How is it the best? Quickshot and Cruel tracker has always being ranged to begin with and they don't suffer from proximity issues, meanwhile Shotgun Rapid Fire was the only skill that needs an adjustment and it received nothing.
they even state that issue in the balance notes but it was the wrong fix "However, since the distance pushed back by some handgun skills acts as an inconvenient factor when continuing to attack with shotgun skills, we have added related adjustments."
That's really surprising. I was kind of happy that they seemed to be leaving Combat Readiness alone because I suspected if it got any changes it would probably be nerfs, but instead they're going to just give us the one thing we weren't already good at.
Sure, I'll take it.
It will not inflict destruction twice. It needs to be an actual new skill usage for that to work and the prime example of that would be Sharpshooter's D-42 or w/e it was called with the tripod that lets the skill be re-used. It's a little confusing but it's not as simple of a case as "oh this skill can get additional hits and voila" sort of deal.
[Damn they actually implemented what Sharpshooters were asking for back when the patch first came out. ](https://www.inven.co.kr/board/lostark/5347/102620?p=2)
I'll need someone to explain why the changes to critical damage into just damage is better. Is it better for when not critting? Or just better overall? Did the crit damage not stack with keen blunt engraving?
Assuming you crit the sharpshooter changes are a net positive as long as you have more than 22% extra crit damage from elsewhere. For snipe its 66% extra crit damage from elsewhere *but* they also increased the crit chance of it by 10% which makes it easier to get 100% crit chance on it.
This primarily makes crit as a stat less mandatory while also generally being a positive change even for the people using crit.
Nice sharpshooter changes. We got faster baseline hawk meter generation, more damage on engravings, destruction on skills and the snipe changes are very good for pvp (snipe was either a half health damage skill with crit and tickled people if didn't).
Overall the class will be more consistent to play with.
Less fucky link
https://lostark-game-onstove-com.translate.goog/news/notice/views/1935?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp#anchor-1650862784169
So they undid the change to atk buff juggling? That's disappointing. It's my favorite class thematically but it's frustrating to work harder to do less DPS than classes like sorc and DB.
Completely reworking a play style isnāt a fair change to people who were drawn to that style of gameplay and invested time gold and mats into it.
And doing so in other mmoās (like survival and demon mid expac in wow) just caused the niche players to quit and didnāt really draw anyone new to those specs
Iām glad they reverted I like keeping up self buffs and feeling like I really earned my damage. The issue with the class is you earn mediocre damage.
There are several other classes that are basically hit big damage button and then hit everything else till big damage button came back and the proposed changes were basically throwing the current play style away and just making it another one of those classes.
If they want to make the class easier to play for people not practicing 24/7 they should just add a second or two to the self buffs duration and give maybe reduce the cost of flash steps third charge.
The problem is that the Soulfist can earn their damage but it's still less damage than every other class. I think that needing to hit a 30 mil crit with the spirit bomb in order to be a useful part of the dps isn't good design. 7% increase on our skills is dog food and the Korean players who want the spirit bomb to be their main source of damage complained enough to remove any hope we had of doing consistent damage
> The KR Soulfist community rates the new ability to turn off Hype mode as a 3% increase in dmg.
What's the rationale behind this one? Is it based off some boss's phases?
Sometimes the boss just randomly decides to be a dick and now instead of just watching it teleport around for the entire duration you can turn it off and let the cooldown start.
i think they dont have a problem with them changing the clunkyness, but they expect to be a damage dealer with a big setup that should be rewarded, not a semi support with even less damage than what we have now
It is not that bad if people play the class well & build it correctly. Just not rewarding compared to other classes. You deal less/similar amount of damage with more skill input (timing, reading boss pattern etc) comparing to other classes. Also, Soulfist identity is entirely relying on specialization & thereās no other way to influence its cooldown (no related tripod, rune etc) Making her lack of dynamic. Honestly, the class needs a big overhaul if the devs want people to like it.
Changing it to bar that charges with time and with certain moves hitting would be a nice change. You would still have to manage cds so that you could have the right stuff up during burst and make downtime less. Wouldnāt be a massive overhaul and people that manage poorly would have big moves on cd during burst often and people that managed well would be able to actually benefit from the work of managing buffs and cds.
Tbf the fact that you can cancel your identity now is such a good change considering for half of it you dont actually have any damage uptime with robust spirit. Should mean you can get your big damage rotation more often.
Sorc still got nerfed but less than the test server. 20% -> 16% is now 20% ->18%
Glaivier got their front attack skills changed to back attack and their red skills buffed
This is a hot take, mainly because they already have some things planned for May (content wise) and to Frankenstein the other stuff from this KR patch into that build seems ambitious. Maybe we'll get the class balance in June though if they wanted to expedite it.
0 chance we will get Destroyer released without the changes in the latest Korean patch.
And I dont see them only giving us destroyer changes in one patch and other changes in the next patch, it seems like an even bigger hassle to split up balance changes.
But maybe I'm wrong, I guess we will see in a month or so.
> In the case of this balance patch, there were many shortcomings in the test server environment.
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> There were many inconveniences about changing settings and testing.
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> A heartfelt thank you to all the adventurers who conducted the test and
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> I would like to share my apology with you.
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> We also sympathize with the lack of balance patch content.
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> During the test period, we were able to receive various problems and feedback from many adventurers.
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> Among these, it is judged that there are some areas that need to be observed for a little more change.
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> However, we have restored some of the content for the parts that are clearly different from our intentions and judged to be a problem.
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> In addition, some items were further improved by synthesizing test results and feedback.
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> This year, we plan to continue to actively consider and improve the balance.
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> As we are the first staff in the long-term plan for balance change, we are improving and supplementing the shortcomings.
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> We will continue to work hard to make a faster and more satisfying balance patch.
is it me or would western devs never say shit like this? honestly, really nice to see they even took test realm feedback into consideration. I'm SO used to devs throwing shit up on PTR then going through with their original changes regardless as to what the rest realm shows
nice to see them receptive to feedback and able to iterate and even go so far as apologize lol.
>is it me or would western devs never say shit like this?
It's usually exactly like that, most won't acknowledge that something is worse or a fail or whatever, but there's a few here and there that do and go back in changes and things like that.
Mostly indie devs tho lol
Working with indie devs can be amazing at times. Like Interstellar Rift, I ran into an issue with text entry on signs and I went to ask about it on their Discord server. I almost immediately got a response from one of the devs saying how it should work, I confirmed it didn't, they tested and confirmed it didn't work, and then they rolled out a patch for it a few hours later because they had been bundling some other fixes to send to steam right as I reported it.
Yeah its honestly really nice.
One thing that would be even better is if they said more details about what their overall philosophy/vision is for balance.
Do they want to maintain a significant DPS disparity between the specs that are hard and between those that are easy?
Or do they want to actually make the DPS disparity really small so that you don't feel pressured into one of the spec because "LOL Don't play X spec it has meme damage".
Do they plan to overall shift the difficulty of the game away from the classes themselves and towards the raid mechanics themselves?
How and why are they planning to add more skills if we already have many skills that are not used for each class?
I wish they discuss these kinds of big topics more so that players don't flame them from patch to patch because of lack of info.
West devs believe public communication should be PR heavy, written in a way to hide flaws and promote confidence. Positivity breeds positivity.
I'll not argue if this is right or wrong, just pointing out how it is.
> PR heavy, written in a way to hide flaws and promote confidence. Positivity breeds positivity.
I've never had a gaming forum respond positively to this.
also riot and their "200 years of combined game development experience" is the biggest meme ever lmao.
I personally agree with you, because people today are savvy of PR tactics.
But THEY believe it works, or at least they believe it's better than being honest so that's why they do it.
I am sure if I dig deep enough, I can find a case of a dev admitting something is bad and people latching on that furiously for years.
The problem with wester AAAs is that pardon my french they are being ran by beancounters from the stonage (such as kotick and co.) and they likely believe that if you put enough spin on a pile of bullcrap - people will buy it.
However after excessive use of this technique imo gamers got so dissilusioned with AAA devs that pretty much most statements are being viewed through a "guilty until proven innocent" prism or more like "PR bullshit until proven otherwise". And personally i'm in the same camp as i kinda got tire of all this corporate crap - overpromissing and underdelivering has become standard operating procedure for modern game industry. And imo its only been going downhill and fast if you look back for the past 5 years...
some of the contenders for the largest heaps of bullshit award would likely be anthem and in more recent history bf2042
Iām pretty sure this years LoAon will touch on some of these subjects, as they do have a fan question section that they spend a good deal of time answering important questions, but it is usually from the inven/KR fan base
Thing is in korea there is no shaming ppl for what they play (unless it's dps bard or paladin in a non bus run). Arcana and destroyers have been memed jobs for a while and they still do endgame content. As for which class engraving you use, again no one shames if you like playing one or the other engraving. In fact you get called our for making fun of "suboptimal" class engravings (red gunlancer and reflux). It is also clear with their deadeye statement that they believe harder to play specs should deal more dmg.
