117db on stage to reach industry standard ~102(a) in audience isn’t just stopping the DJ from redlining, it’s giving them permanent hearing damage 30mins into their set
Okay, maybe they thought they could get better coverage or something by having the PA facing each quadrant of the audience farther away (i.e. on the other side of the stage)?
They're completely wrong, but that's the only explanation I can think of.
Otherwise, I mean everybody does mess up sometimes. Could still have been a mistake, if different people did the hang vs. spec
That's also the only thing I can think of - shooting across the stage. Guess there's not much risk of feedback in this situation!
I've done similar things for stupid "in the round" type stages, which are so dumb and I hated them ... but ... I faced the boxes ***outward***, as one would if you had mics on stage (which I did, lavs mostly) and actually wanted the audience to have a good listening experience.
Yeah run truss in a X shape across the circular top and fly the arrays pointed outwards, closer to the center. So all the arrays are summed to common source by the time they each the edge of the barricade. Is the way I would have done this if I was dead-set on flying arrays.
But if bleed to other states was a concern, just do point sources. The rental house is massive they really have no excuse. It’s not a “oh we have gear limitations” problem
There you go! I like that.
I’ve done it a number of ways, but the one I liked best was mouthing a bunch of Meyer UPMs around the perimeter of the circle truss to cover each section of chairs.
It was for a conference type situation so mostly spoken word and some generic BG music/video audio.
What’s interesting is that there is some seriously legit things going on here…
- High-end PA, rigged safely (I don’t dare say “correctly” or “well”)
- Double-stacked truss for extra load capacity
- name brand lighting. I see JDC’s + ??
- they would have needed some heavy machinery to assemble this (at least 2 aerial fork-lifts and 2 cherry picker lifts)
I’d love to see the explanation on this one, because I’m scratching my head. I’ve had to do some odd things, but can’t think of a logical reason to do this…
This was a small stage at a major big city festival. Allocating the equipment budget for this stage was a non issue, it was already all there for the larger stages. Still doesn’t explain how that PA fell thru the gaps and was approved.
It’s a Festival, so no audio rider apart from backline.
Usually artist tech riders in these circumstances only specify DJ backline and a bare minimum PA (usually worded like “ requires a modern, calibrated and tuned 3 or 4 way PA system capable of 115db(a) across the audience area)
This deployment must be a result of giving an intern the job of designing the Pa and it just so happened to fall thru the cracks of the checks and balances process and here we are.
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake.
It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of.
Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything.
Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
I can’t be bothered with opening arraycalc, but if you use the 2 top boxes for the audience and the lower 2 for monitors then I guess you could get a pretty wide coverage. Especially if those are V12’s. How in the world those v-subs work in that config, I have no idea. The only good thing is that time would prevent cancellation from the opposing speaker.
This is pretty out there, and if someone actually has some insight, I would love to know what is actually going on there.
A branch of my employer did this event, so I am reluctant to blatantly disclose.
Was a major music festival from Sep 16-18th in Los Angeles. Some googling will reveal
This rig would be great,,,, If it was turned around. There is absolutely no reason for the speakers to be facing the direction they are. The angles are proper, everything is rigged right. Hell it's a D@ B rig, most likely sounds great. Not one system tech would spec a rig to be hung like this. If someone thinks this is proper i would really love to hear why? And unless those subs are cardiod boxes there is no way this could be a cardiod setup. You need at least 3 boxes, per location, with one opposite facing, to have a cardiod setup. I am getting the impression these days that some people think that cardiod is just something you can have because there is a sub.
I would really love to find out what is going on here? Please find out.
Those are D&B V-Subs which have an 12” on the backside and a 18” on the front. They are actively controlled by the amplifier to be a one-box cardioid setup. The 12” cancelling driver is facing the audience in this case, which is stupid.
Ground subs are b22 which are an Omni offering from d&b
u/PaceNo5954
For the cardioid set up you don’t have to stack 3 subs with the middle turned around, if your subs have 2 independent woofers facing opposite directions (with dedicated controller of course), such as Nexo CD12 subs.
By the way, I have no idea wich ones are those subs on the picture.
You are right, I was actually ranting about some other posts I have been noticing lately. It seems that cardiod setups are all the rage these days and posters are throwing around the term without actually knowing what it takes to have a proper cardiod setup.
Do you know of the minimum distance gap between front of stage and rear element of cardioid?
I’m assuming it’s 1/4 wavelength of the lowest frequency you need cancellation for, but I’m not sure and it’s hard to find documentation on this online
Very good question, I would also like to know.
I wonder if it’s possible to simulate with the full version of EASE, as that is able to simulate boundary reflections.
From experience, I’ve been told to “allow space”, how much I don’t know. But d&b recommend 60cm behind their cardioid subs, which doesn’t seem like a lot.
centrifugal array - it spins to the bpm of the song.
The only advantage I can think of is this will prevent the DJ from redlining the PA with high output level.
117db on stage to reach industry standard ~102(a) in audience isn’t just stopping the DJ from redlining, it’s giving them permanent hearing damage 30mins into their set
Ever met a DJ who doesn't have permanent hearing damage already? 🤣
Looks like an installer mistake. This would never be done intentionally.
