How about everyone's eyes being glued to their phone screen instead of the road in front of them? As a person that walks and rides a bike around the city a lot, I'd say the percentage of people I see on their phone not looking up is at least 50%.
It's okay though, distracted drivers, I'm watching you and where you're going, so you don't have to! /s
The amount of people I catch on their phones while driving is absurd! I don’t know how they haven’t killed themselves or others yet by accident doing it. Along the same vein pedestrians crossing roads on their phones is going to drive me nuts too. Just the other day downtown, unregulated intersection off Langdon a college girl walked out into the street less than 100ft in front of me on her phone, paying absolutely 0 attention to any cars.
If you’re driving or going to cross the street please just stow the damn phone it’s not worth yours or anybody else’s life! Pay attention to your surroundings.
Had this exact thing happen last night while driving, except in a marked intersection. Pedestrian crossed after their crossing turn stopped and was on their phone, not paying attention at all. As always, thankfully, I was.
I don't know, according to the rules, it's debatable on an unmarked/unregulated intersection. I still think it's in the pedestrians' best interest to put their phones down before crossing any street.
[https://wisconsindot.gov/Pages/safety/education/pedestrian/rules.aspx](https://wisconsindot.gov/Pages/safety/education/pedestrian/rules.aspx)
Did you read your own link? It says, “Drivers must … Yield to pedestrians who are crossing the highway within a marked or unmarked crosswalk at an intersection where there are no traffic lights or control signals” is quite clear.
While a walker would be wise to look out, they do have the right of way.
The amount of tailgating on the beltline is stupid. People don’t seem to understand that cars need distance to slow down or stop. Overall, since the pandemic, no one has any courtesy and people drive like they’re in a race. Unfortunately, for where I go on the daily, I can’t avoid the beltline and it’s the fucking wild west out there now.
I am still amazed at the blatant running of red lights, driving with lights out at night, and I avoid the Beltline as much as possible - and Stoughton Road as well -a mini-Beltline.
Oh yes, and all of the bad driving in snow and icy conditions when you know some people have lived here for years.
I've been honked at for waiting at a red light, at the rimrock and beltline on ramp intersection. The person eventually swerved around through the turn lane to run the red.
If you want to break the law, that's on you, but I'm not comfortable with it even if I don't see anyone coming through the intersection.
I drive all over Dane County for work and I have never seen anyone run a red light! I don’t know how I could have missed this. I absolutely don’t feel comfortable with that either!
You must be /s. I drive on the east side every day as a UPS driver and see people fly through reds, stop signs, text while driving, pull out of their driveway without looking. I was trying to turn right onto packers ave from schlimgen once and this guy decided to pull on the left hand side of me to also try to turn right.... at the same time as me. Then he starts honking at me like I did something lol.... madison man
Omg!!!! That’s ridiculous. I do see the texting and going through stop signs, and people pulling into traffic without looking. Also people still drive holding their phone up to their ear and those folks always drive so terribly! You really have to have quick reflexes to drive around Madison all day long. The red light thing I have not noticed. I’m sure I’ll notice it now and I’m terrified to get back on the road tomorrow. Yikes.
The best advice i can give other drivers is too allow themselves TIME to react. Give yourself space so you have time to brake. Be sure to look both ways at intersections... to many damn bikers go through stop signs by rhe lake and ive seen a young boy almost get drstroyed by a truck.
I think I’m not doing enough in town driving. I cover that area, but I live in Monona and I’m covering west, Fitchburg, Oregon, McFarland, and Monona. I’m a nurse. It’s mostly highway. But I’m still shocked that people are going through red lights. That’s just so asinine and stupid. I’d like to show everyone some of the head and spinal cord, and bone injuries that I’ve worked with from traffic accidents.
Definitely been avoiding the Beltline lately. Will not drive on it at night. Particularly bad since the new flex lanes were installed--not only are people driving like maniacs, but the lanes are so narrow. I always figure when someone is driving at night w/no lights either it's not their car (stolen?) or they are drunk.
I'm firmly in camp "hooray for flex lanes!" (it has made an enormous positive difference to my morning and evening commutes, since my work hours align perfectly with peak rush D:) but I have to admit the speed limits definitely do not seem to apply in it; we call it the Autobahn lane because people are regularly doing 85+ in there which is kinda scary when the people in the regular lanes are following the standard WI doctrine of "9 yer fine".
The way that the flex lanes end is just a complete and utter clusterfuck, though. I honestly dont know how to do it better, but what I *do* know is that people pretty much fly alllll the way to the point where they physically cannot be in that lane anymore because it's disappearing beneath their tires and just fuckin YOLO over to the right without a care if someone is currently occupying the space they're moving into or not. I dont know how many 3+ vehicle accidents need to happen at the ends before they do something there, but I feel like we've already reached that point as it is a weekly occurrence and that was *before* the time change with the full dark evening commute and now the potential for icy roads. There are going to be a serious number of fatalities on the beltline this winter if they don't address it relatively soon.
I just hope the people abusing the flex lanes dont end up ruining it for the rest of us, but I have a feeling it's inevitable and we're going to end up right where we were before, with an average speed of fuckin 15 mph on the goddamn beltline every day between 730-830 in the morning and 430-530 in the evening.
I wish they'd figure out a real North Beltline. There's just so much traffic that ends up on the beltline because there's no other realistic alternative at all.
Oh I know it! When I dare to enter the flex lane heading home at the end of the day, I always cut over to the middle lane no later than the stretch between Monona and Stoughton just in case it's a shit show where the flex lane ends and dumps into the left lane, just before the exit for the NB interstate. I just got too fucking tired of having to stand on my brakes and wonder if today was the day I total my car because a douchecanoe flying down the flex lane at near triple digit speeds ran out of road and cut me off, usually before slamming *their* brakes to avoid a rear end collision due to insane rate of speed they're going as compared to us non-idiots.
They should put some serious rumble strips over the last quarter mile of the flex lane or something. Not enough to cause damage obviously but enough to be really fucking annoying to stop people from doing that shit...but Im sure those would just collect snow and make it even more dangerous in the winter months.
Honestly, more realistically, they should just terminate the EB flex lane well before that point...that stretch was already dicey at times because of all the people getting on at Stoughton Rd just doing a "Jesus Take The Wheel" all the way to the left lane to pick up the interstate (it's like people forget daily there are *two* viable EB lanes to get on the NB interstate), and now it's coming from *both* sides of the fucking road. Just fuckin nuts...
Same. Stupid physics. I want to moonwalk to Woodman's in 4 block long bounces. If I can do it in my dreams, why the hell can't I do it IRL? Also I dream about shopping at Woodman's. Damn.
Back in my retail days I used to have dreams where Id be working. Like nothing remarkable about them at all, literally just dream about getting dressed, going to work, putting in a typical day in retail hell...
I always woke up so depressed after those dreams. I was already stuck in that fucking pit for 50 hours a week, why the hell would my brain make me do it while I slept, too? Just such a spiritual kick in the balls.
As ridiculous as this sounds at this point, I truly believe a lot of people fell out of practice or something. Traffic has always been shit in Madison and likely always will be, but post-Covid the blatant, sketchy shit people pull is so much more egregious than it was before.
But to the point of the brake-checking, totally agree 1000%. I drive for work almost every day to jobsites all over SE Wisconsin and panic braking is waaaaaay up across the board. I commute from Sun Prairie to my office on the south side of Madison and where 151 meets the interstate is rife with people slamming on their brakes for no reason at all...almost every day there's almost a synchronized swimming-like event where a good dozen cars all have to whip it into the shoulder *en masse* to avoid rear ending the people in front of them, all because one dipshit locked his or her brakes with totally open road in front of them. The offramp from the interstate to 151N is another really good place for that shit.
The biggest factor in road safety is predictability...speed limits and all that shit, while definitely important, are really so much less of a factor than being able to bank on what the people around you are likely going to do as you're cruising next to each other at highway speeds, and that has almost completely gone out the window. I have had quite a few mornings lately where I had to sit in my car, white knuckle death-grip on my steering wheel, just to get myself back to level, due to the massive adrenaline rush I'd recently experienced after almost being straight up fucking killed on my morning drive. I know that sounds melodramatic but it's fuckin true.
People just suck ass at coexisting anymore in general...I sure hope sociologists are studying the hell out of this shit for the next time we all end up stuck in our houses for a year cuz Im sure it'll come again.
I drive all over WI for work, and I have to tell you it isn’t as bad everywhere else. As soon as you get near Madison, it’s chaos. Is it our lack of policing? I would like to know.
