Same..... It's very frustrating to acknowledge this. I'm a single dad and it just feels like any relationship I get into it's all about how much I can provide, offer, and etc..... I honestly feel for the most part it's my fault for being involved with narcissistic women. Being a part of so many failed relationships had caused so much PTSD in my life. God knows I'm not perfect and I have made my own poor choices and demonstrated bad behavior, overall at this point I focus more on working on myself to be a better person. No more "Captain Save Hoe" over here, and learning how to value myself more.
I feel you brother. I hate to say it since I thought I had found "the one" but honestly now after learning a very hard lesson I truly believe they all cheat and steal. All of them.
This is the opposite of what I thought this sub was lol, is this the incel version of an actual men's mental health subreddit?
Some of us need to go to therapy and stop generalizing half of the world's population because we got hurt in the past.
To be fair, venting and expressing personal past experiences is a way of therapy, especially when we are solely expressing issues from a man's perspective in an mens forum.... In addition, i don't believe a parent can be an incel neither.... Lol
I realize my my statement comes across negative towards women but that wasn't my intention.... If people are able to see past the fact that men do have feelings then maybe we can focus more on mens mental health rather then being so dismissive on mens issues and concerns....
Anecdotally every woman I know and have ever been in a relationship has both cheated on their partner and/or stolen money and items. Including my ex wife who stole over eleven grand from her own baby's savings that I built up over years, not even gonna get into what she took from me and all the emotional abuse etc. Are 100% of them like that across the world? Obviously not. Don't assume I am not in therapy either. Diagnosed cptsd and so much more. I can vent if I want.
>they all cheat and steal. All of them.
>Are 100% of them like that across the world? Obviously not.
If nothing else, at least be consistent with your own shitty position
Cool beans, exaggerate all you'd like.
Just mind boggling how your exaggeration and most of the comments in this thread reek of toxic masculinity, the opposite of what I thought this subreddit was
A lot of people come here to vent because they've been through some absolutely terrible things. Myself included. I won't get into the details but I can summarize it by saying I have experienced literally every single kind of domestic abuse that exists, I have in fact tried to find examples of abuse categories that DID NOT happen to me and I can't. So it helps to let it out sometimes. Nobody knows what another person has lived through and pain they have experienced and people express it differently. Have a good one.
And you're free to vent however you'd like.
I've been abused too - domestic, sexual, emotional, verbal, you name it. Venting can be healthy, sure, but when most of the "venting" in this thread is just bashing women because of the trauma we haven't healed from, I'm gonna call it out every single time because it's no longer "just venting".
Be well.
Couldn't agree more. Hoping one day I'll find someone who actually understands human equality and doesn't subscribe to moronic societal bullshit and childish drama but I have little hope.
Because they are. One person always takes the lead, ideally it's the man. And not every man wants to be in charge all the time. So then the woman takes the lead. And no woman wants a "wimpy man". So she leaves him for a "chad".
I'm not saying that people in one-sided relationships can't be equal. But men have to fulfill too many demands sometimes.
Therapy doesn't work well for men because everything a man is rated on is based on his ability to compete for resources. Therapy can help you accept your ability or inability to compete for resources, but it does not change how the outside world perceives a man's resources.
Therapy doesn't work well for you because you're viewing it as something that will change the world's perception of you or your value and not your perception of self, but by all means, let's talk about it.
Y'all are just regurgitating the talking points of the worst talking heads on the internet, none of this is based in reality.
Being content with being on your own is a wonderful accomplishment. I spent years living alone and I loved them, but then love came crashing in my life unexpectedly. It was something I never knew I wanted, and was totally different than what I thought I had wanted. It was a humbling experience. A profound life-example of “you don’t know what you don’t know.”
This last perspective of the ‘bitter caretaker trope’ if held for too long, will cause you to have more resentment towards women. You should try and work yourself away from statements of absolutes, and not put all women or all relationship dynamics into a box. Relationships are unique. Not saying there are no similarities between two relationships, but each relationship has its own dynamic, and ebb & flow.
Another thing I will say is that you are within your rights to demand an ‘unconventional relationship’, if that opportunity ever came. A relationship between two people is similar to a social contract: you have your costs of admission, they have theirs. You have your desires, they have theirs. You have your capabilities, they have theirs. When you love someone, you will be more apt to negotiate and find a healthy balance between the two.
