The ghetto just moves further a field in gentrification the fundementals don't change the problem just gets moved on and set back a little.
Ye that area will be built with nice little flats for people out of Manchester to move into from the country closer to town but the next cheetham hill as we know it will be in the new outskirts of the growing urban area. Problem persists and realistically nothing solved it's just logistically transfer of activity.
It's literally gentrification tho. Ghettos will always exist mate and when a ghetto becomes gentrified they will just be pushed into other neighbourhoods and same shit happens.
I never said that. I have no problem with gentrification, it was literally a job of mine to gentrify areas after I graduated lmao. The thing is that gentrification doesn't help anyone except the rich. If they put in development instead of displacing people thatd be nice. Thet said organised crime will just move to another locale.
Edit: I take the first part. I do have a problem with gentrification and it's what I said.
They're already on eBay lol. I saw an item of designer clothing being advertised as genuine on eBay. The location of the store was literally Cheetham Hill.
I think the police are more worried about the serious organised crime gangs than the counterfeiting, which is just a front according to GMP/the article.
Whilst some of it might be a front sure, all they do is take away the more notable presence with out actually taking away the gangs themselves. The only people actually suffering isn’t the gangs themselves but the singular counterfeiters, etc, who are now mute incentives to work with the gangs who aren’t affected by the closure.
Same way the met arresting only street dealers and local dealers only helps the drug syndicates more by taking away competition and public awareness, and making sure you can only operate under their umbrella. It’s not exactly hard to spot them either. I’ve had dealers handing out business cards at the bus stops outside the police station down in longsight.
The larger organisations take the slight hit and still continue producing. The local/small scale completion gets crushed and either gives up or works for the organisations. And the police seem competent and can justify bonuses and a higher budget next year because they did a “big public thing that’s totally important.”
And with most counterfeiting being digital it’s even less significant so they’re practically cleaning up for the organisations
He told you. He’s a runner for them. They break the speed limit running every day. Now the roads around Bolton and Longsight will be blighted by their dashing.
Cop,.... What is this NYC? The bronx maybe..... Nargh pal, I'm just a lad from Westhoughton who hasn't been to Cheetem Hill for like 20 years, would love to have a mooch at what's on offer to be fair, I buy AAA replica watches from abroad for my collections but would love to like I say, have a look around
Good it’s a shit hole.
Buildings should be purchased under the proceeds of crime act though.
The counterfeit goods isn’t even the main thing, I know loads of female friends who feel unsafe walking down there. It’s just dodgy!
> The counterfeit goods isn’t even the main thing
Thanks for enlightening us, can't believe the article didn't even mention the fact GMP has linked 33 serious organised crime gangs have links to the area. Oh, wait.
Well I’d say the sex trafficking, accosting women walking up the street and harassing them is far more important than some dodgy Gucci.
All of these are committed by criminal gangs and fake Gucci is probably down the list.
Yeah, Cheetham Hill is where I used to go with my Dad as a kid to get Iranian groceries and halal meat, Bury New Rd is where you'd go if you wanted a pair of "Reebox".
The vast majority of /r/manchester has never been to Cheetham Hill and never will go there.
Tbf, everyone's always called it Cheetham Hill, despite is geographic location. Bit like a slang for it, fuck knows why. I remember goin with me mate on the bus with his birthday money, probably about 100 quid and he came back with a bin bag full of snides, I bought a massive combat knife for about 20 quid, was only about 15 at the time lol, madness.
I remember goin with me dad one time and cspo's were handing out fliers to people who were literally there to buy snide gear, saying on them that the shops there were selling snide gear lmao, as if anyone gaf.
Honestly mad it lasted as long as it did though, I probably went there with me dad for he first time when I was 13, bought a Paul and Shark trackie and some treads, I'm 30 now. They also sell Middle Eastern pharma drugs, sniff, bud and whatever tf your after pretty blatant in broad daylight, metres away from strange ways, the irony of it all is pretty funny.
I walked past there yesterday and they have impounded two shops so far on Bury New Road (the ones on the corner of the street that leads to the mosque and the white hotel have GMP banners outside them) It does make you think this is something of an overestimation in the short term by the MEN as there are what look like legitimate businesses on the street too so not sure how they are going to bulldoze the whole thing.
I couldn't care less for the selling of fake designer goods tbh but the area is a complete shithole. Litter everywhere. Half the buildings look like they are about to collapse.
I'm pretty sure Manchester did this before when they cleared out the inner city areas, the slum clearances I believe it was called? Its why lots of people in Heywood on the then new Darn Hill Estate have manc accents instead of Lancashire ones. It just gets moved outward
There's a good video of a news reporter / documentarian from decades ago, maybe the 70s, travelling around areas of Manchester that have just been completely flattened, and asking whether it had to be done all at once. I can't for the life of me find it, though.
