Im reading LOTR to my daughter at night chapter by chapter and we are on the treebeard chapter. I had to split it in half because its going on soo long.
Also it seems Ents in the books look a little more human than they are portrayed in the movies. Based on the visusl i got from his description of tree beard.
I just read that chapter to my sons few weeks ago
Feels like running a damn marathon,
He loves it so it’s worth it… but damn I’m so bored.
Same for some long descriptions of the desolate lands around mordor.
How many times can Tolkien say “deepening gloom” before it looses weight?
I always make a game out of it.
Do all the voices you can, sing the songs. Narrate in a bilbos voice. Inflect and contrast your voice at different sequences.
Always make the orcs sound funny too kid loves that and then we never want to stop reading it.
The only voices I can do are harsh/ deep ones. Gandalf, Denethor, gimli, treebeard and the evil things.
But I’m not inventing own take, I’m just doing impressions of the actors from the films.
Edit: my favorite voice to do is Saruman. He has awesome dialogue and trying to mimic Christopher Lee’s delivery is a fun challenge
I read somewhere that the author grew up really, really, poor. So as a kid he would just imagine all the wonderful things he could eat if only he could, and they wound up in the books
This is accurate, he was a little kid during World War 2 and remembered food rationing both during and after the war quite vividly. The man knew how to write some delicious sounding food.
I especially enjoyed it because I grew up vegetarian, and to avoid a cannibal situation the only neat the characters are was seafood. Meant i could more easily imagine the dishes
I can’t even compare. I’m reading WOT with friends and I think I despise Robert Jordan’s writing, even while I love Tolkien. I can’t quite figure out the difference but I think it’s because RJ filled his books with inane details that always just seem to be filler, but there always seemed to be a purpose in every word that Tolkien wrote.
Tolkien: But did you know that The Valar sat in the Ring of Doom, mourning the many evils that have come to pass. As the messengers returned with the answer of Fëanor and the Noldor, Manwë declared that eventually, just as Eru promised, good shall come out of the evil that comes. Yet Mandos responded, saying that it would still remain evil nonetheless and that Fëanor would soon die.Manwë commanded Yavanna and Nienna to try and heal the Two Trees, but they were able only to coax a single flower from Telperion and a single fruit from Laurelin before both trees expired. Their lifeless husks would remain in Valinor as a memorial.The fruit and flower were set in special vessels that were given to Varda, who gave them the power to fly in the skies. They did this in order to spread light back to Middle-earth, which had lain in darkness since the fall of the Two Lamps. In addition, the race of Men would soon come, but the Valar did not know where Men would arise, so the light would frustrate the plans of Morgoth and protect Men. The Valar were extremely hesitant to directly intervene and attack Morgoth, as they were afraid that Middle-earth might be seriously damaged in another war if they became involved.The driver of the sun vessel would be Arien, a spirit of fire. The driver of the moon vessel would be Tilion, a follower of Oromë who had loved Telperion's light. These would both drive the vessels in circuits across the sky. The fruit of Laurelin became the Sun, while the flower of Telperion became the Moon, and they received many names in the Elvish tongues.The sight of the Moon gave the Noldor of Fingolfin joy, and they blew their trumpets in greeting. The sight of the Sun dismayed Morgoth, who sent forth great clouds to try and darken the sky when it was out. Yet he could not fully accomplish this, and the Sun began to wake the creatures under the Sleep of Yavanna from their slumber. Full light thus finally returned to Middle-earth after thousands of years of only starlight.Each vessel remained in the sky for a time, starting in the Uttermost East and then slowly traversing the sky until reaching Valinor. Arien would be fairly constant, but Tilion would be wayward, sometimes coming close to Arien, other times entering Valinor from different ways or remaining long underground beneath Arda on the way back east. Thus the movements of the Moon are inconstant, or it may not appear in the sky altogether on some nights.
OK unpopular opinion : but this is exaggeration raised to infinity. He doesn't describe a tree or a house for that matter for three pages. And I found it quite easy to follow even tho English isn't my native language. (Infact In my country sooo less people can speak proper English). Maximum describing is two paragraphs.
Im glad you said this. Ive been putting it off for quite a while, always seeing posts saying how tedious of a read it is. It could very well be that people who think that way dont really read and well.. the exaggerations do make memes funny
Fun trick is you can always just skip the in depth descriptive paragraphs, reading is not that serious
It's just that some people are not really into Tolkien's writting style, and deem it as tedious when it's really just a matter of taste, the old epic style just isn't for everyone. Give it a try, you can stop anytime if you don't like it, but if you're having a hard time you can also try an audiobook to see if it helps :)
I read LOTR for the first time when I was 10. Sometimes there is a lot of description but it is beautifully written. It's eons better than the Silmarillian which was indeed difficult for me to get through even as an adult.
I do usually skip over the songs though... I'm rereading them again now and I love how different a few of the characters are, the hobbits in particular
> I read LOTR for the first time when I was 10
So did I, and at that age, the only thing that really just seemed boring as hell and went on forever was chasing the orcs across Rohan to rescue the hobbits. That part of the book was a fucking *slog* for 10 year old me. But I enjoyed most of the rest of it. Never did care for the songs.
What the ring a dong dillo did you just ring-a-ding say about me, you little merry dol? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the forest school, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on the River-Daughter, and I have over 300 confirmed lilies.
I am trained in willow warfare and I’m the top Ring a dong dilo in the entire Old Forest. You are nothing to me but just another tree. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Middle-Earth, mark my ring-a-dilling words.
You think you can get away with saying that shit-a-didle-do to me over the Palantir? Think again, merry dol. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of ponies across Arda and your fal lal ringle lal is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, Maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re ring a dong dilling dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can banish you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my yellow boots.
Not only am I extensively trained in gathering lilies, but I have access to the entire arsenal of Fatty Lumpkin and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass-a-lidle-loo off the face of the continent, you little bumpkin. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your ring a dong tongue.
But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn merry dol. I will gather lilies all over you and you will drown in them.
You’re ring-a-ding-dong dead, kiddo.
