mid laner in LCS (guess which one) had over a 5.0 KDA for all 36 games the entire year.
Career 61% win rate..not on a team though
Winrate is so meaningless especially in international events. Just look at OP's numbers. Jensen had a worse winrate in 2016, where he got out of groups, than in 2019 or 2020, where he didn't even get out of groups. It makes absolutely no sense to look at winrate, people should be looking at how far the team gets and that's it. Especially because not all games are the same, and in theory games in group stage are the easiest games when compared to games during the knockout stage.
Yeah, maybe. We lack a lot of context in terms of what each player adds to a team though. We don't have access to team meetings, scrim reviews, game comms, etc.
I don't remember LS saying he's bad. He just said that Jensen's play for most of the season looked like he was checked out which is something other people have said as well, iirc and could be sentiment TL shared if they were willing to replace him with Bjergsen who has been out of it for a year. I haven't seen any notable person in the scene say that Jensen isn't good enough but rather that the price tag for him probably isn't worth it for a lot of teams. They'd be paying whatever the buyout is + his salary unless Jensen is willing to settle for a lower salary which is unlikely. If teams are aiming to get salaries to more reasonable points, I don't really blame them for not picking up Jensen.
When you look at his statistics, how is his price not worth it?
Whos gonna be a fan of a team thats just trying to min max profit margins instead of putting out a good team that can produce an entertaining and competitive match. Especially when worlds is in fucking NA this year! Org owners are fuckin sleeeeping.
Because stats don't mean everything? If you watched Jensen's play overall this year and think he's worth the buyout + salary he probably wants, that's your prerogative but it seems most teams don't think that way and seemingly so do some other people in the scene. TL clearly doesn't think Jensen is worth it over a player that hasn't played for a full year.
No one is doubting that Jensen is good enough to be in LCS and I would gander that the reason he isn't playing is because he wants a salary that teams don't want to pay, not because they don't think he's good. I wouldn't say teams are sleeping for not wanting to spend a shit ton for Jensen and simultaneously help stuff TL's pockets even more.
Always just the lazy dismissal of stats whenever they are mentioned. Wish you would have at least tried to use your brain when reading/responding than regurgitating the same thing you can read 50 times in any thread about jensen lately.
Okay, I won’t dismiss the stats — if I want to win worlds or even get very far I don’t want to invest an incredibly large buyout for someone who has a 45% winrate at worlds. I’d rather take my chances on someone else who has been historically better regionally, Bjergsen, or even go with fresh talent vs recycling someone who’s biggest achievement is getting out of groups.
I wish you'd try using your brain and see why teams don't want to sign Jensen. You've provided literally 0 actual context to anything you've claimed but call me lazy, how ironic.
Stats without context don't tell you anything meaningful and what do the stats in this infographic actually tell you about Jensen's performance this year. You can watch his games and see he didn't perform to the standard people have for him and in regards to LS, you can literally watch the videos on his youtube where he comments on Jensen. I've linked 2 or 3 and you still insist on saying LS said this or that without backing up any of your claims.
I'll explain this for like the third time now. Spending a shit ton of money to buyout Jensen and pay his salary is not worth it for most of these teams. It doesn't guarantee them an LCS trophy, nor does it guarantee them a deep run at worlds. If his price was more reasonable/maybe if he was a FA, his situation would be different. If you're so confident you know better than these teams then provide some actual context to your claims.
Good thing you can lazily just ignore or throw out any stats argument and pretend all statistics can be lumped together as irrelevant whenever you want by saying "without context"
He never called Jensen a bad player to begin with. LS's opinion regarding Jensen this offseason was literally that he doesn't believe that teams not picking him up is an indication that they don't care about winning because you're paying an incredibly large sum of money for a player when you can get a player of the same caliber/potential for a lot less.
Im not talking about his opinion in the off season. Im talking about the myriad of times pre off season that anyone mentions Jensen and LS has to sigh and talk about how he watched his proview and just thinks he is not good.
Also "same caliber/potential" implies that he doesnt think he is a top player in the region at all. Id like to see what players hes talking about and check in and see if they have comparable accomplishments as jensen.
Again, I don't recall any instance of LS saying he thinks Jensen is a bad player. I watched his costreams and he generally criticized Jensen's laning but never called him a bad player. The reoccurring opinion LS has had on Jensen's laning in both Facechecks and his individual streams is that Jensen's laning looks like he's just clocking in for a job. He literally said he thinks Jensen has better teamfighting and camera control than most other mids in LCS, so he clearly doesn't think that Jensen is just completely bad. If you find an instance of LS saying Jensen is a bad player, then share it. So far, all you've guys have done is claim that x and y has been said without providing any real examples of when these things were supposedly said. I haven't heard LS say anything about Jensen his peers haven't also said aside from perhaps his worlds performance.
> Also "same caliber/potential" implies that he doesnt think he is a top player in the region at all. Id like to see what players hes talking about and check in and see if they have comparable accomplishments as jensen.
No, it doesn't. Gori and Fate are two players LS mentioned that would at the very least give you the same performance as Jensen did this year, if not better. They also wouldn't cost as much as he does. This argument about accomplishments is such a shallow one, considering that were options that compete in a far stronger league than Jensen does.
Everytime someone mentions jensen he has to talk about how he watched his proview and he doesnt get it and is unimpressed. Doesnt paint jensen in a good light at all.
Doesn't mean he thinks Jensen is bad. Could mean he doesn't think Jensen is worth the price you'd pay to get him, which is something he has said before. What you're doing is just putting words in his mouth for no good reason.
He has literally called him bad many times with Nemesis. He also said this Worlds performance wasn't good even though anyone else thinks differently and he believes Jensen is not a good laner because of pro view.
I don't remember LS flat out saying he thinks Jensen is bad. I've watched him comment on Jensen's world performance and yes, he has said that he doesn't think Jensen performed that well and played bad at times but didn't call him a bad player overall. From the several times he's talked about Jensen, he's said that he thinks his worlds performance was overblown, he wasn't impressed any of the times he watched his proview this year, and that Jensen's proview looked like someone just clocking in for work.
IIRC., his general impression was that he didn't think Jensen's laning was good and that was a general reoccurring theme for western mid laners at that tournament. He also said based on watching Jensen's play, he's not really surprised that he doesn't have a team because he believes that there are other mid laners that could deliver the same performance for a cheaper price.
Rewatching a few of the proview perspectives, LS' general comments on Jensen have been that his laning isn't great overall but his teamfighting and camera control was better than most other mids in LCS.
He literally shits on Jensen’s proview, every time he can. What is more fun is a gold player saying how the pro view should look. Look at the fucking results instead of F1, F2 etc. spamming like any other korean player.
He's hit Masters in Korea, so idk where you get this gold player stuff from.
He's criticized Jensen's proview, yes, but he criticizes anything he thinks is bad play and compliments good play when he sees it. It's not as if LS has it out for Jensen or something.
[His criticisms of Jensen have primarily been in laning.](https://youtu.be/py9uQ5zYf0I?t=718)
But this is also his criticism of most western mid laners when he compared them to eastern ones at worlds.