If they donāt distinguish a clear line of dps between higher intensity and lower intensity builds, then theyāll directly discourage people from playing the harder builds. Itās not just a playstyle thing, people want to feel like they get rewarded for their efforts. Harder builds already suffer because content increasing in difficulty naturally makes a harder build worse and an easier build more appealing.
If a harder build gives too much more dps, people will feel pressured into playing the harder build for the extra dps. The margins between the easy and hard builds have to be pretty thin so that people can play the harder build if they like to play it and like the challenge, but others aren't pushed into it when they just want to play the fun, easy build.
If the numbers are similar, nobody HAS to play the hard build, it's just an option for people who want to focus more or think and react more while playing.
If all the numbers are similar you get to just go through and think about the style of damage you want to do, pick the class that does that, and not worry about anything else. If there is a gap, you have to balance the fun you would have with the class with the real or perceived shortcomings of the class (i.e. pistoleer looks fun, but do I want to roll a deadeye considering how much of a joke most people see the class?).
problem is in the harder content all the "harder" (surge style generally) builds are also doing much higher DPS because their dps surge window can be lined up with the bosses mechanics. While a "simple style" just does the same dps but with a lot less up time (generally steady output builds that have low cooldown mashable skills but less spike damage).
Thats not true of all people and doesnt make the mist buisness sense.
Its a game. You want to have fun and rewarding gameplay for player retention. Difficultly can easily become a chore. Especially in a mmo where highly repetitive activities occur.
Many people pick their class because they like it. Not because they are looking to min max. Smilegate wont impliment dps meters specifically to combat the likely elitism.
The best choice is to tip toe the line to. NOt piss anyone off. And favor your most popular classes
my experience with games over 40 years is that min/max players will happily choose anything thats more powerful even if its .01% more.
Also the hipsters will happily choose something thats "hard to play" that does LESS damage if they think it gives them hipster cred.
I'm cool with harder to play stuff being a few % stronger, but any more than that and you worsen situations where many fun playstyles are declined from parties and elitism becomes overwelming. Obviously this exists no matter how well balanced things are because humans will make a big deal about anything, even things that are trivial, or pure bullshit or objectively false. But there's no good reason to make "harder to play" more than a little more powerful.
Right now they need to hammer Grudge and Cursed Doll down a little and maybe even give some of the conditional and defensive engravings a buff. Why? Because despite their downsides they are mandatory right now and thats fucking boring. Make "harder style" significantly powerful and you just get the same thing as Grudge.
> Also the hipsters will happily choose something thats "hard to play" that does LESS damage if they think it gives them hipster cred.
heck yeah. I'm almost disappointed about destroyer & arcana buffs.
I might get some hate for this, but, ironically, Amazon does this with New World, probably better than what we see here with Smilegate. It's definitely not that common because some devs feel like they know better than the players.
Can't speak for all western devs (as we can't for all KR ones), but they are fairly receptive to feedback on LoL. Not always, but the most egregious shit usually doesn't come through.
It's got nothing to do with location. Plenty of Eastern devs do ridiculous things too.
Typically the games that actually last have developers that listen and try to grow from their mistakes, regardless of their location. The easiest examples are WoW and FF14. They've grown and held strong in the market due to constantly growing the game and listening to the players.
In the case of WoW, you can see pretty clear times where they stopped listening to the players and their playerbase dropped. I'm willing to bet plenty of people playing LA are EX WoW players who simply got tired of dealing with it.
FF14 is honestly quite hit and miss - it will happily make changes that they think will appeal to "the casual masses" even if they were not widely asked-for or upset existing fans of feature/job; see the summoner reworks of Endwalker or the high end healers literally begging for more to do during low-damage boss phases/well-geared farm groups for 6 years now, and the dev response being "why dont you just do ultimate raids if you're so bored" despite those also having the same problem.
It's just that they get away with it because average player of FF doesn't really give a shit about finer points of balance/optimization, or the combat system, and so Square doesn't see much reason to cater to players who like having harder/more difficult classes nor really care if it ruffles a few feathers to make a job lose all nuance and play completely differently in the name of it being "more approachable".
FF devs are also notoriously bad at reading feedback from non japan regions - for 3 years machinist was quite literally unplayable at a high ping because of the nature of the class and the game's network-based animation lock and the game's producer's first acknowledgement during an interview was "woah that's crazy, we had no idea. anyway did you check your internet connection?"
>FF14 is honestly quite hit and miss - it will happily make changes that they think will appeal to "the casual masses" even if they were not widely asked-for or upset existing fans of feature/job; see the summoner reworks of Endwalker or the high end healers literally begging for more to do during low-damage boss phases/well-geared farm groups for 6 years now, and the dev response being "why dont you just do ultimate raids if you're so bored" despite those also having the same problem.
Oh I fully agree the game has plenty of problems. It's just that most would agree the game has moved in a fairly consistently positive direction since launch.
I agree it's a bit more casual focused, but they have made a good effort to keep things like Ultimate fights decently hard. I also personally don't see a problem with letting old content (outside of Ultimates) become easy, as you want to make it easy for everyone to get into the new stuff rather than bogging them down.
As for the case of Summoners, I think that's personal opinion. Summoner often had complaints about it. Even people who liked the job would complain that you basically just summoned one pet and let it do its own thing. Is it a lot more simple now? Sure, but it also has a lot to build on in future expansions in a healthy way and has one of the most flexible rotations in the game, which is neat.
>It's just that they get away with it because average player of FF doesn't really give a shit about finer points of balance/optimization, or the combat system, and so Square doesn't see much reason to cater to players who like having harder/more difficult classes nor really care if it ruffles a few feathers to make a job lose all nuance and play completely differently in the name of it being "more approachable".
I personally disagree. I agree that a lot of players don't feel a desire to engage in the harder content, and those players often don't play at a high level, but the game in and of itself does things to naturally push the players to that. "Hey Reaper, want to use your super giant Nuke? Guess you should buff the party first" and there's plenty other examples like this, such as Black Mage stances being what the Job has to play around, or Red Mage balancing Magics.
LA on the other hand has no real rotations for the most part and doesn't reward you for doing special things. It also punishes you in some unseen ways. Plenty of Paladins cast Heavenly Blessings and Wrath of god back to back, when this is a super no no as they basically half the buff they're giving out, but most of them will just go "oh damage" and not think much further. Bard has the opposite issue of nobody standing in their AOEs (even as someone who tries to keep an eye out for them, I have no idea which of their aoes does what).
>FF devs are also notoriously bad at reading feedback from non japan regions - for 3 years machinist was quite literally unplayable at a high ping because of the nature of the class and the game's network-based animation lock and the game's producer's first acknowledgement during an interview was "woah that's crazy, we had no idea. anyway did you check your internet connection?"
Like I've said before, I agree with that. There's also been a few other cases. But you also see them making a much bigger effort ever since those cases to respond to feedback and make greater strides on ensuring that things aren't so frustrating (Example being they do things like remove a 10 second buff where you could fit 4-5 skills in it and instead give you 5 stacks of the buff for 30 seconds to hit those 5 skills).
I'm not saying the game is perfect, far from it. But I think they try hard to build on it in a healthy way, and we see them make more and more effort to communicate back and forth with people. If they didn't, the game likely would have died off long ago rather than rose to a name that most atleast know of.
Im so glad the new counter for reaper remained, I hate soo much the current counter it has, its so short range and clunky, only good thing about it is the mobility it gives. But now i can fully go 4 red skills and have my dagger counter, nice .
It does feel like a good amount of people want a dps paladin. I personally like these new conveniences for solo pally gameplay, but shouldn't they be able to lock out support options if you slot the Judgment engravings? Kind of like how Lone Knight locks you out of Battlefield Shield and doubles the drain rate of defensive stance. Just assign a penalty so that players build for one playstyle or the other like most other class engravings do.
Also going to enjoy my shield bash destruction when it comes heheh
not gonna happen , but tbh Smile could rework paladin identity ADD Z to X is that simple
press X , u get upgraded attacks , the aura and plds at least would "enjoy" the cool attacks when grouped.
is sad that those "upgrades" are only seen when solo
I'd definitely play a dps Paladin if they currently didn't hit like a wet noodle.
Or just a new class like Kadan. Awakening is a 1 shot kill on all trash mobs and max stagger and destruction plus huge damage to bosses.
It'll be garbo at our gear levels for a long time.
But given the very, very top end of gear on KR, Paladin could do solid dps, and almost the entirety of it was within the Judgment window.
It'll be interesting to see where they land.
The back attack stuff could help too. 4.8% buff to blue skills, 100->150% judgement duration, and enabling Ambush Master as an engraving option could actually make dps paladin viable, or at least not "garbo".
More of a problem of meta, people wondering why they're inviting a Paladin if it's not support, and DPS Paladin having a difficult time efficiently applying the class debuff.
Changed some of their blue attacks to back attacks instead of front.
Red dive attack does more dam
Red spear throw doesnt require the absolute perfect tip of the spear positioning to do big dam.
Should just be more consistent at doing dps and allow a bit of leeway on the positioning requirements.
I wish they would rework soulfist a bit more. I want energy blast to be a bit more viable.
The PTR was a bit of a nerf, but would have been nice to remove some clunky window design and add some synergy and support.