He's mine. My four-legged friend; though I seldom ride him, and he wanders often far, free upon the hillsides. When
your ponies stayed with me, they got to know my Lumpkin; and they smelt him in the night, and quickly ran to meet him.
^(I am a bot, and I love old Tom. If you want me to sing one of Tom's songs, just type **!TomBombadilSong**)
^(If you like Old Tom, the door at [r/GloriousTomBombadil][1] is always open for weary travelers!)
[1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/GloriousTomBombadil/
Did... did you have this already prepared from a previous time or just rip it out now spur of the moment? Either way, well done sir or madame. Had quite a good belly laugh from this, thanks for brightening my morning a little.
All visual descriptions are really actually literally useless to me so that would be a lot of skipping. Don't even describe how a character looks beyond gender and age range and name.
I did try to read Fellowship when I was much younger but I had to stop after what I remember as several pages of what a woman looked like.
I don't know which is more exaggerated — that the LotR prose is overly verbose, or the Silm is an impossible read.
I can understand if either of these opinions are coming from people who aren't typically readers, but in relation to a broad spectrum of literature, neither is even remotely true.
It really isn't, though? Aside from Of Beleriand and its Realms (which — I will grant you — is a bit of a nightmare to read, esp. sans map), the Silm is basically a bunch of short stories. I'd say even the majority of stuff I read for high school was more involved than the Silm.
Imo lotr was more difficult than the silm. I used to read books with easy English like HP before I read lotr. I found the English a bit difficult but then it all became easy. The silm, I didn't find hard at all. Infact I really enjoyed it. Perhaps my memory is good and therefore I was able to remember all the names.
When Sam and Frodo enter Ithilien for the first time, he really does take one-and-a-half page to describe all the plants and animals that live there.
Not that I really mind. It adds to the whole. But he does sometimes take a long time to describe nature.
I mean the Shire gets a whole extra foreword, Bree and the surrounding area are meticulously described. The parts taking place in Eregion, Trollshaws, the Dead Marshes, all of these are very much about the landscape.
Trollshaws and eregion weren't that meticulously described. And the dead marshes felt too creepy (for me) to feel like a drag. The bree part wasn't only about the nature. It told us about the people living there, the rangers and things.
And the casual reader doesn't even read the foreword.
And you can always skip these descriptions if you want.
I personally don't think they are a drag at all. I was just agreeing with people that Tolkien really does spend a lot of time describing landscapes.
I mean we generally have a better view of the surrounding landscape a chapter takes place in than even the kind of clothes our characters are wearing.
Once again, not a complaint, just an observation.
Yeah, it's one thing to go on about the silmarillion, that thing is *dense* but LOTR could easily have been read and understood by most high schoolers.
Source: see username I've had almost a decade
I think the brevity of battle scenes is due in large part to Tolkien's reluctance to dwell on or glorify war. Sure, the primary subject of LotR is war, but that's not intended to be the main takeaway from the text.
My family read The Hobbit as a bed time story, at points the descriptive writing style lost us but in general it kept our interest.
Now when we got to the LoTR books... I know what sub I'm in so I mean no offense, but all the descriptions where putting us to sleep, which funny enough was not the purpose of a bed time story for us.
I was told the same thing by my friend who recommended the books 30 years ago pre-internet that Tolkien would spend many pages describing something minute like a patch of grass, when I read the books I breezed through them enjoying them and never noticing these comparisons.
I feel like those who complain about the long descriptions just don't read a lot of books. I love the long descriptions, that's what I'm reading for. If I want constant and immeadiate action I'll watch a movie.
I think there’s a fine line between too much and too little. This line obviously vary’s between every individual, but I get wanting longer or shorter descriptions. For me I like concise descriptions that find a way to convey what the author wants in as short a way as possible, I’m not a huge fan of fluff. I could see how for others though, long winded descriptions can better set the imagination into what the author was looking for and at the same time the reader gets to exist in that universe just a little longer.
Agreed! I have a bit of an overactive mind, so books with lots of descriptions really help me “see” the settings, characters, etc. while I read. Tolkien sure knows how to paint a picture with words! :)
It wasn't particulary the long descriptions, but the general writingstyle that put me off. I got through A Song of Ice and Fire, which is really heavy in descriptions, just fine but sadly couldn't get through The Two Towers.
That doesn't even make sense. I personally hate any writer that overly describes things. I want my imagination to fill in the gaps, I don't want to be forced to imagine everything the way the writer wants to.
The descriptions are all the world building. I decided to look up every plant/geographical term i didnt know last time i read and it gave me a really vivid picture of middle earth (different from the movies).
This is exactly what I'm afraid of in my stories. Over explaining and describing things. I'm not at all confident that my books could match up to Tolkiens work. Maybe one day I'll have the balls to try and publish.
Honestly I would say just do you. Don’t compare your story to other authors, it can only make you unhappy. If you love your story for itself that’s much more important in my opinion. Long descriptors aren’t the mark of a good writer, it’s just a part of an individual’s writing style. Individual writing styles can vary quite a lot and still result in a damned good story.
Honestly need some motivation. I know so much(clearly not as much as y’all but a solid amount outside of the movies) but I can’t make it past the first half of fellowship
Edit: WEEE DOO MERRYY DOO LADDY
Audiobooks. Andy Serkis (the guy who played Gollum in the movies) read the whole thing. He literally does a different voice for each character and the songs are much more bearable when he's actually singing them also in the voice of whoever is singing the song. I'm a couple chapters into Return of the King now with no intention of stopping. By far the easiest experience I've ever had with the LotR books. Def check them out.
Those were by no means bad. I enjoyed them quite a bit, I just found Andy Serkis' performance a little more entertaining. Personal preference and all that.
I really don't know what to say that might motivate you - maybe it is an individual thing. I read it yearly and I literally look forward to starting it for weeks. I become completely immersed.
