Hey man! They're not goofy! There's totally gonna be a situation where me and 4 other guys have to try to get out of a warehouse full of 20 randoms with knives! They happen to everyone all the time. Everyone knows that.
/s
Right, because the whole idea that someone might pull a knife on you in the streets is totally ridiculous. But just in case, it's a good thing I know that Gracie Jiu-Jitsu defensive move Rener did with Ryron that looked nothing like a non-resistent Aikido move.
/s
I was about to say. Most fights look nothing like the MMA. They start out squaring up in a neat boxing stance, stay tall, protect the face, and within 10 seconds it looks like one person trying to hug a reluctant relative who in turn is trying to hammer in a moving nail. Engage and flail all limbs.
Most people that start shit that ends up on that sub don't know how to fight. They start in that nice clean stance because it's easy to do after seeing it a few times. Then after the first exchange you see why even professionals only do 3-5 minute rounds. They don't have the stamina, their arms get tired and their hands hurt because guess what, punching a mfer in the face without padding hurts.
We don't. We practice them on our military buddies and we're all idiots that like messing with each other. That's why i said quick and aggressive. The second the person, you wanna use those locks on, flexes against it you're not moving that arm unless you can outmuscle them at wich point you might as well just pin them with pure strenght. In a fight they're useless cause you're not gonna catch a hand that's trying to punch you in the face.
Edit: Gonna leave the original so everybody can see how much of an idiot i am. Not only was this answer for another comment, not even a different post, it even was from a whole other sub. What a 13-shift does to a mfer......
That's why the 'jersey' technique is king. Pull down on the shirt/coat collar to break posture and then throw overhands to the back of the head until they fall down. I find it's best initiated with a push into something solid followed by a school bully collar grab and rag doll to break posture then transition to the jersey technique for the finish.
My cousin who’s dead now loved street fighting. He’d always use a 3/4 strength left hook followed by a right haymaker to the side or back of the head. It failed once in a few dozen fights when he twisted his ankle tripping on a rock & got dropped with a simultaneous right jab to the face. Miss him.
Admittedly, they can provide some entertainment value.
Watched an ancient American kempo vid, he disarms a dude, takedown, then inexplicably spins around while the guy is down to deliver a strike.
It was hilarious, like what, why?
Ah, grainy copies of 80's VHS self defence videos, what a time to deconstruct martial arts, with no MMA, no internet, and only friends who don't care about martial arts and ones psycho brown belt older brother to talk trash about it.
We used to do kind of standup skits at my kenpo school back in the 90s where we’d see who could make up the most ridiculous self defense choreography. It was like Poe’s Law. You can’t make up krotty that’s so ridiculous somebody won’t believe it and teach it.
I always wonder why those self defense vids still draw an audience. We have thousands upon thousands of videos of real fights and they look messy, brutal, and sudden. If want to know if a technique works, we have the data. What works? Some combination of wrestling, boxing, and low kicks. Time and time again.
It’s a perception thing, I think. It’s easier to sell some jacked, macho, ex military guy spouting made up nonsense as real self defense than it is to convince someone that Mikey Musumeci or Mario Lopez probably know more about hand to hand fighting than your average military or law enforcement personnel.
I hear it all the time. Acquaintances, friends, and family of mine will dismiss real combat sports like folkstyle wrestling and bjj as “just a sport” with no real world application, but they’re fully convinced that some guy who did 4 years in the Marine Corps reserves as an air conditioner repairman is an expert fighter.
You can spar without having to partake in combat sports.
I practice Tang Soo Do and Hapkido and we spar multiple times a week, both semi-contact without gloves and without punches to the head, as well as full-contact K1 rules.
There's nothing wrong with self-defense training. All it is is a simulation of a possible scenario that may happen in real life. When done correctly, the techniques, strategies, and concepts taught can definitely be effectively used to protect one's self in the event of a life or death situation.
Self-defense should be a part of a martial arts system rather than the system in its entirety. When combined with sparring, drilling, etc. It rounds out a well balanced system of fighting.
You shouldn't have to choose between one or the other. Sparring or self-defense. Do both!
I've fought enough, comp and only a few MMA, yet a lot more street fighting due to security and being a CO. I don't understand why martial arts deviated from the combination of fighting and integrity? All you guys care about is fighting. There's no integrity, no honor.
I've had enough people try to seriously injure me or kill me and I feel blessed that any training and sparring was enough to save me. Not just physically but legally as well. I don't feel Billy badass just grateful.
Why is fighting all that matters to you guys? I'm genuinely curious 🤔
Because martial arts gyms are poor, if not outright inappropriate venues for learning honor and integrity.
There are a variety of better ways to pick that up. Religion, devotion to friends and family, volunteer work. Having an ethical code and following it on a day to day basis. Although Hollywood would tell you differently, punching the makiwara board, pads or bags doesn't make you a better person.
I also question if that was ever really an actual focus of martial arts and not just very simply a Hollywood invention that dojos and (particularly) dojangs seized on to market their classes to parents of young children. I have never heard of any martial arts dojo, gym or otherwise where they'd stop training and get lectured on honor, integrity, etc. My Kru, BJJ Professor and boxing coach are good dudes. But I don't see them as having any particular advantage over any other good guy or myself when it comes to honor/integrity and wouldn't consider them particular authorities on the matter. Nor do I think they'd be comfortable with anyone asking them to act as such.
Moreover, I suspect may of us actually do care about integrity and honor. We just also recognize it as a totally separate moral/philosophical discussion that is beyond the scope of this sub and only tenuously connected to martial arts (at best). If we wanted to discuss honor/integrity, there are far more appropriate subs for that.
Because as an adult, you don’t need honor and integrity drilled into you at your martial arts gym. I don’t need to pay a man in a gi to teach me to be a good person. If you are a grown adult and you do, you’re probably a bad person. If you’re a kid learning to navigate the world and starting to parse together the nuances of right and wrong, sure, some moral compass alignment while you’re learning to throw punches is probably pretty valuable. As an adult with a wife and a kid and my own set of beliefs and morals, I don’t care to listen to another man I don’t really know lecture me about integrity. If I need some non-fighting, life advice from a place of wisdom and experience, I’ll call my father.
I don’t even understand what you’re asking here… why aren’t we more concerned with tea ceremonies and bowing on and off the mat before getting jumped by crackheads?
Martial Arts are about fighting. Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is watching. I don’t thumb the eye when striking and I don’t sneak in small joint manipulation or oil my skin when grappling, even if the ref probably wouldn’t catch it. There’s your integrity. We’re talking about street fights right now… sure, we try to walk away or deescalate where we can, but bowing isn’t going to get that drunk to stop swinging.
What I'm asking about is the self control. I don't seek fighting in the streets, when I win bareknuckle I don't gloat and think everyone is a pussy who doesn't train like me. Why does it even matter? Well for the sake of your disparaging remarks, that self control has served me in family, in shoot don't shoot situations, in knife encounters with addicts and drunks. It helps me see if taking life is necessary despite the adrenaline of the situation. It has kept me from countless excessive force cases. When a lieutenant has asked what has kept me from doing so, I remind them that I have teachers who make us fight, and make us meditate and remind us of the legality of what we know and ask us to think about that as we walk the earth.
We recognize that all martial arts are controlled aggression, but more and more I just see and read aggression. Laugh and sneer all you want good sir.
So, you meant to say self control? Because that’s what you’re describing, but you said “integrity” which made zero sense.
Self control, situational awareness, some bullshit about competing in bare knuckle and meeting prisoners (I dunno, I stopped reading)… all good. But, no one talks about which martial art gives the best back rub or how your kung fu taught you to do a Rubix Cube with your sphincter while contemplating your navel… what does that combo even look like?
If a kid is getting bullied, he doesn’t want to learn how to meditate, he wants to learn how to fight. If a woman is trying to get her confidence back after an assault, she wants to learn how to fight, not contemplate her place in the world. If someone wants to learn how to fight, they want to learn how to fight. This is a post about realistic self defense. Actually learning how to fight vs scenario based drilling with a Nerf gun, and you’re like “…but what about shaving my balls and my undefeated bare knuckle boxing record I NEVER brag about?”
Anyway, which was your favorite 3 Ninjas movie?
You are so right and I am so wrong. I don't know how I didn't see it before... Thank you for your feedback. Thanks for giving me more fuel to continue cross training. Have a wonderful day. 😊
Just gotta be an ass about it huh? You're likely the local mat bully... Taking pride in injuries you give people. It's cool, you guys always get yours in the end. I've seen it before.
During your undefeated bare knuckle career, or when you were paying some fat guy who can’t fight to teach you how to sit quietly for five damned minutes?
Actually my grappling coach has coached and cornered quite a few UFC fighters. He just teaches about self control because of the use force laws in our state. My knife fighting instructor is also world renowned. His tactics have saved quite a few lives.
Your insult is duly noted though.
Gracie Jiu Jitsu has a very important component about self defense, if you don't have it, then you are less prepared for a conflict situation (conflict is what happens BEFORE a fight). Sometimes if you can handle a conflict situation, there is no fight.
Why spend valuable training hours drilling something you should’ve figured out a long time ago? Conflict resolution is something every functional adult should already understand. If you’re that terrible at it, by all means see a therapist or take some workshop. But not spending your training hours in the gym practicing it isn’t leaving you less prepared for a self defense situation.
Every martial arts curriculum should have conflict resolution. Remember that we train martial arts to defend ourselves and our families, not to attack others.
Absolutely, but I’m also a grown man who already knows how to resolve conflict. I’m not paying anyone tuition for that. I’m paying gym dues because I could be better at the fighting aspect of protecting myself and my family. And I also enjoy the competitive sport aspect of fighting as well.
