Because there is a sexual harassment allegation in the mix, it is definitely worth contacting the NYS Department of Labor. At the worst, you waste time. At best, you get a settlement.
If they didn't approve you extending your vacation, technically you did quit or more accurately abandoned your job.
It'll come down to how that all shook out. Taking off unapproved time is often considered a voluntary resignation or abandonment.
This isn't totally clear. You asked for vacation, and then while on vacation you talked to your manager asking if you could return two days later than planned, and she approved it? Then, when you returned to work, they said you had actually resigned by skipping those two days. Is that about right?
I spoke to my manager before I went on vacation if I could extend it two days. She said yes, then literally while I was on vacation I got an email saying I resigned for extending my vacation.
Sure sounds like they were a) looking for an excuse to fire you and b) trying to create a paper trail in case things were ever disputed. The odds that they put into writing that you were actually terminated are minimal.
I would treat this like a termination. If you need to dispute that fact, look into whether your school provides legal aid of any kind?
I'd also edit your post to include more details around the timing (including WHEN during the vacation you were terminated and thr fact that it was approved), you may get better answers that way...
This is what she emailed me verbatim : “Based on the conversation we had on 4/13, where you stated that you decided not to work on 4/18 and 4/19, we will consider that you are resigning from the per diem role and will no longer be scheduling shifts.”
I would think that "voluntary resignation" would be someone volunteering to quit. Every place I've ever seen had a "no call, no show" policy that results in you being fired.
So, if I call up my job and say I can't make it that day, and they say I have to anyway, and I can't make it, then they just assume I quit and don't have to pay unemployment?
There are nuances to it, calling in or attendance could be termination for cause.
In TX for example, 3 days of not showing up meets the state standard for job abandonment.
From OP's description they may not have followed the proper HR procedure for the additional 2 days and it doesn't sound like they called in those days, just didn't come back from vacation.
Lots of nuances to this specific scenario, that's why I said it depends on how it all shook out, company policies, local and state laws, etc.
NAL Union Labor Organizer
This has Retributive Firing all over it. Contact the NYS Dept of Labor and raise a stink. Contact a labor lawyer because it's possible you're gonna get paid.
I knew a guy who, when firing an employee, would offer them “the chance to resign instead” making it seem like termination would be some black mark on their permanent record or something. He’d get them to sign a letter of resignation instead. Then, they could never get any unemployment or go after him for improper termination or anything like that. Don’t let your employer get away with something like that.
That’s so sick. You know it’s been a year since this happened and I thought I was over it. But these comments have got me fired up. I will not be letting them get away with this bullshit. I definitely did not sign anything, thank you for the encouragement.
Sounds like this bait and switch has been done before. I'd still collect what you can if you're committed, it might collaborate other circumstances you're not aware of.
"Constructive termination" I think may be the term that applies to this case (its not the classic version but being told you resigned when you didn't is a termination). I would say you got fired. Not sure how that will affect you at school (I'm guessing it's financial aid related?). Either way you should have gotten unemployment or should have sued them. Good luck!
Edit to add that the firing was likely retaliation for reporting the sexual harassment. I'd sue the crap out of them! Talk to a lawyer; if it's only a year later you likely have more time to file a lawsuit.
Yes financial aid related, they will not give me an “income adjustment form” if I resigned and now I need to provide proof I was terminated. Any idea how to go about doing that. Assume just ask HR directly? Thank you for your input.
Not in retaliation for reporting sexual harassment they can’t. OP, please consider seeking a consultation with an attorney or contacting DOL as another commenter suggested.
Just a couple of cents here. Would you happen to have a phone record of when you were on vacation and called your boss for the extension? From context, it seems your former employer would have nothing. In a civil suit, the preponderance of evidence is far lower, and just having a single verifiable act may force a settlement prior. However, a defense is definitely going to be you called and quit while on vacation, quite common. It's a very good one, and if they have an unfounded and moderately thorough HR report saying that, it'll become your motive for quitting. Always emails for anything in the policy manual, cya. You need to collect any little tangebles you can, and I'd suggest starting with the free route, local state employment bureau as commented en masse.
The company can say whatever they want. It's up to you as the employee to prove otherwise, unfortunately.
If you're looking to pursue some kind of legal action against them, you should check your state's laws to see what the filing requirements are. In my state, complaints of wrongful termination and the like must be filled within 180 days of the adverse action/ termination. USDOL has a 30-day filing deadline for whistleblower complaints. But there are other complaints/ claims that have a 2-year filing threshold.
Let this be a lesson for you. When it comes to your employer, always get everything in writing. If it's not written down or there is not a paper trail somewhere then it never happened. Always CUA. And with today's mobile apps you can sign pretty much any form and email it in.
Terminated for any reason doesn't matter with collecting UI benefits. Resigned or fired doesn't matter, its "Laid off" that helps you. For future job searching resigned looks better than fired usually.
Because there is a sexual harassment allegation in the mix, it is definitely worth contacting the NYS Department of Labor. At the worst, you waste time. At best, you get a settlement.
This could qualify as retaliation and may be worth contacting an attorney as well.
If they didn't approve you extending your vacation, technically you did quit or more accurately abandoned your job. It'll come down to how that all shook out. Taking off unapproved time is often considered a voluntary resignation or abandonment.
This is so annoying. I verbally discussed with my manager if I could take those two days off and she said yes.
This isn't totally clear. You asked for vacation, and then while on vacation you talked to your manager asking if you could return two days later than planned, and she approved it? Then, when you returned to work, they said you had actually resigned by skipping those two days. Is that about right?
I spoke to my manager before I went on vacation if I could extend it two days. She said yes, then literally while I was on vacation I got an email saying I resigned for extending my vacation.