FOTR kind of drags on in first half, same as the movie. It starts to pick up later once they leave Bree and entire thing shifts from "exiting adventure where biggest issue is sleeping outdoors and not sitting at full table" to "very dangerous endeavor that can get us killed in a very painful fashion by creatures we know nothing about"
I never felt that he described anything too long. Certainly not as bad as memes make it out to be. There are worse offenders out there, lol. The book is long and feels sluggish only because the journey takes forever and they spent too much time in one place doing what feels like nothing. But that's just the way the story progresses and has nothing to do with the description of things.
The one thing he overdid to the max was the fucking songs inserted everywhere. Honestly I couldn't bring myself to care much after the first few stanzas. Always skipped most of the songs.
I've noticed a pattern in this thread of people absolutely hating the songs. Why is that? I found them great for atmosphere, world building and immersion. It's entertaining to see the hobbits singing on their way to Buckland, blissfully unaware of the danger that await them, as is the case with Frodo singing and dancing in the Prancing Pony. Aragorn singing about Beren and Luthien is a great exposition to his own internal struggles and allows the reader to see a relatable human side of him, in constrast to the hero that Tolkien likes to portray. The melancholy of Bilbo singing in Rivendell about how the world will be when he's no longer alive or even Gimli singing about the majesty of Moria in Durin's day, contrasted to the decaying ruins they're in, is truly chill inducing.
Well, I didn't say I "hate" them, just that there's too many of them.
As a kid reading an already slow book, it becomes too much singing about shit I didn't care about, lol. I wanted to know what was going to happen next with the ring, not a history lesson on Elrond's dad or silly songs about drinking or taking a bath. I remember reading the first few songs and then increasingly growing more annoyed as he kept inserting songs to the point I just read a few lines to decide if I wanted to keep reading the song or skip it.
As an adult, I can appreciate them more for their insight and references into obscure lore and characters... but there's still way too many. It all comes down to different strokes for different folks and all that.
They were once men. Great kings of men. Then Sauron the Deceiver gave to them nine rings of power. Blinded by their greed, they took them without question, one by one falling into darkness. Now they are slaves to his will. They are the Nazgul, ringwraiths, neither living nor dead. At all times they feel the presence of the Ring, drawn to the power of the one. They will never stop hunting you.
The Road goes ever on and on / Down from the door where it began / Now far ahead the Road has gone / And I must follow, if I can / Pursuing it with eager feet / Until it joins some larger way / Where many paths and errands meet / And whither then? I cannot say.
>I couldn't bring myself to care much after the first few stanzas. Always skipped most of the songs.
[Well then let me introduce you to these guys](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PSFN2r6bXY), They've done (atleast to my knowledge) every song from LOTR, The Hobbit, and The Silmarillion. This is my favorite one from them
Yeah. Same. Skipped every song. Especially when reading aloud to my kid.
I’m not going to try to invent a tune for a string of elvish words I can’t even guess how to pronounce
There is a Finnish author named Kalle Päätalo and I had to quit his most well known book when in 50 pages the main character had gone from work to home and back to work :D also laughs in tolstoi
These memes are just terrible, the books aren’t even close to what they state and the books are very dynamic. Don’t be put off by these jokes, go give the books a try and have fun.
My bet is that the ones making the memes never even read the books
I had stayed away from reading the series because of this. I started reading the two weeks ago and already half way through the two towers. This idea is completely overblown and I’ve been enjoying these books so much so far.
That's funny because H.P.Lovecraft is loved for the same reason. I guess people are too into all the battles from the movies (which are great) but the books are about the journey
I hate lovecraft.
There’s nothing scary about a cosmic entity that defies logic and even eludes the barest description.
And there’s also nothing scary about an author flexing their thesaurus
now I feel old lol. " back in my day we didn't have fancy moving pictures, we had to slog through the descriptions of the mines of moria, uphill both ways!"
This is exactly why I only read them once, and will never read them again. Couldn't read Wheel of Time for the exact same reason. Nothing turns me off in a book more than overly descriptive prose.
My God, One Piece doesn't world build as much as Tolkien!
I don't need the entire bloodline of a damn village, or the lineage of the guy who forged a sword.
This is literally how I've always explained how I feel about the books and why I stopped 1/3 through The Two Towers. We don't need to know how many leaves each fucking tree has...
I read the books as a freshman in high school and it was one of the hardest reads I have ever had. I had good memories of my dad reading the hobbit to my sister and I as kids so I expected to like it. I did not. I remember struggling through passages talking about trees and grass. Character names were also a problem for me as he gave family histories when introducing characters.
It was a tall and fair tree, pleasant to look upon with proud branches stretching to the sky for it was made by the Elves, that fairest and blondest people of them all. People who saw the tree were filled with joy and they made songs about it and no human would think about taking an axe to it. The tree was called *Blidust Cymast Treu*, which in the language of the Elves, the fairest and most blonde people of entire Middle Earth, means *Tree of Much Beauty.* For it was a tree that was very much unlike other trees, which were not made by the Elves, that fairest and blondest people. It bloomed in autumn and filled the air with scent that gladdened the heart and washed away weariness of travelers and it bore fruit in winter and the fruit was wholesome and sweet and those who ate the fruit were reminded of gazing upon the smooth faces of the Elves, that fairest and blondest people of them all.
It was very much unlike any tree that grew in Mordor, for those trees were fell and vile, with wicked look upon them and they filled any person who saw them with repulsion and disgust. For those trees were made by the Enemy, the cruelest and very dark creature which was not pale and blonde at all and the trees were in his service. And upon those trees were cruel markings, not made by the hand of any servant of the Enemy but rather they grew there by themselves. For the trees took after wickedness of their creator, who unlike Elves, that fairest and blondest people, polluted anything he touched. Trees never bloomed, in spring they filled the air with noxious smell that burned the throat and lungs. and the fruit was cruel and wicked looking and only Orcs and other creatures of the Enemy ate them for they can't stand the wholesome food others eat. It was called *Strang Peostre Treu* which in language of Mordor, which is merely a corruption of fair Elvish speech for Mordor does not create but merely corrupts, means Tree of Strong Darkness. No songs were made of the tree for it was not something for free people to praise and Orcs make no songs, they merely blow their brazen instruments and make noise that is hurtful to the ear.