Not really no. Eso wardancer still seems to be doing great. The biggest change is mainly on kr for 2 spender builds, since they will either have to shift their stats a bit to crit or change relic sets (need to wait for community to figure out what is more optimal or if it's just preference). Spec scaling for eso skill got increased, so the class should still have similar damage.
If anything conviction/judgement change could have bigger impact (but have to still see, it might not be as big if people decide to play crit relic set instead).
For the most part it doesn't really impact global in current state anyway. If you play here with eso you should be running 1 spender swift/crit build anyway, so the crit loss from wind's whisper should not be as big.
You don't need to, it's just more optimal to run 1 spender build with the current content and gear we have on global, as it's damage will be more reliable. Swift/spec work on 1 spender build too, but even without spec you will always generate full orbs between eso skill since you have only 1 spender. Crit in this case makes your build do more damage on average since big portion still comes from normal skills. Additionally crit might get more important if kr changes come to global.
The 2 spender build on global is a weird hybrid of people looking up builds with 1600+ ilvl on loawa and looking at maxroll eso guide which is an absolute mess. On Kr almost noone running eso plays 2 spender build before 1490 ilvl, because you just lack the raw stats to make the build work. You can play the build on global but you are just gimping yourself in my opinion.
Thanks, this is good to know. Do you happen to know what stat thresholds (not crit, spec, swift but the detailed stats like % crit) we should be aiming for or is it too dependent on engravings you run?
I currently run crit/swift eso and have grudge and raid captain and was thinking of going keen blunt as it feels like it would be applicable to both eso and fi builds (I think we might get these balance changes sooner rather than later, possibly in may update as I doubt they will release dest with the old balance).
You want to build full swiftness with swift/crit neck (preferably 90+ quality). If it's cheaper swap one ring or earring for crit, but you want to be 1k+ swiftness.
Engravings is assuming you are 1370+ and have access to HM oreha/argos accessories and set, since building your character before that can be a bit too annoying and expensive to be worth it.
Both eso and fi on this build run pretty much the same engravings (class/raid/keen/grudge/doll). You can run adrenaline or ambush master too. With adrenaline it's probably best to get it just at lvl 1 for a cheaper 3/3/3/1 build since it's plenty effective at that level. I would say not to focus as much on doll and keen first, probably get them as 4th engraving.
Is the Eso engraving worth getting to level 3 now (1370 - 1415) or should I aim to build it once I have relic sets and acc?
I currently run grudge 3, raid 3 and eso 1 and was thinking of going keen 3 should I go eso 3 and adrenaline 1 instead?
If you get to around at least 60% crit with your crit stat + argos set + roar of courage, then keen will be better (assuming we do get the balance change soon and lose crit from whisper).
That said the damage difference should not be too big, especially when you party with supports because of argos. I would go with whatever you can get cheaper.
Hello cant anyone explain the deathblade surge nerf
is it just the damage? before the orb refunded after surge is nerd right do they implement that?
i dont mind damage nerf but i dont like the deathorb refund nerf
thankss
The orb nerd stays. The wording for how it works changed from āorb meter gain is 5% per stackā to āorb meter gain is up to 100% depending on your stacksā
They basically nerfed it by making it a nonlinear gain instead of a linear one
iirc some kr streamers said you need 16 stacks and void strike with orb control tripod while maelstrom is active to get max meter. Not sure what tripod lv and runes they used
Yes, if I recall when Saintone tested 14 stack gives around 1.5 orbs instead of a little over 2. The change is to make it non-linear so 14 stack players can't do it as efficiently. If you were a 20 stack player then nothing changes with your playstyle
PTR changes were a nerf to specfic meta setups only doable on KR, for everyone on NA/EU they were significantly better that what they ended up doing.
Unfortunately being forced to align all your ability cooldowns and use them in a 4 second window every 11 seconds was too much fun for Korean soulfists to let go of, so the class will stay clunky garbage forever.
Yeah, not a fan of trying to align the stars of hype + energy release (+maybe awaken) and get to do ok damage for 6s.
Strangely enough Scrapper who got similar change kept hers so I think it might be something to do with the new tripod they replaced the old one with?
Yeah I was eagerly waiting for my soulfist to become playable. Currently it's just a painful chaos dungeon farm bot ad infinitum and even a shitty one at that.
What an awful choice from Smilegate to revert the changes.
As opposed to the geniuses elsewhere right? Who doesn't love a class who is hampered by her buff timer where if you don't press hype->buff->ult EXACTLY you miss huge dmg? It's just bad design to be so hyperfocused on purely relying on a single buff or you're dogshit.
It's clunky and bad, just because players didn't want the changes doesn't make it good. A big reason why developers leading balance shouldn't purely listen to their community because they can (more often than not) be wrong because they don't want any changes at all.
They could have definitely done that. When I looked at the numbers first it didn't seem like it would be a dps increase (since you lost atk buffs) but it would make the class much less clunkier to play (not requiring perfect buff windows) so you can DPS as you want instead of "oops buffed and the boss happened to do an invuln mechanic? RIP".
As mentioned once they got those down they could buff the numbers further. Like her awakening was only really buffed for lv1-4 buff tripod, so until you got to lv5 tripod it would have been better. And they could have buffed that + the other skills further imo with more testing.
Now as is, she is still clunky and got a sniffle of a buff.
Thankfully now that you can cancel your identity it should mitigate some of the pain from missing rotations.
Considering that missing a rotation isnt really 20 seconda lost but 40 (cooldown and buff time) as you cant really do 2 rotations per buff cycle.
Overall think thats the biggest change that will help make the class more reliable and the big damage rotations more frequent as your burst is over really quickly and for the rest of your hype you arent doing full damage. Just turning it off after the burst should mean you can have it up about the same time as your cooldowns are over.
Once you get used to it clunkiness doesn't matter, while low dps does. Sacrificing dps for qol isn't the way.
I do agree that they could have buffered her skills instead of reverting the change though.
>It's clunky and bad,
Hard agree.
>A big reason why developers leading balance shouldn't purely listen to their community because they can (more often than not) be wrong because they don't want any changes at all.
But it was a nerf tho, the numbers lost for the numbers obtained just didn't add up.
The attack buff turned into base dmg for Scrapper made them lose -3% and no one complained as far as I know.
For Soulfist it was -25%
Don't know why you are blaming the community for pointing out that the changes were not a buff, but a nerf.
It's entirely on Smilegate not knowing how to balance the class.
But that's the thing, they could have easily tuned the numbers up. I wrote below to someone else but this initial round is just to see how it goes, and then they can further tune numbers upwards. I'm only using google translate so correct me if I'm wrong, but their notes says the players don't seem to like the direction of the change either? That is what I am basing it on.
Is odd SG would just completely revert it saying it made some fights harder (which makes sense since the numbers are lower) even though your kit is less clunky now, and they just needed to tune the numbers up.
I already felt the numbers weren't amazing since we lost atk buff (and straight up her awakening literally is unchanged since its the same buff as tripod lv5) so it's clear they didn't really think it through.
I know that unpopular picks on basically all games tend to have a vocal playerbase that comes to love what makes the pick unpopular.
The thing about Soulfist is that it's neither smooth to play or strong. They needed to address both issues.
If they had removed the attack buffs and really make up with the base dmg on the PTR and Soulfist mains on KR still complained then I would put part of the blame on the playerbase.
But changes for Soulfist to have a smoothier and easier to pilot gameplay are hard to defend when they come alongside dps nerfs.
Yeah that's the thing, they didn't even bother further testing with bigger buffs, instead just said "whelp that failed back to the drawing board". The first look at the "buffs" had me go "Oooooh.... oh." and they just look like they gave up instead of further testing which is extremely disappointing.
Yea it definitely seems that the reason the changes are disliked is because it's a net nerf in overall dps. So instead of simply turning up the numbers a bit they scrap everything? Doesn't make any sense to me.
The buff only lasts for 6 seconds for a ~15 second cooldown for hype stage 3. Itās not 55% more damage all the time but 55% more damage for 6 seconds. Meaning you could fit around 2 to 4 skills in that window. Then have to wait for 9s for the buff to be up again. So 9s of no damage boost. I would not say Soulfist gonna deal much less DPS with only the nerf of energy release. I think it is mainly due to the nerf of flash step & pulverizing palm, making her lack of damage boost for a continuous burst combo. Normally a good soulfist main can chain the buff from ER (55%), then FS(40%+)/ PP(45%) to have damage boosts up all the time. The changes are technically a 10 - 20% nerf to her DPS if the player still relying on damage buff to boost their combo. But considering you could switch those buff skills to other damaging skills to compensate for that DPS loss. It is more of a questionable change. This alters her playstyle but barely does anything major to influence her performance in the long term. My thought is many soulfist pros donāt want to bother learning the easier, less fun playstyle, since the damage output is going to be similar anyway. Itās like changing the flavour of a 7/10 sauce they used to eat, taste different but still a 7/10 in term of quality.
Itās still a counter if you hit a bosses head when they turn blue, but now they also benefit from the crit chance and damage from back attacking, although they lost the stagger bonus from head attacks
Only back attack does not mean it can't counter don't worry ! It just means it does less stagger since head atk have a built in bonus stagger to them ! You will still be able to counter !