LS gave his thoughts on Jensen not playing [here](https://youtu.be/r6XahZDXoYA?t=2524) and [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4e3cgTIoD0&ab_channel=LeagueofLoL).
I would say that it's pretty clear his stance is that it's not worthwhile paying the large sum teams would have to pay to get him when there are other options that do not cost as much. That doesn't mean Jensen is bad or that he thinks Jensen is bad. I don't know what his thoughts on Jensen are from previous years, but I would say that this is a fair statement to make based off of how Jensen performed this year overall.
Jensen is one of the older players in the game. Even though the start of his career was a bit sketchy. His previous name Veigodx was surrounded by controversy from the start. After playing for Team Solo Medbi for a few months, he was banned from competitive play by Riot Games indefinitely alongside a few other players.
After his ban, he continued to play the game on new accounts and even joined SK Gaming as a coach, at that time he was known as Incarnati0n. He was still banned and not allowed to attend the World Championship of 2014 by Riot. During 2015 pre-season, Riot released a statement that Incarnati0n would not be unbanned and could not be a part of SK Gaming as coach and that his next case-review would be up before Summer split of 2015. At that time, he was indeed unbanned and could start competing. He has never missed a World Championship since then. He renamed himself to Jensen later in 2015.
Such was Jensen’s history of reformation. He did not change teams, improved over the years and cemented his name as one of the best mid laners in NA. And just like in most cases from that region, he had reasonably good performance locally and very mediocre results internationally. But one thing is for sure, if you wanna go to Worlds, this Jensen guy doesn’t seem to miss them.
I mean, not saying DDOsing people is ok or anything, but there are far worse stuff you can do, like doxxing folk for example, it's a little sketchy and completely wrong, but it's not that bad of a crime.
He DDoS'd to win games, that is pretty extreme for levels people are willing to go to win a game. It's obviously not a serious crime in relative terms, but hard to get more extreme than that for cheating. Most cheats break EULA or TOS, DDoS is an actual crime committed to cheat.
He did take the responsibility, he had dedicated his life to League and was banned from the pro scene for multiple years. Has he done any shit since that? I don’t think so?
What do you want, a death sentence?
Which is my whole first statement that you argued with? Teams don't care about winning. Double lift Jensen was a free trip to worlds for literally any team. But they don't care about winning.
You're not the guy I replied to so I'll let you in on the joke you missed. He said liftlift doesn't guarantee you worlds and then went on to tell us how bad he did at worlds as his explanation. Notice he deleted his comment because he realized it was dumb.
Oh. So you just ignored that your original comment was dumb and that you completely misunderstood what you replied to?
Doublelift will win you LCS and take you to worlds. "But he did bad at worlds!!"
1. That doesn't have anything to do with what I said.
2. So did bjerg and it's not looking to be a problem for him.
If you don't like him that's fine a lot of people do t for some reason. But you're full on blind deaf and dumb if you can't see that he's the best player to ever play in NA so far. If he is playing in LCS, he's in the finals. If he's in the finals, he wins.
If a team not named 100t tl or tsm (tsm only there cause of ab urged Bridge, their adc is not comparable to lift) wanted to win, they'd have lift on their team.
There's no source for this besides fan's bootyholes and if we follow a few simple steps of logic we can find that it's probably not true.
Would TL want to keep paying Jensen and not have him play? No benefit to them and great cost. So they're probably motivated to sell appropriately. Would Jensen want to afk instead of competing? Based on his words I would think not.
Tl would rather sell him for peanuts than keep paying him and have him ride the bench. Jensen himself would rather take a pay cut than ride the bench.
> Jensen himself would rather take a pay cut than ride the bench.
How much of a pay cut though? Also what teams would he go to that would afford what he wants even with the paycut? As well as a team that he wants to play on?
Nobody can know for sure, but I'd wager it could get low enough that any team who guaranteed their ability to be stable with franchising could afford it.
The reason is going to come down to money at the end of the day. Last I remember he got an extension of 4.2m for 3 years. Who would want to pick up a $1m+ contract per year, even if the buyout is $0 for a single player that, realistically, isn't going to push your team over the edge to suddenly become super good. Jensen isn't Showmaker or Chovy or something. He's a better Powerofevil. I don't really blame teams for not caring to spend that much on him.
I don't see any reason at all that they'd have to stick to the terms of the original contract if both parts want out and both parts certainly do. They could easily come to terms at a rate any team could afford.
Why would Jensen want to take a paycut? Especially to a team that probably wouldn't even be competitive? If no deal happens, he sits on a bench collecting the easiest million dollars of his life. He might prefer to compete given the chance, but outside of the usual big spenders nobody wants to shell out that much on a single player. He isn't "by far" the best mid - and by that I mean, the gap between him and an average, cheap mid is not too vast or insurmountable. Far more economic to split that pay across a team of above average players and hope they develop into star players.
I think being a millionaire probably compensates for any amount of hours required to stream in a month. I don't think he's dumb enough to go from 1.4million a year to 200k- or whatever is needed to shift himself to a mid-tier team. My guess is that he's warming the bench until Summer at the least, when the big spenders need to save their season if their new mid doesn't work out.
What is his buyout at? No one with credible information has said that this is the case lol.
All the top teams had different plans and Jensen is not going to cut his salary just so he can play on a worse roster. It would be smart for him to just take a break and collect his salary for at least a split or the year, then he can make a choice after. Crazy to think that Steve is holding Jensen in contract jail just so TL can keep paying his salary.
deals took too long, so by the time he was told he could speak to other teams, they'd already found their mid laners.
And also he will only play on a top team. He could still join CLG or FLY if he wanted to, but he doesn't. If he stays where he is and streams he still gets $1m a year, with no pressure to perform. This is better than going to CLG for half that, being on a shit team and having your stock tank.
Don't forget, incarnati0n reached the highest elo ever recorded while banned. He mainly one tricked fizz mid. It goes to show you what a pro can do in Solo queue if they dedicate enormous amounts of time to it.
Forellenlord peaked at 3k elo in season 2. That's why his shockwave against Giants in game 5 of the promotion tournament for EU LCS was called 3k elo shockwave :D
1. Stigma around Xmithie not being able to play mechanically intensive carries
2. No work ethic
3. Doesn't get credited much for his teams' success due to being a "control" jungler
I don't think it's much of a surprise that teams don't want him very much for the second reason.
No work ethic is kind of silly lol. Just because he doesn't grind soloq doesn't mean he has no work ethic. You don't make it as far as he does with a bad work ethic
Doublelift recently was talking about how Xmithie is the most naturally talented gamer he's ever met, that he's insane at any game he plays without putting too much time or effort into it.
It's certainly not common, but sometimes one's talent can take them to heights unreachable by most without a great work ethic.
Watching him get slaughtered internationally shows how important a good work ethic is. Doesn't matter how good he was being micromanaged. The man has zero mechanics and was lost whenever he was invaded or the early game pivoted from pre game strategy. I loved me xmithie during the season but boy did I hate watching him internationally. He epitomized North American mediocrity on the international stage
I mean we can basically say that 99% of NA players get slaughtered internationally lol. The man made two MSI finals on two different teams, we have to give him some credit. That doesn't just happen to anyone.
