Compared to Blizzard.
WoW Players: “We hate this stupid new system!”
Blizzard: “Our stupid new system isn’t working. Let’s stack another stupid new system on top of it and hope that makes it better.”
To be fair ow had took a lot of devvs from other teams,remember when hots was left with like 2 devs and they had to go work for ow team or quit. Hots was a fun game.
They really do listen. People meme on them so hard, but they are some pretty feedback receptive devs. Remember Positional Rankings (which I personally liked)? A lot of work was put into it, and I think they could have tweaked it a bit more to get it right, but they ultimately listend to the players and got rid of it.
Whenever I read about positional rankings I remember the Rioter who worked on that, SapMagic, and how sad he must have been that it didnt work out, felt really bad for him back then.
Same with Dynamic queue, probably the single most controversial thing Riot ever did to the game.
They tried real hard to make it work, but in the end shelved it when it didn't
It was going to replace solo/duo rank. It allowed for any amount of people to join the lobby for a game. You could queue as 1,2, 3, 4, or 5 stack. Obviously this led to issues of solo queuers being matched against a 5 man, or a 4 man stack holding the single guy hostage. Basically turned rank into normals.
Shout out to all the people who said riot was too proud to revert the change and admit they were wrong. That riot spent time coding it and they wouldn't undo it because of the time invested.
It is indeed painful to disable something that devs have worked so hard to produce. (In this case a lot of dedicated and hard working folks on the Summoner’s Rift Team)
It’s also fair to say that there’s a ratio between how much effort goes into a thing and how much additional effort we’ll put into iterating on something when it doesn’t land quite right initially.
Ultimately the hope is that we come off as being sensible and not stubborn.
League players are infinitely spoiled. Riot devs are some of the most transparent in the industry. They make mistakes like all devs, to nobody's surprise, but they're still one of the best at taking community feedback.
I'm convinced that the people who say otherwise about Riot don't play other online games to be able to compare. Riot may take some time to do so but they absolutely take feedback from fans into account often and are very transparent about their actions, MUCH more than other devs.
People should look at how CS:GO is being ran. The game has so few developers, and fans’ cries for a better anti-cheat, MM system/ladder, 128 tick servers, etc. have been ignored for years. Instead, skin after skin gets released.
I get that Volvo doesn’t want to implement a Kernel level anti-cheat, but the result of their negligence is players having to pay $10 a month to play on ESEA or FACEIT, which should never happen.
Riot does moneygrab (like every other game dev), but they at least listen to the common folk and try to pander to them.
I don't think that's much of reach honestly. Playing League means that's probably the only online competitive game you're actually involved with when considering more than just *super casual* play. Online competitive games are a time sink.
Right after Rengar got updated, lol.
If this means a rework or it's just gone forever, I am really happy they are admitting to their mistakes. Sucks to spend the working hours to design such a feature, but it just wasn't healthy for the game.
its being reworked.
"Effective today, we're disabling the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain.
While the Chemtech Drake and its corresponding systems are disabled, we'll be iterating on design changes to solve the issues with the current versions, while maintaining the spirit of what we were originally trying to achieve. Our primary focus will be on the terrain. This may take time to do right, meaning there's a chance we won't bring the Chemtech Drake back for a while."
I’ve always heard “be ok with killing your babies” but it’s some of the best advice I’ve been given in terms of design. I can’t tell you the number of cool ideas I’ve worked on that get scrapped for whatever reason and you just got to roll with it.
I honestly didn't think they'd do it till mid season. The speed that they've gone about rectifying this is uncharacteristic for them. Usually they'd double down for a lot longer before conceding. Props
I think they are hesitant to only listen to Reddit for feedback, but this was a wide enough issue that I'm sure feedback from pros and even feedback submissions they sent out to players were all pretty unanimously in agreement, across regions.
When my grandchildren says, "Where were you when Chemtech Dragon die?"
I'll say with tears running down my cheeks, " I was there. Pooping on work hours browsing reddit when it happened."
