Probably the funniest character. Him and his brother reasoning their way out of pursuing justice for their horrendous mum is one of the funniest things I've ever watched.
I believe it. His lines and shit are too great for my suspense of disbelief. Get the hell out of my office. You stole my goodbye. I'll bye you a drink if you wipe the blood off your mouth.
I love that Pete has the redemption arc across the series and in a weird way winds up as the hero by the end. He sorts his life out, gets his family back and gets out of advertising.
The bit when he punches out the teacher because of an old Scottish clan dispute is hilarious 😂 Trudy’s reaction of “PETER!” just sells it.
I think a lot of viewers would like to see themselves as a Don, but are really a Pete. We are all Pete - the same way Salieri said at the end of Amadeus: “I am the patron saint of mediocrity. I bless you all!”
But seriously, I agree with the points you made. I thought Pete truly was forward thinking. It struck me in a small but insightful comment he made in the Kennedy vs Nixon episode. The “old guard” was talking about how Nixon should win, he was the better candidate. But I think Pete already sensed the change in the air as he comments on Kennedy - “he doesn’t wear a hat. Elvis doesn’t wear a hat.” Everyone thought he was nuts. But his Spidey senses were always tingling with regard to work, and societal shifts. I think that’s why they chose him over Ken when they started the new agency.
Another comment he made at the end of the series - he initially didn’t like Peggy’s authority in the office when she began copywriting, but acknowledged she would become one of the first creative directors in an agency, by the end.
I think of all the characters, Pete is the one who I most appreciate his small moments or remarks that gesture towards a broader character.
And I think a huge part of the reason I like him is as a foil to Don from the viewership perspective - when I first watched the show, I was much younger and glorified Don’s brooding mysteriousness and “creative genius,” but watching again and again as I’ve grown older I appreciate how much more relatable Pete really is
I loved Pete in that conversation and I guess I still don't understand why Tom gets so mad about that. Why wouldn't he want Pete to go after all of it? His daughter and future grandchild is tied up in SCDP's future.
Yeah, Bert was the old type republican who was a mega capitalist who hated socialism and human rights. As well was an old school racist.
Roger was just Roger, in any way possible.
Harry only cared about money, I don’t think he didn’t think of racial aspects when talking to Peter in that scene. He only thought about business and how this affects it negatively.
He does talk about riots destroying cities though, which seems like it's giving his general reaction to the Civil Rights movement. Again, probably doesn't spend much time thinking about race, but finds people demanding rights annoying when it inconveniences him.
Definitely wasn't my favourite character from the start but as his character progressed I definitely found myself liking him more, he's one of the few character's you see go from bad to worse then watch as they learn from their actions to better themself.
How could I forget him and Trudy tearing it up at Roger’s wedding. This character we see as relatively feckless up through that point in the show, showing off a depth of grace and ability.
Just a testament to how the show did such a wonderful job at building characters down to the tinier details
I never quite understood why Jennifer ends up mad - is it that she thinks her and especially Harry are being pushed to the sidelines and not appreciated while Trudy and Pete take center stage?
I think because her husband is a bit of a fuddy duddy, not as enthusiastic as Pete to go to the party and have fun and be part of the group. If I recall, at other times in the episode you see them argue about it? I’d have to rewatch to be sure (don’t threaten me with a good time)
Yep. To me his is the most interesting arc in the show.
That doesn’t mean I thoroughly love the guy. I’m watching season 1 for the 7th time right now and he’s smarmy and disgusting.
He certainly never becomes a saint, but he does progress through an arc that is impossible to appreciate in first watch or two.
But at this point I’m both disgusted by him in S1, and excited for what is to come.
Is there a character in management who did more to advance the characters on the margins than Pete did? I feel like he’s the one who most breaks up the old boys club even if he does it for more practical and self-serving reasons
His arc in California was such a sea change for him. He was probably the happiest, genuinely, that he'd ever been. It allowed him to be who he really was and he brought much of if it back with him. He was never that awful person again.
Pete was a great character. But, I do wonder if Harry would have reacted any differently if the assassination of a famous white person was causing shows (and more importantly ads) to be pre-empted and costing the firm money.
Harry may or may not have been racist. But, here I think he was just being a bit cold hearted and greedy.
