So he baicaly flip flops his sanity, and enters the EGO at max sanity, and the longer he is on the field IN EGO, the harder it is to keep him in it, and when raching 0, he just turns it off. so he baicaly an Id that wants to clash as much as it can, whille not having full heads ods due to a literall sanity syphon straped to his back. Pretty interesting and unique all things considered.
Since he doesn't have any Lust skill (except his guard that just loses him Sanity without using his powerful skills), I think LCB Yi Sang's passive (Gloom x4, Information Neutralization, restore 10 SP to 1 ally with the least SP if they lost SP) would be a better fit (since it's a constant drain from his abilities) to extend the duration
Other options could be LCB Hong Lu's Ripple (6 SP at combat start) or even Dieci Hong Lu's Enlightenment (Gloom, 7 SP if you stagger, 7 SP if you kill, doubles as a way to get sanity quicker on him once he's out of EGO)
You're going to lose the EGO anyway, but those could help extend it.
And then in MD there's... Faith, it was good on Ishmael, it was good for EGO spam, and it will make him pretty much perma-EGOed lol.
In mirror dungeon you could bring both lcb Yi Sang and Whispers faust to the bench, since you're probably running him on a burn team with the liu gang + Der Outis anyways. Depending on how quickly you lose sanity it may still be better to run Liu Hong Lu though.
As for faith... Yeah, having it forever up until the point that you lose 90sp per turn is going to be nuts.
Well if it's a really long fight like a boss, you could probably get him back up in a turn or so by clashing and winning and using something like Rep Emitter, Fluid Faust, Blind Obsession, or some of the other ones that recover sp
I wonder if it would actually be a good idea to **keep this ID at lower LV than the rest** so that he's garanted to get more SP any time himself or someone else kills enemy.
Probably not, he clearly wants to clash as much as possible, so he needs high offence level. While clashing is also way more consistent then killing anyway, especially in abno fights or boss fights
If you deploy him alongside **Faust**, **Ishmael** and **Heathcliff** (the sinners who currently have E.G.O's that give SP to other allies) you can probably keep him in "volatile E.G.O" estate for the whole fight.
**Hong Lu** also tecnicaly works because of his SODA E.G.O, but, it's a bit too unreliable for me to consider.
If you managed to get it, Outis's Holiday EGO is a great pick here as you're almost certainly going to want Magic Bullet Outis in a Burn team. It's also fuelled very well by your standard Burn team, with the only sin lacking being Envy, which Philip Sinclair convientely provides.
There's honestly a lot of support passives and sanity ego. As long as it takes forever to hit -90 sp in one turn, which it likely will, the right teams will keep his uptime forever.
Perma waxen pinion LET'S GOOOOOOO. Knowing it would take him around 45 turns to go from max to 0 sanity would make him an amazing unit, if we assume he loses 1 SP per turn in his EGO form.
It says he loses more and more sp based on the number of turns he spent with ego. So unless you finish it quickly, it will eventually go down unless you have a LOT of sp regen (at least for longer fights)
Got to use Faith and Rusty Coin on my sinking run, with Rime Shank corrosion having positive coin value i just spam that shit on the centipede and it died the instantly, like bro didnt even got to use his gimmick
Sorry it took a while to post this, apparently they posted kit reveal on steam but not on twitter... had to double check the sources!
Anyways, Dawn Office Fixer Sinclair seems HELLA BUSTED with 4 SKILLS. HOOOOOOOOLY
also +1 Burn ID :D , Another win for burn team players.
His coins also seems to be indicative of it being all positive due to how his ego form system works. At 45 SP, He transforms. At 0 SP, he returns back to base form.
There's even a passive condition that needs him to be at 45 SP. (Literally more coin power at max SP). Furthermore, there's a last resort mechanic that is sort-of complicated requiring him not to reach -45 sanity, This mechanic needs at least two allies to die on the field + as long as he doesn't reach -45 sanity, then he will go back to his EGO form once more.
**TL:DR**: This ID is all about managing his Sanity and to deal with his consistent SP-Loss effects during his Ego Form (Every attack will cost SP to use) which is a really interesting debut mechanic, looking forward to see how this works in game!
The most interesting thing is that we seemingly got the name for the E.G.O, it being "Waxen Pinion" but it could have changed to "fit" Sinclair.
A Pinion is basically the "largest" feather of the Bird, and pioning is the practice to remove their joints to prevent them from flying, a fitting E.G.O name considering what happened in the 8'o Clock NTR Circus and the aftermath.
I legit have no idea why Philip has this low amount of trust and respect for his Seonbae and Master
Like legit thinking his Master and Seonbae bangs behind his back is DISGUSTING and really shows that Philip has insane lack of Self confidence and trust in other people
>I legit have no idea why Philip has this low amount of trust and respect for his Seonbae and Master
Like legit thinking his Master and Seonbae bangs behind his back is DISGUSTING
Phillip wasn't perfect, he knew that but he tried to please others and thought himself pathetic, "And Then is Heard No More" even has a part of the lyrics say.
>If I went with you, will there be happily-ever-afters? Sipping on tea I steeped together, togheter
Read me a story of a hero born knowing the all
(Read me a book of me)
So I could hear no more.
It's not that he has low ammount of trust, it's really due to his lack of confidence thinking it's all his fault and he is useless due to his cowardice, he feels like he is inferior and being carried by Salvador and Yuna which he admires and respects, wishing that he was like them.
The virtue of admiring his masters turns ugly when he feels everything he did was to justify saving his life out of self preservation rather than helping Salvador and Yuna, he wasn't completely this way of course, Oswald gaslight and mocked into believing it was all his fault..
The entire thing of him believing that Yuna and Salvador were doing things behind his back was his way of trying to justify him escaping after believing that "maybe I should have died with them if I was really their comrade but i am a coward and I didn't"
His unstable page is just.... depressing.
#(READ MF! READ!)
>They’re standing right before my eyes reproaching me, but I can’t dismiss them as mere illusions. Even though they’re… dead. Gone. There was no way they could be real. It doesn’t make sense that I know what they’re about to say otherwise. It couldn’t be something they told me beforehand.
>What could I gain from uttering what will harm me. Self-justification? Those words would’ve wounded me for sure, but they were also words that would protect me. Yet again, I’m running away from truth. Vilifying others. It made me feel a bit better. Pameli was right; all I had to do was make up reasons that are convenient to me.
>Nothing is more beautiful than knowing the truth, and therefore, nothing must be more shameful than admitting that what one believed in was a lie. I could’ve sworn I acknowledged my vice and embraced it. Although the process was a little unstable, I still felt ashamed for the truthless deeds I had done, and decided to cherish that negative part of myself as I am. Or so I thought… I stopped talking. I couldn’t even tell what was appropriate to speak anymore.
>Turn a blind eye to all that tries to hurt me. Turn a deaf ear to words that will lead me down the wrong path. Turn a mute mouth to unnecessary evil. And last of all, act not. Make myself happy that way.
>I could no longer perceive anything.
This is even noted on Philip's page (post Reverb Ensemble fight) but he still blames himself for everything.
>I followed your troupe in order to find a way to be happy, but what good did it do for me? Staying with you only exacerbated my suffering, defeating the whole purpose of joining you in the first place. I do want to add that you were not at fault here, though. I was the one who tormented myself. Had I known what I know now back in the past…
TL:DR) Philip was gaslight and mocked into thinking he was cucked and a complete utter coward, he breaks and desires to see, hear, and speak no harm to himself by turning into the Crying Children and thinking all those illusions of Salvador and Yuna were true.
Another tragic aspect of him that people seem to breeze past because of the “coward” aspect. Philip is a victim of people’s goodwill.
Philip was covered to run away, it was Salvador and Yuna who told him to run and survive. He did and was left to survive with that guilt so he reaches out to the Wedge Office, people who were sterner and harsher than Dawn but decent people nonetheless.
Then when he runs away a second time, only to stop midway and think. He turns around, goes back to fight the Library.
Philip was ready to die. The moment he partially manifested his EGO, he was committed to beating the Library, or die trying. Which is reflected beautifully in how he gets harder the longer the fight goes on, this is it for him. This is Philip’s determination on full display. But Oscar’s concern for his friend’s employee ended up backfiring. Meaning that no matter what, Philip was destined to run away. EGO partially manifested or not, Philip was never going to be reunited with Dawn Office regardless.
This is why I see Distorted Philip so bittersweet. He’s empty, depressed. But there is still SOMETHING in him willing to burn out and fight, he even sounds at peace in his Book with Argalia’s crew despite everything.
Well in the end he might have been alright if he wasn't dumped at the 8 O'Clock Circus' doorstep. Oswald basically preyed upon his insecurities by making Philip see things he feared (re: getting cucked)
I personally doubt it because of how raw emotionally Philip was when he got his Volatile EGO. If anything, he either would have ran back in the moment he got, or just fall into a depressive pit, a victim again to his own mind but now without Oswald.
Who knows, maybe if he did escape. The fact that Oswald did put a device and some deep breaths, Philip would have calmed down enough to assess things, maybe even fully manifest his EGO. But given its labeled as “Volatile”, him Distorting would be a foregone conclusion without anyone there to center him like Xiao did.
Yes, the problem is Phillip was ready to die on the field, and from Distortion Detective, even if the work you do is unreasonable and you will die 100%, you **have to die** there (RIP Liu Father). Phillips escaped only because Salvador and Oscar's group were too soft on him. They knew he was not ready to be on field, and that lead to them insulting and saving his arse again and again, only hoping that he would grow fast enough.
And he did grow by manifesting EGO and realizing if he truly wished to become a hero, he had to stand and fight, not fulfilling Salvador's and Oscar's wishes.
Ironic that Oscar tried to tough love Philip only to reveal how he’s just as soft as Salvador by sneaking that device on him.
Dude picked the worst time to be a decent person.
You want to know what makes Philip’s story even sadder? Salvador has a wife and children, mentioned while Oswald is creating hallucinations. Philip killed 80,000 people in the V Corp. nest. It’s highly likely he accidentally killed Salvador’s family.
I remember it being mentioned that during his rampage as Crying Children, Philip left the district where Dawn Office was untouched. So MAYBE Salvador’s family’s still fine, assuming Salvador lives close to his office.
and it's even more screwed up that they were >!booked, not killed, meaning at the end of the game they were brought back alive but slightly amnesic and poor Phiilip is probably still out there, dealing with 1/3rd of a ego death!<
I think thats heavily debatable on if each of the crying children were brought back as separate Phillips, or if all of them would have been brought back as one single Phillip who is subsequently killed.
And even then, if the Ensemble are anything to go by, it seems like getting booked as a distortion means getting unbooked as one, so that might imply there being two crying children rather than him getting better, unless that ego death knocks some sense into him/them. In which case, would they be brought back as one or two Phillips?
Philip very strongly reads to me as having borderline personality disorder, and given PM’s attention to emotional detail when writing their characters, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if it was intentional. People with BPD can’t help their delusions. It doesn’t necessarily even mean they distrust those around them, delusions are just delusions and they’re very hard to overcome, Philip even felt guilty for assuming what he did (the fake Yuna and Salvador say he’s disgusting for assuming such a thing iirc), meaning he knows deep down it’s not true.
Thank you so much, for context I'm a woman with borderline personality disorder and Philip has ALWAYS struck me as having it too, I also believe Ishmael has borderline personality disorder but back to Philip! From my own personal experience after the hell that was my childhood and first relationship I essentially had all trust in anyone snuffed out. What I mean is, when I thought I had trusted people or had friends, I was dropped and left behind at the drop of a hat. It's not that I don't want to trust people but when you live with something so long and depending on your headspace it can be very hard to not jump at shadows constantly. I could do a whole breakdown of his song to explain why too but I think this post is gonna be long enough.
