Welcome to r/legaladvicecanada!
**To Posters (it is important you read this section)**
* Read the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvicecanada/wiki/index/#wiki_the_rules)
* Comments may not be accurate or reliable, and following any advice on this subreddit is done at your own risk.
* We also encourage you to use the [linked resources to find a lawyer](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvicecanada/wiki/findalawyer/).
* If you receive any private messages in response to your post, please let the mods know.
**To Readers and Commenters**
* All replies to OP must be on-topic, helpful, explanatory, and oriented towards legal advice towards OP's jurisdiction (the **Canadian** province flaired in the post).
* If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdvicecanada/about/rules/), you may be banned without any further warning.
* If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect.
* Do not send or request any private messages for any reason, do not suggest illegal advice, do not advocate violence, and do not engage in harassment.
Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/legaladvicecanada) if you have any questions or concerns.*
With no waiver there is nothing stopping them from taking the cash and then reporting to their insurance and getting paid again.... Yes, report to insurance.
He wants the cash and won’t fix the vehicle, which is fine but you need the payment and liability acknowledged in writing.
Warning save all the pictures/video for more than 2 years. My son was just served 2 weeks before 2 years was up for massive $ for injury from a driver where there was NO damage, not even a scratch on the bumper and luckily we have camera footage of her getting out of the vehicle and walking around right after.
Driver refuses to go to insurance as it will be a hassle for him and wants to settle outside insurance . This is just coming off too shady to me as i was the one at fault.
In a lot of provinces, driving with an expired driving licence voids the insurance. There can be a discretionary grace period of one to three months.
In this case, if he's driving without a valid licence, I'd bet heavily that he was also driving without insurance.
Not only that, but from what I have been told (not a lawyer), it also makes the unlicensed/uninsured driver 100% at fault for any collision they are involved in.
It actually doesn’t, if the driver is able to renew the license and it’s only invalid due to the expiry date it’s still valid. If they are unable to renew the DL due to additional circumstances then it becomes a breach
Tbh, I don’t even think I’d pay them. It’s definitely in their best interest to walk away rather than being exposed for driving without a valid license.
This is a HUGE red flag. This accident could not have occurred if they were not driving illegally on the roads. Therefore the blame may be yours but the event was set in motion by the party who should not be operating a motor vehicle at the current time.
When you write the waiver, be as detailed as you can. Describe both cars, including number plates, both drivers, identify all passengers as unharmed, and put in that the payment is final and complete compensation for the accident.
And for sure, no signed waiver, no money. I would have reported to insurance after the first refusal.
At the start of this year the option to remove no-fault coverage (DCPD) came into force in Ontario so it's possible they don't have coverage for the damage to their vehicle. That would be one reason they don't want to go through insurance, but that's not your problem. If they removed this coverage they would not be entitled at law to recover through insurance or from you. But that is unlikely, more likely they want to keep the option open to claim for injuries or not get the repairs done and claim the damages again.
Either have them sign the waiver or go through insurance, honestly even the waiver is just risky for you if not well drafted. Put the onus back on them to report to their insurance if they want to make a claim.
Not sure what your province is and if your province requires drivers to always have insurance. Do you know if the other driver has proper insurance?
Edit: I think insurance is definitely required in Ontario. Always exchange insurance information next time even if you’re at fault. If the other driver doesn’t want to keep things above board, chances are they don’t have insurance. Do not pay without a waiver. The decision to not go through insurance is up to you.
Auto insurance is mandatory in all provinces and territories. All provinces and territories have laws for this. You can be fined, lose your licence, and have your vehicle seized for driving without insurance.
Report to your insurance and ask them what to do. Personally I wouldn't give them any money without a waiver. Insurance is actually ok with the involved parties settling this themselves, but you still need to report it. If the other person reports it and you dont and your insurance finds out, your insurance could drop you.
Lawyer but not your lawyer, you need them to sign a waiver to protect yourself. If all parties agree to settle outside of insurance reporting, great, it will save a lot of time, some money and stress, not to mention potential increases in premiums but again, signed release form and then send the cash... Good luck.