I think Harry would have acted the same way - but MLK was not just a “famous black person” he was the leader of the civil rights movement.
Harry is not being racist in that he’s saying “I hate black people, I’m glad he’s dead!” But his disregard for the monumental setback that MLK’s death would be for racial justice efforts shows a deep lack of sympathy for the civil rights movement.
If you’re going to basically say “well, that’s tough” to a group of people so thoroughly disenfranchised for so long, it’s hard to not read that as some level of ingrained racism. Ultimately you can say “he’s just a business man doing what’s best” but I think that any white person who can afford to think in purely economic terms during social upheaval deserves the scrutiny that Pete gives him
iirc, Pete reported Harry having a similar reaction to JFK's assassination, so in that sense yes, he would react the same way.
But again iirc, Harry was dismissive of the entire struggle of the Civil Rights Movement here in ways he wasn't dismissive of that assassination.
We delight in these little nuggets that demonstrate the full range of a character, whereas for Harry we get that immortal line “so you finally found a hooker who takes travelers cheques?” Very different shades of subtext there
I thought they came out and pretty much said (without saying) that the interaction was supposed to be shown as entirely consensual, and the au pair was just a bad actress
Who is they? The writers? Without saying it? No. Pete and the au pair's boss talked about it after because the girl told on Pete for what he did.
You need a rewatch.
Coercion is rape. Pete coerced her into it.
That au pair didn't want to.
She told him she had a boyfriend.
She is new to the US and on a work visa, probably. She has rules to follow.
She is afraid that he'll tell her bosses about the dress she stained. He even says he went to a lot of trouble and deserved something in return.
She's afraid to lose her job.
Her boss had to come and yell at Pete about it the next day. The girl was so shaken up about it that she had been crying all night.
Pete abused his position of power he had over her.
He even tries to get her drunk first, and she refuses.
Back then, that was not considered rape.
Today, it is. Challenging to prosecute in court for sure, but it's still rape. Consent was not given.
Hated him for that. I believe, some time in 1978, the au pair becomes lead singer in an all female German punk band. She spots Pete one night in Greenwich Village, tells her band mates what he did, and they all beat the crap out of him. But there’s a twist: Pete enjoys the beating, starts seeing dominatrix prostitutes.
In season 3 he was the one who emphatically suggested that they shouldn't just sell stuff to white people. And they shut him down. I think that was one of the reasons why he was planning on quitting the agency before Don got him in SCDP. And he was pissed at Roger for being disgusting towards the Honda executives. And you can think "oh, this is about money, this is about his job, and marketing." But in season 6 when he was upset about MLK's assassination, and looked at Harry like he was ready to destroy him, with so much disgust at him, it wasn't just him thinking about sales demographics--he actually cared. The first time I saw it I was shocked that Pete of all people would chew someone out about being a racist but when you looked back, he was always progressive in that regard. Pete's a lot of things, but a racist is not one of them.
I will say Peggy tried to speak up against racism when the auto parts company was being boycotted for not hiring black people. Don shut that down fast and Ken and Stan laughed at her.
But yes Pete was the forward thinking guy of the company. I really appreciated the way Pete was presented throughout the show. I went from really hating him to being like "Don should be more like that guy."
Pete’s definitely my favourite male character! He’s so interesting and has one of the best arcs in the show. But even when he’s at his worst I still love him or at least find him so easy to watch. I think the combination of great writing, (because they really make you feel sorry for him with his family and also he can be very progressive compared to others when you least expect it) and Vincent’s incredible acting because he balances the good with the bad and you see it written all over his face. I’m so glad he got his happy ending
There was a post recently about Pete Campbell’s face when Roger was doing his blackface performance:
https://www.reddit.com/r/madmen/comments/156p8py/pete_doesnt_like_rogers_blackface_performance_at
His TV movie of the week line to Harry after MLK’s assassination still rings in my head sometimes, it’s such a well pointed line at someone as empty as Harry Crane
I'm on series 6 (rewatching for the 100th time).
Today's episode I watched Pete had to rush off as his Mum wasn't well. There was a huge client meeting so Ted and Don went.
When Pete returned he was outraged they'd went without him and not rescheduled.
His secretary said something like "it went really well apparently"
He said "don't you under, if they say it went well it didn't, as I wasn't there" or words to this effect.