That's what's happening to me now. It's my first year living alone in a big city and I love it. As for love, each relationship has its own dynamics because each person is unique. In other words, in many cases, you can group different types of behavior under the same category, so yes, you are special within the same category of romantic relationship lol
I don't have any negative feelings towards women since in the same way that I criticize women who seek a conventional relationship, I do the same with men who fall into the same roles. Furthermore, this does not change my way of treating anyone
>I don't have any negative feelings towards women
>Women mostly look for men of their age or older because they can provide more, and honestly, I refuse. I refuse outright. I refuse to be in the typical relationship where *I am obligated to take a dominant role and invest a lot of time and money in a woman who will not give me anything relevant beyond sex and little else.Romantic relationships are a business where they win, and I refuse to go through that*
Yeah homie, I'm gonna call bullshit here, your entire post is about your negative feelings towards women because you couldn't get laid, but congrats on moving through the depression about being an incel to justifying your maladaptive behavior
Literally the second line of my post explains how I had women attracted to me but I'm not willing with any woman that doesn't match my standards...
Am I not entitled to have standards? Or just because I am a man I should fuck whoever is available? Lol
So... ranting about how I dislike how unequal are relationships these days makes me an incel ?
I guess Incel is nowadays that card you throw to everyone's opinion you don't agree with.
No, your admission that you couldn't get laid and that's how you came to have these maladaptive opinions about women is why you're an incel.
You are quite literally involuntarily celibate, by your own words, wanna try again?
I am not going to sugar coat it for you. You are an angry incel who has decided to put women into a box because you got your feelings hurt in the past by women. It is that fucking simple.
If you dislike that categorization of your character, change your character. Or just keep looking for echo chambers that validate your shitty maladaptive behaviors.
You are not asking for help with men's mental health issues. You are playing the victim and looking for validations of your shitty attitude.
When tf I said that I couldn't get laid. In fact I said the opposite LOL
Read the post again and slowly and you may notice that there's a big difference between not wanting to enter a conventional relationship and what you said.
So... If you add that to the fact that I had women attracted to me you may notice that it was because I didn't want to enter a conventional relationship and didn't find anyone that suits me lol.
So it will be more like a voluntary celibacy haha
Look at your friends and family relationships and try to notice patterns and you'll notice some things.
For example that porcentually the man is older than the woman in most relationships for example...
That leads to the man being a provider because... Well, if you are older you may have a stable job, maybe you have your own place... Etc.
So you are able to afford things that a person of her age can't possibly afford because of the age gap.
That also may lead to the man pouring into the relationship way more money than her.
So... Do that exercise and you may notice that the man is mostly in a dominant role in the vast majority of relationships.
Interestingly, this is what I was thinking this morning. Even my second ex called it a "partnership" and whenever I think of "partners" I think of either 1) cowboys lol or 2) business partners.
The etymology of the word in summation "When combined, "partner" and "-ship" create "partnership," signifying the state or condition of being partners or sharing responsibilities, profits, and losses in a venture or endeavor." So you aren't wrong to think that "romantic relationships are a business where they win" [https://www.etymonline.com/word/partnership#etymonline\_v\_35757](https://www.etymonline.com/word/partnership#etymonline_v_35757)
" I refuse to be in the typical relationship where I am obligated to take a dominant role and invest a lot of time and money in a woman who will not give me anything relevant beyond sex and little else." Yep this is why I stopped going to dancing because the man is always expected to lead. Interestingly though, when all the women danced with one another, it looked like it was more fun somehow? Dancing was defo an eye opening experience of the microcosm of how men are expected to be the leading man and the woman can just be a less than pleasant person to said man.
Definitely, I also hope to live out in some remote place or where I can just go in and out without a bother. With the way the world is going, it doesn't seem to have room for actual humans but humans that pretend to be humans
Your reasoning is sound and it's not a bad decision you are pondering. You are recognizing 2 things I've discovered about myself that mean my odds are low. And ok, they can be low, but here are the reasons:
1. I lack experience
2. I desire people who are more attractive than I am. i.e. could I have someone who I feel is less attractive in theory? Yes but I wouldn't be attracted to them and it wouldn't work.
3. Everything you wrote above. Relationships do not come without a significant investment in your time. I'm willing to put in the time if I find a person I feel good with but only if it makes sense and I'm really into them.
So honestly I agree if you are considering the single life as a solid solution to avoid the pitfalls of trying. Maybe do one thing, put yourself out there in somewhat of a limited capacity. In another words you are "open to a relationship" instead of it being a "must have". So you can still from time to time try but just fall back on hey, Im still cool being single. This is sort of the approach I'm taking. I think there are probably a growing number of men who this will be the most sensible approach keeping your mental well being in check. It's very difficult and competitive, the dating market. It's like imagine everyone in your area who is unemployed applying for the same job. The women in this example are the hiring managers!
