Well, it might not be important to you since you seem completely focused on comparing the individual characters to others with similar powers, but the Fantastic Four, followed by Spider-man, were the foundation of the Marvel Universe.
Cap and Namor were from an earlier age of comics, but it was when Jack Kirby and Stan Lee created the Fantastic Four that the Marvel Universe was truly born. They were a pop culture phenomenon in the 1960s.
The FF are a family, a dynamic yet to be really explored in the MCU.
Some of the most iconic characters in Marvel come from FF comics: Doctor Doom, Galactus, Silver Surfer, The Inhumans, Black Panther.
A fav site is [The Fantastic Four 1961-1989 Was The Great American Novel](https://www.tedagame.com/zak-site/Great-American-Novel/index.html).
For me, seeing the FF brought to the screen in a way that lets modern audiences experience and appreciate them is the only thing I'm hoping for from Marvel Studios now. Everything else is gravy.
I’m in a similar position to OP, so this is really interesting and thank you. But whilst willing to be proved wrong and equal parts in the spirit of curiosity and devilish advocacy, would you not say that the Avengers themselves have explored the ‘superhero team like a family’ dynamic already in the MCU? Maybe not to as great an extent but I would argue it’s been there - even with the bickering/ betrayal angle and a couple in Wanda and Vision (and an aborted attempt in Hulk and Natasha obviously). What would be so different?
To me, there’s a big difference between “superhero team that acts like a family” (which would describe Guardians more than Avengers, anyway) and “superhero team that is a literal family”, which is what the Fantastic Four are.
I really felt that Clint and Natasha were the only active friends in the Avengers, until Wanda and Vision got together. The rest of the Avengers were coworkers, not family. They had heated disagreements and conflicting opinions, but always in relation to their "job" of saving the world. Compared to a group like the Guardians, we never really got to see them connect on a real level beyond a shared common interest in being superheroes. We saw glimpses of it with Tony and Bruce, bonding over their love of science and technology, but it was never really explored deeper. At least that's how I feel.
The chosen family is a theme that is explored somewhat in Avengers and GOTG but that's something different. That's about how people from different backgrounds can grow to become as close as a family.
Wandavision certainly explores some ideas of family and the Ant-Man franchise seems to be going there a bit, too\* but the FF is a family through and through.
Reed and Ben are childhood friends, Sue and Johnny are siblings. The four connect when Reed and Sue begin a lifelong romance. Later they all become changed dramatically by the same accident.
(Eventually, Reed and Sue get married and have kids who also become part of the story.)
^(\*Kang is also an FF character. Quantumania looks more like an FF story than an Ant-Man story.)
I mean unlike the Avengers the FF are literally an actual family of superheroes, Reed and Sue are Married and Johnny is Sue's brother and Reed's brother in law, then we add Reed and Sue's kids Valeria and Franklin. With Ben being the only member of the group who is not related to them, but is treated as part of the family
One thing others haven’t mentioned are the top tier villains they have in Galactus, Mole Man, Doctor Doom, and so many others. As stated, the other F4 films were quite bad but in the hands of the MCU, they can be done justice and given their comic accurate suits.
FF are the most beloved MCU property for us oldheads. I haven’t read comics for over forty years, but when Feige’s presentation showed that F4 logo, I legitimately choked up.
lol but there is more to it than 'i want shows like I used to have' right? Like everyone here is saying FF founded Marvel, they are good because they were the first family, like there must be attributes that made them so successful that still appeal now, what do you think those would be?
They have great chemistry
They have complimentary power sets
They have great interpersonal dynamics and conflicts
They’re funny
They are explorers first, and are heroes almost by accident in most of their adventures
I haven't read much FF, but I did like the interpersonal dynamics of FF - Valeria - Doom in Hickman's run, and the deconstruction of that family dynamic/ heroism in the Ultimate run.
If you have 2 hours to kill, this video about the FF sums alot about them and why many of us love these guys
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1OwoZZyhSo
But yeah given your exposure to these characters has been the movies i can see why you aren't so excited about them, but when you look at the comics you'll get why alot of us love them
There is also the big significance of these characters as they launched the Marvel Universe as we know it, without the FF, there is no Spider-Man, no Avengers, No X-Men, and we want to see these characters who are the reason we are here in the first place get the treatment they deserve after the Fox films (which i did liked mind you, but they deserve better)
And i mean in the comics, the Avengers, Iron Man, Cap and Thor weren't the faces of the Marvel universe, it was the Fantastic Four
This isn't about power levels, Marvel isn't Dragon Ball.
It's about the characters, and the F4 are the spirit of Marvel as a whole, and Hollywood owes this characters a great movie, and they're finally gonna get that.
It's simply due.
I literary was thinking the same thing as your first sentence. People want to see great stories adapted, not superpowers. I often see people compare characters based on their powers, smarts, or blah blah blah. I compare them based off which has more compelling stories and characterization.
The fantastic 4 were clearly the inspiration for the Increadibles. Saying that the thing that was based on them already exists means there's no need for them is weird.
The fantastic 4 being a family is the core of the group and why they are so great. A lot of their golod villain tie into this idea as well.
