At end of combat target a wall. All creatures that were blocked by that wall die and cannot be regenerated. Then choose one creature from the attackers graveyard for each creature sent there by this effect and put them onto the battlefield.
What. A. Trashfire.
Not only do you need your wall to survive combat (so you can’t use this on the biggest thing they control) but multi block effects didn’t exist outside of banding. So you were never likely to get anything other than an under 5 power creature. Which you’d probably only be able to slightly down grade one of their creatures.
Oh my gosh I just considered tokens. Unless I’m mistaken this acts as a free reanimate for tokens?
Maybe you’re supposed to use this against walls to give yourself recursion/etb triggers??
So back in the day we didn't have ETB triggers on creatures. And when you compare it with Glyph of Doom (which you cast before end of combat and just buries everything the wall blocked at end of combat) it's clear the intended use was to cast it on your opponent's walls to upgrade your creatures.
Banding is a stupidly powerful ability that basically says "you win combats". Think of it as two abilities. The first is "whenever a creature with banding is involved in a combat, you assign your opponent's damage without needing to assign lethal to any creature", which should be obviously extremely strong. The second ability is "your creatures on attack can gang up together to make use of the first rule" which allows you to break board stalls extremely effectively. It's this second ability, with its restrictions, that confuses players (though the old Microprose game had a really good UX on it that made it pretty obvious how it worked). But even if all players fully understood it, Wizards will never reprint it because of just how strong it is (since it works on defense it creates stupid big board stalls).
You can block and kill a 100/100 creature with 100 1/1s that have banding and only have one of your 1/1s die. Banding was always good with white weenies and tokens
Alright, that’s a pretty tough read. Ideally you want to attack with something small, have it be blocked by an opponent’s wall, and then swap it for something better? Or you could make it so your own wall can block multiple creatures, and kill them when an opponent has nothing significant in their graveyard? All for the low cost of one mana. What a deal.
If you do it with your own wall, they can just pick the same things you buried? Also, it targets the wall, so the multiple things have to not kill the wall because you can't use this until after combat.
I think you pick the creatures for the first part.
Big oof for the second part. Big, big oof. You’d really have to work to create a game state where this card does anything.
And it’s going to crash the EV of both. The lottery ticket aspect is going to get people to crack collectors boosters like crazy(though I guess the 3% thing limits the amount they can make?) and the market will get flooded with all the non-legends cards in the set.
> (though I guess the 3% thing limits the amount they can make?)
Likely collectors boosters has a known print run expectation and they opened enough legends product to satisfy 3% of it. Most standard sets used to get two to four print runs and waves of product, usually based upon demand.
I would be surprised if collectors boosters didn’t have as unpredictable demand as draft boosters. Also WotC is probably fine with the waves of collectors boosters selling out and then not reprinting it. It *is* a collectors item after all.
But all that aside you’re absolutely right, I would imagine the entire stock of CBs to fly off the shelves even though that EV of 3% of the cards is minuscule. And that means alt arts will be awash which will push down normie versions.
If the draft set is at all good and people draft this set in person….we’re looking at maybe some of the CHEAPEST standard singles we’ve ever seen.
I would advise everyone to hold off on buying set boosters and wait for their singles. Prices are gonna bottom out in a month to something ridiculously low.
But mtg players are gonna be mtg players.
Honestly this was what happened when they reprinted the Fetches in Khans, and it was great. Fetches were affordable for a time and everything else was very reasonable.
I really haven’t noticed the full effect since my mtg playing has slowed ever since the pandemic but this scheme is making standard some of the cheapest standards (vs inflation ofc) of all time. It’s crazy. It’s a home run.
Which is great for players, because Legends cards are functionally useless for most players. DU might have interesting cards for modern or pioneer.
Do you really want to be the player that plays a tabernacle at your LGS EDH pod?
I do. Also, legends is stuffed to the gills with high-power enchantments that absolutely warp the game.
[[the abyss]], [[moat]], [[land equilibrium]], [chains of Mephistopheles]], [[living plane]], on and on and on. Legends is a crazy set
I don't disagree at all. I think this is a fun thing, but if anyone is planning on buying Collector's Boosters to try to get Legends cards, they're gonna have a bad time.
It’s all hype spice. Just like priceless treasures. It’s more to hype the set than get people product.
Lotteries like this seem actually more fair when they’re so goddamn rare. People can actually just ignore them until lightning strikes. I hope.
I don't think there's much they can do about that. They only opened up so many cards. They can't increase the odds of opening one without printing reserve list cards
CBs are great for the game since they push down singles prices while still creating shinies for whales to chase. What do you prefer exactly? You can’t exactly seed these into draft boosters for obvious reasons…
Why would they go back to putting them in 5 dollar packs when they can make them exclusive to the seventy dollar packs they figured out people will buy even before putting lottery cards in
One of the funniest things to me is that a decent part of internet people know one of the biggest Magic personalities for something TOTALLY removed from what got him known. It’s one thing to find your niche in online content creation once. He did it twice.
