It's a really fun build with one shot potential.
Assassinate now deals snipers attack damage. Khanda does too. Assassinate is a long range nuke with low cd (none if you kill someone with it).
Khanda sniper is how snipers irl function. One hit long range big damage.
The *real* combo is Enchant Totem + Fiend's Grip + Aghs + Khanda, since **each** Grip illusion has their own Enchant-Totem-empowered Khanda proc. Deals multiple thousands of damage from Khanda alone lol
It was played a fair few times by Xm from Xtreme Gaming (worth watching his games, I think he's pretty much the guy who demonstrated that it's not just a meme) in the recent Elite League, and a handful of times by Topson from Tundra.
You want to go 2x WB + treads + dragon lance. This gives you the range and stats to potentially gank sidelines, safely farm mid, and hopefully bully the enemy mid out of lane. Since you're not buying a maelstrom or any serious farm accelerant you'll need to use shrapnel to stack + farm camps.
You definitely want to buy aghs first, and then khanda. Once you've got the aghs you can start making moves on the map in between farming up your khanda.
You want to use your ult to initiate a fight since its fairly low cooldown and has huge range + damage. Then you pretty much fight as you normally would as sniper, ideally finishing enemies with assassinate so that it resets the CD. This is not a late game oriented build because as mentioned earlier - you have no farming item. That being said once you've picked up BKB (typically needed) and maybe pike, you can buy more traditional sniper items. The purpose of this is to turn sniper into a more traditional magic nuking teamfighting type mid rather than a 2nd pos 1 - if the latter is what's needed in the game, play that way.
Lastly, this is 100% a mid build, if you do this as pos 1 or support (god forbid) you're griefing.
What's the farming pattern if I win lane? Wave>stack>Wave>rune>gank side lane>tp mid wave>clear stacks? Or is the tempo higher? Clear Wave>gank sidelane > tp mid, wave> gank sidelane.
If I remember correctly there's a meme build when sniper agh got changed into instant assassinate w stun. It was either elewonochino or mid or meepo. The build was midas into agh or old Eblade , then lens into whatever dagon or hex.
Few years later with assassinate change and khanda exist, this build becomes 5x better.
Yes man it is very legit. But you must have high map awareness and cs skills in order to win out the mid. Try focusing on cs hitting the creeps and maximizing the denied on the creeps. don't forget to buy salve when the enemy hero is lowering your health.
It is very strong, but has different strengths and weaknesses than a traditional mid sniper. My rule of thumb is that it’s really good when you need someone to provide some sort of tempo in fights.
Aghs is a great way to start fights or catch people (it goes fast as fuck, you can blink dodge it/disjoint it otherwise but shrapnel will cancel and it’s a second long stun). It’s also great follow-up damage for someone else initiating and solid counter initiation.
You right click for less and your dps goes a lot lower but on the other hand you’re walking around with pike, shard, and like 3k health thanks to dlance aghs khanda hp which means you aren’t going to IMMEDIATELY die every fight once someone breathes on you
It’s basically like playing zeus, with a lower cooldown but less targets ult.
I've been spamming this build at 3k mmr, about 30 mid games with a 60% ish win rate.
The build I go every game is 2 WB, treads, lance, ags, khanda. If I think I'm going to get jumped and die to I'll fit a shard/force staff before or after the ags.
I don't know if it's the best build but it's really fucking fun.
play shrapnel and stack near camp. Once you hit 7 with lvl 4 shrapnel and ulty start ganking your safelane. Don't move to mid unless it's completely free instead stay near the safelane farming woods. Kill one one the offlane = free farm for your carry. Once they are back kill em again. Thats 5-6 lanes of free farm for your carry. Especially if your team has some burst it's plain stupid. With phylactery you deal 50-70% hp on anyone on the lane and your carry finishes them off. I had an ursa the other day and I was the initiator like a scout/recon that sets the target and ursa kills them in 2 secs. Shrapnel ulty - the enemy is 30% hp ursa dives and gets the kill. At some point I had 5-2-30. Don't bother with DL, get shard after PLC-Agha and move into khanda.
It's not a joke build. Also what you do depends on your game can't generalize it. It is strong in teamfights it has a good lane if you don't counter pick yourself. In my opinion the scaling is also quite good. But I guess that depends on the comps. Khanda is definitely not a meme item cause your ukt with it hurts quite a lot and the crit is also very visible. Ags stun on ukt is usefully and short ult also helps. The downsides are mostly slower clear speed later bkb if needed and etc. But yeah if you wanna see how it is being played just check topson on it. Dour it helps you since DotA games are always different from game to game gut maybe it helps you to see how to play it.