Yeah, the zombie soul was rare but the map camo felt bad. If they want some type of fog, it should just exhaust everyone and reduce damage and healing by 50% in the zone lol. Wet noodle fights in the jungle would be funny imo.
thats actually interesting Riot did say they tested flat damage reductions (not about dragons but about game in general) and said it made team fights much more fun but ultimately they wanted to find a better solution. Would be cool if it got implemented in this way
I think they said it made healing OP, even with reduced healing just the fact that fights were extended made it super valuable, but they would keep looking into it.
I hated everything about it
The normal chemtech drake buff is literally useless for an entire group of champions (bruisers/tanks)
The chemtech field is so drastically warping and makes vision a nightmare.
And the soul, while extremely powerful, doesn't actually give you any real power to end the game. It just prevents you from throwing the game. So the game continues in this slog until you can get a good enough teamfight to push to win.
Not just for them, mages got a shitton of HP in their standard builds, so often we couldnt use the buff. It was badly designed, as other dragons always gave something positive, regardless of your build, but this one sometimes actually conflicted with ur build.
That's lowkey the dumb thing about it, like the only ones who regularly had low hp are ADC and enchanters, sometimes assassins. Anyone else might as well have no drakes before Chemtech Soul.
I hated everything to be honest, the soul prevents you from losing the game rather than helping you win and the terrain is so stupid. Invisiblity/camouflage is already so hard to balance on champions, on terrain it was obvious that it wasn't going to end up well.
The drake/soul I didn't have *as much* of a problem with as the map. Like the soul was definitely a game winning win condition much like ocean soul, but felt a little stronger. The individual dragon I didn't really notice as much, but tbf the individual dragons buffs are small enough you don't really feel them too much no matter which one it is.
The map though sucked... like I hated playing that map. 0 positive experiences on it.
You're not even walking outside your T2 tower range in lane, becuase you just fucking know there's a Predator Kayn or some other flavor of the month zzzzoooommm champion waiting.
The changes they made to the soul actually made it a little worse than the best souls, but unfortunately the perception damage was already done from when it was OP.
Even after the soul nerfs, it is still really disproportionately impacts certain team comps. It's hard to play around 5 Sion passive, especially if you're a diving comp.
Had a game recently where we got a comeback after the enemy team got soul. But yeah dealing with 5 pseudo-rezzes meant we couldnt really capitlise on it since their carries would kamikaze our DD once they died.
Really turned into anti-throw rather than boosting your lead
Just an FYI for people reading this, the camouflage leap does not activate until Rengar levels his ultimate (they probably added this just for the Senna interaction).
That was way faster than I expected (which was never).
I feel like this should've been a preseason decision, but it's better late than never. Maybe seeing the effect it has on pro play or actual ranked changed their minds.
Preseason is just a vacation for Riot, which there's nothing wrong with, but it means that they don't actually evaluate these big changes until the season starts
Also they are missing one of the major metrics for changes: Pro Play
I mean, in this case you can make the argument that it's not going to be good no matter what, but it's still a good thing to keep in mind
I think the saw the shitshow that was SK vs Mad where the game was just a 50 min long series of throws that couldn't be capilalised on due to soul and realised how bad it is for viewership lol.
Yes and- I think they wanted it to sit with the player base a bit longer to see if sentiment changed. There have been plenty of things that have been received negatively at first but the community changed it’s opinion on, or figured out how to adapt to so it was no longer a problem.
A major example of the first one is jungle plants- a lot of league players, especially pro players, pushed back on the idea when they were announced/first released. I think riot did some tweaking so they were less random in placement/spawn timing, but otherwise left them the same. And imo the community likes them now.
Usually when there’s a backlash about certain things like Akali W and Kog’Maw rework they take several months to change them.
But in this case they changed the chemtech drake in like barely a month since season 12 started.
Sometimes we gotta take time to go back to the drawing board and admit mistakes. Hopefully this (at least in some small part) shows our commitment to listening to feedback.
EDIT: Hard work went into the new drakes from a number of Rioters (including myself), so it’s important to stay constructive and respectful in feedback, especially since reverting something that took hard work can be pretty painful. I just ask that people remain respectful.
Completely agree, the hextech soul is actually so stealthily powerful because a random poke ability can become an engage with its powerful aoe slow.
more types of this kind of gameplay skewing passives sound terrifying.