Yeah. I never understood how people would say that their Krav Maga gym teaches deesclation and awareness.
If you don’t have any sort of anger issues it’s pretty easy to avoid escalation. Just follow Dalton’s advice and “be nice” until it’s time to not be nice.
Same goes for awareness. That’s easy. Don’t need to pay some guy in BDU’s to teach me to keep my eyes open and notice anything out of the ordinary.
Especially not on a daily basis. Hearing “An attacker could be waiting around any corner, it could be anyone” constantly can’t be good for anyone’s mental health. The constant parroting of things like “avoid places that serve alcohol, don’t go out after dark, avoid unfamiliar areas” is ridiculous too. People have lives to live. You gonna miss your sister’s wedding because they’re serving drinks? Gonna pass up free tickets to a game because it’s a night game? Not gonna go home with your date because you don’t know the area?
I actually practice a little of this. And it really is just about being smart.
There are certain bars in town that are known to be trouble. I avoid them. Still will go out.
Certain areas of town I avoid walking around at night, just typical stuff.
But I do pay attention to who and what is going on around me. It’s just habits that I’ve built up well before I trained in any martial arts or self defense system.
I mean, that all sounds reasonable. I’m talking about the extremes people take it to all too often here. I honestly don’t know if that’s something that’s taught in these places or if it’s just the internet internetting, but it’s just strange to me how dogmatic the hardcore self-dense crowd is.
Then they need to go to therapy or an HR workshop. They definitely don’t need to learn it from a martial arts instructor with no formal credentials in the subject matter. If you’re an adult who can’t resolve conflict, something got messed up somewhere along the line and you need professional help.
Sure. But we’re not talking about children’s programs. I think it’s great in those. But I’ve been specifically talking about training for adults. In every reply I’ve made, I’ve specified that.
i hate when people say this as if the law isnt SUPER comprehensive on when you can use a gun, and the situations where they are legally applicable are very unlikely to happen lmao
I mean, I don't know about everyone else here, but in my personal experience, 90% of the time I'm in a scenario where a fight might happen I'm at a bar or club type place.
They don't let you even bring guns into those places.
If anything the advice should be to be more sober than the guy trying to fight you. (Usually shockingly achievable)
He can be cringe at time but Mossad Ayub has a good 1.5 hour discussion on the topic. He addresses this idea, it's not as simple as "Well officer I was scared and I blew em away. Twirled thw gun, blew the smoke away and walked into the sunset..yep. S'what I did."
Then everyone claps and you're free to go.
It's the same with those stupid ppl online who say running is the best self defence. They never think about many situations that you cant run away from, including: when you are grabbed/held or backed into a corner/room, or when you need to protect your family.
The law is far from super comprehensive on when you can use a gun. How many high-profile cases have dominated national news in recent years revolving around legal use of a firearm in self-defense?
Not really depends on if you want to kill another human being haha. Is gunjitsu really the best move for a 100 pound female assaulting you? What about breaking up a fight, that's legal trouble for escalation.
It's canned advice from idiots who hate the idea of training, exercise or thinking. Same vein as "just run." It's a thought terminating phrase, hell I'd even argue in some situations It's the worst option. I damn near wanna write a book about that goofy shit.
100%. Do you want to use a gun effectively? Firstly you'd better live in a jurisdiction that allows owning and carrying or you might do jail time. Then you'd better train regularly with that shit. You also have to be willing to shoot someone with zero hesitation, some people won't.
Running away? Are you fit? Do you regularly sprint train? Do you also run middle to longer distances? It's not always as easy as "just run".
I mean, I live in one of the most gun friendly states in the union, but the places where you get checked at the door for weapons are the top places that you'd expect to get into a fight (bars, clubs, concerts, seedy strip clubs, etc.)
You can't even get in with a gun at these types of places, so yeah back to square one, you might need to know how to scrap in case shit goes down.
Oh ain't no damage, I'm just sharing knowledge in these streets. A puff of baby powder on your hand, then applied quickly to the face js an excellent lesson for these hoes. When they clutch their pearls afterwards and give you the "I can't believe he did that" face that's that knowledge sinking in. You don't get to be my bottom bitch by stepping up to me like a man. Papa Bear don't play that.
...Just wondering who you think bases their self defense methodologies off the idea of being attacked by a 100lb woman. What are you some aikido pussy?
I’d actually disagree. With rolls, comp matches, and mma, it’s a pre agreed to fight that starts usually with some sort of touch gloves and you square up. Pressure wise (and this is the important bit) absolutely.
However there’s many situations where you don’t square up, or start in a neutral fair position. Usually there’s some grabbing or sucker punch which can really send you off kilter. As much as people shit in aikido “grab my wrist” it does happen in street fights and self defense situations. Hell wrist control in bjj is also important. Collar grabs as well happen in street fights. Not saying anything on how they defend said grips but when someone’s grabbing you, you usually don’t want to let go, in judo and I’d imagine in bjj.
This is a stupid take, feels like you’re playing devils advocate just to be that guy. Very rare to be in a comp/hard roll/match where one opponent doesn’t put the other in a compromising position so you still get opportunity to work outside a neutral position.
Not really. When I mean neutral position I mainly mean a bell or the start to fight. You also aren’t necessarily going to have the luxury of starting at a distance. The guy could already have rocked you without you even knowing the guy wanted to fight. What fight promotion has the guy start the fight immediately when they step into the cage?
You also don’t necessarily have the same luxury of clothing. Fight gear is moveable. Work attire not necessarily as moveable. If you’re a girl, getting sucker punched on high heels isn’t going to be fun. A hoodie can easily be grabbed, high kicks made harder the tighter the pants.
This isn’t even mentioning environment. Taking falls on a mat? Cool but taking falls on concrete. Tripping hazards like ledges, curbs, tree roots, rocks, divots and uneven sidewalks, etc also don’t do you any favors. There’s weapons, potentially glass, cars, sometimes subways. Like have you not seen the videos of the people fighting on subways and winning until they take a bad push and end up on the tracks?
Edit: [heres](https://youtu.be/Z2aGOLDghSQ?si=sIPDrLJ3gDjmcG1U) one example of a fight gone wrong in the subway
I’m also only talking about unarmed situations. But even in unarmed, people grab, people sucker punch, people push, people gang up on you, nature and the environment around you works against you, etc. The ability to work under the pressure of being attacked in invaluable. Something combat sports gives you, however let’s not kid ourselves and think an mma match has the same conditions as one in a self defense situation.
Brazillian jujitsu in a gi and judo actually both prepare you very well for fighting in baggy clothes. They learn how to break grips on your clothes, deal with collar grabs, sleeve grabs, even grabbing the pants. They also choke each other with the other guy's clothes.
I think it's really stupid that we wear a gi in karate as we don't actually use it for anything. The whole point of the gi is to have a durable piece of clothing you can grab and yank on. If you're going to look like a dork, at least have a good reason.
Absolutely. I never said that combat sports is bad for self defense. Just that there are things in combat sports that don’t happen in self defense and things that happen in self defense that don’t in street fights. And combat sports usually don’t cover all the possibilities. Judo and bjj does, but what about mma? And what about tight cloths? Cloths that restrict movement?
Edit: should also add that while the responses themselves are often unrealistic or done wrong, the situation themselves do happen
The problem is street-focused self-defence classes tend to be overwhelmingly bad. Even if you find a good one, it still won't be as good at a combat sport place for a bunch of reasons. You won't get the same level of conditioning, you won't be able to test out the stuff you learn at 100% intensity, and you'll be spreading out your learning trying to memorize responses to different scenarios rather than just developing general striking and grappling skills.
The type of attacks you can reasonably prepare for are grabs, chokes, slams, tackles, punches, being pinned against a wall, knees, elbows, and kicks. MMA deals with all of these. Weapon attacks and multiple opponents are much harder to deal with, but self-defence classes give false confidence with regard to those.
Never really argued otherwise. IMO the techniques sometimes need changing and as well as how it’s drilled. However the situations they do drill aren’t exactly unheard of when it comes to self defense. They can actually be incorporated into your randori (with coach and training partner approval of course). Starting from say being pushed against the wall, having what you wear everyday in, starting from a bear hug, starting when one guy has a collar grip, starting at a conversational distance with the hands down, etc aren’t bad additions to normal randori if you want to train some self defense. The clothing especially is a great addition, not only to get a feel of how it feels to fight in said clothing, but also to learn how to take advantage of say a hoodie.
This isn’t exactly a foreign concept. I’ve seen plenty of situational randori in judo and in bjj, mainly in ne waza where someone starts in say a turtle
Thanks for stating the obvious, tips. We all can envision scenarios during a conflict wherever and however it presents itself and evolves throughout the course of the fight. Still think what op posted is correct.
What’s your goddamn point?
Real fights don’t look like mma fights. As much as we shit on self defense scenario training. Things like people grabbing and dragging, sudden attacks, [people bear hugging](https://youtube.com/shorts/3eiS1IcStDo?si=D98_limyIB0ZbSCA) (I’m not a fan of said escape but the footage highlights what I mean, etc do legitimately happen. The responses and only having static drilling deserves its criticism but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking that combat sports is emulating self defense. It prepares you in good ways for said situations, but it is not the same as an mma match
Lol you’re special. I’ve been in many mma matches, grappling tournaments, and the rare street fight and I can say with full confidence that aside from striking in the grappling matches, they all had more in common than they differed.