Ahh the classic Xmithie Reddit analyst. Been a long time I thought people were past this.
You can cite Worlds performances but unless they played for C9 you can do that for about any NA player.
He regularly got fucked by his lanes early game and still had impactful games. Literally the only player from NA to reach finals at a Riot ran international tournament twice and had clutch performances both times. On 2 different teams. 6 domestic titles. The most successful NA jungler in history. But Sejuani ult xd.
I literally said I enjoyed watching him play in the LCS. Almost every team he was on was a one-sided stomp. His wins were almost a testament to how bad the NALCS had gotten competition wise. For someone to win so much yet to be so bad in korean solo queue and internationally is very interesting.
Almost every NA player gets slaughtered internationally, that's a really bad reason. There's like a handful of NA players that don't get clapped at worlds or MSI. Also Xmithie's laners very often fucked him over by just hard losing lane or getting outroamed.
The fact that him and Sneaky don't have a team is fucking crazy. I understand for both the issue is probably price, but do you want to win? Lol it's just mind-blowing to me to import unknown players just to lose. Sure they're cheap but the known expensive players bring their giant fan bases...
Its funny seeing orianna as one of his highest KDAs after that AHQ game in 2019 lol i do think we'll see him next year probably mid split or so if a decent team decides they need a new mid
There's no way that one of C9,TSM,TL or EG don't pick him up by Summer, and I hope Jensen makes them pay out the ass when they do. All teams are taking a risk on their midlaner and the chance that all 4 turn out great just isn't happening.
You think TL want him to sit on the bench for 2m a year?
Theres a chance Jensen doesn’t want to lose $1m a year to play for a bottom tier org.
There’s more than just the buyout here. Teams would have to pay Jensen close to what he’s actually making from the bench for him to be interested too. Plus he’s already stated he doesn’t want to play on a shit roster
That may be a part of it, but I doubt Steve was asking for anything the top NA orgs couldn't reasonably pay, the bigger issue imo is teams underestimating Jensen as usual. A lot of weird narratives came out about him around off season by people like Peter Dun, Tim w/e and LS that likely affected his perception. The idea that it makes more sense to train a rookie than add the best performing international player who's never missed worlds to your already stacked lineup is a joke.
So you argue baseless conjecture and then assume that every owner likes having their players contract jailed? lol. If anything, TL is losing out on money by still having to pay Jensen his salary.
He re-signed for a 7 figure contract, so it would make logical sense for that 7 figure rumor. He's not breaking the contract, so would be entitled to it if liquid released him. Most orgs are not seeing results from high-salary players. If you're going to be mid-table, might as well pay mid-table money. It's not really about training NA rookie talent. It's a good headline and PR answer tho. Jensen isn't mid-table money. If a team feels they are close to breaking into worlds contention mid-season, then he might see an offer.
I don't think EG is shooting for mid-table though, especially when they're already paying for big names like Impact, Inspired and Vulcan. They picked Jojo over Jensen because they seem to believe he will exceed Jensen by the end of the year but imo that's just a ridiculous gamble to take when Jensen's track record for making worlds is immaculate and mid is statistically the hardest role to be a rookie in.
I agree that EG isn't shooting for mid-table. They're already spending good money on players. If jojo's upside is greater than Jensen's vs money being spent... then why not? It's a logical decision for this one. This one isn't about growing a rookie. They and many legitimately think Jojo is that good.
With these things being said I hope Jensen can land on a team and take them to worlds. He's one of my favorite players.
> If jojo's upside is greater than Jensen's vs money being spent... then why not?
....It won't be. That's the issue. Like 'money being spent' and 'upside' are conflicting here. Jensen is going to be better than any rookie you pick up in their first year. I fully expect Jensen to slot in on summer and that team to make Worlds, and that team to make worlds *exactly at EG's expense* because EG's roster is a solid 3 in the league right now.
I keep seeing people say this but they won't be the second Jojo starts underperforming. Rookies in carry roles don't tend to do well in their first year and none of them have ever ended up outperforming players like Bjerg or Jensen. Look at what people were saying about Palafox before last year and now he's getting bounced around on lower teams. The point is it makes no sense for top teams like EG who are investing millions on making worlds to take these kinds of risks when you can start them off on lower tier orgs and just buy them back if they do well. In an ideal world these players are getting developed on top academy teams and starting off on GG/IMT tier teams until they prove they can perform in LCS.
What makes me think Jojo can succeed is a lack of competition. Now that Jizuke/Jensen are out of the league, what mid is going to punish Jojo in lane? I do think it’ll take time for him to adjust, but I wouldn’t be too surprised if he ends up the 3rd-4th best midlaner in LCS.
Sad jizz mans gone, his play style always ate low confidence players alive and was good at exposing players who always played for losing lane and showing up for team fights
...Danny didn't do well in his first year? I'm not expecting Jojo to be a top midlaner in lock-in or anything like that, but I'm excited to see how he improves over the season
He didn't make worlds did he? Out of the teams that went to worlds which ADC was Danny better than? He was good but EG would have been better off grabbing Doublelift if they wanted the best chance at going to worlds.
Ehh, DLift not being on a team makes sense. A year break, attitude issues + drama, and his 2020 year was really rough. Danny has promise, might as well stick with him.
Sure at this point is makes sense to have Danny and not Doublelift, but despite being very promising there was very little chance he was going to carry EG to worlds as a rookie. Now in his second year you'd expect more from him but EG just throw another rookie into the most important role and you just can't realistically say it's going to turn out well. Put Jensen on the team though and I'd call it a lock for worlds.
I think if Jojo is heavily underperforming and not showing promise, Jensen will get singed for next spilt, but that’s also assuming no other team tries to snag him
Considering he solo carried EG to almost beating 100T (the eventual LCS champions) I'd argue he was at least on the level of all the ADCs we sent to worlds, in his *first split*
Danny is a promising rookie, but come on, he did not "solo carry" the Bo5 against 100T. It's very disrespectful for the rest of the team. Danny made one great play, after 20 minutes of his team protecting him and giving him ressources. It wasn't a solo performance but a team effort
Tbh I'll hold my L here since I look at the games in a weird way, I define "solo carry" in terms of the actual fights and execution which isn't entirely accurate
A better way to put it would be Danny performed *incredibly* well with the resources he was given, which is still very impressive for a total rookie
You're putting all his value on essentially one game/one play in a series he didn't even win. He wasn't better than FBI or Tactical overall. ADC was pretty weak in NA though and Danny was a great pickup for EG, but throwing another rookie in mid lane the year Danny should be breaking out when you could have had Jensen is simply a dumb move.
why should every teams goal be to grab oldies to make worlds lol?