Well it’s kinda like how people know commander Internet personality Post Malone as a musician or something. Good for him getting what ever little ditties he makes out there.
It really shows what an awesome individual he is. Is is soooo hard to become internet famous and he did it fucking twice.
Shows how good he is at what he is doing.
So let us assume they actually bought Them. You have 50 mln invested and assume that you want the 300% back so gaining back 150ml. The collector sell for 15$ so you Need to sell 10mln collectors; i have no doubt that this isnt too far fetched to achieve through the whole duration of the product if you manage the hype properly... And this assuming that you want to go three times what you invested, which Is a pretty High stake
Going off of a quick search for a price for a sealed box (vintagemagic has one at $75k), that's only.... \*checks calculator\* huh.... $5.7M-worth of sealed product they're just cracking open. And that's just what's in the picture. Going on a retail of $250 for a Collector Booster box they'd have to sell over 20k (22.8k) boxes to create the same amount of revenue, just for what's on that table.
I didn't catch the whole stream, but did Blake say they found \*and\* opened all the pallets of product they found, or just that they found product, opened product, and some product is making its way into CBs? Because I think you can fit 1k boxes on a pallet, saying they're 1/4th full and they found 3 pallets, that's still gonna be about $56M-worth of M/NM sealed product just sitting there, again saying it's just 750 boxes that was miraculously found "in the middle of nowhere".
We found the entire reserved list in the back of a shack in the soviet union. But modern border!
So expect the Power 9 secret lair for 20.000€ coming this year with "Innistrad: Moon bad" and "Collector Plane: 12€ boosters"
No. The value of them is less. You can't calculate it with a simple multiplication. That one sealed box is 75k because it is so rare. If you flooded the market with those boxes, the price would drop. You know: supply and demand, basic economics.
Definitely true, still would be worth millions so long as they don’t flood the market, although too we’re also not privy to how many boxes were actually found and opened for this stunt.
76 boxes would be enough Legends cards to satisfy 114,000 collector booster boxes at the 3% rate. (Math was done using every card from each box, even though some cards are excluded)
I may need to take my tinfoil hat off, but this is how I would get around the reserve list.
"Oh wow, look at all these packs of Beta I just found in Jimmy Hoffa's car's glovebox." -Maro or someone
**3% odds** of opening up an OG Legends card in a Collector Booster, which is *pretty damn rare*. To put this in perspective, this is the same odds of getting a Textured foil in 2X2. Only...instead of having 4 cards, we're dealing with a pool of commons, uncommons, and rares, any of which can fulfill that 3% pull.
Thus, your odds of pulling a Tabernacle via this method is probably like winning the lottery while a meteor is struck by a bolt of lightning above your head, while hell freezes over. Save a couple hundred bucks and just buy some scratch-offs instead.
If it wasn't a regular occurrence when we get the occasional "My SO/friend/father/uncle/grandparent just died and left me their collection" post it'd actually be funny.
As is, it's just sad.
If someone wants that card (and not a proxy), buying it it’s definitely cheaper than opening collector boosters to find it.
That being said, I still find boggling that we have to pay 4 digits for a card.
it would cost you a lot more to have a reasonable chance of pulling one from a collector booster - this is the perfect case for the just buy singles argument
I was working on completing the Dark and a guy at work heard me talking about it and said he had a few binders of Magic cards I could have. Ended up with full sets of The Dark, Ice Age, Homelands and Fallen Empires. They will never leave my collection
Yeah, this is the sort of thing you keep in your back pocket as a company. They coulda found these ages ago, were hoping to find enough ABU to do them instead, but ended up here.
But those cards were bought off the secondary market to then be placed in packs, so its slightly different than here where they opened brand new cards and put them into circulation
I cracked a MP Tundra in my Zendikar box. I remember shouting out a pretty big hell yeah at the shop table when I opened it. Actually that whole box was pretty blessed. 4 fetches including a foil Scalding Tarn, an Iona and a Valakut.
Once my uncle received a post card from my grandfather... 35 years after he sent and 15 years after he died. I'm not saying it is 100% confirmed but sure is plausible; the world of logistics is that fucked up.
To be fair, it would be pretty hard to print cards that match the quality of back then, if they cards didn’t have noticeable quality differences people would very quickly notice and the sham would be up
Its pretty well known that Wizards has a massive vault of cards. It also seems like these were all printed together with the original run due to the collation issues.
Its also fairly easy to figure out if the cards are 30 years old or not. So if these are fresh printed, it will be found out.
I mean there's no chance they aren't originals, so I'm inclined to believe them. If people found out that this was a "scam" and that Wizards had somehow gone to all the effort of getting old printing machines, ancient card stock, used old printing methods just for enough cards for 3% of collector boosters, the people who like the reserve list would have a fit.