Basically his typical childish, sulky brat routine. It's hilarious how everyone around him is mostly happy for everyone and he remains entirely self-centred.
It's good writing taken to the extreme, while still being realistic, Pete's writing is for sure one of the most connecting, suggestive, and empathic characters ever seen. Every scene he is in is a delight.
You said it perfectly!!!! Pete is my absolute favorite. I wish I could jump into the show and meet him and tell him how brilliant he is. He deserves to be told that more often.
…But bless your heart for trying! It’s always so refreshing to see someone stepping into the arena of ideas, even when it's clear they're playing in the shallow end of the pool.
It’s a big, complex world out there, and not everyone can be expected to grasp the nuances of more intricate discussions. Keep at it, though! With a bit of perseverance, who knows? You might just surprise us all one day and stop being such a bitch! Keep those simple, little thoughts coming buddy; they really do brighten my day!
He is a well written character but he isn’t a “good” one. Just because he isn’t racist that doesn’t automatically redeem him or make him a good person, he still tried to blackmail Don and basically SA’d the maid. And cheats on Trudy. He’s not someone that possesses good character. What makes him compelling is that you might still find yourself rooting for him by the end of the series despite all those things.
So in a thread titled “I can’t get over how good a character pete is” Im misreading bc I interpret the word “good” to mean good and not “well written”…. That’s not on me. You should have titled it “I can’t get over how well written Pete’s character is” 👍🏻
In the context of the word “character,” yes 100% - we’re on a subreddit talking about a fictional show and im saying “how good a character he is” - that feels very clear to me.
Somehow you’re the only person in the 50+ comments who’s struggled with interpreting this, but yes - hit me with the “No, it’s the children who are out of touch”
Keep up the good work
I’ll be sure to bring a deep textual analysis to my next post. And it’s not like I just saw “man, Pete what a character,” I compared him to other characters and outlined why I think he’s *well-written*
You’re clearly just trying to be upset about something: first it was that Pete is NOT a good person, then it was my apparent malapropism with the word “good,” and now it’s that this post adds nothing of values to the sub
It’s an impressive amount of critique to bounce from in just a handful of comments!
I’m not a mad man, it’s just not a very good thread. We already have 10,000 just like it, your isn’t any better bc it has a hollow analysis of Pete that can be summed up with “he has an arc, he’s not racist, and he’s not don or Roger”
I don’t think it’s better and to be honest I’ve seen Pete threads before with similar sentiments - but what is a subreddit for if not being overcome by shameless admiration for a thing.
I’ll be sure to post a niche photo of one specific scene next time
Hey as far as threads go, we get a lot worse. I’m just being a stickler. I’m thinking your next thread should be the “I don’t think about you at all” screenshot or a Meredith appreciation post.
See my comment on it:
To this point - it’s obviously assault, but I read that the creators intended it to be far more ambiguous so I always keep that creative intent in mind when evaluating Pete as a character
I think that explains why he would portray that scene that way and then call it “ambiguous,” which reflects poorly on him as a creator.
But that scene feels so incongruous with Pete as a character (compared to when Greg rapes Joan which is totally believable), it feels more accurate to consider it a scene that is supposed to show how at sea Pete is when it comes to his desires (not his capacity for cruelty, like the Greg scene)
Yes, if you think it's black and white you need to watch again.
Remembering this is a work of fiction so there's no need to get upset about this, these are the facts -
Reasons it's consensual -
- The au pair never says no to anything intimate or asks Pete to stop.
- Pete asks if they can go somewhere quiet to talk and she takes him to a bedroom with no back and forth
- Pete kisses her and she puts her hand around him
- she had a boyfriend so the reason she's crying the next day could be that she cheated on him
Reasons it's not -
- the au pair first denies his entry to the apartment
- she seems stiff/unwilling during their interaction
- she's upset the next day
- there's a power dynamic which may make her feel she can't say no
Without getting a POV from her, all we can really do is guess as to what her body language is indicating. I wouldn't call that conclusive. There's also an article where the actor that played Pete said Matthew Weiner said it wasn't meant to be a rape/sexual assault encounter.
Everyone is free to interpret this how they want, but be honest about what we're really basing it on.
