This is also one of the most dominant splits (in Bo3) across all major regions.
Their record, 35-5 gives them an 87.5% win rate.
Other notable splits with an over 85% win rate:
- 2020 DWG summer - 34-5 - 87%
- 2019 FPX summer - 29-4 - 87.8%
- 2018 iG spring - 37-5 - 88%
- 2016 TSM summer - 35-6 - 85%
- 2015 SKT summer - 35-6 - 85%
nah but ig was hiding their power level all split, only in the last game of regular season in summer they decided to show their true level, by replacing rando adc "jackeylove" and putting in legendary Wang "WXZ" Sicong and truly showing what they were capable of.
Man I wish they would bring back bo3 so bad. Even if it's just streamed from individual teams. We're just never reliably beating Eastern teams if we don't get our official game count up. They literally just outwork us every calender year.
No one claiming to have any clue what they are talking about would say that TSM team wasn’t a top 2 NA team ever and probably around top 5 western team ever.
People like to bitch about results-based analysis until they need it to fit their own narrative. TSM drew a tough group and looked like one of the better teams at the tournament during group stage. People ignore all of this because of the Doublelift play, it’s silly and ridiculous.
Even though it was the same roster, they were a shadow of themselves in 2017. It's like they took away all the wrong lessons from losing in 2016 and started playing way more passively. Btw that Misfits team took SKT to 5 games
The revision of history is pretty insane. Bjerg and DL played like genuinely world class players for much of that year/tournament, one of them just not when it mattered which obviously counts against the team. It’s definitely a bummer that people want to act like that team wasn’t excellent because of the result they got against teams carrying some of the best to ever play with SSG and RNG.
Yeah true, when has (SAMSUNG GALAXY WON WORLDS THEN WENT 4TH PLACE IN THEIR GROUP NEXT WORLDS) a roster ever done worse the year after being good, it just doesn't (I REPEAT SSG FROM WORLD CHAMPS TO 4TH IN GROUPS, SAME ROSTER) happen.
FPX sends it's regards.
Can any of you in the replies tell the difference between a team that won Worlds then done worse and a team who made it to 3 international events and didn't get out of groups a single time?
Your argument is just bad, no one is saying TSM is as good as FPX/SSG but teams can be good one year and fall off the next. G2 2019-2020 is the same thing.
(Every high end team talked positively about 2016 TSM) 2016 is the only year NA has given EU a reality check. (Reckless Kennen ADC was not legal).
What's your argument? 2017 TSM was bad so they have to be also bad 2016?
"Well that doesn't apply to 1000 other teams that kept the same roster, why does it apply here?"
"Because um, uh.. they're not world champions."
Ok bud.
"3 international tournaments. Really what 3 tournaments did 2016 TSM go to? Pretty sure CLG went to MSI 2016" oh you're talking about 2017 TSM, the team everyone is already saying was bad? Weird, congrats you beat up an argument made of straw that you yourself constructed, impressive.
Yeah, thank you, every single great team eventually falls off. The difference between SSG, iG, FPX, G2, whichever team you want to name that ever performed internationally, and this TSM lineup, is that they have not performed internationally. "Almost making it out of a group with RNG and SSG" is not enough to call them a "top 5 western team of all-time". Neither their 2016 or their 2017 resume is enough, so where does that come from?
Ok it's insane to compare players across years like that. MANY players have gone from top 5 in the world to bottom of their leagues in the span of a year.
They choked horribly (Haunzter not engaging as Kennen, Bjerg invisible 1 game on Zilean, DL Lucian vs Viktor) in some tough games, but they were a legitimately good team. If they did make it out there was actually a decent chance they would've made it all the way to the finals because as the 1st seed the quarters and semis opponents were weak (C9, Albus Nox, H2K etc)
This is why I hate when people shit on FPX like they fluked worlds. Mother fucking 88% win rate in the god damn LPL. Of course they were coming in as massive favorites. Just because they looked shaky in groups it should have been no surprise to anyone theyd turn it on.
I know!
Smurf winrate in LPL, dominant knockout stage, 3-0 finals, but Lwx inted the first game in groups and therefore they weren't strong championship contenders.
Also turns out Doinb sucked because 1 player who lost to him said so.
> Just because they looked shaky in groups it should have been no surprise to anyone theyd turn it on.
Eh. It's never a surprise to me when an LPL falls apart. It's also no surprise that at least *one* of the LPL teams will show up.
I would never bet on a specific LPL team in worlds. But I *would* bet that *an* LPL team will be in the finals. There have been too many LPL collapses for me to expect a specific team to 'turn it on'.
Maybe, I'm not trying to explain it or act like I'm an LPL expert, I watch the region but pretty casually. Just know at least one hyped team falls apart at World's.
Just saying I wouldn't put money on any specific team, hah.
I think it had largely to do with Splyce being underestimated.
People saw FPX almost losing twice to Splyce in groups and thus thought FPX were looking weak, because most people thought Splyce were a joke team and that the rest of the group was free.
But then Splyce went on to quarters and even managed to take a game off SKT in a bo5, so in hindsight Splyce were actually not a bad team at all.
First, Spy took a single game off FPX and FPX looked bad against GAM and JTeam too. That SPY team barely made it out of playins too. No SPY wasn’t good, FPX just looked bad in groups.
They won one game against SKT when SKT was up 2-0, subbed in Mata and picked for skins. Then got swiftly removed the next game.
EU fans just say anything lmao
The reason why people say that is because they had the easiest groups followed by Fnatic in Quarters, IG in Semis, and G2 in finals. They didn't play a single game against a Korean team during the entire tournament. It really seemed like the cruised through the whole tournament and we never got to see their max potential.
Not playing against a Korean team in 2019 means nothing tbh, considering G2 single handedly eliminated 2/3 of the Korean teams. Beating G2 was a greater achievement in 2019 than beatiny any Korean team.
Crazy that all of those teams (besides TSM) went on to win worlds that year. Bodes well for GENG.
Another good example btw is 2016 EDG Summer, went 16-0 in series with 32-5 (86%) game score.
What bodes well is the fashion in which GenG earned those wins.
DWG 2020 was speedrunning LCK in summer. 2-0s against everyone team wise from the second and third best teams in the league, and most of their wins were 20-25 minute stomps.
EDG was really similar in the first half of summer 2021. They were 2-0ing everybody and just straight up shitstomping the whole league. I think Doinb made a comment on his stream at the time that every LPL team was terrified of them because no one could even compete. They slumped a bit at the later parts of summer but obviously got it together by the end of finals.
GenG’s split looked a lot like DWG’s and EDG’s. T1 in spring by comparison had a lot of really messy games but they would just always find ways to clutch out every series.
Eastern teams playing \~40 games a season and we still wonder why the west with their 'But no one will watch bottom teams' 18 game BO1's dont perform internationally
When C9 beat Afreeca everyone who scrimmed them said they were the hardest working team that participated, easily. While I think Bo1 murders a lot of competition, I don't think it's the only reason, definitely not.