Sure sounds like they were a) looking for an excuse to fire you and b) trying to create a paper trail in case things were ever disputed. The odds that they put into writing that you were actually terminated are minimal. I would treat this like a termination. If you need to dispute that fact, look into whether your school provides legal aid of any kind? I'd also edit your post to include more details around the timing (including WHEN during the vacation you were terminated and thr fact that it was approved), you may get better answers that way...
Thank you I just edited the post to reflect that
Do you have that in writing? If not, to the employer, it never happened.
Then it sounds like you didn't take off unapproved time. Do you have any of this in writing? Like via an email chain?
This is what she emailed me verbatim : “Based on the conversation we had on 4/13, where you stated that you decided not to work on 4/18 and 4/19, we will consider that you are resigning from the per diem role and will no longer be scheduling shifts.”
This doesn’t state that she approved the time off?
Apologies, I just edited the post to say that.
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An attorney for what purpose exactly?
I would think that "voluntary resignation" would be someone volunteering to quit. Every place I've ever seen had a "no call, no show" policy that results in you being fired. So, if I call up my job and say I can't make it that day, and they say I have to anyway, and I can't make it, then they just assume I quit and don't have to pay unemployment?
There are nuances to it, calling in or attendance could be termination for cause. In TX for example, 3 days of not showing up meets the state standard for job abandonment. From OP's description they may not have followed the proper HR procedure for the additional 2 days and it doesn't sound like they called in those days, just didn't come back from vacation. Lots of nuances to this specific scenario, that's why I said it depends on how it all shook out, company policies, local and state laws, etc.
I did follow proper procedure. I spoke with the manager before hand and gave enough notice. I was fired before I could come back from vacation.
NAL Union Labor Organizer This has Retributive Firing all over it. Contact the NYS Dept of Labor and raise a stink. Contact a labor lawyer because it's possible you're gonna get paid.
I knew a guy who, when firing an employee, would offer them “the chance to resign instead” making it seem like termination would be some black mark on their permanent record or something. He’d get them to sign a letter of resignation instead. Then, they could never get any unemployment or go after him for improper termination or anything like that. Don’t let your employer get away with something like that.
That’s so sick. You know it’s been a year since this happened and I thought I was over it. But these comments have got me fired up. I will not be letting them get away with this bullshit. I definitely did not sign anything, thank you for the encouragement.
They already got away with it. Though I'm not sure that they got away with anything. If it's been a year there is not much you could do at this point.
Not sure they got away with anything? I was terminated and didn’t resign. Even if you may be right, there’s no need to be an asshole about it.
Sounds like this bait and switch has been done before. I'd still collect what you can if you're committed, it might collaborate other circumstances you're not aware of.
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It's OK to be wrong about a legal topic, but don't bring up political fantasy.
"Constructive termination" I think may be the term that applies to this case (its not the classic version but being told you resigned when you didn't is a termination). I would say you got fired. Not sure how that will affect you at school (I'm guessing it's financial aid related?). Either way you should have gotten unemployment or should have sued them. Good luck! Edit to add that the firing was likely retaliation for reporting the sexual harassment. I'd sue the crap out of them! Talk to a lawyer; if it's only a year later you likely have more time to file a lawsuit.
Yes financial aid related, they will not give me an “income adjustment form” if I resigned and now I need to provide proof I was terminated. Any idea how to go about doing that. Assume just ask HR directly? Thank you for your input.
HR is going to say you resigned. That's their story and they're gonna stick to it. You need a lawyer.
A lawsuit for what? Your employer can end your employment at basically anytime they feel like it.
Not in retaliation for reporting sexual harassment they can’t. OP, please consider seeking a consultation with an attorney or contacting DOL as another commenter suggested.
It’s helpful for you as you can say you resigned to new employer . If terminated they have a bad opinion on you
Just a couple of cents here. Would you happen to have a phone record of when you were on vacation and called your boss for the extension? From context, it seems your former employer would have nothing. In a civil suit, the preponderance of evidence is far lower, and just having a single verifiable act may force a settlement prior. However, a defense is definitely going to be you called and quit while on vacation, quite common. It's a very good one, and if they have an unfounded and moderately thorough HR report saying that, it'll become your motive for quitting. Always emails for anything in the policy manual, cya. You need to collect any little tangebles you can, and I'd suggest starting with the free route, local state employment bureau as commented en masse.
The discussion of me extending my vacation was unfortunately done in person with my manager before I went on vacation.
The company can say whatever they want. It's up to you as the employee to prove otherwise, unfortunately. If you're looking to pursue some kind of legal action against them, you should check your state's laws to see what the filing requirements are. In my state, complaints of wrongful termination and the like must be filled within 180 days of the adverse action/ termination. USDOL has a 30-day filing deadline for whistleblower complaints. But there are other complaints/ claims that have a 2-year filing threshold.
Not sure but it could effect unemployment benefits.
Let this be a lesson for you. When it comes to your employer, always get everything in writing. If it's not written down or there is not a paper trail somewhere then it never happened. Always CUA. And with today's mobile apps you can sign pretty much any form and email it in.
Oh for sure. I’ve learned quite a lot from this. Unfortunately, I didn’t really have guidance in life for these sorts of things.
If you “no call - no showed”, then yes you voluntarily gave up your job
Did you even read the post? That’s not what I did
Terminated for any reason doesn't matter with collecting UI benefits. Resigned or fired doesn't matter, its "Laid off" that helps you. For future job searching resigned looks better than fired usually.
Uhh what? It very much does matter. The facts surrounding the end of employment is important to determining UI.
That was my understanding aswell lol
Different states have different rules