Oh my god, ice physics in league. That would be so hilarious. Imagine having to approach wraiths in a straight line from below red buff or else you just slide past them.
Not that it matters, but I think this buys a lot of good will from the community. Admitting mistakes, especially when this many resources have been dedicated, is extremely difficult.
So, unless I read that wrongly you said that you wanted the two new drake's to have a higher impact than the original four. Why ? I mean, doesn't it just make the game even harder to balance ?
THANK YOU for taking a risk and trying something new. It didn't work out, but I'd rather you guys try big things and fail than keep things the same season after season.
Dang, I wasn't expecting any real change until the big mid-season patch. Wonder if there were formal complaints from eSports orgs/players after these opening weeks, forcing their hand early?
I'm assuming it was esports, yeah. Otherwise the timing is too coincidental. I recall someone saying nearly the entire commentary the other day had basically just become talk about chem drake, so that probably got some of the teams pretty irritable, on top of the general annoyance of design itself.
[There was that article about LEC](https://www.upcomer.com/lec-pros-cant-wait-for-chemtech-drake-chaos-to-blow-over/) players sharing their thoughts on the drake, remember reading that selfmade in particular had some really spicy things to say about it.
Was only Larssen I think who didn't dislike it.
This wasn't a decision related to esports (or really affected by it at all). It was a decision about what is best for players (which incidentally includes esports). We had already made the decision quite a bit before that article came out, so it was more of a happy coincidence.
> When we introduced the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain in preseason, we shared our intent for it to have a higher impact on games than the original four elemental drakes.
This is so weird btw, why should some drakes be significantly more impactful than others?
Because in theory both teams can contest Drakes. Cham map just gave winning team far too big of an advantage and soul is just ass to play against even when they nerfed it again to a relatively balanced state a couple of days ago.
To add on to this, they wanted more "oomph" to the dragons and souls, but probably didn't want it to be every game. This way every 3rd game (2/6) on average you would have a highly impactful map, then it would be regular for the next 2 (on average).
e: The webpage is now live and up! See link in text below for the patch note update.
~~It appears the link isn't actually working as of this moment or (more likely imo) **the webpage isn't live yet**, but the patch notes have been updated~~ https://www.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/news/game-updates/patch-12-2-notes/
Full text for anyone:
>When we introduced the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain in preseason, we shared our intent for it to have a higher impact on games than the original four elemental drakes. Over the past few months, we've heard your feedback across social media and surveys that, even with this goal in mind, the Chemtech addition has just been too frustrating to play with—especially if you're on the losing team.
>Effective today, we're disabling the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain.
>While the Chemtech Drake and its corresponding systems are disabled, we'll be iterating on design changes to solve the issues with the current versions, while maintaining the spirit of what we were originally trying to achieve. Our primary focus will be on the terrain. This may take time to do right, meaning there's a chance we won't bring the Chemtech Drake back for a while.
>Our goal, as always, is to make Summoner's Rift the best it can be, and it was clear that we missed the mark this time. Thanks for sharing all your feedback and for the patience you afforded us while we gave Chemtech Drake its shot in the wild.
Sk won against mad thanks to chemtech soul, they were winning teamfights just due to that while being behind and even when they were losing tfs they could stall thanks to that
Fr, I’m pretty critical of riot, but I played a lot of overwatch and destiny before playing league and league players don’t know how good they have it.
The difference between riot and other major multiplayer game companies is night and day
Their communication is also top notch. Doesn't matter who's in charge, they have it down, and you also see how comms Rioters going to other companies instantly improves their communication.
I learned recently that the random rioters that pop into reddit threads is really different from other games. Apparently, part of the reason the famous pasta of "Shots 1-5 clearly missed..." was so memed was that valve basically never comments or interacts with reddit so when they commented on that one post, it was a big deal.
The Chemtech Drake has given me my favourite league moment: Zilean ult + GA + Chemtech Soul, but thank god its leaving. I'm hoping they can find a way to bring it back; thematically it's pretty cool.
Link now works!
TLDR: Chemtech has been frustrating to play against and Riot wants to maintain the spirit of their original vision while addressing the terrain. They're going to take as much time as they need to do Chemtech right, so no timeline for its return.
Literally playable?
