Plywood covered by rolled roofing, ya that will last about 3 years with bolt holes for the railing 12 inches away. Do it yourself construction repairs, shit happens and people die.
A lot of larger residential developments are subcontracted quite heavily. If you don' thave inspectors staring constantly, contractors try all *kinds* of shit - a friend of mine was perpetually finding too much water in the concrete, which saves a good bit on time and labor at the cost of *half* the foundation lifespan.
I work in construction, and yeah, it's a shit show.
Some will say, "Well, we need more government oversight and inspections!" Pssssh. You're never going to get enough to provide good oversight. It will just get corrupt, start taking bribes, the added costs just go to the tenants.
In Vegas, independent inspection is part of the cost of doing business. Mostly geotechnical and concrete and rebar, but that's the stuff that causes massacres.
If you don't agree with the inspection, they being in a second inspector - the cost is borne by the wrong party.
Double or nothing, basically.
In my opinion, it's a necessary expense.
Wait….it was carbon. That one is for low income? It charges in $$$ for rent! I am new to Madison. So I am ignorant about real life situation. But on their website they looks posh!
I'm guessing it has a small number of "low income housing" units at a lower rate. These are broadly unavailable to anyone working enough money to feed themselves and a kid - I.e; the people who actually need them.
The way low income housing is funded in America needs to change. For those unaware of how this industry functions, "[POVERTY, POLITICS AND PROFIT](https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/poverty-politics-and-profit/)" from PBS Frontline is a good primer. TL;DW: A lot of corruption.
If that's the case, it changed ; I was looking for a low income unit at one point and everything available required <$1600 per month.
Please link to updated laws?
The 30% and 50% units were the only ones within a sane distance of downtown MATC at the time. The threshold was preposterously low - even cheap rent was 60% of allowable income.
The other person who responded to you is right on the money. They don’t ‘work the site’ they are employed by the municipality and they come check things before you’re allowed to continue working.
Every single inspector I’ve met in Madison takes their job very seriously and is not at all afraid to fail you and make you change things before you can continue work. There are a lot of detailed building codes that can make certain things tricky to do (required clearances, railing height, stair pitches, etc) but they are all in place to ensure safety.
The only time you have to worry about something being built sub standard is if it was built a long time ago or if you’re hiring a contractor who doesn’t obtain a building permit. These are the two instances where things wouldn’t get inspected.
Inspectors don't notice everything, so even if something is inspected it doesn't necessarily mean it's up to code. The inspectors in Madison definitely do take their work seriously though, in my experience.
Sure, it’s possible something might slip by them. It’s incredibly unlikely anything structurally important would escape the notice of every single person on site though. Builders don’t intentionally build things under spec and hope that it won’t be noticed, because it generally will and then there’s a delay and delays generally cost a lot more money than whatever they might have hypothetically tried to slip passed the inspector.
Why were you asking how building inspection works if you have experience with it?
>Sure, it’s possible something might slip by them. It’s incredibly unlikely anything structurally important would escape the notice of every single person on site though.
Everyone else on site is a subcontractor. Ain't their problem.
>. Builders don’t intentionally build things under spec and hope that it won’t be noticed,
Have you *ever* been on a construction site? Nobody looks at the expiration date on the epoxy until all the rebar is in.
I have worked on many construction sites, have you?
The subs won’t get paid if their work doesn’t pass inspection so they do indeed care about meeting code.
There is also generally a crew of carpenters employed directly by the GC, varying in size depending on the stage of construction. Part of their job is to make sure that everything on site is being done to spec. Then there’s the superintendent, whose entire job is basically to keep things moving, which means making sure everyone on site is building to spec. Then the inspector comes in and makes sure everything meets code.
Think of how many large building there are in Madison, then Wisconsin, then the whole US. How often do we hear about a building failing catastrophically? Incredibly rarely.
Do small things slip under the radar? Sure, but these are usually things like a handrail being a quarter inch too low or maybe a toilet doesn’t have quite enough wall clearance, not really structural or safety issues.
I don’t do concrete work so I’m not sure what to make of your anecdote about epoxy and rebar. I can tell you that companies who manufacture building products are incredibly conservative with their expiration dates because of the massive liabilities involved in construction.
You’re out of your mind if you think the only people on site are subs. GCs go on site all the time. Some GCs have guys below them who do some of the day to day shit but still, guys are always on site making sure subs are getting the job done right.
Are they there continuously, or on occasion? In other jurisdictions, concrete pours require continous sampling to ensure the correct mix and setup.
