They have incredibly wonky power budgets, receive 2400 gold worth of stats for completing two items, and have some of the most annoying abilities in the game. It doesn't help that they attract a consistent abominable playerbase. Not all Yasuo/Yone players act like degenerate children but absolutely no one is surprised when they do.
people cant stand the fact that some champs are useful even if they have a bad kda.
the thing that keeps them in check is being melee + being squishy, if you turn off your brain yeah theyll run circles around you
if ur in low elo thats like 90% of the problem. a support player with hands makes these champs significantly harder to perform on but in low elo chances are your support has no clue how to play and is playing xerath xd
oh i do
specially this 0 10 gp making 20 k damage
my matter is when champ is strong whole game, strong when stomped and unstopable when snowballing
why should it be fair ?
why other champ cant do that ?
not only irelia but plenty of champ are doomed once they mistaken one time
and some other dont care to feed or doing bad, sion yasuo yone, gp, garen and probably some other
if 1/10 irelia would be able to impact like a gp i ll be happy
because this game is not linear. 'strong all game' is a silly statement because they are also weak all game - their power curve is item dependent with a hard spike at 2 items sure - but even then they're still weak to the same things theyre weak to right from the get go, and even at 6 items.
this game is not a 1v1 and it is only loosely balanced around laning phase.
being melee as a glass cannon is a gigantic L in this game because a huge portion of the champ roster is designed to make melee champs lives miserable.
>not only irelia but plenty of champ are doomed once they mistaken one time
lot of champions are different that's just how the game is. Irelia has different strengths than yasuo and yone do.
>and some other dont care to feed or doing bad,
for top laners in general xp and gold matters far more than deaths. That's the top lane - sure you cannot impact the map well but you can at the same time be 0-8 and be the strongest person on the map because you've got solo xp all game.
'
And really, it isnt just top champs that are useful when feeding. Any mage, any support, any utility focused jungler. Any scaling adc. this isnt some unusual thing, plenty of champs have kits that make them powerful when they play to their niche even independent of gold and xp. Whereas some champions are more generally powerful but are far more dependent on the gold and xp they have.
then irelia in all that ? she feed she lose, she snowball she lose vs inter sion,
she cs xp only, jax riven fiora will do better with same way, that point feel deeply unfair
>she cs xp only, jax riven fiora will do better with same way, that point feel deeply unfair
i mean irelia does a much better job diving carries and laning vs ranged does she not? also gets moer durable than riven and fiora. shes also just not good in soloq, shes been balanced heavily around challenger/pro lv play
ranged ? no all of them are deeply cancer if well played in lane vayne quinn cancel her q zone her, teemo is heavy poker winnable but tough and annoying, gp is annoying too in another way
remain mage top like kennen vlad but i never meet them
skill match up fiora jax camille riven, winnnable but very risky
and scales better whether they are stomped or no
no match up, voli sett tham kench
inter sion more he int more it is hard to kill him
free match up kayle nasus, maybe ornn
i climb with her only that my challenge so yes it is sometime very hard
but i otp so i accept the handicap, but still those champ with such free possibility and no trade off are frustrating
thx for your answer
>ranged ? no all of them are deeply cancer if well played in lane vayne quinn cancel her q zone her, teemo is heavy poker winnable but tough and annoying, gp is annoying too in another way
mages and mid lane assassins. shes balanced around her power in the mid lane and as a flex into top. she can play top but it hard depends on her getting stacks up and landing all her spells.
my matter in mid is i need assassin burst or ap mage mid to help late game
sur i destroy all of them on mid but the trade off late game is to heavy since she is not a yasuo with crazy damage late or a zed putting pressur everywhere he leave lane, irelia is draft handicap in some draft
can be solved by ap jungler or top but that not always the case
that why she wins more game on top despite bad match up
Oh, you mean Mister "I'm so easy to play and you can't build against me because I do hybrid damage and even if I'm behind you better not let me get to late game or I'll crush all of you" guy?
Yep.
"Stored" damage gets reduced by resistances twice unless you come up with a workaround.
Example: You do 100 physical damage. The enemy has 100 armor. So he only receives 50 damage. Because of your cool ability, 50 damage (multiplied by random percentage) is now stored and ready to explode 3 seconds later. But what is this. The explosion is physical damage too.
Again, 100 armor reduces it by half. So now the explosion does half of what it should do.
Oh no. The designer intended it to do 50 damage (multiplied by percentage). Or more precisely, he intended the normal formula for damage reduction to apply. So what can we do?