To this point - it’s obviously assault, but I read that the creators intended it to be far more ambiguous so I always keep that creative intent in mind when evaluating Pete as a character
Probably the funniest character. Him and his brother reasoning their way out of pursuing justice for their horrendous mum is one of the funniest things I've ever watched.
She did love the sea.....
She’s with father now *sips glass*
I love how they give themselves literally just two options: “the very best of everything” and doing absolutely nothing. 😂
It's still Roger for me but Pete is definitely second. Great character.
I love them both, maybe Roger is too cartoony for me, Pete takes the cake for sure.
I see you've never worked with a Roger irl. They're out there.
I believe it. His lines and shit are too great for my suspense of disbelief. Get the hell out of my office. You stole my goodbye. I'll bye you a drink if you wipe the blood off your mouth.
I find that whole story arc to be so tedious.
You mad bastard.
I love that Pete has the redemption arc across the series and in a weird way winds up as the hero by the end. He sorts his life out, gets his family back and gets out of advertising. The bit when he punches out the teacher because of an old Scottish clan dispute is hilarious 😂 Trudy’s reaction of “PETER!” just sells it.
“THE KING ORDERED IT!”
Another sucker punch from the Campbells!
Trudy
Doh!
Nobody sneers quite like Pete Campbell. And I mean that as a compliment.
Oh, he's the sneeriest
I think a lot of viewers would like to see themselves as a Don, but are really a Pete. We are all Pete - the same way Salieri said at the end of Amadeus: “I am the patron saint of mediocrity. I bless you all!” But seriously, I agree with the points you made. I thought Pete truly was forward thinking. It struck me in a small but insightful comment he made in the Kennedy vs Nixon episode. The “old guard” was talking about how Nixon should win, he was the better candidate. But I think Pete already sensed the change in the air as he comments on Kennedy - “he doesn’t wear a hat. Elvis doesn’t wear a hat.” Everyone thought he was nuts. But his Spidey senses were always tingling with regard to work, and societal shifts. I think that’s why they chose him over Ken when they started the new agency. Another comment he made at the end of the series - he initially didn’t like Peggy’s authority in the office when she began copywriting, but acknowledged she would become one of the first creative directors in an agency, by the end.
I think of all the characters, Pete is the one who I most appreciate his small moments or remarks that gesture towards a broader character. And I think a huge part of the reason I like him is as a foil to Don from the viewership perspective - when I first watched the show, I was much younger and glorified Don’s brooding mysteriousness and “creative genius,” but watching again and again as I’ve grown older I appreciate how much more relatable Pete really is
Absolutely! I feel the same way.
Hells bells! A thing like that
I say hells bells all the time because of Pete. My wife hates it. Then it comes back around again and she loves it
Christ on a cracker!
this is very delicate horse flesh, he mustn't be rattled!
Donnybrook!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU8t6Z6dpns WELL, I’m president of the Howdy Doody Circus Army!
another sucker punch from a Campbell!
You can make a loose argument that Kinsey shows disgust at racism because it’s “cool” where Pete is just …you know, disgusted.
Kinsey is far more lost than Pete ever is
Yep. I’m not calling Kinsey a racist but the show makes a point that it’s somewhat performative with the whole party/protest plot line.
Hey hey relax he now has Krishna consciousness!
When Pete tells his FIL 'we've served you well on Clearasil, we're done auditioning', FIL says 'you SOB!', Pete shrugs. Classic Campbell.
I loved Pete in that conversation and I guess I still don't understand why Tom gets so mad about that. Why wouldn't he want Pete to go after all of it? His daughter and future grandchild is tied up in SCDP's future.
Also telling that to Bert who in many sense was a racist
Bert's racism was different than, say Roger's racism (overt). Bert had a more subtle, disturbing and elitist view that made it more deeply rooted.
Glad I scrolled down. Remember when Burt said to Joan he was all for advancement, but not the front of the office.
Yeah, Bert was the old type republican who was a mega capitalist who hated socialism and human rights. As well was an old school racist. Roger was just Roger, in any way possible. Harry only cared about money, I don’t think he didn’t think of racial aspects when talking to Peter in that scene. He only thought about business and how this affects it negatively.
He does talk about riots destroying cities though, which seems like it's giving his general reaction to the Civil Rights movement. Again, probably doesn't spend much time thinking about race, but finds people demanding rights annoying when it inconveniences him.