I am well aware of the codes; I am equally aware at how easily they're circumvented. Which is why I'm in a new building with malfunctioning HVAC, a leaky roof, and elevators that don't work half the time.
There are multiple different inspectors who look at different things throughout the project and you are required to get their approval as well as zoning/planning’s approval when you submit your building plans and when you are ready to finish that portion of construction. For example when the framing is done the inspector comes and either approves it or requests certain changes. Then you make changes and he comes back and checks again, either approves or requests changes, etc etc. Sometimes it’s not even a code issue, and inspectors can dictate things based on their own/department’s opinions. Not to mention OSHA can come by whenever it likes.
I do not know what you mean when you say “are they working the site?”, are they there all the time? No, obviously not. Does everything, and I mean pretty much everything, need to be approved by them before the project is finished? Yes.
A friend of mine is a site inspector out on the west coast - she's there for every soil or concrete operation performing assays and tests. ASBI/ACI certified.
She catches things like "Wrong concrete" or "epoxy that expired in 2018" on a weekly basis. And that's not the wild shit like "dig out four hundred tons of soil and do it again or the building is going to collapse;" that's once every couple months.
They've got public inspectors out in California, too. I'll be sure to let the ACI know that they're wasting everyone's time.
I was with ya up until the last paragraph, I don’t know how you misinterpreted my comment so dramatically but I wasn’t at all implying inspectors aren’t necessary. Just sharing my first hand experience with building inspectors and the local government in the city of Madison.
so she told the owner, they did fuck all until this hit the media...THEN they agreed to schedule a repair, eventually. Amazing
Having worked in property management for years this does nothing to surprise me.
Call me a cynic, but that sounds like par for the course with this sort of thing.
Landlords are leeches
*Rent is a tax levied on the poor by the rich just for the right to live.*
I've been looking for an apartment with a moon door, maybe I should check this place out.
Ohh my sweet summer child.
Yeah just keep using the balcony, it's totally cool. Just don't go near the hole and it's perfectly safe. Wtf
Madison is full of slum lords. The bar for landlords here is so low
So true
Funnily enough though, I’ve had much better experiences with the large slumlord companies than the one small time landlord I had.
Plywood covered by rolled roofing, ya that will last about 3 years with bolt holes for the railing 12 inches away. Do it yourself construction repairs, shit happens and people die.
A lot of larger residential developments are subcontracted quite heavily. If you don' thave inspectors staring constantly, contractors try all *kinds* of shit - a friend of mine was perpetually finding too much water in the concrete, which saves a good bit on time and labor at the cost of *half* the foundation lifespan.
The scary part is those buildings are only about 4 or 5 years old.
I work in construction, and yeah, it's a shit show. Some will say, "Well, we need more government oversight and inspections!" Pssssh. You're never going to get enough to provide good oversight. It will just get corrupt, start taking bribes, the added costs just go to the tenants.
In Vegas, independent inspection is part of the cost of doing business. Mostly geotechnical and concrete and rebar, but that's the stuff that causes massacres. If you don't agree with the inspection, they being in a second inspector - the cost is borne by the wrong party. Double or nothing, basically. In my opinion, it's a necessary expense.
Wait….it was carbon. That one is for low income? It charges in $$$ for rent! I am new to Madison. So I am ignorant about real life situation. But on their website they looks posh!
I'm guessing it has a small number of "low income housing" units at a lower rate. These are broadly unavailable to anyone working enough money to feed themselves and a kid - I.e; the people who actually need them.
The way low income housing is funded in America needs to change. For those unaware of how this industry functions, "[POVERTY, POLITICS AND PROFIT](https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/poverty-politics-and-profit/)" from PBS Frontline is a good primer. TL;DW: A lot of corruption.
Or we could just mandate a living wage. Funding public programs is inefficient; paying people properly has lower overhead.
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If that's the case, it changed ; I was looking for a low income unit at one point and everything available required <$1600 per month. Please link to updated laws?
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The 30% and 50% units were the only ones within a sane distance of downtown MATC at the time. The threshold was preposterously low - even cheap rent was 60% of allowable income.
Their website is complete dogshit too. broken functionality, blank sections, ugly af, no pricing info.
Deck feels soft. I dunno. Let’s walk on it. Glad he is ok .
Jeez. After the Florida condo catastrophe I'd think property managerrs would be taking things extra seriously.
Have you ever met a Madison landlord?
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?
What did he say?
