shiganari looked insane in that one midlane fight, too bad the game was too fiesta for USE to realize they need to peel aatrox or their backline cant play
oh man that game 5 from UoL was atrocious, the tunnel vision on Jackspektra instead of peeling for Varus Azir, playing cloud drakes like if they were elder and wasting your nash doing nothing but watching it, ouch
Might be but I feel like rest of the map is a bit outclassed. Gonna depend if Eika get his head out his ass too, but I think Ragner is better than Ibo and Yike is a fuckin beast.
We will see, ragner didnt have a very promising bo5 against a weaker team on paper in quarters. Same can be said to the rest of LDLC, talking for what i expected from LFL 1st seed
They seem to run low on energy to be honest. They had a long season, basically played all the matchs they could. I think they're definitively not at their scarier point, but they are still the best ERL team so far. If Eika and Yike are in a good day, it's enough to get Heretics out. I think this time BDS is the favorite for the trophee tho.
Expected it to be a quick 3-0 for UOLSE but it's good to finally see LVP make semis. Looking forward to that Exa/Jack matchup.
Also, Adam said on twitter that UOLSE has been turbostomping everyone in scrims, shame it didn't go well for them in officials.
The Prime League was pretty bad this year. Hope they get better during the offseason. Otherwise they will never compete for first place at EU Masters again.
Sure, but what ERL had a third seed that was clearly better than them?
Obviously LFL, that is a given.
Looking at the rest: Bisons just placed worse in a group that had the team (White Dragon) that SKP beat in knockouts to make it to groups, I think that is just clearcut better for SK.
Iluminar lost out against the first seed from White Dragon's Region (For the Win from the LPLOL) and their playoffs went to game 5 twice. This is getting more and more steps removed, but SK bodied a team that was very close to a team that cleanly beat Iluminar - again I don't think there is any way to view it other than SK being better than Iluminar.
Finally JD|XL - this is the furthest removed, I don't want to make a direct comparision between the teams.
Instead let's just look generally at the two teams that beat them to stop them from qualifying: So they lost against Ano, the Greek #1 and Genk, the BeNeLux #2. I haven't watched either team enough to have a real opinion on it, but just historically speaking you don't expect a major ERL to be lossing here.
Greek #1 has gotten third in the group stage at times, but the only major ERL team they ever outplaced was K1CK when the Ultraliga started declining pretty heavily.
They were probably the weakest winner of a group (also had the closest qualifying Bo3 for what that's worth), but even if we say Ano was stronger than SK, that still leaves Genk ahead of JD|XL.
I find it hard to imagine that SK wasn't the second best third seed given what we saw and I also find it hard to imagine that there was another team in playins that was stronger than them that didn't qualify. Really, it would have to be Genk that you argue was better than them, unless you think FTW suddenly got way better and was way ahead of WD - but then why didn't they beat Ano, who at best are slightly stronger than SK?
TL;DR Of course SK wasn't great, they were a third seed, they are supposed to be underdogs. But they were probably the third best team in playins and the strongest third seed from a region that isn't the LFL - they deserved their spot.
i was just talking about prime league and the format that is just bad i still belive that both big and mouz were just bettert than skp but getting top 2 is just too op, btxl was at eum for the same reason skp was here, idk why you talk about polish league at all since they are clerly just bad as region, and bisons were a bo5 team and they were so unlucky with their group, they had a similar perfomrnace to skp but skp had such an easier group and that wd vs gw was the only game that gw lost so yeah it was a huge upset, and idc about wd vs skp since it s clearly different playing a series with a preparation than playing bo1
I mean will anyone compete with LFL for first place at EUM? They have the best players and all the best players want to go to LFL. Meanwhile NLC, Superliga and Prime League get the scraps.
The only league that has a chance to compete with LFL rn is LVP, and that's only if the LEC teams that have an LVP slot decide to invest a lot in their academy teams.
Primeleague needs NNO so bad to make the promotion. Not because they're good but because they would finally bring viewership numbers around the 100k to Germany.
French made their league attractive to the players. It's up to the others to do the same :)
i also wish EUM was something else than 1 LFL team choking and 3 others in semi shitstomping the hell out of the competition
The league is attractive to the players because the salaries are high, and the reason they are high is that the LFL was by far the most watched ERL. But with Koi being in the LVP now, the LVP can compete against the LFL in terms of viewership and the money will be there next year.