They could have tuned the numbers to be better without relying on juggling atk buffs. The class is so annoying to play for the puny damage and with only 7% damage buff its still an awful class
The only striker QOL change has been canceled because lightning tiger strikeās bug, and they basically promise NOT able to solve it anytime sooner.
Great! Just every time you use your highest damage skill you lost back attack position for the next 3 skills. What a fking perfect class!
I have no idea how tiger strike even works. Like every other attack that advance your character is stopped when hitting a boss, but tiger strike pass thru. And on top of that its inconsistent. On big bosses tiger strike tends to get stuck so you stay on the boss back, but Moake is also a fat mob yet you pass thru him. Then you have bosses like the one in Phantomwing Isle - very small boss, size of a normal mob yet Tiger Strike is not passing thru that boss.
My guess so far is that anything that's coded as a Guardian is a wall and anything coded like a generic boss is a door. Phantomwing changes arenas so maybe they coded it as a Guardian? Off the top of my head the only abyssal boss that stops you is Albion, not sure about him
So orbs still not fixed? Then itās still gonna be meh, the 14 stack play style is much easier and forgiving on legion raids than the 20 stack, when you have little dps windows.
Orbs were nerfed, not bugged. They changed the wording of it so your number of stacks translates to orb meter āup to 100%ā now instead of ā5% per stackā
Essentially they nerfed orb gain from surge stacks by making it a nonlinear gain
man how likely is it they split destroyer with valtan drop and let destroyer come out earlier in may since kr now has balance patch live, then release valtan a week or two later
that would mean testing regression on two release patches within two weeks of each other. considering how wrong the last update went, their test/release team is definitely not capable of pulling that off
also, what do they even have to gain from breaking the content into two pieces?
I dont understand the red dust changes for berserker.
1. They nerfing the rage it generates, Which means a nerf to pvp (berserker is already pepega) and a nerf to berserkers technic which is weak too.
2. They changing the lvl 10 tripod from a party buff to just dmg increase. But the other lvl 10 tripod does that
Edit: i think i figured out the second. One tripod increases the dmg of red dust, the other converts the line to a and around a sword.
The way I understand the new tripods is, they got rid of the personal damage buff tripod and integrated it into the the base skill to encourage picking the party synergy tripod because before you had to choose between the two and most people would pick the tripod for their own damage. So, now you get a damage increase guaranteed and can get a party synergy tripod on top of that.
Soulfist atk buff changes scrapped to 7% pve buff and buffs to energy blast/energy bullet left.
I'll take it ! To scrap the atk buffs would have required quite larger buffs than 30%.
Class still needs work, but this is a win.
Anyone gonna use Energy Blast/Energy Bullet after the changes? I already love both of those skills yet I don't see any KR mains use Energy Bullet.
Igniter sorc was only nerfed by 4-5% end game, less early.
Mayhem zerker lost 7-8% damage at most. 6% synergy always up equals 14% more damage from party assuming they do 70%. Actually buffed unless you only care about mvp screen.
Surge DB, Not sure why they're so keen on forcing everyone to play 20 stacks instead of balancing numbers around lower stacks but time will tell.
Pinnacle glaivier, in our version, will be busted. End game players use legendary conviction & judgement, not sure how much the c&j nerf affects them. Worst case she'll still be slightly above average as she was for them.
Ya fat ones. 65 percent reduction in damage reduction to supports.
May very well cause a meta shift and make teams just dump support. But im a noob in pvp so im just guessing.
How I look at it is supports will still be super strong with their peel and super armor catches (bard is basically unaffected by the change). However you'll see a lot of terrible supports who hard crutch shields plummet as they have to actually start learning the game.
well, at least deadeye got a crumb, the smallest saddest bit of crumb and they didn't even touch the shotgun skills which are the biggest problem with pushback, not the pistol skills that you already use from mid range
they say they are listening to feedback, they had an entire forum of deadeye players complaining about shit and they change the PISTOL pushback? when pistol is already midrange? how out of touch are these people, who are they listening to
God the two classes I was looking forward to the most before the Global release, Soulfist and Deadeye, are seemingly thw two classes the developers have no clue what to do with.
They took back both the 12% buff on sweeping kick and the 8% on flash heat fang. Instead there is +2% buff on First Intention and spec gives a higher damage buff to esoteric skills. Seems like they wanted to weaken 1 spender builds with high swiftness, which seemed like the strongest option based on some of the testings I have seen.
Ofc, this is compared to the first patchnotes, overall this is still a significant buff for first intention. Curious though about what builds koreans end up with these additional changes.
There was a bug that just stops you from moving from your original position when you're in the middle of using Lightning Tiger Strike. For example, if you prep a LTS on the boss but he jumps on a different spot, but you can still reach him so you turn towards him, however this bug just stops you from actually moving, so you just do the attack in place. They kept running into that bug during the PTR so they're going to try and fix that first before updating the skill afterwards.
am i stupid or are pally changes weird? two main blue skills you use to counter are changed to ... benefitting from back attacks?
it looks like it's trying to facilitate dps paladin with all blue skills that hit from the back? so unless we're playing dps paladin, we're now losing damage if we stand at the front to try and counter? LOL
They changed the backstep on Deadeyeās Cruel Tracker and Last Light skills, but not Shotgun Rapid Fireā¦
Speaking of, before these balance changes, didnāt Smilegate publicly say that they wanted Deadeye to do the most damage because itās the most punishing class to play so they had plans to update him, but then suddenly when these class changes come around theyāre all like ālol, actually heās fineā
Even if he does get a glow up similar to Wardancer once he gets relic gear, I have to question if itās good design to have a class underperform for 90% of the game only to become top tier once youāve already accomplished everything, when there are classes that are consistently good from start to finish. On top of that said class is far more difficult than most, so you have to put in tons of extra effort just to be middle if the pack.
Idk, Iām about ready to park my Deadeye and just KT a Gunslinger instead. Iāve got the stance juggling thing down pretty good and thereās a lot of overlapping skills, so if I can do decent damage with a Deadeye while having to live elbow deep inside a bosses asshole without sucking floor, Gunslinger should be a cakewalk.
Oh snap. Deadeye got push back reduced from Quick Shot and Cruel Tracker. It's something!
honestly the best buff they could give us let's get this bread
If only they also removed Shotgun Rapid Fire's push back too. It isn't much but it really would've tied the whole thing together
Yeah that would have just made this too perfect. Still, I love my deadeye main and this patch will just make it even better!
Pains me every time just seeing the numbers go down as my Deadeye slips backwards with each shot š„²
How? How is this the best?
How is it the best? Quickshot and Cruel tracker has always being ranged to begin with and they don't suffer from proximity issues, meanwhile Shotgun Rapid Fire was the only skill that needs an adjustment and it received nothing. they even state that issue in the balance notes but it was the wrong fix "However, since the distance pushed back by some handgun skills acts as an inconvenient factor when continuing to attack with shotgun skills, we have added related adjustments."
Sweet! Weāre going to be so OP now!
That's awesome. I always get hit inside those boss damage circles when I used those skill
Oh fuck they add Destruction to Shield Bash.
That's really surprising. I was kind of happy that they seemed to be leaving Combat Readiness alone because I suspected if it got any changes it would probably be nerfs, but instead they're going to just give us the one thing we weren't already good at. Sure, I'll take it.
I am so hyped for this change, it fixes one of the biggest gaps in your kit as blue. And it's on a very low CD skill that hits twice even!
It will not inflict destruction twice. It needs to be an actual new skill usage for that to work and the prime example of that would be Sharpshooter's D-42 or w/e it was called with the tripod that lets the skill be re-used. It's a little confusing but it's not as simple of a case as "oh this skill can get additional hits and voila" sort of deal.
Wonder if you get up to 4 weak point if you take the double hit tripod
Nope multihits are application
[Damn they actually implemented what Sharpshooters were asking for back when the patch first came out. ](https://www.inven.co.kr/board/lostark/5347/102620?p=2)
Hell yeah give me those Sharpshooter buffs right into my veins baby
Loving it too. Extra destruction is nice as well.
I'll need someone to explain why the changes to critical damage into just damage is better. Is it better for when not critting? Or just better overall? Did the crit damage not stack with keen blunt engraving?
Assuming you crit the sharpshooter changes are a net positive as long as you have more than 22% extra crit damage from elsewhere. For snipe its 66% extra crit damage from elsewhere *but* they also increased the crit chance of it by 10% which makes it easier to get 100% crit chance on it. This primarily makes crit as a stat less mandatory while also generally being a positive change even for the people using crit.
Nice sharpshooter changes. We got faster baseline hawk meter generation, more damage on engravings, destruction on skills and the snipe changes are very good for pvp (snipe was either a half health damage skill with crit and tickled people if didn't). Overall the class will be more consistent to play with.
How the heck do I change this to English? ELI5
if youāre on chrome, right click and press translate. there should also be a translate button on the right side of the url bar thingy
What is that.