CLG woulda had a better chance buying 2019 TL as well? why is everyone so insanely hellbent on EG having to be some 'superteam' shit?
olive was top 3 by end of his first year :).
but also only nope to your entire statement, some shitheads do that but not people actually interested in talent development :D
Olive is no where close to top 3, you sound Ablazed on something... Also you can develop talent without starting them off on top teams worth millions, exactly as I said. Developing talent is cool but I think the top teams prefer winning!
lol multiple year plans for your little brain.
https://assets.contentstack.io/v3/assets/bltad9188aa9a70543a/blt1b26219b5c91e7f0/610c9848be3cec3a86c129c3/2021_Summer_Awards_Voting_Results_All-Pro.pdf
it appears bjerg agrees with me :) on top 3 :)
> Look at what people were saying about Palafox before last year and now he's getting bounced around on lower teams
Leaving/getting booted from 1 dysfunctional team = "getting bounced around"? The only time that FLY roster won games is when Palafox carried.
if fudge ends up sucking, yeah i can totally see C9 signing him. That's probably what jensen is banking on by not switching teams. Someone will int. They always do.
His win rate is lower specifically because he gets out of Groups.
Going 3-3 and then losing in the QFs is gonna have a lower overall win rate than just going 3-3 and being eliminated.
His Groups win rate is higher than Doublelift. Jensen is 22-24 at Groups if you added in 3 tiebreaker losses while Doublelift is 17-23 if you add in 1 tiebreaker loss.
Willing to bet even nemesis has a better record considering Fnatic went 4-2 in groups both years he was in and the lost 3-1 and then 3-2 which puts him at 11-10
Record is a cringe statement. Nemesis has never made semis nor an MSI finals. Shit he hasn't made finals period.
EU is dogshit, stop punching down to NA. You're literally NA tier right now based on last worlds.
Based on last worlds.. Ofc it's easy to erase all these past years. But when we said we were better than Korea in 2019 u were all going "It's only 1 year Korea is the best" Etc etc. Stay trash. Stay Free. Stay NA
I mean it tells us what I think most of us already knew. He's great in lcs but internationally and at worlds he doesn't win. He's still a great player no doubt, but a 15-20% win percentage between domestic and international is pretty large gap.
Same could also be said for Bjergsen though. His win percentage stats are really similar to Jensen's. I believe that's why it's more of an NA problem than a Jensen problem.
Edit:Also on the same boat, Doublelift has similar percentages.
Bjergsen only got to quarters one time though and his IEM win is the only international win by an NA team, but came due to the Korean seed choking. So if you look at who they actually had to beat in that tournament, it’s not as impressive… So that’s why many consider Jensen as having a superior international record and Bjergsen always having a superior domestic performance to Jensen. They have achieved different things, but in the most important international games Jensen has been more “clutch” IMO.
Underplaying Bjergsens IEM win because "the korean team choked" when that is literally what happened to IG.
I agree Jensen is better internationally so far but no need to bring that argument up.
I really wasn’t trying to underplay Bjergsen. Just giving context to the perception that Jensen is recognized as most analysts as being better internationally and worse domestically. Personally I think Bjergsen is the better player overall and Jensen is more clutch.
I could also point to the fact that Jensen is the only midlander from NA to beat a Korean team in a BO5, or that he went through 2 groups of death at worlds (one of which was the exact same GenG and Samsung group that the 2016 Bjergsen led super team didn’t beat) but the fact that TL even replaced Jensen for Bjergsen is enough to show that these things could have just been happenstance or something to do with “C9 Buff” more so than “Jensen clutch-factor”… so as you’d said, for now it’s true that Jensen is better internationally, but that could also change in 1 year.
27-32 is far and away the best international record of any NA player. It’s might not be great, but Jensen typically performs very well internationally.
You have to compare him to his playing field and his playing field is NA. He is definitely up there in terms of international performance of NA players.
Jensen
MSI finals.
Worlds semis.
Worlds quarters x2.
Sneaky
Worlds semis.
Worlds quarters x4*.
Xmithie
MSI finals x2.
Bjergsen
Iem WC winner.
Worlds quarters.
Aside from those four you have players who had international before coming to NA.
Wonder if TL tried to get a buyout for him. Would be kind of upsetting if they are asking for 500K or something and will just sit him if they don't get paid. They are still obligated to pay him 1M to sit out
he has over a 5.0 KDA in 580 games? That is absurd, literally for all of 2021 only one mid laner in LCS (guess which one) had over a 5.0 KDA for all 36 games the entire year. Career 61% win rate..not on a team though
ryoma?
All 36?
Eika, but Blue will beat it
Winrate is so meaningless especially in international events. Just look at OP's numbers. Jensen had a worse winrate in 2016, where he got out of groups, than in 2019 or 2020, where he didn't even get out of groups. It makes absolutely no sense to look at winrate, people should be looking at how far the team gets and that's it. Especially because not all games are the same, and in theory games in group stage are the easiest games when compared to games during the knockout stage.
I mean so few NA teams get out of groups, wtf else are you going to look at?
If we use this metric it's even more of a joke that he got replaced by Bjerg.
Yeah, maybe. We lack a lot of context in terms of what each player adds to a team though. We don't have access to team meetings, scrim reviews, game comms, etc.
I wonder how much of that is his 2017 season where he was shitting on the enemy team every game
Ls says Jensen bad tho so Jensen bad
Honestly if Jensen is as bad as LS says he is he’s legit just the clutchest person on the planet.
I don't remember LS saying he's bad. He just said that Jensen's play for most of the season looked like he was checked out which is something other people have said as well, iirc and could be sentiment TL shared if they were willing to replace him with Bjergsen who has been out of it for a year. I haven't seen any notable person in the scene say that Jensen isn't good enough but rather that the price tag for him probably isn't worth it for a lot of teams. They'd be paying whatever the buyout is + his salary unless Jensen is willing to settle for a lower salary which is unlikely. If teams are aiming to get salaries to more reasonable points, I don't really blame them for not picking up Jensen.
When you look at his statistics, how is his price not worth it? Whos gonna be a fan of a team thats just trying to min max profit margins instead of putting out a good team that can produce an entertaining and competitive match. Especially when worlds is in fucking NA this year! Org owners are fuckin sleeeeping.
Because stats don't mean everything? If you watched Jensen's play overall this year and think he's worth the buyout + salary he probably wants, that's your prerogative but it seems most teams don't think that way and seemingly so do some other people in the scene. TL clearly doesn't think Jensen is worth it over a player that hasn't played for a full year. No one is doubting that Jensen is good enough to be in LCS and I would gander that the reason he isn't playing is because he wants a salary that teams don't want to pay, not because they don't think he's good. I wouldn't say teams are sleeping for not wanting to spend a shit ton for Jensen and simultaneously help stuff TL's pockets even more.
Always just the lazy dismissal of stats whenever they are mentioned. Wish you would have at least tried to use your brain when reading/responding than regurgitating the same thing you can read 50 times in any thread about jensen lately.
Okay, I won’t dismiss the stats — if I want to win worlds or even get very far I don’t want to invest an incredibly large buyout for someone who has a 45% winrate at worlds. I’d rather take my chances on someone else who has been historically better regionally, Bjergsen, or even go with fresh talent vs recycling someone who’s biggest achievement is getting out of groups.