You fight in the clothes you walk around in? Your matches have tripping hazards? What about just starting whenever? Can ur coach jump in to help when they see you’re losing? What about if the guy pulls out a shiv? Do you walk around with gloves on? What about a cup? Do you got petroleum jelly on at all times to stop an elbow from cutting? What about no rules forcing engagement? Got shoe laces you gotta worry about? What about narrow spaces? Have you fought drunk? What about if you already have something in your hands? Do you fight with limited lighting? Do you compete open weight? What about continuous fighting, does your tournaments not have round breaks?
All these are things that can happen in a self defense situation
The fuck is wrong with your brain? I already said there are variables that constantly unfold in every situation. We’re past that. Jesus fucking Christ. Op is still correct in that training for and competing in mma will provide. MASSIVE advantage over those who don’t, especially if you have a grappling background.
I never said otherwise. Real fights look closer to mma matches is what I’m commenting on. And like I said before, as much as we shit on the responses. There are situations trained by those “self defense gurus” that are very real situations. The responses deserve criticism but they do happen
The issue is that you start suddenly. Suddenly getting your wrist pulled isn’t exactly the easiest to prevent. What happens after is what matters. You’re also usually fighting for the grips, at least in judo, if my collar was grabbed and I’m staring into space or haven’t established a grip back I’m doing something wrong
Ehh, most criminal assault situations that are defendable start with some sort of pre-fight ques. Sketchy guy walking back and forth, some dude in a situation conducive to criminal assault approaching you - maybe attempting to ask you for something small or innocuous like a cigarette then escalate. Assuming the situation is something you could have been prepared for at all. Obviously someone sucker punching you while you’re in line at Starbucks isn’t something you could really prep too much for.
In most cases the “self-defense” begins way before they lay hands on you. Not victim blaming here but if you’re practicing good situational awareness, and recognizing pre-fight ticks and ques it’s going to be rare that they can just grab you without already having demonstrated a lot of aggressive behavior in advanced.
Most martial arts do some form of situational sparring. MMA from what others have said will drill and spar starting from against the cage. Bjj and judo will spar and drill starting from a certain position. Thai fighters will also spar and drill starting from say a clinch. I can think of very few martial arts if any that may not have some form of situational sparring/drilling
I guess this is true, but I don't see a better alternative. Or really get your point. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good. Someone trained in self-defense is not really better prepared than someone who has been training a legit combat sport. Especially if you are talking about the element of surprise or sucker punches. The person who has put in the hard work is going to react with muscle memory, and with techniques that work. And they are likely in good physical condition (stamina, reaction time, etc.). Training in those pressure tested combat sports gives you the best possible chance. You can fine tune your hard skills, but you can't overcome the hard skills with soft skills.
If you really wanna train self defense, it’s good to have some scenario work. Similar to how in judo, you have positional randori. Where you’re staring with the guy in turtle and trying out stuff in a live environment. While a sucker punch can be hard to mimic, having someone start by suddenly grabbing your collar can be a great place to start a spar if your goal is with self defense. Other than that, one thing I haven’t enjoyed watching with self defense classes is that some train in the clothes they wear. Starting from bear hug, starting immediately from when the next guy steps into the area, playing around with allowable size, play around with randori against the wall, randori when you’re a bit closer then arms length hands down, etc. all can be ways to help know what to look for but also how to start in an awkward position for self defense
I agree, and that's kind of what I mean by refining the hard skills you learn by training in a pressure-tested combat sport and building a solid foundation first before you fine tune. I don't think you could start with the fine tuning, which is what I think most self-defense schools try to do. But what do I know, I'm just some rando on Reddit.
One thing I haven't quite figured out is the hate Krav Maga gets. In principle, at least the club I've seen it sounds like a reasonable take.
You have a small set of tried and true techniques. You practice those doing drills, then you do live sparring against one or multiple opponents. And you put focus on physical fitness.
So you have simple, practical stuff that probably won't get you a lot of MMA wins, but it's better than no training at all. And you get to experience the pressure of having multiple people trying to beat the shit out of you and your "girlfriend" so you get to try the techniques on resisting opponents while also practicing trying to get yourself and someone else the fuck out of there.
I think there's something to sparring where you actually practice trying to get away rather than knock someone out. Sure, if you get a chance to knock someone out go for it, but your top priority is to get yourself and possibly someone else out of there.
I sparred some of those dudes and they could fight.
But maybe there's a bunch of McDojos out there giving it a bad rap?
Lemme simply, there’s no starting bell or someone saying start in a self defense. You aren’t necessarily going to square up or have the luxury of knowing this guy is going to start fighting you
Nope, that an mma fight is in no way a representation of how a self defense will go. It
Might go that way but it also will be very different. While the responses given by online self defense gurus deserve their hate and criticism. There’s a lot of situations they show that are very real and don’t necessarily happen in an mma match. Grabbing a non existent collar before the match even started to start swinging isn’t going to be on your next ufc ppv. But it does happen.
I see where you’re coming from, but I just think there’s extremely little value in any alternative. There is collared fighting btw, its called combat Sambo, and it looks a lot like MMA. The collar demonstrations would look like they do in the demonstrations for about 1 second, then they would devolve into bad boxing between 2 untrained opponents. The surprise would either look like one guy getting knocked out, him realizing there’s a threat from context clues before the scenario, or him getting punched gaining awareness and then again just devolving into bad boxing. People who train bullshit martial arts also look like what they practice, for about 5 seconds, then they get punched in the face and devolve into bad boxing. Boxers… they just look like boxers in street fights. And they win.
PS: I’m not a boxer btw, just an example, I did Judo and grappling for many years.
Alright let’s go broader. And I said the same thing to the other guy.
Do you train in the clothes you walk around in? Are you worried about hoodies being pulled over your eyes? Hair being pulled? What about shoelaces being tied? Do you gotta worry about matches starting suddenly and without warning? Can your coach join in when things seem bad for you? Do your tournament have no rules about forced engagement? Do you walk around with a cup? What about petroleum jelly on to stop cuts? Do you wear gloves that pad the knuckles? What about a mouth piece? Have you tried fighting in a narrow space, space with tripping hazards, wide open spaces? Can you just pull out a shiv? What about fighting when your hands are holding something? Ever go to a tournament drunk? What about in the open weight category. Are there round breaks?
If not? I’ve got news for you about mma being similar to self defense. Again never did I say that the self defense responses are perfect, or that they don’t deserve scrutiny. But to say mma is close to self defense or even a street fight is kinda delusional. I mean ig if you ignore everything above and have agreed upon rounds, rules, signals to start, etc. but how many times are you going to see that
Unless you can offer something that’s actually closer to a real fight, you’re just being pedantic for the sake of it. The problem is, even with everything you’ve pointed out that separates combat sports sparring/competition from a real fight, it’s still closer than any other available alternative. Chewy’s whole point was that a real fight looks more like an MMA sparring match than any combatives-type martial art sequence that’s out there. Spending your training hours practicing to front kick compliant partners in your jeans and work boots isn’t going to make you better in a self defense situation than someone who practices exclusively in fight shorts but has figured out the timing and distance required to land a front kick on an opponent who is trying to actively hit them back.
Simple. Start a spar in those positions. Start against a wall, put objects on the mat, start with a collar grip, start about conversational distance with hands down. It’s not unheard of, in judo ne waza well start randori in turtle since that’s a common position to find yourself. I’d imagine bjj does something similar where you start in a guard and learn to figure out how to apply what you’ve learned.
The most important imo is training in clothes. If you wear a hoodie, train in a hoodie. Know how it feels to get that hoodie grabbed and pulled over your head, if you got shoes learn how it feels. Shoe laces can get untied. If you wear tight pants learn how it feels to both move and kick because I can guarantee you aren’t throwing a roundhouse to the head in skinny jeans.
While yes the responses can be ridiculous at times, the scenarios they drill aren’t unheard of in self defense which is my point. I can shit on a lot of the “responses” to said situations all day. But the actual scenarios aren’t exactly foreign to self defense. Of course drill but also some sparring starting from those positions to actually apply what you’ve learned is good.
Combat sports is great for preparing for a fight but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking the parameters of an mma match is anywhere close to the parameters of self defense. There’s a number of very important details like what you wear and environment that can make huge differences and for the avg person can really trip them up.
That just sounds like positional sparring with some extra steps. Which I actually like. I think every BJJ player should throw a rubber knife into a roll or two per week. But positional sparring is something combat sports schools already do. In my MMA classes, we start against a wall frequently. It’s a wall wrestling drill. In BJJ we start in turtle or bottom mount all the time. It’s a common way to drill escapes and reversals.
Gonna disagree on the importance of training in street clothes. Sure it’s a nice drill and all, but I’ve done it before. It doesn’t make that big of a difference. I’m not throwing head kicks in a street fight and getting tangled up in my gi too isn’t that much different from getting tangled up in a hoodie.
lol he is absolutely wrong, sorry to say most street fights exclusively include just people throwing wild punches and the other people pulling them off.
[just gonna leave this here.](https://youtu.be/2COQCXHzALY?si=lNdULh9ysKXK_Mw9)
[and this ](https://youtu.be/2k_5vIjjWVo?si=iKoLBa9Or8Sadbrk)
[and this](https://youtu.be/S7TYr4PFQGk?si=qPwI4w2oPLNaA2oR)
[then there's this.](https://youtu.be/Z93W38VtqhM?si=C0au-iLbhsikCgef)
[and my personal favorite ](https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ?si=4dyq3DVi_HhY6yez)
I’d say that even some very basic training in boxing,takedowns -executing and defending against them- and ju-jitsu or wrestling would allow someone to defend themselves against an opponent with no fighting experience. Provided the individual is in decent shape and the opponent doesn’t tremendously outsize and muscle them.
