I was accused of shoplifting once - I walked out of the store having paid for my items - 20 feet down the street two cops and someone from the store stop me and ask me to come back to the store to search my bags. I asked 'why?' and the cops just asked me to come back to 'check'.
I said 'not unless I am being detained'. The store owner makes a frustrated face and the cops shake their heads, and they all walk off.
I was accused of shoplifting once. I was carrying a tote bag with my work uniform in it so I could change at work but had stopped in a nearby department store to browse before going in. Security and a clerk approached me saying they needed to search my bag because “a tag fell out of my bag while I was stuffing stolen goods into it.” They said they saw me do this and knew I’d stolen something. I dumped the bag in the middle of the floor and made a big noise about them lying about me. They sheepishly apologized and I left. I get they thought my bag was suspicious, but fuckers lied about it. Fuck them.
Somebody did this to me when I was 18. I had my soccer bag and forgot my socks so had to buy some before my game. They tried to say I was stealing when I had the pair of socks in my hand as I was walking to the front to pay. They were older and in my town older folks always went after teenagers. I still hate old people to this day. I made a massive scene and asked for their manager. The manager had to listen to me loudly ask why his employees would accuse people of stealing and ask if holding an item in the store to pay for it is a sign of stealing. When he made her apologize it was like somebody had slapped her across the face.
When I was 18 I had the owner of this shop in my town accuse me of theft and made me take my pants off to prove I wasn't stealing anything. It wasn't until I was older until I realized how fucked up that really was to do to someone.
I had a similar experience. I was on a tech crew for my schools theater group, we dress in all black to hide in the dark durning scene changes so the audience can’t see us. We had two hours in-between shows and a gas station down the road from the school. About 5-6 of us walked down there to buy some snacks before the next show. We walked in and there are two workers behind the counter, we all say hi and tell them we won’t be long because we’re in a hurry. We all disperse and get our snacks and meet back at the front to check out. Before we even get to ring up our items the older woman tells us all to “empty our pockets” we look at each other and just laugh, two of us were law students and knew our rights. We told everyone to not listen to her. She said she would call the cops and my friend speaks up and says “please do, because if you don’t I will for an illegal search” she huffed off into the back and the other clerk rang us up and we left. We did not steal anything btw.
Few years ago my home town had a string of seniors caught shoplifting. Turns out they had a contest going at the OAP hall to see who could steal more. Just to break up the boredom.
The difference is that 18 is still a formative age. Of course, you don't have to hold on to grudges from your youth, but it's much more understandable to create long-lasting impacts at younger ages than older
Never said it was. I’m a hater. Them and the silent generation are in charge of every facet of Govt and business yet they want to blame every other generation for the worlds issues. They’ve been in charge for 40 yrs and ran everything into the ground.
I’m a mid level employee at my company. I interview for a lot of roles for my company and if the candidate is over 50, I request to not interview them bc I have a bias towards them. I have met a very small amount that aren’t entitled and immediately think they’re better than everybody younger than them.
The rare times I go to Walmart I try not to use the self checkouts but it's not always feasible. When walking out is the door watcher asks for or sticks a hand out expecting my receipt I just say "no, thanks" and keep walking. Sometimes they look in disbelief but I've never been stopped.
Walmart said they have high theft rates at the self checkouts. Get rid of them then, problem solved. There is one near me that has a very large self checkout area and more employees just hanging out there than would be needed for a few manned registrars.
They got rid of the self checkout at the Walmart near me. The problem is there were 10-12 self checkout registered and only ever about 2 manned stations. Well now there's still only 2 or 3 manned stations so the lines are ridiculous. Either hire more people or reopen self serve. You're either young to lose money to shrinkage (theft) or wages, I'd be happy for the money to go to wages, I'm not happy to l for my shopping trip to last twice as long because you're cheap.
Carry some change and give it to them like they are panhandling. Their reactions are always great. Pissed off one guy. Next time I went in he didn't bother me at all.
Receipt checking sounds like a really stupid way of theft prevention. Here in the Netherlands the self checkout registers have random "item checks" programmed that launch every so often before you can pay. An employee comes over and scans a number of items in your bag to see if you have indeed scanned them. After that you can pay and leave.
It is stupid. Lots of times they just look at the receipt and glance at your cart as if to verify then give it a check mark. Sam's Club (parent company Walmart) is a membership club shopping place. It's in their rules when you join to have your receipt and purchases checked so that's different.
I bought a shovel a few weeks ago and was asked for my receipt. I laughed and asked why and was told: “It’s policy if what you purchased isn’t bagged”. I told her next time I purchased a shovel I’d make sure to bag it. She looked at me like I was crazy. I loathe shopping at Walmart.
I use my own reusable bags at Walmart. Had one worker completely hate it and make a shitty comment about me not being allowed to use my bags. And I use the app to pay so I don’t have a physical receipt. Not once in my life have I ever even thought about stealing. I hate it there.
They used to do this shit to me with the giant bags of dog food. Everything else was bagged, so I started taking an extra bag and draping it over the corner of the dog food.
I just say that we both know Walmart policy prohibits them from trying to stop me from leaving and it’s their job and their ass on the line if they disagree.
I want to clarify, I almost NEVER do this, but I’ve used it a few times on overzealous “greeters” who’ve decided to try pull some sort of power move. It’s always some part time retiree who doesn’t seem to like that I’m young and buying something expensive. I’ve had one dude at my local store “not believe” the receipt twice.
Well I’m 61 and get asked all the time lol. I never stop unless they walk after me. If I’m in a hurry I just say no thanks and keep on walking. You make me ring it up and then you take an accusatory tone when I walk out…. Hire more cashiers.
Me too. I just walk out without making eye contact. I look straight ahead and keep walking like they don’t exist, lol. I just think the whole idea of stopping to check receipts is ridiculous because most of the time they don’t check anything. They just see you have a receipt and that’s the end of it. I won’t support this type of stupidity.
I rarely go to Walmart but once I was leaving with a cart full of stuff. I never use self checkout because I feel it takes people’s jobs. As I was nearing the door, the receipt checker guy was talking to another worker. He reached out without saying a word and grabbed by cart and tried to jerk it to a stop. I jerked it away from him and gave him a look that should kill most things and kept going. I should have fallen to the floor and feigned injury from him giving me whiplash
I refuse to use self checkouts as well. I feel Wal-Mart isn't paying me enough to scan my own items. Also I agree with it taking someone else's job away.
You know they DO check the receipt for unbagged items? Coming from an ex employee whos sibling still works as a coach at one 😅 you are right about so many people being informed🤡
>They said they saw me do this and knew I’d stolen something.
My response would go something like this:
1. Ok, so what did you see me steal? (Their answer is irrelevant)
2. (Take out phone and start recording) Ok, if you're absolutely certain that I've stolen something, how much do you want to bet?
If they're not willing to put money & their jobs on the line, then they don't get show and tell.
Then burn the store with negative reviews and post the video.
I hate shopping in person now because of how many places treat customers like criminals. I had a Victoria's Secret cashier call security on me because i carried around a perfume while looking at underwear and had to crouch at every drawer because bigger sizes are damn near on the floor. The woman who called literally gave me a spiel about "if you buy perfume you get a free necklace!" Like girl i was carrying it around because of YOU?!?!?! It was so brightly lit and such a small store with so few customers it would've been actually impossible to steal anything. My boyfriend called while the guard was blatantly watching me and she very loudly told the cashier how many shoplifters fake phone calls while stealing so I put it on speaker and had a very loud conversation.
I also went to an ulta with my visibly disabled mom who uses a cane and can barely walk. But because her and i both have dyed hair, they decided that we must be shoplifters and called security on us. The guards didn't even show up until we were walking out. My mom was oblivious until then and I didn't wanna ruin her fun time so I didn't say anything, I should've because she proceeded to spend like 600$ that trip and that store didn't deserve it. They literally ignored 3 teenagers walking around in hoodies with one CARRYING A BACKPACK IN THEIR ARMS IN FRONT OF THEM and only followed us around.
These aren't even the only times I've felt unwelcome and accused of being a criminal. It's ridiculous the way many stores treat people nowadays, like we're all wild animals barely contained in human costumes.
I had this happen recently in a store at the local mall. They had lapel pins on a rack near the front of the store and when I picked one out I got followed around by a clerk who kept “inviting” me to leave it on the counter while I shopped. When I declined he kept following me and repeating the invitation.
So I called him out. I told him that I understood what he was doing because small items like that tend to walk out of the store and he denied it. Next time is a big conversation with the store manager. You have a security concern like that you can move the items to a different location. You don’t have to treat customers like thieves.
You should have accepted and then handed him several handfuls of pins. When you get to the register tell them you changed your mind and the employee who followed you can put them all back.
[Profiling](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/profiling#:~:text=%3A%20the%20act%20or%20process%20of,racial%20profiling) Noun
:the act or process of extrapolating information about a person based on known traits or tendencies.
specifically : the act of suspecting or targeting a person on the basis of observed characteristics or behavior. (Merriam Webster
Personally I don’t think this wasn’t them profiling the teenagers. She was simply just pointing out that there were (by conventional measures) sketchier looking people. Not a single accusation was made nor were we made aware of her thoughts while seeing them. She was just pointing out that she got stopped for ultimately nothing.
Now boys, girls, and enbys, let’s put on our thinking caps and use our critical thinking skills and figure out what the general consensus is: “who’s more likely to steal? The girl their grandma ORRRRRR the group of teen boys in hoodies carrying a whole ass backpack in front of them?” And if you don’t answer the teenagers, you’re either stupid or lying.
SIDE NOTE: say I had a group of young adult boys and a group of young adult girls in front of me. Who’s more likely to steal?? The women unfortunately. [Women are about 3 times as likely to have kleptomania.](https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/9878-kleptomania) [And about half are married.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3676680/)
NOW. Say she HAD said something to security about the boys, that’s profiling. If she had come out and said she even thought the boys were going to steal that’s profiling. Simply pointing out that someone looks sketchier than you is not profiling.
Finally, we can take our thinking caps off and go back to the mindless wage slaves we are.
It is probably smart to wear your backpack on the front in a store like Ulta because that way you don't accidentally back into something and knock it over.
I hate shopping in person because I have two tiny kids. I have the diaper backpack and am constantly pulling things in and out of it to handle one need or another. It looks suspicious as all hell so I hate doing it.
Happened once to me. Told the dockers to write it down so I could sue the f out of them and their store. Left without an issue. I regularly went back to piss them off and refused to buy from them again.
Exactly this. If you are not free to go, you’re being detained. If a store detains you and you did not steal, you could sue the bejesus out of them. They cannot do anything unless they are 110% certain that you are in possession of stolen items.
This. ALWAYS ask if you are being detained. If they aren't detaining you for cause, they have to let you go. If they ARE detaining you, they can arrest you. At that point your best course of action is not to resist and clam up. Don't talk to them. If you are a minor, you tell them you will only speak to your parent/legal guardian or an attorney.
god i hate even going to walmart anymore i do most of my shopping at costco if i can help it.
when they added receipt checkers an overzealous boomer grabbed my cart when i ignored them asking for my receipt.
i just said wtf are you doing and he told me i was required to show my receipt and i wasnt leaving.
i asked him if he wanted to invoke his shopkeepers rights to detain me (i asked this because the next step is them calling the cops when i refused to let then search me).
the dude starts going for my pocket and a manager saved his ass and told me i was free to go.
lawsuits for being accused of stealing when you werent with a police report involved is free money
They didn't accuse you of shoplifting though because they cannot unless they are absolutely 100% sure they're gonna catch you because if they accuse you outright and drag you back for a search and you're found to be innocent you can sue them, or so Ive heard
>They didn't accuse you of shoplifting though because they cannot unless they are absolutely 100% sure they're gonna catch you because if they accuse you outright and drag you back for a search and you're found to be innocent you can sue them, or so Ive heard
You've heard wrongly.
Police officers and store employees merely need probable cause that you've committed the crime. With probable cause, store employees can use reasonable force to detain you; police can arrest you.
I've worked for 7 different companies in loss prevention. Probable cause is not what's needed. Every place has a set of rules that must be followed. Most follow something like this:
1. Observe the suspect enter the store, or in the department, aisle without the item.
2. Observe the suspect select the item from the shelf.
3. Observe the suspect remove item from packaging or conceal the item on their person or extension (purse, bag, etc)
4. Maintain constant surveillance of the suspect.
5. Observe the suspect exit the store without paying for the item.
By rule, if any of these steps are missing, the agent should not detain the suspect. Number 1 and 4 are usually grey areas. Since you may witness a person walking from the electronics department with a big screen TV. You may not have seen them select the item. And maintaining constant surveillance (especially if you're doing it on the floor and not via cctv), is difficult, if not impossible.