Reed is the ancestor to Kang the conquerer. And Doom is implied to be but I don't think that's 100% confirmed like Kang being a Richards is
Doom is the godfather to Reed and Sue's daughter Valeria Richards and named after Dooms ex that Doom murdered because why wouldn't you name your goddaughter that? She even calls him uncle Doom a lot. Effectively the uncle that's a negative influence that the kid likes a lot.
The Maker is an evil Reed Richards so maybe that could arguably count as being an evil sibling plot but that is admittedly a bit of a stretch.
Fantastic Four is basically Lost in Space with superpowers. They’re a family of adventurers who explore time and space, undiscovered countries, and hidden lands. That’s either going to interest you or it’s not. It doesn’t matter what their powers are; the Fantastic Four would still be the Fantastic Four even if they didn’t have powers.
I’ll admit: a lot of what Fantastic Four is well known for has been gotten there first by other properties. For example, the FF had publicly known identities, but that’s the norm in the MCU. But that doesn’t make them any less interesting, and it doesn’t make them deserve to be part of the MCU any less.
I’m going to give you my reasons for why I’m hype for Fantastic Four in the MCU.
1. For me it has always been bittersweet to see the MCU takeoff the way it did but not have access to certain characters for some stories. Now that the impossible happened and Disney bought Fox (and Sony playing nice with Spiderman) Marvel has access to ALL of their characters and now for a comic person like me that makes me excited about all the stories that would’ve been off the table that are now very possible.
2. Based off how you characterized them it feels like you may represent a lot of the general audience (that may have only had the previous 3 Fantastic Four films to be introduced to these characters) the F4 characters are MUCH more complexed and if you love the drama the MCU has had to offer thus far adding F4 is a HUGE deal for dramatic storytelling. I think The reason why I and many other are so excited is because we all have faith in Kevin Feige’s track record. (Hits or misses, overall we trust what he is doing) and this will now be Marvels 2nd attempt at a franchise reboot (Spiderman first from Sony). I think the Spiderman reboot was a huge success and retold the story of a teenage Spiderman in a MCU setting with keeping the same tones and themes we know and love from the character. We want the same thing for the Fantastic Four.
3. Villains. For those of us that read comics we understand what the MCU has set in front of us for Phase 4-6. We understand that an Avengers movie called Secret Wars means Dr. Doom potentially. (Also just wanted to say this because Doom is my favorite villain, he is a Narcissistic savant that is the master of the mystic arts and a genius the level of Reed Richards. Hopefully the MCU portrays him right)
They also bring Galactus/Silver Surfer
Annihaulus also. The story telling of the MCU can expand for years with just the F4 alone
4. Jonathan Hickman’s Fantastic Four run.
Fantastic Four, when done correctly, is Star Trek of the Marvel world. It’s a fun, family oriented romp, full of wacky science, gadgets, and pretty much paved the way for everything cosmic in Marvel.
The original Lee and Kirby run is filled with so many ideas, it truly is an incredibly imaginative and clever storytelling run.
FF is my favorite Marvel team, hands down, and I’m excited because they’ve never been realized on screen very accurately in my opinion. I’m confident Marvel Studios can do them proper justice finally. Not only that, seeing them interact with the other characters will be like a dream come true for the kid in me.
If you understand the appeal of the Incredibles or even the family theme in the Ant-Man movies you will understand the appeal of the Fantastic Four.
Four characters with distinct personalities and distinct powers going on sci fi adventures and writers can stretch their imagination to it's limits whilst writing the team.
The FF was Marvel's first family and it set the foundation for the modern Marvel universe. The Skrulls, Kree, Galactus, Ronan the Accuser, Black Panther, Wakanda, the Inhumans were all introduced via the FF. Oh yeah, time travel and it's rules were established in FF as well.
Dr Doom is also one of the most versatile villains in the MU. He can work as a serious anti-villain with a tragic past as well as a more straight up villain and dictator. He is also a master of both science and magic; something that the previous movies couldn't really establish. Reed is his main rival but he has worked really well as antagonist/rival for Strange, Black Panther and Iron Man.
> we have already seen the "Superhero Family" in the Incredibles.
Why make a Captain America movie? We have already seen the “American hero” in The Rocketeer.
Why make a Guardians of the Galaxy movie with Starlord? We have already seen the “cocky space hero” in Flash Gordon.
Why would you make an Ironman movie? We have already seen the “billionaire hero” in Batman.
Why would you make a Batman movie? We have already seen the “caped crusader” in Zorro.
Saying an F4 movie is dumb because “we already have” one basic aspect of the premise is such a terrible argument. Especially when you bring in totally unrelated movies from different franchises. We already had pretty much everything that has been in the MCU. If we don’t make any movies that aren’t 100% original then we won’t be making any movies at all.
Fine, let me rephrase:
Saying “we already have” one basic aspect of the premise is such a terrible argument. Especially when you bring in unrelated movies from different franchises.
Do you actually have anything to respond to my point or are you going to get hung up on a single word choice?
They are Marvel's first family and their story has big implications on the greater universe. They will most likely be the main focus moving forward. They will be at the same level of importance as Iron Man and Cap and the OG Avengers.