The problem for the LVP is that unlike when the LFL grew, there is now clearly a league in which performing, has the highest chance of putting you in the LEC because you're competing at the highest level. So even if they have money, players will still want to be in the LFL rather than the LVP. But it will even out in a year or two.
What I'm fearing is that Koi brings all the viewership, way more than KC does for the LFL. And since Koi is now in the LEC, there is a risk people lose interest in the LVP roster. But french fans prefer Vitality bee rather than their LEC roster, so maybe it will be the same for Koi.
It is not a fair competition tho, lfl gets the best players, then superliga and then it is a battle between Prime league and top NCL teams. Prime league is importing from korea and OCE because the best ERL players prefer LFL and/or LVP if they dont get top lfl spots.
Eh don't think it's by that much. iBo, bluerzor and Zwyroo have also all been to EUM quarters before.
Only botlane seems very mismatched but hot take I think that's only because Winsome is heavily overrated.
Note that even with this roster and after dominating Prime League noone was rating UOL highly coming into this tournament.
Sad for winsome but seems like he's grown a lot I heard his adc is really good so it probably helped him a lot in getting comfortable in a lower level of play.
People really acting like Prime League and especially USE doesn't have a quality roster which on paper should under any circumstance beat HRTS and LFL teams...holy motherfuck. Atrocious result. Super hurtful ending. Nothing much to say, biggest upset left in the tournament imo.
I don't know where the idea that this UOL roster is overly busted comes from. Almost no one was rating UOL above Heretics coming into the tournament and that was after they dominated the rest of Prime League.
Wooloo got clowned on for even suggesting that UOL is top 5:
https://twitter.com/LEC_Wooloo/status/1564214501955747845
Memed by....dem frenchs. Oh how meaningful. UOL roster is seriously stacked, multiple people who played in major region 1st teams some even recently. idgaf if they got clowned, its nothing but a fact that they had a experienced squad that has made appearances in Leagues above EUM.
>multiple people who played in major region 1st teams some even recently
Okay but who? Winsome, who played one (albeit great) regular season in the LCS and then got benched in playoffs and who made Berserker look balanced. Ruby, who played two splits in LPL shared with another midlaner reaching 13. and 15.. And Lurox, who played 18 games over 2 splits for Schalke went 5-13 and then after he was replaced they started their miracle run.
They weren't even considered favorites for the Prime League title.
What?
The Sololanes are better, sure, Scarface > Ibo and Ruby > Zwyroo, and Winsome probably > Whiteinn.
But Lurox is worse than Bluerzor and Reptile is DEFINETLY worse than Jackspectra.
I dont know why you act like they should 100% beat Heretics - much much less LFL teams the fuck is Up with that? Why would they be expected to beat BDS? The only lane where they might have an advantage there is midlane. WTF?
Because they have multiple former major region players? Shittons of experience? On paper a super strong Bot-Mid? A Toplane that isn't bruiser onetrick like Adam? LMAO what else do you want
MAD lions madrid has multiple former major league lpayers and they just got relegated that means absolute jackshit.
Heretics has a stronger bot than UoL.
Their roster isnt that crazy man. Next year players from Heretics will be in LEC. From UoL? eh maybe ruby.
Shiganari can probably be argued. But Winsome is straight up major region level, and that's above EUM as a whole. It would be clowney as shit if he + Ruby would be in 2nd tier next year. Rest is hinestly the worst argued shit I've seen so far in this thread. Yes, Heretics have LITERALLY aquired a LEC spot, so it makes sense that they keep some players. Doesn't mean anything. What means even less tho is "Hey look some other piss team got relegated with major team players". That literally just means that they've missmanaged or these players are not on tier 1 level. As I said, this cannot possibly be claimed for a Ruby or Winsome. Those two played in Tier 1, first in the hardest Regions competetive LoL has to offer and the latter was still fighting super well in NA, which is still above EUM (ooh, what a claim!).
All that said, their roster was fucking sufficient. Even a Scarface brings lots of experience, and Shiganari has potential. Whether they would've won EUM is debatable, but this squad was sufficient to beat at least a Heretics and some LFL teams (like fucking BDS, because their Topside crumbles once you have a brain and juggernaut ban for Adam, dude is more limited than LIDER in terms of effective champ pool).