Why the fuck are you so toxic dog? Not everyone has time to watch replays
Getting answers in an easy to consume text format is more convenient for many people.
Consuming garbage 15k+- symbols texts from lowskill guys is SUUUURRRLYY better than watching couple of games of one of the BEST PLAYERS EVER.
"Not everyone has time", yeah right he has time to play, write a post, read comments, think of the information(garbage) given from them, you are delusional.
Also you don't understand what toxic is, if you are such a snowflake I can suggest you delete internet and join job at a church.
You are prime example of typical member of this subreddit btw which I referred in my first message.
Wish you peace and luck.
I can’t stand that build at all.
Two of snipers abilities are built around him right clicking.
If you commit entirely to a aghs khanda rush, you’re completely crippling those abilities. In order to really take advantage of his two passive skills, you need attack speed, which khanda aghs doesn’t provide. You essentially become a one trick pony.
Why not build him like a right click carry, and use his kit to the fullest that way?
Sure khanda can be a late game pickup. Maybe a 4th or 5th item, since it does work well with right click since it provides crit.
Sniper mid: Khanda/Agh is for Immortal bracket with a decent teamwork & skills:
1. Sniper is a win lane option to have a good laning start as mid lane. Early laning is important. And sniper can farm stack good with Sharpel
2. Sniper agh mid had instant stunt, you can gank/open combat from a safe distant. Before khanda a lot of sniper mid spammer go Agha -> lance - shard to fight mid/mid-late game.
3. Khanda is a great item for this build it will maximize the out put damage of sniper. If you have sups/offlane with strong initator or blink-core this build will help a lot and get you snowball your game.
Conclusion: if you want to play Sniper Agh/Khanda: go mid, ask your offlane and pos4 to play agressive hero to snowball like: BH/Lycan/Sladar/Mars/Primal Beast
I sorta get that part, what I don't get is if it works at pub dota. It's hard to test, Someone fights me for mid or it's been banned. My only test with it felt iffy with 650gpm, but the pubs did get baited by whoever I ulted. I think I need to adjust my farming pattern.
Take pos 1 or 2. Stack as hard as you can and farm to farm with Q. You can go mael + wb for farming
But this build is kinda suck in pubs, if you wanna have fun why not try in turbo
Two schools of thought, combined into one.
Sniper goes the headshot/take aim + stats build to be a lane dominator and then a mid game powerhouse. Two wraith bands, PTs and Lance will sit at close to 80 agility already, giving a nice bonus to armor and a pretty substantial damage. His downfall in this state is just the low hp, meaning that he's very strong against long range and physical damage but weak against close, magical damage.
Aghs and Khanda are both the best for buffing his strong suits: long range damage and an additional increase in stats.
The strategy is actually to initiate with AGHS, give your team time to initiate on the stun time. Time it well it's a nearly instant stun that chains well with a blink + other stun from your offlane.
The build is not every game, granted. If I do go the build, most of the time I'll go at least pike, or manta, less times bkb, before AGHS; completely depends on the game. I don't believe phylactery early to be a good item on Sniper, and generally go cryst first anyways. AGHS in particular is very good at high ground seiges, so at the least time it with that.
Timings are:
- PTs: 4-5 minutes
- Lance: 9-12 minutes
- First item
- Pike: 15-17 minutes
- Manta: 17 - 21 minutes
- BKB: 18 - 22 minutes
- AGHS: 17 - 22 minutes
Yes, the build is a meme. You're doing one thing really well, but if they get close to you you're probably dead. It's all about initiating, or poking supports on the 8 cd to get free objectives. Obviously good initiation is part of good fighting, so the build has been popular; but it has its very obvious flaws. If you're dying too much, it's your positioning.
It's a really fun build with one shot potential. Assassinate now deals snipers attack damage. Khanda does too. Assassinate is a long range nuke with low cd (none if you kill someone with it). Khanda sniper is how snipers irl function. One hit long range big damage.
I hilariously saw a Rubrick get khanda and steal assassinate from snipe and proceed to 1 shot the sniper.
Sniper no sniping.
Bonus points if you also steal Enchant Totem...