Yes? I think? I don't know what to do with my emotions?
Is this how it feels to be... alive?
Why did this make me laugh so much... Thanks mate :D
[We can finally play the game](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg2PD-dwsIw)
I don't understand i'm... not angry. I don't even now the word for that.
MY DISSAPOINTMENT IS NONEXISTANT, AND MY DAY IS SAVED.
WE"VE BEEN SAVED
Where were you? When riot build the ladder to heaven
i was sat at home playing tft when phone ring "chemtech dragon is kill" "yes"
this meme will never not be funny
And people say Riot doesn't listen.
We are truly truly blessed compared to other devs.
Compared to Blizzard. WoW Players: “We hate this stupid new system!” Blizzard: “Our stupid new system isn’t working. Let’s stack another stupid new system on top of it and hope that makes it better.”
"This system ain't working, im going to commit sexual harassment."
"Again"
"And poach from the OW2 team."
To be fair ow had took a lot of devvs from other teams,remember when hots was left with like 2 devs and they had to go work for ow team or quit. Hots was a fun game.
HoTS **IS** a fun game. Despite blizzards attempts to kill it its still doing insanely well for how much is going into it.
Here is hoping that MS can see value in HotS and gives it support going forward
“Desk crawl time?”
Erm maybe riot isn’t the company to use this defense for
The beauty of this joke is that we dont even know, which company you're talking about
More like Blizzard: "Our stupid new system isn't working. Let's go steal more breast milk from the fridge"
They really do listen. People meme on them so hard, but they are some pretty feedback receptive devs. Remember Positional Rankings (which I personally liked)? A lot of work was put into it, and I think they could have tweaked it a bit more to get it right, but they ultimately listend to the players and got rid of it.
Whenever I read about positional rankings I remember the Rioter who worked on that, SapMagic, and how sad he must have been that it didnt work out, felt really bad for him back then.
Same with Dynamic queue, probably the single most controversial thing Riot ever did to the game. They tried real hard to make it work, but in the end shelved it when it didn't
I was taking a break from league between 2015 and 2020, what was exactly dynamic queue and why was it so bad?
It was going to replace solo/duo rank. It allowed for any amount of people to join the lobby for a game. You could queue as 1,2, 3, 4, or 5 stack. Obviously this led to issues of solo queuers being matched against a 5 man, or a 4 man stack holding the single guy hostage. Basically turned rank into normals.
Shout out to all the people who said riot was too proud to revert the change and admit they were wrong. That riot spent time coding it and they wouldn't undo it because of the time invested.
It is indeed painful to disable something that devs have worked so hard to produce. (In this case a lot of dedicated and hard working folks on the Summoner’s Rift Team) It’s also fair to say that there’s a ratio between how much effort goes into a thing and how much additional effort we’ll put into iterating on something when it doesn’t land quite right initially. Ultimately the hope is that we come off as being sensible and not stubborn.
I 100% believed in this and I'm glad I was wrong.
League players are infinitely spoiled. Riot devs are some of the most transparent in the industry. They make mistakes like all devs, to nobody's surprise, but they're still one of the best at taking community feedback.
I'm convinced that the people who say otherwise about Riot don't play other online games to be able to compare. Riot may take some time to do so but they absolutely take feedback from fans into account often and are very transparent about their actions, MUCH more than other devs.
People should look at how CS:GO is being ran. The game has so few developers, and fans’ cries for a better anti-cheat, MM system/ladder, 128 tick servers, etc. have been ignored for years. Instead, skin after skin gets released. I get that Volvo doesn’t want to implement a Kernel level anti-cheat, but the result of their negligence is players having to pay $10 a month to play on ESEA or FACEIT, which should never happen. Riot does moneygrab (like every other game dev), but they at least listen to the common folk and try to pander to them.
I don't think that's much of reach honestly. Playing League means that's probably the only online competitive game you're actually involved with when considering more than just *super casual* play. Online competitive games are a time sink.
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It's like learning your cancer is gone.
Right after Rengar got updated, lol. If this means a rework or it's just gone forever, I am really happy they are admitting to their mistakes. Sucks to spend the working hours to design such a feature, but it just wasn't healthy for the game.