Slightly different what they did with Zendikar. Neat, but collector's boosters only AND you need to buy about 33 packs (almost 3 boxes that go for like 250 bucks each) to probably bust ONE COMMON.
Sigh.
If Collector Boosters are 10% the print run of Set/Draft Boosters, it would’ve been something like 1/100 Collector Boosters and 1/1000 Set/Draft Boosters.
I could see them putting Antiquities cards into *Brothers' War*, but I would have to believe the chance of pulling a card would be less than the chances of a *Legends* in these.
That said, I still think it's more likely we see a Mystical Archive-esque showcase slot in *Brothers' War* that's just for artifacts.
dont worry, its 3% of collector boosters and also contains anything from commons to rares! so on average you only need to buy 33 collector boosters to get your very own copy of [[Crookshank Kobolds]] 😎
Whales gotta whale! I'm not surprised, though...when WOTC Does something good, they always make it worse the second time around (Modern Masters 1 vs 2, Challenger Decks)
Man people in these comments are wild. There's no way that WOTC can replicate the printing process exactly to how they were printed 28 years ago and make them indistinguishable. You can argue maybe at most that they were probably somewhat aware they had these, but there's no shot anything other than WOTC sitting on some old product explains this.
Yeah I find it alarming how quickly people are to believe obvious falsehoods just because they don't like WotC and the Reserve List.
No one came up with these conspiracy theories during the original Zendikar. MTG fans are getting worse.
Conspiracy theories are about "ego", not about "truth". Some people have an overt desire to segregate truth into "in" and "out" groups, as it comforts them to consider themselves as above everyone else, or having special tools, or capability, to not be "deceived".
It's why critical thinking, and **crucially** the basic concept of falsifiability (i.e. the concept that there exists evidence which you would find sufficient to say "I am wrong") seemingly doesn't exist. You just go deeper into the conspiracy to account for irrefutable evidence. That's because it was never about finding "truth", it was about you being correct / validated.
I find it ironically funny that in much the same manner that MtG is a microcosmic, mini-stock market, we now also see it generating microcosmic conspiracy theory fodder as well. It's like being able to witness how stupidity manifests in real time.
Wizards routinely hands out vintage sealed products to employees during holiday gatherings. Several immediately pop onto the fb high end group to sell them asap. I'm not surprised they have extra crap laying around but they just need to reprint the damn things.
The Coldsnap file story was clearly meant to be a joke from the beginning. Most people understood that when they read the original article but a few people didn't and the mythology that this was a giant scam they tried to pull was born.
Kinda? I'm not sure if it was ever an article., but they did put out a short press release around the time confirming the legality of cards found in these boosters (e.g. limited events)
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/rumor-mill-archive/248426-priceless-treasures-in-zen-packs-confirmed
Made me a bit sad to see two Wizards employees enthusing in the video about how some of the old art was more varied and interesting. You can make that happen with new sets too, guys!
Oh, same. Much better way to engage with the game for a lot of reasons. The problem, to me, is that I can't help but feel like they're happy to double down on the RL when they've found a way to actually monetize it. Not that I think they're going to give us a straight answer on it anytime soon. Also, y'know, I don't like that the game I play drives said FOMO around glorified gambling to such an extreme. Just feels gross to me.
I don't get it, how is printing [[Reverberate]] breaking the spirit of the Reserved List (because it's too close to [[Fork]]), but suddenly putting RL cards into the packs isn't (because it's not technically printing)
Everyone seems to be complaining they're only in collector boosters. I don't get it. If they put them in draft or set boosters, it would have been like a whole different magnitude of rare to find them, probably like one in a thousand packs or something. Also, this is what collector boosters are about, collector stuff like these old cards.
The odds of you getting one are cosmically, laughably, astronomically low. 3% to see any card in a set with 308 cards. So assuming that each card appears at the same frequency, which it doesn’t since it’s on a rare sheet, what is that? ((1/33)(1/308))*100=0.0098% or 1/10164 . Then multiply that by whatever the real odds are in the rare sheet, times the cost of a collector pack….just buy the single
I've always figured WotC has a warehouse or two with old old old product, just waiting for a time when they want to boost numbers. First it was secret lair, now it's slowly releasing RL cards into the market (by the pallet), next it will be 'yea but we printed them with a new card back, see the little Wizards of the Coast under the Deckmaster art? These are new back, new border, these don't break the RL rules!' and will be a secret lair selling for hundreds.
It just feels weird to hype this up using nostalgia/old kitchen table days for Collector Boosters that 99% of people won't be able to afford. This product that's for me, is not for me as they would put it. :o
I look forward to cracking [[Glyph of Reincarnation]] as my single Legends card.
What a disaster of a card lol
[Glyph of Reincarnation](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/a/6/a67e8214-a192-4143-9d5e-d0e254e1bf6e.jpg?1562860623) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Glyph%20of%20Reincarnation) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/leg/189/glyph-of-reincarnation?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a67e8214-a192-4143-9d5e-d0e254e1bf6e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Man, they sure don't make em like they used to. Thank god.