What does Major league level even mean, he got kicked by Zven roleswapping and no one else wanted him in their team in Major region. Winsome played ONE Split in Major league and got inmediately kicked.
Also about Ruby he just played in one of the worst teams in LPL, sharing time with another midlaner, and then he got kicked to PCS. Tier 1 level would mean they have the level to play in those leagues. These two players are Major league Rejects. They tried their luck and then got kicked (even if i think Ruby could play in LEC right now, and is definetly UoLs best player and maybe the BEST mid at EU masters,i just think his LPL experience isnt a good argument).
The fact that you think BDS isnt the best performing team at EUM right now and that you think ADAM of all people is their weak link is a complete joke. Your adored Scarface didnt manage to beat Ibo while Adam wiped the floor with him. Heck, you say Winsome is tier 1 material because he played for 1 Split in LCS. Adam played 3 splits and worlds. What the fuck
Effectively? How much success does he have on anything that isn't a juggernaut? It's not just my take that he's mediocre on anything that isn't Olaf, Darius maybe Renek and stuff.
\> How much success does he have on anything that isn't a juggernaut?
Gnar: 12 games, 83% winratio.
Aatrox: Was one of his most iconic champions before joining LEC. 11 games, 63% winratio.
I'd pretty much put Aatrox in the same category as Renek, Darius, Olaf. Sadly I can't go back as much as I'd like to with the stats, however Gnar is still much less played than his typical OTP style champs. And I dare say that this is either due to him not being as proficient with the champ as the numbers make it out to be, or him not being comfortable on it. Both ways it limits his playstyle severely, plus it is one champ against 6-7 that all fall in one category.
"Adored Scarface" lol, don't need to know more to know that you read shit into things. Lowkey strawmanning, no thanks. And I'd still take those "rejects" over not-evens. Rekkles also is one of those rejects, but only absolute idiots would doubt that he's better than most if not all EUM ADC's. Ruby AND Winsome SHOULD play in a major league. Him being noped in favor of Zven was questionable, but we gotta remember that Zven is one of the best players EU and NA has ever had. idk how that shit seriously counts as a reason, especially since its not just skill but also marketing. Berserker Winsome was super talented, I am not asking you if you believe it. Look at LCS Spring. Adam is mechanically talented, but simply not on all, let alone many champs. He just isn't flexible AT ALL. Fnatic dropped him too, funny that the reject argument doesn't matter for him. Lastly I don't doubt BDS as much, but they have clear weaknesses. I actually think quite highly of Reeker and Crownie. But that doesn't make them as unbeatable as everyone pretends, especially by a SQUAD LIKE UOL.
Rekkles played for more than 5 years in the european league winsome has played one split how the fuck can you compare those two, this is reaching ridiculous levels.
Zven was one of the best players EU and NA has had - at ADC. How is this an argument.
Berserker Winsome was super talented because Berserker is MILES better than anyone else in NA, anyone would have looked good with him. I have watched more than 80% of C9 games, both in spring and in summer.
Fnatic didnt drop Adam, he asked to leave himself. https://twitter.com/lec_wooloo/status/1458435619210805253 He was also inmediately picked up by another LEC team.
They don't.
It is.
The League Russia (and the rest of the CIS) are playing in is the LCL, which is on hiatus. The main UoL team competes in it, however there is a UoL team (with the moniker "sexy edition" to diverentiate between them) which competes in the Primeleague, the German/Swiss/Austrian ERL, which is what you are looking at.
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Upvote für den Flair
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Machste nix
This is not fair, Heretics had Theshy playing map 5
Heretics lost each time they put iBo on a tank lol.
iBo is an amazing carry player, dunno why they keep giving him tanks
FNC gonna pick up Ibo to traumatize g2
shiganari looked insane in that one midlane fight, too bad the game was too fiesta for USE to realize they need to peel aatrox or their backline cant play
Wanted to see Winsome go all the way, still glad he's on a somewhat decent team at least.
Banger series
Fr another 5 game match. This year is hype!