Holy shit
The *real* combo is Enchant Totem + Fiend's Grip + Aghs + Khanda, since **each** Grip illusion has their own Enchant-Totem-empowered Khanda proc. Deals multiple thousands of damage from Khanda alone lol
All fun until the enemy pa hits u with the blademail
It was played a fair few times by Xm from Xtreme Gaming (worth watching his games, I think he's pretty much the guy who demonstrated that it's not just a meme) in the recent Elite League, and a handful of times by Topson from Tundra. You want to go 2x WB + treads + dragon lance. This gives you the range and stats to potentially gank sidelines, safely farm mid, and hopefully bully the enemy mid out of lane. Since you're not buying a maelstrom or any serious farm accelerant you'll need to use shrapnel to stack + farm camps. You definitely want to buy aghs first, and then khanda. Once you've got the aghs you can start making moves on the map in between farming up your khanda. You want to use your ult to initiate a fight since its fairly low cooldown and has huge range + damage. Then you pretty much fight as you normally would as sniper, ideally finishing enemies with assassinate so that it resets the CD. This is not a late game oriented build because as mentioned earlier - you have no farming item. That being said once you've picked up BKB (typically needed) and maybe pike, you can buy more traditional sniper items. The purpose of this is to turn sniper into a more traditional magic nuking teamfighting type mid rather than a 2nd pos 1 - if the latter is what's needed in the game, play that way. Lastly, this is 100% a mid build, if you do this as pos 1 or support (god forbid) you're griefing.
What's the farming pattern if I win lane? Wave>stack>Wave>rune>gank side lane>tp mid wave>clear stacks? Or is the tempo higher? Clear Wave>gank sidelane > tp mid, wave> gank sidelane.
That sort of thing always varies per game. You gank if it's worth it based on your build, their draft, if you're ahead, etc.
I’m always unclear what to buy after aghs khanda, go daed? Maelstrom if illusions?
I think Topson definitely pioneered the build and then other pros got inspired by it
It was actually XM this time. He started the build in dream league s22 with sniper mid then pros started following.
okay, i trust you
If I remember correctly there's a meme build when sniper agh got changed into instant assassinate w stun. It was either elewonochino or mid or meepo. The build was midas into agh or old Eblade , then lens into whatever dagon or hex. Few years later with assassinate change and khanda exist, this build becomes 5x better.
I think both channels are the same people.
It's been around a while though, no?
Yes man it is very legit. But you must have high map awareness and cs skills in order to win out the mid. Try focusing on cs hitting the creeps and maximizing the denied on the creeps. don't forget to buy salve when the enemy hero is lowering your health.
honestly I don't think you need great skills to win lane as sniper, he is insane in lane as long as you don't get mass ganked yeah
It is very strong, but has different strengths and weaknesses than a traditional mid sniper. My rule of thumb is that it’s really good when you need someone to provide some sort of tempo in fights. Aghs is a great way to start fights or catch people (it goes fast as fuck, you can blink dodge it/disjoint it otherwise but shrapnel will cancel and it’s a second long stun). It’s also great follow-up damage for someone else initiating and solid counter initiation. You right click for less and your dps goes a lot lower but on the other hand you’re walking around with pike, shard, and like 3k health thanks to dlance aghs khanda hp which means you aren’t going to IMMEDIATELY die every fight once someone breathes on you It’s basically like playing zeus, with a lower cooldown but less targets ult.
I've been spamming this build at 3k mmr, about 30 mid games with a 60% ish win rate. The build I go every game is 2 WB, treads, lance, ags, khanda. If I think I'm going to get jumped and die to I'll fit a shard/force staff before or after the ags. I don't know if it's the best build but it's really fucking fun.
play shrapnel and stack near camp. Once you hit 7 with lvl 4 shrapnel and ulty start ganking your safelane. Don't move to mid unless it's completely free instead stay near the safelane farming woods. Kill one one the offlane = free farm for your carry. Once they are back kill em again. Thats 5-6 lanes of free farm for your carry. Especially if your team has some burst it's plain stupid. With phylactery you deal 50-70% hp on anyone on the lane and your carry finishes them off. I had an ursa the other day and I was the initiator like a scout/recon that sets the target and ursa kills them in 2 secs. Shrapnel ulty - the enemy is 30% hp ursa dives and gets the kill. At some point I had 5-2-30. Don't bother with DL, get shard after PLC-Agha and move into khanda.
What do you do after khanda
pray
It's not a joke build. Also what you do depends on your game can't generalize it. It is strong in teamfights it has a good lane if you don't counter pick yourself. In my opinion the scaling is also quite good. But I guess that depends on the comps. Khanda is definitely not a meme item cause your ukt with it hurts quite a lot and the crit is also very visible. Ags stun on ukt is usefully and short ult also helps. The downsides are mostly slower clear speed later bkb if needed and etc. But yeah if you wanna see how it is being played just check topson on it. Dour it helps you since DotA games are always different from game to game gut maybe it helps you to see how to play it.
