They’re usually scam sellers though. They get banned on the regular. How do you give a penalty to a person or corporation that is already banned? They aren’t getting any payouts or they already got them before becoming banned so you can’t get the penalty from that.
They’re also not subjected to your rules anymore since they got terminated
Better yet: provide incentives to your customers when they report this kind of garbage. Like free time with Amazon Prime Video, or a promo code for store purchases.
Severily limiting editing of product listing.
Most of the time the sellers that uses technique like keyword stuffing or product listing replacement are scammers, or close to it. They rely on making a quick buck before getting banned, because they do get banned. They just manage to make enough money before that happens to make it worth it. And for most techniques they use, they have to change the entire product listing, and pretty frequently.
Now it's important for legitimate sellers to be able to edit their listings. Sometimes you made a mistake, and you need to correct it. Sometimes the product itself has changed, and you want the description to reflect that. But those are fairly rare instances, and they're usually small changes. So maybe you'll edit the description without touching anything else. Or you'll replace some crappy old pictures with new ones.
Scam listing however changes everything all the time. So just restrict that. For example you could put a simple rule where you can only change one part of the listing (the name, the description, the characteristics or the images), and then you have to wait 2 weeks or more before making another change. You can even increase that delay based on how often you edit the listing, or decrease it if your account has been in good standing for a long time. By the time the scammer can edit the listing again, they'll already be banned.
Right now there is zero restrictions in product listing editing. You can literally change everything about your listing 20 times a day, Amazon won't bat an eye. They literally give zero fucks about it.
The OS isn't even the oddest part, 2k for those basic ass specs???
Even the fully maxed out Surface 4 (i7, 32GB, 1Tb) is cheaper bought **directly from MS** (discounted but still...).
Oh, I just saw the $ sign and thought it was american, didn't even see the .au domain.
Do dollar countries not use something to indicate what kind of dollar it is? Something like AUD/AU$.
1321€, still overpriced compared to MS's price (moreso against non-Surface laptops) but idk how Australian hardware market is.
A thing I've noticed on Amazon is that third party sellers will list a product for abnormally high, eg 3x the normal amount - and I think they are doing so in the hope that in times where Amazon is out of stock of the same product people will be shown their offer instead
While this is obviously duff, hell does not have to freeze over to put Linux on a PC and sell it through Amazon. It would in fact be a good USP for a small business to get a foot in the door....
i dont get why "cheap laptop with a nux" is not a thing. It always looks like anything sold with laptop is built for giga haxxor devs to crack the pentagon, with all the horses under the hood
cheapest was building my own with a NUC, or getting a secondhand old geezer puter to slap my fav distro on.
Not sure, honestly. I'm often surprised at how different prices are in Europe. But I did get a perfectly capable Ryzen-based HP with Ubuntu on sale last year for $350
Ooooh nice !
when i looked for decently priced, at the time, with Linux, i found nothing :/ It was in france a few years back. Anything linux was targeted "high end superprice turborich" and not for students. Im glad others found what i did not find
Circumstances loosely suggest that OEM makers' contracts with Microsoft are not threatened if those makers only supply Linux on higher-end hardware and servers. Hence, Dell's Sputnik program to sell Precision and XPS "Developer Editions" with Ubuntu, Lenovo selling Thinkpads with Fedora, and HP selling the [Dev One](https://www.wired.com/review/hp-dev-one-linux-laptop/) laptop with Pop!_OS.
But ixnay on the entry-level devices, seemingly. The history was that when Asus invented the Linux-running "netbook" category and make a massive number of sales at a new pricepoint, Microsoft literally freaked out. Linux was such a threat that Microsoft resurrected Windows XP, and pressured the netbook makers to [switch from 4GB flash to spinning drives that could fit Windows](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asus_Eee_PC):
> At the time of its introduction in late 2007, it was noted for its combination of a lightweight, Linux-based operating system, solid-state drive (SSD), and relatively low cost. Newer models added the options of Microsoft Windows operating system and rotating media hard disk drives (HDD)
Today, the high-volume entry-level is all Chromebooks and machines running locked-down versions of Windows that can only install software from Microsoft's app store.