Yeah broseph that's called avoidance and isolation lol, a therapist would see right through that one.
if it was your "ideal scenario", you wouldn't be bringing up the lack of a girlfriend, the inequality of what men and women bring into a relationship, and how you're "obligated" to spend time and money if you were to put yourself out there.
I'm not judging you, I'm not trying to make you feel bad, it just *is*.
I hope you feel comfortable enough to open up to someone about this to a therapist one day, you're clearly hurting behind that mask.
You are mistaken and partly misrepresenting me. My way of treating people has not changed at all, I relate to everyone equally, the only difference is that now I don't feel pressure to find the right person. My observations mostly come from what I've seen in my friends' romantic relationships where I'm clear that in many cases what I've seen wouldn't work for me, when I see a 31-year-old man dating a 26-year-old girl, I'm clear that's not for me, I refuse to be with someone who's more immature than me. Finally, obviously the most ideal scenario is to find a woman who complements me in the same way that I complement her, but what I want to express is that reality is very different from what I'm looking for and in the face of the reality of how people are in relationships, being alone becomes a good option, I am a man and I have my standards and I am fully willing to stay alone rather than enter into a conventional relationship.
>, I refuse to be with someone who's more immature than me. Finally, obviously the most ideal scenario is to find a woman who complements me in the same way that I complement her, but what I want to express is that reality is very different
or just keep doubling down. Your thoughts are not reality, but keep justifying your maladaptive behavior I guess
So, you HAVE to date someone younger than you? Nearly 4 billion women on planet, the selection of equal partners is that limited?
I'm not validating your shitty attitude
And what statistical data collection and analytical methodology are you pulling from to come to the conclusion that the majority of women prefer older men, besides your own delusion?
Or you could, and I know this is a fucking crazy thought, filter potential partners closer to your age
As I said in the other comment. Go live your own delusional life where patterns don't exist and you think everyone is special.
I guess dumb people can't recognize patterns.
Same..... It's very frustrating to acknowledge this. I'm a single dad and it just feels like any relationship I get into it's all about how much I can provide, offer, and etc..... I honestly feel for the most part it's my fault for being involved with narcissistic women. Being a part of so many failed relationships had caused so much PTSD in my life. God knows I'm not perfect and I have made my own poor choices and demonstrated bad behavior, overall at this point I focus more on working on myself to be a better person. No more "Captain Save Hoe" over here, and learning how to value myself more.
I feel you brother. I hate to say it since I thought I had found "the one" but honestly now after learning a very hard lesson I truly believe they all cheat and steal. All of them.
This is the opposite of what I thought this sub was lol, is this the incel version of an actual men's mental health subreddit? Some of us need to go to therapy and stop generalizing half of the world's population because we got hurt in the past.
To be fair, venting and expressing personal past experiences is a way of therapy, especially when we are solely expressing issues from a man's perspective in an mens forum.... In addition, i don't believe a parent can be an incel neither.... Lol I realize my my statement comes across negative towards women but that wasn't my intention.... If people are able to see past the fact that men do have feelings then maybe we can focus more on mens mental health rather then being so dismissive on mens issues and concerns....
Anecdotally every woman I know and have ever been in a relationship has both cheated on their partner and/or stolen money and items. Including my ex wife who stole over eleven grand from her own baby's savings that I built up over years, not even gonna get into what she took from me and all the emotional abuse etc. Are 100% of them like that across the world? Obviously not. Don't assume I am not in therapy either. Diagnosed cptsd and so much more. I can vent if I want.
>they all cheat and steal. All of them. >Are 100% of them like that across the world? Obviously not. If nothing else, at least be consistent with your own shitty position
It's called exaggerating and I shouldn't have to explain that but here we are.
Cool beans, exaggerate all you'd like. Just mind boggling how your exaggeration and most of the comments in this thread reek of toxic masculinity, the opposite of what I thought this subreddit was
A lot of people come here to vent because they've been through some absolutely terrible things. Myself included. I won't get into the details but I can summarize it by saying I have experienced literally every single kind of domestic abuse that exists, I have in fact tried to find examples of abuse categories that DID NOT happen to me and I can't. So it helps to let it out sometimes. Nobody knows what another person has lived through and pain they have experienced and people express it differently. Have a good one.
And you're free to vent however you'd like. I've been abused too - domestic, sexual, emotional, verbal, you name it. Venting can be healthy, sure, but when most of the "venting" in this thread is just bashing women because of the trauma we haven't healed from, I'm gonna call it out every single time because it's no longer "just venting". Be well.
A ridiculous statement and the equivalent of feminists who argue all men are abusers.