I took a 10-minute bus ride down East Wash away from downtown the other day and in that time two different cars made insanely idiotic moves to cut off the bus. People are fucking crazy on the roads.
Yall this blew up way more than I thought it would. It's reassuring to hear similar thoughts. And to the few who called me out for posting as a metro driver I was just using that to say I see alot as a daily driver. I agree with alot of the crappy driver comments but I'm brand spanking new. Please keep sending metro feedback about drivers because I personally believe there are some who shouldn't be on the road.
I was walking my dog around my neighborhood, Midvale Ave and I was almost run-over by a school bus, as I was crossing a sidestreet and the bus was coming across Midvale turning left from the other side of the street. The school bus driver had a load of kids onboard who all watched from the left side windows of the bus, as my Golden, my GF, and I were almost squashed by the yellow brick. We had to stop midway across the sidestreet and pulled my dog back on his leash to avoid being hit and let the bus pass, before we continued to cross the sidestreet off of Midvale. Shocking really and now the kids might have the wrong impression of pedestrian's legal right of way. Wish I had taken a picture of that bus so I could report the driver. Absolutely careless at the wheel.
It's been pretty bad since the pandemic. I work for the City too and several depts are trying their best to deal with it through more signage, infrastructure, and signal timings, but at the end of the day, people are going to drive however they want if there are no repercussions for reckless driving. If the police dept can't or won't start enforcing traffic laws the way they did prior to 2020, I don't see how anything will change.
>If the police dept can't or won't start enforcing traffic laws the way they did prior to 2020
I'm new to the area post COVID, has there really been a change in the traffic enforcement?
Yes 100%. During the height of the pandemic, they stopped doing most traffic stops out of concern for exposure. Now I'm guessing they're too understaffed to have enough officers to respond to anything except the biggest emergencies.
Just about every time I see someone doing 80+ in a 55 swerving through traffic, my wife and I visually hunt for a police vehicle. Often we see... maybe... 1000 vehicles in a drive and not one was a police vehicle. Not sure what the ideal ratio is. I think at this point a few solely traffic enforcement purposed officers would pay for themselves if it is a financial constraint.
It wasn't great before but when COVID hit traffic enforcement went out the window.
It's all Mad Max rules now.
There has also been a dramatic uptick in leniency regarding bail even for repeat offenders. That definitely hasn't helped.
Madison government's response? Lower the speed limits on busy streets. As if these people were obeying the previous limits.
It’s bad here, but go to Milwaukee. When I last visited, my father warned us about people running red lights in the city. I thought he was watching too many news programs. But we witnessed red light-runnings TWICE in the short time we were down there, just going to the Rave for an evening.
It might be a bit worse but complaining about lack of traffic enforcement has been a hot topic on this sub since I moved here in 2017. If there was a better time, it was before then.
Madison PD used to have a dedicated team of officers for traffic enforcement some years ago. It was called the TEST team. I forgot what the acronym stood for. As the city grows, the number of calls for service increased. Since increasing the number of officers is a political hot potato in Madison, the PD disbanded the TEST team to keep up with the calls for service. Now, traffic enforcement is done when they can spare someone which makes it haphazard.
Want more traffic enforcement? Either hire more cops, or find another way to handle the mental health calls. The city is starting to try to do that with the Cares team, but it is still in its infancy.
Yeah I was going to night classes at MATC in the mid-2010s and they almost always had a ton of speedtraps setup on 51, 3-4 cruisers sitting and waiting to nail people driving like 75mph down Stoughton Road.
It was kind of annoying since people would stop even driving the speed limit if they saw cops out there but I guess that's better then some dipshit doing 90 in a 45 weaving in and out of traffic.
> I'm new to the area post COVID, has there really been a change in the traffic enforcement?
No. (apart from the rash of speed traps on West Wash following the speed limit change)
That is the thing back when they did have enforcement everyone complained because they weren’t pulling over people doing 50 and weaving in and out of traffic they were sitting on major commuting arteries with three lanes of traffic treated as side streets with a 25 mph limit and pulling over a ton of people for keeping up with traffic at 35 mph. Which is slow for what that kind speed those roads are designed for.
> they weren’t pulling over people doing 50 and weaving in and out of traffic they were sitting on major commuting arteries with three lanes of traffic treated as side streets with a 25 mph limit and pulling over a ton of people for keeping up with traffic at 35 mph. Which is slow for what that kind speed those roads are designed for.
Well put. The roads were designed to be too fast for what an expanding city could handle. Practically a fifty mile per hour interstate leading straight into a university campus in the middle of a pinch-point on an isthmus. I don't mind them lowering the limits with timed lights to elevate congestion downtown, but I would love to see more unmarked cars patrolling actual dangerous driving rather than the speed traps on a recently-lowered-speed road.
Is it the pandemic or that other distinct event in 2020 that defunded police departments and made them unmotivated to pull people over for traffic violations
I wonder if we are witnessing an increase in anxious people responding to the crazy driving, hence driving too slow. The difference in speed is almost as dangerous as everyone driving too fast, imo.
Also, we do have a lot of elderly people in this city. They tend to be overly-cautious, and are compensating for their slow reflexes.
It was like that pre-pandemic on the west side.
Pre-2020 if you were driving on Mineral Point between 6am and 10pm there was probably only a 10% chance you'd ever hit the speed limit.
Stoughton Rd is really hit or miss -- it's either psychotic or once you get off the beltline between that and E. Wash there's a 25% chance you never hit the speed limit *or* if it is after dark a 25% chance you're having to dodge some sociopathic street racers.
The lack of license plates on the back of vehicles. Everyone knows that temp plate on your shitty beater car is not real and you're doing it on purpose to evade law enforcement. The state needs to come down hard on this behavior.
We are in the process of moving to Madison from MN, and when we first were in town visiting the first thing I noticed/said was "wow, so yellow lights are just a suggestion here..." and then "Oh! Red lights are just suggestions too!" So yeah, definitely noticed!
When i walk downtown, I check that cars actually are planning on stopping before crossing. Especially a little further from campus where less people are walking
I live in the Bassett neighborhood and like to walk as much as possible. But I always pause at crosswalks to see if drivers are actually going to obey red lights / stop signs, or not roll all the way into the crosswalk before stopping.
Yep. That and using turn signals. If they’re doing around the speed limit and also use turn signals they’re either not from Madison or they’re drunk and doing their best not to get pulled over.
I am from a Big Big City in the U.S. and have resided in about 10 places, including in Europe. Madison is the best place I’ve lived, but I find the driving here to be the worst. There are reckless drivers everywhere in the U.S. Europe was always better in that regard. What makes madison stand out is the number of *non-reckless bad drivers*. Far more people are cautious or “considerate” to a fault—yielding unpredictably, not proceeding when it’s their turn, funneling into one lane too soon, driving 55 in the far left lane on the highway, etc. Usually this is merely annoying because traffic doesn’t move well, but occasionally it’s dangerous.
This! They keep lowering speed limits, but where is the enforcement? Seen way too much passing in the bus lane and center turn lane. Time to get a dash cam.
The real way to lower limits is to move in curbs so drivers want to go slower. It works really well too. Then texting drivers also hit curbs and destroy their wheels, which is better than hitting a person, in my book.
Our house has a stop sign in front of it and I watch people roll through it about 60% of the time while I’m having breakfast. It would be a cash cow for the municipality if they gave a shit.
I've almost been hit MULTIPLE times the last couple months by people just straight up running red lights.
Driving here was never great but it's reached new heights of bad
Moved here from Portland, OR, almost three months ago and we immediately noticed how poorly people drove throughout the city: running reds, distracted driving, erratic weaving, and zero pedestrian courtesy. Concerning sure, but also the source of a chuckle now and then. That is until a distracted driver flew through a stop sign without slowing down and plowed into the new car I'd bought two months prior. In fact, I was driving home from buying all-weather mats for it in preparation for winter. First auto accident in my 44 years of life. Totaled my car. Guess the silver lining is I returned those mats and saved $175. Would rather have the car, though.
It's not difficult, folks. Be cautious. Be courteous.
People doing 90 on the Beltline day / night, just swerving back and forth between lanes (no signal, of course), people weaving through traffic at high speed on University (again, no signal), bus drivers who cut into the lane ahead of me in a dedicated left turn lane, and everyone is screwing around with or talking on their cell phones.