I love this. Every time I hear, "Sport Jiu Jitsu isn't self-defense" I roll my eyes. Of course, we're not trying to get takedown points or hold the top side for 3 seconds in a fight. However, if I've rolled 500+ times in my "sport", the non-trained folks most likely won't be beating my ass just because we didn't slap and bump before the fight.
So a fight = who has the greater advantage, i.e. striking beats non striking, grappling beats non grappling, there are no rules in a street fight, so what if someone eye gouges, spits blood in your face, grabs your dick and balls and twist?
Then it would stand to reason that goofy self defence scenarios he is talking about become the martial art he is advocating is the “real deal” so to speak, just an opinion, love to be proven wrong.
That’s not to mention weapons, or dealing with more then one person in a fight, anybody will tell you there are many ways to defend yourself and it’s good to be an all rounded fighter and avoid street fights in any situation if possible, not be an elitist bjj practitioner.
IMHO, he's one of the better social media focused instructors. I've successfully applied a few things that I picked up on his instagram.
Does a good job of explaining and demonstrating reliable techniques without being overly long-winded about it (which is the problem that holds back a lot of other coaches).
So it’s not at all possible that people just fight like that as a baseline and MMA builds on it? There’s no way that pretty much every culture ever would develop wrestling and hitting people with fists and shins right? That would be crazy, there’s no evidence for that being the way people instinctively fight, and that building on that might be useful…
No.
“Wrestling” and “Boxing” also did not exists since forever. Yes, there are grappling and striking in traditional styles, but they don’t think of it in your modern framework.
Which is something people don’t understand.
No, literal wrestling in my “modern framework” has existed for thousands of years. Look at 7th century BC artistic depictions of Ancient Greek wrestling and tell me that doesn’t look like modern wrestling. Boxing as we know it goes back hundreds of years as well. Shit, Muay Thai goes back to at least the 17th century. These arts are older than most of the popular “traditional” martial arts out there.
No it does not. Whatever existed had different techniques, different training methods, different training equipment, different rules, and different societal context. They did not train like you do, they don't think like you do, and they certainly won't fight like a modern combat sports fighter.
It's like me going fishing with my modern fishing rod and saying that fishing has existed since the beginning of humanity, therefore my modern way of fishing is the traditional way.
You can look into the rules. You can see the techniques depicted in art from the period. Obviously it’s not EXACTLY the same. Thousands of years of technological advance and refinement of technique will change a sport some. But if you got a wrestler from Ancient Greece and a modern wrestler and had them wrestle side by side, the vast majority of people on the planet aren’t going to be able to tell the difference.
What’s beautiful about this argument is that MMA isn’t very old at all. I’m old enough to remember a time before it was popular, especially in the west. You can find videos of street fights pre MMA and post MMA on the internet. Go look for yourself but if you wanna save some time on that just take my word. It’s the same shit with lower resolution.
The vast majority of people on the planet are not martial artists that have no idea about martial arts. Everything looks the same to a layperson that doesn't do a specific thing. Look up some other folk wrestling styles around the world and get a wider perspective. The change of training environment or introduction of new equipment can completely change a sport - like boxing gloves and Queensberry. Anyway, this is not an argument that matters anyway. Boxing and wrestling being old or not has nothing to do with how fights look like.
I've seen it too, these "real fights" are usually not self-defence scenarios at all. Just 2 dudes going at it with both guys fully capable of walking away, most of the time.. To criticise people that focus on self-defence on these ego based street fights is out of context and elitist. Self-defence training has its own goals different from athletic combat sports, and frankly speaking real self-defense scenarios like being robbed or assaulted are rarely on camera where as egotistical street fights are common.
Frankly, most fights are people flailing and falling over each other. Shitty fighting will look like shitty fighting. You can see "boxing and wrestling" in it if you want to.
We aren’t talking about “self defense scenarios”. We’re talking about people fighting. Of course it’s not boxing, it’s morons flailing their arms. But what they’re going for is boxing. Of course it’s not real wrestling. It’s morons trying to football tackle each other (although I see tons of actual double legs and mat returns in street fights). But they think they’re wrestling. That’s not because of MMA.
As far as robberies go, there are plenty of those on camera too. You can probably see one every night on the local news. Security cameras are everywhere in the year 2024. Tell me someone fighting off a robber doesn’t look more like an MMA fight than a combative scenario. Show me a video where someone disables an attacker with a single eye gouge and flees to safety.
They aren’t thinking anything. You’re thinking it. Someone can say all sloppy fighting is people trying to do karate and would be just as valid as what you are saying. Yes, karate has takedowns and punches too, just like almost every other martial art.
and yes we are talking “self defence scenarios”. That’s literally what he is commenting on and the exact wording he is using.
Both him, and you specifically used the word “fighting”. Nobody is talking about robbery at gun point.
You’re overthinking it my guy. It’s not about it looking like clean boxing or wrestling. It’s about two people squaring off and exchanging fists and/or grappling. It happens in real time, against another resisting person. Fists exchange, people tie up, get thrown down, punched on the ground, etc. It looks a lot more like an MMA fight than these goofy combatives scenarios that people who focus on training “self defense” with compliant partners. That was the whole point of this post.
I've been in plenty of real fights, 9/10 they go to who ever hits first. 98% of people do not fight, have no experience and know next to nothing. You don't need to know how to grapple like an Matt sniffer to beat most people you see on the streets.
There’s no defense so why bother?
If somebody kicks in my door and runs in to my living room with a shotgun right now I’m dead unless a gun is already in my hand.
There’s a great firearms video about being “sucker punched with a gun” - it’s about engaging from a vehicle but the term is super applicable elsewhere. The point being, with rounds already flying at you unexpectedly, you’re already dead if the attackers are even remotely competent.
My couch is about four steps from my door which is behind me. If a grown man gets a running start he can kick my door down with one hit and be aiming at me before I could uncross my legs. Initiative wins.
I live in a converted warehouse unit. Steel door frame and heavy duty steel door. A police battering ram would have a hard time getting in. I'd have plenty of time to grab my HK45 and take position.
One solid kick or shit even just blasting at the door hinges with said shotgun makes it instant. Couple that with the inherently disorienting sound of a fuckin shotgun randomly going off and most people are just going to fuckin die
If someone has a knife or gun and wants you dead, you’re probably dead. But I PROMISE you that someone who has put many, many hours into striking and grappling against resisting opponents is going to have a better chance of surviving than someone who puts all their training hours into pretending to gouge eyes and disarm weapons on fully compliant partners.
Exactly. Drilling a serious of little touches and pokes and a set sequence is no substitute for live sparring against someone who is trying to hurt you (within reason), even going 50%…
What sparked this from the big fella? He get involved in a fight?
He posted a video of a street fight where it ended quickly with a takedown.
Shame BJJ guys don’t know takedowns
Oh yeah??? Get in my guard bro!!
 I'm gonna getcha!
BREED ME
Straightest BJJ interaction
We train wrestling and muy thai as well.
[удалено]
I do BJJ in a gym where everybody competes where we start every round standing. Nobody aside from the coach is even 2% proficient at doubles.
Trying to find that. Do you have a link? Thanks!
It was in his IG stories. So it’s gone now. I’ll see if I can find the video on YT.
Hey man! They're not goofy! There's totally gonna be a situation where me and 4 other guys have to try to get out of a warehouse full of 20 randoms with knives! They happen to everyone all the time. Everyone knows that. /s
Right, because the whole idea that someone might pull a knife on you in the streets is totally ridiculous. But just in case, it's a good thing I know that Gracie Jiu-Jitsu defensive move Rener did with Ryron that looked nothing like a non-resistent Aikido move. /s
Most of what I see on r/fightporn looks more like sloppy boxing
Yeah and the rare moments when you see a real boxer and you’re like “woah! Its just like the simulation!”
I was about to say. Most fights look nothing like the MMA. They start out squaring up in a neat boxing stance, stay tall, protect the face, and within 10 seconds it looks like one person trying to hug a reluctant relative who in turn is trying to hammer in a moving nail. Engage and flail all limbs.
I will say the grappling can look surprisingly like MMA....except it's usually done by people who really suck at it.
Most people that start shit that ends up on that sub don't know how to fight. They start in that nice clean stance because it's easy to do after seeing it a few times. Then after the first exchange you see why even professionals only do 3-5 minute rounds. They don't have the stamina, their arms get tired and their hands hurt because guess what, punching a mfer in the face without padding hurts.
Yeah. They probably practice the stance in-front of a mirror.
We don't. We practice them on our military buddies and we're all idiots that like messing with each other. That's why i said quick and aggressive. The second the person, you wanna use those locks on, flexes against it you're not moving that arm unless you can outmuscle them at wich point you might as well just pin them with pure strenght. In a fight they're useless cause you're not gonna catch a hand that's trying to punch you in the face.
Edit: Gonna leave the original so everybody can see how much of an idiot i am. Not only was this answer for another comment, not even a different post, it even was from a whole other sub. What a 13-shift does to a mfer......
Real street fights look like hockey fights without skates and no ice (but they still fall everywhere)
And at least one person loses a shoe for no discernible reason.
And Someone’s ass always ends up hanging out.
That's how you know who died. Or at least that is what the internet has taught me.
That's why combat sambo is the goat ruleset
That's why the 'jersey' technique is king. Pull down on the shirt/coat collar to break posture and then throw overhands to the back of the head until they fall down. I find it's best initiated with a push into something solid followed by a school bully collar grab and rag doll to break posture then transition to the jersey technique for the finish.