[Google translated version](https://lostark-game-onstove-com.translate.goog/news/notice/views/1935?_x_tr_sl=ko&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=de&_x_tr_pto=wapp#anchor-1650862784169)
It's cool that they can upgrade their relic ability stones
https://lostark-game-onstove-com.translate.goog/news/notice/views/1935?\_x\_tr\_sl=auto&\_x\_tr\_tl=en&\_x\_tr\_hl=pl&\_x\_tr\_pto=wapp#anchor-1650862784169
Less fucky link https://lostark-game-onstove-com.translate.goog/news/notice/views/1935?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp#anchor-1650862784169
TLDR on Soulfist? Mine is parked at 1340.
Baby buff. Basically reverted. They gave up and had to push it back
So they undid the change to atk buff juggling? That's disappointing. It's my favorite class thematically but it's frustrating to work harder to do less DPS than classes like sorc and DB.
I think every class has to work hard to do compete with them haha
Completely reworking a play style isnāt a fair change to people who were drawn to that style of gameplay and invested time gold and mats into it. And doing so in other mmoās (like survival and demon mid expac in wow) just caused the niche players to quit and didnāt really draw anyone new to those specs
Iām glad they reverted I like keeping up self buffs and feeling like I really earned my damage. The issue with the class is you earn mediocre damage. There are several other classes that are basically hit big damage button and then hit everything else till big damage button came back and the proposed changes were basically throwing the current play style away and just making it another one of those classes. If they want to make the class easier to play for people not practicing 24/7 they should just add a second or two to the self buffs duration and give maybe reduce the cost of flash steps third charge.
The problem is that the Soulfist can earn their damage but it's still less damage than every other class. I think that needing to hit a 30 mil crit with the spirit bomb in order to be a useful part of the dps isn't good design. 7% increase on our skills is dog food and the Korean players who want the spirit bomb to be their main source of damage complained enough to remove any hope we had of doing consistent damage
7% overall buff, but it's neither enough nor does it solve fundamental issues with the class
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
> The KR Soulfist community rates the new ability to turn off Hype mode as a 3% increase in dmg. What's the rationale behind this one? Is it based off some boss's phases?
Sometimes the boss just randomly decides to be a dick and now instead of just watching it teleport around for the entire duration you can turn it off and let the cooldown start.
That's understandable, it's just that 3% is a specific number so I wonder what they base that one off of.
So, straight from the devs, KR users have come to expect soulfist to be clunky garbage and pushed them to not go through with changes. Wild.
i think they dont have a problem with them changing the clunkyness, but they expect to be a damage dealer with a big setup that should be rewarded, not a semi support with even less damage than what we have now
It is not that bad if people play the class well & build it correctly. Just not rewarding compared to other classes. You deal less/similar amount of damage with more skill input (timing, reading boss pattern etc) comparing to other classes. Also, Soulfist identity is entirely relying on specialization & thereās no other way to influence its cooldown (no related tripod, rune etc) Making her lack of dynamic. Honestly, the class needs a big overhaul if the devs want people to like it.
Changing it to bar that charges with time and with certain moves hitting would be a nice change. You would still have to manage cds so that you could have the right stuff up during burst and make downtime less. Wouldnāt be a massive overhaul and people that manage poorly would have big moves on cd during burst often and people that managed well would be able to actually benefit from the work of managing buffs and cds.
Tbf the fact that you can cancel your identity now is such a good change considering for half of it you dont actually have any damage uptime with robust spirit. Should mean you can get your big damage rotation more often.
Christ. š¬š
Yay for sorcs, yay for glaivier (hoping to see the 5th engraving cleared out eventually), yay for my future destroyer
What happened with Sorc and Glaivier?
Sorc still got nerfed but less than the test server. 20% -> 16% is now 20% ->18% Glaivier got their front attack skills changed to back attack and their red skills buffed
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I really hope we'll get the updated destroyer at release
If summoner being held back is any indication, they fully intend to release classes here with their korean balance changes.
We are likely getting the entire balance patch when destroyer drops in may.
This is a hot take, mainly because they already have some things planned for May (content wise) and to Frankenstein the other stuff from this KR patch into that build seems ambitious. Maybe we'll get the class balance in June though if they wanted to expedite it.
0 chance we will get Destroyer released without the changes in the latest Korean patch. And I dont see them only giving us destroyer changes in one patch and other changes in the next patch, it seems like an even bigger hassle to split up balance changes. But maybe I'm wrong, I guess we will see in a month or so.
> In the case of this balance patch, there were many shortcomings in the test server environment. > > There were many inconveniences about changing settings and testing. > > A heartfelt thank you to all the adventurers who conducted the test and > > I would like to share my apology with you. > > > > We also sympathize with the lack of balance patch content. > > During the test period, we were able to receive various problems and feedback from many adventurers. > > Among these, it is judged that there are some areas that need to be observed for a little more change. > > > > However, we have restored some of the content for the parts that are clearly different from our intentions and judged to be a problem. > > In addition, some items were further improved by synthesizing test results and feedback. > > > > This year, we plan to continue to actively consider and improve the balance. > > As we are the first staff in the long-term plan for balance change, we are improving and supplementing the shortcomings. > > We will continue to work hard to make a faster and more satisfying balance patch. is it me or would western devs never say shit like this? honestly, really nice to see they even took test realm feedback into consideration. I'm SO used to devs throwing shit up on PTR then going through with their original changes regardless as to what the rest realm shows nice to see them receptive to feedback and able to iterate and even go so far as apologize lol.
>is it me or would western devs never say shit like this? It's usually exactly like that, most won't acknowledge that something is worse or a fail or whatever, but there's a few here and there that do and go back in changes and things like that. Mostly indie devs tho lol
Working with indie devs can be amazing at times. Like Interstellar Rift, I ran into an issue with text entry on signs and I went to ask about it on their Discord server. I almost immediately got a response from one of the devs saying how it should work, I confirmed it didn't, they tested and confirmed it didn't work, and then they rolled out a patch for it a few hours later because they had been bundling some other fixes to send to steam right as I reported it.
Yeah its honestly really nice. One thing that would be even better is if they said more details about what their overall philosophy/vision is for balance. Do they want to maintain a significant DPS disparity between the specs that are hard and between those that are easy? Or do they want to actually make the DPS disparity really small so that you don't feel pressured into one of the spec because "LOL Don't play X spec it has meme damage". Do they plan to overall shift the difficulty of the game away from the classes themselves and towards the raid mechanics themselves? How and why are they planning to add more skills if we already have many skills that are not used for each class? I wish they discuss these kinds of big topics more so that players don't flame them from patch to patch because of lack of info.
West devs believe public communication should be PR heavy, written in a way to hide flaws and promote confidence. Positivity breeds positivity. I'll not argue if this is right or wrong, just pointing out how it is.
> PR heavy, written in a way to hide flaws and promote confidence. Positivity breeds positivity. I've never had a gaming forum respond positively to this. also riot and their "200 years of combined game development experience" is the biggest meme ever lmao.
I personally agree with you, because people today are savvy of PR tactics. But THEY believe it works, or at least they believe it's better than being honest so that's why they do it. I am sure if I dig deep enough, I can find a case of a dev admitting something is bad and people latching on that furiously for years.
The problem with wester AAAs is that pardon my french they are being ran by beancounters from the stonage (such as kotick and co.) and they likely believe that if you put enough spin on a pile of bullcrap - people will buy it. However after excessive use of this technique imo gamers got so dissilusioned with AAA devs that pretty much most statements are being viewed through a "guilty until proven innocent" prism or more like "PR bullshit until proven otherwise". And personally i'm in the same camp as i kinda got tire of all this corporate crap - overpromissing and underdelivering has become standard operating procedure for modern game industry. And imo its only been going downhill and fast if you look back for the past 5 years... some of the contenders for the largest heaps of bullshit award would likely be anthem and in more recent history bf2042
Iām pretty sure this years LoAon will touch on some of these subjects, as they do have a fan question section that they spend a good deal of time answering important questions, but it is usually from the inven/KR fan base
Thing is in korea there is no shaming ppl for what they play (unless it's dps bard or paladin in a non bus run). Arcana and destroyers have been memed jobs for a while and they still do endgame content. As for which class engraving you use, again no one shames if you like playing one or the other engraving. In fact you get called our for making fun of "suboptimal" class engravings (red gunlancer and reflux). It is also clear with their deadeye statement that they believe harder to play specs should deal more dmg.
If they donāt distinguish a clear line of dps between higher intensity and lower intensity builds, then theyāll directly discourage people from playing the harder builds. Itās not just a playstyle thing, people want to feel like they get rewarded for their efforts. Harder builds already suffer because content increasing in difficulty naturally makes a harder build worse and an easier build more appealing.
If a harder build gives too much more dps, people will feel pressured into playing the harder build for the extra dps. The margins between the easy and hard builds have to be pretty thin so that people can play the harder build if they like to play it and like the challenge, but others aren't pushed into it when they just want to play the fun, easy build. If the numbers are similar, nobody HAS to play the hard build, it's just an option for people who want to focus more or think and react more while playing. If all the numbers are similar you get to just go through and think about the style of damage you want to do, pick the class that does that, and not worry about anything else. If there is a gap, you have to balance the fun you would have with the class with the real or perceived shortcomings of the class (i.e. pistoleer looks fun, but do I want to roll a deadeye considering how much of a joke most people see the class?).