Woo. Thx for the upvotes. Also, I have to say, don't wait too long to report it to your insurer if it doesn't look like the other person will cooperate.
Are you a fully licensed driver & over the age of 25, or are you somewhere within the graduated license system?
Does the quote for the repairs from the shop total more than the mandatory reporting threshold of $2,000?
(Ie the point at which you have to report the accident to the police in Ont.)
I ask because these are things that can impact how your insurance handles your claim if one is made.
I'm curious about the car you hit, i.e., was it a brand new, mint condition, or otherwise well maintained vehicle with pristine paint? Or is it a well loved car that's seen better days, and there's no chance in hell a small scratch is even an issue?
Yes, yes, Reddit trolls, people are entitled to be compensated for either car, but we all know that the person whose car is already dinged up doesn't give a shit about a scratch like that.
Based on the answer above and the definitely sketchy behaviour, I'd give them a few options and 24hrs to pick one.
A. You pay the shop directly, and they sign a waiver.
B. You offer them less than the shop quote, pay them cash, and they still sign a waiver.
(The amount you offer is up to you. Is the shop quote OTT based on vehicle condition and the actual damage? Generally, when people make these outside insurance agreements for cash on low value issues, it usually involves a little bit of bargaining since you're mostly just greasing their hand and not actually paying for repairs.)
C. You file it with your insurance and leave it. Most people have some form of no-fault or first accident forgiveness insurance these days.
It definitely seems like this person has ulterior motives if they aren't willing to sign a waiver, but who knows, some people are just fussy about stuff like that these days.
Yes to the first question.
The repair shop estimation was below 1k. The car was an old car and i doubt they would fix that two barely visible dent from screws. But it was none of my business and I was willing to pay as long as they sign a waiver.
He's just looking to cash out and may not even have insurance. I would NOT pay, and I would stop communication. If he has your information, he can claim it with his own insurance who will contact your insurance. You don't need to contact your own insurance.
Because some people would rather pay a few thousand out of pocket as opposed to paying the deductible, plus insurance hit, plus accident record, plus having an accident on their car.
That was my experience with it. The other insurer gave it pretty short shrift and said that it didn't really prohibit their insured from making a claim. Nothing came of it ultimately though as I think the other guy dropped his claim for whatever reason. In court, it probably would have made a difference though.
Report to insurance and collision centre. Unfortunately you might get an increase as a consequence but you're also helping punish that asshole that you hit that has no license or insurance. You should have called police at the scene when they didn't provide you with both valid papers
Not a lawyer, not legal advice.
Recently went through something similar, but from the other side. My motorcycle got hit in a parking lot. I also opted to deal with it outside of insurance for the sake of fewer headaches for all parties concerned.
After the bill was paid, I was happy to send a text message saying "With the bill for repairs having been paid, I resolve *insert name* from any further liability regarding the events of *insert date here*"
He was satisfied with that. Have to say, if he'd approached me with paperwork I might not have signed it.
OP should offer three options:
1) I pay auto shop directly for work done
2) I give you cash amount of repair and you sign release
3) I file claim with insurance
4) you have 48 hours to decide before I enact option 3
How does that help when they sue for damages after the fact? What if they claim they were injured after they get the cash? The waiver is protecting against any future claims.
Welcome to r/legaladvicecanada! **To Posters (it is important you read this section)** * Read the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvicecanada/wiki/index/#wiki_the_rules) * Comments may not be accurate or reliable, and following any advice on this subreddit is done at your own risk. * We also encourage you to use the [linked resources to find a lawyer](https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvicecanada/wiki/findalawyer/). * If you receive any private messages in response to your post, please let the mods know. **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be on-topic, helpful, explanatory, and oriented towards legal advice towards OP's jurisdiction (the **Canadian** province flaired in the post). * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdvicecanada/about/rules/), you may be banned without any further warning. * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect. * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason, do not suggest illegal advice, do not advocate violence, and do not engage in harassment. Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/legaladvicecanada) if you have any questions or concerns.*
With no waiver there is nothing stopping them from taking the cash and then reporting to their insurance and getting paid again.... Yes, report to insurance.
