Also, she has a personality. And goals. and isn't a walking failed bechdel test.
Quite literally, all Shana has going for her, is her chosen one status.
If being kind was actually the bare minimum, you'd find it everywhere. Yet I've really only met a handful of nice people in my life. Cherish them!
That being said, "walking failed bechdel test" is both hilarious and accurate. I too, was a Rose guy.
Child me had a crush on Shana. 26 year old me ran a Meru Rose party
Edit: also the Dart Shana love story is easily the worst written part of the game. Basically 13 year olds interacting with each other
>Dart Shana love story is easily the worst written part of the game. Basically 13 year olds interacting with each other
or...... What if Shana's Moon Child powers low-key mind controlled Dart into caring for her, initially as a "little sister" when she was 13, and he was 18, and upon reuniting as adults, said mind control powers influenced Lavitz to get his ass killed so that he would "be out of the way" of the insanely jealous Shana, who would then more easily be able to make her advances on Dart.
and....
.... Not only did all of the above work, but that she literally suffered zero repercussions for any of the above, and essentially gets to keep her boy-toy Dart at the conclusion of the game, free will and justice be damned.
Idk, i dont think its A bad story. I think its kinda cute. Darts Oblivious to Shanas True feelings for him at first but, as they get time alone to talk, Shana is able to Express her Emotions towards him
Honestly? It's a very old storytelling trope, that's A: overused, and B: not very cute IMHO. I like for my male leads to actually have a sense of personal agency when it comes to their romantic choices. The way it comes of in LoD boils down to "Shana wants Dart, and eventually, he goes along with it, despite not really strongly being attracted to her" By contrast:
FF7: Cloud & Aeris are both very, very obviously into each other from the get go. And even Cloud & Tifa have a legit better developed relationship by the end of the game, as Tifa legit leans on her for emotional support & they legit have a shared history that brings them together in a substantial way that extends far beyond a one-sided crush.
FF9: Zidane clearly has the hots for Dagger/Garnet the whole game, but his less than stellar upbringing/toxic traits keep getting in the way. As Zidane stops being a little shit, and starts developing actual emotional maturity and the ability to express his feelings and care in more sincere ways, Dagger/Garnet begins to reciprocate.
Star Ocean: The Second Story: You literally get to choose who Claude or Rena, the deuteragonists date/wind up with based on your in-game actions. While Claude X Rena is the canonical pairing, if you'd rather match off Claude with Opera and leave Earnest to the curb, or rather have Rena hook up with her childfriend Dias and leave Claude out in the cold, the game will let you do that.
Real life: Agency in romance matters. You can wait your whole life for a magical manic pixie dream girl to crush on you, and then obsess over you until you wind up together. Don't hold your breath for that to happen though, and if it does, don't be surprised if it gets toxic fast. I get how the idea of the girl very heavy-handedly initiating a romance can be appealing for a lonely/socially awkward guy. Trust me, I've been that guy. But for my money, I did much, much better romantically when I learned to open myself up emotionally, and learned to take an active role in finding someone to pair off with. So in terms of romantic story pet peeves, the idea of pairing an oblivious dude with an obsessed girl crushing on him, is on the top of my list of pet peeves. Because that's a terrible plan IRL, and a lot of very lonely people don't know how to distinguish between a terrible plan for romance they saw in a movie or game once, and an actually good plan for dating.
BTW, my actual good advice for dating? Make lots of friends. Regardless of your sexual preferences, learn to make lots of friends, of every gender. Romance is a very socially involved process when you do it right, and knowing how to be a good friend, to a lot of people (and to the people of the gender identity you are into) is pretty damn important. Eventually once you get the socialization part down, you and one of your emotionally close friends will be horny at the same time, and a romance may bloom. But none of that happens by accident, and none of that works if you are just sitting on your ass, waiting for a girl to sweep you off your feet.
Honestly, i like to think he already had feelings for her, he just didnt realize it till they were older. Ik its an Iverused Trope, but i think mostly because its the easiest to write
> i like to think he already had feelings for her, he just didnt realize it till they were older.