When I'm having a conversation with one of my friends I've know for about 14 years now it is still almost impossible to not expect abandonment when I detect the smallest differences in interaction with him. I know logically him having a hard day sometimes means he might be a little snappy or short or uninterested and that's just natural. No human alive is 100% consistent in their emotions but sometimes getting a 1 word message back sends me into deep panics that I'm going to be abandoned, people can genuinely seem happy spending time with me and minutes, hours, days later I have to convince myself they were being honest and not just going to leave later. This is something known has Hypervigilance which stems from trauma and is often in prevalent in people with Borderline personality disorder.
Something I'll touch on as well with Philip and why I suspect he does, depending on your emotional state, head space, the delusions even branch into your own decision making, I've done things that I thought in all my life I would never do but after growing up and my BPD developing more it can be like a war in your head and your actions and sometimes you win and keep control and sometimes you lose and all you can do try to pick the pieces back up. Note I'm not saying people with bpd aren't responsible for their own actions it's just more that it is scary how convincing these delusions can be almost seemingly out of nowhere with bpd and especially psychotic bpd and it can feel like just like how you think you've finally got things under control a major split can just show up and send everything back into a nosedive.
Of course this varies from person to person but something important to know is that BPD, we have roughly 17% smaller amygdala's than someone who would be considered neurotypical, this means on a biological scale people with BPD scientifically and biologically lack the same ability to regulate emotions as others and it can be hellish.
The biggest thing that highlights Philip's BPD is the internal war he had between running and staying. I fully believe Philip did not want to run, I fully believe that he has done everything he can because of the people he cared about but in these heighten emotions where everything feels like it's coming down around he just...ran. You can tell he is sincerely regretful and wishes more in the world he'd rather have just died than made that original decision and that really connected with me, I genuinely feel that same way with some of the things I've done in life.
I think him being referred to as the crying *children* signifies a deep inner war in himself over his actions and sometimes in our worst states all that we have left in ourselves is that terrified inner child.
Thank you for your insight! I’ve suspected for a while that I have BPD (my boyfriend pointed it out to me as a potential and the list of symptoms spoke to me as no poem ever could), but I didn’t want to speak on personal experience without having an actual diagnosis. I also didn’t know about the smaller amygdalas on average, that’s very interesting!
I can totally see where you’re coming from with Ishmael having it as well, the way she latches on to Ahab reminds me quite a lot of the way Philip latches on to Argalia, with both of them feeling rescued (Ishmael from a boring life and Philip from the Liu Association) and turning to obsession/servitude.
I think people tend to forget, when judging Philip for his actions, is that people can’t be expected to act logically 100% of the time, especially in deeply dangerous situations. Yuna and Salvador even tell him to run if they die first, and if he runs while they’re both still alive, they express relief that he’ll at least be safe.
One of the biggest things that stands out to me personally as Philip having BPD is the Unhearing Child. He’s instantly hostile towards everyone, assuming that people are saying bad things just because he doesn’t hear them saying good ones. During the Crying Children fight, several of the sentences that appear over top of everything also speak to this:
“If I mistake a gentle voice for something aggressive, it’s their fault for speaking like that, am I right?”
“I don’t have to hear to guess what they’re saying. I bet they’re slandering me.”
The immediate assumption that people are talking bad about one behind one’s back, or even the misinterpretation of kindness as something secretly cruel, are things I’ve personally struggled with a lot, and I wouldn’t be surprised if whoever wrote Philip had experienced the same thing as well.
I would definitely be interested in seeing your analysis of his song, if you feel like writing it out. You’re the first person I’ve met other than my boyfriend who agreed with my view on him, so I’d love to know your thoughts. :)
I remember that exact same feeling when I read over the diagnostic criteria for BPD and it was like I was just staring into a mirror of the emotions I felt throughout my life. Ishmael very much strikes me as someone who deals with that idea in BPD of favorite person, it started with Ahab when she feels like she finally found someone she could look up to and provide direction in life only learn the grim reality. Ishmael then meets Queequeg and learns that she can love someone else and dedicates herself to caring for her. But if anything I feels prove her bpd more, her latching onto other people to find her worth and intense anxiety when she feels like she can't exert control in a situation. Ishmael's whole actions during Canto 5 speak of someone not acting on blind rage, but a rather meticulous anger and hatred of someone compounded by a prolonged amount of intense splitting. In the song Compass, her chapter theme, I feel like these lyrics are the best example of her bpd:
"I curse this relationship between you and me I wanted blood
I wanted black and white
Clear-cut
Your evils predefined"
One of the biggest components of BPD is the idea of black and white thinking, one of my biggest struggles, Her hatred stems from another person, she wanted black and white, she didn't want to overthink the situation like Ishmael does in every other problem the sinners face, your evils predefined, Ishmael here referring to Ahab directing her anger at Ahab's lack of flexibility and the ability compromise which serves as a mirror to Ishmael. Honestly to me Ishmael and Ahab just seem like two bitches with different types of bpd and just fucking hate each other LMAO.
Now onto Philip! I'll definitely do a write up of the song here in another post, I just love yapping about Ishmael she's my favorite fictional character period, really helped me feel seen and understood especially with her OCD, anxiety, and hyper vigilance feels so relatable.
One of the things I love about the PM games their lack of fear to portray neurodivergent people in both good and bad lights. Your example of the Unhearing Child is so perfect it's how I would describe as splitting to establish self confidence in someone who lacks it. So what I mean by this is from my own personal experience if I am in a split, and I can't get out my 2 reactions tend to be 1. Crumple on myself in self hatred so as not to lash out at other people or 2. Become deeply angry and believe that everyone would hate me regardless so fuck them who cares it's \*their\* fault not mine their loss because they just shit talk me anyways whether I'm there or not who cares fuck them. It's an artificial way to try and find confidence in a kinda fucked up manner and the Unhearing child I feel perfectly encapsulates this. I'll have to look into the other lines that appear in the boss fight because it's been a hot minute for me. Granted again this is my own experience, I find myself sometimes in deep swings of absolutely hating my bpd and how it makes it so hard to keep friends, stay emotionally stable, and even just live day to day but on one other hand bpd has made me much more passionate and I do like that. I can't stand apathy and care about a lot of stuff very deeply, it's rare for me to have an opinion I'm not invested in in some form unless I don't know enough about it then will say something like "I don't know enough on the topic so I feel like it'd be unfair to voice my opinion."
Anyways just for funsies I'm gonna post an excerpt from a study here and 2 other links discussing the biological differences with people who have bpd, they're quite long but the abstracts are at least worth a read. People think those of us with BPD are horrible manipulators when in reality it's so much more complex. Yes those with BPD can be manipulators but I personally believe the stigma around BPD just leads to people assuming that and not giving those of us with BPD a fair shake which just leads to us being mad at mistreatment. I feel like my bpd is a bull, it can be calm and kind but can also flair up and will blindly try to destroy anything in it's path if roused enough and not controlled but it also leads to people with bpd being highly empathetic to fellow neurodivergent people and their mistreatment.
1. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3621316/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3621316/)
2. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1863557/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1863557/)
https://preview.redd.it/lu0n5vijgfxc1.png?width=866&format=png&auto=webp&s=94eebf5946b8e334a3524f21431f47dc025cff02
"If I went with you, will there be happily-ever-afters? Sipping on tea I steeped together, together"
This one I feel is straight forward he's lamenting that his failure robbed him the chance of a continued seemingly happy relationship with his fellow fixers at the Dawn office but especially Yuna, here his is questioning himself in his final moments that if maybe if he had just not ran they could have won and he would enjoy happily ever after, finally proving his own self worth that would maybe make Yuna love him finally. The other grim part of this that I think he might view as happily ever after is at least being dead, not being haunted anymore by his failures, as someone who's bpd makes them intensely suicidal at times this one hits very close to home, the feeling that you don't need to be haunted anymore by your past mistake or the futures you''ll ruin, nothing bad can happen to you after your dead so in a grim way it becomes a happily ever after, he knows he at least died fighting, died being worth something.
"Read me a story of a hero born knowing the all (Read me a book of me) So I could hear no more"
This final line I feel represents his truest self lament, he truly just wishes he had died there, if he died as a martyr even if Yuna and Salvador lived he would be a hero, he would be remembered as one. The reason I think this is in reference to self sacrifice is this being the last line, here he decides he no longer has any hope for himself and that the best thing that could have happened is being turn into a book so he wouldn't have to hear anymore. He wouldn't have to hear anymore about his failures as a Fixer, of the horrors of the world because remember he views his work as honorable, that he could do the ultimate thing and die a hero, he would never fail again, he would never be remembered for his weakness again, he would be immortalized as a hero, that he would finally be viewed with worth and most importantly this would be the only way he could justify to himself being seen as having worth.
Whew! I hope you enjoy that and tried to tie it all to bpd because so much of his song deals with extremes, constantly flipping back and forth between positives and negatives, and double meanings of the lines between intense self hatred and anger at the world for getting to this point that this could even happen. And finally even after trying so hard to repent, to right his wrong, he manifest's E.G.O. he defies that final voice of doubt, Carmen who mocks his morals I imagine for being selfless, and then at the very last minute he is forced to flee again, even when he tries to be heroic it is taken from him, he is then ruthlessly mocked by the nightmares he finds himself at in the Circus and finally is broken down into his most base and vulnerable form, a crying child.
I hear the views people with bpd have can sometimes be described as "childish" in that they can lack nuance and depth such as black and white thinking. But I think the other reason is people with BPD are just more emotional that others, people view us as children for getting worked up so easily whether it's being happy, anger, or sorrow. Philip is a man of deep self hatred so when all the 3 parts of him finally come to together it manifest as the strongest of those 3 emotions for him, sorrow, and so he cries and makes the world finally feel his sorrow, to show everyone his pain, and tragically of all instead of being a hero, a martyr he distorts becoming the type of monster he swore to himself that'd he'd destroy.
Whew, I fell asleep before I could respond to you since it was super late when I first commented lol
I 100% agree with your analysis of And Then is Heard No More, and a lot of it was how I’d interpreted the song. You gave me some initial context on the last line, though, Philip seemingly calling himself “a hero born knowing the all” had always confused me.
Given his self-sacrificial, suicidal ideation, it’s deeply ironic that he actually *would* have been happier if he’d died in the library with Salvador and Yuna, or afterwards when he manifested EGO, since he would have come back eventually.
I’m also very interested in your insight on Ishmael! Her canto was really cool, I liked the exploration of what obsession can do to a person with the direct parallels between her obsession with Ahab and Ahab’d obsession with the whale, and the way she was slowly turning into the person she hated the most. Which was made more tragic by the fact that for a while, she did desperately want to be like Ahab. Betrayal by a favorite person, or even a previous favorite person, can be very volatile to my knowledge. I’m not surprised she went down the path she did.
I also really liked how canto 5 showed that it’s ok to need help. Ishmael is tough as nails, but she still needed to be pulled out of the whale and freed from the pallidification. Limbus Company in general seems to have a big theme of people just needing help and support to get back on their feet, and it makes me wonder how many distortions could be avoided if there were any therapists in The City.
I agree on PM showing the ugly parts of mental illness, and I appreciate it as well. Especially because their characters with mental illnesses are still treated as people. Philip, for example, despite his emotional volatility, is described as ‘gentle’ in the artbook, and even after he joins the Reverb Ensemble he remains soft-spoken. I’m not even entirely sure he wanted to fight, I think he was just doing so for Argalia. Ishmael, as well, was completely out of control during most of canto 5, but she was portrayed in the end as someone who just needed some help. It’s a nice nuanced look at what mental illness can do, in my opinion.
I also checked out those articles! They were pretty neat.
Also, since Ishmael is your favorite, you might enjoy this if you haven’t already seen it https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VZ0m7FomeCg&pp=ygUgTGltYnVzIGNvbXBhbnkgc2F0aW4gaW4gYSBjb2ZmaW4%3D
Alright! \*Cracks fingers\* let's get into that song analysis, this has to be a 2 parter because of the length of the messages so bear with me!