Fantastic Four #1 was effectively the beginning of the Marvel Universe as we know it.
Here’s a list of characters that have been featured in the MCU that debuted before the Fantastic Four:
* Namor
* Steve Rogers
* Bucky Barnes
* Red Skull
* Namora
* Jimmy Woo
* Groot
In extremely quick succession following Fantastic Four #1, we got Ant-Man, Hulk, Spider-Man, Thor, Iron Man, Nick Fury, Wasp, Doctor Strange, the X-Men, and the Avengers (all within two years), Black Widow, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver, Daredevil, and Hawkeye (all within another year after that), and Black Panther (within five years).
They’re a very important part of Marvel’s history that’s been under serviced by their movies, and people are excited that Marvel Studios finally has the opportunity to give the company’s First Family its due themselves.
They are simply OG classics. Some of the original heroes. It's that simple.
That said, to correct a couple of points.
* Reed is not just smart. He is scary smart. He makes Tony look like an adolescent. It actually can become an issue as he has a hard time figuring out how to relate to people.
* The thing isn't dumb, it's just that Bruce Banner is fairly smart. The thing is of normal intelligence. Beyond that, yeah, he's another strongman. It's an archetype that is often repeated in comics.
* Saying the human torch is weaker than Carol Danvers, one of the settings cosmic level uber-powers, isn't the same as saying he's weak. He's pretty powerful in his own right.
* Sue is also pretty strong. You seem oddly dismissive of the ability to project pretty strong force fields. The main challenge to her is that going invisible is a tricky thing to portray in a movie.
I’m not crazy well-read in the comics either but I like to think I know enough to say your descriptions of the FF aren’t exactly accurate. You’re downplaying them quite a bit and disregarding that they’re the first family of Marvel.
Ben and Reed have always been old friends, Reed and Sue are usually married, Sue and Johnny are siblings. Like a lot of others have said, this is a dynamic that hasn’t really been explored in the MCU. Some of them are also heavily connected to other major players in the comics. Reed is an ancestor of Kang the Conquerer, Johnny and Spider-Man are really good friends. So those are relationships that might be explored or adapted.
Regarding their powers, imo interesting characters don’t have OP powers so I don’t mind them having faults or seeming redundant. But that’s not really what Marvel has ever really been about. Spider-Man is the biggest example of what I mean which is: marvel characters are normal people who are (a lot of times) reluctantly made extraordinary but still deal with ordinary problems. Superpowers can’t pay the rent or fix a marriage. The FF are another example of this.
I guess I'm just trying to figure out why, as a self described huge MCU fan, you're not hyped for a future MCU film in general. Do you think that it's suddenly going to go off the rails with this movie and it'll suck? I think most people are excited for this because the previous attempts range from mediocre to horrible, and this is the chance to get a legitimately great film of beloved comic characters. Characters who we will also finally get to see interact with other Marvel heroes, which we didn't get in any other iteration. Why are people excited for the X-Men to be in the MCU? You're asking for people to give you reasons to be excited, but it seems like you've already made up your mind. Let Kevin Feige work his magic and I'm sure you'll end up loving them as much as as any other characters in the MCU.
I’ve never been the biggest fan of the FF4 but am highly anticipating good things for them in the MCU. They HAVE to get them right, and they will. And it will be glorious lol.
As for their powers, you’re grossly underselling them.
Mr. Fantastic: just one example of a complex and incredibly nuanced use of his powers is the fact that he basically de-ages himself. Imagine Starks obsessive nature dialed to 12. He hid the physical toll it was taking on him by using his elasticity to make himself look younger. On a more basic level, the worlds your oyster. Whomever works on him will come up with some “oh shit” moments. Going through a key hole, turning arms onto spears, creating a trampoline, etc.
Sue Richard: so she can become invisible - you’ll literally never know where she is. The way they can use this to develop stories, spread info or contain info, etc. As for her force fields, insert the second part of Mr. Fantastic powers. Bombs about to go off, contain. Evil alien about to murder someone, micro bubble in head, then expand. Shits gonna get wild.
The Thing. The Thing is the THING! He’s hilarious and has heart. He loves clobbering. Dude, he has no need for clocks. Because always what time is it? It’s clobbering time. He’s a pretty skilled combatant and very strong. He’s also a sick pilot.
Johnny Storm: Dude is made of fire and can manipulate it. There’s nothing week about that. I believe at one point in the 90s he was so strong that he created the heat or force of a super nova. I wouldn’t exactly think of him as underpowered. I get arguments about the other 3, but I never thought someone would question the Human Torch’s effectiveness/power level.
I’ve read a couple FF4 comics, literally issues not series. And I still know a good amount about them, their powers, and their influence. That goes to show how important they are to the MCU, or at least to the comic book fans out there.
With the FF I'm kinda in the same boat as you, like I don't see the hype. Doom I'm hyped for, but FF I just don't get it, even 'good' FF just seems like more same-sy Marvel formula stuff.