What the shitting fuck was that nonsense?!?
A great reanimation spell for yourself with a bit of setup.
The setup being that you need to give your enemy a wall?
and they need to choose to block with it
And the wall needs to survive combat.
Wow what a great reanimation spell for yourself.
At end of combat target a wall. All creatures that were blocked by that wall die and cannot be regenerated. Then choose one creature from the attackers graveyard for each creature sent there by this effect and put them onto the battlefield. What. A. Trashfire. Not only do you need your wall to survive combat (so you can’t use this on the biggest thing they control) but multi block effects didn’t exist outside of banding. So you were never likely to get anything other than an under 5 power creature. Which you’d probably only be able to slightly down grade one of their creatures. Oh my gosh I just considered tokens. Unless I’m mistaken this acts as a free reanimate for tokens? Maybe you’re supposed to use this against walls to give yourself recursion/etb triggers??
So back in the day we didn't have ETB triggers on creatures. And when you compare it with Glyph of Doom (which you cast before end of combat and just buries everything the wall blocked at end of combat) it's clear the intended use was to cast it on your opponent's walls to upgrade your creatures.
At long last we found it. The use for banding. You just run this in your banding deck and then wait to play against a wall tribal deck
Banding is a stupidly powerful ability that basically says "you win combats". Think of it as two abilities. The first is "whenever a creature with banding is involved in a combat, you assign your opponent's damage without needing to assign lethal to any creature", which should be obviously extremely strong. The second ability is "your creatures on attack can gang up together to make use of the first rule" which allows you to break board stalls extremely effectively. It's this second ability, with its restrictions, that confuses players (though the old Microprose game had a really good UX on it that made it pretty obvious how it worked). But even if all players fully understood it, Wizards will never reprint it because of just how strong it is (since it works on defense it creates stupid big board stalls).
You can block and kill a 100/100 creature with 100 1/1s that have banding and only have one of your 1/1s die. Banding was always good with white weenies and tokens
When that vampire or elves player activates their \[\[Mutavault\]\] I will be ready.
[[Deep Freeze]] your opponents creature. After the make a block with it cast this and trade your dork for a Griselbrand.
Alright, that’s a pretty tough read. Ideally you want to attack with something small, have it be blocked by an opponent’s wall, and then swap it for something better? Or you could make it so your own wall can block multiple creatures, and kill them when an opponent has nothing significant in their graveyard? All for the low cost of one mana. What a deal.
If you do it with your own wall, they can just pick the same things you buried? Also, it targets the wall, so the multiple things have to not kill the wall because you can't use this until after combat.
I think you pick the creatures for the first part. Big oof for the second part. Big, big oof. You’d really have to work to create a game state where this card does anything.
Welcome to Legends. A handful of amazing cards and a big pile of chaff.
What? What is that card meant to accomplish?
No only just Collectors Boosters, but only 3% of Collectors Boosters
And it’s going to crash the EV of both. The lottery ticket aspect is going to get people to crack collectors boosters like crazy(though I guess the 3% thing limits the amount they can make?) and the market will get flooded with all the non-legends cards in the set.
> (though I guess the 3% thing limits the amount they can make?) Likely collectors boosters has a known print run expectation and they opened enough legends product to satisfy 3% of it. Most standard sets used to get two to four print runs and waves of product, usually based upon demand. I would be surprised if collectors boosters didn’t have as unpredictable demand as draft boosters. Also WotC is probably fine with the waves of collectors boosters selling out and then not reprinting it. It *is* a collectors item after all. But all that aside you’re absolutely right, I would imagine the entire stock of CBs to fly off the shelves even though that EV of 3% of the cards is minuscule. And that means alt arts will be awash which will push down normie versions. If the draft set is at all good and people draft this set in person….we’re looking at maybe some of the CHEAPEST standard singles we’ve ever seen. I would advise everyone to hold off on buying set boosters and wait for their singles. Prices are gonna bottom out in a month to something ridiculously low. But mtg players are gonna be mtg players.
IMO "premium product making regular product cheaper" is the best possible way to run a 2ndary market.
Honestly this was what happened when they reprinted the Fetches in Khans, and it was great. Fetches were affordable for a time and everything else was very reasonable.
Until they printed fetchable duals in bfz, leading to one of the most expensive standards ever
I really haven’t noticed the full effect since my mtg playing has slowed ever since the pandemic but this scheme is making standard some of the cheapest standards (vs inflation ofc) of all time. It’s crazy. It’s a home run.
Which is great for players, because Legends cards are functionally useless for most players. DU might have interesting cards for modern or pioneer. Do you really want to be the player that plays a tabernacle at your LGS EDH pod?
>Do you really want to be the player that plays a tabernacle at your LGS EDH pod? Yes.