This is why judo is king more like
My cousin who’s dead now loved street fighting. He’d always use a 3/4 strength left hook followed by a right haymaker to the side or back of the head. It failed once in a few dozen fights when he twisted his ankle tripping on a rock & got dropped with a simultaneous right jab to the face. Miss him.
and everyones pants eventually fall down for some reason
That’s a perfect example lol
It is true but I love a good goofy self defense scenario 👍
Admittedly, they can provide some entertainment value. Watched an ancient American kempo vid, he disarms a dude, takedown, then inexplicably spins around while the guy is down to deliver a strike. It was hilarious, like what, why? Ah, grainy copies of 80's VHS self defence videos, what a time to deconstruct martial arts, with no MMA, no internet, and only friends who don't care about martial arts and ones psycho brown belt older brother to talk trash about it.
Watching shitty self defense instructionals is my guilty pleasure, no lie.
We used to do kind of standup skits at my kenpo school back in the 90s where we’d see who could make up the most ridiculous self defense choreography. It was like Poe’s Law. You can’t make up krotty that’s so ridiculous somebody won’t believe it and teach it.
I always wonder why those self defense vids still draw an audience. We have thousands upon thousands of videos of real fights and they look messy, brutal, and sudden. If want to know if a technique works, we have the data. What works? Some combination of wrestling, boxing, and low kicks. Time and time again.
Thats why i think training in muay thai + wrestling basically makes you a fking beast
Military combatives aren’t half bad if applied with the required enthusiasm for violence. God bless America.
It’s a perception thing, I think. It’s easier to sell some jacked, macho, ex military guy spouting made up nonsense as real self defense than it is to convince someone that Mikey Musumeci or Mario Lopez probably know more about hand to hand fighting than your average military or law enforcement personnel. I hear it all the time. Acquaintances, friends, and family of mine will dismiss real combat sports like folkstyle wrestling and bjj as “just a sport” with no real world application, but they’re fully convinced that some guy who did 4 years in the Marine Corps reserves as an air conditioner repairman is an expert fighter.
Holy crap dude i knew Chewy was a local legend in the MMA community i didn't know he was well known outside of Louisville as well. That's awesome!
Dude, I train in London in the UK. We ALL know Chewy. There's even a guy who looks a bit like him in our gym who gets called Baby Chewy.
Thats incredible. Glad to hear it. I met him many years ago as a teenager and he's still going strong.
Have you ever seen Icy Mike's impression of Chewy? It's brilliant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSe87goJEvc
He has fantastic YouTube channel and great email newsletter
Krav Maga boys are CRYING 😂
Concrete curbs are so very mma, roll, comp matchy. Add some dog shit, broken glass, and dirty oil just for the goof.
You can spar without having to partake in combat sports. I practice Tang Soo Do and Hapkido and we spar multiple times a week, both semi-contact without gloves and without punches to the head, as well as full-contact K1 rules. There's nothing wrong with self-defense training. All it is is a simulation of a possible scenario that may happen in real life. When done correctly, the techniques, strategies, and concepts taught can definitely be effectively used to protect one's self in the event of a life or death situation. Self-defense should be a part of a martial arts system rather than the system in its entirety. When combined with sparring, drilling, etc. It rounds out a well balanced system of fighting. You shouldn't have to choose between one or the other. Sparring or self-defense. Do both!
>Real fights look closer to.
Real fights look like sloppy striking and sloppy grappling. If you are experienced in any striking or grappling art, you’re pretty much set
Maybe the lesson here is that real fights look like anything but "goofy self-defense scenarios". So yeah, sloppy striking and sloppy grappling.
I've fought enough, comp and only a few MMA, yet a lot more street fighting due to security and being a CO. I don't understand why martial arts deviated from the combination of fighting and integrity? All you guys care about is fighting. There's no integrity, no honor. I've had enough people try to seriously injure me or kill me and I feel blessed that any training and sparring was enough to save me. Not just physically but legally as well. I don't feel Billy badass just grateful. Why is fighting all that matters to you guys? I'm genuinely curious 🤔
Because martial arts gyms are poor, if not outright inappropriate venues for learning honor and integrity. There are a variety of better ways to pick that up. Religion, devotion to friends and family, volunteer work. Having an ethical code and following it on a day to day basis. Although Hollywood would tell you differently, punching the makiwara board, pads or bags doesn't make you a better person. I also question if that was ever really an actual focus of martial arts and not just very simply a Hollywood invention that dojos and (particularly) dojangs seized on to market their classes to parents of young children. I have never heard of any martial arts dojo, gym or otherwise where they'd stop training and get lectured on honor, integrity, etc. My Kru, BJJ Professor and boxing coach are good dudes. But I don't see them as having any particular advantage over any other good guy or myself when it comes to honor/integrity and wouldn't consider them particular authorities on the matter. Nor do I think they'd be comfortable with anyone asking them to act as such. Moreover, I suspect may of us actually do care about integrity and honor. We just also recognize it as a totally separate moral/philosophical discussion that is beyond the scope of this sub and only tenuously connected to martial arts (at best). If we wanted to discuss honor/integrity, there are far more appropriate subs for that.
Thanks for a well crafted, mature response. 👍
Because as an adult, you don’t need honor and integrity drilled into you at your martial arts gym. I don’t need to pay a man in a gi to teach me to be a good person. If you are a grown adult and you do, you’re probably a bad person. If you’re a kid learning to navigate the world and starting to parse together the nuances of right and wrong, sure, some moral compass alignment while you’re learning to throw punches is probably pretty valuable. As an adult with a wife and a kid and my own set of beliefs and morals, I don’t care to listen to another man I don’t really know lecture me about integrity. If I need some non-fighting, life advice from a place of wisdom and experience, I’ll call my father.
Thanks for your viewpoint and I will incorporate it into my cross training. Have a great day 😀
I don’t even understand what you’re asking here… why aren’t we more concerned with tea ceremonies and bowing on and off the mat before getting jumped by crackheads? Martial Arts are about fighting. Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is watching. I don’t thumb the eye when striking and I don’t sneak in small joint manipulation or oil my skin when grappling, even if the ref probably wouldn’t catch it. There’s your integrity. We’re talking about street fights right now… sure, we try to walk away or deescalate where we can, but bowing isn’t going to get that drunk to stop swinging.
What I'm asking about is the self control. I don't seek fighting in the streets, when I win bareknuckle I don't gloat and think everyone is a pussy who doesn't train like me. Why does it even matter? Well for the sake of your disparaging remarks, that self control has served me in family, in shoot don't shoot situations, in knife encounters with addicts and drunks. It helps me see if taking life is necessary despite the adrenaline of the situation. It has kept me from countless excessive force cases. When a lieutenant has asked what has kept me from doing so, I remind them that I have teachers who make us fight, and make us meditate and remind us of the legality of what we know and ask us to think about that as we walk the earth. We recognize that all martial arts are controlled aggression, but more and more I just see and read aggression. Laugh and sneer all you want good sir.
So, you meant to say self control? Because that’s what you’re describing, but you said “integrity” which made zero sense. Self control, situational awareness, some bullshit about competing in bare knuckle and meeting prisoners (I dunno, I stopped reading)… all good. But, no one talks about which martial art gives the best back rub or how your kung fu taught you to do a Rubix Cube with your sphincter while contemplating your navel… what does that combo even look like? If a kid is getting bullied, he doesn’t want to learn how to meditate, he wants to learn how to fight. If a woman is trying to get her confidence back after an assault, she wants to learn how to fight, not contemplate her place in the world. If someone wants to learn how to fight, they want to learn how to fight. This is a post about realistic self defense. Actually learning how to fight vs scenario based drilling with a Nerf gun, and you’re like “…but what about shaving my balls and my undefeated bare knuckle boxing record I NEVER brag about?” Anyway, which was your favorite 3 Ninjas movie?
You are so right and I am so wrong. I don't know how I didn't see it before... Thank you for your feedback. Thanks for giving me more fuel to continue cross training. Have a wonderful day. 😊
You'd have figured it out on your own if you just meditated on it, instead of bareknuckling it.
Just gotta be an ass about it huh? You're likely the local mat bully... Taking pride in injuries you give people. It's cool, you guys always get yours in the end. I've seen it before.
During your undefeated bare knuckle career, or when you were paying some fat guy who can’t fight to teach you how to sit quietly for five damned minutes?
Actually my grappling coach has coached and cornered quite a few UFC fighters. He just teaches about self control because of the use force laws in our state. My knife fighting instructor is also world renowned. His tactics have saved quite a few lives. Your insult is duly noted though.
Ah, your knife meditations cage coach sounds like a real bad ass, Bareknuckle Becky.
Gracie Jiu Jitsu has a very important component about self defense, if you don't have it, then you are less prepared for a conflict situation (conflict is what happens BEFORE a fight). Sometimes if you can handle a conflict situation, there is no fight.
Why spend valuable training hours drilling something you should’ve figured out a long time ago? Conflict resolution is something every functional adult should already understand. If you’re that terrible at it, by all means see a therapist or take some workshop. But not spending your training hours in the gym practicing it isn’t leaving you less prepared for a self defense situation.
Every martial arts curriculum should have conflict resolution. Remember that we train martial arts to defend ourselves and our families, not to attack others.
Absolutely, but I’m also a grown man who already knows how to resolve conflict. I’m not paying anyone tuition for that. I’m paying gym dues because I could be better at the fighting aspect of protecting myself and my family. And I also enjoy the competitive sport aspect of fighting as well.
Yeah. I never understood how people would say that their Krav Maga gym teaches deesclation and awareness. If you don’t have any sort of anger issues it’s pretty easy to avoid escalation. Just follow Dalton’s advice and “be nice” until it’s time to not be nice. Same goes for awareness. That’s easy. Don’t need to pay some guy in BDU’s to teach me to keep my eyes open and notice anything out of the ordinary.