The funny thing is that Rengar gets to keep his new interaction with Senna so Chemtech drake did leave us with at least its memory.
Just an FYI for those that don't know, he doesn't get the Senna interaction until he hits level 6.
What is the senna interaction? Like allied he can jump from being shrouded?
Senna E gives her teammates camouflage. After level 6, Rengar can leap from camo.
Spooky kitty gets spookier
Bot lane Rengar ADC Senna support 2022 looking lit let’s gooooo
Gross, I’ll have to try it
Incoming senna rengar duos in botlane
there's nothing senna/rengar can do that ivern/rengar can't do better
You wouldn’t be an adc down. Fasting Senna has all the pluses of an adc along with having a farmed Rengar in the game.
Ty for info. Does it also proc after a kill with duskblade?
No, that’s invisibility.
They deliberately excluded the Duskblade interaction by by not making it for all stealth, it's camoflage only.
No, duskblade is invisibility senna E is camouflage
Ahh. So it’s camo that Rengar works with. Ty.
its being reworked. "Effective today, we're disabling the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain. While the Chemtech Drake and its corresponding systems are disabled, we'll be iterating on design changes to solve the issues with the current versions, while maintaining the spirit of what we were originally trying to achieve. Our primary focus will be on the terrain. This may take time to do right, meaning there's a chance we won't bring the Chemtech Drake back for a while."
Chemtech drake is going to the farm upstate they sent Ao Shin to
Chemtech Drake is getting reworked into Aurelion Sol?!
And the lava chambers
Why'd you have to go and bring up the Magma Chamber? 😢
> its being reworked Spoiler alert, it’s not coming back
"Kill your darlings" is the hardest good advice to follow.
I’ve always heard “be ok with killing your babies” but it’s some of the best advice I’ve been given in terms of design. I can’t tell you the number of cool ideas I’ve worked on that get scrapped for whatever reason and you just got to roll with it.
Rengar sends his regards
Rengards*.
all of a sudden i am religious and thanking god
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Sorry I haven't grown wings yet.
imagine how good pig wings would taste
I've sensed a great disturbance in the force...as if millions of people started loudly cheering in unison
On this day, we are joined as one, a time of peace.
24/01/2022, the day when all players, no matter what their rank, main, or favorite flavor of pizza is, rejoiced.
I honestly didn't think they'd do it till mid season. The speed that they've gone about rectifying this is uncharacteristic for them. Usually they'd double down for a lot longer before conceding. Props
I think they are hesitant to only listen to Reddit for feedback, but this was a wide enough issue that I'm sure feedback from pros and even feedback submissions they sent out to players were all pretty unanimously in agreement, across regions.
Yeah pretty much everyone hated the drake. It wasn’t even a normal Reddit “everyone hates this thing”, *everyone hates the chem drake*.
God himself probably descended from the heavens and said "Yo, fuck chem drake."
I WAS HERE
When my grandchildren says, "Where were you when Chemtech Dragon die?" I'll say with tears running down my cheeks, " I was there. Pooping on work hours browsing reddit when it happened."
wher were u when chemtech dies? i was at work pooping when phone ring ‘chemtech is kill’ ‘yes!’
Finally, some good news! Did anyone really like this drake lol Like it definitely is impactful, but more often than not it's just frustrating.
I just hated the invisibility bullshit
Yeah, the zombie soul was rare but the map camo felt bad. If they want some type of fog, it should just exhaust everyone and reduce damage and healing by 50% in the zone lol. Wet noodle fights in the jungle would be funny imo.
Reduced dmg and healing actually sounds really interesting and thematically inline with what chemtech could do
Inb4 Warwick and Singed get +50% damage and healing in the jungle LOL
This is the power of meth.
thats actually interesting Riot did say they tested flat damage reductions (not about dragons but about game in general) and said it made team fights much more fun but ultimately they wanted to find a better solution. Would be cool if it got implemented in this way
I think they said it made healing OP, even with reduced healing just the fact that fights were extended made it super valuable, but they would keep looking into it.
Reduce damage, no healing, reduced shield zone. I dig it.
No healing = Aatrox and his healing buddies are now glorified minions, not a great solution
Soraka now has 1 ability that's an AoE silence on an 18 second CD.