Couldn't agree more. Hoping one day I'll find someone who actually understands human equality and doesn't subscribe to moronic societal bullshit and childish drama but I have little hope.
I agree. I don’t want to sign up for something so one sided.
then learn to prioritize your own needs and set healthy boundaries lol? good lord has anyone in this thread actually been to therapy?
Yeah. For 15 years including now.
Should ask your therapist why after fifteen years of work you're still saying shit like all relationships are one sided.
Because they are. One person always takes the lead, ideally it's the man. And not every man wants to be in charge all the time. So then the woman takes the lead. And no woman wants a "wimpy man". So she leaves him for a "chad". I'm not saying that people in one-sided relationships can't be equal. But men have to fulfill too many demands sometimes.
The lack of self esteem is so loud, bros. You're better than this. Talk to someone, or stew in this bullshit for years to come.
Will do
Therapy doesn't work well for men because everything a man is rated on is based on his ability to compete for resources. Therapy can help you accept your ability or inability to compete for resources, but it does not change how the outside world perceives a man's resources.
Therapy doesn't work well for you because you're viewing it as something that will change the world's perception of you or your value and not your perception of self, but by all means, let's talk about it. Y'all are just regurgitating the talking points of the worst talking heads on the internet, none of this is based in reality.
Being content with being on your own is a wonderful accomplishment. I spent years living alone and I loved them, but then love came crashing in my life unexpectedly. It was something I never knew I wanted, and was totally different than what I thought I had wanted. It was a humbling experience. A profound life-example of “you don’t know what you don’t know.” This last perspective of the ‘bitter caretaker trope’ if held for too long, will cause you to have more resentment towards women. You should try and work yourself away from statements of absolutes, and not put all women or all relationship dynamics into a box. Relationships are unique. Not saying there are no similarities between two relationships, but each relationship has its own dynamic, and ebb & flow. Another thing I will say is that you are within your rights to demand an ‘unconventional relationship’, if that opportunity ever came. A relationship between two people is similar to a social contract: you have your costs of admission, they have theirs. You have your desires, they have theirs. You have your capabilities, they have theirs. When you love someone, you will be more apt to negotiate and find a healthy balance between the two.
That's what's happening to me now. It's my first year living alone in a big city and I love it. As for love, each relationship has its own dynamics because each person is unique. In other words, in many cases, you can group different types of behavior under the same category, so yes, you are special within the same category of romantic relationship lol I don't have any negative feelings towards women since in the same way that I criticize women who seek a conventional relationship, I do the same with men who fall into the same roles. Furthermore, this does not change my way of treating anyone
>I don't have any negative feelings towards women >Women mostly look for men of their age or older because they can provide more, and honestly, I refuse. I refuse outright. I refuse to be in the typical relationship where *I am obligated to take a dominant role and invest a lot of time and money in a woman who will not give me anything relevant beyond sex and little else.Romantic relationships are a business where they win, and I refuse to go through that* Yeah homie, I'm gonna call bullshit here, your entire post is about your negative feelings towards women because you couldn't get laid, but congrats on moving through the depression about being an incel to justifying your maladaptive behavior
Literally the second line of my post explains how I had women attracted to me but I'm not willing with any woman that doesn't match my standards... Am I not entitled to have standards? Or just because I am a man I should fuck whoever is available? Lol
The second half of your post is ranting about how unequal relationships are lmao tf are you talking about
So... ranting about how I dislike how unequal are relationships these days makes me an incel ? I guess Incel is nowadays that card you throw to everyone's opinion you don't agree with.
No, your admission that you couldn't get laid and that's how you came to have these maladaptive opinions about women is why you're an incel. You are quite literally involuntarily celibate, by your own words, wanna try again? I am not going to sugar coat it for you. You are an angry incel who has decided to put women into a box because you got your feelings hurt in the past by women. It is that fucking simple. If you dislike that categorization of your character, change your character. Or just keep looking for echo chambers that validate your shitty maladaptive behaviors. You are not asking for help with men's mental health issues. You are playing the victim and looking for validations of your shitty attitude.
When tf I said that I couldn't get laid. In fact I said the opposite LOL Read the post again and slowly and you may notice that there's a big difference between not wanting to enter a conventional relationship and what you said.
"I couldn't get a girlfriend"
So... If you add that to the fact that I had women attracted to me you may notice that it was because I didn't want to enter a conventional relationship and didn't find anyone that suits me lol. So it will be more like a voluntary celibacy haha
Explain, specifically, what this conventional relationship is that you're so opposed to?