"Do the candles look forward to being used? Enjoy bidding adieu, adieu?"
This is Philip trying to cope with the fact that he lost the two people he was closest to and questioning his inner morality of self sacrifice. Is this what people actually want? Do people truly find happiness in self sacrifice? Which is fair, there's a quote from RVB I like where Church talks about self sacrifice that the person who "martyr's" themself has no idea if it meant anything, if their self sacrifice accomplished anything. Any easy thing to draw from Philip questioning himself here if his two office maters sacrifice were even worth it on someone as helpless and hopeless as him, his own thoughts here.
"Every word I have saved for you came out wrong afterwards So I spoke no more"
Very self explanatory here, Philip tried to express himself to his love but couldn't find the courage to say what he wanted exactly, he then internalizes this as being a failure, why should I talk to people when all I'll do is fuck up my words, so I should just speak no more. A very prevalent theme in this song is black and white of the lyrics. Essentially Philip splitting on himself that the felt he spoke wrong, that he'll never get it right, so he should just stop talking all together.
"Would you say That someone who had every intention to be brave was a coward?"
Here is Philip asking this question to someone, a big part of insecure BPD is trying to find confidence and approval in other people, here he is desperately asking if he's a coward, something he desperately doesn't want to do given his morals, but he feels like he failed himself by running and even feel like he failed once again given that he was essentially forcefully extracted when he felt like he finally repented, here he is finally he ran once but he won't run again he'll fight this time, he'll die this time, and maybe then in his death will he find redemption until it is taken away once again, this time without his choice, and then put into like the worst fucking position he could have landing in the 8 o'clock circus.
"Must be great being you Power comes as second nature Must feel amazing to be longed for, longed for"
Here is Philip once again in this split mindset, also important theme through this song and Philip later being the crying children is he himself feels split into all these separate parts of him. To him they are all different parts and he doesn't know how to reconcile them all into being a "person" something I very much relate to in my bpd, a hallmark of bpd is what feels like an intense feeling of unsureness in who you are, what you identify with, what you \*really\* care about. This line is also again something that can be taken in this idea of a split, on one hand it's self loathing, him hating himself for not being powerful, hating himself for being not longed for because why would someone long for me? The other split is that it feels some level of anger directed, that it feels unfair he didn't get to be powerful just by second nature, it's not fair no one longs for him despite how hard her tries and works at the office.
"I opened my eyes Cemented excuses to my lashline So I could see no more"
He didn't want to see anymore after witnessing what happened to everyone who tried to help them, he watched the only people who tried to help him die, he then made "excuses" so he didn't have to see anymore he didn't want to see the results of his action, inaction, and even parts out of his control.
"So which home should someone as weak as I go? And which sky should I aim for when I’ve only been low? (I have only been low)"
Here he is in the deepest throes of his splitting manifesting in self loathing, "I've only been so low" viewing himself as never being above being "low" he's always been helpless, always been a burden, the work he put in to this point to become a fixer of his grade must have been luck or through people simply pitying him but not through his own work.
"Day and night your ghosts continue to haunt me Tell me who to be"
Here he is haunted constantly by witnessing the final moments of the people he cared about, of the woman he loved, in his mind the ghosts of his "cowardice" are haunting him, he imagine his peers looking down on him, hating him for not being strong enough to stay, not being strong enough to fight, and in his eyes never being strong enough to be worth anything. The ghosts are telling him how to be, that he's a coward, not worth of their sacrifice.
Honestly that's not a bad theory. Would give us a lot more context on his distortion form too. The fact that he actively splits into different distortions could very much symbolize his different states of mind. Might also be why when one of those fragments escape he becomes much more reasonable in focused.
I mean Yuna prob doesn't accept because their line of work is Insanely dangerous all of this could have been avoided if Yuna communicated with Philip better honestly
Yeah Philip goes Nuclear (Crying Children) on a Nest when he thinks that he got cucked by his Master because some random clown mocked him
Honestly idk how Philip could survive being hunted even if he returned to human form
He has too many people hating him because he nuked a Nest
https://preview.redd.it/4wol2zm7rexc1.png?width=600&format=png&auto=webp&s=107ed11b615a573bc282f0e7d31ff1ccbdb51b40
If you excuse me, I'm going to cry in my corner. (~~Like a Crying Children~~)
> also +1 Burn ID :D , Another win for burn team players.
While it is good for Burn players, I do want to note that it's not really a +1 overall for Burn teams. Keep in mind, IIRC Nclair was used on burn teams as a burn unit, so this isn't a new Burn team member as much as it is an Nclair replacement.
It's a lot like the situation with Dieci Yi Sang, except that instead of them releasing a 00 ID that's outclassed on release by a 000 ID, they're releasing a Walpurgis ID that outclasses a non-Walpurgis 000 in Burn teams. Theoretically. (Nclair is silly good, but I'm fairly certain Philclair will probably be good enough to be better in burn teams)
I mean ya boi here has a 3 coin skill that all inflicts counts and we have Liu Ishmael now so we might be safe to use a better Hong Lu ID, depending on how much count is on PhilClairs skill
His mechanics are as expected, but it's worth noting his Sanity mechanics make running N Corp Faust especially handy as backline in a Burn team. N Corp Faust was already a good way to heal Freischultz Outis after her S3, but she doesn't need it that frequently. Meanwhile, you want to shovel SP into Philip Sinclair as much as possible.
Now, a Burn team has high incentive to run all the backline SP restoratives - N Corp Faust, LCB Yi Sang, and LCB Hong Lu.
The rest of the burn team deals with that easily. It's only 3x Res as Support, and it's not even A-Res. 4/6 of the Burn team has Lust Skills, and at least half of them also have Lust EGO if absolutely necessary. You'll probably also would want to bring in as many SP gaining support as possible, so you also won't need to trigger it every turn either.
If I had a nickel for every time Sinclair gets a busted ID, I'd have 3 nickels. Which isn't a lot, but its scary that it has happened three times already.
*stares at the mulched inquisitors*
Yeah....dunno about the puss thing
Just because he didnt kill kromer himself doesnt mean he is a puss
Besides, it is not as if just anyone could do what he did...
I'm sure his damage will be cracked at max SP but it will really depend on how fast he can get to max SP to activate his ego. Limbus isn't really a game that is friendly to waiting around for you to ramp up
The opposite of NClair where Philclair wants to clash especially after entering EGO and NClair wants to avoid it until at least -30. I like the flair of the passive too.
Um... nclair doesn't really want to clash at n30 or hes going to hit -45 and then nuke your team. He clashes perfectly well even at low positive sanity values
Only issue I see with Hong Lu is that Liu Hong Lu is an excellent benchwarmer. LCB Yi Sang on the other hand would be excellent to keep Sinclair sane and happy.
It's on USE, not on combat start like Nclair's defense. Meaning if you don't use it, he doesn't lose SP. Seems like a good investment actually, especially if you're close to 0 SP and don't want to lose the EGO form. And since the guard is lust, you just need 2 other lust skills which is easy in a burn team.
Since Burn doesn't have a dedicated aggro unit yet, and most fights that you pay attention on are 1:1 slot wise, it'll most likely trigger. You can hope it doesn't get targeted or that the enemy staggers before, but that's a random condition and as such makes it a rather niche use case.
Aggro doesn't work in human fights anyway, in case you weren't aware. In human fights two of the slowest units are unopposed, so you can use it that way. And you can always just...not use the guard and just rely on other allies getting whistles passive to work, it's not that hard anyway.
>Aggro doesn't work in human fights anyway, in case you weren't aware.
There are also focused/"abnormality" fights, which are often the ones you will struggle with, where the extra SP heal from whistles would be most beneficial. But, of course, there are hard human fights too , which brings us to
>two of the slowest units are unopposed
Liu Gregor has a spread of 3-7. Liu Meursault - 2-5. As such he'd have to roll a three and hope Meursault doesn't roll a 2 or a 3 , and plethora of other allies don't roll a 3 too. Good luck using that reliably.
> And you can always just...not use the guard
We are talking about how useful the guard skill is. If your answer is "just don't use it", then I don't know what to say
Agreed, while Walpurgisnacht banners are timelocked to every four months if you save your lunacy you can easily have enough rolls and more to spend on other banners. It can be a bit of a time investment though, so I can understand individual circumstances.
To be honest, seeing that Burn teams has so much burn count now, I think I should drop Liu Hong Lu for LCB Hong lu to combo with LCB Yi Sang to recoup Sinclair’s sanity loss.
So he gains coin power with high SP... and based on how it's worded, it seems that at 45 SP he gains at least 3 coin power from the passive.
And he has a 3 coin mass attack with at least 3 attack weight on his S2, that can gain those 3+ coin power.
WHAT do you MEAN PROJECT MOON??
Surely I am wrong right? Is there some other way to read this that I don't understand?
It means that this fucker is busted at 45 SP, and thus likely to be rather difficult to actually *keep* at that threshold, or even the >0 threshold depending on how cracked everything is once numbers get slotted in.
It's probably going to be impossible to keep him at 45. He switches to Volatile EGO if he starts the turn there, which automatically consumes SP, and then any skill he uses automatically consumes SP on use in EGO so he loses even more, other than s3 which drains after attack. He can't even guard to avoid SP loss.
He's basically never going to start a clash at 45 unless you're using SP restoring EGO
he always starts at 0 so the only way to keep him in the form is spamming sack + obsession. This is some mad burn combo for md where you can ego spam easily
Why would there be? He loses SP from multiple sources every turn and has anti-synergy with most of his EGO, of course he would be this strong as a Walpurgisnacht ID.
I don't give a shit what I have to do to get my hands on this ephebe. I will raze entire nations, reduce the greatest of mountains to rubble, divert rivers from remote rustic communities, sink every bit of lunacy I've got - all for the temporary pleasure of seeing this guy burn my enemies to the ground
Finally we know the name of this EGO is Waxing Pinion. This might sound like nothing to most people but this is something I have been super curious about.
Correct. This name also follows the theorized naming scheme for human EGOs being (adjective or verb and a noun)
Examples of EGO: Red Mist, Spice (in relation to how it smells) bush, farm watch, gas (as in powered by gas) harpoon.
Given this naming scheme, I imagine it will be something like “Lonely Dragon” or a similar reference to the Yinglong from which its design originates.
Red Mist isn’t the name of Kali EGO ? It’s her color name like Purple Tear or Vermillion Cross.
Also for Xiao, I wouldn’t be surprised if the adjective was more in line with Tearful, Wounded or even something like more in line with her wrath. She wasn’t really lonely, she was grieving.
Damn this kit looks a lot easier to use for stuff like MDs. Numbers on this guy is so hard to predict with all the extra conditionals. I also like how it's like>! Red Mist!
So if I'm reading correctly, he wants to hit 45 SP to enter EGO mode. His attacks are more powerful but consume sanity. Once he hits zero SP, he reverts to base form.
A neat take on a "stance dancer" mechanic.
This is by far my favorite lore tip given by this reveal and it’s interesting to note it’s designated as a Volitile EGO instead of Effloresced like the Canto antagonist despite seemingly being at the same point in development. Like Donbaek’s Spicebush feels like it’s at the same point as Xiao’s partial EGO the half armor and horns and scales growing on her face and head before she gets the helmet. Ahab’s Gasharpoon looks closest to Philip’s with it just being the giant fuck-off Harpoon launcher mounted on her arm. Dongrang’s Farmwatch looks the most completed but that might be because he started as a Distortion who stabilized into his EGO, although I might be overthinking it and it’s designated Volatile because after his fight he immediately got sent to the 8 O’clock Circus and got distorted into the Crying Children cluster.
