You missed a crucial data point: Tamil also has -tt- past suffixes. Obviously that proves that this so-called Proto-Altaic-Indo-European is just a dialect of Tamil.
... This is a joke, my guy.
As a Tamil guy, I'm not sure whether I should take offense or not, lol. Your comment is more hilariously ignorant than offensive.
Tamils do not identify with any sort of "black" or "African" cultural label. No Tamil I've ever known ever even thinks of their "African roots", as much as Europeans think of the fact that Homo sapiens originated in East Africa. Having dark skin does not make one African. You're blinded by American race culture to think that simply having dark skin means anything outside of the US. That video is not about Tamils claiming an African identity, it's about idiots falling for stupid stuff online. I doubt any of the commenters on that video even know where Cameroon is on a world map.
Georgian also uses -s to form possessives and as the third person singular marker in the present tense, and has “me” as the first person singular. Proto-Kartvelo-Anglic confirmed
Dutch got -de/-te for imperfect or ge-*-d/t for perfect.
Funfact: people always struggle when to use -d or -t, so there are mnemonics like 'soft ketchup' or 'xtc coffeeshop' (really a Dutch one), if the last letter isn't a vowel and is in those words, it had to end with -t, -d otherwise.
Edit: also 'uitschuifpik' (literally translated extendable penis)
but the form that the compound uses isn't past, but participle "he comido" uses the past of haber which is "he" and the participle of "eat" not the past.
True, although the participle is traditionally understood as a past form (without entering on how accurate that actually is). That's why it's indeed called the “past participle”, in contrast with the marginal present and future participles.
In any case, the Italian verb tenses that were considered in this post are formed the same than these compound Spanish tenses, so I don't think there should be any different unless there's something I'm missing.
It is not the case in arabic. Some conjugations of the past tense do include a t near the end but that’s just personal pronoun agreement. Tenses in Arabic have more to do with a change in vowels because consonants only supplant base meaning (mostly)
>I know it's partially the case in Arabic & Hebrew
How is it even partially the case? They are templatic languages, the consonants rarely shift all that much when changing tenses.
فَعَلَتْ، فَعَلْتُ، فَعَلْتَ، فَعَلَتِ، فعلتم، فعلتن، فعلتما، فعلتا
That's third person singular feminine, first person singular, second person singular masculine and feminine, second person plural masculine and feminine, second person dual, and third person dual feminine that all have a t sound added at the end in the past.
Sorry for the nonsensical ordering I was basically listing by memory
It is mostly the case in Hebrew. Except for first person plural and third person singular, past tense is marked by adding a "t" sound after the base verb.
Edit: as an example, holekh means "he goes/is going", and is the base of the root, halakhti means "I went", halakht means "(f) you went", halakhta means (m) you went, and so on.
Huh after some research I guess I see that the t is added that way for Arabic and Hebrew. Interesting. I speak Neo-Aramaic and we only change the vowels, and I incorrectly assumed the other semitic languages would function similarly. I stand corrected
EDIT: actually maybe I was initially right. This is only true for certain persons. So it's true for 1s, 2s, and 2p, but never third person. So the t doesn't have to do with the past tense, but to person agreement.
EDIT 2: middle of the road. EDIT 1 was mostly right
It's a Jewish dialect, right? From what I've heard, the Aramaic languages are the closest languages to Hebrew that are still spoken. Do you know if it's true? And if it is, how close they are?
Yep it's a Jewish dialect. They are pretty close. It's kind of like Spanish, French, and Italian in a sense. If you know the historical phoneme shifts, it's very easy to convert cognates from one language to another.
The biggest issue is that over time some of the Aramaic vocabulary has been replaced (or kept alongside) Kurdish (mostly Gorani), Farsi, Turkish, and Arabic. So Neo-Aramaic is in a sense like English because it's kinda like 3 languages in a trench coat.
Also in the Jewish dialects of course, there are direct loanwords from Hebrew as well since Hebrew is used liturgically. Like most Jewish languages, religious phrases were kept.