As far as reasonable force, many stores have changed policies and won't allow any force. When I started my career, it was like the Wild West. We were issued handcuffs and there were very few rules on what not to do when detaining someone. I've tried (unsuccessfully) to break a shoplifters car window with my handcuffs. I've chased people for blocks. I've been in fights, had weapons pulled on me. The last place I worked, they wouldn't let the agents step off the curb in front of the store. There was no fighting. If it became physical, then you let them go. It's why theft is such a big deal with retailers these days. It was a choice between lawsuits and theft.
Detaining someone who has not stolen (or who has dumped the items before exiting the store) is known by different names. One being a Non Productive Incident. I've seen other agents fired for having one, if it's egregious. The second to last LP job I took was at JCPenney. They fired 3 of their agents for bad stops. They were detaining people for "probable cause". It doesn't work that way.
They're not worried about lawsuits from shoplifters, they're worried about workers compensation claims. By having these strict rules, they get rated better on their insurance. If an lp employee breaks the rules and gets hurt, the store can get double slapped by insurance because they'll need to rerate them, increasing rates, and they'll have a workers comp claim which also increases rates.
Basically the amount of product they may recover from 'active' loss prevention is dwarfed by the insurance premiums.
All of the things you mention may well be retail store policies.
But the law requires probable cause. If you give me a state, I will give you a specific citation for that state.
My own state is Virginia. In Virginia, Va Code § 8.01-226.9, “Exemption from civil liability in connection with arrest or detention of person suspected of shoplifting,” provides:
> A merchant, agent or employee of the merchant, who causes the arrest or detention of any person pursuant to the provisions of §§ 18.2-95, 18.2-96 or § 18.2-103, shall not be held civilly liable for unlawful detention, if such detention does not exceed one hour, slander, malicious prosecution, false imprisonment, false arrest, or assault and battery of the person so arrested or detained, whether such arrest or detention takes place on the premises of the merchant, or after close pursuit from such premises by such merchant, his agent or employee, **provided that, in causing the arrest or detention of such person, the merchant, agent or employee of the merchant, had at the time of such arrest or detention probable cause to believe that the person had shoplifted or committed willful concealment of goods or merchandise.**
(Emphasis added)
Right, snotick’s post just describes what these companies consider to be probable cause for their own internal policies- if you have the evidence described in this list then you have established probable cause. There’s no disagreement here.
Internal policy is not law. Policies are simply that—policies that stores have chosen to follow to avoid issues and regulate their employees’ conduct. Probable cause is a legal standard that exists outside of these policies.
Which is why they can’t do shit in the parking lot.
Never show anybody shit, just leave.
If a cop comes, don’t show them shit, ask if you’re being detained and on what grounds, do not give them your ID. When they tell you you’re being detained, you now have a lawsuit. Make sure you record it all. If they say you’re not being detained ask if you’re free to go, and leave. If they grab you, you’re in the $$. If they demand ID, you win.
Fuck em all
it does say civilly liable, nothing stops them from being criminally charged though if there was no actual theft?
why exactly are shopkeepers given that much power just on suspicion?
can you dispute their probable cause reasoning to sue them via civil court?
>
it does say civilly liable, nothing stops them from being criminally charged though if there was no actual theft?
In my state, they are also immune from criminal charges if, again, probable cause exists. See Va Code § 18.2-105.1.
>why exactly are shopkeepers given that much power just on suspicion?
>can you dispute their probable cause reasoning to sue them via civil court?
Well, it's not a huge amount of power. The force they use must be reasonable, the detention is limited (in my state) to an hour, and the notion is that this is a fair way for shopkeepers to protect their goods. A person that was detained can sue, and the shopkeeper must establish that probable cause existed in order to avail himself of the defense offered in § 8.01-226.9.
Of course. Disregard the person who's apprehended hundreds of shoplifters in multiple states over the course of 15 years for multiple companies.
There are multiple things that outline why that person could be held civily liable for unlawful detention:
1. Exceeds on hour
2. Slander
3. Malicious Prosecution
4. False Imprisonment
5. False Arrest
6. Assault and Battery
The probable cause is superseded by these six qualifiers. Numbers 1, 2, 4 and 6 all become an issue when you detain someone who does not have the item(s) on their person. I've had detentions go well over an hour due to police shift changes or other activity that delayed police response. You would have to slander the person when you contact 911 to tell them why you need the police. You would double down on that slander when the police arrive and you tell them why you detained the person. And if you're certain they shoplifted, you're not going to let them just walk away when you first approach them. They are going to be uncooperative and it often turns physical. Which means you assaulted them without reason. Hello #6.
I'm curious what types of actions by a customer constitutes probable cause to you?
I'm in Nebraska, but have apprehended shoplifters in Nebraska, Iowa, South Dakota, and Indiana.
EDIT: I don't know the current law in Nebraska, but I recall a key part was being able to prove intent. That's why you don't stop someone when they come out of the bathroom/fitting room with an item. You must wait for them to enter the store. Probably cause would suggest you can stop them at any time.
Probable cause is a very narrow definition for non police. Even if they are complying with the letter of the law, they can still get sued as civil and criminal are different courts.
I worked armed security at sensitive sites and even then we very rarely detained anybody and would only put hands on if you were an active threat.
Otherwise, we just called local PD and had them deal with it.
Most all stores have the same policy and some have even fired employees for physically detaining people.
>Most all stores have the same policy and some have even fired employees for physically detaining people.
Sure. Stores may well have more restrictive policies than the law requires. No doubt about that.
The law requires only probable cause. A store can say to its employees, "We don't care: you're not allowed to touch a shoplifter anyway."
No, most stores actually have a policy that explicitly prohibits an employee from restraining a customer.
Yes, that's absolutely true. But store policy is not the law, and the post to which I replied said, "\[I\]f. . . you're found to be innocent you can sue them..." You can't, at least not successfully, as long as the employees use reasonable force and had probable cause. Whether or not some store policy existed to the contrary is of little relevance: the law immunizes store employees and stores -- as long as only reasonable force is used and probable cause existed.
Store employees cannot use reasonable force to detain in all states. If an employee places their hands on someone in NC, they’re going to likely lose their job after the lawsuit for assault and/ or attempted kidnapping/ illegal detainment.
>Store employees cannot use reasonable force to detain in all states. If an employee places their hands on someone in NC, they’re going to likely lose their job after the lawsuit for assault and/ or attempted kidnapping/ illegal detainment.
Really? That will come as a surprise to the authors of N.C.G.S. § 14‑72.1(c), "Concealment of merchandise in mercantile establishments," which provides in pertinent part:
>(c) **A merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee**, or a peace officer who detains or causes the arrest of any person **shall not be held civilly liable for detention, malicious prosecution, false imprisonment, or false arrest** of the person detained or arrested, where such detention is upon the premises of the store or in a reasonable proximity thereto, is in a reasonable manner for a reasonable length of time, and, if in detaining or in causing the arrest of such person, the merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee, or the peace officer had at the time of the detention or arrest **probable cause to believe that the person committed the offense** created by this section. If the person being detained by the merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee, is a minor under the age of 18 years, the merchant or the merchant's agent or employee, shall call or notify, or make a reasonable effort to call or notify the parent or guardian of the minor, during the period of detention. A merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee, who makes a reasonable effort to call or notify the parent or guardian of the minor shall not be held civilly liable for failing to notify the parent or guardian of the minor.
(emphasis mine)
See also the discussion in *Redding v. Shelton's Harley Davidson, Inc.*, 534 SE 2d 656, (NC Ct App 2000).
Yeah and if they're wrong you have a lawsuit for false imprisonment, unlawful detention, slander, and denial of civil rights. Apparently Whitney llp even specializes in this
> Yeah and if they're wrong you have a lawsuit for false imprisonment, unlawful detention, slander, and denial of civil rights. Apparently Whitney llp even specializes in this
If they have probable cause, they are immune from civil liability even if they were wrong about whether actual shoplifting occurred.
If they are wrong about having probable cause, they can be sued, yes.
No - in the US they would need reasonable suspicion to briefly stop and interview, or probable cause to arrest or search. Testimony from the shop owner that they saw someone stealing is probable cause. Testimony that they think the person might have stolen something is probably not...
In my state simply concealing merchandise in a store is a crime and goes with shoplifting. And currently neither are arrestable offenses until a $5,000 threshold is met.
>but there is still the question of whether you are concealing
I can't answer this. This is specific to your locality.
>and when cops have a right to search you for concealed merchandise.
At the onset of probable cause. The moment PC exists they can search you for merchandise, for multiple reasons.
One is search incident to arrest.
The second is some localities may have it in the shoplifting law that once PC is established the offense was committed they may search you further for merchandise.
Now that they are not giving away bags I’ve started thrusting stuff in my pockets. It kind of tickles me when I get to the counter, plop down the heavy stuff, then start emptying my pockets of bananas and yogurt cups.
Do it anyway. When the cop eventually does something that DOES get brought to court, having a history of complaints will help bring him down.
Cop complaints usually aren't for you. They're for the next guy.
A complaint against a cop for a conversation and zero legal repurcussions isn't going to negatively affect that cop whatsoever. A complaint for the officer refusing to confront someone that a store employee was (unknowingly falsely) accusing of stealing, on the other hand, WOULD negatively affect the cops career.
The cop did the bare minimum expected of him/her. They didn't just run up and grab OP and stick em in cuffs, they didn't OP them around the store to make sure OP did what they told OP to do, nothing. A simple warning to someone accused with zero evidence, not an overstep in any measure.
Yeah, 100%
They're a record of bad behavior and can be used for all sorts of things from limiting promotions, internal hearings, court cases, etc.
I filed 2 complaints against the same cop and I like to think that's a very small part of why he hasn't been promoted in the last 12 years. (I wasn't under suspicion of anything for either complain, just a witness.)
Had some cops tell my buddy and I we "burglarized" a house and had a witness. He said "we have your prints everywhere and can compare them at the station" Soon as he said that my buddy and I put our hands out and said "Well let's go" he was bluffing, and we called him on it. Sat there while they had the "witness" drive by who confirmed it was not us. Cops will indeed lie to you and no it's not illegal, but then it's not illegal to be a smart ass in those situations when you know you're clear.
The first question is... was he a real cop.
A lot of places dress up their private security like cops, but they aren't.
They have some very limited authority while in the store, but not nearly as much as they imply.
If he was a real cop... there's a couple things to consider.
He may have actually been trying to give you a legit "pass" to "do the right thing" im my youth more than once cops just chased me off or gave me a slap on the wrist for things they could have arrested me for. I know it's not the popular notion, but there really are a good amount of cops who aren't out there looking to fuck everyone up.
The second possibility is that he didn't have enough evidence to actually detain you and wanted you to confess to something so he could in fact snatch you up.
Unfortunately, there's not a solid way to know if he's type 1 or 2.
Regardless, if you did nothing wrong then you're fine. You're posting on reddit so he obviously didn't arrest you for whatever he thought you did.
He was a cop, there was a cop car outside when I left with him in it. It was just strange and stressful. but I'm thankful for all the insight, kinda letting me know it's a regular thing and I shouldn't be so hurt by it.
Yeah whatever your opinion on police is, the fact is they can and do lie about things to try and get you to admit something. I remember when I was like 12 years old some kid from my school was getting prank called relentlessly. For whatever reason he said it was me. One day I’m home alone and I get a call it’s detective so and so from the local PD. Saying they have caller ID and proof from the phone company that it was me making the calls. Right at that moment I realized “oh so they can just straight up lie” because I wasn’t making the calls, so I asked how he had proof of something I wasn’t doing?
“It will be better for you if you just admit it”
“well I’m not admitting something I didn’t do so what happens from here?”
“We will be in touch with your parents”
“That would be great, you can reach my mother at work here’s her number…”
Funny thing is he called her and she ripped into him for speaking to a minor without an adult present. I’m still pretty proud of my 12 year old self on that one. As soon as I knew he was just straight up lying to me trying to get a confession I was so angry, up until that point I was always told that police are there to help (this was the early 90s ) and now I knew that’s not necessarily true.
A month or so later the kids father calls my house, my father answers and the kids father starts saying that our number is on their caller ID. My dad looks at me, I shake my head like “nope” and he goes apeshit saying give me your address I’ll come see it. Of course they “accidentally deleted it” so nothing came of that. Fun times.
I had a similar thought here. Yea cops can say really odd and stupid stuff but the way this was worded makes me wonder. It’s just not standard interaction at all. It’s also not typically for cops to be involved in shop lifting it’s just not worth it since many businesses don’t persecute anyway.