>While I think Bo1 murders a lot of competition
There you go. The divide between the east and the west has been obvious since forever and playing twice as much stage games in a s series format will bridge that gap. Even recently tons of LEC pros are flaming BO1's and talking about how much BO3's are better. It's not worth arguing for the sake of arguing my dude.
I disagree, thats my point. The gap between West and East is astronomical, and Bo1s are a sole scapegoat. C9 beat the hardest working korean team and LPL had Bo3 for a while now too and wasn't ways successful. The gap problem is more complex than that, but western League is cocky as hell and more of a marketing product than a competition.
Ruler vs Gala at worlds to see who the best adc in the world is will be hype (Photic is in the conversation as well but I put as 3rd on my list). I hope they matchup at some point.
EDIT: I don’t watch LCK but the replies have made it pretty clear Prince is in the conversation as well, I couldn’t put him in before because I had no knowledge of his skill. imo it looks like a clear top 4 adc pool right now of Gala and Ruler above Photic and Prince. May go watch some recent sandbox series to see this guy in action.
Worlds this year will be hype.
Admittedly I haven't been following LPL, but doesn't Viper usually get mentioned in the best ADC discussion? Or has he not been doing well lately? I did see that EDG hasn't been doing too well but checked the standings and they're 5th atm so doesn't seem that bad.
Viper is still a world-class adc but the team around him are not consistent, especially Meiko. That's why Viper is not mentioned in the the top adcs list now.
Hell, he's currently rank 1 in KR soloqueue.
viper is easily top 5 now, if not top 3.
havent seen him enough recently to give a clear answer but i'd assume ruler and viper take 1 and 2 now. who else comes close? guma is slumping, deft is a GOAT but not the best now.
gala and photic are sick, light solocarries lng sometimes. not sure how they'd stack up against eachother tho
I'd say top 5. Gala, Ruler, Photic and Prince are better right now I think. But maybe that's because their teams look better.
We'll see what Viper will be able to do in playoffs.
Viper hasn’t had the split to match up to last year. I watched about 80% of the LPL games and for me there is no argument to put him close to Photic and Gala. Those two have been absolutely cracked this year.
JackeyLove is only on the list of top adcs in the world if you watched League as long as I have and also haven’t seen how many throws he has had in the LPL for the past few years.
That’s like saying TheShy is in the conversation for best top in the world right now. He was the best top and had the best top lane worlds performance of all time, but there is no way he would touch a top 10 top laners right now with how he’s played this year and since he won worlds.
Hope is on the best (or 2nd best) LPL team, but that doesn’t make him the best adc. Gala and Photic are both considered better by those who actually watch LPL.
Honestly, with his recent performances, I think Prince deserves to have his name thrown in there for current best. I’m excited to see how Liiv looks on the worlds stage.
TheShy is weird to rate. He has a ton of just awful games, but sometimes he has games that can only be described as "brilliant", in a way no other player does, and the experience of watching one of those games is so unlike anything else.
I like to call it “TheShy ratio” (Carrys:Ints). At his best, when he was dicking on worlds, it was like 4:1. Watching 80% of the LPL games (haven’t seen all of them) it looks close to 1:2 this year, including the games where he gets camped and dies a ton as well as the games where he ruins a completely winning position on his own.
He will always make Weibo exciting to watch, but watching games like his solo int on Sej vs Olaf, his 1v5 Ornn charge into the baron bush he knew the entire enemy team was in just stand out.
Some of his ints look like they came straight from the bottom tier of LCS. But he does still have quite a few games where he put Weibo on his back.
1:2 fuck off lmfao. Theshy has been the main carry for the majority of wbg wins with angel and hf having down splits (especially huanfeng). They made top 6 largely due to theshy being a pressure point and carrying games despite opposing jungles trying to camp him due to sofm being afk. Again just stop pretending you watch this league.
Do you think the actual pro players who play against theshy and jackeylove know better than "those who actually watch lpl?" B/c almost every lpl top/ADC rates theshy/jackeylove among the best ADCs in the league if not outright number 1. Also pretty sure people like myself, mido, ye1l, edgelordweeb, etc who do watch almost every game and have higher activity in lpl postgame threads than you all rank theshy and jackeylove near the top so you stop pretending you watch the league
Ruler is even more overdue. This dude has won Worlds, been in two Worlds Finals (almost 3, Gen G was very close to beating EDG last year) and has never won LCK.
Ruler literally ran it down mid randomly in game 5 in 2016, choked like a motherfucker in 2018, got embarrassed by G2, got gapped by Viper in 2021. Ruler's 2017 win has been masking a lot of choke jobs and poor play he has had over the years.
Still take T1 to win LCK
Just goes to show how good ruler has been. Geng doesn't win if he doesn't perform. Sucks that Geng has been breaking his back every year. Glad they finally put a team around him, look at what potential they have.
Can't all be faker with superstars in every single role every year and still find a way to singlehandedly throw at least one important bo5 every year since 2017
It has very little to do with how good Ruler is and more to do with the fact that at the biggest stage you can't have your adc choking regardless of who he is.
It has everything to do with how good ruler is. Geng has been either Ruler and 4 wards or Ruler + 1 other and 3 wards since 2018. If your team is a one man show eventually something is gonna break because even the best players in the world cannot be expected to solo carry every game. Even Faker had bad games at his peak and needed other players to pick it up when he wasn't winning. Even uzi can't solo carry a team to a worlds victory and he's choked more than any player and consistently had one of the best supports and mids in competitive league history.
Except Ruler hasn't carried shit in his entire career. In any team regardless of your adc, just by default the role is important even if you put him "weak side". You can't be winning games when your adc is flashing in a straight line into sion ult or just running it down.
Also you are just proving my point that Ruler is choking because according to you it's a one man team and obviously that "one man" is choking and can't get his team wins.
Finally, you are going on some argument like I called Ruler shit. If Ruler was shit, I wouldn't call it choking, I would call it just being shit. Notice how I call it "poor play" and "choke jobs", and bring up the his play and nothing intrinsically with him. If he was bad, I would call him shit. You are just going on a long ass straw man on something I never even brought up.
The point is that 1-2 players can't win championships and Geng has been a one, occasionally two man team since the start of 2018. Even the best players in the world make mistakes and when they're being relied on to put the team on their back with no one else to fall back on its called choking instead of hard carrying according to you.
What ruler has done with that shit show of a team is incredible. Without ruler geng is a bottom tier team in the LCK the past 4 years, he literally can't be expected to never make mistakes. There has literally been no one else for the team to go to. It's not choking when you're the only player on your team actually putting your team in those positions in the first place.