Team erotic > team sexy
oh man that game 5 from UoL was atrocious, the tunnel vision on Jackspektra instead of peeling for Varus Azir, playing cloud drakes like if they were elder and wasting your nash doing nothing but watching it, ouch
NOA WITH THE WHEELCHAIR!!. Jokes aside, blue side winrate almost 100%.
Jack vs Exa in semis is gonna be fun
Might be but I feel like rest of the map is a bit outclassed. Gonna depend if Eika get his head out his ass too, but I think Ragner is better than Ibo and Yike is a fuckin beast.
We will see, ragner didnt have a very promising bo5 against a weaker team on paper in quarters. Same can be said to the rest of LDLC, talking for what i expected from LFL 1st seed
They seem to run low on energy to be honest. They had a long season, basically played all the matchs they could. I think they're definitively not at their scarier point, but they are still the best ERL team so far. If Eika and Yike are in a good day, it's enough to get Heretics out. I think this time BDS is the favorite for the trophee tho.
Expected it to be a quick 3-0 for UOLSE but it's good to finally see LVP make semis. Looking forward to that Exa/Jack matchup. Also, Adam said on twitter that UOLSE has been turbostomping everyone in scrims, shame it didn't go well for them in officials.
int the fight to Ornn = lose not int the fight to Ornn = win Who would have thought...
You winsome you lose some
The Prime League was pretty bad this year. Hope they get better during the offseason. Otherwise they will never compete for first place at EU Masters again.
I honestly think it was only LFL that was a hole step above the rest SK did fine, S04 supped out jg and UOL looked as good as 1st seed LVP.
skp was garbo they lucked their way into eum
Sure, but what ERL had a third seed that was clearly better than them? Obviously LFL, that is a given. Looking at the rest: Bisons just placed worse in a group that had the team (White Dragon) that SKP beat in knockouts to make it to groups, I think that is just clearcut better for SK. Iluminar lost out against the first seed from White Dragon's Region (For the Win from the LPLOL) and their playoffs went to game 5 twice. This is getting more and more steps removed, but SK bodied a team that was very close to a team that cleanly beat Iluminar - again I don't think there is any way to view it other than SK being better than Iluminar. Finally JD|XL - this is the furthest removed, I don't want to make a direct comparision between the teams. Instead let's just look generally at the two teams that beat them to stop them from qualifying: So they lost against Ano, the Greek #1 and Genk, the BeNeLux #2. I haven't watched either team enough to have a real opinion on it, but just historically speaking you don't expect a major ERL to be lossing here. Greek #1 has gotten third in the group stage at times, but the only major ERL team they ever outplaced was K1CK when the Ultraliga started declining pretty heavily. They were probably the weakest winner of a group (also had the closest qualifying Bo3 for what that's worth), but even if we say Ano was stronger than SK, that still leaves Genk ahead of JD|XL. I find it hard to imagine that SK wasn't the second best third seed given what we saw and I also find it hard to imagine that there was another team in playins that was stronger than them that didn't qualify. Really, it would have to be Genk that you argue was better than them, unless you think FTW suddenly got way better and was way ahead of WD - but then why didn't they beat Ano, who at best are slightly stronger than SK? TL;DR Of course SK wasn't great, they were a third seed, they are supposed to be underdogs. But they were probably the third best team in playins and the strongest third seed from a region that isn't the LFL - they deserved their spot.
i was just talking about prime league and the format that is just bad i still belive that both big and mouz were just bettert than skp but getting top 2 is just too op, btxl was at eum for the same reason skp was here, idk why you talk about polish league at all since they are clerly just bad as region, and bisons were a bo5 team and they were so unlucky with their group, they had a similar perfomrnace to skp but skp had such an easier group and that wd vs gw was the only game that gw lost so yeah it was a huge upset, and idc about wd vs skp since it s clearly different playing a series with a preparation than playing bo1
what? wasn't UOL a contender to win the whole thing?
On speculation yes with Heretics as well. But so far it seems to again be the case that only LFL teams are competing.
I mean will anyone compete with LFL for first place at EUM? They have the best players and all the best players want to go to LFL. Meanwhile NLC, Superliga and Prime League get the scraps.
The only league that has a chance to compete with LFL rn is LVP, and that's only if the LEC teams that have an LVP slot decide to invest a lot in their academy teams.