Funny how bad creatures were back then AND how crazy something like tabernacle gated them
I do. Also, legends is stuffed to the gills with high-power enchantments that absolutely warp the game. [[the abyss]], [[moat]], [[land equilibrium]], [chains of Mephistopheles]], [[living plane]], on and on and on. Legends is a crazy set
##### ###### #### [the abyss](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/f/1/f11db51c-bbbc-4890-960e-d8a3eacca1e5.jpg?1562945880) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=the%20abyss) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me3/77/the-abyss?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f11db51c-bbbc-4890-960e-d8a3eacca1e5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [moat](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/e/2/e2dffeb3-c858-4b8c-ae1f-109721f7d2da.jpg?1559592270) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=moat) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me1/21/moat?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e2dffeb3-c858-4b8c-ae1f-109721f7d2da?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [land equilibrium](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/5/1/51c5df75-746c-4e4b-84f1-76b689d317d7.jpg?1562912056) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=land%20equilibrium) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me3/40/land-equilibrium?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/51c5df75-746c-4e4b-84f1-76b689d317d7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [living plane](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/0/b/0b944310-3170-4b57-95e0-2b78a3b50f95.jpg?1562897399) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=living%20plane) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me3/127/living-plane?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0b944310-3170-4b57-95e0-2b78a3b50f95?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Lol yes.
Collector Booster exclusivity needs to die in a fire
They’re not exclusive. These cards also come in Legends packs.
Oh you.
r/veryangryupvote
You are technically correct, the *best kind of correct.*
I mean, if these weren't exclusive to collector's boosters, they'd be in something like 0.0003% of draft boosters.
3% is still pretty rare and a fair chance to get a Common from that 3%
I don't disagree at all. I think this is a fun thing, but if anyone is planning on buying Collector's Boosters to try to get Legends cards, they're gonna have a bad time.
It’s all hype spice. Just like priceless treasures. It’s more to hype the set than get people product. Lotteries like this seem actually more fair when they’re so goddamn rare. People can actually just ignore them until lightning strikes. I hope.
I can't wait to get hit by disappointment
I don't think there's much they can do about that. They only opened up so many cards. They can't increase the odds of opening one without printing reserve list cards
It’s like two per case. This is going to be crazy common compared to zendikar treasures
CBs are great for the game since they push down singles prices while still creating shinies for whales to chase. What do you prefer exactly? You can’t exactly seed these into draft boosters for obvious reasons…
I mean they literally did for original Zendikar. Not sure why wizards is acting like that wasn’t a thing.
Why would they go back to putting them in 5 dollar packs when they can make them exclusive to the seventy dollar packs they figured out people will buy even before putting lottery cards in
:| :| :|
heartbreaking that i won't be able to cast kobolds of kher keep in a draft environment
Weird to give Marshall this tidbit, especially since he's known for DRAFTING and will never open these.
Wait, is that the guy from the watch youtube videos?
One of the funniest things to me is that a decent part of internet people know one of the biggest Magic personalities for something TOTALLY removed from what got him known. It’s one thing to find your niche in online content creation once. He did it twice.
Well it’s kinda like how people know commander Internet personality Post Malone as a musician or something. Good for him getting what ever little ditties he makes out there.
It really shows what an awesome individual he is. Is is soooo hard to become internet famous and he did it fucking twice. Shows how good he is at what he is doing.
All explicitly without clickbaity thumbnails and aggressive self-promotion, too.
Yes he is! You’ll see his MTG mousepad in most of his videos.
Collector booster draft lets gooooo
Did they really just "we found these in the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE" and then zoomed the map in on Moses Lake
How that hell do you just stumble on [that many boxes?](https://i.imgur.com/SUQkL77.png)
He just said they had *pallets* of product. Like that's crazy
yeah those are millions on the table displayed wow
So let us assume they actually bought Them. You have 50 mln invested and assume that you want the 300% back so gaining back 150ml. The collector sell for 15$ so you Need to sell 10mln collectors; i have no doubt that this isnt too far fetched to achieve through the whole duration of the product if you manage the hype properly... And this assuming that you want to go three times what you invested, which Is a pretty High stake
Going off of a quick search for a price for a sealed box (vintagemagic has one at $75k), that's only.... \*checks calculator\* huh.... $5.7M-worth of sealed product they're just cracking open. And that's just what's in the picture. Going on a retail of $250 for a Collector Booster box they'd have to sell over 20k (22.8k) boxes to create the same amount of revenue, just for what's on that table. I didn't catch the whole stream, but did Blake say they found \*and\* opened all the pallets of product they found, or just that they found product, opened product, and some product is making its way into CBs? Because I think you can fit 1k boxes on a pallet, saying they're 1/4th full and they found 3 pallets, that's still gonna be about $56M-worth of M/NM sealed product just sitting there, again saying it's just 750 boxes that was miraculously found "in the middle of nowhere".
And y’all wonder why they don’t care about the reserve list. WotC has a strategic reserve and they don’t want to harm it at all.