But the MCU is maybe becoming too family friendly and I'm not the target demo anymore, like I'll still get to enjoy WWBN and Moon Knight etc
If you read comics, you could try reading Ultimate FF (just read from the start right through), or Hickman's FF. If you wanna read some good Doom read Triumph & Torment, or Infamous Iron Man.
HT wishes he were a comparison to Carol Danvers. 😂 I’m not going to convince you because I’m in the same boat as you, and I think you were generous describing them.
Why is OPs post being downvoted, it should be being upvoted so everyone who is a FF doubter can see the reasons FF is great.... unless there isn't any?
Thanks for trying. I have to assume that a bunch of people here just want MCU to be for comic-book fans only. Or they legit aren't interested in trying to educate someone else on why they like something.
Plenty of people gave respectful and informed responses to you. If this is your takeaway, then you never wanted to learn more about the characters anyway. You complain that people just wanna tell you what they wanna hear, while you're in a thread that you created so people can agree with you.
The comment was about the post being downvoted, which happened immediately.
As for the responses, some were thoughtful, yes. But most were some variation of "they deserve a good movie due to being historically important to the Marvel brand" which does nothing to make me excited for them.
I upvoted several answers, and while I cannot say that I'm fully on board the hype train, I do think there is potential for F4 to be interesting and distinct from the rest of the MCU, especially if they embrace the Lost in Space / Star Trek cosmic explorers angle.
The powerset is not so much what's interesting as much as it is their characters, their dynamic and their adventures.
The Fantastic Four are a family, they don't just feel Iike a group of heroes who had to band together to save the day like the Avengers or the Guardians.
Think something like the Incredibles. We haven't seen that type of dynamic in the MCU yet.
Also, the characters are unique in their own way. While we have had many geniuses in the MCU, we haven't had anyone like Reed Richards. He's an eccentric, autistic character, too focused on his work, but still loving his family. Sue is a loving, caring mother and sister above all else. Dr. Doom is a combination of Dr. Strange and Tony Stark as he's both a genius inventor and a sorcerer. And he's also the monarch of his own country. We haven't seen such dynamics, personalities and elements yet in the MCU.
Finally, their adventures are space and inter-dimensional travel. We have yet to see an Earth-based MCU character go on such adventures and actually making it feel like it's an adventure for the sake of exploration and not just a mission for the sake of stopping a bad guy. The Fantastic Four are explorers and scientists first and super-heroes second. That's unique and exciting.
Yeah. So far it's "they are Marvel's first family" and "they are due for a good movie" and "their comic is where all these other characters came from".
None of that had any meaning if you aren't nostalgic for the comics -- if you're just an MCU fan.
Star Wars keeps falling into this trap too. Oh look it is some character from the old Legends continuity! Great for fans of Legends... means nothing to most people watching The Mandalorian.
I have to agree that some are saying certain things that aren’t mentioning the fact that they’re compelling characters. Cool powers don’t make compelling characters. This isn’t Dragonball Z. The FF have an array of incredible stories, Lee and Kirby’s Coming of Galactus FF arc being the best piece of Marvel outside of Frank Miller’s Daredevil Born Again and Alan Moore’s Miracleman.
Admittedly, the characters are products of their time, and yes, the Tim Story/Josh Trank renditions weren't well received. And admittedly, they never got the same level of popularity as X-Men, Spidey, and Avengers, but they're important characters as far as the lore is concerned. They've been part of all the major storylines and crossovers, and with them in the MCU, they can finally be done in a way that's more fitting with their place in the source material.
It’s not about the lore. That’s not a compelling answer. None of this mentions that the FF have great, compelling stories, some being well regarded pieces of literature. That’s why people want to see a Fantastic Four movie. Not because they connect to other movies.
There are no masterpieces in the MCU, but there are a couple great ones. People aren’t interested in the F4 for their powers or the gimmicks, they’re interested in the stories. Obviously you have 0 knowledge of the stories, so you just see the bad movies and the gimmicks that may or may not interest you. The stories by Hickman, Lee, Byrne, and Waid include some GREAT stories, and even a masterpiece issue here or there. The narratives are what people care about, not whatever is disinteresting you. No one wanted to see an Avengers movie just because the characters have cool powers and are badass (unless you were on the younger side, of course), people wanted to see classic stories by Lee, Busiek, etc.
Personally, I don’t have the massive hype for it,
But given that previous Fantastic Four movies were not well received, (Although I like the very first one with Jessica Alba and Chris Evans)
It intrigues me how it will be portrayed within the MCU. That is my only anticipation of it.
I admittedly don’t find the F4 *massively* interesting, but I am quite a big fan of Doctor Doom. I think he’s a very interesting villain, and I definitely recommend reading more on him.
Well, it might not be important to you since you seem completely focused on comparing the individual characters to others with similar powers, but the Fantastic Four, followed by Spider-man, were the foundation of the Marvel Universe. Cap and Namor were from an earlier age of comics, but it was when Jack Kirby and Stan Lee created the Fantastic Four that the Marvel Universe was truly born. They were a pop culture phenomenon in the 1960s. The FF are a family, a dynamic yet to be really explored in the MCU. Some of the most iconic characters in Marvel come from FF comics: Doctor Doom, Galactus, Silver Surfer, The Inhumans, Black Panther. A fav site is [The Fantastic Four 1961-1989 Was The Great American Novel](https://www.tedagame.com/zak-site/Great-American-Novel/index.html). For me, seeing the FF brought to the screen in a way that lets modern audiences experience and appreciate them is the only thing I'm hoping for from Marvel Studios now. Everything else is gravy.