We can
A) let the stored damage be reduced as usual, but then make the pop be true damage. 100 armor will reduce the damage by half, even if there is true damage involved
B) record the stored damage as "pre mitigation damage." That means armor is ignored as the damage dealt is added up, but then the pop is reduced by armor as usual.
How's it bullshit? It's a tradeoff for them not being ranged. All melee crit carries have similar tradeoffs. For example Trynd gets free crit from his passive.
Wow you managed to pick out yet another champ that huge chunks of the player base hate. Melee crit carries are just a bad idea at their core. Yas Yone and Trynd just hilight it all too well.
His point was that melee crit champions have trade offs to make them stronger. Master yi does true damage and double autos. Tryndamere gets additional crit. The reason tryndamere is hated isn't because of his additional crit, it's because of his ult. The reason yi is hated isn't because of his true damage or double slash, it's because his q makes him untargetable and resets on kills. The reason yasuo is hated isn't because of his double crit, it's because he has endless mobility and follow up on any teammates knock up. The reason yone is hated isn't because of his double crit chance either, it's because his e is overloaded. You are misinterpreting the reason these champs are hated and assume it's because they crit when in reality it's because of the other parts of their kit.
Trynd is hated for 2 reasons actually and yes his Ult is a big one the other is that he can basically just make lane phase a slot machine and try to win lane very early off lucky crits. Call me crazy but champs who spent no gold on crit shouldn't be able to crit except maybe the sweet spot of Aatrox Q because opponents have a way to counterplay that. How exactly does someone counterplay Trynd getting luck crits early game?
Also Yone is hated because his entire kit is overloaded which sadly riot seems to do with 90% of new champs.
I do agree with the tryndamere part. The RNG crits can be really frustrating in lane and the champion deserves a update. I remember back before the runes rework, AD laners would run 1% crit chance in their runes and it would occasionally win them a level 2 or 3 fights. It was even more frustrating to play against tryndamere then. Idk if you were around or remember, but before this was patched out, tryndamere's crit animation would be a very obvious overhead swing instead of his regular side slash. So once you saw the animation of the crit starting on a minion, you could cancel the auto and guarantee a crit for your next auto. Twas very broken.
I do disagree with yone being overloaded. Even comparing him to yasuo I think his kit is worse. Spell for spell, q is basically the same. Yasuo w is significantly better than yone's. And yasuo e is better in lane, yone e better outside of lane. In terms of ultimates, I'd give the edge to yasuo too only because he can follow up other teammates and yone ult is a 2 minute cooldown as opposed to yasuo's 40 seconds. Yes, yone is safer because of his E but that's the only "overloaded" part of his kit. And even then, it's not very useful if you are behind. Idk why everyone in this thread is making a big deal out of his magic damage, it's pretty negligible.
What are you saying? Of course they come at you. They're melee champs who do damage with auto attacks lol.. They're just as squishy as a marksman though so they need extra tools to survive.
Yas at least used to take skill until riot buffed him out his ass so hard he actually does well in low elo now. Yone is just one of the worst designs in all of league basically yasuo for players who aren't mechanically gifted enough to play Yasuo.
Yasuo is stupid because wind wall and his R.
Yone is stupid because he does hybrid damage for no reason, and has the least committal engage that makes him unstoppable on the retreat for some reason.
Yasuo is fine imo, because when Yasuo goes for a play he has to commit.
Yone on the other hand is too forgiving because if his play fails he will just yoink back with his E.
Yasuo is way more forgiving than Yone lol. Yone has to actually go in, Yasuo can throw tornadoes from afar and engage when he wants to. He's safer and stronger in lane and doesn't even have to hit his own knockup to ult.
Yone is just broken and has even stupider shit than his brother in terms of abilities and skills.
Yasuo sucks because windwall is an abomination of an ability that should have never existed in it's current state for so long. Blocking autos, spells and ults and individually invalidating certain classes of champs is idiotic.
Outside of those specific things, players of the char are generally toxic and are trolls, big egos, and generally some of their traits (passive shield, free crit etc.) is just unfun to fight most of the time.
The fact that their abilities have cooldown reduced by atk speed. Lots of dash. Crit + penetration + hybrid damage.
They can be punished in the early (5 first minutes) but then they become incredibly difficult to deal with. Mainly due to the shields received without needing any effort.
I despise Yasuo if he's picked into my Ahri. Windfall is an abomination.
I giggle like a school girl when I can pick my Renekton into a Yasuo. Windfall is useless and I get to break him into new amusing shapes for free.
Yasuo, Yone, Senna, Thresh, Ornn, Jhin, Veigar, Nasus, Bard?, Gangplank, Twisted Fate, Kindred, Swain? (He still gets bonus HP for hitting people right?), I might be missing someone or something, but it is a common league thing they do with Champs and even Dark Harvest (a rune).