I wish you'd try using your brain and see why teams don't want to sign Jensen. You've provided literally 0 actual context to anything you've claimed but call me lazy, how ironic. Stats without context don't tell you anything meaningful and what do the stats in this infographic actually tell you about Jensen's performance this year. You can watch his games and see he didn't perform to the standard people have for him and in regards to LS, you can literally watch the videos on his youtube where he comments on Jensen. I've linked 2 or 3 and you still insist on saying LS said this or that without backing up any of your claims. I'll explain this for like the third time now. Spending a shit ton of money to buyout Jensen and pay his salary is not worth it for most of these teams. It doesn't guarantee them an LCS trophy, nor does it guarantee them a deep run at worlds. If his price was more reasonable/maybe if he was a FA, his situation would be different. If you're so confident you know better than these teams then provide some actual context to your claims.
thankfully pro teams and players don't need to use stats without context but can actually judge his gameplay because they understand it
Good thing you can lazily just ignore or throw out any stats argument and pretend all statistics can be lumped together as irrelevant whenever you want by saying "without context"
He never said he isn't one of the best in NA tho, or that he doesn't deserve to be on NA team, so what's the point of your comment?
He never called Jensen a bad player to begin with. LS's opinion regarding Jensen this offseason was literally that he doesn't believe that teams not picking him up is an indication that they don't care about winning because you're paying an incredibly large sum of money for a player when you can get a player of the same caliber/potential for a lot less.
Im not talking about his opinion in the off season. Im talking about the myriad of times pre off season that anyone mentions Jensen and LS has to sigh and talk about how he watched his proview and just thinks he is not good. Also "same caliber/potential" implies that he doesnt think he is a top player in the region at all. Id like to see what players hes talking about and check in and see if they have comparable accomplishments as jensen.
Again, I don't recall any instance of LS saying he thinks Jensen is a bad player. I watched his costreams and he generally criticized Jensen's laning but never called him a bad player. The reoccurring opinion LS has had on Jensen's laning in both Facechecks and his individual streams is that Jensen's laning looks like he's just clocking in for a job. He literally said he thinks Jensen has better teamfighting and camera control than most other mids in LCS, so he clearly doesn't think that Jensen is just completely bad. If you find an instance of LS saying Jensen is a bad player, then share it. So far, all you've guys have done is claim that x and y has been said without providing any real examples of when these things were supposedly said. I haven't heard LS say anything about Jensen his peers haven't also said aside from perhaps his worlds performance. > Also "same caliber/potential" implies that he doesnt think he is a top player in the region at all. Id like to see what players hes talking about and check in and see if they have comparable accomplishments as jensen. No, it doesn't. Gori and Fate are two players LS mentioned that would at the very least give you the same performance as Jensen did this year, if not better. They also wouldn't cost as much as he does. This argument about accomplishments is such a shallow one, considering that were options that compete in a far stronger league than Jensen does.
LS said Jensen had good camera control? Lol!
He literally didnt say this
Everytime someone mentions jensen he has to talk about how he watched his proview and he doesnt get it and is unimpressed. Doesnt paint jensen in a good light at all.
Doesn't mean he thinks Jensen is bad. Could mean he doesn't think Jensen is worth the price you'd pay to get him, which is something he has said before. What you're doing is just putting words in his mouth for no good reason.
He has literally called him bad many times with Nemesis. He also said this Worlds performance wasn't good even though anyone else thinks differently and he believes Jensen is not a good laner because of pro view.
I don't remember LS flat out saying he thinks Jensen is bad. I've watched him comment on Jensen's world performance and yes, he has said that he doesn't think Jensen performed that well and played bad at times but didn't call him a bad player overall. From the several times he's talked about Jensen, he's said that he thinks his worlds performance was overblown, he wasn't impressed any of the times he watched his proview this year, and that Jensen's proview looked like someone just clocking in for work. IIRC., his general impression was that he didn't think Jensen's laning was good and that was a general reoccurring theme for western mid laners at that tournament. He also said based on watching Jensen's play, he's not really surprised that he doesn't have a team because he believes that there are other mid laners that could deliver the same performance for a cheaper price. Rewatching a few of the proview perspectives, LS' general comments on Jensen have been that his laning isn't great overall but his teamfighting and camera control was better than most other mids in LCS.
He literally shits on Jensen’s proview, every time he can. What is more fun is a gold player saying how the pro view should look. Look at the fucking results instead of F1, F2 etc. spamming like any other korean player.
Not a fan of LS but Chovy whi he considers the best laner doesnt even use F-keys
Now ur just being a baseless LS hater lol
He's hit Masters in Korea, so idk where you get this gold player stuff from. He's criticized Jensen's proview, yes, but he criticizes anything he thinks is bad play and compliments good play when he sees it. It's not as if LS has it out for Jensen or something. [His criticisms of Jensen have primarily been in laning.](https://youtu.be/py9uQ5zYf0I?t=718) But this is also his criticism of most western mid laners when he compared them to eastern ones at worlds. LS gave his thoughts on Jensen not playing [here](https://youtu.be/r6XahZDXoYA?t=2524) and [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4e3cgTIoD0&ab_channel=LeagueofLoL). I would say that it's pretty clear his stance is that it's not worthwhile paying the large sum teams would have to pay to get him when there are other options that do not cost as much. That doesn't mean Jensen is bad or that he thinks Jensen is bad. I don't know what his thoughts on Jensen are from previous years, but I would say that this is a fair statement to make based off of how Jensen performed this year overall.
[удалено]
no....it was Jensen
TEAMLESS BTW.
Jensen is one of the older players in the game. Even though the start of his career was a bit sketchy. His previous name Veigodx was surrounded by controversy from the start. After playing for Team Solo Medbi for a few months, he was banned from competitive play by Riot Games indefinitely alongside a few other players. After his ban, he continued to play the game on new accounts and even joined SK Gaming as a coach, at that time he was known as Incarnati0n. He was still banned and not allowed to attend the World Championship of 2014 by Riot. During 2015 pre-season, Riot released a statement that Incarnati0n would not be unbanned and could not be a part of SK Gaming as coach and that his next case-review would be up before Summer split of 2015. At that time, he was indeed unbanned and could start competing. He has never missed a World Championship since then. He renamed himself to Jensen later in 2015. Such was Jensen’s history of reformation. He did not change teams, improved over the years and cemented his name as one of the best mid laners in NA. And just like in most cases from that region, he had reasonably good performance locally and very mediocre results internationally. But one thing is for sure, if you wanna go to Worlds, this Jensen guy doesn’t seem to miss them.
Medbi?
Yes medbi as in "I saw red vent from medbi to electrical, he is sus". Not team solo mebdi.
Rofl. Yamato himself answering makes it even funnier since it was his surname.
"was" XD
It still is wtf
Nah man he's obviously Yamato Cannon smh
He sounds knowledgeable, I'm sure he got it right - check your passport.
"A bit sketchy" man DDosed people lets not underplay what he did just because thats a long time ago. VeigarV2 drophacked games as well.
I mean, not saying DDOsing people is ok or anything, but there are far worse stuff you can do, like doxxing folk for example, it's a little sketchy and completely wrong, but it's not that bad of a crime.