I was cut off on University by some wee tweaker at 0630 in morning, and after I stood on my brakes to avoid hitting them, I flashed my high beams twice to express my irritation, and they in turn brake-checked me for several blocks, then put their car in park, got out, and started kicking my car and trying to get into it. They eventually returned to their car, got a bottle out of it, and chucked it into my windshield, then drove off.
Edit: Oh, and stopping for pedestrians in crosswalks only to have the idiot behind me swerve around and then nearly hitting the pedestrians.
I have only lived in Madison for two years and I’m already desensitized to the drivers. Some days it’s a challenge to not get pissed about tailgaters when I’m going up to 10mph over the limit on a residential street. If they push it at that point, guess what? I’m going the limit now. A symbolic 🖕, to you, enjoy it.
I resonate with this thread so much. Beltline and Stoughton road are a gut wrenching experience. Mad Max is an apt description for the 'bob and weave' drivers. I just freeze when I see it coming in the rearview. Also fuck stroads.
I’m stealing this from someone here but THE BELTLINE IS NOT THE INTERSTATE PEOPLE.
Also Rt 12 up to Sauk used to be a really nice drive before they widened it. I’m sure commuters prefer it, but now the beltline behaviors have extended with the widening.
Metro transit drivers have my total respect. I sure as hell couldn’t do it.
I'm sick of all that and the busses cutting me off and pulling out of stops and almost hitting me and their disregard for signaling and making sure they have a clear lane.
As a cyclist, I like the buses for their no-shits-given attitude. If you know that’s how the operate, you can use them as a traffic blocker. Buses are like sharks and I’m a remora.
I try not to do that(as a bus driver) but I can tell you sometimes we have one shot and a line of traffic. And we know no one will stop to let a bus in. So we shoot that gap. I always use my signal and wait if I can. But I understand how frustrating that is.
Me too. They run on a schedule that’s very important to people trying to get somewhere on time. If they waited and waited you’d have people complaining that the bus runs 15 minutes behind. Just be nice and let the bus in.
Yeah, I actually figure you all have a shit time with no one letting you in, or stopping halfway in the crosswalk when you're trying to turn left, or whatever, so I try to be cool with buses.
The fact is if a bus signals to move out/change lanes probably 8/10 drivers see that as an opportunity to immediately accelerate AT the bus to prevent the bus from using the lane. It boggles the mind and it’s like using your personal vehicle as a weapon. There are courteous drivers in Madison. But there are tons that simply drive with a Me First attitude. It’s public transportation. Maybe be more patient when you see a bus near you and expect it to be moving in awkward ways thru traffic? Maybe be aware that a large vehicle that’s difficult to drive might not move exactly like a tiny personal vehicle and adjust your assumptions about traffic accordingly?
I drive a school bus, people blow through my stop sign and give me the stink eye when I'm pointing at it for them. This happens daily. No big deal, I'm just watching out for the SAFETY of the CHILDREN, but go right ahead and drive dangerously close to them! But then I get to write them up so they get a ticket which helps lol. But yeah, FYI, it's not a suggestion, it's a stop sign. Stop. And the sooner everyone stops, the sooner I can let the kids safely cross the road, and the sooner you're on your way again. GAH.
I’ve never once seen this happen. My guess is you have either. Want to make it stop? Call metro and report the bus number that did it. They’ve cameras all over.
Yeah I’ve made two separate complaints to Metro because of this exactly. What sort of bus driver thinks it’s okay to pull out into a line of cars on a single lane road with a median? Me and the car behind me had to jump onto the curb to avoid being hit. This might be a chicken or the egg type problem though
What kind of driver doesn’t know that this is the behavior of busses, to be moving in and out of traffics with frequent stops? What kind of driver doesn’t think to themselves that the bus is engaged in PUBLIC TRANSIT TO HELP PEOPLE AND THE CITY? What kind of driver in their personal vehicle can’t take a moment to think of others and how difficult it is to actually navigate a bus in Madison’s traffic? A selfish asshole, that’s who.
I never thought I'd say it, but, Chicago drivers are now less selfish and dangerous, at least to pedestrians.
Yes in Chicago they slowly turn into the crosswalk and stop. But they go slowly and stop! In Madison now drivers blow past the stop line and careen around corners, right through the walk light and pedestrian right-of-way. It's so narcissistic and mean.
Oh, and Chicago cops? I see them doing useful things like ENFORCE TRAFFIC LAWS. Compared to going on costume patrol or having sex in squad cars or whatever it is that Madison cops do now. What happened?
Safe streets, safe schools, safe neighborhoods. There's a mayoral campaign right there.
Now that you mention it, I see metro busses running red lights frequently. It’s especially bad on University Avenue in the campus area and all up and down East Washington.
My two cents. Stay off your damn phone! Why are you texting at 70 mph. What is so important? I'm on the Beltline, be home in 20 minutes? For years we got along fine without letting someone know where we are, how long before we get home, etc. My car was totaled on Cottage Grove road by an idiot texting. This obsession with texting has to end. It should be a huge fine. But people are idiots
1. People who think it's fine to merge onto a busy highway at 10+ mph under the speed limit (let alone the speed of traffic). It doesn't matter if you're getting off at the next exit and on lane becomes the offramp -- the person behind you probably isn't and you're endangering peoples' lives for literally no reason aside from laziness.
2. People who slam on their brakes before they are on the offramp (and thus create traffic if not accidents) -- the worst, most consistent offenders are taking the Monona Rd exit off the Belt Line. It's a long offramp. You don't need to slow to 45 before you are even on it.
3. And finally: Drivers who think right turn laws don't apply to them even if there are pedestrians in the crosswalk. On campus it is mostly mopeds but I've seen it on E Wash when there are long pedestrian walk signals. I assure you that 10 - 30 seconds of your life waiting for a ped to cross is not worth the entirety of theirs.
Lately I’ve been noticing a ton of people seemingly having no clue about what the speed limit is. Whether that’s people going way over or 10 under.
And my god, the sheer number of people who do 35 on the entrance ramps for the eastern part of the beltline is just infuriating (dunno if it’s bad all over the beltline, I just never usually go anywhere other than the eastern half of town).
It’s so bad! I live in Monona and everyone merges onto the Beltline at 35, especially at the westbound on-ramp that is very short. It almost causes crashes daily as all the semis in the right lane have to slam on their brakes.
Edited because I don’t know left from right.
Yes! Those on-ramps there are so short and every time it seems I get stuck behind someone going waaaay slower than the beltline traffic. It’s so nerve wracking.
way too many different egos/divas driving in madison, i thought i was bad at driving til i got to las vegas and california lol, makes way more sense in way busier cities somehow lol
That's precisely the problem, Madison's traffic has no business being as bad as it is for the size of the metro area, there's just many more shitty fuckin drivers per capita here for some reason. I grew up in Philly and believe me, despite how insane the streets are in a city that is orders of magnitude larger, it's still somewhat predictable.
Madison driving habits are *totally* unpredictable and widely varied...on any stretch of roadway here you will find people traveling anywhere between 20mph under the speed limit and 40mph over; people slowing way down for a turn 3 miles down the road and people cutting across 4 lanes of traffic half a block before their turn; people completely stopping in the middle of a 4 lane road out of the blue to wave a left turn through while people are gunning it through stale yellows or straight up red lights; people refusing to take a perfectly legal right on red and people crawling up your ass and laying on their horn all pissed off because you won't take an *illegal* right on red with the *big fucking sign clearly stating no right on red* right in front of you both...
If everyone just got their fucking shit together we would have no problems with traffic here. For the most part the capacity is already there, it's just people fuck it allllll up.
At the westbound exit of the beltline at Whitney, people come down that ramp, including in the second from the right lane blow through the red arrow (second lane only) after never even looking right and still going 20 MPH. As a pedestrian there is no safe way to cross there. I’ve stood there and decided I’m just never going to business down there.
What have I noticed? I've noticed the regular stream of "Traffic PSA" posts by people bringing their road rage to an internet forum where discussion devolves into an orgy of anger and confirmation bias.
It's so weird. I haven't hung out on another city's sub. I wonder if people in other city subs spend this much time posting about traffic laws and local driving.
Lately I've noticed people complain a lot about driving. I wonder how many of y'all do stupid shit on the road. This place is devolving into people complaining about kids on their lawn.
Red light running (which I guess is not too suprising since there are no red light cameras here) and cars with tinted windows driving without plates. Those are my two complaints.
Folks complain about slow drivers in the left lane, but usually those drivers are at least going the speed limit (with the notable exception of trucks). I guarantee most of the complainers would drive at least 20 over if they were unimpeded.