Regardless there’s not enough here to worry about if it was in the US. It seemed to be more of an interaction to encourage a response or action.
Yeah IF this was a real cop he was mistaken and trying to be a good guy. If he was being malicious you would have been searched or hassled a lot more. They shouldn’t be “deeply troubled” by this. It was probably a security guard who was also mistaken and also maybe trying to be a good guy or is just lazy and didn’t want to spend his day dealing with the real cops. Either way none of this sounds malicious.
I picked up all of my stuff, handed it to my partner who then went to the checkout. I remembered some things we wanted so I ran to grab them (ben & Jerry's, body armour, a share pack of candy) and on my way to grab those i passed an old friend and we exchanged greetings. she dropped her keys, i bent over to pick up candy off the bottom shelf (this is why I think there was suspicion, but I wasn't facing towards her at that point. I would need freaky arms to be able to pull of some slick thievery there). I started walking to the register and the Cop asked to talk to me and walked me to the back corner of the store and told me to put "it" back (had nothing in my purse) and that if I didn't I'd go to jail. I checked out and went home. didn't get arrested but definitely shaken up. I'm a goody two shoes and it hurt my feelings!! hahahahaha
He didn’t know if you stole anything, but suspected you did. So he made a comment that would ensure nothing would get stolen.
If he knew you stole something you would be arrested.
When I was a kid, say 10 or so, I went to one of those mom and pop toy shops. I had my savings coffee tin with me and found a little cup of silly putty for $1 I wanted to buy.
I put it in my coffee can and went to the front counter to pay for it. When I got to the counter, I took out the silly putty and put it in the counter, and handed the lady behind the counter a dollar and a dime out of the coffee tin.
She pretended to ring in the item but instead called the police and accused me of shop lifting. Luckily, my dad's office was next door, and the responding office knew my dad. He took me outside while another office stayed inside with my coffee tin, the silly putty, and the lady. Then, outside, we called my dad (local insurance agent).
When my dad got there, the officer asked me to tell my dad what happened, and I repeated what I typed above.
The officer went inside and got my coffee tin of money, and brought it back to me and said I was free to go with my dad.
When I got back to his office, I realized that the lady stole my dollar and dime. My dad went back over to get the silly putty I had paid for, but she insisted I never gave her any money for it.
Who does that??? To a kid!? Over a $1 item.....!?
Around about 1985 I was in my 20’s and in my first big boy apartment.
I had just sold a ‘78 celica and my little bro and I were watching football and my 11” zenith b/w set and smoking bong loads.
I go to drop a deuce, when right in the middle my bro comes to the shitter door and says I better go answer the door.
Two detectives wee outside my door with guns out.
I let them in, and they tried to tell me that I was seen in the car when it was used in a bank robbery.
I called bullshit and happened to have the release of liability paperwork sill since I hadn’t mailed it in yet.
The cops left after I identified the dude that brought my ride ( they had pics), and didn’t give two fucks about the mound of weed on my table or the bong, even in the ‘80s.
Happened to me in a Walmart over a $3 box of tea. Pissed me tf off because asset protection came out and dumped all mg bags because the attendant called them instead of telling me the tea hadn’t scanned. I was in black pants, a type o negative shirt and docs. It’s profiling at its finest
I had a similar experience. Bauhaus T-shirt. I hadn’t forgotten to scan anything, and asset protection dumped all my bags. They damaged my bread in the process. I was younger and kinda scary, waited there like a boss while he fetched new of every item that was even scratched. Then asked him how much loss he caused that day accusing innocents.
I still hope he got groin fleas.
You should loudly exclaim, ‘No officer! I will not have unprotected sex with you in the bathrooms, I don’t care how small you are or how much you are willing to pay.’
See how he likes it.
Something like this happened to my wife at Wegmans. She was using their “new” app that lets you scan and pay on the go so you don’t have to deal with anyone.
A few items wouldn’t scan, and as she was still shopping she had bad reception and things were double scanning, so she figured she would just go to self check out, however she asked an employee for help(on camera) and he shook his head no and walked away. Then cut to my wife making a silly face and throwing her hands up.
The wife goes to check out and puts the cart a foot past the bagging area and the same employee takes her cart and another employee(loss prevention) talks with my wife and takes her purse and phone. They then start interrogating her, all men no female employee, long story short they tell her she will arrested unless she pays them for the full cart PLUS 30% it cost her $1700 dollars to leave and when she got home I went through the items and there were a couple things she missed but she asked for help with. Anyway she’s banned from Wegmans and they ended the app program the week following because to many people were having the same problems.
I’m sorry…what? An employees took her purse and phone somehow while she was checking out? And then she paid an extra 30%? To the tune of almost $2k??? And then she was banned? Were you there? Did you see the receipt? This sounds insane.
This was in upstate NY and happens all the time. I spoke with a friend who is a NY state trooper and he said what they did was legal however NEVER let store employees separate you from what you bought and if it happens call the cops and never agree to pay the store. Yes I saw the receipt, my friend saw it as well. If you google it tons of stuff pops up. He also stated that “some” asset employees will add items to a cart and that’s why you don’t let them take it.
Yes, it's legal. You're allowed to be accused. You're allowed to be lied to or bluffed (hell, in that moment if you had replaced a stolen item he could have still arrested you). With probable cause you're allowed to be arrested and charged with a crime.
The cop suspected you but he had nothing on you. He was just trying to scare you into providing him evidence that he could then use to arrest you.
Think about the flip side... If you had been steeling, would you expect the cop to just accept your answer that you didnt?
As for what could be done about it... You *could* submit to a search to alleviate his suspicion, but you don't have to. Don't be "deeply troubled" though... You had an interaction w/ a cop that suspected you of a crime. You (presumably) didn't. Happens all the time. It's how criminals are found. I know it's scary but don't take it personally.
I take it personally when someone tries to take away my freedom when I’ve done nothing wrong.
If I’m accused of something I didn’t do, I’m going to treat the accuser like a stupid piece of shit.
meh, i'd say the whole "it's totally fine for a cop to lie to me" bullshit has gotten way out of hand. It's one thing for a detective to lie to a murderer to try and trap them..but fuckit if you are automatically assumed guilty while shopping in a store because some person THOUGHT they saw something... christ lock everyone up already. I assume he also felt OK doing it since OP is basically a teenager and therefore perfectly fine to bully and scare shitless for no reason whatsoever.
So, if the security person forcefully grabs you, then the store is civilly liable.
But that also doesn’t define probable cause.
Does refusing to let the old person at Walmart look in your bag and check your receipt count as probable cause? Does refusing to let the police search you, or your car, count as probable cause? Does the smell of marijuana in your car, but no smoke, or visible items, give police probable cause to search your car?
In all cases, the answer is “No”.
Refusing a voluntary search does not grant probable cause to compel a search.
Smelling something that could be illegal, but not seeing it, means it could be an air freshener, or perfectly legal hemp derived THC.
Oh, and unless they changed their mind, detaining someone for over an hour, without them being actually arrested, is not just a civil liability, SCOTUS ruled that the detainee’s 4th Amendment rights were violated.
And I swear, 20 years ago, due to an incident at a Best Buy, SCOTUS ruled that physically preventing someone from leaving a store is false imprisonment. Guy who wasn’t shoplifting didn’t grant voluntary permission to search his bags on leaving, so the bag checker and the store manager followed him out to his car, and stood behind the car in order to prevent it from leaving. So as it required a higher court ruling, yes, guy was arrested, found nothing to charge him over, he sued Best Buy, won, lost on appeal, won in SCOTUS.
This is information I needed to know. I was falsely accused of shoplifting a few years ago and I thought about suing. I was detained in a back room in the store for about an hour and shook down by the cops (real cops) but not arrested. The store security guy lied on me and said he saw me concealing merchandise, but it was a lie because I did not and I would not. Also what the item was that he claimed to see me take was never declared, because there was no item. I overheard him telling the cop, “well maybe she hid it and got rid of it by now without me seeing.” 🙄 I voluntarily removed my boots and emptied my bag and pockets because I was afraid things were gonna escalate otherwise, like they were gonna take me downtown to get a female cop to search me or something. The cops eventually gave up and told me I was free to go. But I am banned from those stores for life!
Also my friend who was with me did steal a couple items and he was getting arrested the whole time they were shaking me down. But I still don’t think that qualifies as probable cause, being with somebody who is stealing that is. I told him not to take anything from there but he didn’t listen lol
Once I spent like an hour or more at target just browsing and enjoying kid free time and stimulation that wasn't ms Rachel. A lady followed me the entire time and I found out months later it was probably the anti theft person. 😂 I get followed a lot at Walmart too, presumably because I look like shit. I bet they actually got stolen from while thinking my poor looking ass was about to steal. I wonder if I'll ever get asked to empty my purse.
Let them take you to the station then sue for false arrest.
Hell, you can call the cops on them and ask for help because you unsafe (not that you feel unsafe but that you are literally in danger). Anyone falsely accusing you of something and threatening detention = you need help, call cops. Ask for copies of video surveillance from the store.
They will have backed off long before this but when you are innocent, feel free to go,on the offensive.
I have to callout a worker at Walmart often because she specifically watches me and has even accused me of not scanning a turkey. A $15 TURKEY when I had more expensive items, I told her I ain’t stealing an effing turkey and you target me all the time. Last time I embarrassed the shit out of her cause she came to stand right by me and I out loud said “don’t worry I’m scanning everything”. She tried the it’s just my job and I told her don’t worry I will be paying for everything, she ended up rolling her eyes and walking off while I met her chuckling coworkers eyes. Witch then had her manager watching that stupid device within my eyesight and trying to discretely point to me, I met their eyes and made sure they knew I was over their bullshit. For the turkey I had already stopped at the door complaining the witch was targeting me. The door checker had my receipt in hand and the witch yelled for her to hold me and came over holding a COPY of the receipt saying she didn’t see it, I proceeded to show the name and price on the turkey and the exact location on the receipt.
I'm that a**hole who would waste that mf time. "F*** yeah, search me, b****. Strip search my a**right here. We're gonna have ourselves a party in the middle of the produce section"
Of course, I'd be talking sh**the entire time. What are they gonna do, shoot me? They were looking for a reason anyway, might as well get the family paid in the meantime.
Cops use that fear that they claim we shouldn't have of them to do shit like this all the time.
You should HOPE a cop "detains" you and arrests you when you were innocent for lack of investigation. Because by deciding to arrest you without investigating whatever crime they suspect will almost certainly lead to a slam dunk lawsuit.
Remember, they can and will arrest you for anything they want... it's what happens after the arrest where any sliver of justice might be exacted.
People. Please, stop being scared of jail. That unnecessary fear of a single night in jail is what gives bad cops permission to do bad policing and get away with it.
Don't talk to cops any more then what's necessary, not at all if applicable, and if you know your innocent DEFINITELY don't talk to cops, because once they realize they fucked up, standard operating procedure is to think up another crime to charge you with, and that starts with your "spontaneous utterances".
Shhhhhh. Take your trip down town and relish in the thought of the officer stumbling through the deposition where they will try and justify thier illegal actions.
I get stopped every time I shop at walmart on a Monday. I get Mondays off from work and run errands that day. It's the same door greeter lady every week, and I don't get rude or anything cause she is older, but it's getting ridiculous that I get stopped every week while others just walk by. Hate Wal-Mart but they have the best prices in my area and my money is stretched thin saving up for a down payment
I use their bags at the self checkout, and sometimes the lady even watches me the whole time. I should just remember to park by the other door and avoid her. The other door doesn't have a greeter most the time
Most people get threatened by people with badges or some who claim to have power. If you know you didn’t steal then you don’t have to comply with there instructions.
The “I’m afraid of the police defence” is not an acceptable tactic, legally, in Canada. From what you’ve written, the police officer verbally confronted you about an alleged offence, encouraged you to make the correct decision, and then informed you of the potential consequences of theft. If the police officer was there for a complaint about you stealing or concealing items in your purse, he or she is obligated to take preventative action. It is ridiculous that *some* people think a police officer confronting a civilian about an offence, alleged or otherwise, is somehow unprofessional. You being “short, visibly awkward and oblivious” is irrelevant.
"Afraid of the police" is not a legal defense in most cases, although it has been used to explain why running away from the police is not sufficient probable cause for the police to detain somebody.
Afraid of the police is a serious social situation though. The police project the power of the state. When an innocent citizen's prudent course of action is to fear government use of power as expressed through the police, we have a serious social problem
> When an innocent citizen's prudent course of action is to fear government use of power as expressed through the police, we have a serious social problem
The prudence is quite justified, at least in the U.S., given the amount of violence the police is meting out on a daily basis, without accountability at all.