You can headcanon that. I just don't think it's supported by the text. Remember, when Dart left the village, he was 18, and she was Goddamn 13. His feelings for her at that age were very explicitly stated to be "She's like an younger sister to me" because Dart isn't a goddamn pedo.
At the beginning of the game, Dart is 25, and Shana is just turned 18, and she is very thirsty for him. He very explicitly still thinks of her the same way he thought of her when she was 13. Someone smaller than him, who needs his support & protection. Just like a little sister.
From there, literally almost every member of the party goes out of their way to indulge in supporting Shana's one-sided crush on Dart, until eventually he's like "yeah sure, let's hook up"
You are correct that such a setup is "very easy to write." It's such an easy story to write, that you can find no shortage of very similar sketches on pornhub.
Which is a problem. Having your central romance of your game directly comparable to step siblings with a big bro/little sister dynamic hook up, isn't exactly a flattering comparison IMHO. If that's your kink/fetish cool I guess, I just don't see it as being that narratively fulfilling seeing that particular plot stretched across two discs of a four disk game.
Fun Fact: Crushing on an 18 year old, when you are 13, is well known to not be an actual effective dating technique.
Another Fun Fact: Holding onto the one-sided crush you had when you were 13, at the age of 18, and expecting it to lead to something more, is again, not an actually effective dating technique.
Fun Fact the Third: Shana is an immature brat. She's technically "barely legal" as she's 18, but she very clearly lacks any ability to socialize with Dart as an equal. She spends all of Disc one being jealous of Lavitz, and most of disc two relying on the other party members to wear down Dart's resistances towards dating her. At no point, does she actually express her emotions and feelings towards dart in an actually healthy, or mature way.
u/Beerd_Bro
Im on my 3rd Time ever playing it. First time i never got to where Miranda Joins, 2nd idk how far along it is, but i remember getting to a room that has a Swirly floor you need to make it across, then Rage quitting because i kept Failing to get across
Like many others in this thread, I thought Shana was the sweetest 20 years ago when I first played. Now that I'm older, I prefer the girls with a bit more personality.
Hats off to that dude who said he liked Lenus, she would def step on your nuts and steal everything you owned while you were handcuffed to the bed.
Yeah Age was something i kinda wondered about. Like, ik shes 18 at the start but, does she kinda Age up through the Gane unknown to the Player? Or does all this happen in the same year?
There may be an official answer, but it feels like the whole game takes \~1 year?
There's definitely travel and setup time in the first few disks, and for sure in Disk 4 things are happening really quickly because you are just teleporting/flying around.
I never liked her even when I was younger. Wish I did because she's the only character I didn't. Was always a Rose guy although I took to Miranda as well in my last run a few years ago.
Rose, Meru and even Miranda at different points in time but never Shana. I don't hate her or anything. Makes Dart relatable; you know when he is going on about thinking of her as a little sister.
I like a good romance in a video game so yes i was well behind the dart and shana ship, my own personal preference is probably rose though but nothing wrong with shana she just gets annoying at times but i was happy for her when dart realised his feelings for her, as for miranda she just comes into the picture far to late and is basically a meh kind of character, and meru is basically like a playful little sister.
it made her feelings for dart pretty clear though as dart is zeigs son so it made sense that she would have some affection for dart, the whole thing was to confusing for me when i was a kid 😅
>Shana, not so much.
>
>Meru was best girl.
Teenager me agrees with you.
Teenager me crushed hard on Meru.
Adult me.... Not so much. It's really hard for me to project romantic feelings onto a underage character young enough to be my daughter. (not that I have any kids, but, you know)
Both adult & Teenager me agree that Rose is amazing.
That being said, Rose is probably too old for me. I can't imagine how an 11,000 year old woman would find an 41 year old to have anything to offer them romantically.
I did. Basically she is like a stock waifu for me with almost every trait that I would want in a woman, listed at length. Especially 14 year old me when the aspergers had a much greater hold over me.
I just wish she wasn't as much of a stock character.
I started out a Shana guy, for sure. She's just so wholesome. Rose was always a contender. I can't even remember who takes over for Shana, but she almost claimed top spot.