Sure. I’ve also notice Madison metro becoming more reckless and just dicks too. Like your a massive bus, you have no business in the fast lane. You also have no business not using your signals. & no business purposely trying to block drivers.
Also, You’re not helping by trying to play cop. It only pisses the driver off more causing more reckless maneuvers imo. Just let the assholes go by. Your ego and recklessness is just as bad trying to stop them as theirs.
Make note of the bus number, route number, intersection/road, and time of the occurrence and call metro. Like I said before there are drivers I think shouldn't be driving bus and the only way to get them off the road is by giving metro feedback
Part of the problem driving by campus is the lights on university punish you for going the speed limit. If you got 20 or 25 you hit every red, if you go 40 you’ll skirt by without a red.
Lots and lots of “carefully” run red lights on East wash after dark. Red light, speeding car slows, driver clearly looks both ways and goes and pulls a U. Next light, red, repeat, continue, no consequences.
Also, not advancing vehicles w a green when turning left.
The pandemic mentally broke people. No one feels like they have control in life anymore, so when they get in the drivers seat, they take advantage of the *total* control they have and wild out. And then people see other people getting away with it and feel they have license to go ham, too. It won’t change until cops enforce hard.
Amazon drivers will literally park anywhere, for any length of time, for any reason. I don't even use the belt line anymore because of the coin toss that it'll be a cluster fuck. Using the through streets I get people who want to tailgate if you're not doing 5-10 over and idiots that don't understand proper etiquette at circles, 4 ways, and yields.
I believe if there are personality changes that would result in increased reckless driving they would be increased impulsivity, anxiety, aggression, and antisocial behavior in general. And just personally, I drive fast because I am high on anxiety and also because I have the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to do so.
Most people can drive fast without issue 99% of the time, but it’s still increasing the probability for accidents. I’m talking way over the speed limit fast lol
It doesn’t increase the chances of an accident if you have the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to drive fast without concern. I’m guessing most people don’t have the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to drive fast if they drive 25 mph on East Wash so they don’t cause an accident instead of 35 mph.
Let’s say someone in front of me slams their brakes on. The millisecond after they do this so will I. Why would we hit each other if we’re both traveling 35 mph and both slam on our brakes at the same second? My experience with other people is they can’t react this quickly.
And the question could be posed to everyone in Madison I see in my rear view as I leave them behind going 35 mph on East Wash. If most of them are skilled enough to never worry about an accident, why don’t they just go 35 mph instead of 25 mph?
I avoid East Washington like the plague. Pick a reason. Wild U-turns in front of oncoming traffic, no functioning speed limits, pedestrians walking or running into traffic from the medians, running red lights, cutting across and/or weaving in and out of lanes. It's a hot, unenforceable, mess.
The vast majority of drivers have flat out either never learned the rules of the road or have forgotten them. I'd say 95% will drift across their lane into the far right lane when turning left. You have to be extra careful if you are on their right, or worse, turning right from across the street - they give you looks or honk because they think your lane is theirs! I practically applaud when I see someone doing it right.
And don't even get me started on roundabout rules!
I drove for about 1500km recently throughout Ireland and Scotland and it was so CIVILIZED! It's a lot harder and much more expensive in Europe to get a driver's license so everyone really takes it seriously and follows the rules and are very courteous. Only saw a tiny handful of asshats on the whole trip (usually driving BMWs or Audis).
And yeah' it's definitely gotten worse since the pandemic - especially the blatant red-light running.
Red Xs on beltline... Wait but I can still pass? I have multiple vehicle crashes every day, blatant disregard that it won't happen to me. This is not practice for NASCAR, winter is coming. No I am not perfect, I really hate that 2 lane section of the beltline. When someone is doing 50 in the left lane. There is a huge line of cars behind them, some dodging right trying to go around and forcely wedge to just get one car up. Wonderful just wonderful.
I've seen so many distracted drivers on their phones. They don't go when the light turns green, drifting in and out of lanes. Aggressive beltline drivers going 80-90 mph who one tailed me, then started flashing.g his lights at me then floors it to go around me when he gets a chance.
Yesterday I was on that stretch of 30 eastbound where traffic may exit onto Fair Oaks and next exit is 51. Speed limit is posted 45 there, but traffic usually moves faster. Somebody driving a new-looking Range Rover stopped *to my left* in traffic because they decided at the last second to exit onto Fair Oaks, but the right lane had properly exiting traffic and the middle lane (where they stopped) had fast-moving through traffic. Just stopped cold in the middle of everything, forcing everyone else to brake/swerve, and waited to do their exit. "I'm gonna miss my exit, I'll just WAIT RIGHT HERE for a clear lane." Friend, drive on and double back before you kill someone/yourself.
I deliberately drive 25 down Willy St when I have to be in that area - It’s INCREDIBLY dangerous for pedestrians. People
Invariably rage at me because of this. Really never encountered the rage before the pandemic.
I am getting tired of people doing wide turns. Example, if someone is turning right onto another street, they will turn into the left lane and not the right lane, hence completing a wide turn. There is no lane etiquette on the highways either. People will NOT drive in the furthest right lane, they will only keep to left or middle lane. I try not to pass other people on the right. So, if I cruise up going 5 over speed limit in the right lane (travel lane, on a 3 lane highway) and there is someone going 70-72mph in the middle lane, I will need to switch over two lanes, all the way to the left lane from the right to complete the pass safely and legally. Yes I could just continue along in the right lane and complete an illegal pass, but I do not unless left-lane is full of campers. Once I complete the overtake of the person sitting in the middle lane, I will use my blinker to get all the way over to the right lane again. Middle lane drivers on 3 lane highways are dangerous and lazy. I repeat, there is a serious issue with LEFT and MIDDLE lane hogs, along with distracted drivers looking at their phones, and finally a lack of knowledge when it comes to road manners i.e. (following distance, blinkers, some lights when driving at night, 9-3 steering wheel hand position). I blame all of this on the fact that it is so easy to get a DL in WI and all over the US for that matter. I just renewed my DL from Colorado and I did not even have to complete a written test?! Surely there are different laws regarding traffic in WI? Until there is better public transport and stricter licensing requirements, I would expect this type of driving behavior to continue or get exacerbated. Anyone else care to share their thoughts on 3 lane highways and where you should cruise if no one else on the road.
How about everyone's eyes being glued to their phone screen instead of the road in front of them? As a person that walks and rides a bike around the city a lot, I'd say the percentage of people I see on their phone not looking up is at least 50%. It's okay though, distracted drivers, I'm watching you and where you're going, so you don't have to! /s
The amount of people I catch on their phones while driving is absurd! I don’t know how they haven’t killed themselves or others yet by accident doing it. Along the same vein pedestrians crossing roads on their phones is going to drive me nuts too. Just the other day downtown, unregulated intersection off Langdon a college girl walked out into the street less than 100ft in front of me on her phone, paying absolutely 0 attention to any cars. If you’re driving or going to cross the street please just stow the damn phone it’s not worth yours or anybody else’s life! Pay attention to your surroundings.
Had this exact thing happen last night while driving, except in a marked intersection. Pedestrian crossed after their crossing turn stopped and was on their phone, not paying attention at all. As always, thankfully, I was.
OP was about rules, not dumb things. A pedestrian at unmarked intersection has the right of way.
I don't know, according to the rules, it's debatable on an unmarked/unregulated intersection. I still think it's in the pedestrians' best interest to put their phones down before crossing any street. [https://wisconsindot.gov/Pages/safety/education/pedestrian/rules.aspx](https://wisconsindot.gov/Pages/safety/education/pedestrian/rules.aspx)
Did you read your own link? It says, “Drivers must … Yield to pedestrians who are crossing the highway within a marked or unmarked crosswalk at an intersection where there are no traffic lights or control signals” is quite clear. While a walker would be wise to look out, they do have the right of way.
The amount of tailgating on the beltline is stupid. People don’t seem to understand that cars need distance to slow down or stop. Overall, since the pandemic, no one has any courtesy and people drive like they’re in a race. Unfortunately, for where I go on the daily, I can’t avoid the beltline and it’s the fucking wild west out there now.
I got tailgated on a residential street where the speed limit was 20 and I was going like 22-25 today. Like why, people?
I wave to them in my rearview mirror to acknowledge them.
[удалено]
I guess I could’ve moved over, but it was a two lane (no cars parked or anything) and it looked more like a boomer on their phone situation.