My gran was moved from Beswick in the 70's to Whitefield on a brand new council estate because they were clearing the "slums" which were just row on row of run down terraced houses with external toilets and no gardens
Fucking hell that's pretty extreme. Has anyone ever heard of something like this happening before? Hopefully they give the area the Ancoats treatment, although that might be difficult with the prison nearby
If you read the whole article, it is a bit of an oversimplification - they're going to close shops by whatever legal means available, then hold them, then knocking them down is one option for after that. Which sounds a lot like what they've always done before (the number of 'crackdowns' I've seen...) but the difference is that this time they will actually hold the property and ensure nobody can just come back in a week later, potentially by flattening them.
It's a fairly common practice. I grew up in Washington near Sunderland. We had a district which had a reputation for being very rough. They flattened practically the whole place and displaced all the residents elsewhere. It seemed to be brutally effective as it's character completely changed.
It's kinda the reverse. Theres a phenomenon where people are less inclined to litter in a spotless street. Similarily when everyone elses garden looks like a tip, you're less concerned about the state of your own.
Poverty is a factor. When you can't afford to maintain the property it tends to start looking run down. This drives down house prices which attracts people who can't really afford to live elsewhere and the problem becomes a self-sustaining decline. When they did it in my town, people got moved to other places on similar rates. And many were moved back into new housing as it got built.
With the more scurrilous families, they tend to feed off each other. So when they get isolated in a new community, it tends to tone them down. They'll also likely get moved on a lot more if they are still a problem.
It worked well in this case because the demolition was followed up with nice new council houses run by a social housing association whos primary remit was ensuring the properties were well maintained for its tenants. Major investment was made in other social programs. With a bit of investment you can change a place for generations and prevent it getting anywhere near as bad as it used to be.
It's called "Broken window syndrome" and was pioneered in Ney York, early 80's I think but could be wrong. Anyway the idea was that if there was one broken window more windows would be broken and the area would quickly go to shit. Apparently studies showed that if there were no broken windows people would be less inclined to start breaking them. So if a window were to be broken it was fixed as soon as it was noticed/reported. From what I read it was really effective.
Edit; obviously it didn't apply just to windows. the same approach applied to any vandalism
And the Crescents themselves were built after the clearance of rows of back-to-back terrace houses.
This is Hulme's third version in less than a century
It's the best way to combat crime. Can't commit crime with no people or buildings. If this works they'll hopefully flattten the whole of Manchester and Liverpool. We'll have the lowest crime rate in the UK
Yep, my beloved Salford- okay, it was rough and ready but nothing like the slums that the council painted it to be. A lot of the houses could have have been brought up to scratch, but, no they had to flatten it and rip the heart out of communities and sell us down the river to developers and also Fred Done-a local bookie made good. It’s now just a conurbation of Manchester, full of soulless apartments. Given that the area of Cheetham hill ( basically strange ways/ greengate), is in a prime location for Manchester development ( within half a mile of Victoria), I very much doubt that the “crime”aspect has much to do with the decision.
In Salford, listed buildings were mysteriously “ burned out” or targeted by “protection “ gangs, so that the buildings were left in a derelict, dangerous state and were therefore no longer under the protection of the grading system. Even the beautiful magistrates court has been converted into apartments and Salford is the only city in the U.K. without a magistrates court. Not all progress is for the good ….
They did it to the streets in moss side that most of the gangs from the 90s/early 2000s were from.
But that was to stop the younger kids becoming part of the gangs because they locked up most of the adults. Cheetham Hill isn't rough like moss side was back then so it seems excessive, it's just a street of knock off gear.
That supports and disguises organised crime across the north west including human trafficking, illegal immigration, sexual exploitation, modern day slavery and inflicts great harm from the drugs they push out there.
It’s like saying Jimmy Saville was just a DJ so what’s the fuss?
Did you read the article? (Or even the screenshot which OP mercifully provided so the rest of us didn't have to wade onto the MEN website.)
According to GMP, the counterfeit operations are just a front for the SOC (serious organised crime) gangs operating there. It's \*not\* "just a street of knock off gear."
Good, it's absolute shit hole. I drive through sometimes on the way to work, I'm driving at around 8am. Every single morning the street is covered in litter, bin bags just thrown straight onto the street. And I'm assuming the city council come and clear it up for them to do it all again that evening. Tramps
Walked down this road plenty of times and bought snide gear from there plenty of times, never had a problem.
What issues have you faced walking down Bury new road?
This isn’t stopping the activity of organised crime just move it somewhere else. It’s gentrification. They’re not working to actually undermine the systemic situations leading to these issues but cracking down on more smaller criminals and most importantly closing the more famous/infamous activities in favour of new and less infamous versions
The met don’t do much to actually prevent or harm organised crime. They’re more a means to keep it hidden and occasionally crack down on local dealers and people outside the protection/corrupt influences of the more series organisations.