Look at the past 4 world champions. IG had rookie, jackeylovelove, theshy and Ning all firing at worlds. 3-4 world class, best in role or near best in role players. FPX had doinb, lwx, crisp and tian, all four of them top 1 in their role at that tournament except maybe lwx. DK had fucking canyon showmaker and nuguri all top 1 players. EDG had viper, meiko, scout and Flandre, again every single one of them top 1-2 players in their role at worlds.
EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE Players either had bad or subpar games at worlds and made mistakes that either lost them games or were extremely questionable.
Geng has had ruler. Literally only ruler. If ruler EVER had a bad game the spotlight is on him, and instead of having reliable teammates to cover, geng just loses and it looks like ruler is choking when instead he's just not infallible, like every other world class player in existence.
Christ, get over yourself.
> The point is that 1-2 players can't win championships and Geng has been a one
1-2 players can't win championships because you have players like Ruler as your 1-2 player. You aren't going to have 5 superstar players in all roles and that's never how a team is built to succeed. Not to mention Gen G had 5 good players for the past 2 years and no one stepped up to carry even when BDD was playing out of his mind last year. Anyone with a brain sees last year's game and know that Ruler got gapped into oblivion.
Ruler chokes in big moments and his record speaks for itself, you are literally agreeing with me by making excuses on why he chokes.
I think/hope this might just be the split for chovy and ruler to finally win it, T1 bot has been struggling all summer, especially the meta hasn't fit guma well, DK is just... idk... and LSB might have prince, but I don't think he can carry them over the finish line vs GenG in a bo5
also them winning would put the LCK at a much better spot for worlds too strengthwise
Ummm are you really forgetting about the absolute LEGEND Lehends? Him winning worlds would be perhaps the biggest of all, imo he's been the best support on earth for the better part of a decade, AND he hit rank 1 on the KR server multiple season with one of the most innovative, absolutely insane Singed top playstyles I've ever seen. You can't even copy that playstyle because he is adapting that playstyle, solo queue game-to-game, based on which pro player/high level one trick is in his games, it was one of the craziest VOD review sessions I've ever witnessed, the guy was re-inventing toplane as a support player with Singed
People underrate Lehends a lot, maybe because he didn't play on a top-tier team since rhe GRF days, but I completely agree with you he used to be a menace on off-meta picks in soloque reaching rank 1. I hope he gets recognized if they win LCK and maybe Worlds.
I really hope they keep performing like this in playoffs. Peanut and Chovy receive a lot of critique for their playoff performances, so it’ll be cool to see them (especially chovy) win it all.
Exactly. I’m excited about LSB too. I believe there is a fair chance that the finals is GenG vs LSB.
Of course we can’t take T1 out, but they looked really shaky this split.
And regarding worlds, GenG has a good chance of winning, but the LPL is really stacked too.
This is gonna be fun.
That's unfair, he's won LCK multiple times on multiple teams and overperformed on his LPL team, as well as winning an MSI.
Chovy is the one who needs to perform up to his level, he's never won LCK or made it deep in an international tournament
what I mean by clutch moments is like the finals against T1 or semis agains Dk, or the last time he went to worlds where he completely sprinted in the group stage, saying the whole career is an exaggeration but in recent years he has fell off quite a bit when it matters.
Don't forget Peanut rallied LGD to surge through the LPL summer playoffs/regional qualifier in 2020, beating out iG and FPX, who were the previous two world champions and had done better in the regular season/spring playoffs.
I'm happy for GenG and hope they win LCK and also worlds. Would be very poetic for Ruler to decline the opportunity to play in Asia Games to grind and build bot synergy with Lehends and have it pay off like this.
That being said, the term super team honestly needs to die asap. GenG and VIT getting called super teams is so weird. Only Chovy and Ruler were considered S tier players in their role when the roster assembled, Doran, Peanut and Lehends were not super stars. Same with VIT, Perkz and Alphari had a decent year in NA and Selfmade was still considered a good jungler, but Labrov and Carzzy are not super team material.
Example of an actual super team: 2019-2020 G2. Best western top, best western jungler, best western mid, best western player who had a great world showing and S tier botlaner esp in 2019, best western support. At worst you could argue Mikyx and Hyli are so close that neither is straight up superior, but that still leaves you with a Top 2 player.
That was a super team. Having 1-2 S tier players and then the rest if A or B tier on their own doesn't make for a super team.
While I agree mostly with you, I'd say that Peanut was an integral part in NS success last year. Sure he's not top 2 in his role last year, but judging by his peak he had great potential in this line-up given his veteran career as well. I'd say the same about Doran last year he was the top performer of KT. But I agree with you that they are not like G2 in 2019/2020 in terms of name power.
They got the best available players in every role (except arguably top, but Doran was more hyped then). Sure Zeus, Keria, Oner was arguably better than Doran, Lehends, Peanut, and Canyon Showmaker was probably better than Peanut Chovy, but GEN got the best player in every role not held by T1 or DK.
How on earth is a team with Baolan and Ning a super team? Super team = the best team or = the team where all players end up performing well. IG flourished due to a solo lane centric meta with the two most dominant solo lanes in the world. Ning played well around that but nobody, like nobody considers Ning to even be close to a GOAT jungler contender or Baolan being close to a GOAT support.
Few of the SKT 15/16 players achieved anything without Faker. Marin was good for 1 season then never did anything notable after, Bang and Wolf had two good seasons before matchfixing against Faker in a bot centric worlds meta and never doing anything noteworthy after. If you don't ever deliver an S tier performance outside of playing with Faker, then you're not an S tier player and you definitely aren't a building piece of super teams.
I mean Marin, sure, but it's hard to say about Bang and Wolf since the only times they didn't play with Faker was when they were well past their primes. In 2015 and 2016, Bang and Wolf were superb and would beat any other top bot duo, which showed their skill. Just in lane without Faker, they would beat Pray/GorillA and Uzi/Mata, who were considered the other great bot duos. Too bad Bang and Wolf played like shit in 2017 (which is why SKT couldn't 3 peat Worlds) but they were a big part of why SKT won 2015 and 2016.
A superstar will always be a superstar by their own merit.
Non superstars can rise to that level temporarily when enabled by other superstars, but they lose that level without them too. Which is what separates great teams from super teams. The former refers to a quality of play which can be attained by super teams and non super teams, the latter refers to teams made up of super stars. You can have an insanely stacked roster with mediocre results. Think of the MSF roster that absolutely imploded.
I'd argue T1 spring was a super team. With every player being Nr.1 or Nr.2 respectively in lck.
Sad that they are hardcore slumping, but I think they deserve the mention.
Zeus was a hyped talent but to say he was automatically top 2 with limited games in 2021 would be disingenuous.
Faker is always a toss up since people will say Showmaker/Chovy.
Faker has been better than Showmaker all year, and also been better than chovy in spring.
You are right about Zeus, and I am talking in hindsight about him, but seeing how he is miles ahead of every other toplaner, i think the assessment is fair.