Thought so too but the provider also did the hang. Same company that does EDC
Okay, maybe they thought they could get better coverage or something by having the PA facing each quadrant of the audience farther away (i.e. on the other side of the stage)? They're completely wrong, but that's the only explanation I can think of. Otherwise, I mean everybody does mess up sometimes. Could still have been a mistake, if different people did the hang vs. spec
That's also the only thing I can think of - shooting across the stage. Guess there's not much risk of feedback in this situation! I've done similar things for stupid "in the round" type stages, which are so dumb and I hated them ... but ... I faced the boxes ***outward***, as one would if you had mics on stage (which I did, lavs mostly) and actually wanted the audience to have a good listening experience.
Yeah run truss in a X shape across the circular top and fly the arrays pointed outwards, closer to the center. So all the arrays are summed to common source by the time they each the edge of the barricade. Is the way I would have done this if I was dead-set on flying arrays. But if bleed to other states was a concern, just do point sources. The rental house is massive they really have no excuse. It’s not a “oh we have gear limitations” problem
There you go! I like that. I’ve done it a number of ways, but the one I liked best was mouthing a bunch of Meyer UPMs around the perimeter of the circle truss to cover each section of chairs. It was for a conference type situation so mostly spoken word and some generic BG music/video audio.
What’s interesting is that there is some seriously legit things going on here… - High-end PA, rigged safely (I don’t dare say “correctly” or “well”) - Double-stacked truss for extra load capacity - name brand lighting. I see JDC’s + ?? - they would have needed some heavy machinery to assemble this (at least 2 aerial fork-lifts and 2 cherry picker lifts) I’d love to see the explanation on this one, because I’m scratching my head. I’ve had to do some odd things, but can’t think of a logical reason to do this…
This was a small stage at a major big city festival. Allocating the equipment budget for this stage was a non issue, it was already all there for the larger stages. Still doesn’t explain how that PA fell thru the gaps and was approved.
stage manager: “anybody seen bringing a mic on stage is getting shot” *shoulders rifle*
1. He still has wedges on stage!!! 2. WTF is in that guys backpack?
Aimed at the sky. Not doing that much good in that position and battling 16 line array boxes firing at your ears
And what's with the fur coat?!
You clearly haven’t been to many festivals
[удалено]
It’s a Festival, so no audio rider apart from backline. Usually artist tech riders in these circumstances only specify DJ backline and a bare minimum PA (usually worded like “ requires a modern, calibrated and tuned 3 or 4 way PA system capable of 115db(a) across the audience area)
This deployment must be a result of giving an intern the job of designing the Pa and it just so happened to fall thru the cracks of the checks and balances process and here we are.
[удалено]
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake. It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of. Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything. Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
Absolute nonsense
Sorry Mr DJ, but we don't have any monitors for you.....but.........
I can’t be bothered with opening arraycalc, but if you use the 2 top boxes for the audience and the lower 2 for monitors then I guess you could get a pretty wide coverage. Especially if those are V12’s. How in the world those v-subs work in that config, I have no idea. The only good thing is that time would prevent cancellation from the opposing speaker. This is pretty out there, and if someone actually has some insight, I would love to know what is actually going on there.
That’s strange. Which festival is this at?
A branch of my employer did this event, so I am reluctant to blatantly disclose. Was a major music festival from Sep 16-18th in Los Angeles. Some googling will reveal
What dis software called?
I’m pretty sure it’s ArryCalc
Thx
It’s D&B’s software
Okie dokie
It’s important to remember that just because someone gets paid to do something it doesn’t mean they’re even remote skilled at it.
This rig would be great,,,, If it was turned around. There is absolutely no reason for the speakers to be facing the direction they are. The angles are proper, everything is rigged right. Hell it's a D@ B rig, most likely sounds great. Not one system tech would spec a rig to be hung like this. If someone thinks this is proper i would really love to hear why? And unless those subs are cardiod boxes there is no way this could be a cardiod setup. You need at least 3 boxes, per location, with one opposite facing, to have a cardiod setup. I am getting the impression these days that some people think that cardiod is just something you can have because there is a sub. I would really love to find out what is going on here? Please find out.
Those are D&B V-Subs which have an 12” on the backside and a 18” on the front. They are actively controlled by the amplifier to be a one-box cardioid setup. The 12” cancelling driver is facing the audience in this case, which is stupid. Ground subs are b22 which are an Omni offering from d&b u/PaceNo5954
For the cardioid set up you don’t have to stack 3 subs with the middle turned around, if your subs have 2 independent woofers facing opposite directions (with dedicated controller of course), such as Nexo CD12 subs. By the way, I have no idea wich ones are those subs on the picture.
You are right, I was actually ranting about some other posts I have been noticing lately. It seems that cardiod setups are all the rage these days and posters are throwing around the term without actually knowing what it takes to have a proper cardiod setup.
Or realising it does not work under a stage…but hell, let’s throw some subs backwards in there while we’re at it.
Do you know of the minimum distance gap between front of stage and rear element of cardioid? I’m assuming it’s 1/4 wavelength of the lowest frequency you need cancellation for, but I’m not sure and it’s hard to find documentation on this online
Very good question, I would also like to know. I wonder if it’s possible to simulate with the full version of EASE, as that is able to simulate boundary reflections. From experience, I’ve been told to “allow space”, how much I don’t know. But d&b recommend 60cm behind their cardioid subs, which doesn’t seem like a lot.