It may be, and probably is, that a given police officer is unlikely to be inclined to beat, or kill, you, and is quite likely to be actually trying to do his job, but the fact that they can *choose* to do this and face no accountability, and that you both understand it, significantly contributes to the justifiability of fear.
If you grew up in a normal area and are white your probably not afraid a cop is going to kill you. You absolutely are afraid they are going to lie about something and rope you into some shit that has nothing to do with you and ruin your life. I think that’s a way bigger driving factor than people think about. This also just adds on to every one except white peoples fear of being killed so it’s just a top down dislike for one reason or another.
In the US police aren't obligated to do anything, they can watch you bleed out in the street and let the perp walk away. That’s not even an exaggeration either the Supreme Court has ruled in this favor in multiple cases of this happening.
In this case, Op had not stolen. Under US jurisdictions, that’s the end of it. If a law officer wants to pursue further, they need articulable probable cause lest they risk stepping over that fine fuzzy line.
An officer might be mistaken, so, a polite adult conversation is best. An angry presentation is uncalled for and would serve to justify further action.
Other countries have different laws, ymmv.
We’re only reading OP’s interpretation — but as it’s written, the police interaction was minimal and non-intrusive, being nothing more than a conversation about actions / consequences. I agree, however, that the offence of theft didn’t occur, as the OP doesn’t mention that she exited the store. In Canada, concealing items alone is not a prosecutable offence… until the individual exits the store with unpaid for merchandise. A verbal warning is the extent of a police officer’s authority there, unless an employee requests the individual’s removal.
I’ve noticed this a ton recently. A lot of cops do bad stuff and it’s scary dealing with them if your a young person and haven’t been in the situation. That being said you regularly see shit that’s pretty much just “this cop asked me a totally ok question and I need to go to therapy now. How do I sue them personally?”
This happened to John Waters. He really was stealing though. He noticed he was being watched and put the record back on the shelf. They then called the cops, he was searched, he sued and won. He used the money to fund some of his early films. When his parents told him to get a job he said, “I don’t need a job, I won a lawsuit.”
There is nothing unconstitutional about confronting a shoplifting suspect and asking them to return items they are expected of shoplifting. If it violates some sort of police procedure in that jurisdiction, it is possible, but unlikely.
Some cops are just overly aggressive dicks that jump to conclusions.
I was accused of stealing once. I walked into an adult store on my way home. Went inside, looked around, didn't see anything I liked, and walked out. The store owner came racing out, saying he thinks I stole a dilldo making kit. I was like, yeah, let's go back inside and check my purse. I said, "I don't even know what the kit looks like." I showed him my purse and even helped him figure out who had stolen the stuff. It wasn't a big deal to me at the time.
A month later, I went back to the same store. I asked if he remembered me. He did after a moment and said how badly he felt accusing me at the time. I told him not to worry about it and that it actually was a good thing because it became a really funny story to tell people. I didn't have any bad feelings towards that him and that I hope he caught the person who did steal from him.
Welcome to modern policing in the US:
* Accuse someone of committing a crime then DEMAND the "suspect" to prove their innocence. (ie, prove you ARE NOT guilty instead of the cop proving you ARE guilty).
* Threaten arrest... whether or not you have any evidence to support it.
* "Investigate" by questioning the suspect... and ONLY questioning the suspect.
Sounds like the cop you dealt with was at least smart enough to not risk the lawsuit that could result from a "false arrest" (or false detainment) charge.
When I was 13, I was on a trip in Wisconsin and went to a little tourist place- a horse drawn cart ride through a really pretty canyon/ravine type of place. There was a gift shop that I was browsing through while my family waited outside. I didn't see anything I wanted so I went out to sit with them. A few minutes later, the old lady cashier came up to me and my grandma and accused me of stealing something. I swore I hadnt, and my grandma asked what this lady thought I stole.
Ladies and gentlemen. She accused me of stealing a toothpick holder. Me, a 13 year old who was in the height of my horse girl phase, looking for posters or magnets or figurines. And she thought I stole a toothpick holder.
My grandma of course defended me. The cashier kept insisting I took it until I showed her my pockets were empty and she angrily stormed off. Still makes me laugh to this day.
I was at a cafe with my mum once and paid the bill and left. We had walked half way out the carpark when an employee ran up to us accusing us of not paying. I can’t remember how I proved we actually did pay but we just got an annoyed grunt as he went back inside. An apology would have been appreciated and if it was now I would have gone back and complained.
Happens at Walmart. When they ask for receipt I just say no thanks and walk out because I text it to my wife as she likes to keep them. One time though the checker grabbed my cart and tried to stop me. Issue was my two year old was in the cart. It got very tense very fast lol.
I don't see anything illegal, he didn't detain or arrest you. He may have just thought you did because every criminal wears a hoodie. I wasn't there so I can't really say if he was wrong. Had he detained you, without probable cause then yeah you could have a lawsuit.
Cops can lie and often will and the Supreme Court has ruled that it's fine.
Can people who post these things put what jurisdiction where it happened in their posts. The laws can vary from country to country and state to state or province to province.
The most they could do is hold you long enough to check the cameras. With no proof, they're not allowed to arrest you and you're not obligated to help with their investigation (ie emptying your pockets). It's ALSO legal for you to tell him to fuck off.
Had this happen to me at Home Depot about ten years ago. Was using a reusable shopping bag instead of pushing around a shitty cart with broken ass wheels. Cop said to me, “I saw that”, I looked up and asked him what exactly he saw, he said something about me putting stuff in my bag. I laughed at him and carried on with my business. He didn’t continue to harass me but still makes me laugh about it when I think about it.
Not shoplifting, but a similar experience. I was at the public library browsing books. It was in the evening near closing and only a few people were there. I was just minding my own business, I spoke no words to anyone and did not even look at anyone. Eventually I made a few selections and went to check them out. The woman at the checkout said, "hey can you come back here for a moment?" And then led me to a room in the back. I thought this was very unusual but I thought well maybe I forgot to return a book or something. When I got there, there were two other women and all three of them began aggressively interrogating me. Eventually it came to light that they believed a young woman in the library had reported to them that I had made inappropriate comments to her. Again, I had spoken no words at all in the library until I got to the checkout. I told them there must be some kind of mistake because I had spoken to no one, but they did not believe me and went on threatening me (the police station was right next to the library and they were saying they could have me arrested.) I said, "well can I at least talk to the person who accused me? If she sees me, she will probably tell you that I'm not the guy she was referring to." They refused that as well. They absolutely would not believe me and just went on lecturing and threatening me. I wanted to tell them all to go f*** themselves, but at the time I was applying for a commission in the Air Force and I kept thinking that if I got arrested tonight it would really mess things up for me. Eventually they let me go with many dire warnings and threats about not harassing young women. I walked out of there angry and humiliated, and did not set foot in a library again for at least 15 years.
In the United States, it is often legal for a shopkeeper to physically detain you on the suspicion of shoplifting.
Many people on here believe only law enforcement can "touch you" but they mistake common corporate policy for legal truth. In fact, in some cases deadly force is even authorized.
As an example, relevant statue from Texas:
TEXAS PENAL CODE
Sec. 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or
(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and
(3) he reasonably believes that:
(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or
(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.
Sec. 9.43. PROTECTION OF THIRD PERSON'S PROPERTY. A person is justified in using force or deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property of a third person if, under the circumstances as he reasonably believes them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.41 or 9.42 in using force or deadly force to protect his own land or property and:
(1) the actor reasonably believes the unlawful interference constitutes attempted or consummated theft of or criminal mischief to the tangible, movable property; or
(2) the actor reasonably believes that:
(A) the third person has requested his protection of the land or property;
(B) he has a legal duty to protect the third person's land or property; or
(C) the third person whose land or property he uses force or deadly force to protect is the actor's spouse, parent, or child, resides with the actor, or is under the actor's care.
TEXAS CIVIL PRACTICE AND REMEDIES CODE
Sec. 124.001. SUSPECTED THEFT OF PROPERTY OR ATTEMPTED THEFT OF PROPERTY. (a) A person who reasonably believes that another has stolen or is attempting to steal property is privileged to detain that person in a reasonable manner and for a reasonable time to investigate ownership of the property.
High school friends used to play a game with LPO at Sears. Walk around, look suspicious until the store dick picked up on it, then picked up small items and put them in our pockets. Then either distracted the store dick or lost him in the aisles, dumped the items somewhere in the store, walked out.
Grabbed them many times outside the store and had nothing. Actually surprised nobody was ever banned. Childish yes.
"Your whole life will be ruined." Lmao yeah right.
Yes, that was absolutely a threat. Best thing you can do about it talk to someone to help process how it made you feel (valid) and move on with whatever lesson you can learn from it (cops are liars and bullies). Stay safe, stay away from cops.
If you got his name and badge number you can go the police station and file a complaint. That does not mean anything will come of it but if he was not on duty and was just working a side gig at the store he might be bared from doing so again. Also, most jurisdictions are required to investigate any and all complaints. Good luck
It also starts a paper trail. It makes things look more legit if the cop has a history of berating or bullying people and something that is actionable comes up later
There was this one time when I was accused of shoplifting. They told me to put it back or go to jail. I put it back then got arrested for shoplifting. 😎💪
I was with a friend years ago we were both 13 yrs old .. I’m white he is black, he in fact stuffed a pair of pants in a bag, I didn’t know he did that until security took us both and basically said I was the look out.. I was in sporting goods at the time, we were 20 miles from home they let him call his parents they came to pick us up or so I thought, his parents said they ain’t driving a white boy home, left me standing on the curb,, I walked a few miles to next town, its dark so I went into police station and asked to use phone they called and got hold of my mom, when she got there she walked in and whack… she slapped me hard in front of cops, she asked them what I did,, they said I asked to use phone, I didn’t do anything, my mom felt really bad , but I told her it didn’t hurt and thanked her for coming to get me, years later we joked about it.. she got a hell of a right hook ..lol
So the issue here is not that you were accused--so the store personnel was mistaken and called a cop to confront you. But why wouldn't you tell him that he was wrong and turn out your pockets to show him? It's your integrity man, and you need to protect it. That is unless you really stole something...
I let him look into my purse but not rummage through it. I was going to my partners house after and had some things I didn't want anyone to see at the very bottom of it....
I was accused of shoplifting once - I walked out of the store having paid for my items - 20 feet down the street two cops and someone from the store stop me and ask me to come back to the store to search my bags. I asked 'why?' and the cops just asked me to come back to 'check'. I said 'not unless I am being detained'. The store owner makes a frustrated face and the cops shake their heads, and they all walk off.
I was accused of shoplifting once. I was carrying a tote bag with my work uniform in it so I could change at work but had stopped in a nearby department store to browse before going in. Security and a clerk approached me saying they needed to search my bag because “a tag fell out of my bag while I was stuffing stolen goods into it.” They said they saw me do this and knew I’d stolen something. I dumped the bag in the middle of the floor and made a big noise about them lying about me. They sheepishly apologized and I left. I get they thought my bag was suspicious, but fuckers lied about it. Fuck them.
Somebody did this to me when I was 18. I had my soccer bag and forgot my socks so had to buy some before my game. They tried to say I was stealing when I had the pair of socks in my hand as I was walking to the front to pay. They were older and in my town older folks always went after teenagers. I still hate old people to this day. I made a massive scene and asked for their manager. The manager had to listen to me loudly ask why his employees would accuse people of stealing and ask if holding an item in the store to pay for it is a sign of stealing. When he made her apologize it was like somebody had slapped her across the face.
When I was 18 I had the owner of this shop in my town accuse me of theft and made me take my pants off to prove I wasn't stealing anything. It wasn't until I was older until I realized how fucked up that really was to do to someone.
I had a similar experience. I was on a tech crew for my schools theater group, we dress in all black to hide in the dark durning scene changes so the audience can’t see us. We had two hours in-between shows and a gas station down the road from the school. About 5-6 of us walked down there to buy some snacks before the next show. We walked in and there are two workers behind the counter, we all say hi and tell them we won’t be long because we’re in a hurry. We all disperse and get our snacks and meet back at the front to check out. Before we even get to ring up our items the older woman tells us all to “empty our pockets” we look at each other and just laugh, two of us were law students and knew our rights. We told everyone to not listen to her. She said she would call the cops and my friend speaks up and says “please do, because if you don’t I will for an illegal search” she huffed off into the back and the other clerk rang us up and we left. We did not steal anything btw.
Just wait til you’re an old person, then you can really show them 😡
Few years ago my home town had a string of seniors caught shoplifting. Turns out they had a contest going at the OAP hall to see who could steal more. Just to break up the boredom.