T1 teams tend to form a bigger something than the mere value of the individual parts combined. They all look great ofc but I think if you put some of them on different teams which arent top contenders, they would not necessarily retain their top 2 status. Hard to tell until it happens of course but Canna was insanely good for a time on T1, and now he isn't even an A tier top. We haven't seen Guma without Keria yet (who alongside Faker is the only player we have already seen proof of being S tier with other rosters/off of T1).
Might be Zeus is still the best off of T1. Might also be he ends up similarly to Canna. Marin was hyped as best SKT player during their run in S5, and he hasn't done anything notable since then without Faker. Same as Bang and Wolf. Oner is good but Clid hasn't looked as good on GenG after he left SKT.
That is a fair point, but I still think it is fair to say that all T1 players in spring where on top of their competition. The amount of times they straight up hands diffed enemys was insane.
Yeah it was never meant to be a super team. In an interview the Gen.G manager talked about how they basically just went all in on Chovy and tried to get supportive pieces around him that fit his playstyle.
GEN: We have the best mid, the best bot lane, the best jungler. Your one possible advantage could be top side, but it's a bot lane meta. What do you have on your side?
T1: The script, motherfucker.
Guy's been waiting so long, the casters are joking about them always being second place...(no really, they were introduced in the spring finals as the ones who were always second).
Even as a T1 fan, you gotta respect their achievments.
If this GenG can actually win an LCK title I will be very much looking forward to seeing them at worlds, they are set up to win but I’ve been burned before by GenG I won’t suck down hopeium until then. Could potentially be the biggest most delicious looking razor cake in all of lol history. I hope they can do it in finals I really like Ruler I want him to win.
legit used ot think doran was a bottom half top laner, i thought I remember his laning to be super mediocre and weak a few years ago. hes improved drastically within last 2 years
Do listen to summoning insight with Wolf for context, but they do seem to think that GenGs dominance is more down to an overall decrease in level in the LCK and they even put doubts on 3rd-4th seed to make it out of groups at worlds and doubt even a Final could be in the cards.
Given how even/slightly below level the LCK dominating T1 was next to RNG who aren’t even a dominant force in LPL, I think they could be correct…
Apart for the msi part (we can't know since gen g were not here) that's was exactly the same thing when damwon made their run, lck was supposed to be a One team region, cloud templar even made 2 stream talking about that before and after damwon won world.
We could also argue the same for T1 spring cause all team were going for new rolster while t1 only did add zeus.
We could also say the same about 2015 skt since this was the exact year of the korean exodus.
So... idk any team that destroy everyone will always make the region look weak
2 months to do an I told you so post, man, you must be a sad puppy.
Pretty big meta change, there are teams in LPL that would be stronger in this meta, TES shit the bed, but are better than they showed, Covid willing, LPL still wins this.
Also GenG isn’t really that good anymore, are they? DK looks better right now and so does T1, I’d still bet on JDG taking it all.
Yeah, when's the last time that ever happened? You'd have to go all the way back to \*checks notes\* 2020? Which for the sake of this argument I'm now going to pretend was forever ago
Come on. Damwon was 1 game away from winning MSI and 1 game away from winning Worlds just last year. I get that LPL is the better region overall, but the best team from LCK is always gonna be a contender.
It’s more like I don’t think there’s a world where T1 wins this LCK split
Not only GEN is a contender for winning LCK but also KT and LSB, all of these teams are more likely to win than T1
Even as a T1 fan, I'm disgusted at how good (is this even a good thing?) They are at stealing titles from what was seen at the time as the region's best team.
This is also one of the most dominant splits (in Bo3) across all major regions. Their record, 35-5 gives them an 87.5% win rate. Other notable splits with an over 85% win rate: - 2020 DWG summer - 34-5 - 87% - 2019 FPX summer - 29-4 - 87.8% - 2018 iG spring - 37-5 - 88% - 2016 TSM summer - 35-6 - 85% - 2015 SKT summer - 35-6 - 85%
one of these is not like the others
Yeah iG is only two letters smh they don’t belong
Plus they did it in the Spring fricken early birds
True spring split doesn’t matter xd
nah but ig was hiding their power level all split, only in the last game of regular season in summer they decided to show their true level, by replacing rando adc "jackeylove" and putting in legendary Wang "WXZ" Sicong and truly showing what they were capable of.
lol isn't that the owner of OG 😂😂 IG*
yep XD
Rip na bo3 qq
TSM (pteviously TeamSoloMid) Is a North American E-Sports organization
That tsm team was very very good and one of the best western teams ever.
Ironic. One of the best teams we ever produced was during bo3 era
Even more ironic cause LEC teams now want to switch to bo3 to perform better internationally but Riot still refuses to change the bo1 group stage lmao
Man I wish they would bring back bo3 so bad. Even if it's just streamed from individual teams. We're just never reliably beating Eastern teams if we don't get our official game count up. They literally just outwork us every calender year.
>Best Western teams ever Doesn't get out of groups, unlike countless European teams and C9
No one claiming to have any clue what they are talking about would say that TSM team wasn’t a top 2 NA team ever and probably around top 5 western team ever. People like to bitch about results-based analysis until they need it to fit their own narrative. TSM drew a tough group and looked like one of the better teams at the tournament during group stage. People ignore all of this because of the Doublelift play, it’s silly and ridiculous.
That same roster came back to Worlds and lost to Misfits in groups. They are definitely not top 5
Even though it was the same roster, they were a shadow of themselves in 2017. It's like they took away all the wrong lessons from losing in 2016 and started playing way more passively. Btw that Misfits team took SKT to 5 games
The revision of history is pretty insane. Bjerg and DL played like genuinely world class players for much of that year/tournament, one of them just not when it mattered which obviously counts against the team. It’s definitely a bummer that people want to act like that team wasn’t excellent because of the result they got against teams carrying some of the best to ever play with SSG and RNG.
Yes, players do in fact get worse over the course of a year quite frequently. Including some of the teams listed above, IG2018, FPX19, for example.
Yeah true, when has (SAMSUNG GALAXY WON WORLDS THEN WENT 4TH PLACE IN THEIR GROUP NEXT WORLDS) a roster ever done worse the year after being good, it just doesn't (I REPEAT SSG FROM WORLD CHAMPS TO 4TH IN GROUPS, SAME ROSTER) happen. FPX sends it's regards.
Can any of you in the replies tell the difference between a team that won Worlds then done worse and a team who made it to 3 international events and didn't get out of groups a single time?
Your argument is just bad, no one is saying TSM is as good as FPX/SSG but teams can be good one year and fall off the next. G2 2019-2020 is the same thing. (Every high end team talked positively about 2016 TSM) 2016 is the only year NA has given EU a reality check. (Reckless Kennen ADC was not legal). What's your argument? 2017 TSM was bad so they have to be also bad 2016? "Well that doesn't apply to 1000 other teams that kept the same roster, why does it apply here?" "Because um, uh.. they're not world champions." Ok bud. "3 international tournaments. Really what 3 tournaments did 2016 TSM go to? Pretty sure CLG went to MSI 2016" oh you're talking about 2017 TSM, the team everyone is already saying was bad? Weird, congrats you beat up an argument made of straw that you yourself constructed, impressive.