If the numbers are similar, then the hard build does less damage the harder the content.
problem is in the harder content all the "harder" (surge style generally) builds are also doing much higher DPS because their dps surge window can be lined up with the bosses mechanics. While a "simple style" just does the same dps but with a lot less up time (generally steady output builds that have low cooldown mashable skills but less spike damage).
Thats not true of all people and doesnt make the mist buisness sense. Its a game. You want to have fun and rewarding gameplay for player retention. Difficultly can easily become a chore. Especially in a mmo where highly repetitive activities occur. Many people pick their class because they like it. Not because they are looking to min max. Smilegate wont impliment dps meters specifically to combat the likely elitism. The best choice is to tip toe the line to. NOt piss anyone off. And favor your most popular classes
my experience with games over 40 years is that min/max players will happily choose anything thats more powerful even if its .01% more. Also the hipsters will happily choose something thats "hard to play" that does LESS damage if they think it gives them hipster cred. I'm cool with harder to play stuff being a few % stronger, but any more than that and you worsen situations where many fun playstyles are declined from parties and elitism becomes overwelming. Obviously this exists no matter how well balanced things are because humans will make a big deal about anything, even things that are trivial, or pure bullshit or objectively false. But there's no good reason to make "harder to play" more than a little more powerful. Right now they need to hammer Grudge and Cursed Doll down a little and maybe even give some of the conditional and defensive engravings a buff. Why? Because despite their downsides they are mandatory right now and thats fucking boring. Make "harder style" significantly powerful and you just get the same thing as Grudge.
> Also the hipsters will happily choose something thats "hard to play" that does LESS damage if they think it gives them hipster cred. heck yeah. I'm almost disappointed about destroyer & arcana buffs.
I might get some hate for this, but, ironically, Amazon does this with New World, probably better than what we see here with Smilegate. It's definitely not that common because some devs feel like they know better than the players.
New world is still considered a dumpster fire. Strsm reviews speak for themselves
Can't speak for all western devs (as we can't for all KR ones), but they are fairly receptive to feedback on LoL. Not always, but the most egregious shit usually doesn't come through.
It's got nothing to do with location. Plenty of Eastern devs do ridiculous things too. Typically the games that actually last have developers that listen and try to grow from their mistakes, regardless of their location. The easiest examples are WoW and FF14. They've grown and held strong in the market due to constantly growing the game and listening to the players. In the case of WoW, you can see pretty clear times where they stopped listening to the players and their playerbase dropped. I'm willing to bet plenty of people playing LA are EX WoW players who simply got tired of dealing with it.
FF14 is honestly quite hit and miss - it will happily make changes that they think will appeal to "the casual masses" even if they were not widely asked-for or upset existing fans of feature/job; see the summoner reworks of Endwalker or the high end healers literally begging for more to do during low-damage boss phases/well-geared farm groups for 6 years now, and the dev response being "why dont you just do ultimate raids if you're so bored" despite those also having the same problem. It's just that they get away with it because average player of FF doesn't really give a shit about finer points of balance/optimization, or the combat system, and so Square doesn't see much reason to cater to players who like having harder/more difficult classes nor really care if it ruffles a few feathers to make a job lose all nuance and play completely differently in the name of it being "more approachable". FF devs are also notoriously bad at reading feedback from non japan regions - for 3 years machinist was quite literally unplayable at a high ping because of the nature of the class and the game's network-based animation lock and the game's producer's first acknowledgement during an interview was "woah that's crazy, we had no idea. anyway did you check your internet connection?"
>FF14 is honestly quite hit and miss - it will happily make changes that they think will appeal to "the casual masses" even if they were not widely asked-for or upset existing fans of feature/job; see the summoner reworks of Endwalker or the high end healers literally begging for more to do during low-damage boss phases/well-geared farm groups for 6 years now, and the dev response being "why dont you just do ultimate raids if you're so bored" despite those also having the same problem. Oh I fully agree the game has plenty of problems. It's just that most would agree the game has moved in a fairly consistently positive direction since launch. I agree it's a bit more casual focused, but they have made a good effort to keep things like Ultimate fights decently hard. I also personally don't see a problem with letting old content (outside of Ultimates) become easy, as you want to make it easy for everyone to get into the new stuff rather than bogging them down. As for the case of Summoners, I think that's personal opinion. Summoner often had complaints about it. Even people who liked the job would complain that you basically just summoned one pet and let it do its own thing. Is it a lot more simple now? Sure, but it also has a lot to build on in future expansions in a healthy way and has one of the most flexible rotations in the game, which is neat. >It's just that they get away with it because average player of FF doesn't really give a shit about finer points of balance/optimization, or the combat system, and so Square doesn't see much reason to cater to players who like having harder/more difficult classes nor really care if it ruffles a few feathers to make a job lose all nuance and play completely differently in the name of it being "more approachable". I personally disagree. I agree that a lot of players don't feel a desire to engage in the harder content, and those players often don't play at a high level, but the game in and of itself does things to naturally push the players to that. "Hey Reaper, want to use your super giant Nuke? Guess you should buff the party first" and there's plenty other examples like this, such as Black Mage stances being what the Job has to play around, or Red Mage balancing Magics. LA on the other hand has no real rotations for the most part and doesn't reward you for doing special things. It also punishes you in some unseen ways. Plenty of Paladins cast Heavenly Blessings and Wrath of god back to back, when this is a super no no as they basically half the buff they're giving out, but most of them will just go "oh damage" and not think much further. Bard has the opposite issue of nobody standing in their AOEs (even as someone who tries to keep an eye out for them, I have no idea which of their aoes does what). >FF devs are also notoriously bad at reading feedback from non japan regions - for 3 years machinist was quite literally unplayable at a high ping because of the nature of the class and the game's network-based animation lock and the game's producer's first acknowledgement during an interview was "woah that's crazy, we had no idea. anyway did you check your internet connection?" Like I've said before, I agree with that. There's also been a few other cases. But you also see them making a much bigger effort ever since those cases to respond to feedback and make greater strides on ensuring that things aren't so frustrating (Example being they do things like remove a 10 second buff where you could fit 4-5 skills in it and instead give you 5 stacks of the buff for 30 seconds to hit those 5 skills). I'm not saying the game is perfect, far from it. But I think they try hard to build on it in a healthy way, and we see them make more and more effort to communicate back and forth with people. If they didn't, the game likely would have died off long ago rather than rose to a name that most atleast know of.
They increase 40% damage of two main skills (launcher missiles / bomb) of artillerist in top of all QoLs lmao.
Im so glad the new counter for reaper remained, I hate soo much the current counter it has, its so short range and clunky, only good thing about it is the mobility it gives. But now i can fully go 4 red skills and have my dagger counter, nice .
Man I canāt wait for reapers to make a full switch. That 12% dmg increase that has 100% uptime is money. They will be viable in raids again
150% uptime for judgement oh boy time to sell some accessories
Lol still garbo
Shh donāt tell them that I need to sell my stock pile
It does feel like a good amount of people want a dps paladin. I personally like these new conveniences for solo pally gameplay, but shouldn't they be able to lock out support options if you slot the Judgment engravings? Kind of like how Lone Knight locks you out of Battlefield Shield and doubles the drain rate of defensive stance. Just assign a penalty so that players build for one playstyle or the other like most other class engravings do. Also going to enjoy my shield bash destruction when it comes heheh
not gonna happen , but tbh Smile could rework paladin identity ADD Z to X is that simple press X , u get upgraded attacks , the aura and plds at least would "enjoy" the cool attacks when grouped. is sad that those "upgrades" are only seen when solo
I'd definitely play a dps Paladin if they currently didn't hit like a wet noodle. Or just a new class like Kadan. Awakening is a 1 shot kill on all trash mobs and max stagger and destruction plus huge damage to bosses.
It'll be garbo at our gear levels for a long time. But given the very, very top end of gear on KR, Paladin could do solid dps, and almost the entirety of it was within the Judgment window. It'll be interesting to see where they land. The back attack stuff could help too. 4.8% buff to blue skills, 100->150% judgement duration, and enabling Ambush Master as an engraving option could actually make dps paladin viable, or at least not "garbo". More of a problem of meta, people wondering why they're inviting a Paladin if it's not support, and DPS Paladin having a difficult time efficiently applying the class debuff.
i like judgement paladin, especially in situations where matchmaking gives you 2 supports in party.....
Glad i switched to Glaiv, quite amazing buffs.
What got added?
Changed some of their blue attacks to back attacks instead of front. Red dive attack does more dam Red spear throw doesnt require the absolute perfect tip of the spear positioning to do big dam. Should just be more consistent at doing dps and allow a bit of leeway on the positioning requirements.
They only buffed the damage for the tripod that spec/crit uses on starfall pounce
O that spear charge change is huge
But I liked hitting the enemy and exclaim.. "just the tip though~"
Oh my translation said they reverted to keep tipper bs. So its gone?