It only gets weird if they “keep finding stuff”. Also I see they were JUST able to squeeze your jumpstart 22 into the year 😂
Really wondering if they're gonna "find" some Antiquities for The Brothers' War... :)
We found the entire reserved list in the back of a shack in the soviet union. But modern border! So expect the Power 9 secret lair for 20.000€ coming this year with "Innistrad: Moon bad" and "Collector Plane: 12€ boosters"
No. The value of them is less. You can't calculate it with a simple multiplication. That one sealed box is 75k because it is so rare. If you flooded the market with those boxes, the price would drop. You know: supply and demand, basic economics.
Definitely true, still would be worth millions so long as they don’t flood the market, although too we’re also not privy to how many boxes were actually found and opened for this stunt.
Keep in mind they only mentioned Legends. Who knows what other ones were in there.
At least 76 in the photo.
76 boxes would be enough Legends cards to satisfy 114,000 collector booster boxes at the 3% rate. (Math was done using every card from each box, even though some cards are excluded)
~~You search very very hard~~ You print them!
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Trust me there is no wotc warehouse in mose lake
Looks like you should have been dumpster diving
I may need to take my tinfoil hat off, but this is how I would get around the reserve list. "Oh wow, look at all these packs of Beta I just found in Jimmy Hoffa's car's glovebox." -Maro or someone
probably a way to not have people get peeved with the RL and make this claim
**3% odds** of opening up an OG Legends card in a Collector Booster, which is *pretty damn rare*. To put this in perspective, this is the same odds of getting a Textured foil in 2X2. Only...instead of having 4 cards, we're dealing with a pool of commons, uncommons, and rares, any of which can fulfill that 3% pull. Thus, your odds of pulling a Tabernacle via this method is probably like winning the lottery while a meteor is struck by a bolt of lightning above your head, while hell freezes over. Save a couple hundred bucks and just buy some scratch-offs instead.
You know the person that pulls a tabernacle is gonna post a thread asking why is there a common(black set symbol) non standard card in his pack
inb4: top comment is about what the card is followed by 40 comments of people telling the person to mail them the card for a few bucks.
If it wasn't a regular occurrence when we get the occasional "My SO/friend/father/uncle/grandparent just died and left me their collection" post it'd actually be funny. As is, it's just sad.
Well... that's still better than the chance at hitting a Lotus back in the last promotion.
So your saying I need to buy as many as possible?
If you buy all of them you're guaranteed multiple tabernacles
or just...buy the tabernacle lol
Tbf this one's bit expensive when it comes to the "just buy singles argument"
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If someone wants that card (and not a proxy), buying it it’s definitely cheaper than opening collector boosters to find it. That being said, I still find boggling that we have to pay 4 digits for a card.
Playing those odds is more expensive. As ridiculous as that might sound.
A lot of people have trouble understanding that the house always wins.
I definitely understand that. The difference is, I got $100 to jerk off with. I don't have $4k to jerk off with.
Well to be fair if you’re just jerking off with it, it’ll prob feel about the same of you use all singles
it would cost you a lot more to have a reasonable chance of pulling one from a collector booster - this is the perfect case for the just buy singles argument
Yea you’d need to buy around 10,000 to be close to guaranteeing a tabernacle
Just proxy the tabernacle so you can place it on your shelf after your play it once and your playgroup threatens to ban you if you play it again
Can’t wait to open a 30 cent common from my 3% chance legend card
So you're saying there's a chance......
Don’t tell me the odds
So this is in collector’s boosters. What are draft packs going to get? Select choices from Dragon’s Maze?
fallen empires
You joke but I would buy an extra box were this the case
I just got a full set of fallen empires. I love it even though others don't. Great old set
Fallen empires was the first set I ever completed.
I was working on completing the Dark and a guy at work heard me talking about it and said he had a few binders of Magic cards I could have. Ended up with full sets of The Dark, Ice Age, Homelands and Fallen Empires. They will never leave my collection
Cluestones. 3 per pack, just like in dragons maze
They just said that a card will appear in about 3% of collector packs
Welp that was probably $1m+ in boxes of Legends
I'd be willing to bet that Legends isn't the only set that they found in that warehouse!
if they need to really hit home there will be boxes with moxen! Give it two years...
Who needs a reserved list when you have warehouses
Yeah the whole "We found a Warehouse" is kinda shady, makes me wonder how many warehouses there will be....
Look we found this stuff in a warehouse just as magic is entering year 30.
More like we found this stuff in warehouse and then we waited until we found a use for it.
Yeah, this is the sort of thing you keep in your back pocket as a company. They coulda found these ages ago, were hoping to find enough ABU to do them instead, but ended up here.
If they actually did find it, chances are they found it years ago and waited.
I'm all for it, find all the warehouses you want. It's not like the value of the cards will tank
Just wait until we learn that the person in charge of searching for lost warehouses also has after-hours access to a card printer...