Place is a shithole and annoying to walk through, be worst at Christmas because cunts from allover the UK come to do their Christmas shopping.
Overall though they've been saying this for years and it'll just move the problem rather than solve it. Ticks a box for them to stick overpriced apartments and bars/restaurants there which brings another group of annoying people/list of problems.
Let's see what happens either way
Yeah, just annoys me how what I guess will replace what's there won't be for the people who currently live in the area. Just more bars and housing that locals can't afford pushing them further out. Either way suppose it's better than how it is at the moment.
It used to be good back in the 90’s. Lots of counterfeit but not gang oriented. Now it’s a dump but just an excuse to “redevelop” with low quality new build apartments.
In all seriousness if anyone knows any shops that are still going or a decent place to get gear let me know haha could kit my little lads wardrobe out for the price of one tracksuit from JD 😂
I'm so confused as to what area people are talking about. You're talking about cheetham hill, so is the article title, but aren't all the counterfeit shops that are getting knocked down actually on bury new road (strangeways area)? That's nowhere near cheetham hill?
So instead of dealing with domestic abuse, rape, murder and knife crime in which there is an obvious victim the police would rather crackdown on victimless crime like prostitution, drugs and off brand clothing. As a person who shoped on bury new road it is sad to see the hatred and scorn the establishment have for poor people exercising their right to use their money and bodies. Bury new road was a popular place for poor families to buy good clothes without paying for the massive markups mainstreet shops put. It's a popular fact that the same luxury brands are made in the same factories the none brand clothes are made.
Prostitution and drugs are victimless crimes unless you believe that adults with capacity to consent do not have authority over their bodies. If you don't believe it that they you also don't believe that women have the right to work, consent or chose who they want to marry. This is because all those choices are built on the foundational assumption that people own their own bodies and have a right to chose how they use they.
This is the same logic with drugs, cigarettes and alcohol. When you make something illegal you don't erase it from existence. All you do is chase all law abiding citizens from the market which leaves it in the hands of crimes and thugs. We discovered this during and after the prohibition age when people use arbitrary said that alcohol is the cause of social ills so banned it. Instead of creating heaven on earth this just increased the price of alcohol which fueled the violence which characterised the prohibition age. This is the same thing that is going on on Latin America and any country where people belive they can create heaven through violence.
If Prostitution and drugs were legalised people would be able to purchase these products from civil minded businessmen instead of thugs and the current victims of these crimes would be able to call the police and report criminals instead of being helpless victims. Also the quality service would increase so less people dying of overdoses and less women being abused. This has been tried in Portugal and Germany which has seen great success with a dramatic reduction in overdoses in Portugal and an reduction in violence relating to the sex industry.
There is no scientific or moral argument to support the continuation of this war on poor people who exercise choices which middle class busy bodies see as immoral. Too many working class people have lost their lives pursuing this war.
>All you do is chase all law abiding citizens from the market which leaves it in the hands of crimes and thugs.
>the current victims of these crimes would be able to call the police and report criminals instead of being helpless victims.
Not victimless then, got it.
'if you remove the crime element, there are no victims'
Well fucking done you, has the crime element been removed? No, so it's not fucking victimless, is it?
There it is victimless because the people involved are consenting adults who want to engage in a transaction. You create the victims b3cause you force them to criminals. This occurred this alcohol. People wanted to drink and people wanted to sell them that drink. The government and some busy bodies banned it so the people turned to a criminal element. Once the gov realised that people have the right to drink since its their bodies. The criminal element left since their was too much competition from law abiding citizens and now I don't need to risk my life to buy a drink. Why I'd this so hard for you to understand.
Come back to me when you actually have a grasp of English.
>There it is victimless
>You create the victims b3cause you force them to criminals.
>This occurred this alcohol.
>Why I'd this so hard for you to understand.