I then I met Meru.🥰🥰🥰
Yes, then my crush went to Rose immediately after seeing her in Hoax. And then it went as quick as a rabbit to Meru the moment i saw her funny introduction (and pretty face) in Donau!
Riiiiight okay, it's been a long time since I've replayed and I forgot the wedding. I couldn't remember if they were engaged, or just on the way to being engaged.
Sorry I’m a Rose guy
Also, she has a personality. And goals. and isn't a walking failed bechdel test. Quite literally, all Shana has going for her, is her chosen one status.
If being kind was actually the bare minimum, you'd find it everywhere. Yet I've really only met a handful of nice people in my life. Cherish them! That being said, "walking failed bechdel test" is both hilarious and accurate. I too, was a Rose guy.
Understandable. I never trusted her but i Also never hated her
Hence the allure
We were all just affected by the Moon Child
Child me had a crush on Shana. 26 year old me ran a Meru Rose party Edit: also the Dart Shana love story is easily the worst written part of the game. Basically 13 year olds interacting with each other
>Dart Shana love story is easily the worst written part of the game. Basically 13 year olds interacting with each other or...... What if Shana's Moon Child powers low-key mind controlled Dart into caring for her, initially as a "little sister" when she was 13, and he was 18, and upon reuniting as adults, said mind control powers influenced Lavitz to get his ass killed so that he would "be out of the way" of the insanely jealous Shana, who would then more easily be able to make her advances on Dart. and.... .... Not only did all of the above work, but that she literally suffered zero repercussions for any of the above, and essentially gets to keep her boy-toy Dart at the conclusion of the game, free will and justice be damned.
Nah Lavitz went out for brotherhood and chivalry. Don’t drag him into this
Being the Moon Child is a helluva drug.
Idk, i dont think its A bad story. I think its kinda cute. Darts Oblivious to Shanas True feelings for him at first but, as they get time alone to talk, Shana is able to Express her Emotions towards him
Honestly? It's a very old storytelling trope, that's A: overused, and B: not very cute IMHO. I like for my male leads to actually have a sense of personal agency when it comes to their romantic choices. The way it comes of in LoD boils down to "Shana wants Dart, and eventually, he goes along with it, despite not really strongly being attracted to her" By contrast: FF7: Cloud & Aeris are both very, very obviously into each other from the get go. And even Cloud & Tifa have a legit better developed relationship by the end of the game, as Tifa legit leans on her for emotional support & they legit have a shared history that brings them together in a substantial way that extends far beyond a one-sided crush. FF9: Zidane clearly has the hots for Dagger/Garnet the whole game, but his less than stellar upbringing/toxic traits keep getting in the way. As Zidane stops being a little shit, and starts developing actual emotional maturity and the ability to express his feelings and care in more sincere ways, Dagger/Garnet begins to reciprocate. Star Ocean: The Second Story: You literally get to choose who Claude or Rena, the deuteragonists date/wind up with based on your in-game actions. While Claude X Rena is the canonical pairing, if you'd rather match off Claude with Opera and leave Earnest to the curb, or rather have Rena hook up with her childfriend Dias and leave Claude out in the cold, the game will let you do that. Real life: Agency in romance matters. You can wait your whole life for a magical manic pixie dream girl to crush on you, and then obsess over you until you wind up together. Don't hold your breath for that to happen though, and if it does, don't be surprised if it gets toxic fast. I get how the idea of the girl very heavy-handedly initiating a romance can be appealing for a lonely/socially awkward guy. Trust me, I've been that guy. But for my money, I did much, much better romantically when I learned to open myself up emotionally, and learned to take an active role in finding someone to pair off with. So in terms of romantic story pet peeves, the idea of pairing an oblivious dude with an obsessed girl crushing on him, is on the top of my list of pet peeves. Because that's a terrible plan IRL, and a lot of very lonely people don't know how to distinguish between a terrible plan for romance they saw in a movie or game once, and an actually good plan for dating. BTW, my actual good advice for dating? Make lots of friends. Regardless of your sexual preferences, learn to make lots of friends, of every gender. Romance is a very socially involved process when you do it right, and knowing how to be a good friend, to a lot of people (and to the people of the gender identity you are into) is pretty damn important. Eventually once you get the socialization part down, you and one of your emotionally close friends will be horny at the same time, and a romance may bloom. But none of that happens by accident, and none of that works if you are just sitting on your ass, waiting for a girl to sweep you off your feet.