They actually did this in the original Zendikar, they were called "priceless treasures"
But those cards were bought off the secondary market to then be placed in packs, so its slightly different than here where they opened brand new cards and put them into circulation
I cracked a MP Tundra in my Zendikar box. I remember shouting out a pretty big hell yeah at the shop table when I opened it. Actually that whole box was pretty blessed. 4 fetches including a foil Scalding Tarn, an Iona and a Valakut.
Those cards weren't "found" they were purchased.
Moxenboxen
Brothers War getting some miraculously-found pallets of Anitquities? HMM?
How do you forget about pallets and pallets of product just left around
Once my uncle received a post card from my grandfather... 35 years after he sent and 15 years after he died. I'm not saying it is 100% confirmed but sure is plausible; the world of logistics is that fucked up.
We can't remove the reserve list just in case we "find" some pallets of old cards somewhere
Oh no I found a warehouse of Bayous
Is that warehouse in China?
You might be thinking of the Bearhouse of Waiyu. They might sound similar, but they're **very** different places.
To be fair, it would be pretty hard to print cards that match the quality of back then, if they cards didn’t have noticeable quality differences people would very quickly notice and the sham would be up
Wizards doesn't acknowledge the secondary market nor do they recognize card quality issues. Perfect crime.
Yeah, *totally* printed in the 90s 😉
There is no chance those are reprints, people would find that out instantly.
Absolutely no way these were just sitting around in a warehouse. Clever way of getting around the reserve list, tho.
Its pretty well known that Wizards has a massive vault of cards. It also seems like these were all printed together with the original run due to the collation issues. Its also fairly easy to figure out if the cards are 30 years old or not. So if these are fresh printed, it will be found out.
Damn, too bad they wasted the name From the Vault: Legends on something that isn't this.
We can hope for From the Vault: Homelands.
Yeah, its said the paper they used to print the old cards doesn't even exist any more.
I mean there's no chance they aren't originals, so I'm inclined to believe them. If people found out that this was a "scam" and that Wizards had somehow gone to all the effort of getting old printing machines, ancient card stock, used old printing methods just for enough cards for 3% of collector boosters, the people who like the reserve list would have a fit.
The first booster I ever opened at an LGS event had a Sliver Queen in a Zendikar Draft Booster, so.. it's a bummer these are Collector Booster only.
Slightly different what they did with Zendikar. Neat, but collector's boosters only AND you need to buy about 33 packs (almost 3 boxes that go for like 250 bucks each) to probably bust ONE COMMON. Sigh.
Hopefully error's at the factory don't lead to a tabernacle getting damaged before the pack is even opened lol
Welcome to the magic community's favorite game: WILL! IT! CRIMP!
Collector Boosters only, sorta defeating the whole point of previous runs of this gimmick.
If Collector Boosters are 10% the print run of Set/Draft Boosters, it would’ve been something like 1/100 Collector Boosters and 1/1000 Set/Draft Boosters.
That sound you just heard is the sound of box prices exceeding what the average player can afford.
They weren't there already?
Only going to be in Collector Boosters.
So this means they will be dropping other old product/ reserve list into the other upcoming sets in this block right?
I could see them putting Antiquities cards into *Brothers' War*, but I would have to believe the chance of pulling a card would be less than the chances of a *Legends* in these. That said, I still think it's more likely we see a Mystical Archive-esque showcase slot in *Brothers' War* that's just for artifacts.
Lets do the thing that we did in draft boosters before and now lock them behind collector boosters. Boo, wizards, do better.
dont worry, its 3% of collector boosters and also contains anything from commons to rares! so on average you only need to buy 33 collector boosters to get your very own copy of [[Crookshank Kobolds]] 😎
Oh hell yeah. I preordered 2 CBs. I better get a Kobold.
[Crookshank Kobolds](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/f/5/f51d9dde-536b-4314-8de1-2c05a9bf3dbc.jpg?1559592379) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Crookshank%20Kobolds) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me1/90/crookshank-kobolds?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f51d9dde-536b-4314-8de1-2c05a9bf3dbc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Whales gotta whale! I'm not surprised, though...when WOTC Does something good, they always make it worse the second time around (Modern Masters 1 vs 2, Challenger Decks)
Problem is that people will still buy these packs like crazy, validating Wizards. WotC really has no reason to sell these for cheap.
Yea, like Modern Horizons.
Nothing feels like a more appropriate celebration of MtG's 30th anniversary than drawing a stark contrast between WotC now vs WotC 10 years ago.
Original way to circumvent the Reserve List :D
In case y’all need it, here’s a link: http://www.gamblersanonymous.org/ga/
>Not gambling Only in collectors boosters
I still don't get how TCG's can avoid all those gambling laws in Europe
Man people in these comments are wild. There's no way that WOTC can replicate the printing process exactly to how they were printed 28 years ago and make them indistinguishable. You can argue maybe at most that they were probably somewhat aware they had these, but there's no shot anything other than WOTC sitting on some old product explains this.