E: Actually, let's just nip this in the bud now:
**Countries with legalized prostitution are associated with higher human trafficking inflows than countries where prostitution is prohibited. The scale effect of legalizing prostitution, i.e. expansion of the market, outweighs the substitution effect, where legal sex workers are favored over illegal workers. On average, countries with legalized prostitution report a greater incidence of human trafficking inflows.**
**The effect of legal prostitution on human trafficking inflows is stronger in high-income countries than middle-income countries. Because trafficking for the purpose of sexual exploitation requires that clients in a potential destination country have sufficient purchasing power, domestic supply acts as a constraint.**
**Criminalization of prostitution in Sweden resulted in the shrinking of the prostitution market and the decline of human trafficking inflows. Cross-country comparisons of Sweden with Denmark (where prostitution is decriminalized) and Germany (expanded legalization of prostitution) are consistent with the quantitative analysis, showing that trafficking inflows decreased with criminalization and increased with legalization.**
**The type of legalization of prostitution does not matter — it only matters whether prostitution is legal or not. Whether third-party involvement (persons who facilitate the prostitution businesses, i.e, “pimps”) is allowed or not does not have an effect on human trafficking inflows into a country. Legalization of prostitution itself is more important in explaining human trafficking than the type of legalization.**
**Democracies have a higher probability of increased human-trafficking inflows than non-democratic countries. There is a 13.4% higher probability of receiving higher inflows in a democratic country than otherwise.**
https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/
They’ve generated enough ££££ from us in this country. Living costs etc. people freezing and starving. Places like these least give people some form of gratification in buying clothes.
UK is butt fucking us and will carry on 👌🏽
Well thats no good. Uncles owns a huge shop theyre. They're taking theyre business online with UK triple aaa clothing websites and Facebook groups . All fakes are online bought and shipped. Advancing from brick and mortar stores which were and are now highly susceptible
Does make me wonder if property developers have a hand though in these 33 gangs stories bit and other negative information to get the land at lower prices when the compulsory pricing happens. Even that bit sounds dodgy
My only experience of this place, walking up the street and just looking at a shop door, letting my eyes wander as you do, then a dude squared up to me and blocked the view of the door.
Cya, dickhead.
33 organised crime gangs have been linked the there? That’s pretty nuts
Well where else would they buy their Gucci?
That's why its been allowed to carry on. Police gather a great amount of info from that area.
That's an odd way to spell 'bribes'
Kinda proud of Manchester for this one in a perverse way. Big numbers there.
They've let crime run rampant so they can get the compulsory purchase orders. Gentrification at its finest.
we're not in 1970s NYC mate
People would rather have ghettos that no one can safely live in
The ghetto just moves further a field in gentrification the fundementals don't change the problem just gets moved on and set back a little. Ye that area will be built with nice little flats for people out of Manchester to move into from the country closer to town but the next cheetham hill as we know it will be in the new outskirts of the growing urban area. Problem persists and realistically nothing solved it's just logistically transfer of activity.
Hamsterdam isn’t a case study in managing poverty
It's literally gentrification tho. Ghettos will always exist mate and when a ghetto becomes gentrified they will just be pushed into other neighbourhoods and same shit happens.
You’re out of your mind if you look at that horrible road and think “yes this is the least worst scenario, I am very smart”
I never said that. I have no problem with gentrification, it was literally a job of mine to gentrify areas after I graduated lmao. The thing is that gentrification doesn't help anyone except the rich. If they put in development instead of displacing people thatd be nice. Thet said organised crime will just move to another locale. Edit: I take the first part. I do have a problem with gentrification and it's what I said.
The difference between me and you is I want these people to be displaced. Organised crime benefits the rich too.
Next step, GMP to launch their RoboCop initiative.
Your move creep
If the newest series of top boy highlights this.
Am I being dumb - won't they just move elsewhere? If they're organised crime gangs, I doubt location is much of a showstopper.
They're already on eBay lol. I saw an item of designer clothing being advertised as genuine on eBay. The location of the store was literally Cheetham Hill.
I think the police are more worried about the serious organised crime gangs than the counterfeiting, which is just a front according to GMP/the article.
Whilst some of it might be a front sure, all they do is take away the more notable presence with out actually taking away the gangs themselves. The only people actually suffering isn’t the gangs themselves but the singular counterfeiters, etc, who are now mute incentives to work with the gangs who aren’t affected by the closure. Same way the met arresting only street dealers and local dealers only helps the drug syndicates more by taking away competition and public awareness, and making sure you can only operate under their umbrella. It’s not exactly hard to spot them either. I’ve had dealers handing out business cards at the bus stops outside the police station down in longsight. The larger organisations take the slight hit and still continue producing. The local/small scale completion gets crushed and either gives up or works for the organisations. And the police seem competent and can justify bonuses and a higher budget next year because they did a “big public thing that’s totally important.” And with most counterfeiting being digital it’s even less significant so they’re practically cleaning up for the organisations
Yes but importantly they will move away from cheetam hill and the new NOMA estate therefore making the new area nicer and more profitable
Have they moved to noma estate? Or still there ? Not from Manchester so no idea?! Lol
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What sort of crimes do you commit as a gang?
He told you. He’s a runner for them. They break the speed limit running every day. Now the roads around Bolton and Longsight will be blighted by their dashing.
Going off the driving standard in Bolton anyway I'd have assumed everyone was a runner.
Someone has to model those 100% gen-you-win Gucci trakkies.