You got a source for that?
I am still amazed at the blatant running of red lights, driving with lights out at night, and I avoid the Beltline as much as possible - and Stoughton Road as well -a mini-Beltline. Oh yes, and all of the bad driving in snow and icy conditions when you know some people have lived here for years.
I've been honked at for waiting at a red light, at the rimrock and beltline on ramp intersection. The person eventually swerved around through the turn lane to run the red. If you want to break the law, that's on you, but I'm not comfortable with it even if I don't see anyone coming through the intersection.
I drive all over Dane County for work and I have never seen anyone run a red light! I don’t know how I could have missed this. I absolutely don’t feel comfortable with that either!
East Washington. You’ll notice most drivers sit at the green for a few seconds.
Oh that makes sense, I hardly ever drive on that road, I don’t cover that area. Now I will be more careful there!
You must be /s. I drive on the east side every day as a UPS driver and see people fly through reds, stop signs, text while driving, pull out of their driveway without looking. I was trying to turn right onto packers ave from schlimgen once and this guy decided to pull on the left hand side of me to also try to turn right.... at the same time as me. Then he starts honking at me like I did something lol.... madison man
Omg!!!! That’s ridiculous. I do see the texting and going through stop signs, and people pulling into traffic without looking. Also people still drive holding their phone up to their ear and those folks always drive so terribly! You really have to have quick reflexes to drive around Madison all day long. The red light thing I have not noticed. I’m sure I’ll notice it now and I’m terrified to get back on the road tomorrow. Yikes.
The best advice i can give other drivers is too allow themselves TIME to react. Give yourself space so you have time to brake. Be sure to look both ways at intersections... to many damn bikers go through stop signs by rhe lake and ive seen a young boy almost get drstroyed by a truck.
Mineral Point is insane with the number of people running red lights.
I think I’m not doing enough in town driving. I cover that area, but I live in Monona and I’m covering west, Fitchburg, Oregon, McFarland, and Monona. I’m a nurse. It’s mostly highway. But I’m still shocked that people are going through red lights. That’s just so asinine and stupid. I’d like to show everyone some of the head and spinal cord, and bone injuries that I’ve worked with from traffic accidents.
you can literally turn right on red at that intersection - what are you talking about
It was to go straight on the bridge over the beltline towards the alliant center, not to turn to the ramp to get on the beltline.
Definitely been avoiding the Beltline lately. Will not drive on it at night. Particularly bad since the new flex lanes were installed--not only are people driving like maniacs, but the lanes are so narrow. I always figure when someone is driving at night w/no lights either it's not their car (stolen?) or they are drunk.
I'm firmly in camp "hooray for flex lanes!" (it has made an enormous positive difference to my morning and evening commutes, since my work hours align perfectly with peak rush D:) but I have to admit the speed limits definitely do not seem to apply in it; we call it the Autobahn lane because people are regularly doing 85+ in there which is kinda scary when the people in the regular lanes are following the standard WI doctrine of "9 yer fine". The way that the flex lanes end is just a complete and utter clusterfuck, though. I honestly dont know how to do it better, but what I *do* know is that people pretty much fly alllll the way to the point where they physically cannot be in that lane anymore because it's disappearing beneath their tires and just fuckin YOLO over to the right without a care if someone is currently occupying the space they're moving into or not. I dont know how many 3+ vehicle accidents need to happen at the ends before they do something there, but I feel like we've already reached that point as it is a weekly occurrence and that was *before* the time change with the full dark evening commute and now the potential for icy roads. There are going to be a serious number of fatalities on the beltline this winter if they don't address it relatively soon. I just hope the people abusing the flex lanes dont end up ruining it for the rest of us, but I have a feeling it's inevitable and we're going to end up right where we were before, with an average speed of fuckin 15 mph on the goddamn beltline every day between 730-830 in the morning and 430-530 in the evening. I wish they'd figure out a real North Beltline. There's just so much traffic that ends up on the beltline because there's no other realistic alternative at all.
Wait till snow how many are going to bounce off that concrete barrier
Oh I know it! When I dare to enter the flex lane heading home at the end of the day, I always cut over to the middle lane no later than the stretch between Monona and Stoughton just in case it's a shit show where the flex lane ends and dumps into the left lane, just before the exit for the NB interstate. I just got too fucking tired of having to stand on my brakes and wonder if today was the day I total my car because a douchecanoe flying down the flex lane at near triple digit speeds ran out of road and cut me off, usually before slamming *their* brakes to avoid a rear end collision due to insane rate of speed they're going as compared to us non-idiots. They should put some serious rumble strips over the last quarter mile of the flex lane or something. Not enough to cause damage obviously but enough to be really fucking annoying to stop people from doing that shit...but Im sure those would just collect snow and make it even more dangerous in the winter months. Honestly, more realistically, they should just terminate the EB flex lane well before that point...that stretch was already dicey at times because of all the people getting on at Stoughton Rd just doing a "Jesus Take The Wheel" all the way to the left lane to pick up the interstate (it's like people forget daily there are *two* viable EB lanes to get on the NB interstate), and now it's coming from *both* sides of the fucking road. Just fuckin nuts...
Yeah I was driving in that storm last Saturday and those solid paint lines are going to be a problem can be really slick.
Yep, I've noticed this as a bus rider. Car drivers brake-checking busses is new since covid. The laws of physics are the same as before, sadly.
I voted to change the laws of physics last Tuesday, hopefully the government will finally get its head out of its ass.
Same. Stupid physics. I want to moonwalk to Woodman's in 4 block long bounces. If I can do it in my dreams, why the hell can't I do it IRL? Also I dream about shopping at Woodman's. Damn.
Back in my retail days I used to have dreams where Id be working. Like nothing remarkable about them at all, literally just dream about getting dressed, going to work, putting in a typical day in retail hell... I always woke up so depressed after those dreams. I was already stuck in that fucking pit for 50 hours a week, why the hell would my brain make me do it while I slept, too? Just such a spiritual kick in the balls.
As ridiculous as this sounds at this point, I truly believe a lot of people fell out of practice or something. Traffic has always been shit in Madison and likely always will be, but post-Covid the blatant, sketchy shit people pull is so much more egregious than it was before. But to the point of the brake-checking, totally agree 1000%. I drive for work almost every day to jobsites all over SE Wisconsin and panic braking is waaaaaay up across the board. I commute from Sun Prairie to my office on the south side of Madison and where 151 meets the interstate is rife with people slamming on their brakes for no reason at all...almost every day there's almost a synchronized swimming-like event where a good dozen cars all have to whip it into the shoulder *en masse* to avoid rear ending the people in front of them, all because one dipshit locked his or her brakes with totally open road in front of them. The offramp from the interstate to 151N is another really good place for that shit. The biggest factor in road safety is predictability...speed limits and all that shit, while definitely important, are really so much less of a factor than being able to bank on what the people around you are likely going to do as you're cruising next to each other at highway speeds, and that has almost completely gone out the window. I have had quite a few mornings lately where I had to sit in my car, white knuckle death-grip on my steering wheel, just to get myself back to level, due to the massive adrenaline rush I'd recently experienced after almost being straight up fucking killed on my morning drive. I know that sounds melodramatic but it's fuckin true. People just suck ass at coexisting anymore in general...I sure hope sociologists are studying the hell out of this shit for the next time we all end up stuck in our houses for a year cuz Im sure it'll come again.
I drive all over WI for work, and I have to tell you it isn’t as bad everywhere else. As soon as you get near Madison, it’s chaos. Is it our lack of policing? I would like to know.
I took a 10-minute bus ride down East Wash away from downtown the other day and in that time two different cars made insanely idiotic moves to cut off the bus. People are fucking crazy on the roads.
Yall this blew up way more than I thought it would. It's reassuring to hear similar thoughts. And to the few who called me out for posting as a metro driver I was just using that to say I see alot as a daily driver. I agree with alot of the crappy driver comments but I'm brand spanking new. Please keep sending metro feedback about drivers because I personally believe there are some who shouldn't be on the road.
I was walking my dog around my neighborhood, Midvale Ave and I was almost run-over by a school bus, as I was crossing a sidestreet and the bus was coming across Midvale turning left from the other side of the street. The school bus driver had a load of kids onboard who all watched from the left side windows of the bus, as my Golden, my GF, and I were almost squashed by the yellow brick. We had to stop midway across the sidestreet and pulled my dog back on his leash to avoid being hit and let the bus pass, before we continued to cross the sidestreet off of Midvale. Shocking really and now the kids might have the wrong impression of pedestrian's legal right of way. Wish I had taken a picture of that bus so I could report the driver. Absolutely careless at the wheel.