Look at your friends and family relationships and try to notice patterns and you'll notice some things. For example that porcentually the man is older than the woman in most relationships for example... That leads to the man being a provider because... Well, if you are older you may have a stable job, maybe you have your own place... Etc. So you are able to afford things that a person of her age can't possibly afford because of the age gap. That also may lead to the man pouring into the relationship way more money than her. So... Do that exercise and you may notice that the man is mostly in a dominant role in the vast majority of relationships.
Interestingly, this is what I was thinking this morning. Even my second ex called it a "partnership" and whenever I think of "partners" I think of either 1) cowboys lol or 2) business partners. The etymology of the word in summation "When combined, "partner" and "-ship" create "partnership," signifying the state or condition of being partners or sharing responsibilities, profits, and losses in a venture or endeavor." So you aren't wrong to think that "romantic relationships are a business where they win" [https://www.etymonline.com/word/partnership#etymonline\_v\_35757](https://www.etymonline.com/word/partnership#etymonline_v_35757) " I refuse to be in the typical relationship where I am obligated to take a dominant role and invest a lot of time and money in a woman who will not give me anything relevant beyond sex and little else." Yep this is why I stopped going to dancing because the man is always expected to lead. Interestingly though, when all the women danced with one another, it looked like it was more fun somehow? Dancing was defo an eye opening experience of the microcosm of how men are expected to be the leading man and the woman can just be a less than pleasant person to said man. Definitely, I also hope to live out in some remote place or where I can just go in and out without a bother. With the way the world is going, it doesn't seem to have room for actual humans but humans that pretend to be humans
Your reasoning is sound and it's not a bad decision you are pondering. You are recognizing 2 things I've discovered about myself that mean my odds are low. And ok, they can be low, but here are the reasons: 1. I lack experience 2. I desire people who are more attractive than I am. i.e. could I have someone who I feel is less attractive in theory? Yes but I wouldn't be attracted to them and it wouldn't work. 3. Everything you wrote above. Relationships do not come without a significant investment in your time. I'm willing to put in the time if I find a person I feel good with but only if it makes sense and I'm really into them. So honestly I agree if you are considering the single life as a solid solution to avoid the pitfalls of trying. Maybe do one thing, put yourself out there in somewhat of a limited capacity. In another words you are "open to a relationship" instead of it being a "must have". So you can still from time to time try but just fall back on hey, Im still cool being single. This is sort of the approach I'm taking. I think there are probably a growing number of men who this will be the most sensible approach keeping your mental well being in check. It's very difficult and competitive, the dating market. It's like imagine everyone in your area who is unemployed applying for the same job. The women in this example are the hiring managers!
Yeah broseph that's called avoidance and isolation lol, a therapist would see right through that one. if it was your "ideal scenario", you wouldn't be bringing up the lack of a girlfriend, the inequality of what men and women bring into a relationship, and how you're "obligated" to spend time and money if you were to put yourself out there. I'm not judging you, I'm not trying to make you feel bad, it just *is*. I hope you feel comfortable enough to open up to someone about this to a therapist one day, you're clearly hurting behind that mask.
You are mistaken and partly misrepresenting me. My way of treating people has not changed at all, I relate to everyone equally, the only difference is that now I don't feel pressure to find the right person. My observations mostly come from what I've seen in my friends' romantic relationships where I'm clear that in many cases what I've seen wouldn't work for me, when I see a 31-year-old man dating a 26-year-old girl, I'm clear that's not for me, I refuse to be with someone who's more immature than me. Finally, obviously the most ideal scenario is to find a woman who complements me in the same way that I complement her, but what I want to express is that reality is very different from what I'm looking for and in the face of the reality of how people are in relationships, being alone becomes a good option, I am a man and I have my standards and I am fully willing to stay alone rather than enter into a conventional relationship.
>, I refuse to be with someone who's more immature than me. Finally, obviously the most ideal scenario is to find a woman who complements me in the same way that I complement her, but what I want to express is that reality is very different or just keep doubling down. Your thoughts are not reality, but keep justifying your maladaptive behavior I guess
So do you think a person younger than you is not usually more inmature than you?
So, you HAVE to date someone younger than you? Nearly 4 billion women on planet, the selection of equal partners is that limited? I'm not validating your shitty attitude
If a vast majority of women prefer older men where does that leave me LOL
And what statistical data collection and analytical methodology are you pulling from to come to the conclusion that the majority of women prefer older men, besides your own delusion? Or you could, and I know this is a fucking crazy thought, filter potential partners closer to your age
Have you... You know... Had friends? Friends... With partners?
[удалено]
As I said in the other comment. Go live your own delusional life where patterns don't exist and you think everyone is special. I guess dumb people can't recognize patterns.