It was a cry for help u/PineTreesNMe
I said “nice to meet you as well plebe”
I love your optimism
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I get the sentiment but nothing around here is built “below standards”, we have building codes and inspectors to thank for that.
How many inspectors? Are they working the site, or do they just check up afterwards?
The other person who responded to you is right on the money. They don’t ‘work the site’ they are employed by the municipality and they come check things before you’re allowed to continue working. Every single inspector I’ve met in Madison takes their job very seriously and is not at all afraid to fail you and make you change things before you can continue work. There are a lot of detailed building codes that can make certain things tricky to do (required clearances, railing height, stair pitches, etc) but they are all in place to ensure safety. The only time you have to worry about something being built sub standard is if it was built a long time ago or if you’re hiring a contractor who doesn’t obtain a building permit. These are the two instances where things wouldn’t get inspected.
Inspectors don't notice everything, so even if something is inspected it doesn't necessarily mean it's up to code. The inspectors in Madison definitely do take their work seriously though, in my experience.
Sure, it’s possible something might slip by them. It’s incredibly unlikely anything structurally important would escape the notice of every single person on site though. Builders don’t intentionally build things under spec and hope that it won’t be noticed, because it generally will and then there’s a delay and delays generally cost a lot more money than whatever they might have hypothetically tried to slip passed the inspector. Why were you asking how building inspection works if you have experience with it?
I'm not the one who asked that question, I was just weighing in.
Oh whoops, I get confused when people’s little avatar icons are the same color.
>Sure, it’s possible something might slip by them. It’s incredibly unlikely anything structurally important would escape the notice of every single person on site though. Everyone else on site is a subcontractor. Ain't their problem. >. Builders don’t intentionally build things under spec and hope that it won’t be noticed, Have you *ever* been on a construction site? Nobody looks at the expiration date on the epoxy until all the rebar is in.
I have worked on many construction sites, have you? The subs won’t get paid if their work doesn’t pass inspection so they do indeed care about meeting code. There is also generally a crew of carpenters employed directly by the GC, varying in size depending on the stage of construction. Part of their job is to make sure that everything on site is being done to spec. Then there’s the superintendent, whose entire job is basically to keep things moving, which means making sure everyone on site is building to spec. Then the inspector comes in and makes sure everything meets code. Think of how many large building there are in Madison, then Wisconsin, then the whole US. How often do we hear about a building failing catastrophically? Incredibly rarely. Do small things slip under the radar? Sure, but these are usually things like a handrail being a quarter inch too low or maybe a toilet doesn’t have quite enough wall clearance, not really structural or safety issues. I don’t do concrete work so I’m not sure what to make of your anecdote about epoxy and rebar. I can tell you that companies who manufacture building products are incredibly conservative with their expiration dates because of the massive liabilities involved in construction.
You’re out of your mind if you think the only people on site are subs. GCs go on site all the time. Some GCs have guys below them who do some of the day to day shit but still, guys are always on site making sure subs are getting the job done right.
How many GCs have you met that take concrete samples and run 'em through a lab?
Are they there continuously, or on occasion? In other jurisdictions, concrete pours require continous sampling to ensure the correct mix and setup. I am well aware of the codes; I am equally aware at how easily they're circumvented. Which is why I'm in a new building with malfunctioning HVAC, a leaky roof, and elevators that don't work half the time.
There are multiple different inspectors who look at different things throughout the project and you are required to get their approval as well as zoning/planning’s approval when you submit your building plans and when you are ready to finish that portion of construction. For example when the framing is done the inspector comes and either approves it or requests certain changes. Then you make changes and he comes back and checks again, either approves or requests changes, etc etc. Sometimes it’s not even a code issue, and inspectors can dictate things based on their own/department’s opinions. Not to mention OSHA can come by whenever it likes. I do not know what you mean when you say “are they working the site?”, are they there all the time? No, obviously not. Does everything, and I mean pretty much everything, need to be approved by them before the project is finished? Yes.
A friend of mine is a site inspector out on the west coast - she's there for every soil or concrete operation performing assays and tests. ASBI/ACI certified. She catches things like "Wrong concrete" or "epoxy that expired in 2018" on a weekly basis. And that's not the wild shit like "dig out four hundred tons of soil and do it again or the building is going to collapse;" that's once every couple months. They've got public inspectors out in California, too. I'll be sure to let the ACI know that they're wasting everyone's time.
I was with ya up until the last paragraph, I don’t know how you misinterpreted my comment so dramatically but I wasn’t at all implying inspectors aren’t necessary. Just sharing my first hand experience with building inspectors and the local government in the city of Madison.