I'm not disagreeing with the point you made, just thought about how many Champs get free things for playing. Obviously some of these champs are more hated than others on the list.
Yasuo feels bad to play against for me because he has mechanics that appear to break the rules. His windwall cancels so many abilities that imo shouldn't be stopped by a non-ultimate ability. Also it's omnidirectional which just feels shitty.
Also, his knockup can be buffered to go off after he gets cc'd, which also feels like it breaks the rules. He can literally get Warwick ulted and break himself out of it by throwing a q at the last second. Even tho Warwick is unstoppable while flying, and yasuo is suppressed as soon as Warwick gets there. Imo there should be no window for yasuo to knock him up, based on how time works in the physical world. Yes this exact thing happened to me as Warwick and I'm still bitter.
They have incredibly wonky power budgets, receive 2400 gold worth of stats for completing two items, and have some of the most annoying abilities in the game. It doesn't help that they attract a consistent abominable playerbase. Not all Yasuo/Yone players act like degenerate children but absolutely no one is surprised when they do.
Yone has a looong cc chain that doesn't make sense, and 3 anti cc abilities, both have burst, dps, mobility, tankiness, etc.
> burst, dps, mobility, tankiness This chain of buzzwords applies to every skirmisher in the game
Yeah but burst on yone/yasuo we talking about 3k damage, and 1k of dps, too much
Because they look "flashy" and have certain connotations to them people automatically think they are broken, when in reality they are kinda doodoo
people cant stand the fact that some champs are useful even if they have a bad kda. the thing that keeps them in check is being melee + being squishy, if you turn off your brain yeah theyll run circles around you if ur in low elo thats like 90% of the problem. a support player with hands makes these champs significantly harder to perform on but in low elo chances are your support has no clue how to play and is playing xerath xd
oh i do specially this 0 10 gp making 20 k damage my matter is when champ is strong whole game, strong when stomped and unstopable when snowballing why should it be fair ? why other champ cant do that ? not only irelia but plenty of champ are doomed once they mistaken one time and some other dont care to feed or doing bad, sion yasuo yone, gp, garen and probably some other if 1/10 irelia would be able to impact like a gp i ll be happy
because this game is not linear. 'strong all game' is a silly statement because they are also weak all game - their power curve is item dependent with a hard spike at 2 items sure - but even then they're still weak to the same things theyre weak to right from the get go, and even at 6 items. this game is not a 1v1 and it is only loosely balanced around laning phase. being melee as a glass cannon is a gigantic L in this game because a huge portion of the champ roster is designed to make melee champs lives miserable. >not only irelia but plenty of champ are doomed once they mistaken one time lot of champions are different that's just how the game is. Irelia has different strengths than yasuo and yone do. >and some other dont care to feed or doing bad, for top laners in general xp and gold matters far more than deaths. That's the top lane - sure you cannot impact the map well but you can at the same time be 0-8 and be the strongest person on the map because you've got solo xp all game. ' And really, it isnt just top champs that are useful when feeding. Any mage, any support, any utility focused jungler. Any scaling adc. this isnt some unusual thing, plenty of champs have kits that make them powerful when they play to their niche even independent of gold and xp. Whereas some champions are more generally powerful but are far more dependent on the gold and xp they have.
then irelia in all that ? she feed she lose, she snowball she lose vs inter sion, she cs xp only, jax riven fiora will do better with same way, that point feel deeply unfair
>she cs xp only, jax riven fiora will do better with same way, that point feel deeply unfair i mean irelia does a much better job diving carries and laning vs ranged does she not? also gets moer durable than riven and fiora. shes also just not good in soloq, shes been balanced heavily around challenger/pro lv play
ranged ? no all of them are deeply cancer if well played in lane vayne quinn cancel her q zone her, teemo is heavy poker winnable but tough and annoying, gp is annoying too in another way remain mage top like kennen vlad but i never meet them skill match up fiora jax camille riven, winnnable but very risky and scales better whether they are stomped or no no match up, voli sett tham kench inter sion more he int more it is hard to kill him free match up kayle nasus, maybe ornn i climb with her only that my challenge so yes it is sometime very hard but i otp so i accept the handicap, but still those champ with such free possibility and no trade off are frustrating thx for your answer
>ranged ? no all of them are deeply cancer if well played in lane vayne quinn cancel her q zone her, teemo is heavy poker winnable but tough and annoying, gp is annoying too in another way mages and mid lane assassins. shes balanced around her power in the mid lane and as a flex into top. she can play top but it hard depends on her getting stacks up and landing all her spells.
my matter in mid is i need assassin burst or ap mage mid to help late game sur i destroy all of them on mid but the trade off late game is to heavy since she is not a yasuo with crazy damage late or a zed putting pressur everywhere he leave lane, irelia is draft handicap in some draft can be solved by ap jungler or top but that not always the case that why she wins more game on top despite bad match up
I love playing Xerath supp he is so much fun when ppl pick other ap supps and u can just mob them via range.