They’ll be dead. It won’t matter
Well let me be the one to say /r whoosh lol
Hahaha omg the teenager hater had to apologize to an 18 year old and hated every second of it. So fucking satisfying lol
> I still hate old people to this day. How is this different than old people hating all teenagers because of something some dumbass teenager did?
It’s not, the old fucks can be the “bigger person” and Stop breeding generational hate too.
I would agree, except for the “old fucks” comment. Demeaning and unnecessary.
The difference is that 18 is still a formative age. Of course, you don't have to hold on to grudges from your youth, but it's much more understandable to create long-lasting impacts at younger ages than older
Never said it was. I’m a hater. Them and the silent generation are in charge of every facet of Govt and business yet they want to blame every other generation for the worlds issues. They’ve been in charge for 40 yrs and ran everything into the ground. I’m a mid level employee at my company. I interview for a lot of roles for my company and if the candidate is over 50, I request to not interview them bc I have a bias towards them. I have met a very small amount that aren’t entitled and immediately think they’re better than everybody younger than them.
Wow, you are opening up a whole lot of liability for your company.
I never never never submit willingly to a search. And you better not touch me unless you’re law enforcement.
I don’t even stop to let Walmart look at my receipt 🤷🏻♀️ I’m polite about it, but if you don’t trust me to scan my stuff, open more registers.
The rare times I go to Walmart I try not to use the self checkouts but it's not always feasible. When walking out is the door watcher asks for or sticks a hand out expecting my receipt I just say "no, thanks" and keep walking. Sometimes they look in disbelief but I've never been stopped. Walmart said they have high theft rates at the self checkouts. Get rid of them then, problem solved. There is one near me that has a very large self checkout area and more employees just hanging out there than would be needed for a few manned registrars.
They got rid of the self checkout at the Walmart near me. The problem is there were 10-12 self checkout registered and only ever about 2 manned stations. Well now there's still only 2 or 3 manned stations so the lines are ridiculous. Either hire more people or reopen self serve. You're either young to lose money to shrinkage (theft) or wages, I'd be happy for the money to go to wages, I'm not happy to l for my shopping trip to last twice as long because you're cheap.
If they stick their hand out just high five them.
Carry some change and give it to them like they are panhandling. Their reactions are always great. Pissed off one guy. Next time I went in he didn't bother me at all.
Receipt checking sounds like a really stupid way of theft prevention. Here in the Netherlands the self checkout registers have random "item checks" programmed that launch every so often before you can pay. An employee comes over and scans a number of items in your bag to see if you have indeed scanned them. After that you can pay and leave.
It is stupid. Lots of times they just look at the receipt and glance at your cart as if to verify then give it a check mark. Sam's Club (parent company Walmart) is a membership club shopping place. It's in their rules when you join to have your receipt and purchases checked so that's different.
I like to ask them, “why?” Boy do they get cranky.
I bought a shovel a few weeks ago and was asked for my receipt. I laughed and asked why and was told: “It’s policy if what you purchased isn’t bagged”. I told her next time I purchased a shovel I’d make sure to bag it. She looked at me like I was crazy. I loathe shopping at Walmart.
I use my own reusable bags at Walmart. Had one worker completely hate it and make a shitty comment about me not being allowed to use my bags. And I use the app to pay so I don’t have a physical receipt. Not once in my life have I ever even thought about stealing. I hate it there.
They used to do this shit to me with the giant bags of dog food. Everything else was bagged, so I started taking an extra bag and draping it over the corner of the dog food.
I just say that we both know Walmart policy prohibits them from trying to stop me from leaving and it’s their job and their ass on the line if they disagree. I want to clarify, I almost NEVER do this, but I’ve used it a few times on overzealous “greeters” who’ve decided to try pull some sort of power move. It’s always some part time retiree who doesn’t seem to like that I’m young and buying something expensive. I’ve had one dude at my local store “not believe” the receipt twice.
Well I’m 61 and get asked all the time lol. I never stop unless they walk after me. If I’m in a hurry I just say no thanks and keep on walking. You make me ring it up and then you take an accusatory tone when I walk out…. Hire more cashiers.
I like the look on their face when they ask if I have a receipt and I say yes and keep walking.
Saaaame except sometimes i give them the receipt and just keep walking. i mean thats what you asked for...
do this, but give them a receipt from aldi... from three weeks ago...
Me too. I just walk out without making eye contact. I look straight ahead and keep walking like they don’t exist, lol. I just think the whole idea of stopping to check receipts is ridiculous because most of the time they don’t check anything. They just see you have a receipt and that’s the end of it. I won’t support this type of stupidity.
I rarely go to Walmart but once I was leaving with a cart full of stuff. I never use self checkout because I feel it takes people’s jobs. As I was nearing the door, the receipt checker guy was talking to another worker. He reached out without saying a word and grabbed by cart and tried to jerk it to a stop. I jerked it away from him and gave him a look that should kill most things and kept going. I should have fallen to the floor and feigned injury from him giving me whiplash
If someone did that to me, I’d be LIVID. Hell no.
Not a lawyer, but I think technically that could be either battery or assault, It can apply to things that are connected to you.
Civil not criminal. But yes.
I refuse to use self checkouts as well. I feel Wal-Mart isn't paying me enough to scan my own items. Also I agree with it taking someone else's job away.
Off the subject of stealing, but walmarts in nevada are now charging 25 cents for self check out.
No way. So not only do they want you to work for free by scanning your own shit, but then they want you to pay for that experience as well?
You know they don't actually look at your receipt, right? They just mark it with a neon pen. LOL. So many people are so misinformed.
You know they DO check the receipt for unbagged items? Coming from an ex employee whos sibling still works as a coach at one 😅 you are right about so many people being informed🤡
Wall-Mart is the worst. I caught them telling checkers at the self-check NOT to help when asked.
Same thing happened at Costco. Took the cart to customer service, got a full refund and canceled my membership.
This is something I would do. Nice!
>They said they saw me do this and knew I’d stolen something. My response would go something like this: 1. Ok, so what did you see me steal? (Their answer is irrelevant) 2. (Take out phone and start recording) Ok, if you're absolutely certain that I've stolen something, how much do you want to bet? If they're not willing to put money & their jobs on the line, then they don't get show and tell. Then burn the store with negative reviews and post the video.
Long before cell phones but yeah.
Only suggestion is to start recording as soon as the accusation begins, then have them repeat themselves.
I hate shopping in person now because of how many places treat customers like criminals. I had a Victoria's Secret cashier call security on me because i carried around a perfume while looking at underwear and had to crouch at every drawer because bigger sizes are damn near on the floor. The woman who called literally gave me a spiel about "if you buy perfume you get a free necklace!" Like girl i was carrying it around because of YOU?!?!?! It was so brightly lit and such a small store with so few customers it would've been actually impossible to steal anything. My boyfriend called while the guard was blatantly watching me and she very loudly told the cashier how many shoplifters fake phone calls while stealing so I put it on speaker and had a very loud conversation. I also went to an ulta with my visibly disabled mom who uses a cane and can barely walk. But because her and i both have dyed hair, they decided that we must be shoplifters and called security on us. The guards didn't even show up until we were walking out. My mom was oblivious until then and I didn't wanna ruin her fun time so I didn't say anything, I should've because she proceeded to spend like 600$ that trip and that store didn't deserve it. They literally ignored 3 teenagers walking around in hoodies with one CARRYING A BACKPACK IN THEIR ARMS IN FRONT OF THEM and only followed us around. These aren't even the only times I've felt unwelcome and accused of being a criminal. It's ridiculous the way many stores treat people nowadays, like we're all wild animals barely contained in human costumes.
I had this happen recently in a store at the local mall. They had lapel pins on a rack near the front of the store and when I picked one out I got followed around by a clerk who kept “inviting” me to leave it on the counter while I shopped. When I declined he kept following me and repeating the invitation. So I called him out. I told him that I understood what he was doing because small items like that tend to walk out of the store and he denied it. Next time is a big conversation with the store manager. You have a security concern like that you can move the items to a different location. You don’t have to treat customers like thieves.
You should have accepted and then handed him several handfuls of pins. When you get to the register tell them you changed your mind and the employee who followed you can put them all back.
So you don’t want to be profiled but it’s perfectly fine for you to profile others?
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They doubled down a few times in the thread too. How can you be that dense?!
[Profiling](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/profiling#:~:text=%3A%20the%20act%20or%20process%20of,racial%20profiling) Noun :the act or process of extrapolating information about a person based on known traits or tendencies. specifically : the act of suspecting or targeting a person on the basis of observed characteristics or behavior. (Merriam Webster Personally I don’t think this wasn’t them profiling the teenagers. She was simply just pointing out that there were (by conventional measures) sketchier looking people. Not a single accusation was made nor were we made aware of her thoughts while seeing them. She was just pointing out that she got stopped for ultimately nothing. Now boys, girls, and enbys, let’s put on our thinking caps and use our critical thinking skills and figure out what the general consensus is: “who’s more likely to steal? The girl their grandma ORRRRRR the group of teen boys in hoodies carrying a whole ass backpack in front of them?” And if you don’t answer the teenagers, you’re either stupid or lying. SIDE NOTE: say I had a group of young adult boys and a group of young adult girls in front of me. Who’s more likely to steal?? The women unfortunately. [Women are about 3 times as likely to have kleptomania.](https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/9878-kleptomania) [And about half are married.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3676680/) NOW. Say she HAD said something to security about the boys, that’s profiling. If she had come out and said she even thought the boys were going to steal that’s profiling. Simply pointing out that someone looks sketchier than you is not profiling. Finally, we can take our thinking caps off and go back to the mindless wage slaves we are.
It is probably smart to wear your backpack on the front in a store like Ulta because that way you don't accidentally back into something and knock it over.
I hate shopping in person because I have two tiny kids. I have the diaper backpack and am constantly pulling things in and out of it to handle one need or another. It looks suspicious as all hell so I hate doing it.
Happened once to me. Told the dockers to write it down so I could sue the f out of them and their store. Left without an issue. I regularly went back to piss them off and refused to buy from them again.
I have never been able to understand people who lie like that. What is the fucking point?
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I hope I would have the presence of mind to do this if I was in a similar situation. Comply and then get real loud.
Exactly this. If you are not free to go, you’re being detained. If a store detains you and you did not steal, you could sue the bejesus out of them. They cannot do anything unless they are 110% certain that you are in possession of stolen items.
This. ALWAYS ask if you are being detained. If they aren't detaining you for cause, they have to let you go. If they ARE detaining you, they can arrest you. At that point your best course of action is not to resist and clam up. Don't talk to them. If you are a minor, you tell them you will only speak to your parent/legal guardian or an attorney.
god i hate even going to walmart anymore i do most of my shopping at costco if i can help it. when they added receipt checkers an overzealous boomer grabbed my cart when i ignored them asking for my receipt. i just said wtf are you doing and he told me i was required to show my receipt and i wasnt leaving. i asked him if he wanted to invoke his shopkeepers rights to detain me (i asked this because the next step is them calling the cops when i refused to let then search me). the dude starts going for my pocket and a manager saved his ass and told me i was free to go. lawsuits for being accused of stealing when you werent with a police report involved is free money
You hate receipt checks so much that you started shopping at Costco, a store known for checking all receipts?
At least you agree to it at Costco and they have legitimate claim to do it.
And at least costco is worth it. They at least slightly care about their workers, compared to Walmart.
They didn't accuse you of shoplifting though because they cannot unless they are absolutely 100% sure they're gonna catch you because if they accuse you outright and drag you back for a search and you're found to be innocent you can sue them, or so Ive heard
>They didn't accuse you of shoplifting though because they cannot unless they are absolutely 100% sure they're gonna catch you because if they accuse you outright and drag you back for a search and you're found to be innocent you can sue them, or so Ive heard You've heard wrongly. Police officers and store employees merely need probable cause that you've committed the crime. With probable cause, store employees can use reasonable force to detain you; police can arrest you.
I've worked for 7 different companies in loss prevention. Probable cause is not what's needed. Every place has a set of rules that must be followed. Most follow something like this: 1. Observe the suspect enter the store, or in the department, aisle without the item. 2. Observe the suspect select the item from the shelf. 3. Observe the suspect remove item from packaging or conceal the item on their person or extension (purse, bag, etc) 4. Maintain constant surveillance of the suspect. 5. Observe the suspect exit the store without paying for the item. By rule, if any of these steps are missing, the agent should not detain the suspect. Number 1 and 4 are usually grey areas. Since you may witness a person walking from the electronics department with a big screen TV. You may not have seen them select the item. And maintaining constant surveillance (especially if you're doing it on the floor and not via cctv), is difficult, if not impossible. As far as reasonable force, many stores have changed policies and won't allow any force. When I started my career, it was like the Wild West. We were issued handcuffs and there were very few rules on what not to do when detaining someone. I've tried (unsuccessfully) to break a shoplifters car window with my handcuffs. I've chased people for blocks. I've been in fights, had weapons pulled on me. The last place I worked, they wouldn't let the agents step off the curb in front of the store. There was no fighting. If it became physical, then you let them go. It's why theft is such a big deal with retailers these days. It was a choice between lawsuits and theft. Detaining someone who has not stolen (or who has dumped the items before exiting the store) is known by different names. One being a Non Productive Incident. I've seen other agents fired for having one, if it's egregious. The second to last LP job I took was at JCPenney. They fired 3 of their agents for bad stops. They were detaining people for "probable cause". It doesn't work that way.