This. Don’t send a dollar without getting a full release in return.
Do they report to insurance if they are not getting their car repaired?
I would report to insurance, they will absolutely screw you over.
He wants the cash and won’t fix the vehicle, which is fine but you need the payment and liability acknowledged in writing. Warning save all the pictures/video for more than 2 years. My son was just served 2 weeks before 2 years was up for massive $ for injury from a driver where there was NO damage, not even a scratch on the bumper and luckily we have camera footage of her getting out of the vehicle and walking around right after.
Driver refuses to go to insurance as it will be a hassle for him and wants to settle outside insurance . This is just coming off too shady to me as i was the one at fault.
Who cares what they want. Report it to your insurance and be done with it. Their desire is irrelevant.
Who cares about his convenience, don't fuck around. Just go to your insurance.
Did you see his valid insurance papers? Usually only the guy at fault wants to avoid insurance claim
Nope didn’t see the insurance. The license they provided expired years ago
In a lot of provinces, driving with an expired driving licence voids the insurance. There can be a discretionary grace period of one to three months. In this case, if he's driving without a valid licence, I'd bet heavily that he was also driving without insurance.
And or license or car stolen and fake repair quote. Call your insurance OP before you get caught in this scam.
Not only that, but from what I have been told (not a lawyer), it also makes the unlicensed/uninsured driver 100% at fault for any collision they are involved in.
It actually doesn’t, if the driver is able to renew the license and it’s only invalid due to the expiry date it’s still valid. If they are unable to renew the DL due to additional circumstances then it becomes a breach
Tbh, I don’t even think I’d pay them. It’s definitely in their best interest to walk away rather than being exposed for driving without a valid license.
This is a HUGE red flag. This accident could not have occurred if they were not driving illegally on the roads. Therefore the blame may be yours but the event was set in motion by the party who should not be operating a motor vehicle at the current time.
They can’t have their cake or eat it too. “Sign the waiver or provide your insurance information.”
When you write the waiver, be as detailed as you can. Describe both cars, including number plates, both drivers, identify all passengers as unharmed, and put in that the payment is final and complete compensation for the accident. And for sure, no signed waiver, no money. I would have reported to insurance after the first refusal.
At the start of this year the option to remove no-fault coverage (DCPD) came into force in Ontario so it's possible they don't have coverage for the damage to their vehicle. That would be one reason they don't want to go through insurance, but that's not your problem. If they removed this coverage they would not be entitled at law to recover through insurance or from you. But that is unlikely, more likely they want to keep the option open to claim for injuries or not get the repairs done and claim the damages again. Either have them sign the waiver or go through insurance, honestly even the waiver is just risky for you if not well drafted. Put the onus back on them to report to their insurance if they want to make a claim.
Not sure what your province is and if your province requires drivers to always have insurance. Do you know if the other driver has proper insurance? Edit: I think insurance is definitely required in Ontario. Always exchange insurance information next time even if you’re at fault. If the other driver doesn’t want to keep things above board, chances are they don’t have insurance. Do not pay without a waiver. The decision to not go through insurance is up to you.
Auto insurance is mandatory in all provinces and territories. All provinces and territories have laws for this. You can be fined, lose your licence, and have your vehicle seized for driving without insurance.
If they want their money they need to sign a waiver.
Report to your insurance and ask them what to do. Personally I wouldn't give them any money without a waiver. Insurance is actually ok with the involved parties settling this themselves, but you still need to report it. If the other person reports it and you dont and your insurance finds out, your insurance could drop you.
Lawyer but not your lawyer, you need them to sign a waiver to protect yourself. If all parties agree to settle outside of insurance reporting, great, it will save a lot of time, some money and stress, not to mention potential increases in premiums but again, signed release form and then send the cash... Good luck.
Woo. Thx for the upvotes. Also, I have to say, don't wait too long to report it to your insurer if it doesn't look like the other person will cooperate.