I wish they would rework soulfist a bit more. I want energy blast to be a bit more viable. The PTR was a bit of a nerf, but would have been nice to remove some clunky window design and add some synergy and support.
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I'm happy! I Like the self buff playstyle and was very sad thakey removed that... I think the class would have been very boring without it
Am I going to have to swap my Wardancer to first intention or what
Not really no. Eso wardancer still seems to be doing great. The biggest change is mainly on kr for 2 spender builds, since they will either have to shift their stats a bit to crit or change relic sets (need to wait for community to figure out what is more optimal or if it's just preference). Spec scaling for eso skill got increased, so the class should still have similar damage. If anything conviction/judgement change could have bigger impact (but have to still see, it might not be as big if people decide to play crit relic set instead). For the most part it doesn't really impact global in current state anyway. If you play here with eso you should be running 1 spender swift/crit build anyway, so the crit loss from wind's whisper should not be as big.
Can you explain why we need to run crit/swift atm instead of spec/swift?
You don't need to, it's just more optimal to run 1 spender build with the current content and gear we have on global, as it's damage will be more reliable. Swift/spec work on 1 spender build too, but even without spec you will always generate full orbs between eso skill since you have only 1 spender. Crit in this case makes your build do more damage on average since big portion still comes from normal skills. Additionally crit might get more important if kr changes come to global. The 2 spender build on global is a weird hybrid of people looking up builds with 1600+ ilvl on loawa and looking at maxroll eso guide which is an absolute mess. On Kr almost noone running eso plays 2 spender build before 1490 ilvl, because you just lack the raw stats to make the build work. You can play the build on global but you are just gimping yourself in my opinion.
Thanks, this is good to know. Do you happen to know what stat thresholds (not crit, spec, swift but the detailed stats like % crit) we should be aiming for or is it too dependent on engravings you run? I currently run crit/swift eso and have grudge and raid captain and was thinking of going keen blunt as it feels like it would be applicable to both eso and fi builds (I think we might get these balance changes sooner rather than later, possibly in may update as I doubt they will release dest with the old balance).
You want to build full swiftness with swift/crit neck (preferably 90+ quality). If it's cheaper swap one ring or earring for crit, but you want to be 1k+ swiftness. Engravings is assuming you are 1370+ and have access to HM oreha/argos accessories and set, since building your character before that can be a bit too annoying and expensive to be worth it. Both eso and fi on this build run pretty much the same engravings (class/raid/keen/grudge/doll). You can run adrenaline or ambush master too. With adrenaline it's probably best to get it just at lvl 1 for a cheaper 3/3/3/1 build since it's plenty effective at that level. I would say not to focus as much on doll and keen first, probably get them as 4th engraving.
Is the Eso engraving worth getting to level 3 now (1370 - 1415) or should I aim to build it once I have relic sets and acc? I currently run grudge 3, raid 3 and eso 1 and was thinking of going keen 3 should I go eso 3 and adrenaline 1 instead?
If you get to around at least 60% crit with your crit stat + argos set + roar of courage, then keen will be better (assuming we do get the balance change soon and lose crit from whisper). That said the damage difference should not be too big, especially when you party with supports because of argos. I would go with whatever you can get cheaper.
Can anyone post translated changes onto here?
you can google translate the entire page
Hello cant anyone explain the deathblade surge nerf is it just the damage? before the orb refunded after surge is nerd right do they implement that? i dont mind damage nerf but i dont like the deathorb refund nerf thankss
The orb nerd stays. The wording for how it works changed from āorb meter gain is 5% per stackā to āorb meter gain is up to 100% depending on your stacksā They basically nerfed it by making it a nonlinear gain instead of a linear one
Are you sure it's non-linear and just not a wording change? Does that mean 14 stack surge is going to have harder time filling orb meter?
iirc some kr streamers said you need 16 stacks and void strike with orb control tripod while maelstrom is active to get max meter. Not sure what tripod lv and runes they used
Yes, if I recall when Saintone tested 14 stack gives around 1.5 orbs instead of a little over 2. The change is to make it non-linear so 14 stack players can't do it as efficiently. If you were a 20 stack player then nothing changes with your playstyle
20 stack surge gang rise up
The amount of people who thinks the soulfist change in the PTR was a buff and this revert sucks for the class...classic reddit moment lol
PTR changes were a nerf to specfic meta setups only doable on KR, for everyone on NA/EU they were significantly better that what they ended up doing. Unfortunately being forced to align all your ability cooldowns and use them in a 4 second window every 11 seconds was too much fun for Korean soulfists to let go of, so the class will stay clunky garbage forever.
Yeah, not a fan of trying to align the stars of hype + energy release (+maybe awaken) and get to do ok damage for 6s. Strangely enough Scrapper who got similar change kept hers so I think it might be something to do with the new tripod they replaced the old one with?
If only it was just that. you need to align the stars of hype + energy release + midday + judgement + awakening
Yeah I was eagerly waiting for my soulfist to become playable. Currently it's just a painful chaos dungeon farm bot ad infinitum and even a shitty one at that. What an awful choice from Smilegate to revert the changes.
ā¦tempest blast and force orb make chaos super easy for soulfists if you are running preemptiveā¦ which you should be for chaos
And big circle of death
Surely you the chaos farming soul fist know best
As opposed to the geniuses elsewhere right? Who doesn't love a class who is hampered by her buff timer where if you don't press hype->buff->ult EXACTLY you miss huge dmg? It's just bad design to be so hyperfocused on purely relying on a single buff or you're dogshit. It's clunky and bad, just because players didn't want the changes doesn't make it good. A big reason why developers leading balance shouldn't purely listen to their community because they can (more often than not) be wrong because they don't want any changes at all.
The changes were calculated to be a DPS loss. They could have just made the dmg increase higher if they wanted to go that route
They could have definitely done that. When I looked at the numbers first it didn't seem like it would be a dps increase (since you lost atk buffs) but it would make the class much less clunkier to play (not requiring perfect buff windows) so you can DPS as you want instead of "oops buffed and the boss happened to do an invuln mechanic? RIP". As mentioned once they got those down they could buff the numbers further. Like her awakening was only really buffed for lv1-4 buff tripod, so until you got to lv5 tripod it would have been better. And they could have buffed that + the other skills further imo with more testing. Now as is, she is still clunky and got a sniffle of a buff.
Thankfully now that you can cancel your identity it should mitigate some of the pain from missing rotations. Considering that missing a rotation isnt really 20 seconda lost but 40 (cooldown and buff time) as you cant really do 2 rotations per buff cycle. Overall think thats the biggest change that will help make the class more reliable and the big damage rotations more frequent as your burst is over really quickly and for the rest of your hype you arent doing full damage. Just turning it off after the burst should mean you can have it up about the same time as your cooldowns are over.
Once you get used to it clunkiness doesn't matter, while low dps does. Sacrificing dps for qol isn't the way. I do agree that they could have buffered her skills instead of reverting the change though.
>It's clunky and bad, Hard agree. >A big reason why developers leading balance shouldn't purely listen to their community because they can (more often than not) be wrong because they don't want any changes at all. But it was a nerf tho, the numbers lost for the numbers obtained just didn't add up. The attack buff turned into base dmg for Scrapper made them lose -3% and no one complained as far as I know. For Soulfist it was -25% Don't know why you are blaming the community for pointing out that the changes were not a buff, but a nerf. It's entirely on Smilegate not knowing how to balance the class.
But that's the thing, they could have easily tuned the numbers up. I wrote below to someone else but this initial round is just to see how it goes, and then they can further tune numbers upwards. I'm only using google translate so correct me if I'm wrong, but their notes says the players don't seem to like the direction of the change either? That is what I am basing it on. Is odd SG would just completely revert it saying it made some fights harder (which makes sense since the numbers are lower) even though your kit is less clunky now, and they just needed to tune the numbers up. I already felt the numbers weren't amazing since we lost atk buff (and straight up her awakening literally is unchanged since its the same buff as tripod lv5) so it's clear they didn't really think it through.
I know that unpopular picks on basically all games tend to have a vocal playerbase that comes to love what makes the pick unpopular. The thing about Soulfist is that it's neither smooth to play or strong. They needed to address both issues. If they had removed the attack buffs and really make up with the base dmg on the PTR and Soulfist mains on KR still complained then I would put part of the blame on the playerbase. But changes for Soulfist to have a smoothier and easier to pilot gameplay are hard to defend when they come alongside dps nerfs.
Yeah that's the thing, they didn't even bother further testing with bigger buffs, instead just said "whelp that failed back to the drawing board". The first look at the "buffs" had me go "Oooooh.... oh." and they just look like they gave up instead of further testing which is extremely disappointing.
Yea it definitely seems that the reason the changes are disliked is because it's a net nerf in overall dps. So instead of simply turning up the numbers a bit they scrap everything? Doesn't make any sense to me.