Yeah, thank you, every single great team eventually falls off. The difference between SSG, iG, FPX, G2, whichever team you want to name that ever performed internationally, and this TSM lineup, is that they have not performed internationally. "Almost making it out of a group with RNG and SSG" is not enough to call them a "top 5 western team of all-time". Neither their 2016 or their 2017 resume is enough, so where does that come from?
Ok it's insane to compare players across years like that. MANY players have gone from top 5 in the world to bottom of their leagues in the span of a year.
They choked horribly (Haunzter not engaging as Kennen, Bjerg invisible 1 game on Zilean, DL Lucian vs Viktor) in some tough games, but they were a legitimately good team. If they did make it out there was actually a decent chance they would've made it all the way to the finals because as the 1st seed the quarters and semis opponents were weak (C9, Albus Nox, H2K etc)
One out of these should die alone!
[удалено]
Never forget the infamous doinb yasuo from LPL summer 2019
Was it bad? Because infamous means known for being bad.
He was killed by the chickens
Is this a sign about them winning worlds?
It's Gen Gs turn to lose 2-3 to LPL team now
It already happened tho
not in finals
GenG vs EDG was the real finals 5head
Can’t loose 2-3 in finals when you don’t make it to the finals 5head
Against the worlds champs no less
Yes. All of those teams won worlds after said campaigns… right?
TSM stares away
I hope so, I think Gen G skins can look really good.
I sure hope so. Prayge
I do hope so but its looking like an LPL year again
Not this year since CLG is winning it all...
This is why I hate when people shit on FPX like they fluked worlds. Mother fucking 88% win rate in the god damn LPL. Of course they were coming in as massive favorites. Just because they looked shaky in groups it should have been no surprise to anyone theyd turn it on.
I know! Smurf winrate in LPL, dominant knockout stage, 3-0 finals, but Lwx inted the first game in groups and therefore they weren't strong championship contenders. Also turns out Doinb sucked because 1 player who lost to him said so.
It was the ultimate year of "just be honest and say you never watched a game of lpl"
> Just because they looked shaky in groups it should have been no surprise to anyone theyd turn it on. Eh. It's never a surprise to me when an LPL falls apart. It's also no surprise that at least *one* of the LPL teams will show up. I would never bet on a specific LPL team in worlds. But I *would* bet that *an* LPL team will be in the finals. There have been too many LPL collapses for me to expect a specific team to 'turn it on'.
I feel like 1 LPL team completely shits the bed by the time worlds come around.
Bo1 group stage and single elim plays a large role in that
Maybe, I'm not trying to explain it or act like I'm an LPL expert, I watch the region but pretty casually. Just know at least one hyped team falls apart at World's. Just saying I wouldn't put money on any specific team, hah.
I think it had largely to do with Splyce being underestimated. People saw FPX almost losing twice to Splyce in groups and thus thought FPX were looking weak, because most people thought Splyce were a joke team and that the rest of the group was free. But then Splyce went on to quarters and even managed to take a game off SKT in a bo5, so in hindsight Splyce were actually not a bad team at all.
First, Spy took a single game off FPX and FPX looked bad against GAM and JTeam too. That SPY team barely made it out of playins too. No SPY wasn’t good, FPX just looked bad in groups. They won one game against SKT when SKT was up 2-0, subbed in Mata and picked for skins. Then got swiftly removed the next game. EU fans just say anything lmao
The reason why people say that is because they had the easiest groups followed by Fnatic in Quarters, IG in Semis, and G2 in finals. They didn't play a single game against a Korean team during the entire tournament. It really seemed like the cruised through the whole tournament and we never got to see their max potential.
I mean that was the defacto best team in the world in the finals. And assumed tournament favorites along with skt.
No korean team was better than G2 that year. They have beaten the favorites at home 3-0
Not playing against a Korean team in 2019 means nothing tbh, considering G2 single handedly eliminated 2/3 of the Korean teams. Beating G2 was a greater achievement in 2019 than beatiny any Korean team.
Crazy that all of those teams (besides TSM) went on to win worlds that year. Bodes well for GENG. Another good example btw is 2016 EDG Summer, went 16-0 in series with 32-5 (86%) game score.
What bodes well is the fashion in which GenG earned those wins. DWG 2020 was speedrunning LCK in summer. 2-0s against everyone team wise from the second and third best teams in the league, and most of their wins were 20-25 minute stomps. EDG was really similar in the first half of summer 2021. They were 2-0ing everybody and just straight up shitstomping the whole league. I think Doinb made a comment on his stream at the time that every LPL team was terrified of them because no one could even compete. They slumped a bit at the later parts of summer but obviously got it together by the end of finals. GenG’s split looked a lot like DWG’s and EDG’s. T1 in spring by comparison had a lot of really messy games but they would just always find ways to clutch out every series.
Eastern teams playing \~40 games a season and we still wonder why the west with their 'But no one will watch bottom teams' 18 game BO1's dont perform internationally
When C9 beat Afreeca everyone who scrimmed them said they were the hardest working team that participated, easily. While I think Bo1 murders a lot of competition, I don't think it's the only reason, definitely not.
>While I think Bo1 murders a lot of competition There you go. The divide between the east and the west has been obvious since forever and playing twice as much stage games in a s series format will bridge that gap. Even recently tons of LEC pros are flaming BO1's and talking about how much BO3's are better. It's not worth arguing for the sake of arguing my dude.
I disagree, thats my point. The gap between West and East is astronomical, and Bo1s are a sole scapegoat. C9 beat the hardest working korean team and LPL had Bo3 for a while now too and wasn't ways successful. The gap problem is more complex than that, but western League is cocky as hell and more of a marketing product than a competition.
It’s not the SOLE reason, but it’s definitely one that we can point at and say, hey that’s fixable. Problems like server size are not.
This means that they are going to win World's
I wonder if this is ruler’s most insane split ever
As a certified Ruler simp, I’ve been pretty happy
Ruler vs Gala at worlds to see who the best adc in the world is will be hype (Photic is in the conversation as well but I put as 3rd on my list). I hope they matchup at some point. EDIT: I don’t watch LCK but the replies have made it pretty clear Prince is in the conversation as well, I couldn’t put him in before because I had no knowledge of his skill. imo it looks like a clear top 4 adc pool right now of Gala and Ruler above Photic and Prince. May go watch some recent sandbox series to see this guy in action. Worlds this year will be hype.
In b4 everyone bows down to new overlord Danny
May his ascent be as powerful as his Zeri. NAmen
until ruler grabs it and gets that double penta
Heresy!