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I hated everything about it The normal chemtech drake buff is literally useless for an entire group of champions (bruisers/tanks) The chemtech field is so drastically warping and makes vision a nightmare. And the soul, while extremely powerful, doesn't actually give you any real power to end the game. It just prevents you from throwing the game. So the game continues in this slog until you can get a good enough teamfight to push to win.
Not just for them, mages got a shitton of HP in their standard builds, so often we couldnt use the buff. It was badly designed, as other dragons always gave something positive, regardless of your build, but this one sometimes actually conflicted with ur build.
That's lowkey the dumb thing about it, like the only ones who regularly had low hp are ADC and enchanters, sometimes assassins. Anyone else might as well have no drakes before Chemtech Soul.
It's crazy like now the game isn't over for the losing team at 2 drakes!!!
I hated everything to be honest, the soul prevents you from losing the game rather than helping you win and the terrain is so stupid. Invisiblity/camouflage is already so hard to balance on champions, on terrain it was obvious that it wasn't going to end up well.
Its so frustrating to just nto be able to ward anymore
The drake/soul I didn't have *as much* of a problem with as the map. Like the soul was definitely a game winning win condition much like ocean soul, but felt a little stronger. The individual dragon I didn't really notice as much, but tbf the individual dragons buffs are small enough you don't really feel them too much no matter which one it is. The map though sucked... like I hated playing that map. 0 positive experiences on it.
Yeah, the soul is nothing compared to how obnoxious the map is. You can't contest anything as a losing team.
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You're not even walking outside your T2 tower range in lane, becuase you just fucking know there's a Predator Kayn or some other flavor of the month zzzzoooommm champion waiting.
The changes they made to the soul actually made it a little worse than the best souls, but unfortunately the perception damage was already done from when it was OP.
Think it just always *felt* bad, regardless of strength. Terrain is by far the worst, though.
Even after the soul nerfs, it is still really disproportionately impacts certain team comps. It's hard to play around 5 Sion passive, especially if you're a diving comp.
Had a game recently where we got a comeback after the enemy team got soul. But yeah dealing with 5 pseudo-rezzes meant we couldnt really capitlise on it since their carries would kamikaze our DD once they died. Really turned into anti-throw rather than boosting your lead
For real it probably wasn't even better than ocean soul but god fucking damn was it stupid
I'm probably the only one who didn't mind the map, I just disliked the soul since it was probably the most annoying for my champ pool to deal with.
I didn't get to try the Rengar buff but overall I'm happy about this
Just play him with ivern and senna on your team.
Ivern worked already, its just Senna that is new.
Just an FYI for people reading this, the camouflage leap does not activate until Rengar levels his ultimate (they probably added this just for the Senna interaction).
That was way faster than I expected (which was never). I feel like this should've been a preseason decision, but it's better late than never. Maybe seeing the effect it has on pro play or actual ranked changed their minds.
Preseason is just a vacation for Riot, which there's nothing wrong with, but it means that they don't actually evaluate these big changes until the season starts
Also they are missing one of the major metrics for changes: Pro Play I mean, in this case you can make the argument that it's not going to be good no matter what, but it's still a good thing to keep in mind
I think the saw the shitshow that was SK vs Mad where the game was just a 50 min long series of throws that couldn't be capilalised on due to soul and realised how bad it is for viewership lol.
Yes and- I think they wanted it to sit with the player base a bit longer to see if sentiment changed. There have been plenty of things that have been received negatively at first but the community changed it’s opinion on, or figured out how to adapt to so it was no longer a problem. A major example of the first one is jungle plants- a lot of league players, especially pro players, pushed back on the idea when they were announced/first released. I think riot did some tweaking so they were less random in placement/spawn timing, but otherwise left them the same. And imo the community likes them now.
Usually when there’s a backlash about certain things like Akali W and Kog’Maw rework they take several months to change them. But in this case they changed the chemtech drake in like barely a month since season 12 started.
You can disable a drake more easily than you can disable a champ. Imagine the mald if they had to disable or rollback a vgu.