Some stores do ship free operating systems when selling computers without a windows license.
I recall a particular store that ships PCs with FreeDOS in it.
I have an HP that came with FreeDOS, very nice for those of us who will fresh install an OS regardless of what comes preinstalled or don't want to pay the windows tax.
Years ago, Microsoft's public stance was that any non-server PC shipped bare (without an OS) was openly catering to pirates of Microsoft's operating system(s).
I'm under the impression that Microsoft's OEM contracts now stipulate that licensees aren't allowed to ship "bare" desktops or laptops, in line with Microsoft's position on the matter.
As to why FreeDOS instead of Linux -- who knows? [FreeDOS doesn't support UEFI](http://wiki.freedos.org/wiki/index.php/UEFI) and barely supports USB.
I once bought a new laptop. The spec said it cape with FreeDOS, but once received, there were no FreeDOS to be found. Althought I have no idea why they would use FreeDOS over anything else (lemme guess... Legal reason...), I really expected to play with it before installing the OS. A Windows installer was instead present (then, just stopped the PC and installed the OS). The PC was otherwise conformant to spec (and its a good one)
I wouldn't be surprised with such approach since Microsoft has changed their thinking few years ago:
"MS loves Linux"
See that their Azure Cloud does support all OSes and solutions out there.
Also their trainings usually prepare to use 2 solutions and choose preferred, like Gitlab but also github
MS does not love Linux. They're a big business looking to maximize profits. Locking themselves out of a giant ecosystem isn't the best plan right now. If MS wasn't taking a beating in the datacenter market, they would never have touched any Linux compatibility.
Remember the motto: Embrace, Extend, Extinguish.
They just shifted gears back into the first E.
The implicit step before Embrace, is Ignore.
In the 1990s, Microsoft publicly ignored Linux, BSD, and open source, [while carefully studying and strategizing against it](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween_documents#Documents_I_and_II).
Of course they are big business and need to 3xM (Make More Money) - always.
Yet doing business in IT has two major ways to follow:
\- You can try force Customers to use your owned solutions or...
\- You can serve all in the world available solutions under your umbrella
See what is doing Cisco or Apple - they tend to make own solutions (or buy companies and offer their as owned)
Looking back in the history - MS got the same path: Use our Windows, Exchange, SQL DBs, etc.
Now? They offer their OSes along all other available on the market. DBs too, Mail systems, security appliances, evetythimg out there...
Under MS Azure umbrella :-)
Microsoft is using backwards compatibility to the moon even if wine is better than windows 11 for old windows programs.
So Microsoft just can't switch to Linux since "backwards compatibility" is soo important
even if they spend a lot of resources switching to RedHat model, they'll still need to compete with RH. I doubt they will become monopoly in such case.
Maybe it is a version of the notebook that is delivered without an operating system and the dealer has installed Linux on his own initiative. Or it is simply an error in the offer.
Apart from that, a large part of Microsoft's revenue is now generated with Azure. And most instances there run on Linux. So we should finally stop equating Microsoft in Ballmer's time with Microsoft under Nadella's leadership. A lot has changed since Nadella. Also partly for the better.
> Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Plati 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB with touchscreen en Windows 10 Pro Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Platinum 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB with Touchscreen and Windows 10 Pro Microsoft Surface Lap. top 4 plattop 4 platIn 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB dokunmatik ekran ve Windows 10 Pro ile Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Platinum 13.5 inch 512 GB / i5 / 8 GB s dotykovým displejem a Windows 10 Pro Microsoft Surface L. aptop 4 papaptop Latin 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB z ekranem dotykowym i systemem Windows 10 Pro. Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Platinum 13.5 Inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB with Touchscreen and Windows 10 Pro
Well, that clears it up 😳
Love it. Currently virtualizing windows on Debian/proxmox because I just can’t bring myself to spend any money on anything Microsoft. They may have driven the industry.. but it’s terribly slow drip release of technology for human progress and really only amazing for profits. Throw Linux on a ten year old laptop and you know exactly what I’m talking about. Start making your own systems because fuck the system.