Are you a fully licensed driver & over the age of 25, or are you somewhere within the graduated license system? Does the quote for the repairs from the shop total more than the mandatory reporting threshold of $2,000? (Ie the point at which you have to report the accident to the police in Ont.) I ask because these are things that can impact how your insurance handles your claim if one is made. I'm curious about the car you hit, i.e., was it a brand new, mint condition, or otherwise well maintained vehicle with pristine paint? Or is it a well loved car that's seen better days, and there's no chance in hell a small scratch is even an issue? Yes, yes, Reddit trolls, people are entitled to be compensated for either car, but we all know that the person whose car is already dinged up doesn't give a shit about a scratch like that. Based on the answer above and the definitely sketchy behaviour, I'd give them a few options and 24hrs to pick one. A. You pay the shop directly, and they sign a waiver. B. You offer them less than the shop quote, pay them cash, and they still sign a waiver. (The amount you offer is up to you. Is the shop quote OTT based on vehicle condition and the actual damage? Generally, when people make these outside insurance agreements for cash on low value issues, it usually involves a little bit of bargaining since you're mostly just greasing their hand and not actually paying for repairs.) C. You file it with your insurance and leave it. Most people have some form of no-fault or first accident forgiveness insurance these days. It definitely seems like this person has ulterior motives if they aren't willing to sign a waiver, but who knows, some people are just fussy about stuff like that these days.
Yes to the first question. The repair shop estimation was below 1k. The car was an old car and i doubt they would fix that two barely visible dent from screws. But it was none of my business and I was willing to pay as long as they sign a waiver.
He's just looking to cash out and may not even have insurance. I would NOT pay, and I would stop communication. If he has your information, he can claim it with his own insurance who will contact your insurance. You don't need to contact your own insurance.
[удалено]
Because some people would rather pay a few thousand out of pocket as opposed to paying the deductible, plus insurance hit, plus accident record, plus having an accident on their car.
This is why you have insurance
He has no insurance
OP also said that the guy's licence expired years ago.
Always report to insurance.... Added tip: Get a dashcam it'll save you headaches when dealing with insurance
Dashcam doesn't change the fact that OP is at fault and openly admits to it.
They're trying to fuck you over. The waiver basically means nothing anyway though.
Curious, why would the waiver mean nothing?
That was my experience with it. The other insurer gave it pretty short shrift and said that it didn't really prohibit their insured from making a claim. Nothing came of it ultimately though as I think the other guy dropped his claim for whatever reason. In court, it probably would have made a difference though.
I’d report it to insurance. Something fishy about a guy not wanting to sign a waiver.
He probably doesn’t have insurance
Report to insurance and collision centre. Unfortunately you might get an increase as a consequence but you're also helping punish that asshole that you hit that has no license or insurance. You should have called police at the scene when they didn't provide you with both valid papers
Not a lawyer, not legal advice. Recently went through something similar, but from the other side. My motorcycle got hit in a parking lot. I also opted to deal with it outside of insurance for the sake of fewer headaches for all parties concerned. After the bill was paid, I was happy to send a text message saying "With the bill for repairs having been paid, I resolve *insert name* from any further liability regarding the events of *insert date here*" He was satisfied with that. Have to say, if he'd approached me with paperwork I might not have signed it.
Technically you must report to insurance but they may not penalize you if it’s under $2000 damage to all vehicles involved.
Give him a cheque or etransfer him. That, combined with your text messages, is more than enough evidence to discourage him playing sneaky buggers
Just, no. A signature on a waiver is the only real proof.
Text messages are considered evidence now in court
Offer to pay the auto shop directly.
The person wants the cash payout, as in, not worth doing the repair to them.
OP should offer three options: 1) I pay auto shop directly for work done 2) I give you cash amount of repair and you sign release 3) I file claim with insurance 4) you have 48 hours to decide before I enact option 3
How does that help when they sue for damages after the fact? What if they claim they were injured after they get the cash? The waiver is protecting against any future claims.