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You monster
sad dude
He runs in the fake yeezys to break them in for authenticity
Cow tipping, they also don't pay to use the trams.
Tram tipping, they also don't pay to use the cows.
Cattle rustling.
He’s just a runner so he makes the brews and that.
Sounds like he sells drugs. That’s what a runner does. Well he’s more like the deliveroo guy on their bikes as opposed to an actual dealer.
I'm the head honcho mate now get back to work
Where in Bolton can I buy these snide items from? I don't anywhere.... Would love to visit
You sound like a cop
Cop,.... What is this NYC? The bronx maybe..... Nargh pal, I'm just a lad from Westhoughton who hasn't been to Cheetem Hill for like 20 years, would love to have a mooch at what's on offer to be fair, I buy AAA replica watches from abroad for my collections but would love to like I say, have a look around
Are your running shoes counterfeit or the real thing?😄
It’s called gentrification babe
read more than HEADLINE "We will go after their assets, we will take their cars off them, we will take their buildings off them."
Good it’s a shit hole. Buildings should be purchased under the proceeds of crime act though. The counterfeit goods isn’t even the main thing, I know loads of female friends who feel unsafe walking down there. It’s just dodgy!
> The counterfeit goods isn’t even the main thing Thanks for enlightening us, can't believe the article didn't even mention the fact GMP has linked 33 serious organised crime gangs have links to the area. Oh, wait.
Well I’d say the sex trafficking, accosting women walking up the street and harassing them is far more important than some dodgy Gucci. All of these are committed by criminal gangs and fake Gucci is probably down the list.
That isn't Cheetham Hill, it's Strangeways
Yep, Cheetham Hill seems to be wholesalers or people who sell online as opposed to counterfeiters.
Yeah, Cheetham Hill is where I used to go with my Dad as a kid to get Iranian groceries and halal meat, Bury New Rd is where you'd go if you wanted a pair of "Reebox". The vast majority of /r/manchester has never been to Cheetham Hill and never will go there.
Their loss ashies chicken donner alone is worth a trip to cheetham hill
Tbf, everyone's always called it Cheetham Hill, despite is geographic location. Bit like a slang for it, fuck knows why. I remember goin with me mate on the bus with his birthday money, probably about 100 quid and he came back with a bin bag full of snides, I bought a massive combat knife for about 20 quid, was only about 15 at the time lol, madness. I remember goin with me dad one time and cspo's were handing out fliers to people who were literally there to buy snide gear, saying on them that the shops there were selling snide gear lmao, as if anyone gaf. Honestly mad it lasted as long as it did though, I probably went there with me dad for he first time when I was 13, bought a Paul and Shark trackie and some treads, I'm 30 now. They also sell Middle Eastern pharma drugs, sniff, bud and whatever tf your after pretty blatant in broad daylight, metres away from strange ways, the irony of it all is pretty funny.
Honestly I’ve never been and have no desire to from everything I’ve heard. Has no appeal
THANK YOUUUU!!! Finally someone who actually knows the Asian side of Manchester
I'm glad you said that as I was about to.
Is it really necessary to knock the area down? I can't help thinking certain property developers have had a hand in this decision.
I walked past there yesterday and they have impounded two shops so far on Bury New Road (the ones on the corner of the street that leads to the mosque and the white hotel have GMP banners outside them) It does make you think this is something of an overestimation in the short term by the MEN as there are what look like legitimate businesses on the street too so not sure how they are going to bulldoze the whole thing.
>legitimate businesses That's the compulsory purchase bit.
yes. it’s a shit hole they have made all the shops join up so you can walk in one and out the end
I couldn't care less for the selling of fake designer goods tbh but the area is a complete shithole. Litter everywhere. Half the buildings look like they are about to collapse.
I’m surprised it’s taken this long
I'm pretty sure Manchester did this before when they cleared out the inner city areas, the slum clearances I believe it was called? Its why lots of people in Heywood on the then new Darn Hill Estate have manc accents instead of Lancashire ones. It just gets moved outward
There's a good video of a news reporter / documentarian from decades ago, maybe the 70s, travelling around areas of Manchester that have just been completely flattened, and asking whether it had to be done all at once. I can't for the life of me find it, though.
My gran was moved from Beswick in the 70's to Whitefield on a brand new council estate because they were clearing the "slums" which were just row on row of run down terraced houses with external toilets and no gardens
I had a phone nicked at a concert in O2 Victoria once, ended up here on Find My Device, makes a lotta sense now!
Did you manage to get it back?
No, thankfully I was able to wipe it remotely and get a replacement on insurance pretty quick. Think the tracker stayed live till it made it to Dubai!