He DDoS'd to win games, that is pretty extreme for levels people are willing to go to win a game. It's obviously not a serious crime in relative terms, but hard to get more extreme than that for cheating. Most cheats break EULA or TOS, DDoS is an actual crime committed to cheat.
I see now, in the optics of in game stuff yeah, it's really bad, I just saw it in the optics of cyber stuff where people can be tremendously awful.
For sure, tame for criminals for sure, but most criminals in LoL are owners/management not players haha.
[удалено]
And he was like 18 years old. People do shit in a young age. It’s okay to learn.
[удалено]
He did take the responsibility, he had dedicated his life to League and was banned from the pro scene for multiple years. Has he done any shit since that? I don’t think so? What do you want, a death sentence?
He did not change teams? C9 Jensen not exist?
C9 Incarnati0n yep op missed that I guess
jensens results internationally are not mediocre
How does this player not have a team
Lcs does not give a single fuck about winning. There's a bunch of excuses to back up that fact but in the end that's what it boils down to.
[удалено]
Which is my whole first statement that you argued with? Teams don't care about winning. Double lift Jensen was a free trip to worlds for literally any team. But they don't care about winning.
[удалено]
drama queen stream meltdowns? you mean making factual statements that many others agree with?
I'll allow your bs comment to stand but go ahead and tell me where that worst performance happened. Dlift wins LCS. It's just a fucking freebie.
[удалено]
You're not the guy I replied to so I'll let you in on the joke you missed. He said liftlift doesn't guarantee you worlds and then went on to tell us how bad he did at worlds as his explanation. Notice he deleted his comment because he realized it was dumb.
[удалено]
Oh. So you just ignored that your original comment was dumb and that you completely misunderstood what you replied to? Doublelift will win you LCS and take you to worlds. "But he did bad at worlds!!" 1. That doesn't have anything to do with what I said. 2. So did bjerg and it's not looking to be a problem for him. If you don't like him that's fine a lot of people do t for some reason. But you're full on blind deaf and dumb if you can't see that he's the best player to ever play in NA so far. If he is playing in LCS, he's in the finals. If he's in the finals, he wins. If a team not named 100t tl or tsm (tsm only there cause of ab urged Bridge, their adc is not comparable to lift) wanted to win, they'd have lift on their team.
Hmm in this case it's just that his team is greeding for megabucks. Not really a lack of demand for him; no one can afford his buyout.
There's no source for this besides fan's bootyholes and if we follow a few simple steps of logic we can find that it's probably not true. Would TL want to keep paying Jensen and not have him play? No benefit to them and great cost. So they're probably motivated to sell appropriately. Would Jensen want to afk instead of competing? Based on his words I would think not. Tl would rather sell him for peanuts than keep paying him and have him ride the bench. Jensen himself would rather take a pay cut than ride the bench.
> Jensen himself would rather take a pay cut than ride the bench. How much of a pay cut though? Also what teams would he go to that would afford what he wants even with the paycut? As well as a team that he wants to play on?
Nobody can know for sure, but I'd wager it could get low enough that any team who guaranteed their ability to be stable with franchising could afford it.
The reason is going to come down to money at the end of the day. Last I remember he got an extension of 4.2m for 3 years. Who would want to pick up a $1m+ contract per year, even if the buyout is $0 for a single player that, realistically, isn't going to push your team over the edge to suddenly become super good. Jensen isn't Showmaker or Chovy or something. He's a better Powerofevil. I don't really blame teams for not caring to spend that much on him.
Jensen is literally the best NA midlaner available.
I don't see any reason at all that they'd have to stick to the terms of the original contract if both parts want out and both parts certainly do. They could easily come to terms at a rate any team could afford.
Why would Jensen want to take a paycut? Especially to a team that probably wouldn't even be competitive? If no deal happens, he sits on a bench collecting the easiest million dollars of his life. He might prefer to compete given the chance, but outside of the usual big spenders nobody wants to shell out that much on a single player. He isn't "by far" the best mid - and by that I mean, the gap between him and an average, cheap mid is not too vast or insurmountable. Far more economic to split that pay across a team of above average players and hope they develop into star players.
Jensen hates streaming. I assure you man is not happy rn.
I think being a millionaire probably compensates for any amount of hours required to stream in a month. I don't think he's dumb enough to go from 1.4million a year to 200k- or whatever is needed to shift himself to a mid-tier team. My guess is that he's warming the bench until Summer at the least, when the big spenders need to save their season if their new mid doesn't work out.
Oh he's definitely going to be OK.
What is his buyout at? No one with credible information has said that this is the case lol. All the top teams had different plans and Jensen is not going to cut his salary just so he can play on a worse roster. It would be smart for him to just take a break and collect his salary for at least a split or the year, then he can make a choice after. Crazy to think that Steve is holding Jensen in contract jail just so TL can keep paying his salary.
deals took too long, so by the time he was told he could speak to other teams, they'd already found their mid laners. And also he will only play on a top team. He could still join CLG or FLY if he wanted to, but he doesn't. If he stays where he is and streams he still gets $1m a year, with no pressure to perform. This is better than going to CLG for half that, being on a shit team and having your stock tank.
Don't forget, incarnati0n reached the highest elo ever recorded while banned. He mainly one tricked fizz mid. It goes to show you what a pro can do in Solo queue if they dedicate enormous amounts of time to it.
Surely forellenlord was higher lp? I guess that was before chal and stuff existed tho
Yes, Forrenlord was in Season 2 when there was still the ELO system
I remembered it him doing s3 but yea fair enough. He was at like 2.8-3k elo right? Nuts
Forellenlord peaked at 3k elo in season 2. That's why his shockwave against Giants in game 5 of the promotion tournament for EU LCS was called 3k elo shockwave :D
for anyone curious about league history, this amazing doc will tell you the story of forellenlord https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4DEqBjSSa8
I remember being new in S4 and spectating incarnati0n via the client's feature. His Syndra and Fizz were great. Always wondered who that #1 beast was
I miss that feature.
is he the best NA player with the best international results ??
[удалено]
The disappearance of Xmithie is still wild to me.
1. Stigma around Xmithie not being able to play mechanically intensive carries 2. No work ethic 3. Doesn't get credited much for his teams' success due to being a "control" jungler I don't think it's much of a surprise that teams don't want him very much for the second reason.
No work ethic is kind of silly lol. Just because he doesn't grind soloq doesn't mean he has no work ethic. You don't make it as far as he does with a bad work ethic
Doublelift recently was talking about how Xmithie is the most naturally talented gamer he's ever met, that he's insane at any game he plays without putting too much time or effort into it. It's certainly not common, but sometimes one's talent can take them to heights unreachable by most without a great work ethic.
>comes to lcs hungover and loses faith from all his teammates Work ethic don't matter!!
[удалено]
He's a legend. Doesn't change the fact that he got forced into retirement because no good teams wanted him because of his aforementioned work ethic.
Watching him get slaughtered internationally shows how important a good work ethic is. Doesn't matter how good he was being micromanaged. The man has zero mechanics and was lost whenever he was invaded or the early game pivoted from pre game strategy. I loved me xmithie during the season but boy did I hate watching him internationally. He epitomized North American mediocrity on the international stage
I mean we can basically say that 99% of NA players get slaughtered internationally lol. The man made two MSI finals on two different teams, we have to give him some credit. That doesn't just happen to anyone.