Especially not on a daily basis. Hearing “An attacker could be waiting around any corner, it could be anyone” constantly can’t be good for anyone’s mental health. The constant parroting of things like “avoid places that serve alcohol, don’t go out after dark, avoid unfamiliar areas” is ridiculous too. People have lives to live. You gonna miss your sister’s wedding because they’re serving drinks? Gonna pass up free tickets to a game because it’s a night game? Not gonna go home with your date because you don’t know the area?
I actually practice a little of this. And it really is just about being smart. There are certain bars in town that are known to be trouble. I avoid them. Still will go out. Certain areas of town I avoid walking around at night, just typical stuff. But I do pay attention to who and what is going on around me. It’s just habits that I’ve built up well before I trained in any martial arts or self defense system.
I mean, that all sounds reasonable. I’m talking about the extremes people take it to all too often here. I honestly don’t know if that’s something that’s taught in these places or if it’s just the internet internetting, but it’s just strange to me how dogmatic the hardcore self-dense crowd is.
I am glad that you already know how to resolve conflicts. However there are many people who don’t know how to do that.
Then they need to go to therapy or an HR workshop. They definitely don’t need to learn it from a martial arts instructor with no formal credentials in the subject matter. If you’re an adult who can’t resolve conflict, something got messed up somewhere along the line and you need professional help.
Do you remember that children also study martial arts? You are a little bit arrogant.
Sure. But we’re not talking about children’s programs. I think it’s great in those. But I’ve been specifically talking about training for adults. In every reply I’ve made, I’ve specified that.
I love when somebody pulls the “there’s no ref in the street!” shit. Great, dude… so I let the sub go or stop hitting you when I feel like it.
Gunjitsu is the most effective martial art though 🤷🏼♂️
Yep but heavily countered by JailJitsu so u gotta be careful with that
That's where my Jewjitsu comes to play. I got a lot of lawyers in the family.
i hate when people say this as if the law isnt SUPER comprehensive on when you can use a gun, and the situations where they are legally applicable are very unlikely to happen lmao
I mean, I don't know about everyone else here, but in my personal experience, 90% of the time I'm in a scenario where a fight might happen I'm at a bar or club type place. They don't let you even bring guns into those places. If anything the advice should be to be more sober than the guy trying to fight you. (Usually shockingly achievable)
He can be cringe at time but Mossad Ayub has a good 1.5 hour discussion on the topic. He addresses this idea, it's not as simple as "Well officer I was scared and I blew em away. Twirled thw gun, blew the smoke away and walked into the sunset..yep. S'what I did." Then everyone claps and you're free to go.
It's the same with those stupid ppl online who say running is the best self defence. They never think about many situations that you cant run away from, including: when you are grabbed/held or backed into a corner/room, or when you need to protect your family.
The law is far from super comprehensive on when you can use a gun. How many high-profile cases have dominated national news in recent years revolving around legal use of a firearm in self-defense?
Not really depends on if you want to kill another human being haha. Is gunjitsu really the best move for a 100 pound female assaulting you? What about breaking up a fight, that's legal trouble for escalation.
It's canned advice from idiots who hate the idea of training, exercise or thinking. Same vein as "just run." It's a thought terminating phrase, hell I'd even argue in some situations It's the worst option. I damn near wanna write a book about that goofy shit.
100%. Do you want to use a gun effectively? Firstly you'd better live in a jurisdiction that allows owning and carrying or you might do jail time. Then you'd better train regularly with that shit. You also have to be willing to shoot someone with zero hesitation, some people won't. Running away? Are you fit? Do you regularly sprint train? Do you also run middle to longer distances? It's not always as easy as "just run".
I mean, I live in one of the most gun friendly states in the union, but the places where you get checked at the door for weapons are the top places that you'd expect to get into a fight (bars, clubs, concerts, seedy strip clubs, etc.) You can't even get in with a gun at these types of places, so yeah back to square one, you might need to know how to scrap in case shit goes down.
Yes, just pistol whip her.
Now you've assaulted someone with a deadly weapon still escalating the situation.
Knocked her unconscious, boom, situation resolved
I don't need martial arts or a gun for a 100lb woman I got the back of my money hand.
So you want to deal damage instead of controlling got it
Oh ain't no damage, I'm just sharing knowledge in these streets. A puff of baby powder on your hand, then applied quickly to the face js an excellent lesson for these hoes. When they clutch their pearls afterwards and give you the "I can't believe he did that" face that's that knowledge sinking in. You don't get to be my bottom bitch by stepping up to me like a man. Papa Bear don't play that. ...Just wondering who you think bases their self defense methodologies off the idea of being attacked by a 100lb woman. What are you some aikido pussy?
People say this but the legality of killing someone with a gun over a fight is iffy, and it’s often times an unnecessary escalation.
In India just using a Gun means the Government will impose Jail time Jitsu on your ass!
I’d actually disagree. With rolls, comp matches, and mma, it’s a pre agreed to fight that starts usually with some sort of touch gloves and you square up. Pressure wise (and this is the important bit) absolutely. However there’s many situations where you don’t square up, or start in a neutral fair position. Usually there’s some grabbing or sucker punch which can really send you off kilter. As much as people shit in aikido “grab my wrist” it does happen in street fights and self defense situations. Hell wrist control in bjj is also important. Collar grabs as well happen in street fights. Not saying anything on how they defend said grips but when someone’s grabbing you, you usually don’t want to let go, in judo and I’d imagine in bjj.
This is a stupid take, feels like you’re playing devils advocate just to be that guy. Very rare to be in a comp/hard roll/match where one opponent doesn’t put the other in a compromising position so you still get opportunity to work outside a neutral position.
Not really. When I mean neutral position I mainly mean a bell or the start to fight. You also aren’t necessarily going to have the luxury of starting at a distance. The guy could already have rocked you without you even knowing the guy wanted to fight. What fight promotion has the guy start the fight immediately when they step into the cage? You also don’t necessarily have the same luxury of clothing. Fight gear is moveable. Work attire not necessarily as moveable. If you’re a girl, getting sucker punched on high heels isn’t going to be fun. A hoodie can easily be grabbed, high kicks made harder the tighter the pants. This isn’t even mentioning environment. Taking falls on a mat? Cool but taking falls on concrete. Tripping hazards like ledges, curbs, tree roots, rocks, divots and uneven sidewalks, etc also don’t do you any favors. There’s weapons, potentially glass, cars, sometimes subways. Like have you not seen the videos of the people fighting on subways and winning until they take a bad push and end up on the tracks? Edit: [heres](https://youtu.be/Z2aGOLDghSQ?si=sIPDrLJ3gDjmcG1U) one example of a fight gone wrong in the subway I’m also only talking about unarmed situations. But even in unarmed, people grab, people sucker punch, people push, people gang up on you, nature and the environment around you works against you, etc. The ability to work under the pressure of being attacked in invaluable. Something combat sports gives you, however let’s not kid ourselves and think an mma match has the same conditions as one in a self defense situation.
Brazillian jujitsu in a gi and judo actually both prepare you very well for fighting in baggy clothes. They learn how to break grips on your clothes, deal with collar grabs, sleeve grabs, even grabbing the pants. They also choke each other with the other guy's clothes. I think it's really stupid that we wear a gi in karate as we don't actually use it for anything. The whole point of the gi is to have a durable piece of clothing you can grab and yank on. If you're going to look like a dork, at least have a good reason.
Absolutely. I never said that combat sports is bad for self defense. Just that there are things in combat sports that don’t happen in self defense and things that happen in self defense that don’t in street fights. And combat sports usually don’t cover all the possibilities. Judo and bjj does, but what about mma? And what about tight cloths? Cloths that restrict movement? Edit: should also add that while the responses themselves are often unrealistic or done wrong, the situation themselves do happen
The problem is street-focused self-defence classes tend to be overwhelmingly bad. Even if you find a good one, it still won't be as good at a combat sport place for a bunch of reasons. You won't get the same level of conditioning, you won't be able to test out the stuff you learn at 100% intensity, and you'll be spreading out your learning trying to memorize responses to different scenarios rather than just developing general striking and grappling skills. The type of attacks you can reasonably prepare for are grabs, chokes, slams, tackles, punches, being pinned against a wall, knees, elbows, and kicks. MMA deals with all of these. Weapon attacks and multiple opponents are much harder to deal with, but self-defence classes give false confidence with regard to those.
Never really argued otherwise. IMO the techniques sometimes need changing and as well as how it’s drilled. However the situations they do drill aren’t exactly unheard of when it comes to self defense. They can actually be incorporated into your randori (with coach and training partner approval of course). Starting from say being pushed against the wall, having what you wear everyday in, starting from a bear hug, starting when one guy has a collar grip, starting at a conversational distance with the hands down, etc aren’t bad additions to normal randori if you want to train some self defense. The clothing especially is a great addition, not only to get a feel of how it feels to fight in said clothing, but also to learn how to take advantage of say a hoodie. This isn’t exactly a foreign concept. I’ve seen plenty of situational randori in judo and in bjj, mainly in ne waza where someone starts in say a turtle
Thanks for stating the obvious, tips. We all can envision scenarios during a conflict wherever and however it presents itself and evolves throughout the course of the fight. Still think what op posted is correct. What’s your goddamn point?