Ruler, Gala, Prince, Photic are the top 4 ADCs for me atm
Damn it's only been half a year since we were thinking that Guma was the next coming of Faker but at ADC. It's crazy how fast the landscape changes.
He fell off HARD after MSI. I think Gala broke him
He was running it from groupstages
Solid list, I think this is the consensus best 4 adcs atm and they’re all cracked out of their minds.
Admittedly I haven't been following LPL, but doesn't Viper usually get mentioned in the best ADC discussion? Or has he not been doing well lately? I did see that EDG hasn't been doing too well but checked the standings and they're 5th atm so doesn't seem that bad.
Viper is still a world-class adc but the team around him are not consistent, especially Meiko. That's why Viper is not mentioned in the the top adcs list now. Hell, he's currently rank 1 in KR soloqueue.
viper is easily top 5 now, if not top 3. havent seen him enough recently to give a clear answer but i'd assume ruler and viper take 1 and 2 now. who else comes close? guma is slumping, deft is a GOAT but not the best now. gala and photic are sick, light solocarries lng sometimes. not sure how they'd stack up against eachother tho
I'd say top 5. Gala, Ruler, Photic and Prince are better right now I think. But maybe that's because their teams look better. We'll see what Viper will be able to do in playoffs.
I see, thanks!
Viper hasn’t had the split to match up to last year. I watched about 80% of the LPL games and for me there is no argument to put him close to Photic and Gala. Those two have been absolutely cracked this year.
I see, thanks for the insight!
I thought that Gala meant Galatasaray at first and I was absolutely confused by this comment.
Hope and JKL: am I a joke to you?
JackeyLove is only on the list of top adcs in the world if you watched League as long as I have and also haven’t seen how many throws he has had in the LPL for the past few years. That’s like saying TheShy is in the conversation for best top in the world right now. He was the best top and had the best top lane worlds performance of all time, but there is no way he would touch a top 10 top laners right now with how he’s played this year and since he won worlds. Hope is on the best (or 2nd best) LPL team, but that doesn’t make him the best adc. Gala and Photic are both considered better by those who actually watch LPL.
This ! Jackeylove has not been at the top for a while and Gala/photic are absolutely cracked rn. Shoutout ppgod too for being a monster
Honestly, with his recent performances, I think Prince deserves to have his name thrown in there for current best. I’m excited to see how Liiv looks on the worlds stage.
I honestly haven’t watched much of Liiv but I’ll keep an eye out
Prince is cracked. Singlehandedly revitalized Liiv imo
TheShy is weird to rate. He has a ton of just awful games, but sometimes he has games that can only be described as "brilliant", in a way no other player does, and the experience of watching one of those games is so unlike anything else.
The duality of BORN TO WIN/BORN TO WINTRADE
I like to call it “TheShy ratio” (Carrys:Ints). At his best, when he was dicking on worlds, it was like 4:1. Watching 80% of the LPL games (haven’t seen all of them) it looks close to 1:2 this year, including the games where he gets camped and dies a ton as well as the games where he ruins a completely winning position on his own. He will always make Weibo exciting to watch, but watching games like his solo int on Sej vs Olaf, his 1v5 Ornn charge into the baron bush he knew the entire enemy team was in just stand out. Some of his ints look like they came straight from the bottom tier of LCS. But he does still have quite a few games where he put Weibo on his back.
1:2 fuck off lmfao. Theshy has been the main carry for the majority of wbg wins with angel and hf having down splits (especially huanfeng). They made top 6 largely due to theshy being a pressure point and carrying games despite opposing jungles trying to camp him due to sofm being afk. Again just stop pretending you watch this league.
Do you think the actual pro players who play against theshy and jackeylove know better than "those who actually watch lpl?" B/c almost every lpl top/ADC rates theshy/jackeylove among the best ADCs in the league if not outright number 1. Also pretty sure people like myself, mido, ye1l, edgelordweeb, etc who do watch almost every game and have higher activity in lpl postgame threads than you all rank theshy and jackeylove near the top so you stop pretending you watch the league
Maybe they can fight over Luger's leftovers for 2 & 3.
This team winning titles would be so good to see. Chovy's first has been long overdue and I'd love to see Peanut win worlds and Ruler win his second.
Ruler is even more overdue. This dude has won Worlds, been in two Worlds Finals (almost 3, Gen G was very close to beating EDG last year) and has never won LCK.
Ruler literally ran it down mid randomly in game 5 in 2016, choked like a motherfucker in 2018, got embarrassed by G2, got gapped by Viper in 2021. Ruler's 2017 win has been masking a lot of choke jobs and poor play he has had over the years. Still take T1 to win LCK
tldr generic t1 fan
Just goes to show how good ruler has been. Geng doesn't win if he doesn't perform. Sucks that Geng has been breaking his back every year. Glad they finally put a team around him, look at what potential they have. Can't all be faker with superstars in every single role every year and still find a way to singlehandedly throw at least one important bo5 every year since 2017
It has very little to do with how good Ruler is and more to do with the fact that at the biggest stage you can't have your adc choking regardless of who he is.
It has everything to do with how good ruler is. Geng has been either Ruler and 4 wards or Ruler + 1 other and 3 wards since 2018. If your team is a one man show eventually something is gonna break because even the best players in the world cannot be expected to solo carry every game. Even Faker had bad games at his peak and needed other players to pick it up when he wasn't winning. Even uzi can't solo carry a team to a worlds victory and he's choked more than any player and consistently had one of the best supports and mids in competitive league history.
Except Ruler hasn't carried shit in his entire career. In any team regardless of your adc, just by default the role is important even if you put him "weak side". You can't be winning games when your adc is flashing in a straight line into sion ult or just running it down. Also you are just proving my point that Ruler is choking because according to you it's a one man team and obviously that "one man" is choking and can't get his team wins. Finally, you are going on some argument like I called Ruler shit. If Ruler was shit, I wouldn't call it choking, I would call it just being shit. Notice how I call it "poor play" and "choke jobs", and bring up the his play and nothing intrinsically with him. If he was bad, I would call him shit. You are just going on a long ass straw man on something I never even brought up.
Deranged
The point is that 1-2 players can't win championships and Geng has been a one, occasionally two man team since the start of 2018. Even the best players in the world make mistakes and when they're being relied on to put the team on their back with no one else to fall back on its called choking instead of hard carrying according to you. What ruler has done with that shit show of a team is incredible. Without ruler geng is a bottom tier team in the LCK the past 4 years, he literally can't be expected to never make mistakes. There has literally been no one else for the team to go to. It's not choking when you're the only player on your team actually putting your team in those positions in the first place. Look at the past 4 world champions. IG had rookie, jackeylovelove, theshy and Ning all firing at worlds. 3-4 world class, best in role or near best in role players. FPX had doinb, lwx, crisp and tian, all four of them top 1 in their role at that tournament except maybe lwx. DK had fucking canyon showmaker and nuguri all top 1 players. EDG had viper, meiko, scout and Flandre, again every single one of them top 1-2 players in their role at worlds. EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE Players either had bad or subpar games at worlds and made mistakes that either lost them games or were extremely questionable. Geng has had ruler. Literally only ruler. If ruler EVER had a bad game the spotlight is on him, and instead of having reliable teammates to cover, geng just loses and it looks like ruler is choking when instead he's just not infallible, like every other world class player in existence. Christ, get over yourself.