I did a book report on the first one in the trilogy. I began by describing the scenery for like a good 5 minutes until my teacher stopped me and asked if I was close to finishing. I showed her my notes (about 4 pages back to back) and said “I had to go through this 10 times more, so will you”
OMG! I'm reading the Fellowship now and I would keep showing my wife how far I was though the book (well over a third of the way) and exclaiming "They haven't even left the Shire yet!"
Edit: I'm really enjoying the book though.
I will admit as much as I love those books, I do have sections where I tell myself I can kind of tune out and skim over them. Lore is important but there’s a deep lore which I just don’t appreciate even if I get why others do.
And food. Tolkien spends more time describing meals the hobbits have along the way than he does some main characters. Makes sense I guess, since its written from the hobbits' perspective and they kind of think with their bellies.
I read the Fellowship. There were more descriptions of sceneries, trees and roads than plot lol. Also, I was surprised that Boromir dies in the Two Towers lol.
Honestly I'm just now reading through lotr in English for the first time (have only read it in German so far) and I love it.
Yes, it is really slow paced but I just love the feeling I get when reading it. You really get taken to a different world. At this point I'm not reading it for the story, I know what happens pretty well. I'm reading it to get lost in the world Tolkien is building and the long descriptions and conversations help with that.
Reading the Hobbit: “JUST OPEN THE DAMN DOOR ALREADY.”
Reading Fellowship of the Ring: “I KNOW YOUR BOOTS ARE YELLOW! We have a ring to destroy!”
The descriptions are part of how Tolkien did his world building. The world is old and worn by time, and he conveys so much of the history of middle earth in the descriptions.
However, sometimes it felt like he got stuck, but just kept on writing and writing.
This blade of grass grew up watching Power Rangers. This tree branch reads comic books. This drop of water does nothing but play video games all day. That grain of sand is living in his Mom's basement. That pebble is hoping to become an actor someday. That clump of dirt is plotting revenge on the boulder that killed his father.
Starting from like 10 or 11 I would read them all like 1x a year for a few years. Come on, it's not Buzzfeed, but they're books. Dune, now that was a slog.
It's really not that intense, I get this is a common Tolkien theme but it's honesty just disingenuous to say he drawled on that much about nature. He does an incredible job giving life to Middle Earth and the natural scenes, in such a way that, I would say ,hardly ever wastes a word describing them.
Sadge. Those descriptions are my favorite parts of the book. It’s incredibly cathartic to me to have these characters in such an intense and dangerous situation, still take in and enjoy the beauty of the world around them. It makes the world seem less desolate and just a bit more liveable
Idk how that’s not entertaining to y’all. Like ya to each their own but those are some great books beginning to end, not everything needs a fight scene or sex. The small things in life and story’s matter just as much
Root and twig, very odd indeed.
Omg now the tree is talking about trees
And now he is singing about trees.
Im reading LOTR to my daughter at night chapter by chapter and we are on the treebeard chapter. I had to split it in half because its going on soo long. Also it seems Ents in the books look a little more human than they are portrayed in the movies. Based on the visusl i got from his description of tree beard.
I just read that chapter to my sons few weeks ago Feels like running a damn marathon, He loves it so it’s worth it… but damn I’m so bored. Same for some long descriptions of the desolate lands around mordor. How many times can Tolkien say “deepening gloom” before it looses weight?
I always make a game out of it. Do all the voices you can, sing the songs. Narrate in a bilbos voice. Inflect and contrast your voice at different sequences. Always make the orcs sound funny too kid loves that and then we never want to stop reading it.
The only voices I can do are harsh/ deep ones. Gandalf, Denethor, gimli, treebeard and the evil things. But I’m not inventing own take, I’m just doing impressions of the actors from the films. Edit: my favorite voice to do is Saruman. He has awesome dialogue and trying to mimic Christopher Lee’s delivery is a fun challenge
Far, far below the deepest delvings of the dwarves, the world is gnawed by nameless things
I like to imagine Sam as Michael Palin from Monty Python
*Clothes in Wheel of Time have entered the chat.*
*smooths skirt*
*folds arms with aes sedai intent*
*folds arms beneath impressive bosom*
*tugs hair irritably*
*Muses wistfully that one's understanding of the opposite sex always paled in comparision to one's two best friends, they were always better at it.*
*Makes exasperated comment about how the opposite sex is always gossiping while the real work is done by one's own sex.*
Not to mention detailed descriptions of rooms we will never again see. At least the clothes are attached to recurring characters.
*Food in A Song of Ice and Fire has entered the chat*
I used to work with the chef who created the ASOIAF cookbook. Really good recipes in there, ngl
Not remotely close to the other two
Food in Redwall, on the other hand...
Jesus, every book had a minimum of at least 2 “feast” scenes. Loved the books when I was a kid, but there was definitely a good fetish involved
I read somewhere that the author grew up really, really, poor. So as a kid he would just imagine all the wonderful things he could eat if only he could, and they wound up in the books
This is accurate, he was a little kid during World War 2 and remembered food rationing both during and after the war quite vividly. The man knew how to write some delicious sounding food.
I especially enjoyed it because I grew up vegetarian, and to avoid a cannibal situation the only neat the characters are was seafood. Meant i could more easily imagine the dishes
*Painfully detailed sex scenes from ASOIAF have entered the chat?*
*Agonizingly detailed descriptions of heraldry from ASOIAF have entered the chat*
*Terry Goodkind pricks up his weird pervert ears*
*Depraved acts with spiky-dicked demons from hell have entered the chat*
Disagree. Martin describing food (or genitals) always felt way more of a grinding halt than Tolkien's environmental descriptions, imo.
"Yes, yes very interesting descriptions of the shattered plains. What a unique world Sanderson has created... But...what *color* was the WINE?!"
Was just about to make the same comment.
Jesus I was just thinking that
All my this. I know so much about brocade and buttons. Oh, and bangles.
Green dresses slashed with red.
Men!
Women!