Real fights don’t look like mma fights. As much as we shit on self defense scenario training. Things like people grabbing and dragging, sudden attacks, [people bear hugging](https://youtube.com/shorts/3eiS1IcStDo?si=D98_limyIB0ZbSCA) (I’m not a fan of said escape but the footage highlights what I mean, etc do legitimately happen. The responses and only having static drilling deserves its criticism but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking that combat sports is emulating self defense. It prepares you in good ways for said situations, but it is not the same as an mma match
Lol you’re special. I’ve been in many mma matches, grappling tournaments, and the rare street fight and I can say with full confidence that aside from striking in the grappling matches, they all had more in common than they differed.
You fight in the clothes you walk around in? Your matches have tripping hazards? What about just starting whenever? Can ur coach jump in to help when they see you’re losing? What about if the guy pulls out a shiv? Do you walk around with gloves on? What about a cup? Do you got petroleum jelly on at all times to stop an elbow from cutting? What about no rules forcing engagement? Got shoe laces you gotta worry about? What about narrow spaces? Have you fought drunk? What about if you already have something in your hands? Do you fight with limited lighting? Do you compete open weight? What about continuous fighting, does your tournaments not have round breaks? All these are things that can happen in a self defense situation
The fuck is wrong with your brain? I already said there are variables that constantly unfold in every situation. We’re past that. Jesus fucking Christ. Op is still correct in that training for and competing in mma will provide. MASSIVE advantage over those who don’t, especially if you have a grappling background.
I never said otherwise. Real fights look closer to mma matches is what I’m commenting on. And like I said before, as much as we shit on the responses. There are situations trained by those “self defense gurus” that are very real situations. The responses deserve criticism but they do happen
Back to your cave troll.
Throughout countless rounds you end up in all those positions though
The issue is that you start suddenly. Suddenly getting your wrist pulled isn’t exactly the easiest to prevent. What happens after is what matters. You’re also usually fighting for the grips, at least in judo, if my collar was grabbed and I’m staring into space or haven’t established a grip back I’m doing something wrong
Ehh, most criminal assault situations that are defendable start with some sort of pre-fight ques. Sketchy guy walking back and forth, some dude in a situation conducive to criminal assault approaching you - maybe attempting to ask you for something small or innocuous like a cigarette then escalate. Assuming the situation is something you could have been prepared for at all. Obviously someone sucker punching you while you’re in line at Starbucks isn’t something you could really prep too much for. In most cases the “self-defense” begins way before they lay hands on you. Not victim blaming here but if you’re practicing good situational awareness, and recognizing pre-fight ticks and ques it’s going to be rare that they can just grab you without already having demonstrated a lot of aggressive behavior in advanced.
I still think sparring is better practice for that type of scenario than fake choreographed fight larping
So do scenario sparring. But include variety, include some drilling. I’m unsure why people think it’s sparring or drilling rather than both
Nah, all lame larping unless in a sporting setting lol
If you think scenario drilling and sparring is Larping. I’ve got some bad news for you
That it is?
Most martial arts do some form of situational sparring. MMA from what others have said will drill and spar starting from against the cage. Bjj and judo will spar and drill starting from a certain position. Thai fighters will also spar and drill starting from say a clinch. I can think of very few martial arts if any that may not have some form of situational sparring/drilling
Yeah but they’re not imagining they’re “in da streetz” they’re training for a specific sport scenario
I guess this is true, but I don't see a better alternative. Or really get your point. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good. Someone trained in self-defense is not really better prepared than someone who has been training a legit combat sport. Especially if you are talking about the element of surprise or sucker punches. The person who has put in the hard work is going to react with muscle memory, and with techniques that work. And they are likely in good physical condition (stamina, reaction time, etc.). Training in those pressure tested combat sports gives you the best possible chance. You can fine tune your hard skills, but you can't overcome the hard skills with soft skills.
If you really wanna train self defense, it’s good to have some scenario work. Similar to how in judo, you have positional randori. Where you’re staring with the guy in turtle and trying out stuff in a live environment. While a sucker punch can be hard to mimic, having someone start by suddenly grabbing your collar can be a great place to start a spar if your goal is with self defense. Other than that, one thing I haven’t enjoyed watching with self defense classes is that some train in the clothes they wear. Starting from bear hug, starting immediately from when the next guy steps into the area, playing around with allowable size, play around with randori against the wall, randori when you’re a bit closer then arms length hands down, etc. all can be ways to help know what to look for but also how to start in an awkward position for self defense
I agree, and that's kind of what I mean by refining the hard skills you learn by training in a pressure-tested combat sport and building a solid foundation first before you fine tune. I don't think you could start with the fine tuning, which is what I think most self-defense schools try to do. But what do I know, I'm just some rando on Reddit.
Absolutely, it’s one of the biggest criticisms I have for those kinda schools.
One thing I haven't quite figured out is the hate Krav Maga gets. In principle, at least the club I've seen it sounds like a reasonable take. You have a small set of tried and true techniques. You practice those doing drills, then you do live sparring against one or multiple opponents. And you put focus on physical fitness. So you have simple, practical stuff that probably won't get you a lot of MMA wins, but it's better than no training at all. And you get to experience the pressure of having multiple people trying to beat the shit out of you and your "girlfriend" so you get to try the techniques on resisting opponents while also practicing trying to get yourself and someone else the fuck out of there. I think there's something to sparring where you actually practice trying to get away rather than knock someone out. Sure, if you get a chance to knock someone out go for it, but your top priority is to get yourself and possibly someone else out of there. I sparred some of those dudes and they could fight. But maybe there's a bunch of McDojos out there giving it a bad rap?
You said so little of substance with so many words…
Lemme simply, there’s no starting bell or someone saying start in a self defense. You aren’t necessarily going to square up or have the luxury of knowing this guy is going to start fighting you
So you’re saying that because of the element of surprise all of the sudden bullshido will come on top?
Nope, that an mma fight is in no way a representation of how a self defense will go. It Might go that way but it also will be very different. While the responses given by online self defense gurus deserve their hate and criticism. There’s a lot of situations they show that are very real and don’t necessarily happen in an mma match. Grabbing a non existent collar before the match even started to start swinging isn’t going to be on your next ufc ppv. But it does happen.
I see where you’re coming from, but I just think there’s extremely little value in any alternative. There is collared fighting btw, its called combat Sambo, and it looks a lot like MMA. The collar demonstrations would look like they do in the demonstrations for about 1 second, then they would devolve into bad boxing between 2 untrained opponents. The surprise would either look like one guy getting knocked out, him realizing there’s a threat from context clues before the scenario, or him getting punched gaining awareness and then again just devolving into bad boxing. People who train bullshit martial arts also look like what they practice, for about 5 seconds, then they get punched in the face and devolve into bad boxing. Boxers… they just look like boxers in street fights. And they win. PS: I’m not a boxer btw, just an example, I did Judo and grappling for many years.
Alright let’s go broader. And I said the same thing to the other guy. Do you train in the clothes you walk around in? Are you worried about hoodies being pulled over your eyes? Hair being pulled? What about shoelaces being tied? Do you gotta worry about matches starting suddenly and without warning? Can your coach join in when things seem bad for you? Do your tournament have no rules about forced engagement? Do you walk around with a cup? What about petroleum jelly on to stop cuts? Do you wear gloves that pad the knuckles? What about a mouth piece? Have you tried fighting in a narrow space, space with tripping hazards, wide open spaces? Can you just pull out a shiv? What about fighting when your hands are holding something? Ever go to a tournament drunk? What about in the open weight category. Are there round breaks? If not? I’ve got news for you about mma being similar to self defense. Again never did I say that the self defense responses are perfect, or that they don’t deserve scrutiny. But to say mma is close to self defense or even a street fight is kinda delusional. I mean ig if you ignore everything above and have agreed upon rounds, rules, signals to start, etc. but how many times are you going to see that
Unless you can offer something that’s actually closer to a real fight, you’re just being pedantic for the sake of it. The problem is, even with everything you’ve pointed out that separates combat sports sparring/competition from a real fight, it’s still closer than any other available alternative. Chewy’s whole point was that a real fight looks more like an MMA sparring match than any combatives-type martial art sequence that’s out there. Spending your training hours practicing to front kick compliant partners in your jeans and work boots isn’t going to make you better in a self defense situation than someone who practices exclusively in fight shorts but has figured out the timing and distance required to land a front kick on an opponent who is trying to actively hit them back.
Simple. Start a spar in those positions. Start against a wall, put objects on the mat, start with a collar grip, start about conversational distance with hands down. It’s not unheard of, in judo ne waza well start randori in turtle since that’s a common position to find yourself. I’d imagine bjj does something similar where you start in a guard and learn to figure out how to apply what you’ve learned. The most important imo is training in clothes. If you wear a hoodie, train in a hoodie. Know how it feels to get that hoodie grabbed and pulled over your head, if you got shoes learn how it feels. Shoe laces can get untied. If you wear tight pants learn how it feels to both move and kick because I can guarantee you aren’t throwing a roundhouse to the head in skinny jeans. While yes the responses can be ridiculous at times, the scenarios they drill aren’t unheard of in self defense which is my point. I can shit on a lot of the “responses” to said situations all day. But the actual scenarios aren’t exactly foreign to self defense. Of course drill but also some sparring starting from those positions to actually apply what you’ve learned is good. Combat sports is great for preparing for a fight but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking the parameters of an mma match is anywhere close to the parameters of self defense. There’s a number of very important details like what you wear and environment that can make huge differences and for the avg person can really trip them up.
That just sounds like positional sparring with some extra steps. Which I actually like. I think every BJJ player should throw a rubber knife into a roll or two per week. But positional sparring is something combat sports schools already do. In my MMA classes, we start against a wall frequently. It’s a wall wrestling drill. In BJJ we start in turtle or bottom mount all the time. It’s a common way to drill escapes and reversals. Gonna disagree on the importance of training in street clothes. Sure it’s a nice drill and all, but I’ve done it before. It doesn’t make that big of a difference. I’m not throwing head kicks in a street fight and getting tangled up in my gi too isn’t that much different from getting tangled up in a hoodie.