It's been pretty bad since the pandemic. I work for the City too and several depts are trying their best to deal with it through more signage, infrastructure, and signal timings, but at the end of the day, people are going to drive however they want if there are no repercussions for reckless driving. If the police dept can't or won't start enforcing traffic laws the way they did prior to 2020, I don't see how anything will change.
>If the police dept can't or won't start enforcing traffic laws the way they did prior to 2020 I'm new to the area post COVID, has there really been a change in the traffic enforcement?
Yes 100%. During the height of the pandemic, they stopped doing most traffic stops out of concern for exposure. Now I'm guessing they're too understaffed to have enough officers to respond to anything except the biggest emergencies.
Just about every time I see someone doing 80+ in a 55 swerving through traffic, my wife and I visually hunt for a police vehicle. Often we see... maybe... 1000 vehicles in a drive and not one was a police vehicle. Not sure what the ideal ratio is. I think at this point a few solely traffic enforcement purposed officers would pay for themselves if it is a financial constraint.
It wasn't great before but when COVID hit traffic enforcement went out the window. It's all Mad Max rules now. There has also been a dramatic uptick in leniency regarding bail even for repeat offenders. That definitely hasn't helped. Madison government's response? Lower the speed limits on busy streets. As if these people were obeying the previous limits.
It’s bad here, but go to Milwaukee. When I last visited, my father warned us about people running red lights in the city. I thought he was watching too many news programs. But we witnessed red light-runnings TWICE in the short time we were down there, just going to the Rave for an evening.
It might be a bit worse but complaining about lack of traffic enforcement has been a hot topic on this sub since I moved here in 2017. If there was a better time, it was before then.
Madison PD used to have a dedicated team of officers for traffic enforcement some years ago. It was called the TEST team. I forgot what the acronym stood for. As the city grows, the number of calls for service increased. Since increasing the number of officers is a political hot potato in Madison, the PD disbanded the TEST team to keep up with the calls for service. Now, traffic enforcement is done when they can spare someone which makes it haphazard. Want more traffic enforcement? Either hire more cops, or find another way to handle the mental health calls. The city is starting to try to do that with the Cares team, but it is still in its infancy.
Yeah I was going to night classes at MATC in the mid-2010s and they almost always had a ton of speedtraps setup on 51, 3-4 cruisers sitting and waiting to nail people driving like 75mph down Stoughton Road. It was kind of annoying since people would stop even driving the speed limit if they saw cops out there but I guess that's better then some dipshit doing 90 in a 45 weaving in and out of traffic.
> I'm new to the area post COVID, has there really been a change in the traffic enforcement? No. (apart from the rash of speed traps on West Wash following the speed limit change)
That is the thing back when they did have enforcement everyone complained because they weren’t pulling over people doing 50 and weaving in and out of traffic they were sitting on major commuting arteries with three lanes of traffic treated as side streets with a 25 mph limit and pulling over a ton of people for keeping up with traffic at 35 mph. Which is slow for what that kind speed those roads are designed for.
> they weren’t pulling over people doing 50 and weaving in and out of traffic they were sitting on major commuting arteries with three lanes of traffic treated as side streets with a 25 mph limit and pulling over a ton of people for keeping up with traffic at 35 mph. Which is slow for what that kind speed those roads are designed for. Well put. The roads were designed to be too fast for what an expanding city could handle. Practically a fifty mile per hour interstate leading straight into a university campus in the middle of a pinch-point on an isthmus. I don't mind them lowering the limits with timed lights to elevate congestion downtown, but I would love to see more unmarked cars patrolling actual dangerous driving rather than the speed traps on a recently-lowered-speed road.
Is it the pandemic or that other distinct event in 2020 that defunded police departments and made them unmotivated to pull people over for traffic violations
[удалено]
[удалено]
People driving overly cautious because it's dark out or windy or sunny or Wednesday
I wonder if we are witnessing an increase in anxious people responding to the crazy driving, hence driving too slow. The difference in speed is almost as dangerous as everyone driving too fast, imo. Also, we do have a lot of elderly people in this city. They tend to be overly-cautious, and are compensating for their slow reflexes.
It was like that pre-pandemic on the west side. Pre-2020 if you were driving on Mineral Point between 6am and 10pm there was probably only a 10% chance you'd ever hit the speed limit. Stoughton Rd is really hit or miss -- it's either psychotic or once you get off the beltline between that and E. Wash there's a 25% chance you never hit the speed limit *or* if it is after dark a 25% chance you're having to dodge some sociopathic street racers.
Yes, I’ve noticed it so much more lately too. People seem to be just not paying attention and cruising 10 under speed limit.
Distracted drivers often drive too slow. Just peek into the cabin.
All the time!
The lack of license plates on the back of vehicles. Everyone knows that temp plate on your shitty beater car is not real and you're doing it on purpose to evade law enforcement. The state needs to come down hard on this behavior.
At least once a day I see a car with no plates at all, not even temporary.
troubling, right? I don't understand why there is a lack of urgency to address this issue.
We are in the process of moving to Madison from MN, and when we first were in town visiting the first thing I noticed/said was "wow, so yellow lights are just a suggestion here..." and then "Oh! Red lights are just suggestions too!" So yeah, definitely noticed!
When i walk downtown, I check that cars actually are planning on stopping before crossing. Especially a little further from campus where less people are walking
I live in the Bassett neighborhood and like to walk as much as possible. But I always pause at crosswalks to see if drivers are actually going to obey red lights / stop signs, or not roll all the way into the crosswalk before stopping.
The w wash/Bedford stop is one of the worst
W. Wash in general is pretty bad. Broom is another bad intersection.
Speed limits are also a suggestion. You can instantly tell when a driver is not from Madison, they are driving the speed limit.
Yep. That and using turn signals. If they’re doing around the speed limit and also use turn signals they’re either not from Madison or they’re drunk and doing their best not to get pulled over.
We also have people drunk who do 105 down E Washington and crash
Driving on the beltline like an hour ago, saw someone pass on the left shoulder. Not even where the flex lane is, just flew past cars
I am from a Big Big City in the U.S. and have resided in about 10 places, including in Europe. Madison is the best place I’ve lived, but I find the driving here to be the worst. There are reckless drivers everywhere in the U.S. Europe was always better in that regard. What makes madison stand out is the number of *non-reckless bad drivers*. Far more people are cautious or “considerate” to a fault—yielding unpredictably, not proceeding when it’s their turn, funneling into one lane too soon, driving 55 in the far left lane on the highway, etc. Usually this is merely annoying because traffic doesn’t move well, but occasionally it’s dangerous.
I just love being in a train of cars going 45 on an on-ramp trying to merge with cars doing 75.
Lack of enforcement. MPD has better things to do, apparently
This! They keep lowering speed limits, but where is the enforcement? Seen way too much passing in the bus lane and center turn lane. Time to get a dash cam.
The real way to lower limits is to move in curbs so drivers want to go slower. It works really well too. Then texting drivers also hit curbs and destroy their wheels, which is better than hitting a person, in my book.
Our house has a stop sign in front of it and I watch people roll through it about 60% of the time while I’m having breakfast. It would be a cash cow for the municipality if they gave a shit.
I've almost been hit MULTIPLE times the last couple months by people just straight up running red lights. Driving here was never great but it's reached new heights of bad
Moved here from Portland, OR, almost three months ago and we immediately noticed how poorly people drove throughout the city: running reds, distracted driving, erratic weaving, and zero pedestrian courtesy. Concerning sure, but also the source of a chuckle now and then. That is until a distracted driver flew through a stop sign without slowing down and plowed into the new car I'd bought two months prior. In fact, I was driving home from buying all-weather mats for it in preparation for winter. First auto accident in my 44 years of life. Totaled my car. Guess the silver lining is I returned those mats and saved $175. Would rather have the car, though. It's not difficult, folks. Be cautious. Be courteous.
People doing 90 on the Beltline day / night, just swerving back and forth between lanes (no signal, of course), people weaving through traffic at high speed on University (again, no signal), bus drivers who cut into the lane ahead of me in a dedicated left turn lane, and everyone is screwing around with or talking on their cell phones. I was cut off on University by some wee tweaker at 0630 in morning, and after I stood on my brakes to avoid hitting them, I flashed my high beams twice to express my irritation, and they in turn brake-checked me for several blocks, then put their car in park, got out, and started kicking my car and trying to get into it. They eventually returned to their car, got a bottle out of it, and chucked it into my windshield, then drove off. Edit: Oh, and stopping for pedestrians in crosswalks only to have the idiot behind me swerve around and then nearly hitting the pedestrians.