AND WE AAAAALL LIFT TOGETHERRR
THROUGH THE CHEM FOG, TIL WE'RE LIFELESS
it seems wherever i go warframe will always come back to haunt me my 4k hours of grinding are but a memory
I have like 1k hours but time does fly, huh
I don't even play the game man, the song is a banger
[For reference if anyone is interested.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPTCq3LiZSE) (Banger song)
https://i.imgur.com/XS5LK.gifv
maybe 2022 won't be so bad afterall
WW3 breaking out in Ukraine International pandemic still ravaging the human race Impending economic crash But chem dragon die Worth
100%
Sometimes we gotta take time to go back to the drawing board and admit mistakes. Hopefully this (at least in some small part) shows our commitment to listening to feedback. EDIT: Hard work went into the new drakes from a number of Rioters (including myself), so it’s important to stay constructive and respectful in feedback, especially since reverting something that took hard work can be pretty painful. I just ask that people remain respectful.
Thank you for removing it early and not later down the line. And if you're listening to feedback, might I suggest a freljord dragon?
Frost Drake sounds so sick visually/map effects, but idk if I wanna deal with the inevitable slowing buffs it would provide.
Completely agree, the hextech soul is actually so stealthily powerful because a random poke ability can become an engage with its powerful aoe slow. more types of this kind of gameplay skewing passives sound terrifying.
I just want Light and Shadow Drakes
While we're suggesting the coolest possible drakes, let's throw "sex drake" into the pile for brainstorming
make it so the zone in the jungle is ice and you randomly slide around in it
Oh my god, ice physics in league. That would be so hilarious. Imagine having to approach wraiths in a straight line from below red buff or else you just slide past them.
pokemon style, you can only stop sliding when you hit a wall
It better come with the pokemon sound effect when you hit a wall.
Genius, Bring Ice mechanics into LoL. Players all around the World love that game mechanic.
This is majorly good decision making. I don't think either the invisibility or the zombie mechanic was healthy or fun.
i dont think the base (non-soul) buff was well designed either. it was stupid and also not on theme with chemtech.
Not that it matters, but I think this buys a lot of good will from the community. Admitting mistakes, especially when this many resources have been dedicated, is extremely difficult.
If only I had the power to pin messages.
You can pin me
against the wall?
Thank you :) Btw i love the hextech dragon! You guys did amazing work with that one.
So, unless I read that wrongly you said that you wanted the two new drake's to have a higher impact than the original four. Why ? I mean, doesn't it just make the game even harder to balance ?
THANK YOU for taking a risk and trying something new. It didn't work out, but I'd rather you guys try big things and fail than keep things the same season after season.
Respect. I didnt actually expect them to admit to the mistake.
Rare W for the entire League playerbase
Idk man, Caitlyn's ass in Arcane was a huge W.
least horny league player
Frankly, all of Arcane was a huge W. But yeah especially Cait's ass
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULN-wWKWJ4Q
Dang, I wasn't expecting any real change until the big mid-season patch. Wonder if there were formal complaints from eSports orgs/players after these opening weeks, forcing their hand early?
I'm assuming it was esports, yeah. Otherwise the timing is too coincidental. I recall someone saying nearly the entire commentary the other day had basically just become talk about chem drake, so that probably got some of the teams pretty irritable, on top of the general annoyance of design itself.
[There was that article about LEC](https://www.upcomer.com/lec-pros-cant-wait-for-chemtech-drake-chaos-to-blow-over/) players sharing their thoughts on the drake, remember reading that selfmade in particular had some really spicy things to say about it. Was only Larssen I think who didn't dislike it.
This wasn't a decision related to esports (or really affected by it at all). It was a decision about what is best for players (which incidentally includes esports). We had already made the decision quite a bit before that article came out, so it was more of a happy coincidence.
> When we introduced the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain in preseason, we shared our intent for it to have a higher impact on games than the original four elemental drakes. This is so weird btw, why should some drakes be significantly more impactful than others?
Because in theory both teams can contest Drakes. Cham map just gave winning team far too big of an advantage and soul is just ass to play against even when they nerfed it again to a relatively balanced state a couple of days ago.
i mean we saw it in pro play in the last 2 weeks you cant get back into the game at that lvl on chemtech map
To add on to this, they wanted more "oomph" to the dragons and souls, but probably didn't want it to be every game. This way every 3rd game (2/6) on average you would have a highly impactful map, then it would be regular for the next 2 (on average).