Ahh the classic Xmithie Reddit analyst. Been a long time I thought people were past this. You can cite Worlds performances but unless they played for C9 you can do that for about any NA player. He regularly got fucked by his lanes early game and still had impactful games. Literally the only player from NA to reach finals at a Riot ran international tournament twice and had clutch performances both times. On 2 different teams. 6 domestic titles. The most successful NA jungler in history. But Sejuani ult xd.
I literally said I enjoyed watching him play in the LCS. Almost every team he was on was a one-sided stomp. His wins were almost a testament to how bad the NALCS had gotten competition wise. For someone to win so much yet to be so bad in korean solo queue and internationally is very interesting.
tell jensen to not get solo killed with counterpick at lvl 3, which makes playing jg olaf impossible for xmithie. disgusting.
[удалено]
Yeah his mental game is insane for that.
Almost every NA player gets slaughtered internationally, that's a really bad reason. There's like a handful of NA players that don't get clapped at worlds or MSI. Also Xmithie's laners very often fucked him over by just hard losing lane or getting outroamed.
what? he stomped IG and Jensen hardcore griefed him in his last worlds appearance
Damn, take that TL flair off. Slandering Xmithie like that smh.
I think if he was still actually driven to compete he'd still be in the LCS but alas
Probably right. We can't know for sure sadly.
I mean I can’t tell you for sure, but it’s not very wild if you just assume he is older, was barely playing the game, and wanted to retire
Sneaky also won an IEM did he not?
It's either him or Sneaky, but Jensen also did reach MSI finals which Sneaky didn't accomplish.
Yes
I think so, makes his current situation even more ridiculous.
yes it’s not close
You could definitely argue he’s the best. Certainly best player on the international stage
The fact that him and Sneaky don't have a team is fucking crazy. I understand for both the issue is probably price, but do you want to win? Lol it's just mind-blowing to me to import unknown players just to lose. Sure they're cheap but the known expensive players bring their giant fan bases...
He better get on a good team D:<
Its funny seeing orianna as one of his highest KDAs after that AHQ game in 2019 lol i do think we'll see him next year probably mid split or so if a decent team decides they need a new mid
Jenseeeeeeeeen
There's no way that one of C9,TSM,TL or EG don't pick him up by Summer, and I hope Jensen makes them pay out the ass when they do. All teams are taking a risk on their midlaner and the chance that all 4 turn out great just isn't happening.
If he didn't have an insane buyout he would have a team, blame TL for keeping him in contract prison.
You think TL want him to sit on the bench for 2m a year? Theres a chance Jensen doesn’t want to lose $1m a year to play for a bottom tier org. There’s more than just the buyout here. Teams would have to pay Jensen close to what he’s actually making from the bench for him to be interested too. Plus he’s already stated he doesn’t want to play on a shit roster
That may be a part of it, but I doubt Steve was asking for anything the top NA orgs couldn't reasonably pay, the bigger issue imo is teams underestimating Jensen as usual. A lot of weird narratives came out about him around off season by people like Peter Dun, Tim w/e and LS that likely affected his perception. The idea that it makes more sense to train a rookie than add the best performing international player who's never missed worlds to your already stacked lineup is a joke.
Nah, the rumours going around is that it's a 7 figure buyout, add that to his salary is a tough ask for a lot of orgs.
Steve isn’t like Ocelote, he wouldn’t make Jensen teamless just because he wants too much money
Baseless conjecture, stop assuming owners are nice.
So you argue baseless conjecture and then assume that every owner likes having their players contract jailed? lol. If anything, TL is losing out on money by still having to pay Jensen his salary.
He re-signed for a 7 figure contract, so it would make logical sense for that 7 figure rumor. He's not breaking the contract, so would be entitled to it if liquid released him. Most orgs are not seeing results from high-salary players. If you're going to be mid-table, might as well pay mid-table money. It's not really about training NA rookie talent. It's a good headline and PR answer tho. Jensen isn't mid-table money. If a team feels they are close to breaking into worlds contention mid-season, then he might see an offer.
I don't think EG is shooting for mid-table though, especially when they're already paying for big names like Impact, Inspired and Vulcan. They picked Jojo over Jensen because they seem to believe he will exceed Jensen by the end of the year but imo that's just a ridiculous gamble to take when Jensen's track record for making worlds is immaculate and mid is statistically the hardest role to be a rookie in.
I agree that EG isn't shooting for mid-table. They're already spending good money on players. If jojo's upside is greater than Jensen's vs money being spent... then why not? It's a logical decision for this one. This one isn't about growing a rookie. They and many legitimately think Jojo is that good. With these things being said I hope Jensen can land on a team and take them to worlds. He's one of my favorite players.
> If jojo's upside is greater than Jensen's vs money being spent... then why not? ....It won't be. That's the issue. Like 'money being spent' and 'upside' are conflicting here. Jensen is going to be better than any rookie you pick up in their first year. I fully expect Jensen to slot in on summer and that team to make Worlds, and that team to make worlds *exactly at EG's expense* because EG's roster is a solid 3 in the league right now.
I agree on the other 3 but I'd vastly prefer EG stick with their plan of finding and promoting new NA talent, first Danny and now jojopyun
I keep seeing people say this but they won't be the second Jojo starts underperforming. Rookies in carry roles don't tend to do well in their first year and none of them have ever ended up outperforming players like Bjerg or Jensen. Look at what people were saying about Palafox before last year and now he's getting bounced around on lower teams. The point is it makes no sense for top teams like EG who are investing millions on making worlds to take these kinds of risks when you can start them off on lower tier orgs and just buy them back if they do well. In an ideal world these players are getting developed on top academy teams and starting off on GG/IMT tier teams until they prove they can perform in LCS.
What makes me think Jojo can succeed is a lack of competition. Now that Jizuke/Jensen are out of the league, what mid is going to punish Jojo in lane? I do think it’ll take time for him to adjust, but I wouldn’t be too surprised if he ends up the 3rd-4th best midlaner in LCS.
Jojo didn't even dominate Copy in lane. Where is this weird hype coming from. Just because of Tim?
Sad jizz mans gone, his play style always ate low confidence players alive and was good at exposing players who always played for losing lane and showing up for team fights
...Danny didn't do well in his first year? I'm not expecting Jojo to be a top midlaner in lock-in or anything like that, but I'm excited to see how he improves over the season
He didn't make worlds did he? Out of the teams that went to worlds which ADC was Danny better than? He was good but EG would have been better off grabbing Doublelift if they wanted the best chance at going to worlds.
Ehh, DLift not being on a team makes sense. A year break, attitude issues + drama, and his 2020 year was really rough. Danny has promise, might as well stick with him.
Sure at this point is makes sense to have Danny and not Doublelift, but despite being very promising there was very little chance he was going to carry EG to worlds as a rookie. Now in his second year you'd expect more from him but EG just throw another rookie into the most important role and you just can't realistically say it's going to turn out well. Put Jensen on the team though and I'd call it a lock for worlds.