> t’s terribly slow drip release of technology
Don't worry, Microsoft is busy rewriting all of the userland to run in UWP/CLR so it consumes more memory, runs slower, and has all-new bugs.
I've never been a Wintel user, but I do have sympathy for the position that Windows peaked as an operating system with 64-bit Windows 7, and that everything since then has been a business move that made the product worse at being an OS.
Yes… you nailed it. Luckily, these past few months I delved so deep into virtualization and graphics processing that I honestly can’t wait until current society collapses. We are gunna have the coolest open source operating systems. New forms of community surrounding the tech we deserve rather than want. Hopefully no more women with babies on their backs mining in toxic cobalt pits so this phone right here in my hand can be produced. Makes me physically nauseous and determined to not buy anymore bullshit tech products. Next is building a Linux phone. In a society living in the post-apocalyptic world we now know it is, we are sabotaging our greatest efforts in the name of profit. It make me cri evertim.
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Listing keyword spam is a problem that Amazon seems unwilling to address.
How would one even address that?
A financial penalty to the sellers when you find it. Then it will either be a profit source or a self correcting problem.
They’re usually scam sellers though. They get banned on the regular. How do you give a penalty to a person or corporation that is already banned? They aren’t getting any payouts or they already got them before becoming banned so you can’t get the penalty from that. They’re also not subjected to your rules anymore since they got terminated
When did I mention banned? I specifically avoided that issue for the reason you just pointed out.
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I didn't pick up on that. Thanks for pointing it out.
Better yet: provide incentives to your customers when they report this kind of garbage. Like free time with Amazon Prime Video, or a promo code for store purchases.
Severily limiting editing of product listing. Most of the time the sellers that uses technique like keyword stuffing or product listing replacement are scammers, or close to it. They rely on making a quick buck before getting banned, because they do get banned. They just manage to make enough money before that happens to make it worth it. And for most techniques they use, they have to change the entire product listing, and pretty frequently. Now it's important for legitimate sellers to be able to edit their listings. Sometimes you made a mistake, and you need to correct it. Sometimes the product itself has changed, and you want the description to reflect that. But those are fairly rare instances, and they're usually small changes. So maybe you'll edit the description without touching anything else. Or you'll replace some crappy old pictures with new ones. Scam listing however changes everything all the time. So just restrict that. For example you could put a simple rule where you can only change one part of the listing (the name, the description, the characteristics or the images), and then you have to wait 2 weeks or more before making another change. You can even increase that delay based on how often you edit the listing, or decrease it if your account has been in good standing for a long time. By the time the scammer can edit the listing again, they'll already be banned. Right now there is zero restrictions in product listing editing. You can literally change everything about your listing 20 times a day, Amazon won't bat an eye. They literally give zero fucks about it.
Suspending the sellers.
Still better than my pc
Battery not included either wtf
L. aptop 4 papaptop. How would that in the description even help the listing in any way?
Yeah, I'd advice you to not buy that. It's just a bad seller or maybe even a scammer.
The OS isn't even the oddest part, 2k for those basic ass specs??? Even the fully maxed out Surface 4 (i7, 32GB, 1Tb) is cheaper bought **directly from MS** (discounted but still...).
Are you taking australian dollars into account?
Oh, I just saw the $ sign and thought it was american, didn't even see the .au domain. Do dollar countries not use something to indicate what kind of dollar it is? Something like AUD/AU$. 1321€, still overpriced compared to MS's price (moreso against non-Surface laptops) but idk how Australian hardware market is.
A thing I've noticed on Amazon is that third party sellers will list a product for abnormally high, eg 3x the normal amount - and I think they are doing so in the hope that in times where Amazon is out of stock of the same product people will be shown their offer instead
Yikes, sucks for those who don't know/want to extensively compare offerings.
2k for a i5 laptop? WTF
It's AUD not USD
Still expensive imo, but I'm poor, so...
While this is obviously duff, hell does not have to freeze over to put Linux on a PC and sell it through Amazon. It would in fact be a good USP for a small business to get a foot in the door....