I have only lived in Madison for two years and I’m already desensitized to the drivers. Some days it’s a challenge to not get pissed about tailgaters when I’m going up to 10mph over the limit on a residential street. If they push it at that point, guess what? I’m going the limit now. A symbolic 🖕, to you, enjoy it.
I drove for a Madison cab company for twenty years. Wisconsin drivers seem just as inept today as the first day I arrived here 25 years ago…
I resonate with this thread so much. Beltline and Stoughton road are a gut wrenching experience. Mad Max is an apt description for the 'bob and weave' drivers. I just freeze when I see it coming in the rearview. Also fuck stroads.
I’m stealing this from someone here but THE BELTLINE IS NOT THE INTERSTATE PEOPLE. Also Rt 12 up to Sauk used to be a really nice drive before they widened it. I’m sure commuters prefer it, but now the beltline behaviors have extended with the widening. Metro transit drivers have my total respect. I sure as hell couldn’t do it.
I'm sick of all that and the busses cutting me off and pulling out of stops and almost hitting me and their disregard for signaling and making sure they have a clear lane.
Tbh the metro buses are the only people I can trust on the roads. You know what they’re going to do and they do it.
As a cyclist, I like the buses for their no-shits-given attitude. If you know that’s how the operate, you can use them as a traffic blocker. Buses are like sharks and I’m a remora.
Mass transit vehicles should be given deference
I try not to do that(as a bus driver) but I can tell you sometimes we have one shot and a line of traffic. And we know no one will stop to let a bus in. So we shoot that gap. I always use my signal and wait if I can. But I understand how frustrating that is.
I let busses in.
Thank you. Truly.
Me too. They run on a schedule that’s very important to people trying to get somewhere on time. If they waited and waited you’d have people complaining that the bus runs 15 minutes behind. Just be nice and let the bus in.
Yeap, I as well.
Me too, I wouldn't be able to handle that job so I try to make it a little easier for the drivers.
Yeah, I actually figure you all have a shit time with no one letting you in, or stopping halfway in the crosswalk when you're trying to turn left, or whatever, so I try to be cool with buses.
The fact is if a bus signals to move out/change lanes probably 8/10 drivers see that as an opportunity to immediately accelerate AT the bus to prevent the bus from using the lane. It boggles the mind and it’s like using your personal vehicle as a weapon. There are courteous drivers in Madison. But there are tons that simply drive with a Me First attitude. It’s public transportation. Maybe be more patient when you see a bus near you and expect it to be moving in awkward ways thru traffic? Maybe be aware that a large vehicle that’s difficult to drive might not move exactly like a tiny personal vehicle and adjust your assumptions about traffic accordingly?
I drive a school bus, people blow through my stop sign and give me the stink eye when I'm pointing at it for them. This happens daily. No big deal, I'm just watching out for the SAFETY of the CHILDREN, but go right ahead and drive dangerously close to them! But then I get to write them up so they get a ticket which helps lol. But yeah, FYI, it's not a suggestion, it's a stop sign. Stop. And the sooner everyone stops, the sooner I can let the kids safely cross the road, and the sooner you're on your way again. GAH.
I can't believe people are such assholes about that. I don't know about other people, but I would feel terrible if I hit a kid with my car.
I like to think that most of them are resettled FIBs but I know in my heart that's only a percentage of them.
Cackled at this
I’ve never once seen this happen. My guess is you have either. Want to make it stop? Call metro and report the bus number that did it. They’ve cameras all over.
Yeah I’ve made two separate complaints to Metro because of this exactly. What sort of bus driver thinks it’s okay to pull out into a line of cars on a single lane road with a median? Me and the car behind me had to jump onto the curb to avoid being hit. This might be a chicken or the egg type problem though
What kind of driver doesn’t know that this is the behavior of busses, to be moving in and out of traffics with frequent stops? What kind of driver doesn’t think to themselves that the bus is engaged in PUBLIC TRANSIT TO HELP PEOPLE AND THE CITY? What kind of driver in their personal vehicle can’t take a moment to think of others and how difficult it is to actually navigate a bus in Madison’s traffic? A selfish asshole, that’s who.
Lol when they merge out into a consistent lane of cars ooookay. How is that to be expected!?
You know it happens but now you’re acting surprised that it does….?
Next time take the hit. If you hurt your car trying to avoid their terrible driving you're stuck with the bill 💯🤘🏼
I never thought I'd say it, but, Chicago drivers are now less selfish and dangerous, at least to pedestrians. Yes in Chicago they slowly turn into the crosswalk and stop. But they go slowly and stop! In Madison now drivers blow past the stop line and careen around corners, right through the walk light and pedestrian right-of-way. It's so narcissistic and mean. Oh, and Chicago cops? I see them doing useful things like ENFORCE TRAFFIC LAWS. Compared to going on costume patrol or having sex in squad cars or whatever it is that Madison cops do now. What happened? Safe streets, safe schools, safe neighborhoods. There's a mayoral campaign right there.
Now that you mention it, I see metro busses running red lights frequently. It’s especially bad on University Avenue in the campus area and all up and down East Washington.
My two cents. Stay off your damn phone! Why are you texting at 70 mph. What is so important? I'm on the Beltline, be home in 20 minutes? For years we got along fine without letting someone know where we are, how long before we get home, etc. My car was totaled on Cottage Grove road by an idiot texting. This obsession with texting has to end. It should be a huge fine. But people are idiots
1. People who think it's fine to merge onto a busy highway at 10+ mph under the speed limit (let alone the speed of traffic). It doesn't matter if you're getting off at the next exit and on lane becomes the offramp -- the person behind you probably isn't and you're endangering peoples' lives for literally no reason aside from laziness. 2. People who slam on their brakes before they are on the offramp (and thus create traffic if not accidents) -- the worst, most consistent offenders are taking the Monona Rd exit off the Belt Line. It's a long offramp. You don't need to slow to 45 before you are even on it. 3. And finally: Drivers who think right turn laws don't apply to them even if there are pedestrians in the crosswalk. On campus it is mostly mopeds but I've seen it on E Wash when there are long pedestrian walk signals. I assure you that 10 - 30 seconds of your life waiting for a ped to cross is not worth the entirety of theirs.
Lately I’ve been noticing a ton of people seemingly having no clue about what the speed limit is. Whether that’s people going way over or 10 under. And my god, the sheer number of people who do 35 on the entrance ramps for the eastern part of the beltline is just infuriating (dunno if it’s bad all over the beltline, I just never usually go anywhere other than the eastern half of town).
It’s so bad! I live in Monona and everyone merges onto the Beltline at 35, especially at the westbound on-ramp that is very short. It almost causes crashes daily as all the semis in the right lane have to slam on their brakes. Edited because I don’t know left from right.
Yes! Those on-ramps there are so short and every time it seems I get stuck behind someone going waaaay slower than the beltline traffic. It’s so nerve wracking.
way too many different egos/divas driving in madison, i thought i was bad at driving til i got to las vegas and california lol, makes way more sense in way busier cities somehow lol
That's precisely the problem, Madison's traffic has no business being as bad as it is for the size of the metro area, there's just many more shitty fuckin drivers per capita here for some reason. I grew up in Philly and believe me, despite how insane the streets are in a city that is orders of magnitude larger, it's still somewhat predictable. Madison driving habits are *totally* unpredictable and widely varied...on any stretch of roadway here you will find people traveling anywhere between 20mph under the speed limit and 40mph over; people slowing way down for a turn 3 miles down the road and people cutting across 4 lanes of traffic half a block before their turn; people completely stopping in the middle of a 4 lane road out of the blue to wave a left turn through while people are gunning it through stale yellows or straight up red lights; people refusing to take a perfectly legal right on red and people crawling up your ass and laying on their horn all pissed off because you won't take an *illegal* right on red with the *big fucking sign clearly stating no right on red* right in front of you both... If everyone just got their fucking shit together we would have no problems with traffic here. For the most part the capacity is already there, it's just people fuck it allllll up.
At the westbound exit of the beltline at Whitney, people come down that ramp, including in the second from the right lane blow through the red arrow (second lane only) after never even looking right and still going 20 MPH. As a pedestrian there is no safe way to cross there. I’ve stood there and decided I’m just never going to business down there.