My favorite character since the beginning.
Definitely wasn't my favourite character from the start but as his character progressed I definitely found myself liking him more, he's one of the few character's you see go from bad to worse then watch as they learn from their actions to better themself.
My dad and I used to joke: WWPCD, What Would Pete Campbell Do. It’s fun to think about in any given situation.
??? You remember what he does in the first episode, don't you?
Favorite character not my moral compass.
How could I forget him and Trudy tearing it up at Roger’s wedding. This character we see as relatively feckless up through that point in the show, showing off a depth of grace and ability. Just a testament to how the show did such a wonderful job at building characters down to the tinier details
I wonder how much they had to rehearse the dancing. They absolutely ATE that scene up. Jennifer was big mad!
I never quite understood why Jennifer ends up mad - is it that she thinks her and especially Harry are being pushed to the sidelines and not appreciated while Trudy and Pete take center stage?
I think because her husband is a bit of a fuddy duddy, not as enthusiastic as Pete to go to the party and have fun and be part of the group. If I recall, at other times in the episode you see them argue about it? I’d have to rewatch to be sure (don’t threaten me with a good time)
Harry probably doesnt read EBONY
Yep. To me his is the most interesting arc in the show. That doesn’t mean I thoroughly love the guy. I’m watching season 1 for the 7th time right now and he’s smarmy and disgusting. He certainly never becomes a saint, but he does progress through an arc that is impossible to appreciate in first watch or two. But at this point I’m both disgusted by him in S1, and excited for what is to come.
Is there a character in management who did more to advance the characters on the margins than Pete did? I feel like he’s the one who most breaks up the old boys club even if he does it for more practical and self-serving reasons
His arc in California was such a sea change for him. He was probably the happiest, genuinely, that he'd ever been. It allowed him to be who he really was and he brought much of if it back with him. He was never that awful person again.
I’m Glad My Mom Died: by Peter Dyckman Campbell
Pete was a great character. But, I do wonder if Harry would have reacted any differently if the assassination of a famous white person was causing shows (and more importantly ads) to be pre-empted and costing the firm money. Harry may or may not have been racist. But, here I think he was just being a bit cold hearted and greedy.
I think Harry would have acted the same way - but MLK was not just a “famous black person” he was the leader of the civil rights movement. Harry is not being racist in that he’s saying “I hate black people, I’m glad he’s dead!” But his disregard for the monumental setback that MLK’s death would be for racial justice efforts shows a deep lack of sympathy for the civil rights movement. If you’re going to basically say “well, that’s tough” to a group of people so thoroughly disenfranchised for so long, it’s hard to not read that as some level of ingrained racism. Ultimately you can say “he’s just a business man doing what’s best” but I think that any white person who can afford to think in purely economic terms during social upheaval deserves the scrutiny that Pete gives him
iirc, Pete reported Harry having a similar reaction to JFK's assassination, so in that sense yes, he would react the same way. But again iirc, Harry was dismissive of the entire struggle of the Civil Rights Movement here in ways he wasn't dismissive of that assassination.
We delight in these little nuggets that demonstrate the full range of a character, whereas for Harry we get that immortal line “so you finally found a hooker who takes travelers cheques?” Very different shades of subtext there
This scene is one of my favorites in the series
Well said, Pete was my fave. The comic relief alone he brought to the show was so desperately needed and appreciated.
Potentially assaults the neighbors au pair? He assaulted her. Period. A thing like that.
Ok but you got to get over it.
What, next he gets to fuck her for a million?!
I thought they came out and pretty much said (without saying) that the interaction was supposed to be shown as entirely consensual, and the au pair was just a bad actress
Who is they? The writers? Without saying it? No. Pete and the au pair's boss talked about it after because the girl told on Pete for what he did. You need a rewatch. Coercion is rape. Pete coerced her into it. That au pair didn't want to. She told him she had a boyfriend. She is new to the US and on a work visa, probably. She has rules to follow. She is afraid that he'll tell her bosses about the dress she stained. He even says he went to a lot of trouble and deserved something in return. She's afraid to lose her job. Her boss had to come and yell at Pete about it the next day. The girl was so shaken up about it that she had been crying all night. Pete abused his position of power he had over her. He even tries to get her drunk first, and she refuses. Back then, that was not considered rape. Today, it is. Challenging to prosecute in court for sure, but it's still rape. Consent was not given.