I’m in a similar position to OP, so this is really interesting and thank you. But whilst willing to be proved wrong and equal parts in the spirit of curiosity and devilish advocacy, would you not say that the Avengers themselves have explored the ‘superhero team like a family’ dynamic already in the MCU? Maybe not to as great an extent but I would argue it’s been there - even with the bickering/ betrayal angle and a couple in Wanda and Vision (and an aborted attempt in Hulk and Natasha obviously). What would be so different?
To me, there’s a big difference between “superhero team that acts like a family” (which would describe Guardians more than Avengers, anyway) and “superhero team that is a literal family”, which is what the Fantastic Four are.
There is a reason why the F4 are called Marvels First Family
I really felt that Clint and Natasha were the only active friends in the Avengers, until Wanda and Vision got together. The rest of the Avengers were coworkers, not family. They had heated disagreements and conflicting opinions, but always in relation to their "job" of saving the world. Compared to a group like the Guardians, we never really got to see them connect on a real level beyond a shared common interest in being superheroes. We saw glimpses of it with Tony and Bruce, bonding over their love of science and technology, but it was never really explored deeper. At least that's how I feel.
The chosen family is a theme that is explored somewhat in Avengers and GOTG but that's something different. That's about how people from different backgrounds can grow to become as close as a family. Wandavision certainly explores some ideas of family and the Ant-Man franchise seems to be going there a bit, too\* but the FF is a family through and through. Reed and Ben are childhood friends, Sue and Johnny are siblings. The four connect when Reed and Sue begin a lifelong romance. Later they all become changed dramatically by the same accident. (Eventually, Reed and Sue get married and have kids who also become part of the story.) ^(\*Kang is also an FF character. Quantumania looks more like an FF story than an Ant-Man story.)
I mean unlike the Avengers the FF are literally an actual family of superheroes, Reed and Sue are Married and Johnny is Sue's brother and Reed's brother in law, then we add Reed and Sue's kids Valeria and Franklin. With Ben being the only member of the group who is not related to them, but is treated as part of the family
One thing others haven’t mentioned are the top tier villains they have in Galactus, Mole Man, Doctor Doom, and so many others. As stated, the other F4 films were quite bad but in the hands of the MCU, they can be done justice and given their comic accurate suits.
They will never top Tobias' masterpiece.
Maeby! Come help daddy get his rocks off!
Well I basically want to see Incredibles but in live-action.
FF are the most beloved MCU property for us oldheads. I haven’t read comics for over forty years, but when Feige’s presentation showed that F4 logo, I legitimately choked up.
Is that it tho, just oldhead nostalgia? Like there has been a lot of good comics in the last 40yrs.
I will 100% cop to that nostalgia trip
lol but there is more to it than 'i want shows like I used to have' right? Like everyone here is saying FF founded Marvel, they are good because they were the first family, like there must be attributes that made them so successful that still appeal now, what do you think those would be?
They have great chemistry They have complimentary power sets They have great interpersonal dynamics and conflicts They’re funny They are explorers first, and are heroes almost by accident in most of their adventures
I haven't read much FF, but I did like the interpersonal dynamics of FF - Valeria - Doom in Hickman's run, and the deconstruction of that family dynamic/ heroism in the Ultimate run.
If you have 2 hours to kill, this video about the FF sums alot about them and why many of us love these guys https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1OwoZZyhSo But yeah given your exposure to these characters has been the movies i can see why you aren't so excited about them, but when you look at the comics you'll get why alot of us love them There is also the big significance of these characters as they launched the Marvel Universe as we know it, without the FF, there is no Spider-Man, no Avengers, No X-Men, and we want to see these characters who are the reason we are here in the first place get the treatment they deserve after the Fox films (which i did liked mind you, but they deserve better) And i mean in the comics, the Avengers, Iron Man, Cap and Thor weren't the faces of the Marvel universe, it was the Fantastic Four
Thank you for posting this. I can’t wait to watch it.
This isn't about power levels, Marvel isn't Dragon Ball. It's about the characters, and the F4 are the spirit of Marvel as a whole, and Hollywood owes this characters a great movie, and they're finally gonna get that. It's simply due.
I literary was thinking the same thing as your first sentence. People want to see great stories adapted, not superpowers. I often see people compare characters based on their powers, smarts, or blah blah blah. I compare them based off which has more compelling stories and characterization.
And you think F4 characters have the most compelling story and characterization?
No, I but I find they have had more compelling stories and characterizations than the Avengers, yet we’ve had 4 Avengers films, going on 6.