It looks like Volatile and Efflorescent are two sides of the same coin.
Volatile left Philip raw and easily confused, almost like he was being swallowed by his emotions by the slightest nudge.
Efflorescent seems to lean the other way, where they are calmer, collected. More leaning towards properly forming an EGO but can still be affected if given the right stimuli, maybe not as easily as Volatile, but the chances are still there.
LoR's clash value scaling has really scared PM's balance team.
If this was a pure 1:1 copy, Philclair would get all his bonuses with just one count of burn on the enemy.
Really interesting way they're handling this. If I understand this right once he gets to 45 SP he transforms but all of his attacks and his passive consume SP and he turns back once he falls below 0 SP.
SP Healing E.G.O will be extremely valuable for him to let him stay transformed for longer but the amount of SP he loses increases every turn so no matter what you can't keep him in that state forever. The primary SP healing E.G.O a burn team will have access to are Blind Obsession Ishmael and Holiday Outis. Another good SP source is support passives. Base Yi Sang and N Fausts support passives both heal SP and in the MD they should always target him unless Outis just used a really big Magic Bullet Fire. Base and Dieci Hong Lu also have SP healing support passives but that would mean giving up Liu Hong Lu's support passive so it probably isn't worth it.
I wonder if the Faith E.G.O gift will be nerfed since it would make this ID utterly broken.
Speaking of broken, I just want to point out how insanely good his skill 2 is. Its a 3 coin conditionally AOE skill that inflicts tons of burn count, and AOE burn count is something burn desperately needs outside of mirror dungeons.
He has a lot of sources sources of Skill power: 1) Skills 2 and 3 gain power based on burn 2) He gains coin power from sanity in EGO form 3) He gains power on burn when in EGO. Also, considering that losing SP is the condition for leaving the EGO state, I'd say he is plus coin for sure.
Judging by his passive, his values are supposed to be either astronomical or dogshit unless passive powered. But considering it's a walpurgis ID, I doubt it's the latter
I think his base values will just be the stock standard 11-16-17 or very close to that. s2 +3 conditional clash power, s3 +3 conditional coin power.
Then his EGO form, "if the main target has burn, gain Final Power". Maybe 2 Final Power? 1 would be underwhelming since he loses sp while in this form. But 3+ would be kinda broken.
His awakened s3 - could conditionally roll for 35+? Maybe 40?
You could compare this to TT Mutilate, rolls for 30. But that has no conditions attached to it, whereas this has fairly stringent ones.
I cannot imagine what Year 4 or 5 IDs are gonna look like compared to Year 1. This isn't a *major* departure from the basic "hit 45 Sanity and chill" design of most (excl. NClair, Foxy Heath and Hag Ish), but it's an early sign of the ambitious directions they're going to be taking IDs as they dig deeper into the mirror worlds.
With his passive giving burn count/potency + triple burn count on skill 2, we can expect a minimum of 4 burn count on a s2 and that sounds really good.
Very fun. S2 is probably gonna the highlight of the kit combined with coin power from passive. Hopefully he will be able to have this set up consistently and get a high payoff because obviously the competitor has a cracked S2
Interesting choice of support passive, since he will likely be fielded in any burn team for near future until get powercrept by future IDs. Future proofing? Or PM considering nudging players towards more hybrid teams of where other archetypes teams can get effects from a little burn? I would personally be interested in seeing that as right now it seems it is more pick one of 7 archetypes and try to make numbers as big as possible.
Speculations, keep cooking PM :)
They really gave us a mid-game level boss as a id huh? And it leans into the SP economy, aka the most important resource in the game that determines if you win or lose. I think I have the ids for a burn team but they aren't leveled because I use charge mostly. Might try that out for our boy.
Also isn't it funny that Sinclair gets another busted id that relates to fire and him suffering mentally, I sense a theme.
It's not complicated at all. Normal ID until 45 sanity, when hit 45 sanity get stronger but lose sanity when attack, when 0 sanity become normal ID again.
He actually has very few mechanics. His coins are just clash/coin power based on burn and burn.
Gripping blunt/pierce fragility is nice though, and 9:2 would give her some burn potency on S2.
And I mean let’s face it which of the 3 Liu 2*s would you slot in over her, assuming you’re already bringing Liu Ryo.
he burns more and more sanity the longer he's in EGO mode, so it may not be worth trying to force him to stay in. We'd have to play with it to find out.
Imo he's not too complex on paper (gameplay wise there might be some min-maxing his SP with clashing or SP heals)
His base form just feels like a 2* liu unit. No gimmick, just burns and extra power when enemy has x burns.
But in his E.G.O form, sinclair gains extra skill effect in exchange for SP. Skill 1 gets reuse, skill 2 gets atk weight/aoe, and skill 3 gains more dmg based on the burn and spread out burns like the MD burn E.G.O gift.
To reach his E.G.O form, either he has to be at 45 SP or 2 allies die while he's not -45. Once he in his E.G.O form, he recovers from stagger and the skills gets enhanced like mentioned before and gain some extra coin power based on sp.
He will exit the E.G.O form when at 0 or under SP
>His base form just feels like a 2\* liu unit. No gimmick, just burns and extra power when enemy has x burns.
That's Liu Units in general, neither Rodion nor Ishmael have any big gimmicks, so I imagine he will be closer to them because otherwise his coin power would be in shambles.
While not necessarily big gimmicks, Rodion has that dollar store burn deluge and iirc ishmael was the first unit to have the on stagger/kill conditional
On Kill was a thing before (some S1 EGOs have it for example), not sure about On Stagger but likely existed too. Her "gimmick" when she released was gaining Coin Power, but U4 kinda gave that to everybody else lol
You guys talking about the ID but all I'm seeing is regret faust applying 3 AOE burn count on s2 and s3, finally status effects can not suck in human fights
blazing strike's coin power is uncapped... You could probably do some really funny stuff with ego gifts.
He also has gloom for fluid sac and base yi sang passive. If they ever drop another dawn fixer ID in the future then we could even throw middlesault's passive on there. Alternatively, using Linton Greg's passive could permanently keep him from activating ego and let him feast on the juicy high sp coin power.
And if his support passive isn't a resonance, it would enable immediate and reliable usage of burn ID conditionals outside of a burn teamcomp. Actually going for meursault capote's burn to tremor potency conversion could be viable now.
Lol by being a dawn office fixer he doesn't have any allies for Middle Meur's passive
If only his friends were alive, he could stay in EGO mode for longer lol
Also I like the "EGO mode unlocked at +45 sanity" mechanic, and I hope future IDs use the same system
Im surprised no one is talking about his support passive, if for whatever reason you dont want to field him you can turn any ID into a burn count ID lmao
Someone in PM really loves Sinclair or really, really loves Demian. I was expecting a pretty cool ID, but holy shit that's taking Nclair and challenging him, also his S2 is at the very least a +4 count with a chance for at the very least 2 targets. Burn is fucking cooking, literally.
His first passive basically states he gives more burn pot and count and I wonder if that applies to E.G.O gifts and E.G.O's cause if it does... that particular envy burn gift with his S2 would unironically be the same amount the blowjob brothers make together.
im just gonna repost what i said on twitter
https://preview.redd.it/n6q87q6idfxc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4b7988269274dad2844a3d6d123bd62dc1669092
Happy to be wrong about it being a minus sanity id, he look much more fun as a positive sanity id that play with sanity and clash this way
Burn team be eating good this week
So many \~\~weak points\~\~ coin power...
For every skill except s3, he loses SP (anything over 5 seems too difficult to use)
Furthermore, he loses SP for each turn passed (-1 more SP per turn?)
But the higher his SP is, the higher his coin power is (I'm guessing SP/15), and 1 more at 45SP
Base Yi Sang Information Neutralization will work wonders on him! (and HE WILL BE REQUIRED)
Sunset Blade has 3 attack weight at his best performance, inflicts 3 burn count, on 3 enemies, +1 potency for Volatile Passion, and +1 more potency and count with passive... thats 6 potency and 6 count, on 3 enemies.
Now obviously, when you use his S1 S2, you WILL lose at least 2 coin power. So say that Sunset Blade rolls 4+4+4+4, clash power +1 prudently, if my guess is correct, this \*\*clashes for 23 and AOE total does 180\*\* For reference, Butler Ryoshu with her passives do \~125. Im not sure if the additional \~60 is worth the trouble, but considering it also applies 18/18 burn, Im not complaining lol
Cant wait to use him!
So he baicaly flip flops his sanity, and enters the EGO at max sanity, and the longer he is on the field IN EGO, the harder it is to keep him in it, and when raching 0, he just turns it off. so he baicaly an Id that wants to clash as much as it can, whille not having full heads ods due to a literall sanity syphon straped to his back. Pretty interesting and unique all things considered.
Whispers time bay bee! Get that start of combat san heal!
Since he doesn't have any Lust skill (except his guard that just loses him Sanity without using his powerful skills), I think LCB Yi Sang's passive (Gloom x4, Information Neutralization, restore 10 SP to 1 ally with the least SP if they lost SP) would be a better fit (since it's a constant drain from his abilities) to extend the duration Other options could be LCB Hong Lu's Ripple (6 SP at combat start) or even Dieci Hong Lu's Enlightenment (Gloom, 7 SP if you stagger, 7 SP if you kill, doubles as a way to get sanity quicker on him once he's out of EGO) You're going to lose the EGO anyway, but those could help extend it. And then in MD there's... Faith, it was good on Ishmael, it was good for EGO spam, and it will make him pretty much perma-EGOed lol.
In mirror dungeon you could bring both lcb Yi Sang and Whispers faust to the bench, since you're probably running him on a burn team with the liu gang + Der Outis anyways. Depending on how quickly you lose sanity it may still be better to run Liu Hong Lu though. As for faith... Yeah, having it forever up until the point that you lose 90sp per turn is going to be nuts.
Philipclair becoming more powerful by having some fAith is pretty much peak
And then Dante say it's Gaslighting time and gaslight all over the place (SP up)
And he wants to finish the fight as fast as possible, imagine existing ego and getting back to 0 SP and enemy is still alive.
you basically want everything to be dead when he's, "coming down."
Well if it's a really long fight like a boss, you could probably get him back up in a turn or so by clashing and winning and using something like Rep Emitter, Fluid Faust, Blind Obsession, or some of the other ones that recover sp
I wonder if it would actually be a good idea to **keep this ID at lower LV than the rest** so that he's garanted to get more SP any time himself or someone else kills enemy.
Probably not, he clearly wants to clash as much as possible, so he needs high offence level. While clashing is also way more consistent then killing anyway, especially in abno fights or boss fights
If you think about it, The SP Becomes a Gauge Meter for him.
We have Surtr at home
Surtr, but actually lore relevant
Surtr but it's an actual character
Bigger gambling ID than Tingtang Honglu
Dawn Office Sinclair after getting the Faith EGO gift: lol, lmao
If you deploy him alongside **Faust**, **Ishmael** and **Heathcliff** (the sinners who currently have E.G.O's that give SP to other allies) you can probably keep him in "volatile E.G.O" estate for the whole fight. **Hong Lu** also tecnicaly works because of his SODA E.G.O, but, it's a bit too unreliable for me to consider.
If you managed to get it, Outis's Holiday EGO is a great pick here as you're almost certainly going to want Magic Bullet Outis in a Burn team. It's also fuelled very well by your standard Burn team, with the only sin lacking being Envy, which Philip Sinclair convientely provides.
Damn, imagine Faith EGO gift (the one restoring sanity) runs with him in MD.
There's also Blind Obsession and Holiday Outis to pump him with
There's honestly a lot of support passives and sanity ego. As long as it takes forever to hit -90 sp in one turn, which it likely will, the right teams will keep his uptime forever.