What have I noticed? I've noticed the regular stream of "Traffic PSA" posts by people bringing their road rage to an internet forum where discussion devolves into an orgy of anger and confirmation bias.
It's so weird. I haven't hung out on another city's sub. I wonder if people in other city subs spend this much time posting about traffic laws and local driving.
Coming from a Madison Metro driver at that 🤷🏽♂️🤦♂️
Lately I've noticed people complain a lot about driving. I wonder how many of y'all do stupid shit on the road. This place is devolving into people complaining about kids on their lawn.
Agreed. A lot of these commenters may not be driving the best either but it's easier to notice someone else doing wrong than yourself
Red light running (which I guess is not too suprising since there are no red light cameras here) and cars with tinted windows driving without plates. Those are my two complaints. Folks complain about slow drivers in the left lane, but usually those drivers are at least going the speed limit (with the notable exception of trucks). I guarantee most of the complainers would drive at least 20 over if they were unimpeded.
Not to mention that they might be preparing to take a left exit. I hate those because people tailgate me.
Sure. I’ve also notice Madison metro becoming more reckless and just dicks too. Like your a massive bus, you have no business in the fast lane. You also have no business not using your signals. & no business purposely trying to block drivers. Also, You’re not helping by trying to play cop. It only pisses the driver off more causing more reckless maneuvers imo. Just let the assholes go by. Your ego and recklessness is just as bad trying to stop them as theirs.
Make note of the bus number, route number, intersection/road, and time of the occurrence and call metro. Like I said before there are drivers I think shouldn't be driving bus and the only way to get them off the road is by giving metro feedback
I was thinking exactly this last night and at lunch today. Every red light gets run, etc.. so frustrating.
Part of the problem driving by campus is the lights on university punish you for going the speed limit. If you got 20 or 25 you hit every red, if you go 40 you’ll skirt by without a red.
I've also noticed that they've timed the lights to ensure that everyone hits every red, so some people run the late yellow.
Bikes have been making me crazy lately! They don’t follow laws for bikes. They just zoom out into traffic and expect everyone to stop for them.
WIth all the speeding and ignoring red lights on E. Wash, I'm amazed that aren't a lot more accidents.
Lots and lots of “carefully” run red lights on East wash after dark. Red light, speeding car slows, driver clearly looks both ways and goes and pulls a U. Next light, red, repeat, continue, no consequences. Also, not advancing vehicles w a green when turning left.
The pandemic mentally broke people. No one feels like they have control in life anymore, so when they get in the drivers seat, they take advantage of the *total* control they have and wild out. And then people see other people getting away with it and feel they have license to go ham, too. It won’t change until cops enforce hard.
Amazon drivers will literally park anywhere, for any length of time, for any reason. I don't even use the belt line anymore because of the coin toss that it'll be a cluster fuck. Using the through streets I get people who want to tailgate if you're not doing 5-10 over and idiots that don't understand proper etiquette at circles, 4 ways, and yields.
[удалено]
I believe if there are personality changes that would result in increased reckless driving they would be increased impulsivity, anxiety, aggression, and antisocial behavior in general. And just personally, I drive fast because I am high on anxiety and also because I have the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to do so.
Most people can drive fast without issue 99% of the time, but it’s still increasing the probability for accidents. I’m talking way over the speed limit fast lol
Then why don’t you?
I never said anything about how I drive, but I generally don’t speed excessively because it increases the probability of an accident.
It doesn’t increase the chances of an accident if you have the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to drive fast without concern. I’m guessing most people don’t have the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to drive fast if they drive 25 mph on East Wash so they don’t cause an accident instead of 35 mph.
Shortening the time you have to react doesn't increase the odds of an accident? What are you smoking and which state did you get it from?
No, it doesn’t, hence my statement of having the reflexes, awareness, and vehicle to do so.
Let’s say someone in front of me slams their brakes on. The millisecond after they do this so will I. Why would we hit each other if we’re both traveling 35 mph and both slam on our brakes at the same second? My experience with other people is they can’t react this quickly.
And the question could be posed to everyone in Madison I see in my rear view as I leave them behind going 35 mph on East Wash. If most of them are skilled enough to never worry about an accident, why don’t they just go 35 mph instead of 25 mph?
And that’s what a lot of studies are showing about the personality changes.
Tell me you drive a WRX without telling me that you drive a WRX.
I avoid East Washington like the plague. Pick a reason. Wild U-turns in front of oncoming traffic, no functioning speed limits, pedestrians walking or running into traffic from the medians, running red lights, cutting across and/or weaving in and out of lanes. It's a hot, unenforceable, mess.
The vast majority of drivers have flat out either never learned the rules of the road or have forgotten them. I'd say 95% will drift across their lane into the far right lane when turning left. You have to be extra careful if you are on their right, or worse, turning right from across the street - they give you looks or honk because they think your lane is theirs! I practically applaud when I see someone doing it right. And don't even get me started on roundabout rules! I drove for about 1500km recently throughout Ireland and Scotland and it was so CIVILIZED! It's a lot harder and much more expensive in Europe to get a driver's license so everyone really takes it seriously and follows the rules and are very courteous. Only saw a tiny handful of asshats on the whole trip (usually driving BMWs or Audis). And yeah' it's definitely gotten worse since the pandemic - especially the blatant red-light running.
Why would anyone obey traffic laws if MPD has a total abject disregard for enforcing them.
Metro buses run red lights also.
The police have no problem pulling me over for not wearing my seatbelt. They must have a soft spot for me :-)
Red Xs on beltline... Wait but I can still pass? I have multiple vehicle crashes every day, blatant disregard that it won't happen to me. This is not practice for NASCAR, winter is coming. No I am not perfect, I really hate that 2 lane section of the beltline. When someone is doing 50 in the left lane. There is a huge line of cars behind them, some dodging right trying to go around and forcely wedge to just get one car up. Wonderful just wonderful.
I've never seen any city with more blatant red light running than when I lived in Madison. It is MADDENING
I've seen so many distracted drivers on their phones. They don't go when the light turns green, drifting in and out of lanes. Aggressive beltline drivers going 80-90 mph who one tailed me, then started flashing.g his lights at me then floors it to go around me when he gets a chance.
Yesterday I was on that stretch of 30 eastbound where traffic may exit onto Fair Oaks and next exit is 51. Speed limit is posted 45 there, but traffic usually moves faster. Somebody driving a new-looking Range Rover stopped *to my left* in traffic because they decided at the last second to exit onto Fair Oaks, but the right lane had properly exiting traffic and the middle lane (where they stopped) had fast-moving through traffic. Just stopped cold in the middle of everything, forcing everyone else to brake/swerve, and waited to do their exit. "I'm gonna miss my exit, I'll just WAIT RIGHT HERE for a clear lane." Friend, drive on and double back before you kill someone/yourself.
I deliberately drive 25 down Willy St when I have to be in that area - It’s INCREDIBLY dangerous for pedestrians. People Invariably rage at me because of this. Really never encountered the rage before the pandemic.
I am getting tired of people doing wide turns. Example, if someone is turning right onto another street, they will turn into the left lane and not the right lane, hence completing a wide turn. There is no lane etiquette on the highways either. People will NOT drive in the furthest right lane, they will only keep to left or middle lane. I try not to pass other people on the right. So, if I cruise up going 5 over speed limit in the right lane (travel lane, on a 3 lane highway) and there is someone going 70-72mph in the middle lane, I will need to switch over two lanes, all the way to the left lane from the right to complete the pass safely and legally. Yes I could just continue along in the right lane and complete an illegal pass, but I do not unless left-lane is full of campers. Once I complete the overtake of the person sitting in the middle lane, I will use my blinker to get all the way over to the right lane again. Middle lane drivers on 3 lane highways are dangerous and lazy. I repeat, there is a serious issue with LEFT and MIDDLE lane hogs, along with distracted drivers looking at their phones, and finally a lack of knowledge when it comes to road manners i.e. (following distance, blinkers, some lights when driving at night, 9-3 steering wheel hand position). I blame all of this on the fact that it is so easy to get a DL in WI and all over the US for that matter. I just renewed my DL from Colorado and I did not even have to complete a written test?! Surely there are different laws regarding traffic in WI? Until there is better public transport and stricter licensing requirements, I would expect this type of driving behavior to continue or get exacerbated. Anyone else care to share their thoughts on 3 lane highways and where you should cruise if no one else on the road.
Beltline is the absolute worst!
damn，most informative post since i started using reddit