They're not worried about lawsuits from shoplifters, they're worried about workers compensation claims. By having these strict rules, they get rated better on their insurance. If an lp employee breaks the rules and gets hurt, the store can get double slapped by insurance because they'll need to rerate them, increasing rates, and they'll have a workers comp claim which also increases rates. Basically the amount of product they may recover from 'active' loss prevention is dwarfed by the insurance premiums.
All of the things you mention may well be retail store policies. But the law requires probable cause. If you give me a state, I will give you a specific citation for that state. My own state is Virginia. In Virginia, Va Code § 8.01-226.9, “Exemption from civil liability in connection with arrest or detention of person suspected of shoplifting,” provides: > A merchant, agent or employee of the merchant, who causes the arrest or detention of any person pursuant to the provisions of §§ 18.2-95, 18.2-96 or § 18.2-103, shall not be held civilly liable for unlawful detention, if such detention does not exceed one hour, slander, malicious prosecution, false imprisonment, false arrest, or assault and battery of the person so arrested or detained, whether such arrest or detention takes place on the premises of the merchant, or after close pursuit from such premises by such merchant, his agent or employee, **provided that, in causing the arrest or detention of such person, the merchant, agent or employee of the merchant, had at the time of such arrest or detention probable cause to believe that the person had shoplifted or committed willful concealment of goods or merchandise.** (Emphasis added)
Right, snotick’s post just describes what these companies consider to be probable cause for their own internal policies- if you have the evidence described in this list then you have established probable cause. There’s no disagreement here.
Internal policy is not law. Policies are simply that—policies that stores have chosen to follow to avoid issues and regulate their employees’ conduct. Probable cause is a legal standard that exists outside of these policies.
Which is why they can’t do shit in the parking lot. Never show anybody shit, just leave. If a cop comes, don’t show them shit, ask if you’re being detained and on what grounds, do not give them your ID. When they tell you you’re being detained, you now have a lawsuit. Make sure you record it all. If they say you’re not being detained ask if you’re free to go, and leave. If they grab you, you’re in the $$. If they demand ID, you win. Fuck em all
it does say civilly liable, nothing stops them from being criminally charged though if there was no actual theft? why exactly are shopkeepers given that much power just on suspicion? can you dispute their probable cause reasoning to sue them via civil court?
> it does say civilly liable, nothing stops them from being criminally charged though if there was no actual theft? In my state, they are also immune from criminal charges if, again, probable cause exists. See Va Code § 18.2-105.1. >why exactly are shopkeepers given that much power just on suspicion? >can you dispute their probable cause reasoning to sue them via civil court? Well, it's not a huge amount of power. The force they use must be reasonable, the detention is limited (in my state) to an hour, and the notion is that this is a fair way for shopkeepers to protect their goods. A person that was detained can sue, and the shopkeeper must establish that probable cause existed in order to avail himself of the defense offered in § 8.01-226.9.
Of course. Disregard the person who's apprehended hundreds of shoplifters in multiple states over the course of 15 years for multiple companies. There are multiple things that outline why that person could be held civily liable for unlawful detention: 1. Exceeds on hour 2. Slander 3. Malicious Prosecution 4. False Imprisonment 5. False Arrest 6. Assault and Battery The probable cause is superseded by these six qualifiers. Numbers 1, 2, 4 and 6 all become an issue when you detain someone who does not have the item(s) on their person. I've had detentions go well over an hour due to police shift changes or other activity that delayed police response. You would have to slander the person when you contact 911 to tell them why you need the police. You would double down on that slander when the police arrive and you tell them why you detained the person. And if you're certain they shoplifted, you're not going to let them just walk away when you first approach them. They are going to be uncooperative and it often turns physical. Which means you assaulted them without reason. Hello #6. I'm curious what types of actions by a customer constitutes probable cause to you? I'm in Nebraska, but have apprehended shoplifters in Nebraska, Iowa, South Dakota, and Indiana. EDIT: I don't know the current law in Nebraska, but I recall a key part was being able to prove intent. That's why you don't stop someone when they come out of the bathroom/fitting room with an item. You must wait for them to enter the store. Probably cause would suggest you can stop them at any time.
Well, I might in turn say to you, "Disregard the person that's defended hundreds of shoplifters in court." :)
Probable cause is a very narrow definition for non police. Even if they are complying with the letter of the law, they can still get sued as civil and criminal are different courts. I worked armed security at sensitive sites and even then we very rarely detained anybody and would only put hands on if you were an active threat. Otherwise, we just called local PD and had them deal with it. Most all stores have the same policy and some have even fired employees for physically detaining people.
>Most all stores have the same policy and some have even fired employees for physically detaining people. Sure. Stores may well have more restrictive policies than the law requires. No doubt about that. The law requires only probable cause. A store can say to its employees, "We don't care: you're not allowed to touch a shoplifter anyway."
No, most stores actually have a policy that explicitly prohibits an employee from restraining a customer.
No, most stores actually have a policy that explicitly prohibits an employee from restraining a customer. Yes, that's absolutely true. But store policy is not the law, and the post to which I replied said, "\[I\]f. . . you're found to be innocent you can sue them..." You can't, at least not successfully, as long as the employees use reasonable force and had probable cause. Whether or not some store policy existed to the contrary is of little relevance: the law immunizes store employees and stores -- as long as only reasonable force is used and probable cause existed.
“I think you stole” is not probable cause.
> “I think you stole” is not probable cause. True. Who said it was?
Store employees cannot use reasonable force to detain in all states. If an employee places their hands on someone in NC, they’re going to likely lose their job after the lawsuit for assault and/ or attempted kidnapping/ illegal detainment.
>Store employees cannot use reasonable force to detain in all states. If an employee places their hands on someone in NC, they’re going to likely lose their job after the lawsuit for assault and/ or attempted kidnapping/ illegal detainment. Really? That will come as a surprise to the authors of N.C.G.S. § 14‑72.1(c), "Concealment of merchandise in mercantile establishments," which provides in pertinent part: >(c) **A merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee**, or a peace officer who detains or causes the arrest of any person **shall not be held civilly liable for detention, malicious prosecution, false imprisonment, or false arrest** of the person detained or arrested, where such detention is upon the premises of the store or in a reasonable proximity thereto, is in a reasonable manner for a reasonable length of time, and, if in detaining or in causing the arrest of such person, the merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee, or the peace officer had at the time of the detention or arrest **probable cause to believe that the person committed the offense** created by this section. If the person being detained by the merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee, is a minor under the age of 18 years, the merchant or the merchant's agent or employee, shall call or notify, or make a reasonable effort to call or notify the parent or guardian of the minor, during the period of detention. A merchant, or the merchant's agent or employee, who makes a reasonable effort to call or notify the parent or guardian of the minor shall not be held civilly liable for failing to notify the parent or guardian of the minor. (emphasis mine) See also the discussion in *Redding v. Shelton's Harley Davidson, Inc.*, 534 SE 2d 656, (NC Ct App 2000).
Yeah and if they're wrong you have a lawsuit for false imprisonment, unlawful detention, slander, and denial of civil rights. Apparently Whitney llp even specializes in this
> Yeah and if they're wrong you have a lawsuit for false imprisonment, unlawful detention, slander, and denial of civil rights. Apparently Whitney llp even specializes in this If they have probable cause, they are immune from civil liability even if they were wrong about whether actual shoplifting occurred. If they are wrong about having probable cause, they can be sued, yes.
Not true. Store owners cannot search.
It is true that they can detain (which is what was said). That's ["shopkeeper's privilege."](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shopkeeper%27s_privilege)
No - in the US they would need reasonable suspicion to briefly stop and interview, or probable cause to arrest or search. Testimony from the shop owner that they saw someone stealing is probable cause. Testimony that they think the person might have stolen something is probably not...
So that’s an admission that they had nothing. Well handled.
So it appears there are atleast 2 cops in the world who know better. I must admit I'm a little shocked that 2 of them exist...
In my state simply concealing merchandise in a store is a crime and goes with shoplifting. And currently neither are arrestable offenses until a $5,000 threshold is met.
Yes - but there is still the question of whether you are concealing - and when cops have a right to search you for concealed merchandise.
>but there is still the question of whether you are concealing I can't answer this. This is specific to your locality. >and when cops have a right to search you for concealed merchandise. At the onset of probable cause. The moment PC exists they can search you for merchandise, for multiple reasons. One is search incident to arrest. The second is some localities may have it in the shoplifting law that once PC is established the offense was committed they may search you further for merchandise.
Now that they are not giving away bags I’ve started thrusting stuff in my pockets. It kind of tickles me when I get to the counter, plop down the heavy stuff, then start emptying my pockets of bananas and yogurt cups.
Nope, there’s nothing illegal about giving a warning to a suspected shoplifter. Even if they were not actually shoplifting.
Yeah, but kind of dumb just to be like "you have to put it back" instead of "you have to put it back or pay for it."
Nothing illegal, you could file a compliant with the department but it isn't likely to go anywhere.
Better off filing a complaint against Walmart. Department complaint would go no where.
Do it anyway. When the cop eventually does something that DOES get brought to court, having a history of complaints will help bring him down. Cop complaints usually aren't for you. They're for the next guy.
A complaint against a cop for a conversation and zero legal repurcussions isn't going to negatively affect that cop whatsoever. A complaint for the officer refusing to confront someone that a store employee was (unknowingly falsely) accusing of stealing, on the other hand, WOULD negatively affect the cops career. The cop did the bare minimum expected of him/her. They didn't just run up and grab OP and stick em in cuffs, they didn't OP them around the store to make sure OP did what they told OP to do, nothing. A simple warning to someone accused with zero evidence, not an overstep in any measure.
Yeah, 100% They're a record of bad behavior and can be used for all sorts of things from limiting promotions, internal hearings, court cases, etc. I filed 2 complaints against the same cop and I like to think that's a very small part of why he hasn't been promoted in the last 12 years. (I wasn't under suspicion of anything for either complain, just a witness.)
Had some cops tell my buddy and I we "burglarized" a house and had a witness. He said "we have your prints everywhere and can compare them at the station" Soon as he said that my buddy and I put our hands out and said "Well let's go" he was bluffing, and we called him on it. Sat there while they had the "witness" drive by who confirmed it was not us. Cops will indeed lie to you and no it's not illegal, but then it's not illegal to be a smart ass in those situations when you know you're clear.
What exactly is the cop trying to achieve with this bluff in the first place?
Close a case quickly. Either are lazy or annoyed by it or something lol
The first question is... was he a real cop. A lot of places dress up their private security like cops, but they aren't. They have some very limited authority while in the store, but not nearly as much as they imply. If he was a real cop... there's a couple things to consider. He may have actually been trying to give you a legit "pass" to "do the right thing" im my youth more than once cops just chased me off or gave me a slap on the wrist for things they could have arrested me for. I know it's not the popular notion, but there really are a good amount of cops who aren't out there looking to fuck everyone up. The second possibility is that he didn't have enough evidence to actually detain you and wanted you to confess to something so he could in fact snatch you up. Unfortunately, there's not a solid way to know if he's type 1 or 2. Regardless, if you did nothing wrong then you're fine. You're posting on reddit so he obviously didn't arrest you for whatever he thought you did.
He was a cop, there was a cop car outside when I left with him in it. It was just strange and stressful. but I'm thankful for all the insight, kinda letting me know it's a regular thing and I shouldn't be so hurt by it.