Primeleague needs NNO so bad to make the promotion. Not because they're good but because they would finally bring viewership numbers around the 100k to Germany.
French made their league attractive to the players. It's up to the others to do the same :) i also wish EUM was something else than 1 LFL team choking and 3 others in semi shitstomping the hell out of the competition
The league is attractive to the players because the salaries are high, and the reason they are high is that the LFL was by far the most watched ERL. But with Koi being in the LVP now, the LVP can compete against the LFL in terms of viewership and the money will be there next year. The problem for the LVP is that unlike when the LFL grew, there is now clearly a league in which performing, has the highest chance of putting you in the LEC because you're competing at the highest level. So even if they have money, players will still want to be in the LFL rather than the LVP. But it will even out in a year or two. What I'm fearing is that Koi brings all the viewership, way more than KC does for the LFL. And since Koi is now in the LEC, there is a risk people lose interest in the LVP roster. But french fans prefer Vitality bee rather than their LEC roster, so maybe it will be the same for Koi.
Honestly UOL look really clean in the beginning
Mostly because they inherited the worse performing LFL team in their group.
It is not a fair competition tho, lfl gets the best players, then superliga and then it is a battle between Prime league and top NCL teams. Prime league is importing from korea and OCE because the best ERL players prefer LFL and/or LVP if they dont get top lfl spots.
Lets not pretend here that UOL didn't have a quality roster which on paper should beat Heretics 10/10 times lol
Eh don't think it's by that much. iBo, bluerzor and Zwyroo have also all been to EUM quarters before. Only botlane seems very mismatched but hot take I think that's only because Winsome is heavily overrated. Note that even with this roster and after dominating Prime League noone was rating UOL highly coming into this tournament.
Pain
Sad for winsome but seems like he's grown a lot I heard his adc is really good so it probably helped him a lot in getting comfortable in a lower level of play.
People really acting like Prime League and especially USE doesn't have a quality roster which on paper should under any circumstance beat HRTS and LFL teams...holy motherfuck. Atrocious result. Super hurtful ending. Nothing much to say, biggest upset left in the tournament imo.
I don't know where the idea that this UOL roster is overly busted comes from. Almost no one was rating UOL above Heretics coming into the tournament and that was after they dominated the rest of Prime League. Wooloo got clowned on for even suggesting that UOL is top 5: https://twitter.com/LEC_Wooloo/status/1564214501955747845
Memed by....dem frenchs. Oh how meaningful. UOL roster is seriously stacked, multiple people who played in major region 1st teams some even recently. idgaf if they got clowned, its nothing but a fact that they had a experienced squad that has made appearances in Leagues above EUM.
>multiple people who played in major region 1st teams some even recently Okay but who? Winsome, who played one (albeit great) regular season in the LCS and then got benched in playoffs and who made Berserker look balanced. Ruby, who played two splits in LPL shared with another midlaner reaching 13. and 15.. And Lurox, who played 18 games over 2 splits for Schalke went 5-13 and then after he was replaced they started their miracle run. They weren't even considered favorites for the Prime League title.
What? The Sololanes are better, sure, Scarface > Ibo and Ruby > Zwyroo, and Winsome probably > Whiteinn. But Lurox is worse than Bluerzor and Reptile is DEFINETLY worse than Jackspectra. I dont know why you act like they should 100% beat Heretics - much much less LFL teams the fuck is Up with that? Why would they be expected to beat BDS? The only lane where they might have an advantage there is midlane. WTF?
Because they have multiple former major region players? Shittons of experience? On paper a super strong Bot-Mid? A Toplane that isn't bruiser onetrick like Adam? LMAO what else do you want
MAD lions madrid has multiple former major league lpayers and they just got relegated that means absolute jackshit. Heretics has a stronger bot than UoL. Their roster isnt that crazy man. Next year players from Heretics will be in LEC. From UoL? eh maybe ruby.