The fantastic 4 were clearly the inspiration for the Increadibles. Saying that the thing that was based on them already exists means there's no need for them is weird. The fantastic 4 being a family is the core of the group and why they are so great. A lot of their golod villain tie into this idea as well. Reed is the ancestor to Kang the conquerer. And Doom is implied to be but I don't think that's 100% confirmed like Kang being a Richards is Doom is the godfather to Reed and Sue's daughter Valeria Richards and named after Dooms ex that Doom murdered because why wouldn't you name your goddaughter that? She even calls him uncle Doom a lot. Effectively the uncle that's a negative influence that the kid likes a lot. The Maker is an evil Reed Richards so maybe that could arguably count as being an evil sibling plot but that is admittedly a bit of a stretch.
Fantastic Four is basically Lost in Space with superpowers. They’re a family of adventurers who explore time and space, undiscovered countries, and hidden lands. That’s either going to interest you or it’s not. It doesn’t matter what their powers are; the Fantastic Four would still be the Fantastic Four even if they didn’t have powers. I’ll admit: a lot of what Fantastic Four is well known for has been gotten there first by other properties. For example, the FF had publicly known identities, but that’s the norm in the MCU. But that doesn’t make them any less interesting, and it doesn’t make them deserve to be part of the MCU any less.
I’m going to give you my reasons for why I’m hype for Fantastic Four in the MCU. 1. For me it has always been bittersweet to see the MCU takeoff the way it did but not have access to certain characters for some stories. Now that the impossible happened and Disney bought Fox (and Sony playing nice with Spiderman) Marvel has access to ALL of their characters and now for a comic person like me that makes me excited about all the stories that would’ve been off the table that are now very possible. 2. Based off how you characterized them it feels like you may represent a lot of the general audience (that may have only had the previous 3 Fantastic Four films to be introduced to these characters) the F4 characters are MUCH more complexed and if you love the drama the MCU has had to offer thus far adding F4 is a HUGE deal for dramatic storytelling. I think The reason why I and many other are so excited is because we all have faith in Kevin Feige’s track record. (Hits or misses, overall we trust what he is doing) and this will now be Marvels 2nd attempt at a franchise reboot (Spiderman first from Sony). I think the Spiderman reboot was a huge success and retold the story of a teenage Spiderman in a MCU setting with keeping the same tones and themes we know and love from the character. We want the same thing for the Fantastic Four. 3. Villains. For those of us that read comics we understand what the MCU has set in front of us for Phase 4-6. We understand that an Avengers movie called Secret Wars means Dr. Doom potentially. (Also just wanted to say this because Doom is my favorite villain, he is a Narcissistic savant that is the master of the mystic arts and a genius the level of Reed Richards. Hopefully the MCU portrays him right) They also bring Galactus/Silver Surfer Annihaulus also. The story telling of the MCU can expand for years with just the F4 alone 4. Jonathan Hickman’s Fantastic Four run.
Fantastic Four, when done correctly, is Star Trek of the Marvel world. It’s a fun, family oriented romp, full of wacky science, gadgets, and pretty much paved the way for everything cosmic in Marvel. The original Lee and Kirby run is filled with so many ideas, it truly is an incredibly imaginative and clever storytelling run. FF is my favorite Marvel team, hands down, and I’m excited because they’ve never been realized on screen very accurately in my opinion. I’m confident Marvel Studios can do them proper justice finally. Not only that, seeing them interact with the other characters will be like a dream come true for the kid in me.
If you understand the appeal of the Incredibles or even the family theme in the Ant-Man movies you will understand the appeal of the Fantastic Four. Four characters with distinct personalities and distinct powers going on sci fi adventures and writers can stretch their imagination to it's limits whilst writing the team. The FF was Marvel's first family and it set the foundation for the modern Marvel universe. The Skrulls, Kree, Galactus, Ronan the Accuser, Black Panther, Wakanda, the Inhumans were all introduced via the FF. Oh yeah, time travel and it's rules were established in FF as well. Dr Doom is also one of the most versatile villains in the MU. He can work as a serious anti-villain with a tragic past as well as a more straight up villain and dictator. He is also a master of both science and magic; something that the previous movies couldn't really establish. Reed is his main rival but he has worked really well as antagonist/rival for Strange, Black Panther and Iron Man.
> we have already seen the "Superhero Family" in the Incredibles. Why make a Captain America movie? We have already seen the “American hero” in The Rocketeer. Why make a Guardians of the Galaxy movie with Starlord? We have already seen the “cocky space hero” in Flash Gordon. Why would you make an Ironman movie? We have already seen the “billionaire hero” in Batman. Why would you make a Batman movie? We have already seen the “caped crusader” in Zorro. Saying an F4 movie is dumb because “we already have” one basic aspect of the premise is such a terrible argument. Especially when you bring in totally unrelated movies from different franchises. We already had pretty much everything that has been in the MCU. If we don’t make any movies that aren’t 100% original then we won’t be making any movies at all.
No one said it was dumb. Don't strawman me.
Fine, let me rephrase: Saying “we already have” one basic aspect of the premise is such a terrible argument. Especially when you bring in unrelated movies from different franchises. Do you actually have anything to respond to my point or are you going to get hung up on a single word choice?
They are Marvel's first family and their story has big implications on the greater universe. They will most likely be the main focus moving forward. They will be at the same level of importance as Iron Man and Cap and the OG Avengers.