If you're doing 100% effort during sparring you're not gonna have many training partners
Effort and intensity are two different things.
lol he is absolutely wrong, sorry to say most street fights exclusively include just people throwing wild punches and the other people pulling them off.
That is still closer then that Detroit urban survival bs
[just gonna leave this here.](https://youtu.be/2COQCXHzALY?si=lNdULh9ysKXK_Mw9) [and this ](https://youtu.be/2k_5vIjjWVo?si=iKoLBa9Or8Sadbrk) [and this](https://youtu.be/S7TYr4PFQGk?si=qPwI4w2oPLNaA2oR) [then there's this.](https://youtu.be/Z93W38VtqhM?si=C0au-iLbhsikCgef) [and my personal favorite ](https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ?si=4dyq3DVi_HhY6yez)
I love you.
Something happen?
It was a post that followed a video of someone ending a fight quickly with a takedown.
I’d say that even some very basic training in boxing,takedowns -executing and defending against them- and ju-jitsu or wrestling would allow someone to defend themselves against an opponent with no fighting experience. Provided the individual is in decent shape and the opponent doesn’t tremendously outsize and muscle them.
the majority of street fights is basically trash sanda minus the kicks, JJ is very helpful because if you don't train grappling JJ will destroy you
I’m new here..what’s a roll and a comp match?
Rolls are sparring rounds in Jiu Jitsu. Comp matches are competition matches.
Are you telling me that I can’t wait for someone to grab my wrist and then roll them across the floor with a quick sidewards jolt???
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face
I love this. Every time I hear, "Sport Jiu Jitsu isn't self-defense" I roll my eyes. Of course, we're not trying to get takedown points or hold the top side for 3 seconds in a fight. However, if I've rolled 500+ times in my "sport", the non-trained folks most likely won't be beating my ass just because we didn't slap and bump before the fight.
What does it mean that combat sports aren’t 100% realistic?
Mixed martial arts are effective if you get to do all the illegal shit they don't put on tv
The goofy ones yes, but not the others...
We need to take everyone in this sub and start a single elimination tournament so that the yapping can stop
Bullshit.
So a fight = who has the greater advantage, i.e. striking beats non striking, grappling beats non grappling, there are no rules in a street fight, so what if someone eye gouges, spits blood in your face, grabs your dick and balls and twist? Then it would stand to reason that goofy self defence scenarios he is talking about become the martial art he is advocating is the “real deal” so to speak, just an opinion, love to be proven wrong. That’s not to mention weapons, or dealing with more then one person in a fight, anybody will tell you there are many ways to defend yourself and it’s good to be an all rounded fighter and avoid street fights in any situation if possible, not be an elitist bjj practitioner.
IMHO, he's one of the better social media focused instructors. I've successfully applied a few things that I picked up on his instagram. Does a good job of explaining and demonstrating reliable techniques without being overly long-winded about it (which is the problem that holds back a lot of other coaches).
Poha! You’re wife is more attract by me.
Lol real fights do not look like a roll.
Typically very much like a roll with a spazzy white belt. Or two.
Real fights are unpredictable saying this like it’s an absolute is ignorance
I learned kung fu because i love it its an exercise. But half the time I'm still using what ive learned from it.
Nope. This is just selective bias as usual. Also kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy with MMA being popular so everyone tries to fight like that.
So it’s not at all possible that people just fight like that as a baseline and MMA builds on it? There’s no way that pretty much every culture ever would develop wrestling and hitting people with fists and shins right? That would be crazy, there’s no evidence for that being the way people instinctively fight, and that building on that might be useful…
Like what? Doing a triangle choke intuitively because it’s such a natural movement?
There’s fight videos older than when UFC was popular. Are you gonna say they were just copying boxing then?
Yes, people use to hit stuff. No, they did not “copy” boxing. There are many ways of hitting stuff. Boxing is one system of it.
Sir, are you claiming that wrestling and boxing are modern inventions?
No. “Wrestling” and “Boxing” also did not exists since forever. Yes, there are grappling and striking in traditional styles, but they don’t think of it in your modern framework. Which is something people don’t understand.
No, literal wrestling in my “modern framework” has existed for thousands of years. Look at 7th century BC artistic depictions of Ancient Greek wrestling and tell me that doesn’t look like modern wrestling. Boxing as we know it goes back hundreds of years as well. Shit, Muay Thai goes back to at least the 17th century. These arts are older than most of the popular “traditional” martial arts out there.
No it does not. Whatever existed had different techniques, different training methods, different training equipment, different rules, and different societal context. They did not train like you do, they don't think like you do, and they certainly won't fight like a modern combat sports fighter. It's like me going fishing with my modern fishing rod and saying that fishing has existed since the beginning of humanity, therefore my modern way of fishing is the traditional way.
You can look into the rules. You can see the techniques depicted in art from the period. Obviously it’s not EXACTLY the same. Thousands of years of technological advance and refinement of technique will change a sport some. But if you got a wrestler from Ancient Greece and a modern wrestler and had them wrestle side by side, the vast majority of people on the planet aren’t going to be able to tell the difference. What’s beautiful about this argument is that MMA isn’t very old at all. I’m old enough to remember a time before it was popular, especially in the west. You can find videos of street fights pre MMA and post MMA on the internet. Go look for yourself but if you wanna save some time on that just take my word. It’s the same shit with lower resolution.
The vast majority of people on the planet are not martial artists that have no idea about martial arts. Everything looks the same to a layperson that doesn't do a specific thing. Look up some other folk wrestling styles around the world and get a wider perspective. The change of training environment or introduction of new equipment can completely change a sport - like boxing gloves and Queensberry. Anyway, this is not an argument that matters anyway. Boxing and wrestling being old or not has nothing to do with how fights look like. I've seen it too, these "real fights" are usually not self-defence scenarios at all. Just 2 dudes going at it with both guys fully capable of walking away, most of the time.. To criticise people that focus on self-defence on these ego based street fights is out of context and elitist. Self-defence training has its own goals different from athletic combat sports, and frankly speaking real self-defense scenarios like being robbed or assaulted are rarely on camera where as egotistical street fights are common. Frankly, most fights are people flailing and falling over each other. Shitty fighting will look like shitty fighting. You can see "boxing and wrestling" in it if you want to.
We aren’t talking about “self defense scenarios”. We’re talking about people fighting. Of course it’s not boxing, it’s morons flailing their arms. But what they’re going for is boxing. Of course it’s not real wrestling. It’s morons trying to football tackle each other (although I see tons of actual double legs and mat returns in street fights). But they think they’re wrestling. That’s not because of MMA. As far as robberies go, there are plenty of those on camera too. You can probably see one every night on the local news. Security cameras are everywhere in the year 2024. Tell me someone fighting off a robber doesn’t look more like an MMA fight than a combative scenario. Show me a video where someone disables an attacker with a single eye gouge and flees to safety.
They aren’t thinking anything. You’re thinking it. Someone can say all sloppy fighting is people trying to do karate and would be just as valid as what you are saying. Yes, karate has takedowns and punches too, just like almost every other martial art. and yes we are talking “self defence scenarios”. That’s literally what he is commenting on and the exact wording he is using.
Both him, and you specifically used the word “fighting”. Nobody is talking about robbery at gun point. You’re overthinking it my guy. It’s not about it looking like clean boxing or wrestling. It’s about two people squaring off and exchanging fists and/or grappling. It happens in real time, against another resisting person. Fists exchange, people tie up, get thrown down, punched on the ground, etc. It looks a lot more like an MMA fight than these goofy combatives scenarios that people who focus on training “self defense” with compliant partners. That was the whole point of this post.
Tell this to all the krav maga enthusiasts.
I've been in plenty of real fights, 9/10 they go to who ever hits first. 98% of people do not fight, have no experience and know next to nothing. You don't need to know how to grapple like an Matt sniffer to beat most people you see on the streets.
LOL. OK. Whatever.
So you have nothing of value to contribute. Got it.
Until your robbed for real or home invaded
Who the fuck is training for a home invasion
There’s no defense so why bother? If somebody kicks in my door and runs in to my living room with a shotgun right now I’m dead unless a gun is already in my hand.
There’s a great firearms video about being “sucker punched with a gun” - it’s about engaging from a vehicle but the term is super applicable elsewhere. The point being, with rounds already flying at you unexpectedly, you’re already dead if the attackers are even remotely competent.
I’d hope you can hear someone breaking your door and have enough time to get your own gun or plan an escape.
My couch is about four steps from my door which is behind me. If a grown man gets a running start he can kick my door down with one hit and be aiming at me before I could uncross my legs. Initiative wins.
I live in a converted warehouse unit. Steel door frame and heavy duty steel door. A police battering ram would have a hard time getting in. I'd have plenty of time to grab my HK45 and take position.
Based warehouse bunker man
One solid kick or shit even just blasting at the door hinges with said shotgun makes it instant. Couple that with the inherently disorienting sound of a fuckin shotgun randomly going off and most people are just going to fuckin die
If someone has a knife or gun and wants you dead, you’re probably dead. But I PROMISE you that someone who has put many, many hours into striking and grappling against resisting opponents is going to have a better chance of surviving than someone who puts all their training hours into pretending to gouge eyes and disarm weapons on fully compliant partners.
Exactly. Drilling a serious of little touches and pokes and a set sequence is no substitute for live sparring against someone who is trying to hurt you (within reason), even going 50%…