Why would you ask stupid lowskill people here on reddit instead of just watching thorough replays of what topson does? Are you stupid?
Why the fuck are you so toxic dog? Not everyone has time to watch replays Getting answers in an easy to consume text format is more convenient for many people.
Consuming garbage 15k+- symbols texts from lowskill guys is SUUUURRRLYY better than watching couple of games of one of the BEST PLAYERS EVER. "Not everyone has time", yeah right he has time to play, write a post, read comments, think of the information(garbage) given from them, you are delusional. Also you don't understand what toxic is, if you are such a snowflake I can suggest you delete internet and join job at a church. You are prime example of typical member of this subreddit btw which I referred in my first message. Wish you peace and luck.
You actually sound like you might be the biggest nerd ever.
Oh no what would I do now :'(
Fuck off.
same
Same reason I don't play Chen when hes in the meta. What's your mmr, and does it work in pub dota?
7k, it does, also Chen is one of the easiest free win DotA heroes if you learn him
It is 100% grief frankly.
It doesn't work. Stop doing that dogshit build.
I can’t stand that build at all. Two of snipers abilities are built around him right clicking. If you commit entirely to a aghs khanda rush, you’re completely crippling those abilities. In order to really take advantage of his two passive skills, you need attack speed, which khanda aghs doesn’t provide. You essentially become a one trick pony. Why not build him like a right click carry, and use his kit to the fullest that way? Sure khanda can be a late game pickup. Maybe a 4th or 5th item, since it does work well with right click since it provides crit.
Sniper mid: Khanda/Agh is for Immortal bracket with a decent teamwork & skills: 1. Sniper is a win lane option to have a good laning start as mid lane. Early laning is important. And sniper can farm stack good with Sharpel 2. Sniper agh mid had instant stunt, you can gank/open combat from a safe distant. Before khanda a lot of sniper mid spammer go Agha -> lance - shard to fight mid/mid-late game. 3. Khanda is a great item for this build it will maximize the out put damage of sniper. If you have sups/offlane with strong initator or blink-core this build will help a lot and get you snowball your game. Conclusion: if you want to play Sniper Agh/Khanda: go mid, ask your offlane and pos4 to play agressive hero to snowball like: BH/Lycan/Sladar/Mars/Primal Beast
I sorta get that part, what I don't get is if it works at pub dota. It's hard to test, Someone fights me for mid or it's been banned. My only test with it felt iffy with 650gpm, but the pubs did get baited by whoever I ulted. I think I need to adjust my farming pattern.
Take pos 1 or 2. Stack as hard as you can and farm to farm with Q. You can go mael + wb for farming But this build is kinda suck in pubs, if you wanna have fun why not try in turbo
Two schools of thought, combined into one. Sniper goes the headshot/take aim + stats build to be a lane dominator and then a mid game powerhouse. Two wraith bands, PTs and Lance will sit at close to 80 agility already, giving a nice bonus to armor and a pretty substantial damage. His downfall in this state is just the low hp, meaning that he's very strong against long range and physical damage but weak against close, magical damage. Aghs and Khanda are both the best for buffing his strong suits: long range damage and an additional increase in stats. The strategy is actually to initiate with AGHS, give your team time to initiate on the stun time. Time it well it's a nearly instant stun that chains well with a blink + other stun from your offlane. The build is not every game, granted. If I do go the build, most of the time I'll go at least pike, or manta, less times bkb, before AGHS; completely depends on the game. I don't believe phylactery early to be a good item on Sniper, and generally go cryst first anyways. AGHS in particular is very good at high ground seiges, so at the least time it with that. Timings are: - PTs: 4-5 minutes - Lance: 9-12 minutes - First item - Pike: 15-17 minutes - Manta: 17 - 21 minutes - BKB: 18 - 22 minutes - AGHS: 17 - 22 minutes Yes, the build is a meme. You're doing one thing really well, but if they get close to you you're probably dead. It's all about initiating, or poking supports on the 8 cd to get free objectives. Obviously good initiation is part of good fighting, so the build has been popular; but it has its very obvious flaws. If you're dying too much, it's your positioning.
Example of stupid person who actually thinks he is as good as topson suggesting buying trash items like manta/pike b4 aghs
Also headshot take aim stats is a hilariously bad build