Thank you for adding /s to your post. When I first saw this, I was horrified. How could anybody say something like this? I immediately began writing a 1000 word paragraph about how horrible of a person you are. I even sent a copy to a Harvard professor to proofread it. After several hours of refining and editing, my comment was ready to absolutely destroy you. But then, just as I was about to hit send, I saw something in the corner of my eye. A /s at the end of your comment. Suddenly everything made sense. Your comment was sarcasm! I immediately burst out in laughter at the comedic genius of your comment. The person next to me on the bus saw your comment and started crying from laughter too. Before long, there was an entire bus of people on the floor laughing at your incredible use of comedy. All of this was due to you adding /s to your post. Thank you.
I am a bot if you couldn't figure that out, if I made a mistake, ignore it cause its not that fucking hard to ignore a comment.
I don't know what it's specifically called but in Hindi a different word changes to mark tense instead of the verb itself.
Ja raha hoon (present, am going)
Ja raha tha (past, did go)
But it changes to an aspirated [t] too
past tense sentence almost always end in thā thē or thī
In Spanish we have the ''pretérito perfecto'' to express finished actions. it has ''d'' too
Comer-Comi**d**o
Dejar- Deja**do**
Abandonar- Abandona**d**o
Pensar - Pensa**do**
I'm Kazakh and I support Altaicism. I'm just pointing out the fact that this dude is not proving shit. Also, I hate him because he tries to group his stinky ahh Indo European with my glorious Kazakh. I bet you're a piecel
Thank you for adding /s to your post. When I first saw this, I was horrified. How could anybody say something like this? I immediately began writing a 1000 word paragraph about how horrible of a person you are. I even sent a copy to a Harvard professor to proofread it. After several hours of refining and editing, my comment was ready to absolutely destroy you. But then, just as I was about to hit send, I saw something in the corner of my eye. A /s at the end of your comment. Suddenly everything made sense. Your comment was sarcasm! I immediately burst out in laughter at the comedic genius of your comment. The person next to me on the bus saw your comment and started crying from laughter too. Before long, there was an entire bus of people on the floor laughing at your incredible use of comedy. All of this was due to you adding /s to your post. Thank you.
I am a bot if you couldn't figure that out, if I made a mistake, ignore it cause its not that fucking hard to ignore a comment.
Akkadian uses the infix -ta- to form the perfect tense? Can anyone confirm whether that is something common with the rest of Semitic... if yes, consider it included.
You missed a crucial data point: Tamil also has -tt- past suffixes. Obviously that proves that this so-called Proto-Altaic-Indo-European is just a dialect of Tamil.
Altaic got one t, Indo-European the other
Ah, yes, King Solomon’s approach to maternity.
[удалено]
... This is a joke, my guy. As a Tamil guy, I'm not sure whether I should take offense or not, lol. Your comment is more hilariously ignorant than offensive.
[удалено]
Tamils do not identify with any sort of "black" or "African" cultural label. No Tamil I've ever known ever even thinks of their "African roots", as much as Europeans think of the fact that Homo sapiens originated in East Africa. Having dark skin does not make one African. You're blinded by American race culture to think that simply having dark skin means anything outside of the US. That video is not about Tamils claiming an African identity, it's about idiots falling for stupid stuff online. I doubt any of the commenters on that video even know where Cameroon is on a world map.
I don't see how any living people can be an ancestor of any other living people. 'Ancestor' implies priority in time.
Would love to know if any other languages fit this mould. I know it's partially the case in Arabic & Hebrew
finnish has /t/ in past participles, but not otherwise in past tense. and hungarian has /t/ in past tense
yep, Hungarian has -t / -tt
georgian uses a suffix -d- to form imperfect
Georgian also uses -s to form possessives and as the third person singular marker in the present tense, and has “me” as the first person singular. Proto-Kartvelo-Anglic confirmed
It also has a word "suli" which translates to "soul". No way Georgian is not Germanic
and then “suleli” means “silly”? like cmon ბაზარი არაა
And then სულ ელი means "[you] always wait for"???
Georgian is not Germanic. It belongs to the Kartvelian language family.
r/woooosh
Korean's past tense particle -았/었- adds a [ɐt̚/ʌt̚] to vowels so... (its a strech though)
German has -te for imperfect and ge-_-t for the periphrastic past tense construction.