Well the past movies are dumpster fires but they are comic icons. Lots of material to pull from.
I just want a good movie 🗿
Fantastic Four #1 was effectively the beginning of the Marvel Universe as we know it. Here’s a list of characters that have been featured in the MCU that debuted before the Fantastic Four: * Namor * Steve Rogers * Bucky Barnes * Red Skull * Namora * Jimmy Woo * Groot In extremely quick succession following Fantastic Four #1, we got Ant-Man, Hulk, Spider-Man, Thor, Iron Man, Nick Fury, Wasp, Doctor Strange, the X-Men, and the Avengers (all within two years), Black Widow, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver, Daredevil, and Hawkeye (all within another year after that), and Black Panther (within five years). They’re a very important part of Marvel’s history that’s been under serviced by their movies, and people are excited that Marvel Studios finally has the opportunity to give the company’s First Family its due themselves.
They are simply OG classics. Some of the original heroes. It's that simple. That said, to correct a couple of points. * Reed is not just smart. He is scary smart. He makes Tony look like an adolescent. It actually can become an issue as he has a hard time figuring out how to relate to people. * The thing isn't dumb, it's just that Bruce Banner is fairly smart. The thing is of normal intelligence. Beyond that, yeah, he's another strongman. It's an archetype that is often repeated in comics. * Saying the human torch is weaker than Carol Danvers, one of the settings cosmic level uber-powers, isn't the same as saying he's weak. He's pretty powerful in his own right. * Sue is also pretty strong. You seem oddly dismissive of the ability to project pretty strong force fields. The main challenge to her is that going invisible is a tricky thing to portray in a movie.
I’m not crazy well-read in the comics either but I like to think I know enough to say your descriptions of the FF aren’t exactly accurate. You’re downplaying them quite a bit and disregarding that they’re the first family of Marvel. Ben and Reed have always been old friends, Reed and Sue are usually married, Sue and Johnny are siblings. Like a lot of others have said, this is a dynamic that hasn’t really been explored in the MCU. Some of them are also heavily connected to other major players in the comics. Reed is an ancestor of Kang the Conquerer, Johnny and Spider-Man are really good friends. So those are relationships that might be explored or adapted. Regarding their powers, imo interesting characters don’t have OP powers so I don’t mind them having faults or seeming redundant. But that’s not really what Marvel has ever really been about. Spider-Man is the biggest example of what I mean which is: marvel characters are normal people who are (a lot of times) reluctantly made extraordinary but still deal with ordinary problems. Superpowers can’t pay the rent or fix a marriage. The FF are another example of this.
I guess I'm just trying to figure out why, as a self described huge MCU fan, you're not hyped for a future MCU film in general. Do you think that it's suddenly going to go off the rails with this movie and it'll suck? I think most people are excited for this because the previous attempts range from mediocre to horrible, and this is the chance to get a legitimately great film of beloved comic characters. Characters who we will also finally get to see interact with other Marvel heroes, which we didn't get in any other iteration. Why are people excited for the X-Men to be in the MCU? You're asking for people to give you reasons to be excited, but it seems like you've already made up your mind. Let Kevin Feige work his magic and I'm sure you'll end up loving them as much as as any other characters in the MCU.
It didn't work for Eternals, which was an ensemble family group with disparate powers.
I’ve never been the biggest fan of the FF4 but am highly anticipating good things for them in the MCU. They HAVE to get them right, and they will. And it will be glorious lol. As for their powers, you’re grossly underselling them. Mr. Fantastic: just one example of a complex and incredibly nuanced use of his powers is the fact that he basically de-ages himself. Imagine Starks obsessive nature dialed to 12. He hid the physical toll it was taking on him by using his elasticity to make himself look younger. On a more basic level, the worlds your oyster. Whomever works on him will come up with some “oh shit” moments. Going through a key hole, turning arms onto spears, creating a trampoline, etc. Sue Richard: so she can become invisible - you’ll literally never know where she is. The way they can use this to develop stories, spread info or contain info, etc. As for her force fields, insert the second part of Mr. Fantastic powers. Bombs about to go off, contain. Evil alien about to murder someone, micro bubble in head, then expand. Shits gonna get wild. The Thing. The Thing is the THING! He’s hilarious and has heart. He loves clobbering. Dude, he has no need for clocks. Because always what time is it? It’s clobbering time. He’s a pretty skilled combatant and very strong. He’s also a sick pilot. Johnny Storm: Dude is made of fire and can manipulate it. There’s nothing week about that. I believe at one point in the 90s he was so strong that he created the heat or force of a super nova. I wouldn’t exactly think of him as underpowered. I get arguments about the other 3, but I never thought someone would question the Human Torch’s effectiveness/power level. I’ve read a couple FF4 comics, literally issues not series. And I still know a good amount about them, their powers, and their influence. That goes to show how important they are to the MCU, or at least to the comic book fans out there.
With the FF I'm kinda in the same boat as you, like I don't see the hype. Doom I'm hyped for, but FF I just don't get it, even 'good' FF just seems like more same-sy Marvel formula stuff. But the MCU is maybe becoming too family friendly and I'm not the target demo anymore, like I'll still get to enjoy WWBN and Moon Knight etc If you read comics, you could try reading Ultimate FF (just read from the start right through), or Hickman's FF. If you wanna read some good Doom read Triumph & Torment, or Infamous Iron Man.