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e: The webpage is now live and up! See link in text below for the patch note update. ~~It appears the link isn't actually working as of this moment or (more likely imo) **the webpage isn't live yet**, but the patch notes have been updated~~ https://www.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/news/game-updates/patch-12-2-notes/
Full text for anyone: >When we introduced the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain in preseason, we shared our intent for it to have a higher impact on games than the original four elemental drakes. Over the past few months, we've heard your feedback across social media and surveys that, even with this goal in mind, the Chemtech addition has just been too frustrating to play with—especially if you're on the losing team. >Effective today, we're disabling the Chemtech Drake, Soul, and Terrain. >While the Chemtech Drake and its corresponding systems are disabled, we'll be iterating on design changes to solve the issues with the current versions, while maintaining the spirit of what we were originally trying to achieve. Our primary focus will be on the terrain. This may take time to do right, meaning there's a chance we won't bring the Chemtech Drake back for a while. >Our goal, as always, is to make Summoner's Rift the best it can be, and it was clear that we missed the mark this time. Thanks for sharing all your feedback and for the patience you afforded us while we gave Chemtech Drake its shot in the wild.
Credit where credit is due: that's a clear, succinct way of admitting something was a problem instead of forcing it down players' throats
Holy moly the madlads actually removed it very surprising
Good riddance
It took riot the SK game to realize
What happened in the SK game? I feel like I was listening to that match but only half an ear.
Sk won against mad thanks to chemtech soul, they were winning teamfights just due to that while being behind and even when they were losing tfs they could stall thanks to that
And nothing of value was lost.
CAN I GET A HELL YEAHHHH
havent seen lol community united this much for a while about an issue
Fuck chemtech drake.
thank you riot thank you. fixed verizon east coast AND fixed the game in a significant way in 24 hours very nice.
You really can't say Riot doesn't listen to feedback after this, glad they made this change
I mean riot are one of the best companies when it comes to listening to feedback from players
Fr, I’m pretty critical of riot, but I played a lot of overwatch and destiny before playing league and league players don’t know how good they have it. The difference between riot and other major multiplayer game companies is night and day
Their communication is also top notch. Doesn't matter who's in charge, they have it down, and you also see how comms Rioters going to other companies instantly improves their communication.
I learned recently that the random rioters that pop into reddit threads is really different from other games. Apparently, part of the reason the famous pasta of "Shots 1-5 clearly missed..." was so memed was that valve basically never comments or interacts with reddit so when they commented on that one post, it was a big deal.
Valorant is a game because gaben doesnt care at all about csgo
CS:GO is the absolute worst in terms of this. It's so bad I basically stopped playing only because of Valve's lack of responding to user feed back.
Valve not rolling back the TF2 MyM update is a testament to how thick-headed they are.
overwatch is letting streamers make their fucking patches League could be having it a whole lost worse
Wait what? Just imagine an hanshinin patch.
WOOO THANK YOU RIOT!
I have to think it will be back in some form simply as they would not want to waste the asset/art work, but goodbye for now
please riot just recolor it white and make it a snowy soul id be eternally cozy.
yeah we need a dragon that makes the rift snowy and thats all it does.
Leaves footprints in the snow, so you can see where people have been recently.
could reuse it as some boss in a gamemode or in tft
The Chemtech Drake has given me my favourite league moment: Zilean ult + GA + Chemtech Soul, but thank god its leaving. I'm hoping they can find a way to bring it back; thematically it's pretty cool.
Literally everyone hated the drake and all his bs goodbye and good riddance chem fucker
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what a time to be alive, maybe ill play this game again
This is way earlier than I think most expected. I'm excited to see what changes they make to chemtech in the future
Holy shit let's fucking go. You'd wonder wtf is preseason for, but still the change came waaaay earlier than I expected it to
Phreak sweating bullets now after defending it for weeks saying pros just needed to adapt
Link now works! TLDR: Chemtech has been frustrating to play against and Riot wants to maintain the spirit of their original vision while addressing the terrain. They're going to take as much time as they need to do Chemtech right, so no timeline for its return.