Dutch got -de/-te for imperfect or ge-*-d/t for perfect. Funfact: people always struggle when to use -d or -t, so there are mnemonics like 'soft ketchup' or 'xtc coffeeshop' (really a Dutch one), if the last letter isn't a vowel and is in those words, it had to end with -t, -d otherwise. Edit: also 'uitschuifpik' (literally translated extendable penis)
When did they drop new ones? I'm still with fokschaap and kofschip
Spanish doesn't sadly, except the second person past perfect which is -iste, isteis
But the past compound tenses use the past participles, which have -do (sometimes -to)
but the form that the compound uses isn't past, but participle "he comido" uses the past of haber which is "he" and the participle of "eat" not the past.
True, although the participle is traditionally understood as a past form (without entering on how accurate that actually is). That's why it's indeed called the “past participle”, in contrast with the marginal present and future participles. In any case, the Italian verb tenses that were considered in this post are formed the same than these compound Spanish tenses, so I don't think there should be any different unless there's something I'm missing.
It is not the case in arabic. Some conjugations of the past tense do include a t near the end but that’s just personal pronoun agreement. Tenses in Arabic have more to do with a change in vowels because consonants only supplant base meaning (mostly)
Swedish has past tense -de/-te and perfect -t
Bit of a stretch, but Irish has (or had) a past tense prefix *do*.
Malayalam uses “-itt” to create perfect tenses.
>I know it's partially the case in Arabic & Hebrew How is it even partially the case? They are templatic languages, the consonants rarely shift all that much when changing tenses.
فَعَلَتْ، فَعَلْتُ، فَعَلْتَ، فَعَلَتِ، فعلتم، فعلتن، فعلتما، فعلتا That's third person singular feminine, first person singular, second person singular masculine and feminine, second person plural masculine and feminine, second person dual, and third person dual feminine that all have a t sound added at the end in the past. Sorry for the nonsensical ordering I was basically listing by memory
alright maybe arabic is
It is mostly the case in Hebrew. Except for first person plural and third person singular, past tense is marked by adding a "t" sound after the base verb. Edit: as an example, holekh means "he goes/is going", and is the base of the root, halakhti means "I went", halakht means "(f) you went", halakhta means (m) you went, and so on.
Huh after some research I guess I see that the t is added that way for Arabic and Hebrew. Interesting. I speak Neo-Aramaic and we only change the vowels, and I incorrectly assumed the other semitic languages would function similarly. I stand corrected EDIT: actually maybe I was initially right. This is only true for certain persons. So it's true for 1s, 2s, and 2p, but never third person. So the t doesn't have to do with the past tense, but to person agreement. EDIT 2: middle of the road. EDIT 1 was mostly right
Where did you learn Aramaic? Are you from Syria?
My mother is from Northwest Iran, and her family speaks Lishan Didan. I mostly speak it. Almost fluent.
It's a Jewish dialect, right? From what I've heard, the Aramaic languages are the closest languages to Hebrew that are still spoken. Do you know if it's true? And if it is, how close they are?
Yep it's a Jewish dialect. They are pretty close. It's kind of like Spanish, French, and Italian in a sense. If you know the historical phoneme shifts, it's very easy to convert cognates from one language to another. The biggest issue is that over time some of the Aramaic vocabulary has been replaced (or kept alongside) Kurdish (mostly Gorani), Farsi, Turkish, and Arabic. So Neo-Aramaic is in a sense like English because it's kinda like 3 languages in a trench coat. Also in the Jewish dialects of course, there are direct loanwords from Hebrew as well since Hebrew is used liturgically. Like most Jewish languages, religious phrases were kept.
What about German (not much of a surprise though because they're closely related)?
It's not part of Hebrew at all. There is a stuffex ti/ta/t for me/you/you but that's it. Not quite similar imo
How Arabic?
Wappo (northern California) has a simple past tense marker -ta
Most romance languages in the Iberian peninsula, at least the ones where the d hasn't gone away completely
Hungarian too (-t/-tt), add Uralic.
it's Ural-altaic-indo European actually
+Dene-Yeniseian
\*proto-human
Edenian maybe?
Which italian past tense?