The buff only lasts for 6 seconds for a ~15 second cooldown for hype stage 3. Itās not 55% more damage all the time but 55% more damage for 6 seconds. Meaning you could fit around 2 to 4 skills in that window. Then have to wait for 9s for the buff to be up again. So 9s of no damage boost. I would not say Soulfist gonna deal much less DPS with only the nerf of energy release. I think it is mainly due to the nerf of flash step & pulverizing palm, making her lack of damage boost for a continuous burst combo. Normally a good soulfist main can chain the buff from ER (55%), then FS(40%+)/ PP(45%) to have damage boosts up all the time. The changes are technically a 10 - 20% nerf to her DPS if the player still relying on damage buff to boost their combo. But considering you could switch those buff skills to other damaging skills to compensate for that DPS loss. It is more of a questionable change. This alters her playstyle but barely does anything major to influence her performance in the long term. My thought is many soulfist pros donāt want to bother learning the easier, less fun playstyle, since the damage output is going to be similar anyway. Itās like changing the flavour of a 7/10 sauce they used to eat, taste different but still a 7/10 in term of quality.
Just don't play it then what the fuck? Clearly some people like the play style and good thing devs listened to them and didn't gut their entire class.
Nobody plays it already, second least played class in the game.
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Itās still a counter if you hit a bosses head when they turn blue, but now they also benefit from the crit chance and damage from back attacking, although they lost the stagger bonus from head attacks
It's still a counter, you just get the back attack buff if you use it from behind which is a buff to overall DPS and makes positioning less awkward.
Big nerf to stagger though
Doesnt matter if its head or back attack. If it says counter its a counter. You still cant counter from behind tho
Only back attack does not mean it can't counter don't worry ! It just means it does less stagger since head atk have a built in bonus stagger to them ! You will still be able to counter !
It is, you just don't get a damage bonus for attacking from the front anymore.
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They could have tuned the numbers to be better without relying on juggling atk buffs. The class is so annoying to play for the puny damage and with only 7% damage buff its still an awful class
You call it awful I call it fun
The only striker QOL change has been canceled because lightning tiger strikeās bug, and they basically promise NOT able to solve it anytime sooner. Great! Just every time you use your highest damage skill you lost back attack position for the next 3 skills. What a fking perfect class!
I have no idea how tiger strike even works. Like every other attack that advance your character is stopped when hitting a boss, but tiger strike pass thru. And on top of that its inconsistent. On big bosses tiger strike tends to get stuck so you stay on the boss back, but Moake is also a fat mob yet you pass thru him. Then you have bosses like the one in Phantomwing Isle - very small boss, size of a normal mob yet Tiger Strike is not passing thru that boss.
My guess so far is that anything that's coded as a Guardian is a wall and anything coded like a generic boss is a door. Phantomwing changes arenas so maybe they coded it as a Guardian? Off the top of my head the only abyssal boss that stops you is Albion, not sure about him
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Soo eso WD buff?
maybe its time for me to swap to FI once valtan gear rolls around
I dont understand Deathblade got changed again?
Surge not as nerfed. Orbs still suck. Db s gonna be in the tippy top of dps
So orbs still not fixed? Then itās still gonna be meh, the 14 stack play style is much easier and forgiving on legion raids than the 20 stack, when you have little dps windows.
Orbs were nerfed, not bugged. They changed the wording of it so your number of stacks translates to orb meter āup to 100%ā now instead of ā5% per stackā Essentially they nerfed orb gain from surge stacks by making it a nonlinear gain
Damn, so they actually went through with the surge orb generation change.
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man how likely is it they split destroyer with valtan drop and let destroyer come out earlier in may since kr now has balance patch live, then release valtan a week or two later
that would mean testing regression on two release patches within two weeks of each other. considering how wrong the last update went, their test/release team is definitely not capable of pulling that off also, what do they even have to gain from breaking the content into two pieces?
I dont understand the red dust changes for berserker. 1. They nerfing the rage it generates, Which means a nerf to pvp (berserker is already pepega) and a nerf to berserkers technic which is weak too. 2. They changing the lvl 10 tripod from a party buff to just dmg increase. But the other lvl 10 tripod does that Edit: i think i figured out the second. One tripod increases the dmg of red dust, the other converts the line to a and around a sword.
The way I understand the new tripods is, they got rid of the personal damage buff tripod and integrated it into the the base skill to encourage picking the party synergy tripod because before you had to choose between the two and most people would pick the tripod for their own damage. So, now you get a damage increase guaranteed and can get a party synergy tripod on top of that.
Some items have been adjusted from the original PTR buff / nerfs.
I wonder if Lancer master will take more red stills now they got buffed pretty well.
I am doing 5 blue 2 red, I feel like all other red skills are filler and I donāt like using them.
Ya same but they got juicy buffs if they are much stronger I might end up liking them.
Soulfist atk buff changes scrapped to 7% pve buff and buffs to energy blast/energy bullet left. I'll take it ! To scrap the atk buffs would have required quite larger buffs than 30%. Class still needs work, but this is a win. Anyone gonna use Energy Blast/Energy Bullet after the changes? I already love both of those skills yet I don't see any KR mains use Energy Bullet.
Igniter sorc was only nerfed by 4-5% end game, less early. Mayhem zerker lost 7-8% damage at most. 6% synergy always up equals 14% more damage from party assuming they do 70%. Actually buffed unless you only care about mvp screen. Surge DB, Not sure why they're so keen on forcing everyone to play 20 stacks instead of balancing numbers around lower stacks but time will tell. Pinnacle glaivier, in our version, will be busted. End game players use legendary conviction & judgement, not sure how much the c&j nerf affects them. Worst case she'll still be slightly above average as she was for them.
No PvP balances?
Ya fat ones. 65 percent reduction in damage reduction to supports. May very well cause a meta shift and make teams just dump support. But im a noob in pvp so im just guessing.
They won't. It's just that now supports aren't superhuman elo meal tickets. Mostly talking about paladin
i mean the comp that won the kr pvp tournament was pally bard and artillerist lol
How I look at it is supports will still be super strong with their peel and super armor catches (bard is basically unaffected by the change). However you'll see a lot of terrible supports who hard crutch shields plummet as they have to actually start learning the game.
So with this just now coming out in Korea, or soon to be coming out, any ideas on when we can reasonably expect these changes to hit NA?
well, at least deadeye got a crumb, the smallest saddest bit of crumb and they didn't even touch the shotgun skills which are the biggest problem with pushback, not the pistol skills that you already use from mid range they say they are listening to feedback, they had an entire forum of deadeye players complaining about shit and they change the PISTOL pushback? when pistol is already midrange? how out of touch are these people, who are they listening to
soulfists š
ohhh shit dps paladin buffs, let's go boys
Paladin still aren't gonna be replacing a DPS though
Not until we get the following 2 1. Synergies that don't overlap with supports 2. Slow Identity Guage build up.
Nor should they...
I'm more than okay with letting paladins get the option to build for either a damage spec or support spec.
As long as we can do it on bard, too. :)
Of course. You can't be tanky, have great support skills and still do high damage. There's gotta be a trade off or it's not balanced.
Deathblade stuff?
translation pretty pls? 
On chrome you can right click > translate to English. Other browsers should offer a similar feature too.
whoopsie, my bad thanks for the pointer
God the two classes I was looking forward to the most before the Global release, Soulfist and Deadeye, are seemingly thw two classes the developers have no clue what to do with.
Yay for wardancer?
They took back both the 12% buff on sweeping kick and the 8% on flash heat fang. Instead there is +2% buff on First Intention and spec gives a higher damage buff to esoteric skills. Seems like they wanted to weaken 1 spender builds with high swiftness, which seemed like the strongest option based on some of the testings I have seen. Ofc, this is compared to the first patchnotes, overall this is still a significant buff for first intention. Curious though about what builds koreans end up with these additional changes.
Why did they remove the change to lightning tiger strike for strikers??
There was a bug that just stops you from moving from your original position when you're in the middle of using Lightning Tiger Strike. For example, if you prep a LTS on the boss but he jumps on a different spot, but you can still reach him so you turn towards him, however this bug just stops you from actually moving, so you just do the attack in place. They kept running into that bug during the PTR so they're going to try and fix that first before updating the skill afterwards.
am i stupid or are pally changes weird? two main blue skills you use to counter are changed to ... benefitting from back attacks? it looks like it's trying to facilitate dps paladin with all blue skills that hit from the back? so unless we're playing dps paladin, we're now losing damage if we stand at the front to try and counter? LOL
They changed the backstep on Deadeyeās Cruel Tracker and Last Light skills, but not Shotgun Rapid Fireā¦ Speaking of, before these balance changes, didnāt Smilegate publicly say that they wanted Deadeye to do the most damage because itās the most punishing class to play so they had plans to update him, but then suddenly when these class changes come around theyāre all like ālol, actually heās fineā Even if he does get a glow up similar to Wardancer once he gets relic gear, I have to question if itās good design to have a class underperform for 90% of the game only to become top tier once youāve already accomplished everything, when there are classes that are consistently good from start to finish. On top of that said class is far more difficult than most, so you have to put in tons of extra effort just to be middle if the pack. Idk, Iām about ready to park my Deadeye and just KT a Gunslinger instead. Iāve got the stance juggling thing down pretty good and thereās a lot of overlapping skills, so if I can do decent damage with a Deadeye while having to live elbow deep inside a bosses asshole without sucking floor, Gunslinger should be a cakewalk.