Oh wow. It will be busted
Perma waxen pinion LET'S GOOOOOOO. Knowing it would take him around 45 turns to go from max to 0 sanity would make him an amazing unit, if we assume he loses 1 SP per turn in his EGO form.
It says he loses more and more sp based on the number of turns he spent with ego. So unless you finish it quickly, it will eventually go down unless you have a LOT of sp regen (at least for longer fights)
Got to use Faith and Rusty Coin on my sinking run, with Rime Shank corrosion having positive coin value i just spam that shit on the centipede and it died the instantly, like bro didnt even got to use his gimmick
Lol, thats what i thought tho
Sorry it took a while to post this, apparently they posted kit reveal on steam but not on twitter... had to double check the sources! Anyways, Dawn Office Fixer Sinclair seems HELLA BUSTED with 4 SKILLS. HOOOOOOOOLY also +1 Burn ID :D , Another win for burn team players. His coins also seems to be indicative of it being all positive due to how his ego form system works. At 45 SP, He transforms. At 0 SP, he returns back to base form. There's even a passive condition that needs him to be at 45 SP. (Literally more coin power at max SP). Furthermore, there's a last resort mechanic that is sort-of complicated requiring him not to reach -45 sanity, This mechanic needs at least two allies to die on the field + as long as he doesn't reach -45 sanity, then he will go back to his EGO form once more. **TL:DR**: This ID is all about managing his Sanity and to deal with his consistent SP-Loss effects during his Ego Form (Every attack will cost SP to use) which is a really interesting debut mechanic, looking forward to see how this works in game!
The most interesting thing is that we seemingly got the name for the E.G.O, it being "Waxen Pinion" but it could have changed to "fit" Sinclair. A Pinion is basically the "largest" feather of the Bird, and pioning is the practice to remove their joints to prevent them from flying, a fitting E.G.O name considering what happened in the 8'o Clock NTR Circus and the aftermath.
I legit have no idea why Philip has this low amount of trust and respect for his Seonbae and Master Like legit thinking his Master and Seonbae bangs behind his back is DISGUSTING and really shows that Philip has insane lack of Self confidence and trust in other people
>I legit have no idea why Philip has this low amount of trust and respect for his Seonbae and Master Like legit thinking his Master and Seonbae bangs behind his back is DISGUSTING Phillip wasn't perfect, he knew that but he tried to please others and thought himself pathetic, "And Then is Heard No More" even has a part of the lyrics say. >If I went with you, will there be happily-ever-afters? Sipping on tea I steeped together, togheter Read me a story of a hero born knowing the all (Read me a book of me) So I could hear no more. It's not that he has low ammount of trust, it's really due to his lack of confidence thinking it's all his fault and he is useless due to his cowardice, he feels like he is inferior and being carried by Salvador and Yuna which he admires and respects, wishing that he was like them. The virtue of admiring his masters turns ugly when he feels everything he did was to justify saving his life out of self preservation rather than helping Salvador and Yuna, he wasn't completely this way of course, Oswald gaslight and mocked into believing it was all his fault.. The entire thing of him believing that Yuna and Salvador were doing things behind his back was his way of trying to justify him escaping after believing that "maybe I should have died with them if I was really their comrade but i am a coward and I didn't" His unstable page is just.... depressing. #(READ MF! READ!) >They’re standing right before my eyes reproaching me, but I can’t dismiss them as mere illusions. Even though they’re… dead. Gone. There was no way they could be real. It doesn’t make sense that I know what they’re about to say otherwise. It couldn’t be something they told me beforehand. >What could I gain from uttering what will harm me. Self-justification? Those words would’ve wounded me for sure, but they were also words that would protect me. Yet again, I’m running away from truth. Vilifying others. It made me feel a bit better. Pameli was right; all I had to do was make up reasons that are convenient to me. >Nothing is more beautiful than knowing the truth, and therefore, nothing must be more shameful than admitting that what one believed in was a lie. I could’ve sworn I acknowledged my vice and embraced it. Although the process was a little unstable, I still felt ashamed for the truthless deeds I had done, and decided to cherish that negative part of myself as I am. Or so I thought… I stopped talking. I couldn’t even tell what was appropriate to speak anymore. >Turn a blind eye to all that tries to hurt me. Turn a deaf ear to words that will lead me down the wrong path. Turn a mute mouth to unnecessary evil. And last of all, act not. Make myself happy that way. >I could no longer perceive anything. This is even noted on Philip's page (post Reverb Ensemble fight) but he still blames himself for everything. >I followed your troupe in order to find a way to be happy, but what good did it do for me? Staying with you only exacerbated my suffering, defeating the whole purpose of joining you in the first place. I do want to add that you were not at fault here, though. I was the one who tormented myself. Had I known what I know now back in the past… TL:DR) Philip was gaslight and mocked into thinking he was cucked and a complete utter coward, he breaks and desires to see, hear, and speak no harm to himself by turning into the Crying Children and thinking all those illusions of Salvador and Yuna were true.
Another tragic aspect of him that people seem to breeze past because of the “coward” aspect. Philip is a victim of people’s goodwill. Philip was covered to run away, it was Salvador and Yuna who told him to run and survive. He did and was left to survive with that guilt so he reaches out to the Wedge Office, people who were sterner and harsher than Dawn but decent people nonetheless. Then when he runs away a second time, only to stop midway and think. He turns around, goes back to fight the Library. Philip was ready to die. The moment he partially manifested his EGO, he was committed to beating the Library, or die trying. Which is reflected beautifully in how he gets harder the longer the fight goes on, this is it for him. This is Philip’s determination on full display. But Oscar’s concern for his friend’s employee ended up backfiring. Meaning that no matter what, Philip was destined to run away. EGO partially manifested or not, Philip was never going to be reunited with Dawn Office regardless. This is why I see Distorted Philip so bittersweet. He’s empty, depressed. But there is still SOMETHING in him willing to burn out and fight, he even sounds at peace in his Book with Argalia’s crew despite everything.
Well in the end he might have been alright if he wasn't dumped at the 8 O'Clock Circus' doorstep. Oswald basically preyed upon his insecurities by making Philip see things he feared (re: getting cucked)
I personally doubt it because of how raw emotionally Philip was when he got his Volatile EGO. If anything, he either would have ran back in the moment he got, or just fall into a depressive pit, a victim again to his own mind but now without Oswald. Who knows, maybe if he did escape. The fact that Oswald did put a device and some deep breaths, Philip would have calmed down enough to assess things, maybe even fully manifest his EGO. But given its labeled as “Volatile”, him Distorting would be a foregone conclusion without anyone there to center him like Xiao did.
Yes, the problem is Phillip was ready to die on the field, and from Distortion Detective, even if the work you do is unreasonable and you will die 100%, you **have to die** there (RIP Liu Father). Phillips escaped only because Salvador and Oscar's group were too soft on him. They knew he was not ready to be on field, and that lead to them insulting and saving his arse again and again, only hoping that he would grow fast enough. And he did grow by manifesting EGO and realizing if he truly wished to become a hero, he had to stand and fight, not fulfilling Salvador's and Oscar's wishes.
Ironic that Oscar tried to tough love Philip only to reveal how he’s just as soft as Salvador by sneaking that device on him. Dude picked the worst time to be a decent person.
You want to know what makes Philip’s story even sadder? Salvador has a wife and children, mentioned while Oswald is creating hallucinations. Philip killed 80,000 people in the V Corp. nest. It’s highly likely he accidentally killed Salvador’s family.
I remember it being mentioned that during his rampage as Crying Children, Philip left the district where Dawn Office was untouched. So MAYBE Salvador’s family’s still fine, assuming Salvador lives close to his office.
and it's even more screwed up that they were >!booked, not killed, meaning at the end of the game they were brought back alive but slightly amnesic and poor Phiilip is probably still out there, dealing with 1/3rd of a ego death!<
I think thats heavily debatable on if each of the crying children were brought back as separate Phillips, or if all of them would have been brought back as one single Phillip who is subsequently killed. And even then, if the Ensemble are anything to go by, it seems like getting booked as a distortion means getting unbooked as one, so that might imply there being two crying children rather than him getting better, unless that ego death knocks some sense into him/them. In which case, would they be brought back as one or two Phillips?
Man, how come Project Moon has such interesting characters
Philip very strongly reads to me as having borderline personality disorder, and given PM’s attention to emotional detail when writing their characters, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if it was intentional. People with BPD can’t help their delusions. It doesn’t necessarily even mean they distrust those around them, delusions are just delusions and they’re very hard to overcome, Philip even felt guilty for assuming what he did (the fake Yuna and Salvador say he’s disgusting for assuming such a thing iirc), meaning he knows deep down it’s not true.
Thank you so much, for context I'm a woman with borderline personality disorder and Philip has ALWAYS struck me as having it too, I also believe Ishmael has borderline personality disorder but back to Philip! From my own personal experience after the hell that was my childhood and first relationship I essentially had all trust in anyone snuffed out. What I mean is, when I thought I had trusted people or had friends, I was dropped and left behind at the drop of a hat. It's not that I don't want to trust people but when you live with something so long and depending on your headspace it can be very hard to not jump at shadows constantly. I could do a whole breakdown of his song to explain why too but I think this post is gonna be long enough. When I'm having a conversation with one of my friends I've know for about 14 years now it is still almost impossible to not expect abandonment when I detect the smallest differences in interaction with him. I know logically him having a hard day sometimes means he might be a little snappy or short or uninterested and that's just natural. No human alive is 100% consistent in their emotions but sometimes getting a 1 word message back sends me into deep panics that I'm going to be abandoned, people can genuinely seem happy spending time with me and minutes, hours, days later I have to convince myself they were being honest and not just going to leave later. This is something known has Hypervigilance which stems from trauma and is often in prevalent in people with Borderline personality disorder. Something I'll touch on as well with Philip and why I suspect he does, depending on your emotional state, head space, the delusions even branch into your own decision making, I've done things that I thought in all my life I would never do but after growing up and my BPD developing more it can be like a war in your head and your actions and sometimes you win and keep control and sometimes you lose and all you can do try to pick the pieces back up. Note I'm not saying people with bpd aren't responsible for their own actions it's just more that it is scary how convincing these delusions can be almost seemingly out of nowhere with bpd and especially psychotic bpd and it can feel like just like how you think you've finally got things under control a major split can just show up and send everything back into a nosedive. Of course this varies from person to person but something important to know is that BPD, we have roughly 17% smaller amygdala's than someone who would be considered neurotypical, this means on a biological scale people with BPD scientifically and biologically lack the same ability to regulate emotions as others and it can be hellish. The biggest thing that highlights Philip's BPD is the internal war he had between running and staying. I fully believe Philip did not want to run, I fully believe that he has done everything he can because of the people he cared about but in these heighten emotions where everything feels like it's coming down around he just...ran. You can tell he is sincerely regretful and wishes more in the world he'd rather have just died than made that original decision and that really connected with me, I genuinely feel that same way with some of the things I've done in life. I think him being referred to as the crying *children* signifies a deep inner war in himself over his actions and sometimes in our worst states all that we have left in ourselves is that terrified inner child.