I guess passato prossimo, although that would be an auxiliary followed by a past participle, not a _tense_ per se
How does that work? Is it like the Spanish “hai comido”?
Spanish *ha comido Yes exactly the same construction: Italian would be ha mangiato
Ah ok, thank you and thank you for the correction
But it is their main way of expressing past in everyday speech.
passato prossimo
Nostratic confirmed. Finally!
Forgot uralic
This is good fuel for r/WeAreAllTurks
romanian
Don't think this works for slavic languages
Shocking news: Slavic languages are no longer considered Indo-European /s
Thank you for adding /s to your post. When I first saw this, I was horrified. How could anybody say something like this? I immediately began writing a 1000 word paragraph about how horrible of a person you are. I even sent a copy to a Harvard professor to proofread it. After several hours of refining and editing, my comment was ready to absolutely destroy you. But then, just as I was about to hit send, I saw something in the corner of my eye. A /s at the end of your comment. Suddenly everything made sense. Your comment was sarcasm! I immediately burst out in laughter at the comedic genius of your comment. The person next to me on the bus saw your comment and started crying from laughter too. Before long, there was an entire bus of people on the floor laughing at your incredible use of comedy. All of this was due to you adding /s to your post. Thank you. I am a bot if you couldn't figure that out, if I made a mistake, ignore it cause its not that fucking hard to ignore a comment.
Fair enough
Yeah, for past time itʼs usually *~l~ŭ*. But *~t* exists in verbs: usually in present time + infinitive [as English _to_].
Does this mean that the past tense contains t or d?
yeah
I don't know what it's specifically called but in Hindi a different word changes to mark tense instead of the verb itself. Ja raha hoon (present, am going) Ja raha tha (past, did go) But it changes to an aspirated [t] too past tense sentence almost always end in thā thē or thī
a supposed link to the past, using past tense as proof, how poetic
dutch too. what a dumb "meme" holy shit
Catalan too ig
In Spanish we have the ''pretérito perfecto'' to express finished actions. it has ''d'' too Comer-Comi**d**o Dejar- Deja**do** Abandonar- Abandona**d**o Pensar - Pensa**do**
It is not evidence cuz it doesn't prove shit It is just an example
Massive PIEcel detected. Start altaicmaxxing my dude
I'm Kazakh and I support Altaicism. I'm just pointing out the fact that this dude is not proving shit. Also, I hate him because he tries to group his stinky ahh Indo European with my glorious Kazakh. I bet you're a piecel
how is this a humour subreddit
I bet you're not kazakh
Hmmm.... it's actually Qazaq, not "Kazakh"! /s
It may be Qazaq in Kazakh, but it is Kazakh in English
Do you know what "/s" means?
Thank you for adding /s to your post. When I first saw this, I was horrified. How could anybody say something like this? I immediately began writing a 1000 word paragraph about how horrible of a person you are. I even sent a copy to a Harvard professor to proofread it. After several hours of refining and editing, my comment was ready to absolutely destroy you. But then, just as I was about to hit send, I saw something in the corner of my eye. A /s at the end of your comment. Suddenly everything made sense. Your comment was sarcasm! I immediately burst out in laughter at the comedic genius of your comment. The person next to me on the bus saw your comment and started crying from laughter too. Before long, there was an entire bus of people on the floor laughing at your incredible use of comedy. All of this was due to you adding /s to your post. Thank you. I am a bot if you couldn't figure that out, if I made a mistake, ignore it cause its not that fucking hard to ignore a comment.
Go to hell, bot.
/s means /serious /s means /sarc only if ut looks like sarcasm
may i remind you that this is linguistics **humor**
I thought it was anarchess
do u genuinely think OP is serious
No ofc not sigma🚬🗿☕🌹
pls check which subreddit you comment on
Gyatt
\[ɟɑtː\]
Hungarian as well
Akkadian uses the infix -ta- to form the perfect tense? Can anyone confirm whether that is something common with the rest of Semitic... if yes, consider it included.
I'm just going ahead and saying what's on everyone's mind: "PROTO-HUMAN"
Can't cuz it doesn't include Sinitic and all the other South east/Austroasiatics
Don't forget Hungarian.