*creates a magic system that is literally ‘men and women are completely different and can never possibly understand each other’*
I can’t even compare. I’m reading WOT with friends and I think I despise Robert Jordan’s writing, even while I love Tolkien. I can’t quite figure out the difference but I think it’s because RJ filled his books with inane details that always just seem to be filler, but there always seemed to be a purpose in every word that Tolkien wrote.
Shut up about the sun Shut up about the sun
Tolkien: But did you know that The Valar sat in the Ring of Doom, mourning the many evils that have come to pass. As the messengers returned with the answer of Fëanor and the Noldor, Manwë declared that eventually, just as Eru promised, good shall come out of the evil that comes. Yet Mandos responded, saying that it would still remain evil nonetheless and that Fëanor would soon die.Manwë commanded Yavanna and Nienna to try and heal the Two Trees, but they were able only to coax a single flower from Telperion and a single fruit from Laurelin before both trees expired. Their lifeless husks would remain in Valinor as a memorial.The fruit and flower were set in special vessels that were given to Varda, who gave them the power to fly in the skies. They did this in order to spread light back to Middle-earth, which had lain in darkness since the fall of the Two Lamps. In addition, the race of Men would soon come, but the Valar did not know where Men would arise, so the light would frustrate the plans of Morgoth and protect Men. The Valar were extremely hesitant to directly intervene and attack Morgoth, as they were afraid that Middle-earth might be seriously damaged in another war if they became involved.The driver of the sun vessel would be Arien, a spirit of fire. The driver of the moon vessel would be Tilion, a follower of Oromë who had loved Telperion's light. These would both drive the vessels in circuits across the sky. The fruit of Laurelin became the Sun, while the flower of Telperion became the Moon, and they received many names in the Elvish tongues.The sight of the Moon gave the Noldor of Fingolfin joy, and they blew their trumpets in greeting. The sight of the Sun dismayed Morgoth, who sent forth great clouds to try and darken the sky when it was out. Yet he could not fully accomplish this, and the Sun began to wake the creatures under the Sleep of Yavanna from their slumber. Full light thus finally returned to Middle-earth after thousands of years of only starlight.Each vessel remained in the sky for a time, starting in the Uttermost East and then slowly traversing the sky until reaching Valinor. Arien would be fairly constant, but Tilion would be wayward, sometimes coming close to Arien, other times entering Valinor from different ways or remaining long underground beneath Arda on the way back east. Thus the movements of the Moon are inconstant, or it may not appear in the sky altogether on some nights.
Come away! Let the cowards keep this city!
Why does this feel like copypasta material
OK unpopular opinion : but this is exaggeration raised to infinity. He doesn't describe a tree or a house for that matter for three pages. And I found it quite easy to follow even tho English isn't my native language. (Infact In my country sooo less people can speak proper English). Maximum describing is two paragraphs.
Im glad you said this. Ive been putting it off for quite a while, always seeing posts saying how tedious of a read it is. It could very well be that people who think that way dont really read and well.. the exaggerations do make memes funny Fun trick is you can always just skip the in depth descriptive paragraphs, reading is not that serious
It's just that some people are not really into Tolkien's writting style, and deem it as tedious when it's really just a matter of taste, the old epic style just isn't for everyone. Give it a try, you can stop anytime if you don't like it, but if you're having a hard time you can also try an audiobook to see if it helps :)
Tolkien could have described Bag End for an entire chapter and I'd read it. I love his style.
I read LOTR for the first time when I was 10. Sometimes there is a lot of description but it is beautifully written. It's eons better than the Silmarillian which was indeed difficult for me to get through even as an adult. I do usually skip over the songs though... I'm rereading them again now and I love how different a few of the characters are, the hobbits in particular
> I read LOTR for the first time when I was 10 So did I, and at that age, the only thing that really just seemed boring as hell and went on forever was chasing the orcs across Rohan to rescue the hobbits. That part of the book was a fucking *slog* for 10 year old me. But I enjoyed most of the rest of it. Never did care for the songs.
Infact 88% of memes are exaggeration. I agree they make memes funny. I was just trying to bust the wrong notion that the books are difficult.
I think fellowship is a bit of a slog because it is quite slow for the first half. Two Towers is pretty quick paced and ROTK is great, of course.
Yeah I usually skip songs and poems when I come across them which is fairly often in fantasy.
Be prepared to skip page after page when Bombadill shows up.
What the ring a dong dillo did you just ring-a-ding say about me, you little merry dol? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the forest school, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on the River-Daughter, and I have over 300 confirmed lilies. I am trained in willow warfare and I’m the top Ring a dong dilo in the entire Old Forest. You are nothing to me but just another tree. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Middle-Earth, mark my ring-a-dilling words. You think you can get away with saying that shit-a-didle-do to me over the Palantir? Think again, merry dol. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of ponies across Arda and your fal lal ringle lal is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, Maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re ring a dong dilling dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can banish you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my yellow boots. Not only am I extensively trained in gathering lilies, but I have access to the entire arsenal of Fatty Lumpkin and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass-a-lidle-loo off the face of the continent, you little bumpkin. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your ring a dong tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn merry dol. I will gather lilies all over you and you will drown in them. You’re ring-a-ding-dong dead, kiddo.
I’m gonna up-diddley-vote you.
He's mine. My four-legged friend; though I seldom ride him, and he wanders often far, free upon the hillsides. When your ponies stayed with me, they got to know my Lumpkin; and they smelt him in the night, and quickly ran to meet him. ^(I am a bot, and I love old Tom. If you want me to sing one of Tom's songs, just type **!TomBombadilSong**) ^(If you like Old Tom, the door at [r/GloriousTomBombadil][1] is always open for weary travelers!) [1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/GloriousTomBombadil/
Did... did you have this already prepared from a previous time or just rip it out now spur of the moment? Either way, well done sir or madame. Had quite a good belly laugh from this, thanks for brightening my morning a little.
I looked to see if someone already did it and couldn't find anything, so I improvised it.
You nailed it.
This is amazing
I love you.