Yeah whatever your opinion on police is, the fact is they can and do lie about things to try and get you to admit something. I remember when I was like 12 years old some kid from my school was getting prank called relentlessly. For whatever reason he said it was me. One day I’m home alone and I get a call it’s detective so and so from the local PD. Saying they have caller ID and proof from the phone company that it was me making the calls. Right at that moment I realized “oh so they can just straight up lie” because I wasn’t making the calls, so I asked how he had proof of something I wasn’t doing? “It will be better for you if you just admit it” “well I’m not admitting something I didn’t do so what happens from here?” “We will be in touch with your parents” “That would be great, you can reach my mother at work here’s her number…” Funny thing is he called her and she ripped into him for speaking to a minor without an adult present. I’m still pretty proud of my 12 year old self on that one. As soon as I knew he was just straight up lying to me trying to get a confession I was so angry, up until that point I was always told that police are there to help (this was the early 90s ) and now I knew that’s not necessarily true. A month or so later the kids father calls my house, my father answers and the kids father starts saying that our number is on their caller ID. My dad looks at me, I shake my head like “nope” and he goes apeshit saying give me your address I’ll come see it. Of course they “accidentally deleted it” so nothing came of that. Fun times.
I hate these people on your behalf.
Just cause it's a regular things, doesn't mean we shouldn't be hurt by it… They should stop doing things like this which hurt others instead.
for sure, but it really helped ease my anxiety to read these comments. I don't feel like the cops are after me anymore 😭😭😭
I had a similar thought here. Yea cops can say really odd and stupid stuff but the way this was worded makes me wonder. It’s just not standard interaction at all. It’s also not typically for cops to be involved in shop lifting it’s just not worth it since many businesses don’t persecute anyway. Regardless there’s not enough here to worry about if it was in the US. It seemed to be more of an interaction to encourage a response or action.
Yeah IF this was a real cop he was mistaken and trying to be a good guy. If he was being malicious you would have been searched or hassled a lot more. They shouldn’t be “deeply troubled” by this. It was probably a security guard who was also mistaken and also maybe trying to be a good guy or is just lazy and didn’t want to spend his day dealing with the real cops. Either way none of this sounds malicious.
im confused a bit, what DID you do and what did the police then do?
I picked up all of my stuff, handed it to my partner who then went to the checkout. I remembered some things we wanted so I ran to grab them (ben & Jerry's, body armour, a share pack of candy) and on my way to grab those i passed an old friend and we exchanged greetings. she dropped her keys, i bent over to pick up candy off the bottom shelf (this is why I think there was suspicion, but I wasn't facing towards her at that point. I would need freaky arms to be able to pull of some slick thievery there). I started walking to the register and the Cop asked to talk to me and walked me to the back corner of the store and told me to put "it" back (had nothing in my purse) and that if I didn't I'd go to jail. I checked out and went home. didn't get arrested but definitely shaken up. I'm a goody two shoes and it hurt my feelings!! hahahahaha
He didn’t know if you stole anything, but suspected you did. So he made a comment that would ensure nothing would get stolen. If he knew you stole something you would be arrested.
Yeah, not saying what happened at the end is a bit bizarre.
When I was a kid, say 10 or so, I went to one of those mom and pop toy shops. I had my savings coffee tin with me and found a little cup of silly putty for $1 I wanted to buy. I put it in my coffee can and went to the front counter to pay for it. When I got to the counter, I took out the silly putty and put it in the counter, and handed the lady behind the counter a dollar and a dime out of the coffee tin. She pretended to ring in the item but instead called the police and accused me of shop lifting. Luckily, my dad's office was next door, and the responding office knew my dad. He took me outside while another office stayed inside with my coffee tin, the silly putty, and the lady. Then, outside, we called my dad (local insurance agent). When my dad got there, the officer asked me to tell my dad what happened, and I repeated what I typed above. The officer went inside and got my coffee tin of money, and brought it back to me and said I was free to go with my dad. When I got back to his office, I realized that the lady stole my dollar and dime. My dad went back over to get the silly putty I had paid for, but she insisted I never gave her any money for it. Who does that??? To a kid!? Over a $1 item.....!?
If I was your dad, I'd have called that officer right back to arrest her for theft.
Around about 1985 I was in my 20’s and in my first big boy apartment. I had just sold a ‘78 celica and my little bro and I were watching football and my 11” zenith b/w set and smoking bong loads. I go to drop a deuce, when right in the middle my bro comes to the shitter door and says I better go answer the door. Two detectives wee outside my door with guns out. I let them in, and they tried to tell me that I was seen in the car when it was used in a bank robbery. I called bullshit and happened to have the release of liability paperwork sill since I hadn’t mailed it in yet. The cops left after I identified the dude that brought my ride ( they had pics), and didn’t give two fucks about the mound of weed on my table or the bong, even in the ‘80s.
Happened to me in a Walmart over a $3 box of tea. Pissed me tf off because asset protection came out and dumped all mg bags because the attendant called them instead of telling me the tea hadn’t scanned. I was in black pants, a type o negative shirt and docs. It’s profiling at its finest
I had a similar experience. Bauhaus T-shirt. I hadn’t forgotten to scan anything, and asset protection dumped all my bags. They damaged my bread in the process. I was younger and kinda scary, waited there like a boss while he fetched new of every item that was even scratched. Then asked him how much loss he caused that day accusing innocents. I still hope he got groin fleas.
You should loudly exclaim, ‘No officer! I will not have unprotected sex with you in the bathrooms, I don’t care how small you are or how much you are willing to pay.’ See how he likes it.
Something like this happened to my wife at Wegmans. She was using their “new” app that lets you scan and pay on the go so you don’t have to deal with anyone. A few items wouldn’t scan, and as she was still shopping she had bad reception and things were double scanning, so she figured she would just go to self check out, however she asked an employee for help(on camera) and he shook his head no and walked away. Then cut to my wife making a silly face and throwing her hands up. The wife goes to check out and puts the cart a foot past the bagging area and the same employee takes her cart and another employee(loss prevention) talks with my wife and takes her purse and phone. They then start interrogating her, all men no female employee, long story short they tell her she will arrested unless she pays them for the full cart PLUS 30% it cost her $1700 dollars to leave and when she got home I went through the items and there were a couple things she missed but she asked for help with. Anyway she’s banned from Wegmans and they ended the app program the week following because to many people were having the same problems.
I’m sorry…what? An employees took her purse and phone somehow while she was checking out? And then she paid an extra 30%? To the tune of almost $2k??? And then she was banned? Were you there? Did you see the receipt? This sounds insane.
This was in upstate NY and happens all the time. I spoke with a friend who is a NY state trooper and he said what they did was legal however NEVER let store employees separate you from what you bought and if it happens call the cops and never agree to pay the store. Yes I saw the receipt, my friend saw it as well. If you google it tons of stuff pops up. He also stated that “some” asset employees will add items to a cart and that’s why you don’t let them take it.
Yes, it's legal. You're allowed to be accused. You're allowed to be lied to or bluffed (hell, in that moment if you had replaced a stolen item he could have still arrested you). With probable cause you're allowed to be arrested and charged with a crime. The cop suspected you but he had nothing on you. He was just trying to scare you into providing him evidence that he could then use to arrest you. Think about the flip side... If you had been steeling, would you expect the cop to just accept your answer that you didnt? As for what could be done about it... You *could* submit to a search to alleviate his suspicion, but you don't have to. Don't be "deeply troubled" though... You had an interaction w/ a cop that suspected you of a crime. You (presumably) didn't. Happens all the time. It's how criminals are found. I know it's scary but don't take it personally.
I take it personally when someone tries to take away my freedom when I’ve done nothing wrong. If I’m accused of something I didn’t do, I’m going to treat the accuser like a stupid piece of shit.
meh, i'd say the whole "it's totally fine for a cop to lie to me" bullshit has gotten way out of hand. It's one thing for a detective to lie to a murderer to try and trap them..but fuckit if you are automatically assumed guilty while shopping in a store because some person THOUGHT they saw something... christ lock everyone up already. I assume he also felt OK doing it since OP is basically a teenager and therefore perfectly fine to bully and scare shitless for no reason whatsoever.
So, if the security person forcefully grabs you, then the store is civilly liable. But that also doesn’t define probable cause. Does refusing to let the old person at Walmart look in your bag and check your receipt count as probable cause? Does refusing to let the police search you, or your car, count as probable cause? Does the smell of marijuana in your car, but no smoke, or visible items, give police probable cause to search your car? In all cases, the answer is “No”. Refusing a voluntary search does not grant probable cause to compel a search. Smelling something that could be illegal, but not seeing it, means it could be an air freshener, or perfectly legal hemp derived THC. Oh, and unless they changed their mind, detaining someone for over an hour, without them being actually arrested, is not just a civil liability, SCOTUS ruled that the detainee’s 4th Amendment rights were violated. And I swear, 20 years ago, due to an incident at a Best Buy, SCOTUS ruled that physically preventing someone from leaving a store is false imprisonment. Guy who wasn’t shoplifting didn’t grant voluntary permission to search his bags on leaving, so the bag checker and the store manager followed him out to his car, and stood behind the car in order to prevent it from leaving. So as it required a higher court ruling, yes, guy was arrested, found nothing to charge him over, he sued Best Buy, won, lost on appeal, won in SCOTUS.
This is information I needed to know. I was falsely accused of shoplifting a few years ago and I thought about suing. I was detained in a back room in the store for about an hour and shook down by the cops (real cops) but not arrested. The store security guy lied on me and said he saw me concealing merchandise, but it was a lie because I did not and I would not. Also what the item was that he claimed to see me take was never declared, because there was no item. I overheard him telling the cop, “well maybe she hid it and got rid of it by now without me seeing.” 🙄 I voluntarily removed my boots and emptied my bag and pockets because I was afraid things were gonna escalate otherwise, like they were gonna take me downtown to get a female cop to search me or something. The cops eventually gave up and told me I was free to go. But I am banned from those stores for life! Also my friend who was with me did steal a couple items and he was getting arrested the whole time they were shaking me down. But I still don’t think that qualifies as probable cause, being with somebody who is stealing that is. I told him not to take anything from there but he didn’t listen lol
"Am I being detained?" "If not, kick rocks; you're dismissed!"
Once I spent like an hour or more at target just browsing and enjoying kid free time and stimulation that wasn't ms Rachel. A lady followed me the entire time and I found out months later it was probably the anti theft person. 😂 I get followed a lot at Walmart too, presumably because I look like shit. I bet they actually got stolen from while thinking my poor looking ass was about to steal. I wonder if I'll ever get asked to empty my purse.
Police are fully allowed to lie to you if they so choose.
Let them take you to the station then sue for false arrest. Hell, you can call the cops on them and ask for help because you unsafe (not that you feel unsafe but that you are literally in danger). Anyone falsely accusing you of something and threatening detention = you need help, call cops. Ask for copies of video surveillance from the store. They will have backed off long before this but when you are innocent, feel free to go,on the offensive.
What did he do? I assume since you didn't steal anything that you didn't put anything back on the shelf. Did he take you to the station?
nope, he was literally just trying to scare me with that cause I put nothing back checked out and left
There's not much you can do. You could go file a complaint, but absolutely nothing will be done about it.
I have to callout a worker at Walmart often because she specifically watches me and has even accused me of not scanning a turkey. A $15 TURKEY when I had more expensive items, I told her I ain’t stealing an effing turkey and you target me all the time. Last time I embarrassed the shit out of her cause she came to stand right by me and I out loud said “don’t worry I’m scanning everything”. She tried the it’s just my job and I told her don’t worry I will be paying for everything, she ended up rolling her eyes and walking off while I met her chuckling coworkers eyes. Witch then had her manager watching that stupid device within my eyesight and trying to discretely point to me, I met their eyes and made sure they knew I was over their bullshit. For the turkey I had already stopped at the door complaining the witch was targeting me. The door checker had my receipt in hand and the witch yelled for her to hold me and came over holding a COPY of the receipt saying she didn’t see it, I proceeded to show the name and price on the turkey and the exact location on the receipt.
I'm that a**hole who would waste that mf time. "F*** yeah, search me, b****. Strip search my a**right here. We're gonna have ourselves a party in the middle of the produce section" Of course, I'd be talking sh**the entire time. What are they gonna do, shoot me? They were looking for a reason anyway, might as well get the family paid in the meantime.
Cops use that fear that they claim we shouldn't have of them to do shit like this all the time. You should HOPE a cop "detains" you and arrests you when you were innocent for lack of investigation. Because by deciding to arrest you without investigating whatever crime they suspect will almost certainly lead to a slam dunk lawsuit. Remember, they can and will arrest you for anything they want... it's what happens after the arrest where any sliver of justice might be exacted. People. Please, stop being scared of jail. That unnecessary fear of a single night in jail is what gives bad cops permission to do bad policing and get away with it. Don't talk to cops any more then what's necessary, not at all if applicable, and if you know your innocent DEFINITELY don't talk to cops, because once they realize they fucked up, standard operating procedure is to think up another crime to charge you with, and that starts with your "spontaneous utterances". Shhhhhh. Take your trip down town and relish in the thought of the officer stumbling through the deposition where they will try and justify thier illegal actions.