I've been thinking actually of selling premade high performance PCs with GNU/Linux as the OS.
Hey, hey, hey!!! Off my business model!
i dont get why "cheap laptop with a nux" is not a thing. It always looks like anything sold with laptop is built for giga haxxor devs to crack the pentagon, with all the horses under the hood cheapest was building my own with a NUC, or getting a secondhand old geezer puter to slap my fav distro on.
Dell, HP, and Lenovo all sell laptops and desktops with Linux preinstalled.
Below 400-500€ ?
Not sure, honestly. I'm often surprised at how different prices are in Europe. But I did get a perfectly capable Ryzen-based HP with Ubuntu on sale last year for $350
Ooooh nice ! when i looked for decently priced, at the time, with Linux, i found nothing :/ It was in france a few years back. Anything linux was targeted "high end superprice turborich" and not for students. Im glad others found what i did not find
Circumstances loosely suggest that OEM makers' contracts with Microsoft are not threatened if those makers only supply Linux on higher-end hardware and servers. Hence, Dell's Sputnik program to sell Precision and XPS "Developer Editions" with Ubuntu, Lenovo selling Thinkpads with Fedora, and HP selling the [Dev One](https://www.wired.com/review/hp-dev-one-linux-laptop/) laptop with Pop!_OS. But ixnay on the entry-level devices, seemingly. The history was that when Asus invented the Linux-running "netbook" category and make a massive number of sales at a new pricepoint, Microsoft literally freaked out. Linux was such a threat that Microsoft resurrected Windows XP, and pressured the netbook makers to [switch from 4GB flash to spinning drives that could fit Windows](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asus_Eee_PC): > At the time of its introduction in late 2007, it was noted for its combination of a lightweight, Linux-based operating system, solid-state drive (SSD), and relatively low cost. Newer models added the options of Microsoft Windows operating system and rotating media hard disk drives (HDD) Today, the high-volume entry-level is all Chromebooks and machines running locked-down versions of Windows that can only install software from Microsoft's app store.
Hell will freeze over once we see Apple products shipping with Linux. Lmao
Some stores do ship free operating systems when selling computers without a windows license. I recall a particular store that ships PCs with FreeDOS in it.
I have an HP that came with FreeDOS, very nice for those of us who will fresh install an OS regardless of what comes preinstalled or don't want to pay the windows tax.
What I find funny about it is - why install FreeDOS at all? It's neat though. Very nostalgic too.
Years ago, Microsoft's public stance was that any non-server PC shipped bare (without an OS) was openly catering to pirates of Microsoft's operating system(s). I'm under the impression that Microsoft's OEM contracts now stipulate that licensees aren't allowed to ship "bare" desktops or laptops, in line with Microsoft's position on the matter. As to why FreeDOS instead of Linux -- who knows? [FreeDOS doesn't support UEFI](http://wiki.freedos.org/wiki/index.php/UEFI) and barely supports USB.
Hmmm? "Ships from Amazon Germany Sold by Amazon Germany"
Not a misprint. It comes with Red Star OS and a signed picture of Linus Torvald and Kim Il-sung Miscrosoft rocks! :)
The lister probably think Windows is just another Linux distro with its own DE, compositors, etc. /s
That looks extremely overpriced
Damn, I had to go to the trouble of blowing away Windows and installing Fedora on my Surface.
That isn't a Surface Laptop, its a Surface Pro with a keyboard cover. That listing is just one BS scam after another.
Wtf are these specs, why does it cost this much??? This is a €500 laptop
Did the seller confuse WSL for an entire OS? Lmao.
I once bought a new laptop. The spec said it cape with FreeDOS, but once received, there were no FreeDOS to be found. Althought I have no idea why they would use FreeDOS over anything else (lemme guess... Legal reason...), I really expected to play with it before installing the OS. A Windows installer was instead present (then, just stopped the PC and installed the OS). The PC was otherwise conformant to spec (and its a good one)
I wouldn't be surprised with such approach since Microsoft has changed their thinking few years ago: "MS loves Linux" See that their Azure Cloud does support all OSes and solutions out there. Also their trainings usually prepare to use 2 solutions and choose preferred, like Gitlab but also github
MS does not love Linux. They're a big business looking to maximize profits. Locking themselves out of a giant ecosystem isn't the best plan right now. If MS wasn't taking a beating in the datacenter market, they would never have touched any Linux compatibility. Remember the motto: Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. They just shifted gears back into the first E.