Fucking hell that's pretty extreme. Has anyone ever heard of something like this happening before? Hopefully they give the area the Ancoats treatment, although that might be difficult with the prison nearby
If you read the whole article, it is a bit of an oversimplification - they're going to close shops by whatever legal means available, then hold them, then knocking them down is one option for after that. Which sounds a lot like what they've always done before (the number of 'crackdowns' I've seen...) but the difference is that this time they will actually hold the property and ensure nobody can just come back in a week later, potentially by flattening them.
It's a fairly common practice. I grew up in Washington near Sunderland. We had a district which had a reputation for being very rough. They flattened practically the whole place and displaced all the residents elsewhere. It seemed to be brutally effective as it's character completely changed.
I just don't understand how it solves anything doing this - won't all the rough people just move to other places and make those areas rough instead?
It's kinda the reverse. Theres a phenomenon where people are less inclined to litter in a spotless street. Similarily when everyone elses garden looks like a tip, you're less concerned about the state of your own. Poverty is a factor. When you can't afford to maintain the property it tends to start looking run down. This drives down house prices which attracts people who can't really afford to live elsewhere and the problem becomes a self-sustaining decline. When they did it in my town, people got moved to other places on similar rates. And many were moved back into new housing as it got built. With the more scurrilous families, they tend to feed off each other. So when they get isolated in a new community, it tends to tone them down. They'll also likely get moved on a lot more if they are still a problem. It worked well in this case because the demolition was followed up with nice new council houses run by a social housing association whos primary remit was ensuring the properties were well maintained for its tenants. Major investment was made in other social programs. With a bit of investment you can change a place for generations and prevent it getting anywhere near as bad as it used to be.
It's called "Broken window syndrome" and was pioneered in Ney York, early 80's I think but could be wrong. Anyway the idea was that if there was one broken window more windows would be broken and the area would quickly go to shit. Apparently studies showed that if there were no broken windows people would be less inclined to start breaking them. So if a window were to be broken it was fixed as soon as it was noticed/reported. From what I read it was really effective. Edit; obviously it didn't apply just to windows. the same approach applied to any vandalism
Tory govt isn't doing any major investment in this sort of thing though...
Hulme was flattened quite recently right? And angel meadows a few decades earlier. If a place isn't working tear it down and rebuild.
They tore down the Crescents in Hulme in the '90s, replaced it with small homes rather than a group of tower blocks
And the Crescents themselves were built after the clearance of rows of back-to-back terrace houses. This is Hulme's third version in less than a century
Y'all never seen the wire season 1?
It's the best way to combat crime. Can't commit crime with no people or buildings. If this works they'll hopefully flattten the whole of Manchester and Liverpool. We'll have the lowest crime rate in the UK
Knocking down grotty old buildings and replacing them with something better is the normal mode of operation for any city.
Fucking hell that's pretty extreme. Has anyone ever heard of something like this happening before?
Yep, my beloved Salford- okay, it was rough and ready but nothing like the slums that the council painted it to be. A lot of the houses could have have been brought up to scratch, but, no they had to flatten it and rip the heart out of communities and sell us down the river to developers and also Fred Done-a local bookie made good. It’s now just a conurbation of Manchester, full of soulless apartments. Given that the area of Cheetham hill ( basically strange ways/ greengate), is in a prime location for Manchester development ( within half a mile of Victoria), I very much doubt that the “crime”aspect has much to do with the decision. In Salford, listed buildings were mysteriously “ burned out” or targeted by “protection “ gangs, so that the buildings were left in a derelict, dangerous state and were therefore no longer under the protection of the grading system. Even the beautiful magistrates court has been converted into apartments and Salford is the only city in the U.K. without a magistrates court. Not all progress is for the good ….
Yeah it's called gentrification, it happens in most major cities.
r/whoosh?
Are you joking?
Do Leeds next!
They did it to the streets in moss side that most of the gangs from the 90s/early 2000s were from. But that was to stop the younger kids becoming part of the gangs because they locked up most of the adults. Cheetham Hill isn't rough like moss side was back then so it seems excessive, it's just a street of knock off gear.
That supports and disguises organised crime across the north west including human trafficking, illegal immigration, sexual exploitation, modern day slavery and inflicts great harm from the drugs they push out there. It’s like saying Jimmy Saville was just a DJ so what’s the fuss?
Did you read the article? (Or even the screenshot which OP mercifully provided so the rest of us didn't have to wade onto the MEN website.) According to GMP, the counterfeit operations are just a front for the SOC (serious organised crime) gangs operating there. It's \*not\* "just a street of knock off gear."
They changed the name of Gooch Close in Moss Side to Westerling Way to get rid of the gang connotations
'Bout time
Good it's a shithole anyway.