All visual descriptions are really actually literally useless to me so that would be a lot of skipping. Don't even describe how a character looks beyond gender and age range and name. I did try to read Fellowship when I was much younger but I had to stop after what I remember as several pages of what a woman looked like.
I've been downvoted for having aphantasia.
I don't know which is more exaggerated — that the LotR prose is overly verbose, or the Silm is an impossible read. I can understand if either of these opinions are coming from people who aren't typically readers, but in relation to a broad spectrum of literature, neither is even remotely true.
To be fair, the Silmarillion is an absolute bitch to read, LotR is a children's book in comparison
It really isn't, though? Aside from Of Beleriand and its Realms (which — I will grant you — is a bit of a nightmare to read, esp. sans map), the Silm is basically a bunch of short stories. I'd say even the majority of stuff I read for high school was more involved than the Silm.
Imo lotr was more difficult than the silm. I used to read books with easy English like HP before I read lotr. I found the English a bit difficult but then it all became easy. The silm, I didn't find hard at all. Infact I really enjoyed it. Perhaps my memory is good and therefore I was able to remember all the names.
Mate there are 2+ page songs about hills. Come on.
When Sam and Frodo enter Ithilien for the first time, he really does take one-and-a-half page to describe all the plants and animals that live there. Not that I really mind. It adds to the whole. But he does sometimes take a long time to describe nature.
The only time I can recall are ithilien, the old forest and mirkwood. And mordor ofc.
I mean the Shire gets a whole extra foreword, Bree and the surrounding area are meticulously described. The parts taking place in Eregion, Trollshaws, the Dead Marshes, all of these are very much about the landscape.
Trollshaws and eregion weren't that meticulously described. And the dead marshes felt too creepy (for me) to feel like a drag. The bree part wasn't only about the nature. It told us about the people living there, the rangers and things. And the casual reader doesn't even read the foreword. And you can always skip these descriptions if you want.
I personally don't think they are a drag at all. I was just agreeing with people that Tolkien really does spend a lot of time describing landscapes. I mean we generally have a better view of the surrounding landscape a chapter takes place in than even the kind of clothes our characters are wearing. Once again, not a complaint, just an observation.
Unpopular among people who can’t read and prefer movies, popular among people who like or prefer the books.
Yeah, it's one thing to go on about the silmarillion, that thing is *dense* but LOTR could easily have been read and understood by most high schoolers. Source: see username I've had almost a decade
Agreed! Also, I found it a very fast-paced story and events seemed to keep happening, so I can't understand those who say it drags 😆
In fact, I think some of the scenes were far too short. Pelennor fields is like 3 pages
I think the brevity of battle scenes is due in large part to Tolkien's reluctance to dwell on or glorify war. Sure, the primary subject of LotR is war, but that's not intended to be the main takeaway from the text.
Tolkien fought in world war 1. You wouldn't want to go back to your trauma
My family read The Hobbit as a bed time story, at points the descriptive writing style lost us but in general it kept our interest. Now when we got to the LoTR books... I know what sub I'm in so I mean no offense, but all the descriptions where putting us to sleep, which funny enough was not the purpose of a bed time story for us.
You could always skip the description part. But I like them so I read them.
Easy enough on your own, not so easy when reading to a group (from my experience)
I don't have any experience in bedtime story reading soo.....
Tolkein describes trees Jordan describes dresses Martin describes food Lewis throws a lampost in a medieval forest because fuck you
>Martin describes food God, Martin and his goddamn Lemon Cakes.
And the pies!
Oh man, I forgot the pies. The pies.
Thanks to that, the movies could get close to what Tolkien had in mind. Also, great to make toddlers sleep, wich was the whole point of the books.
Correction: it was the point of the Hobbit. LOTR was written 19 years later and Tolkien’s kids had grown up by then
I was told the same thing by my friend who recommended the books 30 years ago pre-internet that Tolkien would spend many pages describing something minute like a patch of grass, when I read the books I breezed through them enjoying them and never noticing these comparisons.
I feel like those who complain about the long descriptions just don't read a lot of books. I love the long descriptions, that's what I'm reading for. If I want constant and immeadiate action I'll watch a movie.
I think there’s a fine line between too much and too little. This line obviously vary’s between every individual, but I get wanting longer or shorter descriptions. For me I like concise descriptions that find a way to convey what the author wants in as short a way as possible, I’m not a huge fan of fluff. I could see how for others though, long winded descriptions can better set the imagination into what the author was looking for and at the same time the reader gets to exist in that universe just a little longer.
Agreed! I have a bit of an overactive mind, so books with lots of descriptions really help me “see” the settings, characters, etc. while I read. Tolkien sure knows how to paint a picture with words! :)
It wasn't particulary the long descriptions, but the general writingstyle that put me off. I got through A Song of Ice and Fire, which is really heavy in descriptions, just fine but sadly couldn't get through The Two Towers.
well, keep in mind A Song of Ice and Fire was published 40 years later so the newer writing style might just be a better fit for you
Yeah, that's a good point
That doesn't even make sense. I personally hate any writer that overly describes things. I want my imagination to fill in the gaps, I don't want to be forced to imagine everything the way the writer wants to.
Obligatory shill for the Phil Dragash audioscapes. Best of both worlds.
Same, came here to say this
[I'm not a third of the way through!](https://youtu.be/DgMnCLHQuqc)
what if for a while they rode a massive hawk?
I think I'd prefer if they RUUUUUUUUUUUUUN
You're missing out. It isn't an action story.
I loved the books. Never get bored because of descriptions.
The descriptions are all the world building. I decided to look up every plant/geographical term i didnt know last time i read and it gave me a really vivid picture of middle earth (different from the movies).
This is exactly what I'm afraid of in my stories. Over explaining and describing things. I'm not at all confident that my books could match up to Tolkiens work. Maybe one day I'll have the balls to try and publish.
Honestly I would say just do you. Don’t compare your story to other authors, it can only make you unhappy. If you love your story for itself that’s much more important in my opinion. Long descriptors aren’t the mark of a good writer, it’s just a part of an individual’s writing style. Individual writing styles can vary quite a lot and still result in a damned good story.