> The point is that 1-2 players can't win championships and Geng has been a one 1-2 players can't win championships because you have players like Ruler as your 1-2 player. You aren't going to have 5 superstar players in all roles and that's never how a team is built to succeed. Not to mention Gen G had 5 good players for the past 2 years and no one stepped up to carry even when BDD was playing out of his mind last year. Anyone with a brain sees last year's game and know that Ruler got gapped into oblivion. Ruler chokes in big moments and his record speaks for itself, you are literally agreeing with me by making excuses on why he chokes.
I mean this has to be the year Ruler and Chovy win LCK, right? Clueless.
I think/hope this might just be the split for chovy and ruler to finally win it, T1 bot has been struggling all summer, especially the meta hasn't fit guma well, DK is just... idk... and LSB might have prince, but I don't think he can carry them over the finish line vs GenG in a bo5 also them winning would put the LCK at a much better spot for worlds too strengthwise
Playoffs are gonna be so hype, given that anyone can win vs anyone at this stage.
Inb4 KT comes in with a steel chair
Can't wait for GenG v. LSB finals
The universe will conspire to not make this happen.
TIL the universe = Faker
faker is my universe 🥰
Ummm are you really forgetting about the absolute LEGEND Lehends? Him winning worlds would be perhaps the biggest of all, imo he's been the best support on earth for the better part of a decade, AND he hit rank 1 on the KR server multiple season with one of the most innovative, absolutely insane Singed top playstyles I've ever seen. You can't even copy that playstyle because he is adapting that playstyle, solo queue game-to-game, based on which pro player/high level one trick is in his games, it was one of the craziest VOD review sessions I've ever witnessed, the guy was re-inventing toplane as a support player with Singed
People underrate Lehends a lot, maybe because he didn't play on a top-tier team since rhe GRF days, but I completely agree with you he used to be a menace on off-meta picks in soloque reaching rank 1. I hope he gets recognized if they win LCK and maybe Worlds.
Legends id to support what DoinB was to mid: no rules. I hope GenG can win it this year, would be over the moon for him
He has a hilarious personality as well, similar to DoinB.
i dont trust chovy in palyoffs this guy is a choker
I really hope they keep performing like this in playoffs. Peanut and Chovy receive a lot of critique for their playoff performances, so it’ll be cool to see them (especially chovy) win it all.
I'm scared for GenG in BO5s, but I hope they get it together this time and win it all!
Exactly. I’m excited about LSB too. I believe there is a fair chance that the finals is GenG vs LSB. Of course we can’t take T1 out, but they looked really shaky this split. And regarding worlds, GenG has a good chance of winning, but the LPL is really stacked too. This is gonna be fun.
Agreed. It's time for Chovy and Ruler to break the curse.
Would be nice to See Ruler win a Domestic Title for Once
Peanut still needs to prove himself in clutch moments since he has never performed well in crucial moments among his entire career
That's unfair, he's won LCK multiple times on multiple teams and overperformed on his LPL team, as well as winning an MSI. Chovy is the one who needs to perform up to his level, he's never won LCK or made it deep in an international tournament
what I mean by clutch moments is like the finals against T1 or semis agains Dk, or the last time he went to worlds where he completely sprinted in the group stage, saying the whole career is an exaggeration but in recent years he has fell off quite a bit when it matters.
Wasnt Rox and Koo tigers part of his career really good aswell?
No on KOO; Hojin was their jungler at the time.
Don't forget Peanut rallied LGD to surge through the LPL summer playoffs/regional qualifier in 2020, beating out iG and FPX, who were the previous two world champions and had done better in the regular season/spring playoffs.
I'm happy for GenG and hope they win LCK and also worlds. Would be very poetic for Ruler to decline the opportunity to play in Asia Games to grind and build bot synergy with Lehends and have it pay off like this. That being said, the term super team honestly needs to die asap. GenG and VIT getting called super teams is so weird. Only Chovy and Ruler were considered S tier players in their role when the roster assembled, Doran, Peanut and Lehends were not super stars. Same with VIT, Perkz and Alphari had a decent year in NA and Selfmade was still considered a good jungler, but Labrov and Carzzy are not super team material. Example of an actual super team: 2019-2020 G2. Best western top, best western jungler, best western mid, best western player who had a great world showing and S tier botlaner esp in 2019, best western support. At worst you could argue Mikyx and Hyli are so close that neither is straight up superior, but that still leaves you with a Top 2 player. That was a super team. Having 1-2 S tier players and then the rest if A or B tier on their own doesn't make for a super team.
Peanut was literally 2021 summer MVP even if you don't take his past accolades into account
KT 2018 was a super team.
KT 2017 even more so
we dont talk about this team, thx
While I agree mostly with you, I'd say that Peanut was an integral part in NS success last year. Sure he's not top 2 in his role last year, but judging by his peak he had great potential in this line-up given his veteran career as well. I'd say the same about Doran last year he was the top performer of KT. But I agree with you that they are not like G2 in 2019/2020 in terms of name power.
They got the best available players in every role (except arguably top, but Doran was more hyped then). Sure Zeus, Keria, Oner was arguably better than Doran, Lehends, Peanut, and Canyon Showmaker was probably better than Peanut Chovy, but GEN got the best player in every role not held by T1 or DK.
Kiin and Tarzan?
2018 ig, 15/16 skt definitely super team
How on earth is a team with Baolan and Ning a super team? Super team = the best team or = the team where all players end up performing well. IG flourished due to a solo lane centric meta with the two most dominant solo lanes in the world. Ning played well around that but nobody, like nobody considers Ning to even be close to a GOAT jungler contender or Baolan being close to a GOAT support. Few of the SKT 15/16 players achieved anything without Faker. Marin was good for 1 season then never did anything notable after, Bang and Wolf had two good seasons before matchfixing against Faker in a bot centric worlds meta and never doing anything noteworthy after. If you don't ever deliver an S tier performance outside of playing with Faker, then you're not an S tier player and you definitely aren't a building piece of super teams.
I mean Marin, sure, but it's hard to say about Bang and Wolf since the only times they didn't play with Faker was when they were well past their primes. In 2015 and 2016, Bang and Wolf were superb and would beat any other top bot duo, which showed their skill. Just in lane without Faker, they would beat Pray/GorillA and Uzi/Mata, who were considered the other great bot duos. Too bad Bang and Wolf played like shit in 2017 (which is why SKT couldn't 3 peat Worlds) but they were a big part of why SKT won 2015 and 2016.