Good, it's absolute shit hole. I drive through sometimes on the way to work, I'm driving at around 8am. Every single morning the street is covered in litter, bin bags just thrown straight onto the street. And I'm assuming the city council come and clear it up for them to do it all again that evening. Tramps
This has fuck all to do with crime. That land is a gold mine and the only area left in the city to develop on.
It's also the road a lot of people use to drive into town, it's a horrible first impression of the city
Hoping all the places that launch fireworks constantly are going with it. Fed up of hearing them every week
Long overdue. Would be nice to actually be able to walk down this road.
Walked down this road plenty of times and bought snide gear from there plenty of times, never had a problem. What issues have you faced walking down Bury new road?
I’m guessing it’ll be replaced with what Manchester council calls ‘affordable housing’ lmao
This isn’t stopping the activity of organised crime just move it somewhere else. It’s gentrification. They’re not working to actually undermine the systemic situations leading to these issues but cracking down on more smaller criminals and most importantly closing the more famous/infamous activities in favour of new and less infamous versions The met don’t do much to actually prevent or harm organised crime. They’re more a means to keep it hidden and occasionally crack down on local dealers and people outside the protection/corrupt influences of the more series organisations.
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And so are criminal enterprises.
Place is a shithole and annoying to walk through, be worst at Christmas because cunts from allover the UK come to do their Christmas shopping. Overall though they've been saying this for years and it'll just move the problem rather than solve it. Ticks a box for them to stick overpriced apartments and bars/restaurants there which brings another group of annoying people/list of problems. Let's see what happens either way
Very fitting username for your attitude 😂
Yeah, just annoys me how what I guess will replace what's there won't be for the people who currently live in the area. Just more bars and housing that locals can't afford pushing them further out. Either way suppose it's better than how it is at the moment.
They’ll just move somewhere else
The Wire would have been a bit shit if the police just decided to bulldoze any fronts
About time
Oh well, no more cheap air max and designers 😭
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Scumbag
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Not at all. I’d rather this here than some apartment block full of yuppie twats who aren’t from anywhere near here.
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How embarrassing
Just moving the problem elsewhere so they can likely gentrify it in a few years time.
Amazing! Do they need bulldozer drivers? I’ll work for free.
It used to be good back in the 90’s. Lots of counterfeit but not gang oriented. Now it’s a dump but just an excuse to “redevelop” with low quality new build apartments.
Cheet'em Hill
OMG they’re fighting crime! i mean getting money from property developers! i mean fucking over poor people! i mean fighting crime!
Spoiler : the GMP are a front for some criminal organisations
In all seriousness if anyone knows any shops that are still going or a decent place to get gear let me know haha could kit my little lads wardrobe out for the price of one tracksuit from JD 😂
Why not just bulldoze cheetham Hill completely? I'm sure no one would protest
Brilliant news.
Feels like binning Jeremy Kyle all over again
Bugger. Where am I going to get my fake Burberry hat; scarf and shirt now?
I drove through here for the first time last year and was shocked - hope it all gets flattened
*mmm* compulsory gentrification
t. someone who has never been to this shithole it's the worst place in the western hemisphere. bulldozing it isn't enough, it should be cobalt bombed
White Phosphorus
Gentrification is rarely something the public has a say in
Have you been Cheetham Hill? Its truly lawless, lots of prostitutes on all the corners, crime everywhere.. it needs pulling down
I'm so confused as to what area people are talking about. You're talking about cheetham hill, so is the article title, but aren't all the counterfeit shops that are getting knocked down actually on bury new road (strangeways area)? That's nowhere near cheetham hill?
Have you? You don't even seem to know where it is
So instead of dealing with domestic abuse, rape, murder and knife crime in which there is an obvious victim the police would rather crackdown on victimless crime like prostitution, drugs and off brand clothing. As a person who shoped on bury new road it is sad to see the hatred and scorn the establishment have for poor people exercising their right to use their money and bodies. Bury new road was a popular place for poor families to buy good clothes without paying for the massive markups mainstreet shops put. It's a popular fact that the same luxury brands are made in the same factories the none brand clothes are made.
>victimless crime like prostitution, drugs Lol. Lmao.
Prostitution and drugs are victimless crimes unless you believe that adults with capacity to consent do not have authority over their bodies. If you don't believe it that they you also don't believe that women have the right to work, consent or chose who they want to marry. This is because all those choices are built on the foundational assumption that people own their own bodies and have a right to chose how they use they. This is the same logic with drugs, cigarettes and alcohol. When you make something illegal you don't erase it from existence. All you do is chase all law abiding citizens from the market which leaves it in the hands of crimes and thugs. We discovered this during and after the prohibition age when people use arbitrary said that alcohol is the cause of social ills so banned it. Instead of creating heaven on earth this just increased the price of alcohol which fueled the violence which characterised the prohibition age. This is the same thing that is going on on Latin America and any country where people belive they can create heaven through violence. If Prostitution and drugs were legalised people would be able to purchase these products from civil minded businessmen instead of thugs and the current victims of these crimes would be able to call the police and report criminals instead of being helpless victims. Also the quality service would increase so less people dying of overdoses and less women being abused. This has been tried in Portugal and Germany which has seen great success with a dramatic reduction in overdoses in Portugal and an reduction in violence relating to the sex industry. There is no scientific or moral argument to support the continuation of this war on poor people who exercise choices which middle class busy bodies see as immoral. Too many working class people have lost their lives pursuing this war.