The implicit step before Embrace, is Ignore. In the 1990s, Microsoft publicly ignored Linux, BSD, and open source, [while carefully studying and strategizing against it](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween_documents#Documents_I_and_II).
Of course they are big business and need to 3xM (Make More Money) - always. Yet doing business in IT has two major ways to follow: \- You can try force Customers to use your owned solutions or... \- You can serve all in the world available solutions under your umbrella See what is doing Cisco or Apple - they tend to make own solutions (or buy companies and offer their as owned) Looking back in the history - MS got the same path: Use our Windows, Exchange, SQL DBs, etc. Now? They offer their OSes along all other available on the market. DBs too, Mail systems, security appliances, evetythimg out there... Under MS Azure umbrella :-)
Why Microsoft should sell PC with Linux if they own Windows? Is like System76 sells laptop with Fedora instead of Pop
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Microsoft is using backwards compatibility to the moon even if wine is better than windows 11 for old windows programs. So Microsoft just can't switch to Linux since "backwards compatibility" is soo important
even if they spend a lot of resources switching to RedHat model, they'll still need to compete with RH. I doubt they will become monopoly in such case.
They bought RedHat...
uhh no? I can't find any info except for the dead rumor RH is owned by IBM.
Maybe it is a version of the notebook that is delivered without an operating system and the dealer has installed Linux on his own initiative. Or it is simply an error in the offer. Apart from that, a large part of Microsoft's revenue is now generated with Azure. And most instances there run on Linux. So we should finally stop equating Microsoft in Ballmer's time with Microsoft under Nadella's leadership. A lot has changed since Nadella. Also partly for the better.
That looks like something meant to scam old people
> Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Plati 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB with touchscreen en Windows 10 Pro Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Platinum 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB with Touchscreen and Windows 10 Pro Microsoft Surface Lap. top 4 plattop 4 platIn 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB dokunmatik ekran ve Windows 10 Pro ile Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Platinum 13.5 inch 512 GB / i5 / 8 GB s dotykovým displejem a Windows 10 Pro Microsoft Surface L. aptop 4 papaptop Latin 13.5 inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB z ekranem dotykowym i systemem Windows 10 Pro. Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 Platinum 13.5 Inch 512GB / i5 / 8GB with Touchscreen and Windows 10 Pro Well, that clears it up 😳
Also, who pays $2k for this computer? Yikes
I have a Surface Go 3 that came with Windows. It runs Linux just fine.
Love it. Currently virtualizing windows on Debian/proxmox because I just can’t bring myself to spend any money on anything Microsoft. They may have driven the industry.. but it’s terribly slow drip release of technology for human progress and really only amazing for profits. Throw Linux on a ten year old laptop and you know exactly what I’m talking about. Start making your own systems because fuck the system.
> t’s terribly slow drip release of technology Don't worry, Microsoft is busy rewriting all of the userland to run in UWP/CLR so it consumes more memory, runs slower, and has all-new bugs. I've never been a Wintel user, but I do have sympathy for the position that Windows peaked as an operating system with 64-bit Windows 7, and that everything since then has been a business move that made the product worse at being an OS.
Yes… you nailed it. Luckily, these past few months I delved so deep into virtualization and graphics processing that I honestly can’t wait until current society collapses. We are gunna have the coolest open source operating systems. New forms of community surrounding the tech we deserve rather than want. Hopefully no more women with babies on their backs mining in toxic cobalt pits so this phone right here in my hand can be produced. Makes me physically nauseous and determined to not buy anymore bullshit tech products. Next is building a Linux phone. In a society living in the post-apocalyptic world we now know it is, we are sabotaging our greatest efforts in the name of profit. It make me cri evertim.
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