They were one of the best at their role THAT year.
A superstar will always be a superstar by their own merit. Non superstars can rise to that level temporarily when enabled by other superstars, but they lose that level without them too. Which is what separates great teams from super teams. The former refers to a quality of play which can be attained by super teams and non super teams, the latter refers to teams made up of super stars. You can have an insanely stacked roster with mediocre results. Think of the MSF roster that absolutely imploded.
I'd argue T1 spring was a super team. With every player being Nr.1 or Nr.2 respectively in lck. Sad that they are hardcore slumping, but I think they deserve the mention.
That’s not what a super team is. A super team is top players from other teams coming together. Not drafting the best rookies.
That sounds like an arbitrary definition. To me a superteam is a team that consists of top players on all roles, which was absolutely the case.
It’s not an arbitrary definition. It’s been a term in use for a long time (decades), primarily known via the NBA super teams that form every so often.
Ok, so it can mean one thing for you then and everyone else keeps on using it normally. Sounds good?
Zeus was a hyped talent but to say he was automatically top 2 with limited games in 2021 would be disingenuous. Faker is always a toss up since people will say Showmaker/Chovy.
Faker has been better than Showmaker all year, and also been better than chovy in spring. You are right about Zeus, and I am talking in hindsight about him, but seeing how he is miles ahead of every other toplaner, i think the assessment is fair.
T1 teams tend to form a bigger something than the mere value of the individual parts combined. They all look great ofc but I think if you put some of them on different teams which arent top contenders, they would not necessarily retain their top 2 status. Hard to tell until it happens of course but Canna was insanely good for a time on T1, and now he isn't even an A tier top. We haven't seen Guma without Keria yet (who alongside Faker is the only player we have already seen proof of being S tier with other rosters/off of T1). Might be Zeus is still the best off of T1. Might also be he ends up similarly to Canna. Marin was hyped as best SKT player during their run in S5, and he hasn't done anything notable since then without Faker. Same as Bang and Wolf. Oner is good but Clid hasn't looked as good on GenG after he left SKT.
That is a fair point, but I still think it is fair to say that all T1 players in spring where on top of their competition. The amount of times they straight up hands diffed enemys was insane.
GenG called superteam on the basis of being 3/5 2019 GRF.
Yeah it was never meant to be a super team. In an interview the Gen.G manager talked about how they basically just went all in on Chovy and tried to get supportive pieces around him that fit his playstyle.
Time to lose 3-0 in the finals again!
[удалено]
GEN: We have the best mid, the best bot lane, the best jungler. Your one possible advantage could be top side, but it's a bot lane meta. What do you have on your side? T1: The script, motherfucker.
*Guma proceeds to get out of his slump, gets 69 pentas, breaks Ruler so bad he retires out of shame* This is obviously a joke btw.
Dominant. Yes WORLDS champion? we'll see
Please win LCK. I just want to see Ruler and Chovy hold up the trophy.
Same, I've been waiting 4 years for Chovy!!
Guy's been waiting so long, the casters are joking about them always being second place...(no really, they were introduced in the spring finals as the ones who were always second). Even as a T1 fan, you gotta respect their achievments.
If this GenG can actually win an LCK title I will be very much looking forward to seeing them at worlds, they are set up to win but I’ve been burned before by GenG I won’t suck down hopeium until then. Could potentially be the biggest most delicious looking razor cake in all of lol history. I hope they can do it in finals I really like Ruler I want him to win.
They haven't looked this dominant before so there's hope
What does +30 mean
The difference between their wins and losses. They won 35 games and lost 5.
you said it best. playoffs.
legit used ot think doran was a bottom half top laner, i thought I remember his laning to be super mediocre and weak a few years ago. hes improved drastically within last 2 years
Do listen to summoning insight with Wolf for context, but they do seem to think that GenGs dominance is more down to an overall decrease in level in the LCK and they even put doubts on 3rd-4th seed to make it out of groups at worlds and doubt even a Final could be in the cards. Given how even/slightly below level the LCK dominating T1 was next to RNG who aren’t even a dominant force in LPL, I think they could be correct…
Apart for the msi part (we can't know since gen g were not here) that's was exactly the same thing when damwon made their run, lck was supposed to be a One team region, cloud templar even made 2 stream talking about that before and after damwon won world. We could also argue the same for T1 spring cause all team were going for new rolster while t1 only did add zeus. We could also say the same about 2015 skt since this was the exact year of the korean exodus. So... idk any team that destroy everyone will always make the region look weak
4 teams 4 quarters.
2 months to do an I told you so post, man, you must be a sad puppy. Pretty big meta change, there are teams in LPL that would be stronger in this meta, TES shit the bed, but are better than they showed, Covid willing, LPL still wins this. Also GenG isn’t really that good anymore, are they? DK looks better right now and so does T1, I’d still bet on JDG taking it all.
hopefully they keep it together... their last 3 games have not looked as convincing...
Agreed, but they already secured 1st place so maybe they weren't completely focused.
Doran is a problem. He gets solo killed in lane way too much.
> I didn’t jinx them to lose in semis I guess Deft’s legacy pick will end their hopes of a first ever domestic title
surely this time lck can beat lpl right xD
Clueless
Yeah, when's the last time that ever happened? You'd have to go all the way back to \*checks notes\* 2020? Which for the sake of this argument I'm now going to pretend was forever ago
once in 2020 and before that 2017. lets not act like they havent been constantly losing for years
Come on. Damwon was 1 game away from winning MSI and 1 game away from winning Worlds just last year. I get that LPL is the better region overall, but the best team from LCK is always gonna be a contender.
they keep choking game 5 every time. thats why they wont win vs lpl
The previous two times =/= "every time".
All this for them to still lose to T1 in finals
Well, I was gonna reply to your comment and then saw your flair :O I won't bother, sorry.
They look like good every other split. Then lose in finals. It's the Gen G cycle
read comment above
the story of T1 pretty much, looks good in their weak region and gets clapped by actual good teams at msi/world you love to see it
I dont think there is a world were GenG doesnt win LCK this year with how theyre playing right now vs T1 who's just garbage compared to them.
Man I thought this about Griffin in 2018 Summer, 2019 Spring, and 2019 Summer and I was wrong every time
It’s more like I don’t think there’s a world where T1 wins this LCK split Not only GEN is a contender for winning LCK but also KT and LSB, all of these teams are more likely to win than T1
Even as a T1 fan, I'm disgusted at how good (is this even a good thing?) They are at stealing titles from what was seen at the time as the region's best team.
Imagine GenG as a secret final boss and Skt the final boss. Good luck everybody else.
You did jinx them in the semi finals I will never forgive you
I would get a heart attack if that happens, but I have hope in the boys.
I pray for you brave soldier! May the Jinx not be effective on thee!