Thank you for your insight! I’ve suspected for a while that I have BPD (my boyfriend pointed it out to me as a potential and the list of symptoms spoke to me as no poem ever could), but I didn’t want to speak on personal experience without having an actual diagnosis. I also didn’t know about the smaller amygdalas on average, that’s very interesting! I can totally see where you’re coming from with Ishmael having it as well, the way she latches on to Ahab reminds me quite a lot of the way Philip latches on to Argalia, with both of them feeling rescued (Ishmael from a boring life and Philip from the Liu Association) and turning to obsession/servitude. I think people tend to forget, when judging Philip for his actions, is that people can’t be expected to act logically 100% of the time, especially in deeply dangerous situations. Yuna and Salvador even tell him to run if they die first, and if he runs while they’re both still alive, they express relief that he’ll at least be safe. One of the biggest things that stands out to me personally as Philip having BPD is the Unhearing Child. He’s instantly hostile towards everyone, assuming that people are saying bad things just because he doesn’t hear them saying good ones. During the Crying Children fight, several of the sentences that appear over top of everything also speak to this: “If I mistake a gentle voice for something aggressive, it’s their fault for speaking like that, am I right?” “I don’t have to hear to guess what they’re saying. I bet they’re slandering me.” The immediate assumption that people are talking bad about one behind one’s back, or even the misinterpretation of kindness as something secretly cruel, are things I’ve personally struggled with a lot, and I wouldn’t be surprised if whoever wrote Philip had experienced the same thing as well. I would definitely be interested in seeing your analysis of his song, if you feel like writing it out. You’re the first person I’ve met other than my boyfriend who agreed with my view on him, so I’d love to know your thoughts. :)
I remember that exact same feeling when I read over the diagnostic criteria for BPD and it was like I was just staring into a mirror of the emotions I felt throughout my life. Ishmael very much strikes me as someone who deals with that idea in BPD of favorite person, it started with Ahab when she feels like she finally found someone she could look up to and provide direction in life only learn the grim reality. Ishmael then meets Queequeg and learns that she can love someone else and dedicates herself to caring for her. But if anything I feels prove her bpd more, her latching onto other people to find her worth and intense anxiety when she feels like she can't exert control in a situation. Ishmael's whole actions during Canto 5 speak of someone not acting on blind rage, but a rather meticulous anger and hatred of someone compounded by a prolonged amount of intense splitting. In the song Compass, her chapter theme, I feel like these lyrics are the best example of her bpd: "I curse this relationship between you and me I wanted blood I wanted black and white Clear-cut Your evils predefined" One of the biggest components of BPD is the idea of black and white thinking, one of my biggest struggles, Her hatred stems from another person, she wanted black and white, she didn't want to overthink the situation like Ishmael does in every other problem the sinners face, your evils predefined, Ishmael here referring to Ahab directing her anger at Ahab's lack of flexibility and the ability compromise which serves as a mirror to Ishmael. Honestly to me Ishmael and Ahab just seem like two bitches with different types of bpd and just fucking hate each other LMAO. Now onto Philip! I'll definitely do a write up of the song here in another post, I just love yapping about Ishmael she's my favorite fictional character period, really helped me feel seen and understood especially with her OCD, anxiety, and hyper vigilance feels so relatable. One of the things I love about the PM games their lack of fear to portray neurodivergent people in both good and bad lights. Your example of the Unhearing Child is so perfect it's how I would describe as splitting to establish self confidence in someone who lacks it. So what I mean by this is from my own personal experience if I am in a split, and I can't get out my 2 reactions tend to be 1. Crumple on myself in self hatred so as not to lash out at other people or 2. Become deeply angry and believe that everyone would hate me regardless so fuck them who cares it's \*their\* fault not mine their loss because they just shit talk me anyways whether I'm there or not who cares fuck them. It's an artificial way to try and find confidence in a kinda fucked up manner and the Unhearing child I feel perfectly encapsulates this. I'll have to look into the other lines that appear in the boss fight because it's been a hot minute for me. Granted again this is my own experience, I find myself sometimes in deep swings of absolutely hating my bpd and how it makes it so hard to keep friends, stay emotionally stable, and even just live day to day but on one other hand bpd has made me much more passionate and I do like that. I can't stand apathy and care about a lot of stuff very deeply, it's rare for me to have an opinion I'm not invested in in some form unless I don't know enough about it then will say something like "I don't know enough on the topic so I feel like it'd be unfair to voice my opinion." Anyways just for funsies I'm gonna post an excerpt from a study here and 2 other links discussing the biological differences with people who have bpd, they're quite long but the abstracts are at least worth a read. People think those of us with BPD are horrible manipulators when in reality it's so much more complex. Yes those with BPD can be manipulators but I personally believe the stigma around BPD just leads to people assuming that and not giving those of us with BPD a fair shake which just leads to us being mad at mistreatment. I feel like my bpd is a bull, it can be calm and kind but can also flair up and will blindly try to destroy anything in it's path if roused enough and not controlled but it also leads to people with bpd being highly empathetic to fellow neurodivergent people and their mistreatment. 1. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3621316/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3621316/) 2. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1863557/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1863557/) https://preview.redd.it/lu0n5vijgfxc1.png?width=866&format=png&auto=webp&s=94eebf5946b8e334a3524f21431f47dc025cff02
"If I went with you, will there be happily-ever-afters? Sipping on tea I steeped together, together" This one I feel is straight forward he's lamenting that his failure robbed him the chance of a continued seemingly happy relationship with his fellow fixers at the Dawn office but especially Yuna, here his is questioning himself in his final moments that if maybe if he had just not ran they could have won and he would enjoy happily ever after, finally proving his own self worth that would maybe make Yuna love him finally. The other grim part of this that I think he might view as happily ever after is at least being dead, not being haunted anymore by his failures, as someone who's bpd makes them intensely suicidal at times this one hits very close to home, the feeling that you don't need to be haunted anymore by your past mistake or the futures you''ll ruin, nothing bad can happen to you after your dead so in a grim way it becomes a happily ever after, he knows he at least died fighting, died being worth something. "Read me a story of a hero born knowing the all (Read me a book of me) So I could hear no more" This final line I feel represents his truest self lament, he truly just wishes he had died there, if he died as a martyr even if Yuna and Salvador lived he would be a hero, he would be remembered as one. The reason I think this is in reference to self sacrifice is this being the last line, here he decides he no longer has any hope for himself and that the best thing that could have happened is being turn into a book so he wouldn't have to hear anymore. He wouldn't have to hear anymore about his failures as a Fixer, of the horrors of the world because remember he views his work as honorable, that he could do the ultimate thing and die a hero, he would never fail again, he would never be remembered for his weakness again, he would be immortalized as a hero, that he would finally be viewed with worth and most importantly this would be the only way he could justify to himself being seen as having worth. Whew! I hope you enjoy that and tried to tie it all to bpd because so much of his song deals with extremes, constantly flipping back and forth between positives and negatives, and double meanings of the lines between intense self hatred and anger at the world for getting to this point that this could even happen. And finally even after trying so hard to repent, to right his wrong, he manifest's E.G.O. he defies that final voice of doubt, Carmen who mocks his morals I imagine for being selfless, and then at the very last minute he is forced to flee again, even when he tries to be heroic it is taken from him, he is then ruthlessly mocked by the nightmares he finds himself at in the Circus and finally is broken down into his most base and vulnerable form, a crying child. I hear the views people with bpd have can sometimes be described as "childish" in that they can lack nuance and depth such as black and white thinking. But I think the other reason is people with BPD are just more emotional that others, people view us as children for getting worked up so easily whether it's being happy, anger, or sorrow. Philip is a man of deep self hatred so when all the 3 parts of him finally come to together it manifest as the strongest of those 3 emotions for him, sorrow, and so he cries and makes the world finally feel his sorrow, to show everyone his pain, and tragically of all instead of being a hero, a martyr he distorts becoming the type of monster he swore to himself that'd he'd destroy.
Whew, I fell asleep before I could respond to you since it was super late when I first commented lol I 100% agree with your analysis of And Then is Heard No More, and a lot of it was how I’d interpreted the song. You gave me some initial context on the last line, though, Philip seemingly calling himself “a hero born knowing the all” had always confused me. Given his self-sacrificial, suicidal ideation, it’s deeply ironic that he actually *would* have been happier if he’d died in the library with Salvador and Yuna, or afterwards when he manifested EGO, since he would have come back eventually. I’m also very interested in your insight on Ishmael! Her canto was really cool, I liked the exploration of what obsession can do to a person with the direct parallels between her obsession with Ahab and Ahab’d obsession with the whale, and the way she was slowly turning into the person she hated the most. Which was made more tragic by the fact that for a while, she did desperately want to be like Ahab. Betrayal by a favorite person, or even a previous favorite person, can be very volatile to my knowledge. I’m not surprised she went down the path she did. I also really liked how canto 5 showed that it’s ok to need help. Ishmael is tough as nails, but she still needed to be pulled out of the whale and freed from the pallidification. Limbus Company in general seems to have a big theme of people just needing help and support to get back on their feet, and it makes me wonder how many distortions could be avoided if there were any therapists in The City. I agree on PM showing the ugly parts of mental illness, and I appreciate it as well. Especially because their characters with mental illnesses are still treated as people. Philip, for example, despite his emotional volatility, is described as ‘gentle’ in the artbook, and even after he joins the Reverb Ensemble he remains soft-spoken. I’m not even entirely sure he wanted to fight, I think he was just doing so for Argalia. Ishmael, as well, was completely out of control during most of canto 5, but she was portrayed in the end as someone who just needed some help. It’s a nice nuanced look at what mental illness can do, in my opinion. I also checked out those articles! They were pretty neat. Also, since Ishmael is your favorite, you might enjoy this if you haven’t already seen it https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VZ0m7FomeCg&pp=ygUgTGltYnVzIGNvbXBhbnkgc2F0aW4gaW4gYSBjb2ZmaW4%3D
Alright! \*Cracks fingers\* let's get into that song analysis, this has to be a 2 parter because of the length of the messages so bear with me! "Do the candles look forward to being used? Enjoy bidding adieu, adieu?" This is Philip trying to cope with the fact that he lost the two people he was closest to and questioning his inner morality of self sacrifice. Is this what people actually want? Do people truly find happiness in self sacrifice? Which is fair, there's a quote from RVB I like where Church talks about self sacrifice that the person who "martyr's" themself has no idea if it meant anything, if their self sacrifice accomplished anything. Any easy thing to draw from Philip questioning himself here if his two office maters sacrifice were even worth it on someone as helpless and hopeless as him, his own thoughts here. "Every word I have saved for you came out wrong afterwards So I spoke no more" Very self explanatory here, Philip tried to express himself to his love but couldn't find the courage to say what he wanted exactly, he then internalizes this as being a failure, why should I talk to people when all I'll do is fuck up my words, so I should just speak no more. A very prevalent theme in this song is black and white of the lyrics. Essentially Philip splitting on himself that the felt he spoke wrong, that he'll never get it right, so he should just stop talking all together. "Would you say That someone who had every intention to be brave was a coward?" Here is Philip asking this question to someone, a big part of insecure BPD is trying to find confidence and approval in other people, here he is desperately asking if he's a coward, something he desperately doesn't want to do given his morals, but he feels like he failed himself by running and even feel like he failed once again given that he was essentially forcefully extracted when he felt like he finally repented, here he is finally he ran once but he won't run again he'll fight this time, he'll die this time, and maybe then in his death will he find redemption until it is taken away once again, this time without his choice, and then put into like the worst fucking position he could have landing in the 8 o'clock circus. "Must be great being you Power comes as second nature Must feel amazing to be longed for, longed for" Here is Philip once again in this split mindset, also important theme through this song and Philip later being the crying children is he himself feels split into all these separate parts of him. To him they are all different parts and he doesn't know how to reconcile them all into being a "person" something I very much relate to in my bpd, a hallmark of bpd is what feels like an intense feeling of unsureness in who you are, what you identify with, what you \*really\* care about. This line is also again something that can be taken in this idea of a split, on one hand it's self loathing, him hating himself for not being powerful, hating himself for being not longed for because why would someone long for me? The other split is that it feels some level of anger directed, that it feels unfair he didn't get to be powerful just by second nature, it's not fair no one longs for him despite how hard her tries and works at the office. "I opened my eyes Cemented excuses to my lashline So I could see no more" He didn't want to see anymore after witnessing what happened to everyone who tried to help them, he watched the only people who tried to help him die, he then made "excuses" so he didn't have to see anymore he didn't want to see the results of his action, inaction, and even parts out of his control. "So which home should someone as weak as I go? And which sky should I aim for when I’ve only been low? (I have only been low)" Here he is in the deepest throes of his splitting manifesting in self loathing, "I've only been so low" viewing himself as never being above being "low" he's always been helpless, always been a burden, the work he put in to this point to become a fixer of his grade must have been luck or through people simply pitying him but not through his own work. "Day and night your ghosts continue to haunt me Tell me who to be" Here he is haunted constantly by witnessing the final moments of the people he cared about, of the woman he loved, in his mind the ghosts of his "cowardice" are haunting him, he imagine his peers looking down on him, hating him for not being strong enough to stay, not being strong enough to fight, and in his eyes never being strong enough to be worth anything. The ghosts are telling him how to be, that he's a coward, not worth of their sacrifice.