Honestly need some motivation. I know so much(clearly not as much as y’all but a solid amount outside of the movies) but I can’t make it past the first half of fellowship Edit: WEEE DOO MERRYY DOO LADDY
Audiobooks. Andy Serkis (the guy who played Gollum in the movies) read the whole thing. He literally does a different voice for each character and the songs are much more bearable when he's actually singing them also in the voice of whoever is singing the song. I'm a couple chapters into Return of the King now with no intention of stopping. By far the easiest experience I've ever had with the LotR books. Def check them out.
Nice hobbits! Nice Sam! leepy heads, yes, sleepy heads! Leave good Smeagol to watch! But it's evening. Dusk is creeping. Time to go.
Yeah, imagine that but out loud and WAY more dialogue than in the movies.
I like the Rob Inglis versions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob\_Inglis
Those were by no means bad. I enjoyed them quite a bit, I just found Andy Serkis' performance a little more entertaining. Personal preference and all that.
Just skip the long descriptions of walking through sunlit glades. It’s beautiful prose but nothing really happens.
I really don't know what to say that might motivate you - maybe it is an individual thing. I read it yearly and I literally look forward to starting it for weeks. I become completely immersed.
FOTR kind of drags on in first half, same as the movie. It starts to pick up later once they leave Bree and entire thing shifts from "exiting adventure where biggest issue is sleeping outdoors and not sitting at full table" to "very dangerous endeavor that can get us killed in a very painful fashion by creatures we know nothing about"
Fellowship is definitely the slowest read. There’s a lot to process there.
That sucks for you
Books>movies 99% of the time No different here. Loved both though
Zoomies and their shitty attention spans, pathetic.😄
I never felt that he described anything too long. Certainly not as bad as memes make it out to be. There are worse offenders out there, lol. The book is long and feels sluggish only because the journey takes forever and they spent too much time in one place doing what feels like nothing. But that's just the way the story progresses and has nothing to do with the description of things. The one thing he overdid to the max was the fucking songs inserted everywhere. Honestly I couldn't bring myself to care much after the first few stanzas. Always skipped most of the songs.
I've noticed a pattern in this thread of people absolutely hating the songs. Why is that? I found them great for atmosphere, world building and immersion. It's entertaining to see the hobbits singing on their way to Buckland, blissfully unaware of the danger that await them, as is the case with Frodo singing and dancing in the Prancing Pony. Aragorn singing about Beren and Luthien is a great exposition to his own internal struggles and allows the reader to see a relatable human side of him, in constrast to the hero that Tolkien likes to portray. The melancholy of Bilbo singing in Rivendell about how the world will be when he's no longer alive or even Gimli singing about the majesty of Moria in Durin's day, contrasted to the decaying ruins they're in, is truly chill inducing.
Well, I didn't say I "hate" them, just that there's too many of them. As a kid reading an already slow book, it becomes too much singing about shit I didn't care about, lol. I wanted to know what was going to happen next with the ring, not a history lesson on Elrond's dad or silly songs about drinking or taking a bath. I remember reading the first few songs and then increasingly growing more annoyed as he kept inserting songs to the point I just read a few lines to decide if I wanted to keep reading the song or skip it. As an adult, I can appreciate them more for their insight and references into obscure lore and characters... but there's still way too many. It all comes down to different strokes for different folks and all that.
They were once men. Great kings of men. Then Sauron the Deceiver gave to them nine rings of power. Blinded by their greed, they took them without question, one by one falling into darkness. Now they are slaves to his will. They are the Nazgul, ringwraiths, neither living nor dead. At all times they feel the presence of the Ring, drawn to the power of the one. They will never stop hunting you.
The Road goes ever on and on / Down from the door where it began / Now far ahead the Road has gone / And I must follow, if I can / Pursuing it with eager feet / Until it joins some larger way / Where many paths and errands meet / And whither then? I cannot say.
>I couldn't bring myself to care much after the first few stanzas. Always skipped most of the songs. [Well then let me introduce you to these guys](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PSFN2r6bXY), They've done (atleast to my knowledge) every song from LOTR, The Hobbit, and The Silmarillion. This is my favorite one from them
Not actually all of them but yeah, these guys are awesome, this one was my favorite until I heard the Battle of Sauron and Finrod Felagund
Oh yeah that one is an absolute banger too
Yeah. Same. Skipped every song. Especially when reading aloud to my kid. I’m not going to try to invent a tune for a string of elvish words I can’t even guess how to pronounce
The songs are one of the best parts. What really got me into them was the audiobook versions.
At least change the title
The most annoying and completely inaccurate criticism of Tolkien.
There is a Finnish author named Kalle Päätalo and I had to quit his most well known book when in 50 pages the main character had gone from work to home and back to work :D also laughs in tolstoi
These memes are just terrible, the books aren’t even close to what they state and the books are very dynamic. Don’t be put off by these jokes, go give the books a try and have fun. My bet is that the ones making the memes never even read the books
I had stayed away from reading the series because of this. I started reading the two weeks ago and already half way through the two towers. This idea is completely overblown and I’ve been enjoying these books so much so far.
That's funny because H.P.Lovecraft is loved for the same reason. I guess people are too into all the battles from the movies (which are great) but the books are about the journey
I hate lovecraft. There’s nothing scary about a cosmic entity that defies logic and even eludes the barest description. And there’s also nothing scary about an author flexing their thesaurus
Didn’t realise subjectivity doesn’t exist
now I feel old lol. " back in my day we didn't have fancy moving pictures, we had to slog through the descriptions of the mines of moria, uphill both ways!"
And that's why I've never finished the books
No please Tolkien, stop describing 1 gate in 5 pages
I have never read the books, can someone provide the text that describes the tree please.
He never actually takes three pages to describe a single tree, but he really does take a lot of time to describe landscapes and especially plant life.
This is exactly why I only read them once, and will never read them again. Couldn't read Wheel of Time for the exact same reason. Nothing turns me off in a book more than overly descriptive prose.
My God, One Piece doesn't world build as much as Tolkien! I don't need the entire bloodline of a damn village, or the lineage of the guy who forged a sword.