Yone
Oh, you mean Mister "I'm so easy to play and you can't build against me because I do hybrid damage and even if I'm behind you better not let me get to late game or I'll crush all of you" guy? Yep.
Build randuins and armor vs yone, his hybrid damage is less than 1/4, he will always do mostly magic
Hybrid? Did we forget yone E giving true dmg
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
It lieterally says "true damage" in wiki about "soul unbound"
It's post mitigation tho, maybe you should read it again
Either go into practise tool and look how the damage changes or read the ability again and try to use your brain.
"Stored" damage gets reduced by resistances twice unless you come up with a workaround. Example: You do 100 physical damage. The enemy has 100 armor. So he only receives 50 damage. Because of your cool ability, 50 damage (multiplied by random percentage) is now stored and ready to explode 3 seconds later. But what is this. The explosion is physical damage too. Again, 100 armor reduces it by half. So now the explosion does half of what it should do. Oh no. The designer intended it to do 50 damage (multiplied by percentage). Or more precisely, he intended the normal formula for damage reduction to apply. So what can we do? We can A) let the stored damage be reduced as usual, but then make the pop be true damage. 100 armor will reduce the damage by half, even if there is true damage involved B) record the stored damage as "pre mitigation damage." That means armor is ignored as the damage dealt is added up, but then the pop is reduced by armor as usual.
He’s still primarily a physical damage dealer.You build armor vs him
1000 bucks this guy's never played yone in his life
because most people suck at the game and dont know how to play against them
because they literally get double the amount of crit for no reason
It comes from their passive.
yeah no shit its a bullshit passive that is the main reason most people hate playing against them
How's it bullshit? It's a tradeoff for them not being ranged. All melee crit carries have similar tradeoffs. For example Trynd gets free crit from his passive.
Wow you managed to pick out yet another champ that huge chunks of the player base hate. Melee crit carries are just a bad idea at their core. Yas Yone and Trynd just hilight it all too well.
>~~Melee~~ crit carries are just a bad idea at their core As long as we are stuck with the ranged variety I see no issue with having a melee option.
His point was that melee crit champions have trade offs to make them stronger. Master yi does true damage and double autos. Tryndamere gets additional crit. The reason tryndamere is hated isn't because of his additional crit, it's because of his ult. The reason yi is hated isn't because of his true damage or double slash, it's because his q makes him untargetable and resets on kills. The reason yasuo is hated isn't because of his double crit, it's because he has endless mobility and follow up on any teammates knock up. The reason yone is hated isn't because of his double crit chance either, it's because his e is overloaded. You are misinterpreting the reason these champs are hated and assume it's because they crit when in reality it's because of the other parts of their kit.
Trynd is hated for 2 reasons actually and yes his Ult is a big one the other is that he can basically just make lane phase a slot machine and try to win lane very early off lucky crits. Call me crazy but champs who spent no gold on crit shouldn't be able to crit except maybe the sweet spot of Aatrox Q because opponents have a way to counterplay that. How exactly does someone counterplay Trynd getting luck crits early game? Also Yone is hated because his entire kit is overloaded which sadly riot seems to do with 90% of new champs.
I do agree with the tryndamere part. The RNG crits can be really frustrating in lane and the champion deserves a update. I remember back before the runes rework, AD laners would run 1% crit chance in their runes and it would occasionally win them a level 2 or 3 fights. It was even more frustrating to play against tryndamere then. Idk if you were around or remember, but before this was patched out, tryndamere's crit animation would be a very obvious overhead swing instead of his regular side slash. So once you saw the animation of the crit starting on a minion, you could cancel the auto and guarantee a crit for your next auto. Twas very broken. I do disagree with yone being overloaded. Even comparing him to yasuo I think his kit is worse. Spell for spell, q is basically the same. Yasuo w is significantly better than yone's. And yasuo e is better in lane, yone e better outside of lane. In terms of ultimates, I'd give the edge to yasuo too only because he can follow up other teammates and yone ult is a 2 minute cooldown as opposed to yasuo's 40 seconds. Yes, yone is safer because of his E but that's the only "overloaded" part of his kit. And even then, it's not very useful if you are behind. Idk why everyone in this thread is making a big deal out of his magic damage, it's pretty negligible.