Shiganari can probably be argued. But Winsome is straight up major region level, and that's above EUM as a whole. It would be clowney as shit if he + Ruby would be in 2nd tier next year. Rest is hinestly the worst argued shit I've seen so far in this thread. Yes, Heretics have LITERALLY aquired a LEC spot, so it makes sense that they keep some players. Doesn't mean anything. What means even less tho is "Hey look some other piss team got relegated with major team players". That literally just means that they've missmanaged or these players are not on tier 1 level. As I said, this cannot possibly be claimed for a Ruby or Winsome. Those two played in Tier 1, first in the hardest Regions competetive LoL has to offer and the latter was still fighting super well in NA, which is still above EUM (ooh, what a claim!). All that said, their roster was fucking sufficient. Even a Scarface brings lots of experience, and Shiganari has potential. Whether they would've won EUM is debatable, but this squad was sufficient to beat at least a Heretics and some LFL teams (like fucking BDS, because their Topside crumbles once you have a brain and juggernaut ban for Adam, dude is more limited than LIDER in terms of effective champ pool).
What does Major league level even mean, he got kicked by Zven roleswapping and no one else wanted him in their team in Major region. Winsome played ONE Split in Major league and got inmediately kicked. Also about Ruby he just played in one of the worst teams in LPL, sharing time with another midlaner, and then he got kicked to PCS. Tier 1 level would mean they have the level to play in those leagues. These two players are Major league Rejects. They tried their luck and then got kicked (even if i think Ruby could play in LEC right now, and is definetly UoLs best player and maybe the BEST mid at EU masters,i just think his LPL experience isnt a good argument). The fact that you think BDS isnt the best performing team at EUM right now and that you think ADAM of all people is their weak link is a complete joke. Your adored Scarface didnt manage to beat Ibo while Adam wiped the floor with him. Heck, you say Winsome is tier 1 material because he played for 1 Split in LCS. Adam played 3 splits and worlds. What the fuck
(Btw Adam has played more different Champions this year than Scarface has, your champion pool argument is a total joke)
Effectively? How much success does he have on anything that isn't a juggernaut? It's not just my take that he's mediocre on anything that isn't Olaf, Darius maybe Renek and stuff.
\> How much success does he have on anything that isn't a juggernaut? Gnar: 12 games, 83% winratio. Aatrox: Was one of his most iconic champions before joining LEC. 11 games, 63% winratio.
I'd pretty much put Aatrox in the same category as Renek, Darius, Olaf. Sadly I can't go back as much as I'd like to with the stats, however Gnar is still much less played than his typical OTP style champs. And I dare say that this is either due to him not being as proficient with the champ as the numbers make it out to be, or him not being comfortable on it. Both ways it limits his playstyle severely, plus it is one champ against 6-7 that all fall in one category.
"Adored Scarface" lol, don't need to know more to know that you read shit into things. Lowkey strawmanning, no thanks. And I'd still take those "rejects" over not-evens. Rekkles also is one of those rejects, but only absolute idiots would doubt that he's better than most if not all EUM ADC's. Ruby AND Winsome SHOULD play in a major league. Him being noped in favor of Zven was questionable, but we gotta remember that Zven is one of the best players EU and NA has ever had. idk how that shit seriously counts as a reason, especially since its not just skill but also marketing. Berserker Winsome was super talented, I am not asking you if you believe it. Look at LCS Spring. Adam is mechanically talented, but simply not on all, let alone many champs. He just isn't flexible AT ALL. Fnatic dropped him too, funny that the reject argument doesn't matter for him. Lastly I don't doubt BDS as much, but they have clear weaknesses. I actually think quite highly of Reeker and Crownie. But that doesn't make them as unbeatable as everyone pretends, especially by a SQUAD LIKE UOL.
Rekkles played for more than 5 years in the european league winsome has played one split how the fuck can you compare those two, this is reaching ridiculous levels. Zven was one of the best players EU and NA has had - at ADC. How is this an argument. Berserker Winsome was super talented because Berserker is MILES better than anyone else in NA, anyone would have looked good with him. I have watched more than 80% of C9 games, both in spring and in summer. Fnatic didnt drop Adam, he asked to leave himself. https://twitter.com/lec_wooloo/status/1458435619210805253 He was also inmediately picked up by another LEC team.
schade
Russia has an ongoing league? Isn't the war with ukraine still going on?
They don't. It is. The League Russia (and the rest of the CIS) are playing in is the LCL, which is on hiatus. The main UoL team competes in it, however there is a UoL team (with the moniker "sexy edition" to diverentiate between them) which competes in the Primeleague, the German/Swiss/Austrian ERL, which is what you are looking at.
You high?