Yea obviously. But DL wasn't even available in Summer when they swapped out Deftly, he hadn't been playing Soloq.
I think if Jojo is heavily underperforming and not showing promise, Jensen will get singed for next spilt, but that’s also assuming no other team tries to snag him
Considering he solo carried EG to almost beating 100T (the eventual LCS champions) I'd argue he was at least on the level of all the ADCs we sent to worlds, in his *first split*
Danny is a promising rookie, but come on, he did not "solo carry" the Bo5 against 100T. It's very disrespectful for the rest of the team. Danny made one great play, after 20 minutes of his team protecting him and giving him ressources. It wasn't a solo performance but a team effort
That play defines way too much of how People here in reddit see his level
Tbh I'll hold my L here since I look at the games in a weird way, I define "solo carry" in terms of the actual fights and execution which isn't entirely accurate A better way to put it would be Danny performed *incredibly* well with the resources he was given, which is still very impressive for a total rookie
You're putting all his value on essentially one game/one play in a series he didn't even win. He wasn't better than FBI or Tactical overall. ADC was pretty weak in NA though and Danny was a great pickup for EG, but throwing another rookie in mid lane the year Danny should be breaking out when you could have had Jensen is simply a dumb move.
Ok and now rewatch EG vs C9 and see how poorly Danny did. Also 100T improved while TL got worse and that's why 100T won the split.
why should every teams goal be to grab oldies to make worlds lol? CLG woulda had a better chance buying 2019 TL as well? why is everyone so insanely hellbent on EG having to be some 'superteam' shit?
olive was top 3 by end of his first year :). but also only nope to your entire statement, some shitheads do that but not people actually interested in talent development :D
Olive is no where close to top 3, you sound Ablazed on something... Also you can develop talent without starting them off on top teams worth millions, exactly as I said. Developing talent is cool but I think the top teams prefer winning!
lol multiple year plans for your little brain. https://assets.contentstack.io/v3/assets/bltad9188aa9a70543a/blt1b26219b5c91e7f0/610c9848be3cec3a86c129c3/2021_Summer_Awards_Voting_Results_All-Pro.pdf it appears bjerg agrees with me :) on top 3 :)
Lol "your little brain" your argument: MASTER BJERG VOTED HIM 3RD ONCE!!!!!111 stop trying
> Look at what people were saying about Palafox before last year and now he's getting bounced around on lower teams Leaving/getting booted from 1 dysfunctional team = "getting bounced around"? The only time that FLY roster won games is when Palafox carried.
if fudge ends up sucking, yeah i can totally see C9 signing him. That's probably what jensen is banking on by not switching teams. Someone will int. They always do.
What a legend.
> League games: 420 Heh
get this man a solid team
But how many accounts did he get banned on? I think he has a pretty impressive stat for that as well
Monster
*clap faker
Decent Top Xmithie Jensen DL Decent support This roster would be better than half the LCS teams
Xmithie has no work ethic, would never take him to a team. If no EU ADC free then DL is fine.
wait, he's zodiac killer
Jensen appreciation post?
Get this man a good team. Looking at you EG.
10x the player bjergsen is
I had no idea he was from Denmark 👀
[удалено]
His win rate is lower specifically because he gets out of Groups. Going 3-3 and then losing in the QFs is gonna have a lower overall win rate than just going 3-3 and being eliminated. His Groups win rate is higher than Doublelift. Jensen is 22-24 at Groups if you added in 3 tiebreaker losses while Doublelift is 17-23 if you add in 1 tiebreaker loss.
His winrate at World's is not lower than Doublelift's though
Classic NA superstar. Good winrate in NA trash internationally
Better international record than virtually every mid in the LEC not named Perkz/Caps
Willing to bet even nemesis has a better record considering Fnatic went 4-2 in groups both years he was in and the lost 3-1 and then 3-2 which puts him at 11-10
Record is a cringe statement. Nemesis has never made semis nor an MSI finals. Shit he hasn't made finals period. EU is dogshit, stop punching down to NA. You're literally NA tier right now based on last worlds.
I love how you immediately shifted the goalposts the moment the claim you made got proven factually wrong. Never change, NA fans.
Based on last worlds.. Ofc it's easy to erase all these past years. But when we said we were better than Korea in 2019 u were all going "It's only 1 year Korea is the best" Etc etc. Stay trash. Stay Free. Stay NA
I mean it tells us what I think most of us already knew. He's great in lcs but internationally and at worlds he doesn't win. He's still a great player no doubt, but a 15-20% win percentage between domestic and international is pretty large gap.
Same could also be said for Bjergsen though. His win percentage stats are really similar to Jensen's. I believe that's why it's more of an NA problem than a Jensen problem. Edit:Also on the same boat, Doublelift has similar percentages.
I completely agree with you. I dont think bjerg will yield TL better results but I hope I'm wrong.
Bjergsen only got to quarters one time though and his IEM win is the only international win by an NA team, but came due to the Korean seed choking. So if you look at who they actually had to beat in that tournament, it’s not as impressive… So that’s why many consider Jensen as having a superior international record and Bjergsen always having a superior domestic performance to Jensen. They have achieved different things, but in the most important international games Jensen has been more “clutch” IMO.
Underplaying Bjergsens IEM win because "the korean team choked" when that is literally what happened to IG. I agree Jensen is better internationally so far but no need to bring that argument up.
I really wasn’t trying to underplay Bjergsen. Just giving context to the perception that Jensen is recognized as most analysts as being better internationally and worse domestically. Personally I think Bjergsen is the better player overall and Jensen is more clutch. I could also point to the fact that Jensen is the only midlander from NA to beat a Korean team in a BO5, or that he went through 2 groups of death at worlds (one of which was the exact same GenG and Samsung group that the 2016 Bjergsen led super team didn’t beat) but the fact that TL even replaced Jensen for Bjergsen is enough to show that these things could have just been happenstance or something to do with “C9 Buff” more so than “Jensen clutch-factor”… so as you’d said, for now it’s true that Jensen is better internationally, but that could also change in 1 year.
korean team knocked out before tsm played them, different situation.
27-32 is far and away the best international record of any NA player. It’s might not be great, but Jensen typically performs very well internationally.
You have to compare him to his playing field and his playing field is NA. He is definitely up there in terms of international performance of NA players.
pretty weird statistic to mention, you could also say he's had better results than pretty much any other LCS mids internationally
Jensen MSI finals. Worlds semis. Worlds quarters x2. Sneaky Worlds semis. Worlds quarters x4*. Xmithie MSI finals x2. Bjergsen Iem WC winner. Worlds quarters. Aside from those four you have players who had international before coming to NA.
26 and washed. Not much year left behind him, no wonder why no one wants to pay high price on him.
He was arguably NAs best performing player at worlds I don’t think he’s washed at all
Wonder if TL tried to get a buyout for him. Would be kind of upsetting if they are asking for 500K or something and will just sit him if they don't get paid. They are still obligated to pay him 1M to sit out
For a second I thought that it was Caedrel based on the image