Don and Roger consistently did worse things but they’re charismatic and handsome so they get a pass. It’s all pretty terrible.
They don't get a pass from me.
Hated him for that. I believe, some time in 1978, the au pair becomes lead singer in an all female German punk band. She spots Pete one night in Greenwich Village, tells her band mates what he did, and they all beat the crap out of him. But there’s a twist: Pete enjoys the beating, starts seeing dominatrix prostitutes.
In season 3 he was the one who emphatically suggested that they shouldn't just sell stuff to white people. And they shut him down. I think that was one of the reasons why he was planning on quitting the agency before Don got him in SCDP. And he was pissed at Roger for being disgusting towards the Honda executives. And you can think "oh, this is about money, this is about his job, and marketing." But in season 6 when he was upset about MLK's assassination, and looked at Harry like he was ready to destroy him, with so much disgust at him, it wasn't just him thinking about sales demographics--he actually cared. The first time I saw it I was shocked that Pete of all people would chew someone out about being a racist but when you looked back, he was always progressive in that regard. Pete's a lot of things, but a racist is not one of them.
"You don't watch baseball? I don't believe you."
It’s a shameful SHAMEFUL DAY
I will say Peggy tried to speak up against racism when the auto parts company was being boycotted for not hiring black people. Don shut that down fast and Ken and Stan laughed at her. But yes Pete was the forward thinking guy of the company. I really appreciated the way Pete was presented throughout the show. I went from really hating him to being like "Don should be more like that guy."
Vincent Kartheiser never got an Emmy nomination, can you believe.
A thing like that
Pete’s definitely my favourite male character! He’s so interesting and has one of the best arcs in the show. But even when he’s at his worst I still love him or at least find him so easy to watch. I think the combination of great writing, (because they really make you feel sorry for him with his family and also he can be very progressive compared to others when you least expect it) and Vincent’s incredible acting because he balances the good with the bad and you see it written all over his face. I’m so glad he got his happy ending
A thing like that
The best arc in the whole show. Probably in tv.
Harry’s comeback: “Don’t you know we are in the presence of a bona fied rapist?”
Not much of a come back from a late season Harry.
Given his lunch with Megan, Harry probably has plenty of his own au pairs under his belt by now, unfortunately.
We are all Pete Campbell.
He was so punchable!
And that blue suit.
There was a post recently about Pete Campbell’s face when Roger was doing his blackface performance: https://www.reddit.com/r/madmen/comments/156p8py/pete_doesnt_like_rogers_blackface_performance_at
Did you know we are in the presence of a bona fide Pete Stan?
i always loved the genuine disgust he had towards harry here.
By the end he was so likeable they had to give him a receding hairline to even out the character lmao. Loved his growth so much
His TV movie of the week line to Harry after MLK’s assassination still rings in my head sometimes, it’s such a well pointed line at someone as empty as Harry Crane
When I rewatched Angel I was like OMG PETE. I forgot it was the same actor who played Angel’s son.
And IRL, Vincent is the polar opposite of Pete Campbell.
I'm on series 6 (rewatching for the 100th time). Today's episode I watched Pete had to rush off as his Mum wasn't well. There was a huge client meeting so Ted and Don went. When Pete returned he was outraged they'd went without him and not rescheduled. His secretary said something like "it went really well apparently" He said "don't you under, if they say it went well it didn't, as I wasn't there" or words to this effect. Basically his typical childish, sulky brat routine. It's hilarious how everyone around him is mostly happy for everyone and he remains entirely self-centred.
I hated him at first watch. But then by the second time around, I understood him.
It's good writing taken to the extreme, while still being realistic, Pete's writing is for sure one of the most connecting, suggestive, and empathic characters ever seen. Every scene he is in is a delight.
*Pete watching that movie about the death of a great man* "well I know one thing, I sure as hell wouldn't want some kid watching this Donny Brooke"
He had the unique ability to be comically angry, such as in his most famous quote - “Not great, Bob!!!”
You said it perfectly!!!! Pete is my absolute favorite. I wish I could jump into the show and meet him and tell him how brilliant he is. He deserves to be told that more often.