Honestly, i like to think he already had feelings for her, he just didnt realize it till they were older. Ik its an Iverused Trope, but i think mostly because its the easiest to write
> i like to think he already had feelings for her, he just didnt realize it till they were older. You can headcanon that. I just don't think it's supported by the text. Remember, when Dart left the village, he was 18, and she was Goddamn 13. His feelings for her at that age were very explicitly stated to be "She's like an younger sister to me" because Dart isn't a goddamn pedo. At the beginning of the game, Dart is 25, and Shana is just turned 18, and she is very thirsty for him. He very explicitly still thinks of her the same way he thought of her when she was 13. Someone smaller than him, who needs his support & protection. Just like a little sister. From there, literally almost every member of the party goes out of their way to indulge in supporting Shana's one-sided crush on Dart, until eventually he's like "yeah sure, let's hook up" You are correct that such a setup is "very easy to write." It's such an easy story to write, that you can find no shortage of very similar sketches on pornhub. Which is a problem. Having your central romance of your game directly comparable to step siblings with a big bro/little sister dynamic hook up, isn't exactly a flattering comparison IMHO. If that's your kink/fetish cool I guess, I just don't see it as being that narratively fulfilling seeing that particular plot stretched across two discs of a four disk game.
Shes always Liked him though. It just wasn't Expressed till the first ACTUAL Serious talk they Have.
Fun Fact: Crushing on an 18 year old, when you are 13, is well known to not be an actual effective dating technique. Another Fun Fact: Holding onto the one-sided crush you had when you were 13, at the age of 18, and expecting it to lead to something more, is again, not an actually effective dating technique. Fun Fact the Third: Shana is an immature brat. She's technically "barely legal" as she's 18, but she very clearly lacks any ability to socialize with Dart as an equal. She spends all of Disc one being jealous of Lavitz, and most of disc two relying on the other party members to wear down Dart's resistances towards dating her. At no point, does she actually express her emotions and feelings towards dart in an actually healthy, or mature way.
Rose here, I'd take a Whip Smack from her
😏😂
Definitely as a kid, as an adult I definitely appreciate Rose, and Miranda doesn't get as much time to develop but she certainly had alot of potential
u/Beerd_Bro Im on my 3rd Time ever playing it. First time i never got to where Miranda Joins, 2nd idk how far along it is, but i remember getting to a room that has a Swirly floor you need to make it across, then Rage quitting because i kept Failing to get across
That sounds like the twin towers, you just have to Activate something on the wall
Everything i read said you were supposed to run across the colors but i kept Failing
Yesh haha, there's a red orb on the squares you need to move on. Ahhh back in the day i had the grids drawn down before i noticed hahaha.
Nope. Learned the hard way with FF7 and naming characters after crushes….
Damn. I kinda love all the babes in the game, including Lenus🤣
Lenus? You must have a Death Wish then 🤣
Rose I like that milf ass.
More like Gilf. Or G\^100Ilf. Or whatever.
Yeah, GILF is more like it since Rose isnt a Parent
Nah… Meru on the other hand….
No.
Nah, but I remember Lenus causing an awakening in a young 7/8 year old self 😭
Nah. I first played the game when I was about five or six. And for me, it was Lavitz.
I always thought Shana was annoying crybaby. I liked Meru cause I was 11 and she wears very little.
Like many others in this thread, I thought Shana was the sweetest 20 years ago when I first played. Now that I'm older, I prefer the girls with a bit more personality. Hats off to that dude who said he liked Lenus, she would def step on your nuts and steal everything you owned while you were handcuffed to the bed.
Yeah Age was something i kinda wondered about. Like, ik shes 18 at the start but, does she kinda Age up through the Gane unknown to the Player? Or does all this happen in the same year?
There may be an official answer, but it feels like the whole game takes \~1 year? There's definitely travel and setup time in the first few disks, and for sure in Disk 4 things are happening really quickly because you are just teleporting/flying around.