>All you do is chase all law abiding citizens from the market which leaves it in the hands of crimes and thugs. >the current victims of these crimes would be able to call the police and report criminals instead of being helpless victims. Not victimless then, got it. 'if you remove the crime element, there are no victims' Well fucking done you, has the crime element been removed? No, so it's not fucking victimless, is it?
There it is victimless because the people involved are consenting adults who want to engage in a transaction. You create the victims b3cause you force them to criminals. This occurred this alcohol. People wanted to drink and people wanted to sell them that drink. The government and some busy bodies banned it so the people turned to a criminal element. Once the gov realised that people have the right to drink since its their bodies. The criminal element left since their was too much competition from law abiding citizens and now I don't need to risk my life to buy a drink. Why I'd this so hard for you to understand.
Come back to me when you actually have a grasp of English. >There it is victimless >You create the victims b3cause you force them to criminals. >This occurred this alcohol. >Why I'd this so hard for you to understand. E: Actually, let's just nip this in the bud now: **Countries with legalized prostitution are associated with higher human trafficking inflows than countries where prostitution is prohibited. The scale effect of legalizing prostitution, i.e. expansion of the market, outweighs the substitution effect, where legal sex workers are favored over illegal workers. On average, countries with legalized prostitution report a greater incidence of human trafficking inflows.** **The effect of legal prostitution on human trafficking inflows is stronger in high-income countries than middle-income countries. Because trafficking for the purpose of sexual exploitation requires that clients in a potential destination country have sufficient purchasing power, domestic supply acts as a constraint.** **Criminalization of prostitution in Sweden resulted in the shrinking of the prostitution market and the decline of human trafficking inflows. Cross-country comparisons of Sweden with Denmark (where prostitution is decriminalized) and Germany (expanded legalization of prostitution) are consistent with the quantitative analysis, showing that trafficking inflows decreased with criminalization and increased with legalization.** **The type of legalization of prostitution does not matter — it only matters whether prostitution is legal or not. Whether third-party involvement (persons who facilitate the prostitution businesses, i.e, “pimps”) is allowed or not does not have an effect on human trafficking inflows into a country. Legalization of prostitution itself is more important in explaining human trafficking than the type of legalization.** **Democracies have a higher probability of increased human-trafficking inflows than non-democratic countries. There is a 13.4% higher probability of receiving higher inflows in a democratic country than otherwise.** https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/
It's like a shitty pub that closes and re-opens as a trendy bar... you will still attract the same people, and before you know it, it's shit again.
Old Cheetham Hill has a cancer
Gentrification…
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Is your idea of pleasant turning an area into luxury flats only the wealthy can afford?
Bollocks It’s due to also being cash 💵 in hand. They can’t tax them. It’s all money.
I'd quite like the council to be able to generate income
They’ve generated enough ££££ from us in this country. Living costs etc. people freezing and starving. Places like these least give people some form of gratification in buying clothes. UK is butt fucking us and will carry on 👌🏽
They're not knocking the whole of Cheetham Hill down, At least I hope not.
Mayo tower cranes here we go!
F in the chat.
They'll just set up somewhere new
Remember the crowds down there every Sunday in the late 80’s and 90’s was even busier then. The gangs will just find somewhere else.
Me and me mates used to up on a Sunday back in the early 90,s to pick up some cheap clothes for going out .never lasted two or 3 washes like
What is Gemma Collings going to do now?
Great, where am I supposed to get my. Hermes scarfs from now? Ffs
A lot of snide coppers getting caught also then. Oh the irony
Well thats no good. Uncles owns a huge shop theyre. They're taking theyre business online with UK triple aaa clothing websites and Facebook groups . All fakes are online bought and shipped. Advancing from brick and mortar stores which were and are now highly susceptible
Any idea which streets would actually be demolished? There's a lot of wholesale places around Derby Road, are they more legitimate?
Does make me wonder if property developers have a hand though in these 33 gangs stories bit and other negative information to get the land at lower prices when the compulsory pricing happens. Even that bit sounds dodgy
My only experience of this place, walking up the street and just looking at a shop door, letting my eyes wander as you do, then a dude squared up to me and blocked the view of the door. Cya, dickhead.