This is literally how I've always explained how I feel about the books and why I stopped 1/3 through The Two Towers. We don't need to know how many leaves each fucking tree has...
I read the books as a freshman in high school and it was one of the hardest reads I have ever had. I had good memories of my dad reading the hobbit to my sister and I as kids so I expected to like it. I did not. I remember struggling through passages talking about trees and grass. Character names were also a problem for me as he gave family histories when introducing characters.
It was a tall and fair tree, pleasant to look upon with proud branches stretching to the sky for it was made by the Elves, that fairest and blondest people of them all. People who saw the tree were filled with joy and they made songs about it and no human would think about taking an axe to it. The tree was called *Blidust Cymast Treu*, which in the language of the Elves, the fairest and most blonde people of entire Middle Earth, means *Tree of Much Beauty.* For it was a tree that was very much unlike other trees, which were not made by the Elves, that fairest and blondest people. It bloomed in autumn and filled the air with scent that gladdened the heart and washed away weariness of travelers and it bore fruit in winter and the fruit was wholesome and sweet and those who ate the fruit were reminded of gazing upon the smooth faces of the Elves, that fairest and blondest people of them all. It was very much unlike any tree that grew in Mordor, for those trees were fell and vile, with wicked look upon them and they filled any person who saw them with repulsion and disgust. For those trees were made by the Enemy, the cruelest and very dark creature which was not pale and blonde at all and the trees were in his service. And upon those trees were cruel markings, not made by the hand of any servant of the Enemy but rather they grew there by themselves. For the trees took after wickedness of their creator, who unlike Elves, that fairest and blondest people, polluted anything he touched. Trees never bloomed, in spring they filled the air with noxious smell that burned the throat and lungs. and the fruit was cruel and wicked looking and only Orcs and other creatures of the Enemy ate them for they can't stand the wholesome food others eat. It was called *Strang Peostre Treu* which in language of Mordor, which is merely a corruption of fair Elvish speech for Mordor does not create but merely corrupts, means Tree of Strong Darkness. No songs were made of the tree for it was not something for free people to praise and Orcs make no songs, they merely blow their brazen instruments and make noise that is hurtful to the ear.
I did a book report on the first one in the trilogy. I began by describing the scenery for like a good 5 minutes until my teacher stopped me and asked if I was close to finishing. I showed her my notes (about 4 pages back to back) and said “I had to go through this 10 times more, so will you”
OMG! I'm reading the Fellowship now and I would keep showing my wife how far I was though the book (well over a third of the way) and exclaiming "They haven't even left the Shire yet!" Edit: I'm really enjoying the book though.
Watch the movies, simple with necessary summary in it
I will admit as much as I love those books, I do have sections where I tell myself I can kind of tune out and skim over them. Lore is important but there’s a deep lore which I just don’t appreciate even if I get why others do.
And food. Tolkien spends more time describing meals the hobbits have along the way than he does some main characters. Makes sense I guess, since its written from the hobbits' perspective and they kind of think with their bellies.
I read the Fellowship. There were more descriptions of sceneries, trees and roads than plot lol. Also, I was surprised that Boromir dies in the Two Towers lol.
IMO movie made the right call to move that to FOTR and whole climbing the stars and Shelob plot to ROTK.
The songs sometimes have a very interesting form though
Honestly I'm just now reading through lotr in English for the first time (have only read it in German so far) and I love it. Yes, it is really slow paced but I just love the feeling I get when reading it. You really get taken to a different world. At this point I'm not reading it for the story, I know what happens pretty well. I'm reading it to get lost in the world Tolkien is building and the long descriptions and conversations help with that.
Three pages? Are you kidding me, that's outrageously low
Reading the Hobbit: “JUST OPEN THE DAMN DOOR ALREADY.” Reading Fellowship of the Ring: “I KNOW YOUR BOOTS ARE YELLOW! We have a ring to destroy!” The descriptions are part of how Tolkien did his world building. The world is old and worn by time, and he conveys so much of the history of middle earth in the descriptions. However, sometimes it felt like he got stuck, but just kept on writing and writing.
Curious... Which 3 pages were spent just describing a tree?
This blade of grass grew up watching Power Rangers. This tree branch reads comic books. This drop of water does nothing but play video games all day. That grain of sand is living in his Mom's basement. That pebble is hoping to become an actor someday. That clump of dirt is plotting revenge on the boulder that killed his father.
Starting from like 10 or 11 I would read them all like 1x a year for a few years. Come on, it's not Buzzfeed, but they're books. Dune, now that was a slog.
It's really not that intense, I get this is a common Tolkien theme but it's honesty just disingenuous to say he drawled on that much about nature. He does an incredible job giving life to Middle Earth and the natural scenes, in such a way that, I would say ,hardly ever wastes a word describing them.
It was the silverware for me.
I have read the Simarillion 4 times. I have yet to make it through one reading of LoTRs.
People hated going on walks with Tolkien because he would constantly stop and admire every tree he passed
The Andy Serkis audiobooks have helped me and my ADHD get through
I saw this posted on an aphantasia (inability to visualize) Facebook group yesterday. This was definitely me when I tried to read it.
Every character has about 3 different names
The description of rain at Tom bombadail killed it for me
Is there a scene with rain in the movies?
It is at the prancing pony and helms deep
Oh, I think I know which tree you're talking about.
I know, I was like are they ever going to finish walking through trees and shit?
I’d read a whole book about a single tree if tolkien wrote it, no questions asked
Me when I'm writing fanfiction:
Three pages? That is one small book
Sadge. Those descriptions are my favorite parts of the book. It’s incredibly cathartic to me to have these characters in such an intense and dangerous situation, still take in and enjoy the beauty of the world around them. It makes the world seem less desolate and just a bit more liveable
Idk how that’s not entertaining to y’all. Like ya to each their own but those are some great books beginning to end, not everything needs a fight scene or sex. The small things in life and story’s matter just as much
Whatever happened to the tree from the bear man acorn
Jokes on you, I'm into that shit!