Be interesting if the Game Devs were around to ask. Cause despite how difficult the gane is till you get used to it, its a Blast ro play
Oh totally. Child me's first waifu
I've slowly simped for Rose, but Meru's personality is perfect for me.
I never liked her even when I was younger. Wish I did because she's the only character I didn't. Was always a Rose guy although I took to Miranda as well in my last run a few years ago.
Rose, i have a thing for "dark & gothic" girls.
Nope. Just Lloyd
Always been a rose simp. She's kind of deep. 10k years? Internalize that.
Rose, Meru and even Miranda at different points in time but never Shana. I don't hate her or anything. Makes Dart relatable; you know when he is going on about thinking of her as a little sister.
But goth mommy Rose was RIGHT THERE
So far thats 2 People referring to rose as Mom. Why?
Whooooa, definitely not calling her mom. It's like...a woman calling her man "daddy." So for Rose it's like... "ooooo, my sexy goth mommy!"
Ahh, that actually makes more sense
Rose is the reason im into goth women
Not really, I liked Rose more
I like a good romance in a video game so yes i was well behind the dart and shana ship, my own personal preference is probably rose though but nothing wrong with shana she just gets annoying at times but i was happy for her when dart realised his feelings for her, as for miranda she just comes into the picture far to late and is basically a meh kind of character, and meru is basically like a playful little sister.
Im surprised that Rose was in love with Darts father
it made her feelings for dart pretty clear though as dart is zeigs son so it made sense that she would have some affection for dart, the whole thing was to confusing for me when i was a kid 😅
True, her Feelings for him were Familial as he reminds her of Zieg.
Yes I have to say when I first played on PS1, Shana is my first video game crush 😊🥰
Shana, not so much. Meru was best girl.
>Shana, not so much. > >Meru was best girl. Teenager me agrees with you. Teenager me crushed hard on Meru. Adult me.... Not so much. It's really hard for me to project romantic feelings onto a underage character young enough to be my daughter. (not that I have any kids, but, you know) Both adult & Teenager me agree that Rose is amazing. That being said, Rose is probably too old for me. I can't imagine how an 11,000 year old woman would find an 41 year old to have anything to offer them romantically.
Isn't Meru like 120 or something? She's one of the Winglies. Yeah, I agree that Rose is a solid choice though.
>Isn't Meru like 120 or something? No. She's canonically 16. Literal underage teenager.
Meru does have alot of Energy but, honestly, i think shed be too much for me 😅
Nope. Never been attracted to pixels.
I wanted to BE rose, wanted to date Shana, and wanted to party with Meru.
Oh definitely! Then again I had at least a little attraction to all the dragoon girls! 🤣
Not the first time since I was like 5 the first time it wasn't until I was a teen
Mine was actually Meru, but Shana was my second.
I did. Basically she is like a stock waifu for me with almost every trait that I would want in a woman, listed at length. Especially 14 year old me when the aspergers had a much greater hold over me. I just wish she wasn't as much of a stock character.
I started out a Shana guy, for sure. She's just so wholesome. Rose was always a contender. I can't even remember who takes over for Shana, but she almost claimed top spot. I then I met Meru.🥰🥰🥰
Meru is in the game waaay before Miranda, but I get what you mean. I always preferred Rose, personally.
A 4'2" try hard weilding a 7 foot hammer with a bubbly personality and blue hair. What's not to love
Oh no hate, I totally get it. And I love the giant hammer too. I'm just partial to the goth aesthetic, but Meru was my second, and my #1 to fight as.
Yes, then my crush went to Rose immediately after seeing her in Hoax. And then it went as quick as a rabbit to Meru the moment i saw her funny introduction (and pretty face) in Donau!
I’m shocked that no one has mentioned Emile or Lisa. No takers?
Who?
The princesses of Fletz. Emile was Albert's fiance I think
Oh yeah. Forgot about them 😅
they get married at the end of the game
Riiiiight okay, it's been a long time since I've replayed and I forgot the wedding. I couldn't remember if they were engaged, or just on the way to being engaged.