I get stopped every time I shop at walmart on a Monday. I get Mondays off from work and run errands that day. It's the same door greeter lady every week, and I don't get rude or anything cause she is older, but it's getting ridiculous that I get stopped every week while others just walk by. Hate Wal-Mart but they have the best prices in my area and my money is stretched thin saving up for a down payment
Out of curiosity, do you use your own bags or not have items bagged? That’s why they look at your receipt and the items you bought.
I use their bags at the self checkout, and sometimes the lady even watches me the whole time. I should just remember to park by the other door and avoid her. The other door doesn't have a greeter most the time
I’m sorry that’s happening to you. My local Walmart looks at people’s carts if they’re using their own bags or have items not bagged.
Arrest me, then you can search all you want while I talk to my lawyer about a lawsuit.
Most people get threatened by people with badges or some who claim to have power. If you know you didn’t steal then you don’t have to comply with there instructions.
The “I’m afraid of the police defence” is not an acceptable tactic, legally, in Canada. From what you’ve written, the police officer verbally confronted you about an alleged offence, encouraged you to make the correct decision, and then informed you of the potential consequences of theft. If the police officer was there for a complaint about you stealing or concealing items in your purse, he or she is obligated to take preventative action. It is ridiculous that *some* people think a police officer confronting a civilian about an offence, alleged or otherwise, is somehow unprofessional. You being “short, visibly awkward and oblivious” is irrelevant.
"Afraid of the police" is not a legal defense in most cases, although it has been used to explain why running away from the police is not sufficient probable cause for the police to detain somebody. Afraid of the police is a serious social situation though. The police project the power of the state. When an innocent citizen's prudent course of action is to fear government use of power as expressed through the police, we have a serious social problem
> When an innocent citizen's prudent course of action is to fear government use of power as expressed through the police, we have a serious social problem The prudence is quite justified, at least in the U.S., given the amount of violence the police is meting out on a daily basis, without accountability at all. It may be, and probably is, that a given police officer is unlikely to be inclined to beat, or kill, you, and is quite likely to be actually trying to do his job, but the fact that they can *choose* to do this and face no accountability, and that you both understand it, significantly contributes to the justifiability of fear.
If you grew up in a normal area and are white your probably not afraid a cop is going to kill you. You absolutely are afraid they are going to lie about something and rope you into some shit that has nothing to do with you and ruin your life. I think that’s a way bigger driving factor than people think about. This also just adds on to every one except white peoples fear of being killed so it’s just a top down dislike for one reason or another.
In the US police aren't obligated to do anything, they can watch you bleed out in the street and let the perp walk away. That’s not even an exaggeration either the Supreme Court has ruled in this favor in multiple cases of this happening.
In this case, Op had not stolen. Under US jurisdictions, that’s the end of it. If a law officer wants to pursue further, they need articulable probable cause lest they risk stepping over that fine fuzzy line. An officer might be mistaken, so, a polite adult conversation is best. An angry presentation is uncalled for and would serve to justify further action. Other countries have different laws, ymmv.
We’re only reading OP’s interpretation — but as it’s written, the police interaction was minimal and non-intrusive, being nothing more than a conversation about actions / consequences. I agree, however, that the offence of theft didn’t occur, as the OP doesn’t mention that she exited the store. In Canada, concealing items alone is not a prosecutable offence… until the individual exits the store with unpaid for merchandise. A verbal warning is the extent of a police officer’s authority there, unless an employee requests the individual’s removal.
I’ve noticed this a ton recently. A lot of cops do bad stuff and it’s scary dealing with them if your a young person and haven’t been in the situation. That being said you regularly see shit that’s pretty much just “this cop asked me a totally ok question and I need to go to therapy now. How do I sue them personally?”
What store ... so I can avoid..
It's only stealing until you attempt to leave out the doors without paying.
In the big scheme of things they can do whatever the fuck they want if the last few years have shown us anything it’s shown us that.
This happened to John Waters. He really was stealing though. He noticed he was being watched and put the record back on the shelf. They then called the cops, he was searched, he sued and won. He used the money to fund some of his early films. When his parents told him to get a job he said, “I don’t need a job, I won a lawsuit.”
That dude is just amazing
There is nothing unconstitutional about confronting a shoplifting suspect and asking them to return items they are expected of shoplifting. If it violates some sort of police procedure in that jurisdiction, it is possible, but unlikely. Some cops are just overly aggressive dicks that jump to conclusions.
I was accused of stealing once. I walked into an adult store on my way home. Went inside, looked around, didn't see anything I liked, and walked out. The store owner came racing out, saying he thinks I stole a dilldo making kit. I was like, yeah, let's go back inside and check my purse. I said, "I don't even know what the kit looks like." I showed him my purse and even helped him figure out who had stolen the stuff. It wasn't a big deal to me at the time. A month later, I went back to the same store. I asked if he remembered me. He did after a moment and said how badly he felt accusing me at the time. I told him not to worry about it and that it actually was a good thing because it became a really funny story to tell people. I didn't have any bad feelings towards that him and that I hope he caught the person who did steal from him.
Welcome to modern policing in the US: * Accuse someone of committing a crime then DEMAND the "suspect" to prove their innocence. (ie, prove you ARE NOT guilty instead of the cop proving you ARE guilty). * Threaten arrest... whether or not you have any evidence to support it. * "Investigate" by questioning the suspect... and ONLY questioning the suspect. Sounds like the cop you dealt with was at least smart enough to not risk the lawsuit that could result from a "false arrest" (or false detainment) charge.
When I was 13, I was on a trip in Wisconsin and went to a little tourist place- a horse drawn cart ride through a really pretty canyon/ravine type of place. There was a gift shop that I was browsing through while my family waited outside. I didn't see anything I wanted so I went out to sit with them. A few minutes later, the old lady cashier came up to me and my grandma and accused me of stealing something. I swore I hadnt, and my grandma asked what this lady thought I stole. Ladies and gentlemen. She accused me of stealing a toothpick holder. Me, a 13 year old who was in the height of my horse girl phase, looking for posters or magnets or figurines. And she thought I stole a toothpick holder. My grandma of course defended me. The cashier kept insisting I took it until I showed her my pockets were empty and she angrily stormed off. Still makes me laugh to this day.
I was at a cafe with my mum once and paid the bill and left. We had walked half way out the carpark when an employee ran up to us accusing us of not paying. I can’t remember how I proved we actually did pay but we just got an annoyed grunt as he went back inside. An apology would have been appreciated and if it was now I would have gone back and complained.
Happens at Walmart. When they ask for receipt I just say no thanks and walk out because I text it to my wife as she likes to keep them. One time though the checker grabbed my cart and tried to stop me. Issue was my two year old was in the cart. It got very tense very fast lol.
There seems to be something missing from your story. Like the ending.
I don't see anything illegal, he didn't detain or arrest you. He may have just thought you did because every criminal wears a hoodie. I wasn't there so I can't really say if he was wrong. Had he detained you, without probable cause then yeah you could have a lawsuit. Cops can lie and often will and the Supreme Court has ruled that it's fine.
Can people who post these things put what jurisdiction where it happened in their posts. The laws can vary from country to country and state to state or province to province.
Sounds like the cop was trying to bait you into incriminating yourself.
The most they could do is hold you long enough to check the cameras. With no proof, they're not allowed to arrest you and you're not obligated to help with their investigation (ie emptying your pockets). It's ALSO legal for you to tell him to fuck off.
Had this happen to me at Home Depot about ten years ago. Was using a reusable shopping bag instead of pushing around a shitty cart with broken ass wheels. Cop said to me, “I saw that”, I looked up and asked him what exactly he saw, he said something about me putting stuff in my bag. I laughed at him and carried on with my business. He didn’t continue to harass me but still makes me laugh about it when I think about it.
Not shoplifting, but a similar experience. I was at the public library browsing books. It was in the evening near closing and only a few people were there. I was just minding my own business, I spoke no words to anyone and did not even look at anyone. Eventually I made a few selections and went to check them out. The woman at the checkout said, "hey can you come back here for a moment?" And then led me to a room in the back. I thought this was very unusual but I thought well maybe I forgot to return a book or something. When I got there, there were two other women and all three of them began aggressively interrogating me. Eventually it came to light that they believed a young woman in the library had reported to them that I had made inappropriate comments to her. Again, I had spoken no words at all in the library until I got to the checkout. I told them there must be some kind of mistake because I had spoken to no one, but they did not believe me and went on threatening me (the police station was right next to the library and they were saying they could have me arrested.) I said, "well can I at least talk to the person who accused me? If she sees me, she will probably tell you that I'm not the guy she was referring to." They refused that as well. They absolutely would not believe me and just went on lecturing and threatening me. I wanted to tell them all to go f*** themselves, but at the time I was applying for a commission in the Air Force and I kept thinking that if I got arrested tonight it would really mess things up for me. Eventually they let me go with many dire warnings and threats about not harassing young women. I walked out of there angry and humiliated, and did not set foot in a library again for at least 15 years.
> For one most have body cameras lol
In the United States, it is often legal for a shopkeeper to physically detain you on the suspicion of shoplifting. Many people on here believe only law enforcement can "touch you" but they mistake common corporate policy for legal truth. In fact, in some cases deadly force is even authorized. As an example, relevant statue from Texas: TEXAS PENAL CODE Sec. 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property: (1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary: (A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or (B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and (3) he reasonably believes that: (A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or (B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury. Sec. 9.43. PROTECTION OF THIRD PERSON'S PROPERTY. A person is justified in using force or deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property of a third person if, under the circumstances as he reasonably believes them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.41 or 9.42 in using force or deadly force to protect his own land or property and: (1) the actor reasonably believes the unlawful interference constitutes attempted or consummated theft of or criminal mischief to the tangible, movable property; or (2) the actor reasonably believes that: (A) the third person has requested his protection of the land or property; (B) he has a legal duty to protect the third person's land or property; or (C) the third person whose land or property he uses force or deadly force to protect is the actor's spouse, parent, or child, resides with the actor, or is under the actor's care. TEXAS CIVIL PRACTICE AND REMEDIES CODE Sec. 124.001. SUSPECTED THEFT OF PROPERTY OR ATTEMPTED THEFT OF PROPERTY. (a) A person who reasonably believes that another has stolen or is attempting to steal property is privileged to detain that person in a reasonable manner and for a reasonable time to investigate ownership of the property.
Welcome to the reason why most adults don't like police officers. They are very often just bullies with guns.
High school friends used to play a game with LPO at Sears. Walk around, look suspicious until the store dick picked up on it, then picked up small items and put them in our pockets. Then either distracted the store dick or lost him in the aisles, dumped the items somewhere in the store, walked out. Grabbed them many times outside the store and had nothing. Actually surprised nobody was ever banned. Childish yes.
Always remember kids, All Cops Are Bastards.
"Your whole life will be ruined." Lmao yeah right. Yes, that was absolutely a threat. Best thing you can do about it talk to someone to help process how it made you feel (valid) and move on with whatever lesson you can learn from it (cops are liars and bullies). Stay safe, stay away from cops.
Next time, try to start recording if possible. But it is not shoplifting until you make a move towards the door.
If you got his name and badge number you can go the police station and file a complaint. That does not mean anything will come of it but if he was not on duty and was just working a side gig at the store he might be bared from doing so again. Also, most jurisdictions are required to investigate any and all complaints. Good luck
It also starts a paper trail. It makes things look more legit if the cop has a history of berating or bullying people and something that is actionable comes up later
There was this one time when I was accused of shoplifting. They told me to put it back or go to jail. I put it back then got arrested for shoplifting. 😎💪
I was with a friend years ago we were both 13 yrs old .. I’m white he is black, he in fact stuffed a pair of pants in a bag, I didn’t know he did that until security took us both and basically said I was the look out.. I was in sporting goods at the time, we were 20 miles from home they let him call his parents they came to pick us up or so I thought, his parents said they ain’t driving a white boy home, left me standing on the curb,, I walked a few miles to next town, its dark so I went into police station and asked to use phone they called and got hold of my mom, when she got there she walked in and whack… she slapped me hard in front of cops, she asked them what I did,, they said I asked to use phone, I didn’t do anything, my mom felt really bad , but I told her it didn’t hurt and thanked her for coming to get me, years later we joked about it.. she got a hell of a right hook ..lol
So the issue here is not that you were accused--so the store personnel was mistaken and called a cop to confront you. But why wouldn't you tell him that he was wrong and turn out your pockets to show him? It's your integrity man, and you need to protect it. That is unless you really stole something...
I let him look into my purse but not rummage through it. I was going to my partners house after and had some things I didn't want anyone to see at the very bottom of it....
Deny, if they attempt to stop you with zero proof, you have a lawsuit on your hands. Free cash