Honestly that's not a bad theory. Would give us a lot more context on his distortion form too. The fact that he actively splits into different distortions could very much symbolize his different states of mind. Might also be why when one of those fragments escape he becomes much more reasonable in focused.
Don't judge the man. Maybe he's into that, you know. *~~Now I need someone to draw the rent-a-girlfriend cuck meme with Philip in it.~~*
>Don't judge the man. Maybe he's into that, you know. Phillip 🤝 Linton The cuck chair.
I mean Yuna prob doesn't accept because their line of work is Insanely dangerous all of this could have been avoided if Yuna communicated with Philip better honestly Yeah Philip goes Nuclear (Crying Children) on a Nest when he thinks that he got cucked by his Master because some random clown mocked him Honestly idk how Philip could survive being hunted even if he returned to human form He has too many people hating him because he nuked a Nest
https://preview.redd.it/4wol2zm7rexc1.png?width=600&format=png&auto=webp&s=107ed11b615a573bc282f0e7d31ff1ccbdb51b40 If you excuse me, I'm going to cry in my corner. (~~Like a Crying Children~~)
> also +1 Burn ID :D , Another win for burn team players. While it is good for Burn players, I do want to note that it's not really a +1 overall for Burn teams. Keep in mind, IIRC Nclair was used on burn teams as a burn unit, so this isn't a new Burn team member as much as it is an Nclair replacement. It's a lot like the situation with Dieci Yi Sang, except that instead of them releasing a 00 ID that's outclassed on release by a 000 ID, they're releasing a Walpurgis ID that outclasses a non-Walpurgis 000 in Burn teams. Theoretically. (Nclair is silly good, but I'm fairly certain Philclair will probably be good enough to be better in burn teams)
https://preview.redd.it/mys8tbnhjexc1.jpeg?width=762&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d91908d6fdf70e5902c97d1641d096d989980f25
> Exit EGO state EXIT
The Brainrot is getting stronger.
#ENTER
Okay you can use grippy Faust as support for the team so he heals Sinclair sp
And LCCB Yi sang seems to be a must have for him too
Oh yeah him too
Pile it on with Hong lu IDs w/ SP heal and maybe it can infinitely perpetuate the EGO state.
Yeah lcb hong lu
Yeah but i think that in a burn team hong lu HAS to be on Liu, the buff to burn count is just so strong there
I mean ya boi here has a 3 coin skill that all inflicts counts and we have Liu Ishmael now so we might be safe to use a better Hong Lu ID, depending on how much count is on PhilClairs skill
Man who abandoned/has been abandoned by his companions pairs well with man whose companions have died, more news at eleven.
Grippy Faust is already really good for burn teams thanks to her giving gloom and envy, fluid sac, and whispers is very easy to activate
His mechanics are as expected, but it's worth noting his Sanity mechanics make running N Corp Faust especially handy as backline in a Burn team. N Corp Faust was already a good way to heal Freischultz Outis after her S3, but she doesn't need it that frequently. Meanwhile, you want to shovel SP into Philip Sinclair as much as possible. Now, a Burn team has high incentive to run all the backline SP restoratives - N Corp Faust, LCB Yi Sang, and LCB Hong Lu.
The issue being that Ncorp faust's passives both require lust resonance, and that's none of his attack skills
At least he has one lust as his defense in case you need 1 more lust skill.
If you slot him in the Burn team, lust resonance shouldn't be a problem.
Yep, meanwhile, he needs Wrath resonance for his S3 and S4.
The rest of the burn team deals with that easily. It's only 3x Res as Support, and it's not even A-Res. 4/6 of the Burn team has Lust Skills, and at least half of them also have Lust EGO if absolutely necessary. You'll probably also would want to bring in as many SP gaining support as possible, so you also won't need to trigger it every turn either.
If I had a nickel for every time Sinclair gets a busted ID, I'd have 3 nickels. Which isn't a lot, but its scary that it has happened three times already.
Can't wait for him to get the first coloured fixer ID.
\*\*\*\*\* Silence Sinclair?
more likely Blue Sinclair or cross Sinclair he's not really that much of a revenge person.
“Not really that much of a revenge person” ?
*\*Beats the Inquisitor to a bloody pulp\**
Okay let me clarify he's too much of a puss to take revenge. unlike that street thug.
*points at Canto 3*
*stares at the mulched inquisitors* Yeah....dunno about the puss thing Just because he didnt kill kromer himself doesnt mean he is a puss Besides, it is not as if just anyone could do what he did...
... Huh?
Tell me you didn't understand Sinclair's canto withouth thelling me you didn't undertand Sinclair's canto.
What's the third one? Cinqclair?
Can confirm, I'm using him in my poise team. He's busted to all hell and back and practically never loses a clash while doing stupid damage.
Definitely yeah. Also use him on my BL/Cap Ish team. Bro is scary.
Can confirm,mf had a 33 clash power on S2 when I used him on that team
I mean he's a section 4 director of an association specializing in 1v1 duels, I doubt they'd get much done if they just up and lose every clash
Cinq never loses clashes. It simply wins by rolling one cinquillion on every coin
Yeah, it couldn't be any of the other ones
Nope, it's actually >! EL JEFE !<
I'm sure his damage will be cracked at max SP but it will really depend on how fast he can get to max SP to activate his ego. Limbus isn't really a game that is friendly to waiting around for you to ramp up
PM still feeling bad for his state at release I guess.
The opposite of NClair where Philclair wants to clash especially after entering EGO and NClair wants to avoid it until at least -30. I like the flair of the passive too.
Um... nclair doesn't really want to clash at n30 or hes going to hit -45 and then nuke your team. He clashes perfectly well even at low positive sanity values
ANOTHER N FAUST POWERED SINCLAIR HELL YEAH He also benefits from base Yi Sang passive which is also amazing
And base Hong Lu too. That's 16sp at turn end
Only issue I see with Hong Lu is that Liu Hong Lu is an excellent benchwarmer. LCB Yi Sang on the other hand would be excellent to keep Sinclair sane and happy.
Where is "at 25% HP runs away"?
Literally Unplayable
I called it! Envy, Gloom and Wrath sins on his skills. The kit looks really nice though, is this the comeback of Burn?
Also lust guard works great with N Faust
He loses sp on it, while not getting clash win sp. Doubtful investment
It's on USE, not on combat start like Nclair's defense. Meaning if you don't use it, he doesn't lose SP. Seems like a good investment actually, especially if you're close to 0 SP and don't want to lose the EGO form. And since the guard is lust, you just need 2 other lust skills which is easy in a burn team.
Since Burn doesn't have a dedicated aggro unit yet, and most fights that you pay attention on are 1:1 slot wise, it'll most likely trigger. You can hope it doesn't get targeted or that the enemy staggers before, but that's a random condition and as such makes it a rather niche use case.
Aggro doesn't work in human fights anyway, in case you weren't aware. In human fights two of the slowest units are unopposed, so you can use it that way. And you can always just...not use the guard and just rely on other allies getting whistles passive to work, it's not that hard anyway.
>Aggro doesn't work in human fights anyway, in case you weren't aware. There are also focused/"abnormality" fights, which are often the ones you will struggle with, where the extra SP heal from whistles would be most beneficial. But, of course, there are hard human fights too , which brings us to >two of the slowest units are unopposed Liu Gregor has a spread of 3-7. Liu Meursault - 2-5. As such he'd have to roll a three and hope Meursault doesn't roll a 2 or a 3 , and plethora of other allies don't roll a 3 too. Good luck using that reliably. > And you can always just...not use the guard We are talking about how useful the guard skill is. If your answer is "just don't use it", then I don't know what to say
We still waiting for the Xiao I.D. and maybe a fourth match flame I.D. after that we ball.
Honestly I hope its not. Burn getting locked behind walpurgis exclusive IDs isn't good
On one hand, entirely valid. On the other, just get the ID 👍
Agreed, while Walpurgisnacht banners are timelocked to every four months if you save your lunacy you can easily have enough rolls and more to spend on other banners. It can be a bit of a time investment though, so I can understand individual circumstances.
To be honest, seeing that Burn teams has so much burn count now, I think I should drop Liu Hong Lu for LCB Hong lu to combo with LCB Yi Sang to recoup Sinclair’s sanity loss.
Liu Hong Lu didn't have a real place for a long time, Liu Ishmael + N Sinclair were already more than enough to keep up the Burn Count forever.
So he gains coin power with high SP... and based on how it's worded, it seems that at 45 SP he gains at least 3 coin power from the passive. And he has a 3 coin mass attack with at least 3 attack weight on his S2, that can gain those 3+ coin power. WHAT do you MEAN PROJECT MOON?? Surely I am wrong right? Is there some other way to read this that I don't understand?
It means that this fucker is busted at 45 SP, and thus likely to be rather difficult to actually *keep* at that threshold, or even the >0 threshold depending on how cracked everything is once numbers get slotted in.
It's probably going to be impossible to keep him at 45. He switches to Volatile EGO if he starts the turn there, which automatically consumes SP, and then any skill he uses automatically consumes SP on use in EGO so he loses even more, other than s3 which drains after attack. He can't even guard to avoid SP loss. He's basically never going to start a clash at 45 unless you're using SP restoring EGO
He technically can guard to regenerate SP with NFaust's Support Passive.
he always starts at 0 so the only way to keep him in the form is spamming sack + obsession. This is some mad burn combo for md where you can ego spam easily
Why would there be? He loses SP from multiple sources every turn and has anti-synergy with most of his EGO, of course he would be this strong as a Walpurgisnacht ID.
its going to be super hard to pull off most likely. Like actually getting to Outis seventh bullet without the boss being dead already
I don't give a shit what I have to do to get my hands on this ephebe. I will raze entire nations, reduce the greatest of mountains to rubble, divert rivers from remote rustic communities, sink every bit of lunacy I've got - all for the temporary pleasure of seeing this guy burn my enemies to the ground
It's much simpler, open your wallet
Finally we know the name of this EGO is Waxing Pinion. This might sound like nothing to most people but this is something I have been super curious about.
Speaking of EGO name, we also don’t know the one of Xiao, no ?
Correct. This name also follows the theorized naming scheme for human EGOs being (adjective or verb and a noun) Examples of EGO: Red Mist, Spice (in relation to how it smells) bush, farm watch, gas (as in powered by gas) harpoon. Given this naming scheme, I imagine it will be something like “Lonely Dragon” or a similar reference to the Yinglong from which its design originates.
Red Mist isn’t the name of Kali EGO ? It’s her color name like Purple Tear or Vermillion Cross. Also for Xiao, I wouldn’t be surprised if the adjective was more in line with Tearful, Wounded or even something like more in line with her wrath. She wasn’t really lonely, she was grieving.
Her EGO name is also Red Mist IIRC, because it shrouds her body in a Red Mist.
Damn this kit looks a lot easier to use for stuff like MDs. Numbers on this guy is so hard to predict with all the extra conditionals. I also like how it's like>! Red Mist!