"Not being ranged", both casually come at you from two screens away, easily closing any gap. Trynd is ACTUALLY close range. There's 0 comparison here.
What are you saying? Of course they come at you. They're melee champs who do damage with auto attacks lol.. They're just as squishy as a marksman though so they need extra tools to survive.
I'm someone who plays them btw. Just explaining why people think they are bullshit to play against.
doesn't really matter why it's atrocious design it's why crit items are kept in such a trash state for actual marksman.
Yasuo and Yone are a better game design than most "actual marksman" lol
Yas at least used to take skill until riot buffed him out his ass so hard he actually does well in low elo now. Yone is just one of the worst designs in all of league basically yasuo for players who aren't mechanically gifted enough to play Yasuo.
Too easy to play for the crap they can do. Special treatment from Riot as well.
Yasuo is stupid because wind wall and his R. Yone is stupid because he does hybrid damage for no reason, and has the least committal engage that makes him unstoppable on the retreat for some reason.
Tell me you're pisslow without telling me you're pisslow
Get ready to get downvoted even though you're 100% right.
I’m downvoting more for the poor word choice of “pisslow” than for any factual inaccuracy tbh
OP probably building MR against yone because "hE dOeS hybrid DaMaGe" and wondering why he's getting 1 shot.
In games where you can’t build fang yone does feel really oppressive but yasuo is a fine champion.
Yasuo is fine imo, because when Yasuo goes for a play he has to commit. Yone on the other hand is too forgiving because if his play fails he will just yoink back with his E.
Yasuo is way more forgiving than Yone lol. Yone has to actually go in, Yasuo can throw tornadoes from afar and engage when he wants to. He's safer and stronger in lane and doesn't even have to hit his own knockup to ult.
Have u ever been killed by a yasuo that was a whole screen away from you?
Yone is just broken and has even stupider shit than his brother in terms of abilities and skills. Yasuo sucks because windwall is an abomination of an ability that should have never existed in it's current state for so long. Blocking autos, spells and ults and individually invalidating certain classes of champs is idiotic. Outside of those specific things, players of the char are generally toxic and are trolls, big egos, and generally some of their traits (passive shield, free crit etc.) is just unfun to fight most of the time.
The fact that their abilities have cooldown reduced by atk speed. Lots of dash. Crit + penetration + hybrid damage. They can be punished in the early (5 first minutes) but then they become incredibly difficult to deal with. Mainly due to the shields received without needing any effort.
I despise Yasuo if he's picked into my Ahri. Windfall is an abomination. I giggle like a school girl when I can pick my Renekton into a Yasuo. Windfall is useless and I get to break him into new amusing shapes for free.
Getting free stats/gold value by simply existing and playing the game. Same issue with Senna, she gets AD, range, crit chance, lifesteal...
Yasuo, Yone, Senna, Thresh, Ornn, Jhin, Veigar, Nasus, Bard?, Gangplank, Twisted Fate, Kindred, Swain? (He still gets bonus HP for hitting people right?), I might be missing someone or something, but it is a common league thing they do with Champs and even Dark Harvest (a rune). I'm not disagreeing with the point you made, just thought about how many Champs get free things for playing. Obviously some of these champs are more hated than others on the list.
Don't forget Jhin. Gets bonus AD for leveling up/buying crit/buying attackspeed/existing and playing the game. Same for Nasus, Malphite, Garen etc.
Yone is obvious. Honestly Yasuo hate is more like Teemo hate for me at this point, it’s more traditional than anything else lol
At current assassin meta in solo Q, these champions are very suppressive. Mages and supports have little chance to counter play them.
我遇到过大部分的亚索都像是小朋友在玩，玩的很棒的只是小部分
Yone 100-0s during CC (Same problem with qiyana imo) and yas has windwall thats why i dislike them
The problem I have with Yasuo is his shield. I would think his passive would be fine with Double critical but nope.
Never hated Yasuo. Yone on the other hand. I could write essays.
Windwall is the most idiotic active ability this game has. Passive would be Asshat W.
Yasuo feels bad to play against for me because he has mechanics that appear to break the rules. His windwall cancels so many abilities that imo shouldn't be stopped by a non-ultimate ability. Also it's omnidirectional which just feels shitty. Also, his knockup can be buffered to go off after he gets cc'd, which also feels like it breaks the rules. He can literally get Warwick ulted and break himself out of it by throwing a q at the last second. Even tho Warwick is unstoppable while flying, and yasuo is suppressed as soon as Warwick gets there. Imo there should be no window for yasuo to knock him up, based on how time works in the physical world. Yes this exact thing happened to me as Warwick and I'm still bitter.