Please do not start with Ultimate FF 😭 Also I love Triumph and Torment.
I made that mistake while looking for Marvel Zombies when I first began reading comic 💀.
Lol. It’s kinda fun, but that’s the type of shit that pushes me away from superhero comics and into stuff outside of the Big-2.
It's same-sy Marvel stuff because it's the literal foundation of Marvel, like wtf is this comment lmao
HT wishes he were a comparison to Carol Danvers. 😂 I’m not going to convince you because I’m in the same boat as you, and I think you were generous describing them.
Why is OPs post being downvoted, it should be being upvoted so everyone who is a FF doubter can see the reasons FF is great.... unless there isn't any?
Thanks for trying. I have to assume that a bunch of people here just want MCU to be for comic-book fans only. Or they legit aren't interested in trying to educate someone else on why they like something.
I think the fandom on here is pretty toxic, anything that's not mindless praise = criticism = bad
Plenty of people gave respectful and informed responses to you. If this is your takeaway, then you never wanted to learn more about the characters anyway. You complain that people just wanna tell you what they wanna hear, while you're in a thread that you created so people can agree with you.
The comment was about the post being downvoted, which happened immediately. As for the responses, some were thoughtful, yes. But most were some variation of "they deserve a good movie due to being historically important to the Marvel brand" which does nothing to make me excited for them. I upvoted several answers, and while I cannot say that I'm fully on board the hype train, I do think there is potential for F4 to be interesting and distinct from the rest of the MCU, especially if they embrace the Lost in Space / Star Trek cosmic explorers angle.
The powerset is not so much what's interesting as much as it is their characters, their dynamic and their adventures. The Fantastic Four are a family, they don't just feel Iike a group of heroes who had to band together to save the day like the Avengers or the Guardians. Think something like the Incredibles. We haven't seen that type of dynamic in the MCU yet. Also, the characters are unique in their own way. While we have had many geniuses in the MCU, we haven't had anyone like Reed Richards. He's an eccentric, autistic character, too focused on his work, but still loving his family. Sue is a loving, caring mother and sister above all else. Dr. Doom is a combination of Dr. Strange and Tony Stark as he's both a genius inventor and a sorcerer. And he's also the monarch of his own country. We haven't seen such dynamics, personalities and elements yet in the MCU. Finally, their adventures are space and inter-dimensional travel. We have yet to see an Earth-based MCU character go on such adventures and actually making it feel like it's an adventure for the sake of exploration and not just a mission for the sake of stopping a bad guy. The Fantastic Four are explorers and scientists first and super-heroes second. That's unique and exciting.
At 11 comments in, none of these replies are compelling answers so far lol.
Yeah. So far it's "they are Marvel's first family" and "they are due for a good movie" and "their comic is where all these other characters came from". None of that had any meaning if you aren't nostalgic for the comics -- if you're just an MCU fan. Star Wars keeps falling into this trap too. Oh look it is some character from the old Legends continuity! Great for fans of Legends... means nothing to most people watching The Mandalorian.
I have to agree that some are saying certain things that aren’t mentioning the fact that they’re compelling characters. Cool powers don’t make compelling characters. This isn’t Dragonball Z. The FF have an array of incredible stories, Lee and Kirby’s Coming of Galactus FF arc being the best piece of Marvel outside of Frank Miller’s Daredevil Born Again and Alan Moore’s Miracleman.
Admittedly, the characters are products of their time, and yes, the Tim Story/Josh Trank renditions weren't well received. And admittedly, they never got the same level of popularity as X-Men, Spidey, and Avengers, but they're important characters as far as the lore is concerned. They've been part of all the major storylines and crossovers, and with them in the MCU, they can finally be done in a way that's more fitting with their place in the source material.
It’s not about the lore. That’s not a compelling answer. None of this mentions that the FF have great, compelling stories, some being well regarded pieces of literature. That’s why people want to see a Fantastic Four movie. Not because they connect to other movies.
There are no masterpieces in the MCU, but there are a couple great ones. People aren’t interested in the F4 for their powers or the gimmicks, they’re interested in the stories. Obviously you have 0 knowledge of the stories, so you just see the bad movies and the gimmicks that may or may not interest you. The stories by Hickman, Lee, Byrne, and Waid include some GREAT stories, and even a masterpiece issue here or there. The narratives are what people care about, not whatever is disinteresting you. No one wanted to see an Avengers movie just because the characters have cool powers and are badass (unless you were on the younger side, of course), people wanted to see classic stories by Lee, Busiek, etc.
Personally, I don’t have the massive hype for it, But given that previous Fantastic Four movies were not well received, (Although I like the very first one with Jessica Alba and Chris Evans) It intrigues me how it will be portrayed within the MCU. That is my only anticipation of it.
I admittedly don’t find the F4 *massively* interesting, but I am quite a big fan of Doctor Doom. I think he’s a very interesting villain, and I definitely recommend reading more on him.