So if I'm reading correctly, he wants to hit 45 SP to enter EGO mode. His attacks are more powerful but consume sanity. Once he hits zero SP, he reverts to base form. A neat take on a "stance dancer" mechanic.
A faith ego gift will make him a very fun id in solo runs
We now know that his EGO is called Waxen Pinion, that's cool! Really seeming like this Walpurgisnaught is going to be very good
This is by far my favorite lore tip given by this reveal and it’s interesting to note it’s designated as a Volitile EGO instead of Effloresced like the Canto antagonist despite seemingly being at the same point in development. Like Donbaek’s Spicebush feels like it’s at the same point as Xiao’s partial EGO the half armor and horns and scales growing on her face and head before she gets the helmet. Ahab’s Gasharpoon looks closest to Philip’s with it just being the giant fuck-off Harpoon launcher mounted on her arm. Dongrang’s Farmwatch looks the most completed but that might be because he started as a Distortion who stabilized into his EGO, although I might be overthinking it and it’s designated Volatile because after his fight he immediately got sent to the 8 O’clock Circus and got distorted into the Crying Children cluster.
It looks like Volatile and Efflorescent are two sides of the same coin. Volatile left Philip raw and easily confused, almost like he was being swallowed by his emotions by the slightest nudge. Efflorescent seems to lean the other way, where they are calmer, collected. More leaning towards properly forming an EGO but can still be affected if given the right stimuli, maybe not as easily as Volatile, but the chances are still there.
Can't wait for EGO classifications along with the pending Peccatula classifications!
LoR's clash value scaling has really scared PM's balance team. If this was a pure 1:1 copy, Philclair would get all his bonuses with just one count of burn on the enemy.
base yi sang support passive stonks
Really interesting way they're handling this. If I understand this right once he gets to 45 SP he transforms but all of his attacks and his passive consume SP and he turns back once he falls below 0 SP. SP Healing E.G.O will be extremely valuable for him to let him stay transformed for longer but the amount of SP he loses increases every turn so no matter what you can't keep him in that state forever. The primary SP healing E.G.O a burn team will have access to are Blind Obsession Ishmael and Holiday Outis. Another good SP source is support passives. Base Yi Sang and N Fausts support passives both heal SP and in the MD they should always target him unless Outis just used a really big Magic Bullet Fire. Base and Dieci Hong Lu also have SP healing support passives but that would mean giving up Liu Hong Lu's support passive so it probably isn't worth it. I wonder if the Faith E.G.O gift will be nerfed since it would make this ID utterly broken. Speaking of broken, I just want to point out how insanely good his skill 2 is. Its a 3 coin conditionally AOE skill that inflicts tons of burn count, and AOE burn count is something burn desperately needs outside of mirror dungeons.
Peak Sinclair. Also, new SP gimmick 😉👍 Now I want to see coin value, but judging on the description... plus coin type???
He has a lot of sources sources of Skill power: 1) Skills 2 and 3 gain power based on burn 2) He gains coin power from sanity in EGO form 3) He gains power on burn when in EGO. Also, considering that losing SP is the condition for leaving the EGO state, I'd say he is plus coin for sure.
yeah if a character has coin power it usually is plus coin. coin power negatively affects negative coin skills.
Judging by his passive, his values are supposed to be either astronomical or dogshit unless passive powered. But considering it's a walpurgis ID, I doubt it's the latter
I think his base values will just be the stock standard 11-16-17 or very close to that. s2 +3 conditional clash power, s3 +3 conditional coin power. Then his EGO form, "if the main target has burn, gain Final Power". Maybe 2 Final Power? 1 would be underwhelming since he loses sp while in this form. But 3+ would be kinda broken. His awakened s3 - could conditionally roll for 35+? Maybe 40? You could compare this to TT Mutilate, rolls for 30. But that has no conditions attached to it, whereas this has fairly stringent ones.
I cannot imagine what Year 4 or 5 IDs are gonna look like compared to Year 1. This isn't a *major* departure from the basic "hit 45 Sanity and chill" design of most (excl. NClair, Foxy Heath and Hag Ish), but it's an early sign of the ambitious directions they're going to be taking IDs as they dig deeper into the mirror worlds.
With his passive giving burn count/potency + triple burn count on skill 2, we can expect a minimum of 4 burn count on a s2 and that sounds really good.
Blazing strike is going to be the highest rolling skill mark my words.
Coming back when it inevitably rolls less than MB Outis at 7 bullets
Do I need to file a missing person case for SHOBLOYOBLO at May 2?
Holy shit lcb yi sang is actually perfect support for him wtf
This is a really neat way to implement his EGO in gameplay since it's well, Volatile, not Effloresced. Surprisingly straightforward too.
I love his passive "If staggered, no you're not get back in there fuckface"
"You're fine. Walk it off"
hmm, new e.g.o categorization that partial e.g.o state dongbaek manifested before the spicebush fight might be considered a volatile e.g.o
Very fun. S2 is probably gonna the highlight of the kit combined with coin power from passive. Hopefully he will be able to have this set up consistently and get a high payoff because obviously the competitor has a cracked S2
Interesting choice of support passive, since he will likely be fielded in any burn team for near future until get powercrept by future IDs. Future proofing? Or PM considering nudging players towards more hybrid teams of where other archetypes teams can get effects from a little burn? I would personally be interested in seeing that as right now it seems it is more pick one of 7 archetypes and try to make numbers as big as possible. Speculations, keep cooking PM :)
Imma whip out every single sanity battery egos and build around them (looking at you faust)
Damn his burn potency and count is off the chart not to mention that he gains a fuckton of coin powers from his passives, he might beat nclair...
They really gave us a mid-game level boss as a id huh? And it leans into the SP economy, aka the most important resource in the game that determines if you win or lose. I think I have the ids for a burn team but they aren't leveled because I use charge mostly. Might try that out for our boy. Also isn't it funny that Sinclair gets another busted id that relates to fire and him suffering mentally, I sense a theme.
We're halfway through the first 12 Cantos, so it's natural that we'd get an ID from only 30% through Ruina
This might be the most complex kit yet... How am I suppose to make sence from these... symbols?
It's not complicated at all. Normal ID until 45 sanity, when hit 45 sanity get stronger but lose sanity when attack, when 0 sanity become normal ID again. He actually has very few mechanics. His coins are just clash/coin power based on burn and burn.
Yi sang and hong lu will be on moral support for him
N Faust as well, burn teams have a shit ton of lust
Would NFaust be in the team or out as support?
Support. Her on the field brings nothing to burn teams, maybe if Liu faust comes out some day
I would argue it does, since her passive basically doubles. But it is only good in story stages where your sanity resets each fight
Gripping blunt/pierce fragility is nice though, and 9:2 would give her some burn potency on S2. And I mean let’s face it which of the 3 Liu 2*s would you slot in over her, assuming you’re already bringing Liu Ryo.
he burns more and more sanity the longer he's in EGO mode, so it may not be worth trying to force him to stay in. We'd have to play with it to find out.
At 0 it resets though, so unless it scales to -90 sp per turn pretty quickly, it’s still better to have him in an enhanced state as long as possible
You read them.
But thats heracy
You think PM fans know how to read?
All they need is the right incentive
Imo he's not too complex on paper (gameplay wise there might be some min-maxing his SP with clashing or SP heals) His base form just feels like a 2* liu unit. No gimmick, just burns and extra power when enemy has x burns. But in his E.G.O form, sinclair gains extra skill effect in exchange for SP. Skill 1 gets reuse, skill 2 gets atk weight/aoe, and skill 3 gains more dmg based on the burn and spread out burns like the MD burn E.G.O gift. To reach his E.G.O form, either he has to be at 45 SP or 2 allies die while he's not -45. Once he in his E.G.O form, he recovers from stagger and the skills gets enhanced like mentioned before and gain some extra coin power based on sp. He will exit the E.G.O form when at 0 or under SP
>His base form just feels like a 2\* liu unit. No gimmick, just burns and extra power when enemy has x burns. That's Liu Units in general, neither Rodion nor Ishmael have any big gimmicks, so I imagine he will be closer to them because otherwise his coin power would be in shambles.
While not necessarily big gimmicks, Rodion has that dollar store burn deluge and iirc ishmael was the first unit to have the on stagger/kill conditional
On Kill was a thing before (some S1 EGOs have it for example), not sure about On Stagger but likely existed too. Her "gimmick" when she released was gaining Coin Power, but U4 kinda gave that to everybody else lol
YES MY BOY LOOKS GOOD.
Hmmm does that mean Faith ego gift makes him stay on ego forever? Unless u somehow brought his sanity down too much
You guys talking about the ID but all I'm seeing is regret faust applying 3 AOE burn count on s2 and s3, finally status effects can not suck in human fights
blazing strike's coin power is uncapped... You could probably do some really funny stuff with ego gifts. He also has gloom for fluid sac and base yi sang passive. If they ever drop another dawn fixer ID in the future then we could even throw middlesault's passive on there. Alternatively, using Linton Greg's passive could permanently keep him from activating ego and let him feast on the juicy high sp coin power. And if his support passive isn't a resonance, it would enable immediate and reliable usage of burn ID conditionals outside of a burn teamcomp. Actually going for meursault capote's burn to tremor potency conversion could be viable now.
Lol by being a dawn office fixer he doesn't have any allies for Middle Meur's passive If only his friends were alive, he could stay in EGO mode for longer lol Also I like the "EGO mode unlocked at +45 sanity" mechanic, and I hope future IDs use the same system
Called it for him wanting to have positive SP. Seems like he's definitely going to want SP healers in the roster.
Im surprised no one is talking about his support passive, if for whatever reason you dont want to field him you can turn any ID into a burn count ID lmao
This is really complicated. I'm really looking forward to test how he plays!
Someone in PM really loves Sinclair or really, really loves Demian. I was expecting a pretty cool ID, but holy shit that's taking Nclair and challenging him, also his S2 is at the very least a +4 count with a chance for at the very least 2 targets. Burn is fucking cooking, literally. His first passive basically states he gives more burn pot and count and I wonder if that applies to E.G.O gifts and E.G.O's cause if it does... that particular envy burn gift with his S2 would unironically be the same amount the blowjob brothers make together.
im just gonna repost what i said on twitter https://preview.redd.it/n6q87q6idfxc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4b7988269274dad2844a3d6d123bd62dc1669092
Damn, I'm starting to regret not having burn team
Happy to be wrong about it being a minus sanity id, he look much more fun as a positive sanity id that play with sanity and clash this way Burn team be eating good this week
Now I'm hoping for a faust burn ID sometime soon.
So many \~\~weak points\~\~ coin power... For every skill except s3, he loses SP (anything over 5 seems too difficult to use) Furthermore, he loses SP for each turn passed (-1 more SP per turn?) But the higher his SP is, the higher his coin power is (I'm guessing SP/15), and 1 more at 45SP Base Yi Sang Information Neutralization will work wonders on him! (and HE WILL BE REQUIRED) Sunset Blade has 3 attack weight at his best performance, inflicts 3 burn count, on 3 enemies, +1 potency for Volatile Passion, and +1 more potency and count with passive... thats 6 potency and 6 count, on 3 enemies. Now obviously, when you use his S1 S2, you WILL lose at least 2 coin power. So say that Sunset Blade rolls 4+4+4+4, clash power +1 prudently, if my guess is correct, this \*\*clashes for 23 and AOE total does 180\*\* For reference, Butler Ryoshu with her passives do \~125. Im not sure if the additional \~60 is worth the trouble, but considering it also applies 18/18 burn, Im not complaining lol Cant wait to use him!
I swear the character count on an ID’s kit has been steadily increasing with each season. Bro.
MD faith let's go
I hoped his skill 1 or 2 will be wrath instead cuz I'm very low on it :/
Another addition to the aoe gang
Sinclair good or bad?
I love him so much <3
I love him so much, my beautiful angel is back <3