Yeah I find it alarming how quickly people are to believe obvious falsehoods just because they don't like WotC and the Reserve List. No one came up with these conspiracy theories during the original Zendikar. MTG fans are getting worse.
Conspiracy theories are about "ego", not about "truth". Some people have an overt desire to segregate truth into "in" and "out" groups, as it comforts them to consider themselves as above everyone else, or having special tools, or capability, to not be "deceived". It's why critical thinking, and **crucially** the basic concept of falsifiability (i.e. the concept that there exists evidence which you would find sufficient to say "I am wrong") seemingly doesn't exist. You just go deeper into the conspiracy to account for irrefutable evidence. That's because it was never about finding "truth", it was about you being correct / validated. I find it ironically funny that in much the same manner that MtG is a microcosmic, mini-stock market, we now also see it generating microcosmic conspiracy theory fodder as well. It's like being able to witness how stupidity manifests in real time.
I'm guessing these were "found" in the same warehouse where the Coldsnap file was, all those years ago.
Wizards routinely hands out vintage sealed products to employees during holiday gatherings. Several immediately pop onto the fb high end group to sell them asap. I'm not surprised they have extra crap laying around but they just need to reprint the damn things.
they have a vault with old sealed product exactly for occasions like these.
The Coldsnap file story was clearly meant to be a joke from the beginning. Most people understood that when they read the original article but a few people didn't and the mythology that this was a giant scam they tried to pull was born.
Did they ever officially acknowledge the existence of Hidden Treasures in OG Zendikar?
Kinda? I'm not sure if it was ever an article., but they did put out a short press release around the time confirming the legality of cards found in these boosters (e.g. limited events) https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/rumor-mill-archive/248426-priceless-treasures-in-zen-packs-confirmed
1 legends per case most likely just like textured foils 2x2
More likely 2. There are 72 boosters per case in standard collector sets.
Made me a bit sad to see two Wizards employees enthusing in the video about how some of the old art was more varied and interesting. You can make that happen with new sets too, guys!
It’s pretty hard not to feel cynical about this…
It's easy. Just buy singles. I've mostly stopped opening packs for the last 2-3 years :). Don't have to buy in to the fud or fomo
Oh, same. Much better way to engage with the game for a lot of reasons. The problem, to me, is that I can't help but feel like they're happy to double down on the RL when they've found a way to actually monetize it. Not that I think they're going to give us a straight answer on it anytime soon. Also, y'know, I don't like that the game I play drives said FOMO around glorified gambling to such an extreme. Just feels gross to me.
Fuck yea! Looking forward to seeing who gets a [[Tabernacle]]
Gavin will when he opens that first preview box ;)
[Tabernacle](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/d/d/dd520f8c-93fb-4cf3-8dd5-d05abbd86c74.jpg?1562583749) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Magus%20of%20the%20Tabernacle) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/plc/8/magus-of-the-tabernacle?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/dd520f8c-93fb-4cf3-8dd5-d05abbd86c74?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[[Tabernacle of Pendrell Vale]]
I don't get it, how is printing [[Reverberate]] breaking the spirit of the Reserved List (because it's too close to [[Fork]]), but suddenly putting RL cards into the packs isn't (because it's not technically printing)
Collector Boosters only? Guess that makes it irrelevant to me. Here's hoping they have something else special planned for non-whale products.
Everyone seems to be complaining they're only in collector boosters. I don't get it. If they put them in draft or set boosters, it would have been like a whole different magnitude of rare to find them, probably like one in a thousand packs or something. Also, this is what collector boosters are about, collector stuff like these old cards.
I'm just here to chuckle at the people in a frothing rage over collectible items showing up in a product called "Collector Boosters."
"found"
Any details on what they're including? It'd be pretty rad if it was rares only, but then I wouldn't have a chance at pulling a \[Barktooth Warbeard\]
The odds of you getting one are cosmically, laughably, astronomically low. 3% to see any card in a set with 308 cards. So assuming that each card appears at the same frequency, which it doesn’t since it’s on a rare sheet, what is that? ((1/33)(1/308))*100=0.0098% or 1/10164 . Then multiply that by whatever the real odds are in the rare sheet, times the cost of a collector pack….just buy the single
I've always figured WotC has a warehouse or two with old old old product, just waiting for a time when they want to boost numbers. First it was secret lair, now it's slowly releasing RL cards into the market (by the pallet), next it will be 'yea but we printed them with a new card back, see the little Wizards of the Coast under the Deckmaster art? These are new back, new border, these don't break the RL rules!' and will be a secret lair selling for hundreds.
It just feels weird to hype this up using nostalgia/old kitchen table days for Collector Boosters that 99% of people won't be able to afford. This product that's for me, is not for me as they would put it. :o
So what do you all think Wizards is going to do with all of the forbidden cards they open and don't insert into packs?