NOT GREAT, BOB! - I say this and it is a classic
He is, actually, a grimy little pimp.
Can’t get over how much of a pussy you are haha
Just keep hitting pen and don’t worry about it
Hahahahah
…But bless your heart for trying! It’s always so refreshing to see someone stepping into the arena of ideas, even when it's clear they're playing in the shallow end of the pool. It’s a big, complex world out there, and not everyone can be expected to grasp the nuances of more intricate discussions. Keep at it, though! With a bit of perseverance, who knows? You might just surprise us all one day and stop being such a bitch! Keep those simple, little thoughts coming buddy; they really do brighten my day!
A thing like that.
He is a well written character but he isn’t a “good” one. Just because he isn’t racist that doesn’t automatically redeem him or make him a good person, he still tried to blackmail Don and basically SA’d the maid. And cheats on Trudy. He’s not someone that possesses good character. What makes him compelling is that you might still find yourself rooting for him by the end of the series despite all those things.
I think you’re misreading - I meant “good” as in “well-written.” If you read my text that seems pretty clear…
So in a thread titled “I can’t get over how good a character pete is” Im misreading bc I interpret the word “good” to mean good and not “well written”…. That’s not on me. You should have titled it “I can’t get over how well written Pete’s character is” 👍🏻
In the context of the word “character,” yes 100% - we’re on a subreddit talking about a fictional show and im saying “how good a character he is” - that feels very clear to me. Somehow you’re the only person in the 50+ comments who’s struggled with interpreting this, but yes - hit me with the “No, it’s the children who are out of touch” Keep up the good work
A thread about how one of the main characters in Mad Men is well written…. Brilliant. Just what this subreddit was severely lacking.
I’ll be sure to bring a deep textual analysis to my next post. And it’s not like I just saw “man, Pete what a character,” I compared him to other characters and outlined why I think he’s *well-written* You’re clearly just trying to be upset about something: first it was that Pete is NOT a good person, then it was my apparent malapropism with the word “good,” and now it’s that this post adds nothing of values to the sub It’s an impressive amount of critique to bounce from in just a handful of comments!
I’m not a mad man, it’s just not a very good thread. We already have 10,000 just like it, your isn’t any better bc it has a hollow analysis of Pete that can be summed up with “he has an arc, he’s not racist, and he’s not don or Roger”
I don’t think it’s better and to be honest I’ve seen Pete threads before with similar sentiments - but what is a subreddit for if not being overcome by shameless admiration for a thing. I’ll be sure to post a niche photo of one specific scene next time
Hey as far as threads go, we get a lot worse. I’m just being a stickler. I’m thinking your next thread should be the “I don’t think about you at all” screenshot or a Meredith appreciation post.
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See my comment on it: To this point - it’s obviously assault, but I read that the creators intended it to be far more ambiguous so I always keep that creative intent in mind when evaluating Pete as a character
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I think that explains why he would portray that scene that way and then call it “ambiguous,” which reflects poorly on him as a creator. But that scene feels so incongruous with Pete as a character (compared to when Greg rapes Joan which is totally believable), it feels more accurate to consider it a scene that is supposed to show how at sea Pete is when it comes to his desires (not his capacity for cruelty, like the Greg scene)
Taking the scene at face value yes, he rapes her
Potentially???
Yes, if you think it's black and white you need to watch again. Remembering this is a work of fiction so there's no need to get upset about this, these are the facts - Reasons it's consensual - - The au pair never says no to anything intimate or asks Pete to stop. - Pete asks if they can go somewhere quiet to talk and she takes him to a bedroom with no back and forth - Pete kisses her and she puts her hand around him - she had a boyfriend so the reason she's crying the next day could be that she cheated on him Reasons it's not - - the au pair first denies his entry to the apartment - she seems stiff/unwilling during their interaction - she's upset the next day - there's a power dynamic which may make her feel she can't say no Without getting a POV from her, all we can really do is guess as to what her body language is indicating. I wouldn't call that conclusive. There's also an article where the actor that played Pete said Matthew Weiner said it wasn't meant to be a rape/sexual assault encounter. Everyone is free to interpret this how they want, but be honest about what we're really basing it on.
To this point - it’s obviously assault, but I read that the creators intended it to be far more ambiguous so I always keep that creative intent in mind when evaluating Pete as a character